[GENERAL] Automatic install on windows
I have a client that wants a disaster recovery plan put into place. What is the easiest way to do a hands free install of postgresql on a window box? Thank you for your time, Jason Long CEO and Chief Software Engineer BS Physics, MS Chemical Engineering http://www.supernovasoftware.com HJBUG Founder and President http://www.hjbug.com
Re: [GENERAL] dynamic table/col names in plpgsql
ugh, I'm going down a rathole with this... the dynamic part of the query is the table name, and therefore, if I want to select into a row variable, that variable's declaration needs to be dynamic, too. That seems kind of crazy, and I see no way to do that anyway. Maybe I'm going about this all wrong. So, what is the right approach? The problem I'm trying to solve is that I want to key off one of the parameters passed into my function, and then operate on either table_a or table_b, depending on that parameter (do some select queries, possibly followed by an update query). The column names are the same for both tables, so all other parts of the query should remain relatively static. Its just the table name I need to be dynamic with. Thanks, Gary On 6/25/07, gary jefferson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks Michael and Steve. Related question: If I previously had a IF EXISTS (select ...) statement, and the 'select ...' part now needs to be run with EXECUTE, how do I check for existence? It looks like I need to do an 'INTO' with a row variable? I can't seem to find an example snippet of how to accomplish this in the pg docs. Where should I be looking? Thanks again! Gary ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] [SQL] another simple SQL question
Joshua wrote: Ok here is another simple question from a novice Here is what my table looks like firstname lastname fullname -- -- --- smith, john green, susan white, jeff How can I break the fullname field into firstname lastname fields so it looks like the following: firstname lastname fullname - - - john smith smith, john susan green green, susan jeff white white, jeff Please let me know. Sorry for such simple novice questions, I appreciate your support. How I would do it would be to write a trivial application program to do it. I spent a long time working on databases of telephone directory information, and we needed to look up people by name, by address, by town, etc. It turned out that the best way to handle finding-name fields was to leave the first, middle, and last names in one field. A big problem is multicultural. Some people (e.g., Chinese) tend to give family name first followed by given name. Others (e.g., English) tend to give given names first, followed by family name. Telephone operating companies do not get these things correct, so it better just to keep them together. The relational database management system we used, that I originally wrote for UNIX, allowed partial matching on fields, and I even put a SOUNDEX scheme on the name fields. Thus, a query like 'ristorante italiano' would locate 'Moms Pizza Italian Restaurant' without doing a sequential search of the entire database. Similarly, 'T S Eliot' would locate 'Eliot Thomas Stearns'. Problems remain, such as 'Doug Mc Ilroy' would not find 'M Douglas McIlroy the way we built the program below. You might look here: http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/freeabs_all.jsp?tp=arnumber=810466isnumber=16537 for one way to do this. It explains briefly how to make a suitable index for it. -- .~. Jean-David Beyer Registered Linux User 85642. /V\ PGP-Key: 9A2FC99A Registered Machine 241939. /( )\ Shrewsbury, New Jerseyhttp://counter.li.org ^^-^^ 12:25:02 up 4 days, 20:00, 3 users, load average: 4.25, 4.14, 4.12 ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] permission denied for schema
Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
jef peeraer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Tom Lane schreef:
That's a foreign-key check, which is supposed to be done as the owner of
the table. You did not show us who owns table clienten, but I think
that role must be missing the intended(?) membership in deterp_group.
registratie=# \z deterp.clienten;
Access privileges for database registratie
Schema | Name | Type |Access privileges
+--+---+--
deterp | clienten | table | {jpe=arwdxt/jpe,deterp_group=arwdxt/jpe}
Hmm. This doesn't actually say so, but I think that jpe must be the
owner of clienten, and he's also the owner of the schema. Which makes
the failure really darn odd.
I tried to reproduce the situation on 8.1.9 and couldn't see any
problem. I do not see anything in the 8.1 CVS history that looks
related, but it's slightly possible this is a bug that's fixed between
8.1.3 and 8.1.9 (and even if that is not the case, you really really
ought to update anyway).
Just for the record, I've seen the same problem in my database (a
superuser trying to INSERT leads to the same security exception), not
sure which release but the version was 8.1. Haven't seen the problem
for some time now, currently running 8.1.8.
Regards,
Manuel.
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives?
http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] minimum function
Tom Lane wrote: Gunther Mayer [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: SELECT minimum(5,6) = 5 You're looking for the least/greatest functions (in 8.1 and up IIRC). regards, tom lane Awesome, that's exactly what I was looking for. My pl/pgsql minimum() hack is gonna go in the dumpster now ;-) Thanks so much guys. Gunther P.S.: Can't believe I didn't spot that in the documentation, that's what happens in the rare cases of using the wrong search terms... ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
[GENERAL] was is the normal number of postgres.exe?
We are testing an application received from a collaborator that uses the latest version of postgresql. After a few minutes of use we often see a dozen or more postgres.exe listed by the windows XP task manager. This is at a time when we are not doing anything with the application so these processes are not associated with our current use of the application. These processes are using zero cpu and between 2,500k and 3,500k of memory. Occasionally we also see one or two postgres.exe that are using about 50% of cpu. On another machine that is running postgresql as a service we usually see three or four postgresql. Any ideas about what could be causing the large number of postgres.exe or the cpu hogging postgres.exe? Thanks for any ideas or leads. -=bill ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [GENERAL] was is the normal number of postgres.exe?
In response to Wm.A.Stafford [EMAIL PROTECTED]: We are testing an application received from a collaborator that uses the latest version of postgresql. After a few minutes of use we often see a dozen or more postgres.exe listed by the windows XP task manager. This is at a time when we are not doing anything with the application so these processes are not associated with our current use of the application. These processes are using zero cpu and between 2,500k and 3,500k of memory. Occasionally we also see one or two postgres.exe that are using about 50% of cpu. On another machine that is running postgresql as a service we usually see three or four postgresql. Any ideas about what could be causing the large number of postgres.exe or the cpu hogging postgres.exe? Each connection to the database spawns a new process. On a POSIX system, you can use netstat to see what each process is connected to. I'm sure there's some equivalent on Windows. Connections that are idle still require a process running to handle them. If they're using CPU, then they are executing queries or doing other work. There are also a few processes that are always running depending on your configuration: the background writer, and possibly the autovacuum process. These will use CPU if they're actually doing work. -- Bill Moran http://www.potentialtech.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
[GENERAL] yet another simple SQL question
Ok, You guys must be getting sick of these newbie questions, but I can't resist since I am learning a lot from these email lists and getting results quick! Thanks to everyone for their contributions. Here is my questions I have a column that looks like this firstname - John B Mark A Jennifer D Basically I have the first name followed by a middle initial. Is there a quick command I can run to strip the middle initial? Basically, I just need to delete the middle initial so the column would then look like the following: firstname --- John Mark Jennifer Thanks again for all of your help today. Everything you guys have been sending has produced successful results. Thanks. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] Move a database from one server to other
Nicholas Barr writes: It is much much safer to use pg_dump/pg_restore and know that your data is consistent. http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/static/backup-dump.html In particular look at the section 23.1.2. Using pg_dumpall That will copy your entire data set including users. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [GENERAL] Automatic install on windows
Jason Long wrote: I have a client that wants a disaster recovery plan put into place. What is the easiest way to do a hands free install of postgresql on a window box? http://pginstaller.projects.postgresql.org/silent.html //Magnus ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
[GENERAL] Standby servers and incrementally updated backups
It is my understanding that once a standby server has reached the point where it is often waiting for wal files to replay, it is pretty much caught up to the primary server, with the differences being in whatever wal files are currently in queue to be archived by the primary. If I'm correct, then for large databases wherein it can take hours to take a base backup, is there anything to be gained by using incrementally updated backups? Erik Jones Software Developer | Emma® [EMAIL PROTECTED] 800.595.4401 or 615.292.5888 615.292.0777 (fax) Emma helps organizations everywhere communicate market in style. Visit us online at http://www.myemma.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] yet another simple SQL question
On Jun 25, 2007, at 12:44 PM, Joshua wrote: Ok, You guys must be getting sick of these newbie questions, but I can't resist since I am learning a lot from these email lists and getting results quick! Thanks to everyone for their contributions. Here is my questions I have a column that looks like this firstname - John B Mark A Jennifer D Basically I have the first name followed by a middle initial. Is there a quick command I can run to strip the middle initial? Basically, I just need to delete the middle initial so the column would then look like the following: firstname --- John Mark Jennifer Thanks again for all of your help today. Everything you guys have been sending has produced successful results. Try something along the lines of: SELECT substring(firstname from '^(\w*)\W') from table_name; Erik Jones Software Developer | Emma® [EMAIL PROTECTED] 800.595.4401 or 615.292.5888 615.292.0777 (fax) Emma helps organizations everywhere communicate market in style. Visit us online at http://www.myemma.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] Move a database from one server to other
On Jun 25, 2007, at 10:44 , Nicholas Barr wrote: Only copy the data directory if both servers are offline and not running and if both servers use the same version of postgres. ... and have the same architecture. As you note, copying the data directory is *not* the recommended way to do this. Use pg_dump[all] or something like Slony. Michael Glaesemann grzm seespotcode net ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] acampada
Sorry, I have no idea about what happen!! Sorry! El Lunes, 25 de Junio de 2007, Andrej Ricnik-Bay escribió: On 6/26/07, Adrián Ribao Martínez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ya he publicado la informacióne en la página y he abierto un post en el foro para organizarlo. Creo que lo mejor sería que fueras respondiendo a las preguntas que se formulan en el. Esta es la direccion: http://foro.universoheroes.com/showthread.php?tid=1105pid=21813#pid21813 Un saludo! Ok, so you top-post, and somehow get spanish onto an English list what was that all about? ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
[GENERAL] I want to apologize
Please, I'm sorry, I have sent some emails to the list that shouldn't go there. I have realized right now that there is a bug with Kmail, and every time I reply a message, the email address is [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have no idea why. Sorry again. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] Standby servers and incrementally updated backups
On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 13:42 -0500, Erik Jones wrote: It is my understanding that once a standby server has reached the point where it is often waiting for wal files to replay, it is pretty much caught up to the primary server, with the differences being in whatever wal files are currently in queue to be archived by the primary. Yes. You can tell by using select pg_xlogfile_name(pg_current_xlog_location()); to see what the current file on the Primary is. If I'm correct, then for large databases wherein it can take hours to take a base backup, is there anything to be gained by using incrementally updated backups? If you are certain there are parts of the database not touched at all between backups. The only real way to be sure is to take file level checksums, or you can trust file dates. Many backup solutions can do this for you. -- Simon Riggs EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [GENERAL] A problem in inheritance
to impact that update you'd have to have a rule on account_login. No rule on a child table will matter. Well i had the same perception In order to double check this i created an On insert do nothing rule on the child table and did an insertion to the master table i.e (account_login) but this time the On insert do nothing rule did affect and no insert was done to the child table... Note: I did not have any on insert do nothing rule on the master table. Regards, Talha Amjad On 6/23/07, Jim Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jun 20, 2007, at 12:53 PM, Talha Khan wrote: THE ACTUAL TEST: DROP RULE account_login_no_update ON account_login; UPDATE account_login set originating_source = 'xxx'; Now the update should not effect the child table but it does, evident from the output of the following query: That's because you dropped the rule that would have affected that query. Remember that rules effectively work on the query strings themselves, so to impact that update you'd have to have a rule on account_login. No rule on a child table will matter. -- Jim Nasby[EMAIL PROTECTED] EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com 512.569.9461 (cell)
Re: [GENERAL] Standby servers and incrementally updated backups
On Jun 25, 2007, at 3:40 PM, Simon Riggs wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 13:42 -0500, Erik Jones wrote: It is my understanding that once a standby server has reached the point where it is often waiting for wal files to replay, it is pretty much caught up to the primary server, with the differences being in whatever wal files are currently in queue to be archived by the primary. Yes. You can tell by using select pg_xlogfile_name(pg_current_xlog_location()); to see what the current file on the Primary is. Thanks for the tip. If I'm correct, then for large databases wherein it can take hours to take a base backup, is there anything to be gained by using incrementally updated backups? If you are certain there are parts of the database not touched at all between backups. The only real way to be sure is to take file level checksums, or you can trust file dates. Many backup solutions can do this for you. Wait, um, what? I'm still not clear on why you would want to run a backup of an already caught up standby server. Erik Jones Software Developer | Emma® [EMAIL PROTECTED] 800.595.4401 or 615.292.5888 615.292.0777 (fax) Emma helps organizations everywhere communicate market in style. Visit us online at http://www.myemma.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] VACUUM ANALYZE extremely slow
errr... workmem is 256Mb of course, and 5m for explain analyze costs. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] Dynamic Log tigger (plpgsql)
How can I do OLD.columnName != NEW.columnName if I don't know what the columnNames are at Compile Time? I have the columnName in a variable. Are you trying to do this from a plpgsql function? If so then I think you should try to do this from a C function. With C functions you will get more control over the new and old versions of the tuple since you get their pointers via TriggerData-tg_trigtuple (old tuple) and TriggerData-tg_newtuple (new tuple). I think this would work. And if there is no other possibility i will do that. But as I saw, it is necessary to have Sysadmin rights, if you want to add a C function. If possible i want to do it as a regular DB-Owner. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
[GENERAL] commit transaction failed
I m having a problem while calling the procedure in prostgresql 8.2
from adoconnection, It gets executed for some time and after 5-10 call
it gives error startTransaction failed or CommitTransaction Failed.
CREATE OR REPLACE FUNCTION sp_getnewfiles(IN strserverid character
varying, IN nmaxcount integer, OUT stroutrecno character varying) AS
$BODY$
DECLARE
cur RECORD;
i integer;
BEGIN
i:=0;
LOCK TABLE inputtable IN ROW EXCLUSIVE MODE NOWAIT;
FOR cur IN select recno from InputTable where FileState=0 order by
recno limit nMaxCount for update
LOOP
if i=0 then
strOutRecNo:='recno=';
else
strOutRecNo:=strOutRecNo || ' or recno=';
end if;
strOutRecNo:=strOutRecNo||cur.recno;
update inputtable set filestate=1,serverid=strServerID where
recno=cur.recno;
i:=i+1;
END LOOP;
EXCEPTION
WHEN no_data_found THEN
--DO NOTHING
WHEN OTHERS THEN
--rollback;
RAISE EXCEPTION 'some error';
END;
$BODY$
LANGUAGE 'plpgsql' VOLATILE STRICT;
the calling code is
CADOXSet rset(pCnn);
ostringstream ost;
ostselect * from
sp_getnewfiles('GetServerID()',nMaxCount);
rset.Open(ost.str());
ASSERT(rset.IsEOF()==false);
strRecNo=rset.GetFieldValue(0);
the error I encountered after some number of calls is either -
Error message: Unspecified error
Engine Used: PgOleDb
Error type : StartTransaction failed
or
Error message: Unspecified error
Engine Used: PgOleDb
Error type : commitTransaction failed
Thanks in advance:
Nasim
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
[GENERAL] Rule vs Trigger
Suppose I want to update a statistics table S after an insertion into an activity table A. In order to update S automatically, I can either create a rule on A or create an after trigger on A. What's the performance implication on using rule vs trigger? Thanks in advance. Alfred ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] VACUUM ANALYZE extremely slow
Hi. Sorry for being a bit emotional, I was pretty constructive in my earlier posts (the earlier, the more constructive if you care to search) but I am progressively getting pissed off :( Thanks for the initial tip, running ANALYZE w/o vacuum is faster. Are frequent vacuums even necessary if there are virtually no deletes in the system and updates are much less frequent compared to inserts? Now for the answers. * What other non-default configuration settings do you have? I played w/shared buffers, setting them between 16k and 32k,~ 24k seems to be the best but the difference is minimal. The work_mem setting is 256kb, and I increased effective cache size to ~700Mb (~35% ram) based on a tip from some article. max_fsm_* is increased too to accomodate vacuum analyze runs. * What version of PostgreSQL are you using and on what OS? 8.1 and Debian What kind of disks and controllers do you have? Umm... Unfortunately I do not know, and do not have access to check :) THe development server probably has a fast consumer grade HDD, not a RAID I suppose. * My system has to go down remark was probably a bit exaggerated; the system is noticeably slower when the vacuum is running and that is basically without workload; it will probably become unusable under load. * Specific queries that were slow: there are generally no specific queries, everything runs slowly, mostly due to estimates being grossly inaccurate (like 800k cost for a complex query based on Explain and then 5, actual cost based on e.analyze) I was not able to find any special bottlenecks in the queries. I come from MSSQL (and a bit of MySQL) background, and the only thing I noticed is that there are a lot of seqscans in the places where indexes should be used (imo), when I turn seqscans off indexes are ridiculously slow (I have already posted about it), presumably due to random access used to build a big result set; however, result set is not in fact big in real queries and postgres supposedly doesn't do some magic that MSSQL does (join order or something) that makes the join that should utilize the index narrower and thus faster. There are also some weird development-stage-specific bottlenecks like adding a column to 34m row table and updating it to default value (I wasn't able to wait till the end of that query, it probably runs for days); I think I understand why it is slow based on forum posts, but again, MSSQL and MySQL do it better. Also there's a general impression of everything being slow even after MySQL on the same server; starting from seqscans to aggregate operations; I won't be able to supply concrete evidence tho (not yet anyway), it's just the gut feeling. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
[GENERAL] pg_dump to include multiple tables
Hi All, I want to dump the database by using pg_dump command but the problem is the version at the server is 7.4 which doesn't support the provision for excluding tables as in version 8.2. There are 500+ tables in the database,from which 15-20 are of huge sizes.I want to exclude them.Is there any way to do it? I knw that I have to use include instead of excluding the tables.Do I have to include each and every tables manually or is there way to do that? Do i have to write the script for this? if yes, how should I proceed? Please help me out with this issue. Thanks in Advance. Cheers, Cha -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/pg_dump-to-include-multiple-tables-tf3944396.html#a11188783 Sent from the PostgreSQL - general mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] fsync error when restoring from archived xlogs
On 20/06/2007, at 6:48 AM, Simon Riggs wrote: This problem is fixed in 8.1.9. Seems it was inadvertently introduced in 8.1.7 (Jan 2007) and was not reported as a bug until after 8.1.8 was out, in early April. The 8.1.9 release notes make no mention of the bug fix, which isn't very helpful, I'll agree. It's a duplicate bug. Please check next time before you report. Simon, Thanks for the reply. Good to know that I wasn't just doing something stupid. :) To be fair, I did search for an answer before posting to the list. However, I must've been searching for the wrong terms as my search didn't turn up anything on the -bugs list! Regards, Tom ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] Standby servers and incrementally updated backups
On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 16:00 -0500, Erik Jones wrote: On Jun 25, 2007, at 3:40 PM, Simon Riggs wrote: If I'm correct, then for large databases wherein it can take hours to take a base backup, is there anything to be gained by using incrementally updated backups? If you are certain there are parts of the database not touched at all between backups. The only real way to be sure is to take file level checksums, or you can trust file dates. Many backup solutions can do this for you. Wait, um, what? I'm still not clear on why you would want to run a backup of an already caught up standby server. Sorry, misread your question. While you are running a warm standby config, you will still want to take regular backups for recoverability and DR. These are additional backups, i.e they are not required to maintain the warm standby. You can backup the Primary, or you can backup the Standby, so most people will choose to backup the Standby to reduce the overhead on the Primary. -- Simon Riggs EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [GENERAL] unexpected shutdown
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: My database has shutdown several times in the last couple days. I have no idea why. I am running centos and I have not rebooted the server or made any configuration changes. So in particular, you didn't disable memory overcommit? LOG: server process (PID 501) was terminated by signal 9 If you didn't issue a manual kill -9, then this is almost certainly a trace of the kernel OOM killer at work. Google for OOM kill to learn more, or see memory overcommit in the PG docs. Memory overcommit is evil on a server. regards, tom lane You guys were right :Jun 17 11:04:57 kernel: Out of Memory: Killed process 24928 (postmaster). I did not disable memory overcommit. I guess this is something I will have to do. I have actually never seen this before or heard of memory overcommit. I am surprised a setting like this comes enabled by default. I read a bit about it and it seems to make sense to disable it, but from practical experience do you know of any negative side effects? The consensus on using overcommit_memory = 2 is far from general. Your problem is a java application with memory issues, so I think you should address that directly first. Either run it elsewhere (and turn the host running PG into a dedicated one) or fix its memory leaks or use resource limits provided by the OS to limit the java app. Linux kernel people aren't totally clueless about VM. If they chose to keep overcommiting and the OOM killer enabled by default, there're reasons. With overcommitting on, you save al lot of swap space from being allocated, leaving it for stuff that is actually used and not just potentially used. The overall system throughput is thus higher. When it comes to OOM situation, with overcommitting off things aren't much better. First, OOM happens much before than with overcommiting on. This usually isn't perceived as a big advantage, since 95% of the cases the OOM is caused by one runaway process, so sooner or later it will cause OOM either way. But in a correctly administered server, with OS limits configured, a single runaway process doesn't cause OOM. OOM may still happen for excessive load, and I'd rather see my system handle some high load spikes than go into OOM situation. So lowering the threshold of what 'excessive load' is, isn't necessarily a good idea. And OK, let's say you've hit OOM anyway. There's no win-win solution. Having PG processes SIGKILL'd is quite bad. But sitting in front of a keyboard watching your system die w/o being able to login (OOM, so fork fails) isn't much better. You may be able to do something (sysrq, maybe) but the chances you manage to run a proper shutdown are quite thin, in the general case. So you have to choose between the risk of PG being SIGKILL'd (but the OOM _may_ pick the right process instead) and the risk of being forced into hitting the 'reset' button. Either way, your precious data isn't happy at all. So the bottom line is, avoid OOM by properly configuing OS resource limits. If you don't, then overcommit_memory = 2 is _definitely_ better. If you do, it's a hard call. If you think about it, the funny thing is that the more experienced the sysadm you're talking to is, the less experience he has about handling OOM situations. By definition. :) .TM. -- / / / / / / Marco Colombo ___/ ___ / / Technical Manager / / / ESI s.r.l. _/ _/ _/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
[GENERAL] Duplicate records returned
I'm getting duplicate rows returned. I don't know know and can't find out how to construct the SQL to return what I want. I have an old version of postgres which I cannot upgrade. I'm not even sure how to get the version. Does this help? $ grep -i version /pi/bin/setup wtversion='2.0' export wtversion My SQL knowledge is quite limited so I've searched all over the net and read doco but I can't figure this out. I want to find the total number of hours worked on all projects with projects.parent=Projects, projects.pct100, restrictions.hidden=5 (not hidden) I keep getting duplicate records and I think it's it's becuase I'm joining a table on 2 other tables. I've tried INTERSECT but I keep getting parse errors and can't work out why that is. I've tried creating a temp table but still have to do the twin joins!! I've also tried creating a view but without success Here's an example of correct data, a single user and a single project select username, sum(hours) from timerecs where project like 'Testing' and username = 'long' group by username ; username |sum -+--- long |127 but there will be many projects to process and to select the applicable projects requires test on 2 other tables, projects and restrictions $the_sql = SELECT projectname, username, sum(hours); $the_sql .= FROM timerecs; $the_sql .= WHERE projectname = projects.projectname ; $the_sql .= AND projectname = restrictions.projectname; $the_sql .= AND projects.parent = 'Projects'; $the_sql .= AND projects.pct 100; $the_sql .= AND restrictions.hidden = 5; $the_sql .= AND projectname = 'Testing'; # just for tsting $the_sql .= AND username = 'long'; # just for testing $the_sql .= AND projectname = projects.projectname ; $the_sql .= GROUP BY projectname, username; $the_sql .= ORDER BY projectname, username; $the_sql .= ;; produces 1 Testing|long|254 How do I get the right list of projectname from timerecs by joining with the projects and restrictions tables? I've tried SELECT DISTINCT projectname but make no difference. If I take the 'restrictions' join out it's fine. I've also tried prefacing all column names with table names without any change Thanks ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
[GENERAL] Error or bug?
Hi all. Under PGSQL v8.2.4, in a PL/PgSQL function whenver I try to run this statement: INSERT INTO table1 SELECT var1.*; I get his message: ERROR: record type has not been registered CONTEXT: SQL statement INSERT INTO table1 select $1 .* Of course var1 has been declared as table1 type. I suspect this could be a bug. But cannot be sure. Any hint? -- Vincenzo Romano -= NotOrAnd.IT Information Technologies =- tel +39 0823 454163 | cel +39 339 8083886 | fax +39 02 700506964 Smooth seas never make experienced sailormen ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
[GENERAL] postgresql varchar[] data type equivalent in Oracle
Dear All, I like to know about postgresql varchar[ ] data type equivalent in Oracle. Regards Murali Doss T.S.
Re: [GENERAL] problem importing data with psql
Hi All,
Am able to resolve the problem by setting PGPASSWORD=password in my
environment variables and passing the -q(quiet) command in my ant script.
Cheers,
Cha
cha wrote:
Hi All,
Am using the following command to import tables in my database. I got list
of tables which i need to import.
So have made ant script and batch file to accomplish the purpose.
Ant script contains all the configurations with following command :
arg line=/c psql -h ${db.host} -p ${db.port} ${db.name} -U ${db.user} -a
-v -d -f ${data.dir}/${db.name}/${table.name}-data.sql /
To call this ant file am passing the following command in my batch file as
:
call ant -f impdb.xml -Dtable.name=abc
call ant -f impdb.xml -Dtable.name=bcd
But am not able to import the tables with batch file, though am able to
run the same command from the prompt successfully.
I have to import 400+ tables , so need to automate the job rather than
manually.
So Can anyone throw light on this issue? Where am wrong? What's need to be
done?
Awaiting for the reply.
Cheers,
Cha
--
View this message in context:
http://www.nabble.com/problem-importing-data-with-psql-tf3956973.html#a11235322
Sent from the PostgreSQL - general mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate
subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your
message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
[GENERAL] dynamic table/col names in plpgsql
Is there a way to use a variable as the name of a table or column in plpgsql? This might be a simple question, but I can't find the answer in the docs. http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/interactive/plpgsql-declarations.html hints that there are data types that correspond to table/column, but I don't see them listed here http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/interactive/datatype.html ... Also, I assume that once I figure out the right datatypes, I can assign to them from functions like substring()? Thanks, Gary ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [GENERAL] Optimizer problem in 8.1.6
En un mensaje anterior, Michael Glaesemann escribió: On Jun 22, 2007, at 10:16 , Fernando Schapachnik wrote: EXPLAIN SELECT DISTINCT p.id Can you provide EXPLAIN ANALYZE? I suspect that when you rewrote the query it changed how the planner took into account the statistics. If your statistics are off, perhaps this changes how the planner rewrites the query. Sure. The DB is VACUUM'ed daily, and the users database only received a few updates per day. This is from the rewrote one: - Unique (cost=18.65..2838.38 rows=268 width=4) (actual time=0.265..1503.554 rows=209 loops=1) - Nested Loop (cost=18.65..2529.51 rows=123548 width=4) (actual time=0.257..1127.666 rows=101992 loops=1) - Index Scan using partes_tecnicos_pkey on partes_tecnicos p (cost=0.00..39.89 rows=268 width=4) (actual time=0.025..2.115 rows=209 loops=1) Filter: ((id_cola_por_ambito = 1) AND (id_situacion 6)) - Materialize (cost=18.65..23.26 rows=461 width=0) (actual time=0.005..1.817 rows=488 loops=209) - Nested Loop (cost=0.00..18.19 rows=461 width=0) (actual time=0.209..5.670 rows=488 loops=1) - Index Scan using active_users on users u (cost=0.00..5.97 rows=1 width=0) (actual time=0.141..0.147 rows=1 loops=1) Index Cond: (login = 'xxx'::text) Filter: (active AND ((field1 IS NULL) OR (NOT field1))) - Seq Scan on rel_usr_sector_parte_tecnico r (cost=0.00..7.61 rows=461 width=0) (actual time=0.053..1.995 rows=488 loops=1) Total runtime: 1504.500 ms (11 rows) The original one is taking a *lot* of time (more than an hour by now). Thanks! Fernando. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
[GENERAL] problem importing data with psql
Hi All,
Am using the following command to import tables in my database. I got list
of tables which i need to import.
So have made ant script and batch file to accomplish the purpose.
Ant script contains all the configurations with following command :
arg line=/c psql -h ${db.host} -p ${db.port} ${db.name} -U ${db.user} -a
-v -d -f ${data.dir}/${db.name}/${table.name}-data.sql /
To call this ant file am passing the following command in my batch file as :
call ant -f impdb.xml -Dtable.name=abc
call ant -f impdb.xml -Dtable.name=bcd
But am not able to import the tables with batch file, though am able to run
the same command from the prompt successfully.
I have to import 400+ tables , so need to automate the job rather than
manually.
So Can anyone throw light on this issue? Where am wrong? What's need to be
done?
Awaiting for the reply.
Cheers,
Cha
--
View this message in context:
http://www.nabble.com/problem-importing-data-with-psql-tf3956973.html#a11227923
Sent from the PostgreSQL - general mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate
subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your
message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
[GENERAL] Need help with generic query
Background: I have a number of schemas all of which contain a ticket table having the same columns. The goal of the function xticket1 below is to collect all ticket rows satisfying some condition from all those schemas, and additionally label each one by adding a new column containing the name of the schema it belongs to. -- Create a temporary table with the right layout -- for our function's return type (know a better way?) CREATE TEMP TABLE tix ( LIKE master.ticket ); ALTER TABLE tix ADD COLUMN schema_name text; CREATE OR REPLACE FUNCTION xticket1(condition TEXT) RETURNS SETOF tix AS $BODY$ DECLARE scm RECORD; result RECORD; BEGIN FOR scm IN SELECT schema_name FROM public.instance_defs LOOP FOR result IN EXECUTE 'SELECT ' || scm.schema_name || '.ticket.*,' || ' ''' || scm.schema_name || ''' AS schema_name' || ' FROM ' || scm.schema_name || '.ticket' || ' WHERE ' || condition LOOP RETURN NEXT result; END LOOP; END LOOP; RETURN; END; $BODY$ LANGUAGE plpgsql; The problem is, psql is complaining: ERROR: wrong record type supplied in RETURN NEXT I don't know why, and I don't know how to get psql to give me useful debugging info that would help me discover why. Can someone help? Thanks ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
[GENERAL] commit failed when calling postgresql procedure
PLATEFORM: VC++ 7 , ADO, WINDOWS 2003, POSTGRE 8.2
I m having a problem while calling the procedure in prostgresql 8.2
from adoconnection, It gets executed for some time and after 5-10 call
it gives error either startTransaction failed or commit failed.
CREATE OR REPLACE FUNCTION sp_getnewfiles(IN strserverid character
varying, IN nmaxcount integer, OUT stroutrecno character varying) AS
$BODY$
DECLARE
cur RECORD;
i integer;
BEGIN
i:=0;
LOCK TABLE inputtable IN ROW EXCLUSIVE MODE NOWAIT;
FOR cur IN select recno from InputTable where FileState=0 order by
recno limit nMaxCount for update
LOOP
if i=0 then
strOutRecNo:='recno=';
else
strOutRecNo:=strOutRecNo || ' or recno=';
end if;
strOutRecNo:=strOutRecNo||cur.recno;
update inputtable set filestate=1,serverid=strServerID where
recno=cur.recno;
i:=i+1;
END LOOP;
EXCEPTION
WHEN no_data_found THEN
--DO NOTHING
WHEN OTHERS THEN
--rollback;
RAISE EXCEPTION 'some error';
END;
$BODY$
LANGUAGE 'plpgsql' VOLATILE STRICT;
the calling code is
CADORecordset rset(pCnn);
rset.Open(select * from sp_getnewfiles('server',10));
strRecNo=rset.GetFieldValue(0);
the error I encountered after some number of calls is either -
Error message: Unspecified error
Engine Used: PgOleDb
Error type : StartTransaction failed
or
Error message: Unspecified error
Engine Used: PgOleDb
Error type : commit failed
Thanks in advance:
Nasim
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
[GENERAL] LC_CTYPE and matching accented chars
Trying to understand how I can get Pg 8.2 to match 'martín' when I
search for 'martin', and going through the documentation, specially
http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/static/locale.html
http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.1/static/functions-matching.html
Here is a transcript of my commandline - I suspect I am quite close, but
something is missing. Hints _really_ appreciated!
# do I have a Spanish locale on this box?
locale -a
# no I don't - let's make one
sudo locale-gen es_AR.utf8
# check that I have it
locale -a
...
sudo pg_createcluster --locale=es_AR.utf8 8.2 arg
sudo pg_ctlcluster 8.2 arg start
sudo -u postgres createdb --cluster 8.2/arg testing
sudo -u postgres psql --cluster 8.2/arg testing
# in psql...
=# create table test (value text);
CREATE TABLE
=# insert into test values ('martín');
INSERT 0 1
# this is apparently the right way to
# select base character based on the equivalence class
# as defined in the LC_CTYPE
=# select * from test where value ~ 'mart[=i=]n';
value
---
(0 rows)
# grumble - double check
=# SHOW LC_CTYPE;
lc_ctype
es_AR.utf8
Any hints in general?
- How can I read the LC_CTYPE definition? IOWs locale-gen has created a
binary blob in /usr/lib/locale/es_AR.utf8/LC_CTYPE but I sure there is
a human-readable definition somewhere...
- Is that the correct syntax?
- Pg bug? I doubt many people are counting on this behaviour... as it
seems to be widely announced to be brittle and slow.
cheers,
m
--
---
Martin @ Catalyst .Net .NZ Ltd, PO Box 11-053, Manners St, Wellington
WEB: http://catalyst.net.nz/ PHYS: Level 2, 150-154 Willis St
OFFICE: +64(4)916-7224 UK: 0845 868 5733 ext 7224 MOB: +64(21)364-017
Make things as simple as possible, but no simpler - Einstein
---
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives?
http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] Standby servers and incrementally updated backups
On Jun 25, 2007, at 4:40 PM, Simon Riggs wrote: On Mon, 2007-06-25 at 16:00 -0500, Erik Jones wrote: On Jun 25, 2007, at 3:40 PM, Simon Riggs wrote: If I'm correct, then for large databases wherein it can take hours to take a base backup, is there anything to be gained by using incrementally updated backups? If you are certain there are parts of the database not touched at all between backups. The only real way to be sure is to take file level checksums, or you can trust file dates. Many backup solutions can do this for you. Wait, um, what? I'm still not clear on why you would want to run a backup of an already caught up standby server. Sorry, misread your question. While you are running a warm standby config, you will still want to take regular backups for recoverability and DR. These are additional backups, i.e they are not required to maintain the warm standby. You can backup the Primary, or you can backup the Standby, so most people will choose to backup the Standby to reduce the overhead on the Primary. Ok, yeah, that's what I was thinking and is where we are headed in the next month or so here at work: we already have a standby running and will be adding a second standby server that we will be using for snapshot backups (packaged with the pertinent wal files...) as well as periodically bringing the second standby up to run dumps from just to cover all of our bases and also to be able to take our main primary server down for maintenance and still have both a production and standby running. I guess I was really just wanting to make sure I wasn't missing some other big usage for incremental backups from the standby. Erik Jones Software Developer | Emma® [EMAIL PROTECTED] 800.595.4401 or 615.292.5888 615.292.0777 (fax) Emma helps organizations everywhere communicate market in style. Visit us online at http://www.myemma.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
[GENERAL] CHECK
I would want to know as I make to control that the length of the field character insert is of one sure dimension ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
[GENERAL] Throwing exceptions
Hi, I need a way to throw a message in a function, when an exception occurs, but I don't want to write again and again the same message in every place I need to throw it. So, is there a way to handle this situation in a more general manner? Thanks in advance, -- Germán Hüttemann Arza CNC - Centro Nacional de Computación UNA - Universidad Nacional de Asunción Campus Universitario, San Lorenzo - Paraguay http://www.cnc.una.py - Tel.: +595 21 585550 ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [GENERAL] Rule vs Trigger
--- Alfred Zhao [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Suppose I want to update a statistics table S after an insertion into an activity table A. In order to update S automatically, I can either create a rule on A or create an after trigger on A. What's the performance implication on using rule vs trigger? Thanks in advance. My understanding is that Triggers offer better performance than rules do. However, one important advantage of triggers over rules is that rules are not able to correctly handle DML statements that affects more than one record in a single statement. Regards, Richard Broersma Jr. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] CHECK
--- scuffio [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would want to know as I make to control that the length of the field character insert is of one sure dimension A check constraint can certainly do this. If you want to generalize it, you can roll you check constraint into a domain (user defined column type). http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/interactive/ddl-constraints.html http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/interactive/sql-createdomain.html Regards, Richard Broersma Jr. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [GENERAL] Error or bug?
Vincenzo Romano [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Under PGSQL v8.2.4, in a PL/PgSQL function whenver I try to run this statement: INSERT INTO table1 SELECT var1.*; I get his message: ERROR: record type has not been registered Works for me: $ psql ... Welcome to psql 8.2.4, the PostgreSQL interactive terminal. ... regression=# create table table1(f1 int, f2 text); CREATE TABLE regression=# create or replace function foo() returns void as $$ declare var1 table1; begin select * into var1 from table1; insert into table1 select var1.*; end$$ language plpgsql; CREATE FUNCTION regression=# insert into table1 values(1,'one'); INSERT 0 1 regression=# select foo(); foo - (1 row) regression=# select * from table1; f1 | f2 +- 1 | one 1 | one (2 rows) If that's not what you did, then let's see exactly what you did do. regards, tom lane ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] Throwing exceptions
On Jun 21, 2007, at 10:30 , Germán Hüttemann Arza wrote: I need a way to throw a message in a function, when an exception occurs, but I don't want to write again and again the same message in every place I need to throw it. So, is there a way to handle this situation in a more general manner? The message is just a string. Assign the message to a variable and use the variable in place of the message. For example, in PL/pgSQL: k_error_message := 'Boom! %'; RAISE EXCEPTION k_error_message, v_foo.id; Hope that helps. Michael Glaesemann grzm seespotcode net ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] pg_dump to include multiple tables
On Jun 19, 2007, at 0:40 , cha wrote: I want to dump the database by using pg_dump command but the problem is the version at the server is 7.4 which doesn't support the provision for excluding tables as in version 8.2. The v8.2 pg_dump will be able to dump data from the v7.4 server, so use a newer pg_dump. Note that you may have difficulty loading the dump file created by the newer version into an older server. But hopefully you're upgrading, as 7.4 is getting a little long in the tooth. Michael Glaesemann grzm seespotcode net ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] pg_restore out of memory
Re-did the machine that was running out of memory and installed FreeBSD 6.2 AMD64. The rows that used to fail now load. Therefore, the problem is only with the i386 version. Should I report this as a bug or is this nornal and expected? ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] VACUUM ANALYZE extremely slow
Sergei Shelukhin escribió: * What other non-default configuration settings do you have? I played w/shared buffers, setting them between 16k and 32k,~ 24k seems to be the best but the difference is minimal. The work_mem setting is 256kb, and I increased effective cache size to ~700Mb (~35% ram) based on a tip from some article. max_fsm_* is increased too to accomodate vacuum analyze runs. work_mem = 256 MB is probably too much; you might be filling your RAM with it, causing the system to swap. Try decreasing it. This would be particularly noticeable under load. Keep in mind that work_mem is per sort/hash and per backend, i.e. if you have a query which does 3 sorts and is being executed by 5 processes in parallel, you will have 3 * 5 * 256 MB = 3840 MB of RAM in active use. * My system has to go down remark was probably a bit exaggerated; the system is noticeably slower when the vacuum is running and that is basically without workload; it will probably become unusable under load. You can set the vacuum_cost_* settings in order to reduce the impact of vacuum in the available I/O. * Specific queries that were slow: there are generally no specific queries, everything runs slowly, mostly due to estimates being grossly inaccurate (like 800k cost for a complex query based on Explain and then 5, actual cost based on e.analyze) You might want to try increasing statistic targets for the problematic columns. It would be useful to choose one of these and send them along for dissection here on the lists, to investigate the actual problems. Misestimations are a problem at times, but most of the time there are workarounds. -- Alvaro Herrerahttp://www.advogato.org/person/alvherre Oh, great altar of passive entertainment, bestow upon me thy discordant images at such speed as to render linear thought impossible (Calvin a la TV) ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] pg_restore out of memory
On Jun 25, 2007, at 9:33 PM, Francisco Reyes wrote: Therefore, the problem is only with the i386 version. Should I report this as a bug or is this nornal and expected? i wouldn't call it a bug to need more resources than you've got available :-) obviously the limits on the i386 version of FreeBSD are less than that on the amd64 version, but I've not got any big i386 machines (ie, more than 1Gb of RAM) to compare. All my big boxes are amd64. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [GENERAL] pg_restore out of memory
Vivek Khera writes: i wouldn't call it a bug to need more resources than you've got available :-) Hm... now I am really confused. The same settings on AMD64 work. So how are more resources available when I have the same amount of memory and the same settings? I even tried a machine with less memory, in AMD64 and the records that failed in i386 loaded fine. Even with default settings in postgresql.conf the problem records load whereas they fail in i386. I think it must be a variable that is likely 4 bits in i386 and 8bits in 64 bits. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] pg_restore out of memory
On Jun 25, 2007, at 10:32 PM, Francisco Reyes wrote: Hm... now I am really confused. The same settings on AMD64 work. So how are more resources available when I have the same amount of memory and the same settings? you set your maxdsize to the same as on i386? on even my smallest amd64 boxes I see a data size limit of 33Mb per process. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] pg_restore out of memory
Vivek Khera writes: you set your maxdsize to the same as on i386? On the AMD64 I have /boot/loader.conf as kern.ipc.semmni=256 kern.ipc.semmns=512 kern.ipc.semmnu=256 In i386 I believe I had set kern.ipc.semmni=256 kern.ipc.semmns=512 kern.ipc.semmnu=256 kern.maxdsiz=1600MB kern.dfldsiz=1600MB kern.maxssiz=512MB In another machine, my laptop, I did not even increase anything. Used defaults straight from postgresql.conf and the large columns loaded fine. All 4 trouble rows were above 80MB. Limits compared. AMD64 limit cputime unlimited filesize unlimited datasize 33554432 kbytes stacksize524288 kbytes coredumpsize unlimited memoryuseunlimited vmemoryuse unlimited descriptors 11095 memorylocked unlimited maxproc 5547 sbsize unlimited Limit in i386 was Report from limit: cputime unlimited filesize unlimited datasize 2097152 kbytes stacksize131072 kbytes coredumpsize unlimited memoryuseunlimited vmemoryuse unlimited descriptors 11095 memorylocked unlimited maxproc 5547 sbsize unlimited ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
[GENERAL] data partitions across different nodes
Are there any solutions based on PostgreSQL that can support distributing partitions (horizontal fragmentations) across different nodes. It doesn't need to support distributed transaction, since data inconsistent is not a critical problem in my situation. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] data partitions across different nodes
On 6/26/07, 金星星 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are there any solutions based on PostgreSQL that can support distributing partitions (horizontal fragmentations) across different nodes. It doesn't need to support distributed transaction, since data inconsistent is not a critical problem in my situation. pgpool-II might be what you're looking for. http://pgpool.projects.postgresql.org/pgpool-II/en/ Regards MP
[GENERAL] varchar(n) VS text
Having read http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/interactive/datatype-character.html I am puzzling over this issue: 1) Is there ever ANY reason to prefer varchar(n) to text as a column type? 2) For instance, if I know that a character-type column will never contain more than 300 characters, would I be better to define it as varchar(300) or as text? 3) What if, in practice that same column usually contains strings of no more than 10 characters (although I can't guarantee that it wouldn't explode up to 300 in the one-in-a-million case)? 4) On the other hand, what if a column systematically contains strings of 5 or fewer characters. Is it better to define it as varchar(5) or as text? From my reading of the dataype documentation, the ONLY reason I can think of for using varchar(n) would be in order to add an extra data-type constraint to the column. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] varchar(n) VS text
On Mon, 25 Jun 2007, Pierre Thibaudeau wrote: From my reading of the dataype documentation, the ONLY reason I can think of for using varchar(n) would be in order to add an extra data-type constraint to the column. That's my understanding as well. I can think of a few reasons to use char(n) over text if you know exactly how many characters you will always have, but char isn't what you asked about. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] varchar(n) VS text
Pierre Thibaudeau [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am puzzling over this issue: 1) Is there ever ANY reason to prefer varchar(n) to text as a column type? In words of one syllable: no. Not unless you have an application requirement for a specific maximum length limit (eg, your client code will crash if fed a string longer than 256 bytes, or there's a genuine data-validity constraint that you can enforce this way). Or if you want to have schema-level portability to some other DB that understands varchar(N) but not text. (varchar(N) is SQL-standard, while text isn't, so I'm sure there are some such out there.) From my reading of the dataype documentation, the ONLY reason I can think of for using varchar(n) would be in order to add an extra data-type constraint to the column. That is *exactly* what it does. No more and no less. There's no performance advantage, in fact you can expect to lose a few cycles to the constraint check. regards, tom lane ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 12:35:11AM -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
Michael Fuhr [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 09:51:30AM +0900, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
It seems that real takes 8 byte storage sizes.
Real is 4 bytes but other columns' alignment requirements might
result in no space being saved.
Even with no other columns involved, if you're on a machine with
MAXALIGN = 8 (which includes all 64-bit platforms as well as some
that aren't), the row width won't shrink.
I see table sizes shrink on 64-bit sparc and x86 architectures, as
in the following example that results in adjacent 4-byte columns.
Or am I misinterpreting what's happening?
test= create table test (col1 double precision, col2 integer);
CREATE TABLE
test= insert into test select 1.0, 1 from generate_series(1, 1);
INSERT 0 1
test= select pg_relation_size('test');
pg_relation_size
--
524288
(1 row)
test= alter table test alter col1 type real;
ALTER TABLE
test= select pg_relation_size('test');
pg_relation_size
--
450560
(1 row)
--
Michael Fuhr
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] writing debug output in perl
Harpreet Dhaliwal wrote: Can anyone help me out with funciton(s) to write a debug output in a perl function on postgres. Check out DBI-Link and see how it is done there: http://pgfoundry.org/projects/dbi-link/ Yours, Laurenz Albe ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
Actually, table size shrinked a little.
But I misinterpreted it as no shrinking.
I expected much more shrinking.
Thank you for your concerns.
Michael Fuhr [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I see table sizes shrink on 64-bit sparc and x86 architectures, as
in the following example that results in adjacent 4-byte columns.
Or am I misinterpreting what's happening?
test= create table test (col1 double precision, col2 integer);
CREATE TABLE
test= insert into test select 1.0, 1 from generate_series(1, 1);
INSERT 0 1
test= select pg_relation_size('test');
pg_relation_size
--
524288
(1 row)
test= alter table test alter col1 type real;
ALTER TABLE
test= select pg_relation_size('test');
pg_relation_size
--
450560
(1 row)
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives?
http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 12:35:11AM -0400, Tom Lane wrote: As for that pg_dump measurement, the text form isn't going to get smaller ... 1.2 is the same length as 1.2. Non-text formats like -Fc should (or might) shrink, right? They appear to in the tests I've done. -- Michael Fuhr ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Real type takes 4 byte storage sizes and double precision takes 8 bytes. I altered a data type from double precision to real and vacuumed DB. But PostgreSQL's data disk usage did not shrinked. And pg_dump size remained same. It seems that real takes 8 byte storage sizes. Keep in mind that vacuum doesn't immediately shorten the table when it finds free space. It just marks the space as free and available for reuse. This could also be due to alignment restrictions on the other columns or the row as a whole. If you're curious exactly what's going on and how to optimize your table layout send your table definition and we can tell you exactly how it's being laid out and where the extra 4 bytes are going. -- Gregory Stark EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
Michael Fuhr [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Altering a column's type rewrites the table so vacuuming afterward shouldn't be necessary. I'm gonna alter another table type from double precision to real. This table size is lager than disk free space. Can it be possible? Previsouly, I saw continuous increasing in disk usage until alter complete. I'm afraid of disk full and aftereffects. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
Gregory Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This could also be due to alignment restrictions on the other columns or the row as a whole. If you're curious exactly what's going on and how to optimize your table layout send your table definition and we can tell you exactly how it's being laid out and where the extra 4 bytes are going. Here's my table: create table WaferTestItem ( WaferID integer NOT NULL REFERENCES Wafer (ID), X integer NOT NULL, Y integer NOT NULL, TestItemID integer NOT NULL REFERENCES TestItem (ID), Value double precision NOT NULL, PRIMARY KEY (WaferID, X, Y, TestItemID) ); What happen if type of Value altered to real? ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Gregory Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This could also be due to alignment restrictions on the other columns or the row as a whole. If you're curious exactly what's going on and how to optimize your table layout send your table definition and we can tell you exactly how it's being laid out and where the extra 4 bytes are going. Here's my table: create table WaferTestItem ( WaferID integer NOT NULL REFERENCES Wafer (ID), X integer NOT NULL, Y integer NOT NULL, TestItemID integer NOT NULL REFERENCES TestItem (ID), Value double precision NOT NULL, PRIMARY KEY (WaferID, X, Y, TestItemID) ); What happen if type of Value altered to real? That table is pretty much optimally packed. It's 4+4+4+4+8 or 24 bytes with no padding between any of the fields. The next record can start immediately after the end of the previous one because 24 is a multiple of 8. If you reduce the last field to 4 bytes then it'll be 4+4+4+4+4 or 20 bytes. On your 64-bit platform you need 8-byte alignment for the next record so there'll be 4 bytes of padding before the next record. I haven't done the arithmetic but there's a small chance (like 1 in 14 think) that this size will leave just enough space at the end of the page for one extra record with the reduced size. In which case you would expect about 0.7% space savings (these are realy small tuples, one more on a page doesn't represent much saving). If you had happened to have one more integer then going to real would save you a lot of space though. Then it would be the difference between 32 and 24 bytes (plus record headers). That would be more than 12% saving (on 8.2 -- on 8.3 it would be over 14%). -- Gregory Stark EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
On Monday 25 June 2007 03:35, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Michael Fuhr [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Altering a column's type rewrites the table so vacuuming afterward
shouldn't be necessary.
I'm gonna alter another table type from double precision to real.
This table size is lager than disk free space.
Can it be possible?
Previsouly, I saw continuous increasing in disk usage until
alter complete.
I'm afraid of disk full and aftereffects.
Correct, modifying table data types requires a table re-write, so you're
likely to run out of space. You're not too likely to have much trouble by
trying, when you run out of disk space the transaction will roll back and you
should be ok. One method to try and get around this might be to drop and
then recreate relevant indexes (thereby freeing up space ahead of time)
though you'll need to commit between those commands. HTH
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter LAMP :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [GENERAL] Experiences of PostgreSQL on-disk bitmap index patch
On Thursday 21 June 2007 04:39, Christan Josefsson wrote:
Ok.
Big thanks for the information.
You mentioned Bizgres, do you have any more information in that direction,
or do you know who to contact regarding information on Bizgres bitmap
indexes. If there is a bitmap index patch in Bizgres which can be applied
to the latest stable source of PostgreSQL then I have a solution until 8.4
(which I according to your answers is the assumed release for introducing
on-disk bitmap indexes).
If you really want to see on-disk bitmaps in, you might want to study the
patches and the missing vacuum related bits and then think about submitting
an updated version. My take on the future of that patch is the original
developers aren't terribly motivated to finish it, in much part because some
of the testing people have done vs. 8.3 shows it solves an even smaller
number of issues than originally hoped. my .02 anyway.
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter LAMP :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [GENERAL] Experiences of PostgreSQL on-disk bitmap index patch
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Christan Josefsson) writes: So you indicate that the so called bitmap index scan, a.k.a in-memory bitmap indexes (right?), already adds such an improvement when it comes to optimized response time on large query sets (having the characteristics as normally used to identify cases where bitmap indexes improves performance like: low cardinality keys, large data volumes etc), so that the on-disk indexes are not really needed or atleast not worth wile implementing? It looks very much like that may be the case... Bitmap index scans have a somewhat different set of functionality, but there is enough overlap that the cases where on-disk bitmap indexes are useful (and in-memory bitmap scans aren't) look like rare edge cases. There may be users that see those rare edge cases all the time; they'll find on-disk bitmap indexes worth having, and, possibly, worth implementing. But to be sure, there used to be a lot of burning interest in on-disk bitmap indexes, and in-memory bitmap index scans have quenched many of the flames... -- cbbrowne,@,cbbrowne.com http://linuxfinances.info/info/advocacy.html WindowsNT will not accept fecal matter in its diet... it's that simple. I suppose that is a good ward against cannibalism. -- Nick Manka ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] Experiences of PostgreSQL on-disk bitmap index patch
Thanks Robert!
So you indicate that the so called bitmap index scan, a.k.a in-memory bitmap
indexes (right?), already adds such an improvement when it comes to
optimized response time on large query sets (having the characteristics as
normally used to identify cases where bitmap indexes improves performance
like: low cardinality keys, large data volumes etc), so that the on-disk
indexes are not really needed or atleast not worth wile implementing?
Regards,
Christian
2007/6/25, Robert Treat [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
On Thursday 21 June 2007 04:39, Christan Josefsson wrote:
Ok.
Big thanks for the information.
You mentioned Bizgres, do you have any more information in that
direction,
or do you know who to contact regarding information on Bizgres bitmap
indexes. If there is a bitmap index patch in Bizgres which can be
applied
to the latest stable source of PostgreSQL then I have a solution until
8.4
(which I according to your answers is the assumed release for
introducing
on-disk bitmap indexes).
If you really want to see on-disk bitmaps in, you might want to study the
patches and the missing vacuum related bits and then think about
submitting
an updated version. My take on the future of that patch is the original
developers aren't terribly motivated to finish it, in much part because
some
of the testing people have done vs. 8.3 shows it solves an even smaller
number of issues than originally hoped. my .02 anyway.
--
Robert Treat
Build A Brighter LAMP :: Linux Apache {middleware} PostgreSQL
Re: [GENERAL] alter table type from double precision to real
Michael Fuhr [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 12:35:11AM -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
Even with no other columns involved, if you're on a machine with
MAXALIGN = 8 (which includes all 64-bit platforms as well as some
that aren't), the row width won't shrink.
I see table sizes shrink on 64-bit sparc and x86 architectures, as
in the following example that results in adjacent 4-byte columns.
Or am I misinterpreting what's happening?
Sorry, I should've clarified that this depends on whether the total row
length is a multiple of 8. In your example, you have an 8-byte column
followed by a 4-byte column. MAXALIGN-8 machines will pad the row
length to 16 bytes. You then altered it to be two 4-byte columns,
requiring no padding to have a row length of 8 bytes. (Plus overhead
of course, but the overhead is MAXALIGN'd anyway.)
The case I was thinking of was more like this:
regression=# create table test (col1 double precision);
CREATE TABLE
regression=# insert into test select 1.0 from generate_series(1, 1);
INSERT 0 1
regression=# select pg_relation_size('test');
pg_relation_size
--
368640
(1 row)
regression=# alter table test alter col1 type real;
ALTER TABLE
regression=# select pg_relation_size('test');
pg_relation_size
--
368640
(1 row)
The space savings disappears into alignment padding.
regards, tom lane
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
[GENERAL] simple SQL question
I have a column with the following values (example below) 5673 4731 4462 5422 756 3060 I want the column to display the numbers as follows: 56.73 47.31 44.62 54.22 7.56 30.60 I have been playing around with string functions but cannot seem to figure out a quick solution. Does anyone have any suggestions? Please let me know. Thanks. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: {Spam} [GENERAL] simple SQL question
Le lundi 25 juin 2007, Joshua a écrit : I have been playing around with string functions but cannot seem to figure out a quick solution. Does anyone have any suggestions? Please let me know. What about: pgloader=# select a::float / 100 from (values(5673), (4731), (4462), (5422), (756), (3060)) as x(a); ?column? -- 56.73 47.31 44.62 54.22 7.56 30.6 (6 lignes) -- dim signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [GENERAL] Experiences of PostgreSQL on-disk bitmap index patch
Chris Browne [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: But to be sure, there used to be a lot of burning interest in on-disk bitmap indexes, and in-memory bitmap index scans have quenched many of the flames... Well, we had in-memory bitmaps already in 8.1, and the bitmap index work happened since that. I think the main argument for bitmap indexes is the potential to make the index smaller. A btree index requires a minimum of 16 bytes per entry (20 if MAXALIGN=8), whereas a bitmap index can in principle get down to a few bits per entry for a high-cardinality column value. So you could hope for a 10x smaller index and corresponding reduction in index search time. The fly in the ointment is that if the column value is so high cardinality as all that, it's questionable whether you want an index search at all rather than just seqscanning; and it's definite that the index access cost will be only a fraction of the heap access cost. So the prospects for actual net performance gain are a lot less than the index-size argument makes them look. There doubtless are gains on some workloads, but how much and on how wide a range of workloads is still an open question. regards, tom lane ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] simple SQL question
On Mon, 25 Jun 2007, Joshua wrote: I have a column with the following values (example below) 5673 4731 4462 5422 756 3060 Are these numbers that will be used in calculations, or are they strings? I want the column to display the numbers as follows: 56.73 47.31 44.62 54.22 7.56 30.60 Numeric(4,2) will do this. Also, whatever the UI you are using in your application can make the translation from display format to storage format. I have been playing around with string functions but cannot seem to figure out a quick solution. Does anyone have any suggestions? If they are strings, why not enter and store them with the decimal point? Rich -- Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D. |The Environmental Permitting Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.| Accelerator(TM) http://www.appl-ecosys.com Voice: 503-667-4517 Fax: 503-667-8863 ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
[GENERAL] another simple SQL question
Ok here is another simple question from a novice Here is what my table looks like firstname lastname fullname -- -- --- smith, john green, susan white, jeff How can I break the fullname field into firstname lastname fields so it looks like the following: firstname lastname fullname - - - john smith smith, john susan green green, susan jeff white white, jeff Please let me know. Sorry for such simple novice questions, I appreciate your support. THANKS! ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
[GENERAL] Move a database from one server to other
Hello, I have to move all the data in my actual server to the new one. I have several databases in postgresql, and I'd like to know the best way to move them. I thoung that maybe copying all the data directory... but I'm not sure, and I don't know where it's stored. I'd apreciate your help. Thank you very much. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] another simple SQL question
Ok here is another simple question from a novice
Here is what my table looks like
firstname lastname fullname
-- -- ---
smith, john
green, susan
white, jeff
How can I break the fullname field into firstname lastname fields so it
looks like the following:
firstname lastname fullname
- - -
john smith smith, john
susan green green, susan
jeff white white, jeff
Please let me know. Sorry for such simple novice questions, I appreciate
your support.
THANKS!
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
temp=# create table temptable3 (firstname varchar(32), lastname
varchar(32), fullname varchar(32)) without oids;
CREATE TABLE
temp=# insert into temptable3 (fullname) values ('smith, john');
INSERT 0 1
temp=# insert into temptable3 (fullname) values ('spencer, frank');
INSERT 0 1
temp=# select * from temptable3; firstname | lastname |fullname
---+--+
| | smith, john
| | spencer, frank
(2 rows)
temp=# update temptable3 set firstname=trim(substring(fullname from
position(',' in fullname) + 1)), lastname=trim(substring(fullname from 0
for position(',' in fullname)));
UPDATE 2
temp=# select * from temptable3; firstname | lastname |fullname
---+--+
john | smith| smith, john
frank | spencer | spencer, frank
(2 rows)
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [GENERAL] Move a database from one server to other
Hello, I have to move all the data in my actual server to the new one. I have several databases in postgresql, and I'd like to know the best way to move them. I thoung that maybe copying all the data directory... but I'm not sure, and I don't know where it's stored. I'd apreciate your help. Thank you very much. Only copy the data directory if both servers are offline and not running and if both servers use the same version of postgres. This method is not recommended AFAIK. It is much much safer to use pg_dump/pg_restore and know that your data is consistent. http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/static/backup-dump.html Nick ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [GENERAL] dynamic table/col names in plpgsql
Thanks Michael and Steve. Related question: If I previously had a IF EXISTS (select ...) statement, and the 'select ...' part now needs to be run with EXECUTE, how do I check for existence? It looks like I need to do an 'INTO' with a row variable? I can't seem to find an example snippet of how to accomplish this in the pg docs. Where should I be looking? Thanks again! Gary On 6/23/07, Michael Glaesemann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jun 23, 2007, at 22:47 , gary jefferson wrote: Is there a way to use a variable as the name of a table or column in plpgsql? AIUI, you need to use EXECUTE and build the query string yourself. http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/interactive/plpgsql- statements.html#PLPGSQL-STATEMENTS-EXECUTING-DYN Take a look at the quote_ident function as well: http://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.2/interactive/functions-string.html Hope this helps you get started. Michael Glaesemann grzm seespotcode net ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org/
Re: [GENERAL] acampada
Ya he publicado la informacióne en la página y he abierto un post en el foro para organizarlo. Creo que lo mejor sería que fueras respondiendo a las preguntas que se formulan en el. Esta es la direccion: http://foro.universoheroes.com/showthread.php?tid=1105pid=21813#pid21813 Un saludo! El Jueves, 21 de Junio de 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: muchísimas gracias Adrián, hasta pronto, un saludo Guadalupe si conectan conmigo ,iré informándote para que sepas como va la acampada Adrián Ribao Martínez [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha escrito: Hola, si lo he recibido, es que he estado un poco liado, a ver si lo pongo pronto en la página y el foro ok? Siento el retraso, un saludo. El Miércoles, 20 de Junio de 2007, escribió: Hola Adrián soy Guadalupe, la de la acampada para el concierto de los Héroes en zaragoza, te envié dos mensajes hace unos días, uno por este medio y otro desde mi correo particular, los has recibido?? podrás poner la información el foro?,necesitas algun dato más? bueno, espero tus noticias, gracias de antemano. un saludo Guadalupe Adrián Ribao Martínez [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha escrito: Hola, he leido tu correo de casualidad, porque miro entre los 1300 mensajes que tengo de spam una vez al año, y resulta que estaba alli el tuyo. Me parece una idea muy interesante, si quieres puedo publicarlo en la página, no se si estais ya llenos o no. Sobre cuanto es el precio? ¿cuantos autobuses habría y la frecuencia de cada uno? Un saludo. El Jueves, 14 de Junio de 2007, escribió: Hola, me pongo en contaco contigo, por ver si puedes ayudarme, deseo dar información a todos aquellos fans que tengan su entrada para ir a los conciertos de los dias 10 y 12 de octubre a Zaragoza, y se hayan quedado sin alojamiento, para darles una opción . se está creando la organización , para una acampada esos dias,en la comarca de la Ribera Alta del Ebro, varios pueblos (todos de 20 a 30 km de la ciudad, con accesos por autopista o autovia) la montarán especialmente para estas personas, dándoles el servicio de baños, autocar para bajar a Zaragoza al concierto y delvoverlos al camping, comida al dia siguiente , con vigilanciaen fin, creemos que estará muy bien, el precio será muy adecuado , y tenemos ya a unos 150 inscritos. como todo está bastante organizado ya, nos parece adecuado que si hay alguien que no encuentre sitio, y esta opción le interese, pudiese ponerse en contacto con nosotros, le indicaríamos de que forma se hará la reserva y dariamos toda la información adecuada. gracias, si puedes ,desde tu expriencia en el foro, podria ser una buena ayuda. si desean, pueden ponerse en contacto por medio de : [EMAIL PROTECTED], mi nombre es Guadalupe, pueden dirigirse desde alli, les responderemos a todos. muchas gracias un saludo ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
