Re: Status of PSR-12 survey

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,
Sorry for being a little late to this party, FIG has me a little exhausted
at the moment to say the least. I agree with pretty much all of the
opinions and responses in this thread other than the ones saying we should
wait or that we should use the survey result as gospel. We are still moving
forward with our plans to do a survey (As Paul recommended and campaigned
for) and we will use our brains to decide what the best options are based
on that survey.

It's just a matter of shaving off time and focus for me, I'm working on
getting to that point but life has been hectic. I think Michael's "before
the end of august" is a good estimate that we are shooting for.

Paul, I really appreciate the amount of energy you're putting into the
PSR-12 discussion. We've already decided to do a more thorough survey based
on your feedback, however we will not concede to waiting or to deciding on
the final content of PSR-12 strictly based on a survey. Instead, we will
send out the survey and will use the results to determine the best content
for PSR-12. Once that is over and done with you can express your opinion on
the matter through a vote.

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Tue, Aug 2, 2016 at 1:09 AM 'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
Interoperability Group  wrote:

> We hear you. We'll collect as much data as we can. Then will build a PSR
> based on the data collected but not only the data collected.
>
>
> On Monday, August 1, 2016 at 5:51:19 PM UTC+3, Larry Garfield wrote:
>>
>> On 08/01/2016 01:32 AM, Andrew Carter wrote:
>> > Some projects still don't use PSR-2 because of the hell involved in
>> changing style guide mid project when you have hundreds of pull requests.
>> PSR-2 didn't have the option of being prescriptive.
>>
>> Additionally, the "lowest common denominator only" approach of PSR-2 led
>> to inconsistencies that still hinder its adoption.  (The confusing and
>> inconsistent braces placement is *the* number 1 reason why Drupal still
>> refuses to adopt PSR-2, even moreso than the massive impact on the
>> codebase and community that such a change would entail.)  Simply rubber
>> stamping a plurality survey does not lead to a consistent and coherent
>> spec, which is what we should be striving to achieve.
>>
>> > The job of the FIG is to solve problems by working together?
>> >
>> > These projects are the community, so if they all work together creating
>> one now - there's the best chance of acceptance. The more code written with
>> custom style guides - the less likely this standard will achieve acceptance
>> amongst the bigger projects.
>> >
>> > All projects here will need a PHP 7 style guide. Just make one together
>> now rather than all making different ones.
>> >
>> > I've got nothing else to add so self throttling. Maybe this is the sort
>> of thing voting members need to be surveyed on (prescriptive or
>> descriptive).
>>
>> Also quoting from Chris Tankersley:
>>
>>  > Which is the intent of the FIG? To provide an after-the-fact decision
>> on how things should work, like the RFC process, or provide details on
>> how things should work _before_ there is widespread adoption, more akin
>> to the ISO process?
>>
>> In practice, a balance between the two.  That is informally the case
>> now, and FIG 3's mission statement makes that explicit.  We should not
>> be inventing things entirely from whole cloth, but that doesn't mean we
>> are bound exclusively to "what's been done already we can rubber stamp",
>> either.
>>
>> PSR-0 was similar to the PEAR convention, but as no one was using
>> namespaces yet it was still forward-looking, based on experience.
>>
>> PSR-3 was closely based on Monolog, but also pulled in a tokenizing
>> system inspired by Drupal, but using a syntax that was more Twig-esque
>> than either system.
>>
>> PSR-4 was based on a feature request, but no one was using "truncated"
>> paths yet at that point.  It was new, innovative, and controversial, but
>> the right call.
>>
>> PSR-6 was developed essentially in parallel with Stash.
>>
>> PSR-7 was naturally inspired by both HttpFoundation and Zend Framework's
>> Request library, but the use of a mostly-immutable design was fairly new
>> and neither major HTTP library at the time was already doing that.  It
>> was still a good call, however, despite being "innovative".
>>
>> We absolutely should gather data on what projects are already doing
>> already (for PSR-12 or for anything else), but it is grossly negligent
>> to say that we must be enslaved to the result.  Producing a good spec is
>> more important than producing a legacy-centric spec. Historically,
>> that's almost always been our approach, and should remain so.
>>
>> And now we've repeated in this thread the same conversation we've had
>> about PSR-12 every time it's come up, to the same result.
>>
>> --Larry Garfield
>>
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Re: [PSR-12] Enforce short type keywords

[Korvin Szanto]

I think that's the way to go. Change it from "in both code and
documentation blocks i.e." to "in code i.e."

Thanks,
Korvin

On Tue, Aug 2, 2016 at 6:24 AM 'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
Interoperability Group  wrote:

> So would it be OK if we won't touch documentation i.e. remove "in both
> code and documentation blocks"?
>
>
> On Tuesday, August 2, 2016 at 1:28:07 PM UTC+3, Michael Cullum wrote:
>
>> My main issue with this change is that it dictates how it should be used
>> in documentation (essentially doc blocks and comments), and presently
>> nothing (I think) in PSR-2 or PSR-12 dictates how comments or docs should
>> be done as well as code. I'd therefore say this is out of scope.
>>
>> Furthermore, whilst neither of these two issues are enough to warrant
>> removal on their own [in my opinion], I'd add it introduces a BC break on
>> PSR-2 which is relatively un-necessary nor hugely helpful and the link to
>> it being added due to a PHP 7 feature is rather tenuous (although no more
>> so than that relating to operators, hence I say this is not reason enough
>> on its own).
>>
>> Many thanks,
>> Michael Cullum
>> (Not speaking as Secretary but as Former PSR-12 Editor inline with
>> declared conflicts of interest)
>>
> On 2 Aug 2016 9:10 a.m., "'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
>> Interoperability Group"  wrote:
>>
> PSR-5 scope is phpDoc exclusively. It cannot affect types used for
>>> typecasting.
>>>
>>> On Monday, August 1, 2016 at 6:32:45 PM UTC+3, Larry Garfield wrote:

 On 07/31/2016 02:03 PM, 'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
 Interoperability Group wrote:

 For the PSR-12 coding standard I've made a change that forces using
 short form of type keywords i.e. bool instead of boolean, int instead of
 integer etc.:


 https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/commit/a77993bdf52eb6d5cb9ca37dba3af4df9e3b909c

 As Michael Cullum pointed out, I was too fast and it should be
 discussed. I need your answers for the following questions:

 1. If this additional rule makes sense?
 2. What possible drawbacks are there?

 *Why was the change made*

 PHP 7.0 introduced scalar types declaration
 
 which does not support long type aliases. Therefore it makes sense to
 enforce primary short type forms to be used to have uniform syntax and
 prevent possible confusion.

 *Counter-agruments from Michael*

 This could conflict with other PSRs like PSR-5 and seems out of scope
> of this PSR to be honest.


 I fully agree with the policy.  With PHP 7 using only short-versions
 for types it makes sense for everything else to follow that as well.

 However, I'm sympathetic to the scope question.  It does seem more like
 PSR-5's responsibility.  PSR-5 isnt' finalized (and is currently fallow),
 so it's not binding on anything.

 I guess I could go either way here, although unless PSR-12 considers
 coding style within docblocks generally to be in scope (I don't think it
 does?) I'd probably agree with Michael and remove it.  Whenever PSR-5 gets
 reactivated that change should be made there instead.

 --Larry Garfield

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Re: [Vote] Require Aura project to replace its representative

[Korvin Szanto]

Looks like this vote is not going to pass, but I feel like I should cast my
vote regardless and +0 feels like an easy way out.

+1 concrete5

To me the issue is that Paul does not acknowledge that his behavior is
detrimental, I have no reason to believe that he is going to make any
attempt to be more civil and amicable in the future.
My vote would be a -1 if I had seen Paul respond with something like "Well
I didn't feel like I was being inappropriate, but I see how you could feel
that way. I'll try to be more considerate in the future."

Thanks,
Korvin

On Tue, Aug 2, 2016 at 4:35 AM Lukas Kahwe Smith 
wrote:

> -1 from Jackalope
>
> > On 29 Jul 2016, at 01:56, Samantha Quiñones 
> wrote:
> >
> > All,
> >
> > The discussion period having concluded, I am now opening a vote on the
> matter of the proposal to require the Aura project to name a new voting
> representative.
> >
> > The discussion thread is available here:
> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/php-fig/w38tCU4mdgU/R1oyiIMuAAAJ
> >
> > To summarize, I am opening this vote at the request of a number of
> voting representatives who have asked that this matter be taken up under
> the Voting Representatives section of the Membership Bylaw, the full text
> of which is located here:
> http://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/membership/#voting-representatives. The
> relevant section of the bylaw is as follows:
> >
> > "If, in the judgement of PHP-FIG, a Voting Representative is acting
> inappropriately and to the detriment of PHP-FIG's ability to meet its
> objectives, a vote may be taken to request a replacement Voting
> Representative in accordance with the Voting Protocol bylaw or to expel the
> Member Project where replacing a Voting Representative is not possible."
> >
> > A vote of +1 is a vote for requiring the Aura project to name a new
> voting representative.
> >
> > A vote of -1 is a vote against requiring the Aura project to name a new
> voting representative.
> >
> > If the motion passes, the current voting representative (Paul M. Jones)
> will be removed as the listed voting representative for the Aura project.
> The Aura project may then name a new representative in the usual fashion.
> If the project fails to name a new representative, it is subject to
> expulsion under the bylaws.
> >
> > If the motion fails, the Aura project will not be required to name a new
> representative.
> >
> > This vote will proceed according the Voting Protocol and will close on
> 11-August-2011 at 23:59 UTC.
> >
> > To further clarify, this vote is not a vote to ban Paul M. Jones from
> participation in the FIG, only to request the Aura project to name a new
> voting representative. Further, this vote is not about whether you like or
> dislike Paul, but if you believe that he has acted in a way detrimental to
> the FIG.
> >
> > I want to make it explicitly and unequivocally clear that the purpose of
> this thread is for qualified voting members to vote on the matter at hand.
> This is a very sensitive issue and I will not tolerate discussion or
> flaming in this thread. I ask that all participants please respect Paul's
> dignity, as well as the dignity of the FIG, and refrain from personal
> attacks or other disruptive or divisive behavior. There are human beings
> involved in absolutely every step of this process and I further ask you to
> give one another the benefit of the doubt and operate from the assumption
> that others are working as hard for the success and advancement of the FIG
> as you are.
> >
> > If you have any questions about this vote, please direct them to info
> [at] php-fig.org.
> >
> > Thank you for your participation,
> > Samantha Quiñones, Secretary
> >
> > --
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> .
> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
> regards,
> Lukas Kahwe Smith
> sm...@pooteeweet.org
>
>
>
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Re: [VOTE] "FIG 3.0" Bylaw amendments

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 concrete5

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:39 AM Larry Garfield 
wrote:

> A few days later than planned, but I am hereby opening a vote for the
> following bylaw changes, colloquially known as "FIG 3.0".
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/752
>
> The vote will be open for 2 weeks, closing on 2 September 2016 @ 23:59 UTC.
>
> As usual, the vote is open to voting representatives only and is a
> simple +1/-1 vote.
>
> --Larry Garfield
>
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Re: [VOTE] Secretary Election August 2016

[Korvin Szanto]

concrete5:

1. Jonathan
2. Phil
3. Amanda
4. Matthew
5. Samantha

On Tue, Aug 23, 2016 at 10:43 PM Michael Cullum  wrote:

> A reminder this vote ends very soon: *23:59 UTC on the 26th August*
>
> --
> Michael C
> PHP FIG Secretary
>
> On Monday, 22 August 2016 15:01:09 UTC+8, Leo Feyer wrote:
>>
>> Contao:
>>
>> Amanda Folson
>> Samantha Quiñones
>> Jonathan Reinink
>> Matthew 'Matt' Trask
>> Phil Sturgeon
>> Paul 'PMJ' Jones
>>
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Re: Alternative to FIG 3.0 - Is it time to call FIG complete?

[Korvin Szanto]

On Mon, Aug 29, 2016 at 8:06 AM Joe Ferguson  wrote:

> For another group to be successful I believe FIG would have to close up
> shop. Disband sounds like the wrong word to me. I do like "Archive" that
> Woody mentioned previously.
>
> A potential new organization road map for what FIG may need to do & what a
> new organization would need to do:
>
> FIG's agenda:
>
> * Formal 2 week discussion to discuss the following points:
> * Do voting reps want to close up / disband / archive FIG? - If Yes,
> continue
> * Allow transfer of all in progress work to any new organization that
> is willing to pick it up
> * Set end date for FIG (~4-6 weeks after passing vote closes)
> * End date allows time for any formal last minute business & lead time
> for new organization.
> * Stop opening votes for FIG members to vote on (So that this vote is the
> last closed vote)
> * Open 2 week voting period
>
>
> New Org Agenda:
>
> * Get your ducks in a row asap
> * Write your bylaws / Figure out who and how your membership works
> * Formally declare your intentions to FIG voting members
> * Start talking to everyone currently working on in progress work and
> inform them of your intentions
>
>
I just don't see why this is at all necessary, what does this get us other
than a new name? To me it seems like this is just a semantic runaround for
what old fig will be once fig 3.0 passes. IMO once FIG 3.0 is around for a
little bit of time, FIG 2.0 will become just a slide on someones
presentation and that's all. What does it matter if that slide says "Gone:
Disbanded then remade into FIG 3.0" vs "Gone: Reformed as FIG 3.0"?


>
> IMHO a competing organization to FIG would struggle. I feel like the best
> path forward in this scenario *requires* FIG to no longer be active.
>
>
Definitely agree here, FIG is not much without the people that make it
happen and those people need whatever extra time they have to be devoted to
the most current organization instead of being split unnecessarily.


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Re: [VOTE] PSR-6 Errata

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 concrete5

On Sat, Aug 27, 2016 at 5:31 PM Chuck Burgess  wrote:

> -1 from PEAR
>
> CRB
> *about.me/ashnazg *
>
> On Mon, Aug 22, 2016 at 10:43 AM, Fabien Potencier <
> fabien.potenc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 8/22/16 00:09, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote:
>>
>>> -1 from Jackalope
>>>
>>> not sure here what to do .. feels a bit like a precedent .. its a clear
>>> omission, yet any fix is a BC break (classic bug fix is kinda always a BC
>>> break). so if we do a BC break, then rather the exception .. if we don’t
>>> want to break BC, we release a new PSR with this fix (since just versioning
>>> the PSR to 6.1 isn’t’ semver for a BC break)?
>>>
>>
>> I think we need to see what current implementations do. From what I
>> understand reading the code:
>>
>> * Stash already throws an InvalidArgumentException (467 981 Packagist
>> installs)
>> * Symfony already throws an InvalidArgumentException (48 233 Packagist
>> installs)
>> * php-cache injects the value without any check (43 786 Packagist
>> installs)
>>
>> That's for the implementations with the most installations on Packagist.
>> Having a look at the other implementations, most of them do like php-cache.
>>
>> So, as most of (2 is probably not significant but Stash has many
>> installs) the "major" implementations already throws an
>> InvalidArgumentException, why not just document that in PSR-6? I understand
>> the BC break and all, but can't we be a bit pragmatic here (or is it just a
>> classic French/latin way of thinking)?
>>
>> Fabien
>>
>> On 19 Aug 2016, at 20:43, Larry Garfield  wrote:

 I hereby open a vote for the following Errata for PSR-6:

 https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/787

 Basically, it's a vote to merge that PR.

 The vote will be open for 2 weeks, closing on 2 September 2016 @ 23:59
 UTC.

 As usual, the vote is open to voting representatives only and is a
 simple +1/-1 vote.

 I definitely appreciate the point that an InvalidArgumentException
 would have been better, and had this issue been brought up during the
 Review phase I'd probably have gone that direction.  However, adding an
 exception does count as an API change, albeit a small one, so I am not
 comfortable with that direction in an Errata. (Obviously if you feel that
 this is a bad decision, vote -1.)

 --Larry Garfield

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>>>
>>> regards,
>>> Lukas Kahwe Smith
>>> sm...@pooteeweet.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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Re: Alternative to FIG 3.0 - Is it time to call FIG complete?

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Paul,
Thanks for the replies to my comments,

On Mon, Sep 5, 2016 at 9:19 AM Paul Jones  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Multiple responses inline.
>
>
> * * *
>
> > On Aug 29, 2016, at 10:20, Korvin Szanto  wrote:
> >
> > I just don't see why this is at all necessary, what does this get us
> other than a new name? To me it seems like this is just a semantic
> runaround for what old fig will be once fig 3.0 passes.
>
> From my original blog post, the benefits (among others) are these:
>
> - As a brand-new organization, it can define its vision and mission
> without in-group rivalry.


To me this would mean that an individual or a small group of individuals
would dictate vision and mission for the rest of us, why would we want this?


> - It can curate its membership, bringing in only the people and projects
> that adhere to its vision (and keeping out those who do not)


This reads to me: "It can exclude more people" which sounds like a negative


> - It can establish any organizational structure (hierarchical or
> otherwise) from the outset, without having to worry about precedent or
> prior expectations
>

This reads to me: "It can dictate structure instead of voting in structure"
which sounds like another negative


> - It can have any code of conduct it wants as part of its foundational
> structure.
>

How is this excluded in the FIG 3.0 proposal? We could have a CoC as part
of the foundational structure there too if we want.

- Whatever negative baggage is perceived as being part of the FIG is
> dropped.
>

I think the PHP community - especially those that pay attention to the FIG
- deserve a little more credit. I don't think it matters to those who have
disdain for the fig whether it breaks down and reforms or whether it forms
into a new group, they will still consider it a continuation of the FIG
because it's full of the FIG members.


> Joe Ferguson paraphrased this as "green fields." (If nothing else, think
> of the biggest benefit as the ability to exclude that pesky, pernicious,
> Paul M. Jones without needing a vote to do it.)
>

Is this something you wanted a serious response for?


>
> > IMO once FIG 3.0 is around for a little bit of time, FIG 2.0 will become
> just a slide on someones presentation and that's all. What does it matter
> if that slide says "Gone: Disbanded then remade into FIG 3.0" vs "Gone:
> Reformed as FIG 3.0"?
>
> The new group (if any arises) will be a new and different creation, with a
> new and different name. It may resemble the FIG in some ways, but it most
> definitely will *not* be the same. It will be a break from, not a
> continuation of, the FIG. As such I don't see why anybody would confuse it
> with FIG, especially if the new group behaves properly and actively
> distances itself from FIG and the FIG's PSRs, as it should.
>
>
I think this distinction matters to only a few while anyone paying
attention will obviously realize that this is a continuation of the FIG
regardless of the course of action. Especially considering we're trying to
plan it here in the FIG mailing list.

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE] [Bylaw Amendment] Do not require interface suffix on future PSR Interfaces

[Korvin Szanto]

-1 concrete5

On Thu, Sep 8, 2016 at 9:42 PM Ryan Thompson  wrote:

> -1 PyroCMS
>
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Re: Resigning My Position ...

[Korvin Szanto]

If only this had passed an acceptance vote, maybe we'd have a different
environment today if we had a few more hugs.

On Fri, Sep 9, 2016 at 7:53 AM Paul Jones  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I am resigning my position as sponsor of PSR-8, the "Huggable" Interface.
> This was a fun joke way-back-when, but its time has passed.
>
> And if I may suggest it, perhaps the editor should voluntarily withdraw
> the PSR from consideration.
>
> Thanks everyone!
>
>
> --
>
> Paul M. Jones
> http://paul-m-jones.com
>
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Re: Resigning My Position ...

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,
First of all, I want to apologize to everyone for the content of this 
email. My hope is that it won't seemtoo  critical and instead will read how 
I intended.

Here's a list of my positions:

1. This thread is depressing
2. People on every side need to take a step back and chill
3. PSR-8 is great, I'm -1 on removing it and +1 on voting it in officially 
4. We as representatives should have the right to call a vote for anything 
what-so-ever as long as there is no bylaw prohibiting it regardless of 
discussion period.

A lot of people look to us for answers and depend on the things we produce, 
so our discussions are certainly very serious, but I think we should all 
take a second to examine who we are and what we are doing and perhaps 
realize:

1. Sometimes we're all wrong and sometimes we are all a little overzealous
2. A joke is a joke, we can have a joke it's not a big deal
3. We don't need the secretaries to hold our hands. They do not need to 
remind anyone of anything, I'd rather they focus on better things if that's 
an issue. (Super happy that they do remind us though)
4. We are all just people trying to do the best we can, lets all jump on 
the "benefit of the doubt" train instead of the demoralizing back and forth 
we continually have.

To all parties in all of these dramatic encounters, it takes two to tango. 
If someone is drumming up drama, reply in a reasonable way affording some 
benefit of the doubt and set the issue to rest. No need to get upset, no 
need for hostility, we're all people fighting our own battles trying to 
make this organization into the best organization it can be. I wouldn't say 
I know everyone here but I feel like over the past couple years I've come 
to know a lot of you personally, and I know that each and every one of you 
is better than throwing in anecdotal attacks and bringing up drama from the 
past to argue something as simple as "Should we have this april fools joke 
still".

Thanks for reading Love you all,
Korvin



On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 6:35:59 AM UTC-7, Jordi Boggiano wrote:
>
> As a person that has spent the last couple weeks looking at this thread 
> and others, feeling I should call Paul's BS many times, and not doing it 
> because frankly I don't have the energy and rather spend it on other 
> stuff, I can indeed confirm all this shit is driving people away. 
>
> Paul seems bent on destruction at this point, since as he put it "treat 
> me bad, I'll treat you worse" [1]. Yes people were fed up with you Paul 
> and tried to send you a sign. If all you take out of that is escalate it 
> to the next level then we might as well all pack our bags and go home, 
> save ourselves some trouble. Or maybe you pack yours and leave the rest 
> of us to do work here, and come back when you feel you can contribute 
> without pooping all over the playground. 
>
> Regardless, thanks Larry. *hug* 
>
> Best, 
> Jordi 
>
> P.S: I don't have Larry's patience, and I am sure this is more 
> inflammatory than necessary, but frankly I don't feel like I have to put 
> on silky gloves to respond to such behavior. 
>
> [1] https://twitter.com/pmjones/status/762097547334684672 
>
> On 12/09/2016 14:56, Larry Garfield wrote: 
> > Fellow FIG list members, we have been trolled. 
> > 
> > PSR-8 is a non-issue, non-entity, with no activity.  It was an April 
> > Fools joke cum running gag, in which Paul was an active participant as 
> > Sponsor.  Why did Paul bring it up right now? Of all times? And with an 
> > obviously baiting subject line?  It's not at all possible that it has 
> > something to with the Editor of PSR-8 being me, and Paul and I being the 
> > strongest voices on each side on FIG 3?  Even though Paul was until a 
> > few days ago the Sponsor for PSR-8, meaning he was "in on the joke" from 
> > the beginning? 
> > 
> > No, that couldn't possibly be the reason.  Not in the least. 
> > 
> > That there is no way to withdraw/abandon a PSR right now isn't even a 
> > question.  A simple look at the bylaws will tell you that, and Paul was 
> > at the meeting at ZendCon last year where we discussed that.  We even 
> > wrote up a proposed abandonment process in the same writeup that 
> > included the initial secretaries proposal.  You can find that here, 
> > towards the end: 
> > 
> > https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/php-fig/pxezV88Uk1I/eW3GvtPRCgAJ 
> > 
> > That never turned into a bylaw, so no, there's no current PSR 
> > abandonment process.  The Secretaries apparently looked at each other at 
> > some point and went "yep, there isn't."  This hardly requires a public 
> > vote; it's acknowledging what was already public knowledge, written up 
> > on the list, and discussed at the ZendCon meeting. 
> > 
> > FIG 3 included an abandonment process based on that discussion.  (I 
> > believe the time-frames are a bit different, but it's the same spirit.) 
> > While working on FIG 3, Michael and I noticed that the odds of PSR-8 
> > being able to field 

Re: [VOTE] "FIG 3.0" Bylaw amendments (Take 2)

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 concrete5
On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 4:14 PM Larry Garfield 
wrote:

> I hereby open a vote for the following bylaw changes, colloquially known
> as "FIG 3.0".  I'm fairly certain anything that needs to be said has
> been said by now by all parties.
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/752
>
> The vote will be open for 2 weeks, closing on 30 September 2016.
>
> As usual, the vote is open to voting representatives only and is a
> simple +1/-1 vote.
>
> --Larry Garfield
>
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Re: [Review][Discuss] FIG 3.0 Upcoming Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Great job guys, I'm excited to see where this takes us and the php
community at large.

I will say that it's too bad this discussion period was wasted, it would've
been nice to have an opportunity to talk about fig 3.0 at all.

Thanks,
Korvin
On Sat, Sep 17, 2016 at 8:06 AM Paul Jones  wrote:

>
> > On Sep 15, 2016, at 13:37, Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
> mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > On Thu, Sep 15, 2016 at 9:11 AM, Paul Jones  wrote:
> >> So I still have no idea if the secretary role is intended as an
> "assistant" type of secretary, or some other type of secretary. Again, this
> should be a straightforward thing to answer.
> >
> > You're creating a false dichotomy, Paul.
>
> Not at all. It might be part assistant, part something else (or perhaps
> multiple something elses).
>
> Regardless, I seem to have gotten an answer from Larry's SitePoint article
> on the FIG at <
> https://www.sitepoint.com/the-past-present-and-future-of-the-php-fig/> :
>
> > In late 2015, FIG added a 3-person Secretary position, elected by
> project reps, to handle managerial tasks but stay out of technical tasks. I
> personally feel that change has been a resounding success, as managerial
> tasks are actually getting done now ...
>
> Based on that, it seems the Voting Members are the workers in FIG, and the
> secretaries are the managers in FIG.
>
> Is that what everyone who voted +1 on the secretary role understood the
> case to be?
>
>
> --
>
> Paul M. Jones
> http://paul-m-jones.com
>
>
>
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Re: [Review][Discuss] FIG 3.0 Upcoming Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Thank you for making your position clear once again, can we stop now?

On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:47 AM Paul Jones  wrote:

>
> > On Sep 19, 2016, at 10:24, Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
> mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > On Sat, Sep 17, 2016 at 10:06 AM, Paul Jones 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> On Sep 15, 2016, at 13:37, Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
> mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> You're creating a false dichotomy, Paul.
> >>
> >> Not at all. It might be part assistant, part something else (or perhaps
> >> multiple something else
> >
> > And now you're moving the goalposts, because *before* you were asking if
> it was
> > one or the other.
>
> Again, not at all. I pointed out the same possibility in my original
> conversations with Michael (to which you were not privy, and since they
> were on the record, I can publish them here if you like as proof).  The
> goalposts are just where they were when I started.
>
> I continue to find it remarkable the amount of evasion going on here.
>
> If the FIG secretarial role is something truly new-and-different, that
> cannot be related to any other kind (or kinds) of secretary anywhere at any
> time ever, then the title is poorly chosen.
>
> On the other hand, if it *does* fit a particular kind(s) of secretary,
> then the authors should say what it is.
>
> At this point I don't expect the evasiveness to stop, but I will keep
> pointing it out as it happens.
>
>
> --
>
> Paul M. Jones
> http://paul-m-jones.com
>
>
>
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concrete5 will remain a part of the FIG

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
concrete5 has been a part of the FIG since late 2014 and we have loved
every second of it. Since the beginning we have made a serious effort to
follow every PSR and we've been careful to not miss votes. We've been
sponsors and editors and members of working groups, we're even active in
IRC all with the hope that our membership will have a positive impact on
the ecosystem as a whole. I can't necessarily attest to our minor impact
but I can certainly see the huge impact the FIG has had and still has on
this community and proud doesn't come close to describing how we feel about
it.

We believe strongly that the FIG and now this new group are the ticket to a
better future for all PHP developers and we are so grateful to have had the
opportunity to be a part of it. Now we are excited for the next chapter and
have every intention of remaining a part of this group from here on out.

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: [Important] [Internals] All projects must declare intention to remain members

[Korvin Szanto]

Just to double confirm:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/php-fig/nlBi4SAmLRw
concrete5 is in it for the long haul

On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 10:01 AM Larry E. Masters  wrote:

> CakePHP will remain a member project of FIG
>
> --
> Larry E. Masters
> Co-Founder CakePHP - cakephp.org
> 702-518-3693
>
> On October 2, 2016 at 6:44:02 PM, Michael Cullum (m...@michaelcullum.com)
> wrote:
>
> As per the FIG 3.0 bylaws, all member projects must, between the 1st
> October and 31st October, declare they wish to remain a member project of
> the FIG. If you don't wish to remain, then it would be useful for you to
> also state this so we don't chase you up on it. Project reps, simply reply
> to this topic if you wish to remain.
>
> I'd note that with FIG 3.0; there is much less of a burden/requirement for
> project reps to put time into FIG efforts, but of course remaining ensures
> you can still have a main seat at the table in deciding who steers the FIG
> and assurance to be involved in any PSRs that are relevant to your project
> and you can of course continue to be as actively involved (or more so) than
> presently too.
>
> Should any old member projects who have previously left wish to re-join
> the FIG due to the new lower requirement on activity, I imagine in January
> there will be a combined vote for new member projects.
>
> Many thanks,
> The Secretaries
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Re: Output escaping PSR

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Chris,
Are you thinking like a text filter PSR or more of an output management
PSR? It sounds like a single interface with a single method to me:
`FilterInterface::filter($mixed): mixed;`.

Thanks,
Korvin

On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 7:39 AM Chris Riley  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I think there could be quite some value in producing a spec and set of
> interfaces for consistent output escaping across frameworks. Security is an
> important consideration in every app and having a consistent API would make
> it much easier get it right.
>
> Would like to hear peoples opinions on this and collect volunteers to join
> a working group.
>
> ~C
>
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Re: Output escaping PSR

[Korvin Szanto]

On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 4:18 PM Sara Golemon  wrote:

> On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 at 9:40:03 AM UTC-7, Korvin Szanto wrote:
>
> Are you thinking like a text filter PSR or more of an output management
> PSR? It sounds like a single interface with a single method to me:
> `FilterInterface::filter($mixed): mixed;`.
>
>
> There's many different forms of filtering:
> * Pass filtering (removing of illegal sequences)
> * Replacement filtering (transformation of illegal sequences with
> placeholders)
> * Panic filtering (raise an exception on illegal sequences)
> * Escaping (included because it's often conflated with filtering)
>
> There are whitelist and blacklist variants of these.   There are also
> context sensitive issues for many of these; What's illegal in a JS context
> isn't the same as an HTML text context, or an HTML attribute context.
>
> I don't know that we need standards for these permutations, but I imagine
> it's a little more than "single interface with a single method".
>

Fair enough, until January my head is still in FIG 2.0 mode. I still would
say that the examples you provide can fit into a single interface, but I do
see that with FIG 3.0 our scope is probably a little bit different than
lowest-common-denominator interface.

@Chris I like the idea so far. Escaping is certainly an issue we've had in
concrete5 and it's something we've tried to solve in the past with mixed
results. One thing that I'd say is it that this kind of filtering might go
hand in hand with validation as well.

Best wishes,
Korvin


> -Sara
>
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[PSR-12] Survey for outstanding issues

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,
I've been dragging my feet a bit on getting this survey completed and put
out there, but I think we're now ready to get some real feedback. We will
be accepting responses to this survey for about the next two weeks. I'm not
going to be super specific about the timing of it, but at some point after
two weeks has passed we will disable responses and start reviewing the
results.

Q: Who can take this survey?
A: Anyone who is familiar with PHP 7 and feels like they have a stake in
this should add a response to this survey.

Q: Should I research PHP 7 first?
A: It's important that you know all of the syntax and features that we plan
to be defining so you will do well by doing your research first.

Q: Do I need to read through PSR-12 first?
A: You certainly should. We do copy relevant text out directly from the
PSR-12 documents into the survey so you can likely get through this survey
without studying PSR-12 too hard.

Q: Why do you ask for my full name?
A: So that we can differentiate one reply from the next. A project
representative may reply to the form twice, once for the project and once
for themselves. If this makes you uncomfortable, feel free to put a handle
in instead. Try to make it unique.

Q: Why do you ask for my email?
A: If we have any kind of misunderstanding or want to get more information
we might shoot you an email. If this isn't something you want to share
please do not share it.

Q: I'm a jokester, wouldn't it be funny if I made a joke response?
A: Please oh please do not make me sort through joke / fake replies :(

We hope to get a good idea of what the public, projects, and
representatives think about what we have put together. We ask that you
respond only once unless you are also a representative of a project in the
PHP-FIG and ask that you read all directions in the survey carefully.

After we've had time to sift through the results, we will post a summary on
the list and post an anonymized list of responses that can be seen by all.

Please take this survey here: https://goo.gl/forms/SonvjwqicPoBBwwl1


PSR-12:
https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/extended-coding-style-guide.md
Meta:
https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/extended-coding-style-guide-meta.md

Thanks for taking the time to respond!
Korvin & the PSR-12 team

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[CC Nomination] Larry Garfield

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,
I think it's clear to all that Larry is an extremely valuable member of the
PHP-FIG. Over the years he has shown the kind of solid feedback and
thorough examination that I think will be most valuable for the FIG moving
forward.

I think it would be an absolute shame if his insight and experience weren't
put to proper use, so I am writing here today to nominate him and offer my
support for him to be one of the initial members of the Core Committee.

Best wishes,
Korvin

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[CC Nomination] Jason Coward

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,
Yesterday Jason appealed to the group [1] requesting to be nominated to run
for the core committee. Now I don't personally know Jason, but I also don't
have any reasons why he should not be nominated. Instead of hoping someone
else will do it, I think it's best to get it done now and nominate him
formally.

[1] https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/php-fig/U7ZPqpd9W3I/E6Bk1Ya2BwAJ

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE][Accept] PSR-13: Link Definition Interfaces

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 concrete5

On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 5:30 AM Matteo Beccati  wrote:

> +1 from Revive Adserver
>
> On 31/10/2016 22:15, Matthew Weier O'Phinney wrote:
> > Per the by-laws, the required review period has passed for the
> > proposed standard PSR-13 (Link Definition Interfaces). No changes have
> > been made in the past two weeks since re-opening the review period.
> >
> > The specification is here:
> >
> > -
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/a47c644f9d0f914bb0a9777eeaec157f2d51dbff/proposed/links.md
> >
> > And the meta document is here:
> >
> > -
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/a47c644f9d0f914bb0a9777eeaec157f2d51dbff/proposed/links-meta.md
> >
> > As coordinator, as of 21:20 UTC, I hereby open voting to accept the
> > proposed standard.
> >
> > There are currently 37 voting member projects, which means we must
> > have 13 votes to pass quorum, with half or more of all votes cast in
> > favor, in order to approve acceptance of PSR-13.
> >
>
>
> --
> Matteo Beccati
>
> Development & Consulting - http://www.beccati.com/
>
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Re: [CC][Nomination] Samantha Quiñones

[Korvin Szanto]

Errm we can delete posts on google groups at our own discretion? Is there a
way to disable that?

On Tue, Nov 8, 2016 at 6:37 AM Adam Culp  wrote:

> Sorry  about that. Appears that in my posting to multiple similar threads
> I pasted the link to a thread I'd previously deleted because I wanted to
> rephase it. (we can't edit posts here)
>
> I will remove the post with the cross link, it is no longer relevant.
>
> Regards,
> Adam Culp
>
>
> On Tuesday, November 8, 2016 at 8:26:42 AM UTC-5, Brian Teeman wrote:
>
> Adam that link point back to this thread
>
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Re: [Internals][FIG 3.0] Extending Nomination Period & Delaying FIG 3.0 Transition

[Korvin Szanto]

We definitely need to delay this. Thank you for raising the issue Michael
and Roman.

On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 9:53 AM Larry Garfield 
wrote:

> Under the circumstances, I do not object.  What end-date are you proposing
> for nominations?  Early December?
>
> --Larry Garfield
>
>
> On 11/09/2016 11:08 AM, Michael Cullum wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Does anyone have any objections to extending the Core Committee nomination
> period one month and pushing the FIG 3.0 implementation timetable back a
> month (so the new implementation date will be 1st February)?
>
> There are still a number of people looking to be nominated or considering
> standing; meanwhile right now we only have 7 candidates when 15-20 would be
> a much more appropriate number for a fair election and we think at least 12
> at a minimum is still achievable if given a little more time.
>
> --
> FIG Secretaries
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Re: [CC][Nomination] Korvin Szanto

[Korvin Szanto]

I accept this nomination, thanks Adam!

Best wishes,
Korvin
On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at 2:34 PM Adam Culp  wrote:

> I hereby nominate Korvin Szanto for the FIG CC. He is a regular
> contributor, and constructively communicates to find meaningful solutions
> to issues even when voices become heated. His technical ability is also of
> a level that he brings a high level of quality to each thread he has
> contributed to.
>
> Regards,
> Adam Culp
> IBMiToolkit
>
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Re: [PSR-12] Survey for outstanding issues

[Korvin Szanto]

We're still gathering responses from a few member projects unfortunately.
We will announce results once those are in.

Best wishes,
Korvin
On Fri, Nov 25, 2016 at 11:26 AM glen-84  wrote:

> What were the results?
>
>
> On Monday, 17 October 2016 19:22:09 UTC+2, Korvin Szanto wrote:
>
> Hi All,
> I've been dragging my feet a bit on getting this survey completed and put
> out there, but I think we're now ready to get some real feedback. We will
> be accepting responses to this survey for about the next two weeks. I'm not
> going to be super specific about the timing of it, but at some point after
> two weeks has passed we will disable responses and start reviewing the
> results.
>
> Q: Who can take this survey?
> A: Anyone who is familiar with PHP 7 and feels like they have a stake in
> this should add a response to this survey.
>
> Q: Should I research PHP 7 first?
> A: It's important that you know all of the syntax and features that we
> plan to be defining so you will do well by doing your research first.
>
> Q: Do I need to read through PSR-12 first?
> A: You certainly should. We do copy relevant text out directly from the
> PSR-12 documents into the survey so you can likely get through this survey
> without studying PSR-12 too hard.
>
> Q: Why do you ask for my full name?
> A: So that we can differentiate one reply from the next. A project
> representative may reply to the form twice, once for the project and once
> for themselves. If this makes you uncomfortable, feel free to put a handle
> in instead. Try to make it unique.
>
> Q: Why do you ask for my email?
> A: If we have any kind of misunderstanding or want to get more information
> we might shoot you an email. If this isn't something you want to share
> please do not share it.
>
> Q: I'm a jokester, wouldn't it be funny if I made a joke response?
> A: Please oh please do not make me sort through joke / fake replies :(
>
> We hope to get a good idea of what the public, projects, and
> representatives think about what we have put together. We ask that you
> respond only once unless you are also a representative of a project in the
> PHP-FIG and ask that you read all directions in the survey carefully.
>
> After we've had time to sift through the results, we will post a summary
> on the list and post an anonymized list of responses that can be seen by
> all.
>
> Please take this survey here: https://goo.gl/forms/SonvjwqicPoBBwwl1
>
>
> PSR-12:
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/extended-coding-style-guide.md
> Meta:
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/extended-coding-style-guide-meta.md
>
> Thanks for taking the time to respond!
> Korvin & the PSR-12 team
>
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Re: [PSR-12]

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,
This is something that we polled with the survey. At this point we are
still waiting for some member replies but I can tell you that by and large
things were pretty unanimous. As far as this specific issue, it looks like
94% responded with no objections and 2/3rds of responses preferred the
status quo of declare on the next line. Because of that data and because of
the subjective nature of this issue, we're probably unlikely to take
further discussion into serious consideration unless there's a new argument
that we haven't discussed before.

Thank you all for paying such close attention, I really appreciate you
keeping the discussion and excitement going while we work to get this
wrapped up. I plan to collect the remaining member replies and post some
results with a plan moving forward sometime this week.

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Sun, Dec 4, 2016 at 2:52 PM Michael Sheakoski <
michael.sheako...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Michael Mayer, I think your suggestion sounds like a good idea. My main
> point originally was to keep the declare() statements close to the  because they change how the language works. An example of what your
> suggestion might look like:
>
>  declare(strict_types=1);
> declare(encoding='ISO-8859-1');
> declare(ticks=1);
>
> /**
>  * Hello. I am a file-level DocBlock.
>  * I hope you are enjoying the example.
>  */
>
> use Foo\Bar\Baz;
> use InvalidArgumentException;
>
> /**
>  * Class Thing is a wonderful class,
>  * the best class.
>  */
> class Thing extends Baz
> {
> ...
> }
>
> I left the  they're closely related, but a blank line between other blocks should still
> remain. What does everyone think?
>
> -Michael
>
>
> On Sunday, December 4, 2016 at 2:01:09 PM UTC-5, Michael Mayer wrote:
>
> But we already have today:
>
> declare(encoding='ISO-8859-1');
> declare(ticks=1);
>
> And for both holds: *the file is running a special mode of PHP, not the
> usual one.*
> – Should I write all of them in the first line, or is strict_types such
> special?
> – And, if so, what makes it such special?
>
> Furthermore, at least for ticks, I see valid multi-line use cases:
>
> Block declare statements are allowed and MUST be formatted as below. Note
> position of braces and spacing:
> declare(ticks=1) {
> //some code
> }
>
>
> Moreover:
>
>  Each block MUST be in the order listed below, although blocks that are
> not relevant may be omitted.
>
>- File-level docblock.
>
>
>- One or more declare statements.
>
>
>- The namespace declaration of the file.
>
>
>- …
>
> Hence, I know where they are, and *I don't need to scan around doc blocks
> and namespace declarations.*
>
> Sorry, but I cannot see at the moment, how a consistent style
> recommendation may look like with that change.
> However, I understand that declare statements are more important than the 
> *File-level
> docblock –* thus why
> not move them to the top of the list instead?
>
> Best regards,
> Michael Mayer
>
> Am Sonntag, 4. Dezember 2016 18:50:55 UTC+1 schrieb Jordi Boggiano:
>
> I'm with Rudolph on this one, as I replied in the survey that was sent a
> while back. IMO it should be on the first line to make sure it's visible
> and not missed because it is such a meaningful line. It completely
> changes the way the engine works, it's not php anymore, but strict php,
> and you better be aware of it.
>
> As for the fear that more flags will be added, well of course it's
> possible but IMO unlikely. In any case we can revisit that topic if
> needed when we have more flags, I don't think we need to set the rule of
> today based on future unknowns.
>
> Cheers
>
> On 04/12/2016 14:48, Michael Mayer wrote:
> > I disagree too.
> >
> > What, if PHP8 will introduce a new execution directive and PHP9 as well
> > etc. And all of these are considered as good practice.
> > Where should I put them? All in the same line?
> >
> > |
> >  >
> declare(strict_types=1);declare(php8_directive=1);declare(php9_directive=1);
>
> >
> > useFoo\Bar\Baz;
> >
> > classThingextendsBaz
> > {
> > }
> > |
> >
> > Ewww!
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Michael Mayer
> >
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > Groups "PHP Framework Interoperability Group" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> > an email to php-fig+u...@googlegroups.com
> > .
> > To post to this group, send email to php...@googlegroups.com
> > .
> > To view this discussion on the web visit
> >
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/php-fig/07f36815-e178-42ee-b76c-42fa446fbfd9%40googlegroups.com
> > <
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/php-fig/07f36815-e178-42ee-b76c-42fa446fbfd9%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
>
> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
>
> --
> Jordi Boggiano
> @seldaek - http://seld.be
>
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[CC Nomination] Chris, Tobias, Sam, Beau, Marc, Steve

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone
I am posting here to formally nominate the people who have posted to the
list but haven't had a nomination come in yet. I think it's better to have
more people in the running and to let the electorate decide instead of
letting our inaction be the decider, so I'm going to flex my fig
representative muscles and use my power to nominate them all at once.

So I am nominating the following people in no particular order:
Chris Tankersley
Tobias Nyholm
Sam Minnée
Beau Simensen
Marc Alexander
Steve Winter

Please let me know if I missed anyone (sorry in advance), or if for some
reason a bulk nomination doesn't work.

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: [CC Nomination] Chris, Tobias, Sam, Beau, Marc, Steve

[Korvin Szanto]

Ah I see, I was confused because the titles of those threads are
"Nomination Request". Thanks for clearing that up!

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 3:23 PM Chris Tankersley 
wrote:

> Beau and Tobias were formally nominated by me via Sculpin :P
>
> I do thank you for the deciding to nominate me formally.
>
> I, in turn, accept the nomination request from Korvin.
>
> -Chris
>
> On Dec 7, 2016 6:19 PM, "Korvin Szanto"  wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone
> I am posting here to formally nominate the people who have posted to the
> list but haven't had a nomination come in yet. I think it's better to have
> more people in the running and to let the electorate decide instead of
> letting our inaction be the decider, so I'm going to flex my fig
> representative muscles and use my power to nominate them all at once.
>
> So I am nominating the following people in no particular order:
> Chris Tankersley
> Tobias Nyholm
> Sam Minnée
> Beau Simensen
> Marc Alexander
> Steve Winter
>
> Please let me know if I missed anyone (sorry in advance), or if for some
> reason a bulk nomination doesn't work.
>
> Best wishes,
> Korvin
>
>
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Re: [Internals] Change to FIG 3.0 term lengths

[Korvin Szanto]

I was going to remain silent since I didn't have objections but it looks
like we are going to be +1'ing instead. So +1 :)

On Wed, Dec 7, 2016 at 11:34 AM Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, Dec 6, 2016 at 9:24 AM, Michael Cullum 
> wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > It was noted by a few individuals that the way the bylaws stand about
> > fulfilling the initial 12 Core Committee roles as if there is a 12-member
> > vacancy this leads to a rather inefficient situation where some people
> would
> > have their terms expire in April/May of this year which I'm sure you all
> > agree is non-ideal as (1) they won't have time to settle in (2) CC
> elections
> > take time and focus away from working on specifications and two in such a
> > short period is relatively unhelpful.
> >
> > However, a small change could help resolve this issue so I'm just asking
> if
> > anyone objects to us doing it slightly differently**
> >
> > The old system would have involved the following three terms:
> > Top four candidates term expires in: August 2018
> > Next four candidates term expires in: January 2018
> > Last four candidates terms expire in:  April 2017
> >
> > My suggestion is to change it so they receive the following (slightly
> > extended terms so the minimum term is ~1 year and maximum is just over 2
> > years):
> > Top four candidates term expires in: April 2019
> > Next four candidates term expires in: August 2018
> > Last four candidates terms expire in:  January 2018
> >
> > Essentially, we just skip the first normal CC election and extend
> everyone's
> > term by a few months so that we stay on the defined calendar for future
> > elections.
>
> This sounds reasonable to me; I was taken by surprise by how quickly
> the secretary position was up for election again this past year, and
> would definitely like to avoid that situation again.
>
>
> --
> Matthew Weier O'Phinney
> mweierophin...@gmail.com
> https://mwop.net/
>
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Re: [CC][Nomination] Korvin Szanto

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,
I wanted to post back to this thread and give a rundown of who I am for
those who don't know me.

* I am extremely passionate about opening up communities and working
together rather than separately
* Working on an open source CMS has taught me to work with competition to
better serve the users rather than against each other
* I’ve lived through the pain of closed source / closed community “this
just works” thinking, and it has annoyed me so deeply I’ve made career
decisions based on it
* I manage large swaths of a big open source project including things
important to FIG like principle design and security issue management
* I’ve always been active in FIG decisions, and I think my track record
shows I am considerate of all views and careful with political situations

So why do I want to be a member of the Core Committee?

I have worked with many different languages in many different environments
and I'm always excited by best practices and elegant code. PHP is an
extremely forgiving language and it's taken us quite a long time to bolster
the community up to the point where we can hold a conversation about SOLID.
I'd say the community has shown that they are ready for FIG 3.0 to exist,
and I think it's important that we realize that we are writing rules that
will have an effect on EVERYONE and not just framework developers who are
implementing them. Working to modernize concrete5 over the years has taught
me some extremely valuable lessons and has allowed me to shift my mind away
from "RULES RULES RULES" and towards a more pragmatic approach that suits
junior and senior devs alike instead of just the computer scientists at the
top.

If you vote for me, you're voting for an active thorough reviewer that will
ensure PSRs work for everyone they are meant for and don't become
overcomplicated like we've seen happen in the past.

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Mon, Nov 14, 2016 at 1:02 PM Michael Cullum  wrote:

Thanks both!

http://bit.ly/cc-election-candidates

--
Michael C

On 13 November 2016 at 19:01, Korvin Szanto  wrote:

I accept this nomination, thanks Adam!

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at 2:34 PM Adam Culp  wrote:

I hereby nominate Korvin Szanto for the FIG CC. He is a regular
contributor, and constructively communicates to find meaningful solutions
to issues even when voices become heated. His technical ability is also of
a level that he brings a high level of quality to each thread he has
contributed to.

Regards,
Adam Culp
IBMiToolkit

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Re: [VOTE] First Core Committee Elections

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi All,

I'm super excited about this lineup of names, I think the PHP is going to 
benefit immensely from this first CC.

Korvin Szanto
Larry Garfield
Sara Golemon
Matthew Weier O’Phinney
Beau Simensen
Graham Daniels
Gary Hockin
Cees-Jan Kiewiet
Tobias Nyholm
Chris Tankersley
Samantha Quiñones

I voted for those who have impressed me with their knowledge and/or effort 
in the PHP-FIG and greater PHP community.

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE][Accept] PSR-16: Simple Cache

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 concrete5

On Fri, Dec 30, 2016 at 2:58 PM Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:

> -1 from Zend Framework
>
> I'm missing a few details in the meta document and the spec for which I
> cannot find discussions:
>
> - I've seen a number of libraries allow a callback for the "default"
> value, which allows deferring calculation of such a value until it's
> needed. Was this ever considered? If so, why was it rejected? If not, could
> this be important?
>
> - The spec mentions compatibility with psr-6, and mentions that each
> instance should be considered a logical pool instance. What I fail to see
> in the meta document is any indication of examples of how the two relate at
> an operational level. Examples, I feel, are required here.
>
> - I've seen discussion of why hasMultiple was omitted, but those are not
> captured in the meta document.
>
> As such, the spec feels incomplete.
>
> On Dec 18, 2016 9:25 AM, "Jordi Boggiano"  wrote:
>
> After a fruitful month of review and final tweaks (thanks to all
> involved), I think we are ready for a vote here at the PSR-16 headquarters.
>
> Please find the specification here:
>
> -
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/1d4f586d0bbe7e30cf8972268be8cef9d321fdcc/proposed/simplecache.md
>
> And the meta document:
>
> -
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/1d4f586d0bbe7e30cf8972268be8cef9d321fdcc/proposed/simplecache-meta.md
>
> There are currently 37 voting member projects, which means we must
> have 13 votes to pass quorum, with half or more of all votes cast in
> favor, in order to approve acceptance of PSR-16.
>
> Voting starts now (Dec 18th 15:25 UTC) and will therefore run until
> January 1st, 15:25 UTC - so we can hopefully start the year on a good note
> ;)
>
> Best Regards and Merry Christmas while I am at it,
> Jordi
>
> --
> Jordi Boggiano
> @seldaek - http://seld.be
>
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Re: Membership Request: H.Bora ABACI (Catappa)

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi,
In order to begin the process of being accepted into the group you first
need to have a sponsor.

Just a quick look into the project shows no issues or pull requests open or
closed, is this a new project without a community? If so you may find it
much easier to contribute as an individual once we have the new structure
fully laid out.

Best wishes,
Korvin
On Tue, Jan 3, 2017 at 10:46 AM  wrote:

Hi,
I would like to submit my application for membership on behalf of the
"Catappa Framework. "
Catappa provides an Annotation-based MVC and ORM.

Catappa,  implementation "PSR-4: Improved Auto Loading" and "PSR-7: HTTP
message interfaces".

As we add new features, we will pay attention to compatibility with other
PSR standards.

Link:www.catappaframework.com
Github:https://github.com/HBora/Catappa-Framework/tree/1.0.3
Packagist:https://packagist.org/packages/catappa/catappa


Thanks for the consideration.

H.Bora ABACI.

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Re: [VOTE][Accept] PSR-11 ContainerInterface

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 concrete5

On Fri, Feb 3, 2017 at 7:32 AM Michiel Rook  wrote:

> +1 from Phing.
>
>
> On 31-01-17 16:35, Matthew Weier O'Phinney wrote:
>
> After a couple months of review, and no additional tweaks during the
> last couple weeks, we are ready to initiate an acceptance vote for
> PSR-11.
>
> Please find the specification here:
>
> - 
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/c4cbf7c1ef5052e10e776381d69670beaa59beed/proposed/container.md
>
> and the metadocument here:
>
> - 
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/c4cbf7c1ef5052e10e776381d69670beaa59beed/proposed/container-meta.md
>
> This vote falls in the tail-end of the FIG 2.0 by-laws. As such:
>
> - We currently have 37 voting member projects, which means
> - We need 13 votes to pass quorum, and
> - Half or more of all votes cast must be in favor
>
> in order for the vote to approve acceptance of PSR-11.
>
> Voting starts now, and will run until 23:59 UTC on 13 February 2017.
>
> On behalf of the PSR-11 team, thanks for your attention!
>
>
>
>
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Re: Enhance code readability

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,

On Sat, Feb 4, 2017 at 11:41 AM Ryan R.  wrote:

> Hello,
> I'd like to propose a change to the PSR-2 rule concerning the presence of
> one (and only one) empty line after opening braces for conditional
> statements.
>

I wasn't aware that this was the case, can you link to where in PSR-2
you're seeing that? From what I understand PSR-2 currently allows blank
lines and even (sort of) encourages adding them to improve readability [1]:

> Blank lines MAY be added to improve readability and to indicate related
blocks of code.

 so we should be all set on this front.

[1] http://www.php-fig.org/psr/psr-2/#lines

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: Enhance code readability

[Korvin Szanto]

I agree that this could be organized to be easier to understand at a
glance, but I don't understand why this is still an issue. It sounds like
PHPCS is assuming that code needs to exactly match examples in every way.
That's simply not the case. I've shown that the document says specifically
that blank lines are allowed for readability, can anyone show anything in
the document that says differently?

What I would do is take this to PHPCS. I don't think this deserves errata,
instead we should take care with PSR-12 to make sure that this
misunderstanding doesn't continue.

Best wishes,
Korvin
On Mon, Feb 6, 2017 at 6:15 PM Greg Sherwood  wrote:

> On Monday, 6 February 2017 20:45:47 UTC+11, Ryan R. wrote:
>
> I use an extreme example here to show how relaxing coding standards can
> lead to unexpected results and thus inconsistency. It seems to me that
> developers relying on PHPCS to keep their code clean through checking and
> auto-fixing will now have to use custom rulesets to enforce what is a
> pretty standard rule. That feels like a big step backwards.
>
>
> @Greg : Would it not be possible to add some kind of parameter value to
> indicate the upper limits authorized ? And set it to 1 by default (or 0
> since you do not want to modify the current system because of the number of
> projects relying on it) ?
> Then if we want to allow empty lines we could simply modify the parameter
> value !
>
>
> Yes, that's what I was trying to suggest in my reply. Either way, some set
> of developers would not be able to use the included PSR2 standard as-is -
> they would need to use a ruleset.xml file and either include a specific
> sniff or change a sniff option.
>
> Given that developers who want to allow a single blank line already have
> to use a custom ruleset, keeping the default at 0 blank lines means those
> developers can change their ruleset from excluding the sniff to changing
> one of its settings - making it more useful.
>
> But obviously, the side effect is that you're not following PSR2 as PHPCS
> sees it. I don't think this makes any difference (any consistency is good)
> but maybe others do.
>
> If you think an option would solve your specific problem and you're not
> too concerned about if PSR-2 in PHPCS enforces 0 or 1 blank lines, then I'd
> suggest opening a new Github issue and we can work out a solution along
> those lines.
>
> Greg
>
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Re: [Vote] [Core Committee] Membership Application: Phergie

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 Phergie
On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 7:40 AM Samantha Quiñones 
wrote:

> +1
>
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Re: [Vote] [Core Committee] Membership Application: Phergie

[Korvin Szanto]

Errr to early to be reading and typing at the same time :S

+1
On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 7:52 AM Korvin Szanto  wrote:

> +1 Phergie
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 7:40 AM Samantha Quiñones 
> wrote:
>
> +1
>
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Re: Proposing PSR 18 'Singleton' Pre-Draft

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Richard,
I took a really fast look at the repo since I'm currently waiting for a
plane. I noticed that this seems to be more of an implementation than a set
of interfaces to standardize on. Are you wanting to standardize the
implementation?

Thanks,
Korvin

On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 5:55 PM Richard T. Miles 
wrote:

> Hello to everyone here at PHP-FIG!
>
> I have been working on 'Singleton' in my spare time and think it may have
> some use in this community.
> I am a Computer Science student at the University of North Texas so
> development starts and stops pretty
> sporadically ( 1 am and coffee ). I think it finally has enough content to
> be presentable under a 'Pre-draft'
> context.
>
> Singleton Github Repository:
> https://github.com/RichardTMiles/Singleton-Standard
>
> All comments and constructive criticism welcome!
>
> Thanks for your time,
> Richard Miles
>
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Re: PSR-7 Alternate Proposal

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,

On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 2:04 PM John Porter 
wrote:

> Hi Michael,
>
> Thanks for your response. I have read about, and personally discussed the
> SOLID principles with Uncle Bob, and I do believe that there is more than
> one final interpretation of those principles. I can see your points, but
> raise you this:
>
> SRP says only that a `car` class should not implement both
> responsibilities *by itself*!
>
>
> Currently, the middleware proposal and current used implementation ask for
> exactly that. That the middleware be responsible for the inbound and
> outbound flow. Even if it is for the middleware to decide that for itself,
> it is still a breach of SRP allowing a class to decide that. My point is
> the choice should not be there in the first place, by way of defined
> interfaces.
>

The middleware doesn't necessarily dictate where your behavior takes place.
Follow Dependency Inversion and Interface Segregation and you can achieve a
single responsibility for each class, even for the extra-strict (in my
opinion) version of SRP/ISP you are presenting. If you want to have these
concerns be separate, inject the behaviors as dependencies and treat the
middleware itself as more of a behavior router. That way each of your
individual behaviors are handled in individual classes.

A good example of this in my mind is containers. We have the container PSR
that is super minimal (has / get). That doesn't mean that a container won't
also try to do dependency injection and automatic instance inflation all
kinds of other stuff. In fact most of them WILL. They simply delegate those
responsibilities / behaviors to a dependency and there-by avoid SRP/ISP/OCP
issues. IMHO


> My point about ISP is to follow the definition you stated. If we take away
> the choice of multiple responsibilities from the middleware, then we must
> separate the interfaces. And I do know that it is not about PHP interfaces,
> but that is what they are for, along with the same in JAVA, and class
> abstractions; they are used to define the contract between classes: Can
> this middleware affect the request? Can this middleware affect the
> response? That kind of question comes from the interface the class
> implements.
>

The current state of PSR-15 as I see it doesn't prevent tracking what the
middleware is doing in the course of a request. Since the DelegateInterface
is an instance that a middleware stack is injecting, you can track pretty
easily how far the request moves through the stack.

Now if the issue is trying to preemptively know whether or not the
middleware does this or that, PSR-15 currently doesn't cover inserting
middleware into a stack. In my mind this is something that humans do so
they should be aware of what the middleware does and is for when they add
it to the stack.

So with those two arguments in mind, can you provide an example where a
middleware stack would need to be able to identify whether a middleware
will be returning a response or a request or dieing without simply
observing what happens when the request flows through the stack?

Thanks for the interest and discussion, I'm very pleased with the state of
the FIG these days, very constructive and interesting.

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Re: Proposing PSR 18 'Singleton' Pre-Draft

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Richard,
Perhaps moving forward we have an opportunity to include more code in our
recommendations, and I think that's likely a good thing. With that said, I
would think with containerization being a big thing in PHP these days,
singletons are going to be a tough sell.

I think something like this would best benefit the community as an open
source project perhaps on composer that people can use if they want. That
way if it gains serious traction you'll have had feedback and a solid proof
of the idea that people want to not have to think about how they work with
singletons.

Some things that would be good to pay attention to as you do this is
implementing other PSRs (like PSR-1 and 2 and PSR-11), ensuring your
contracts are defined in something that is typehint-able (you can't
typehint on traits), and perhaps thinking about how you can invert the
responsibility of bootstrapping the singleton that is being used.

Thanks for your interest in the FIG, I hope to hear from you more in the
future!

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 6:35 PM Richard T. Miles 
wrote:

> I suppose I was thinking 'How should one implement for maximum
> portability?' A Skeleton system requires the use of methods that can not
> be defined in a standard interface ( static members ). I do consider myself
> a bit novice; however, the intention of the singleton isn't to limit the
> creative process of the developer. I believe storing data in skeleton
> pattern is a `Cleaner` abstraction model than a container system. I
> definitely want to hear what the communities thoughts on the matter are.
> I understand PHP-Fig tries to leave the creative process open to the next
> innovation, and it may be that this abstraction is to detailed; however, I
> figured I would try to add some code to this great community :)
>
> Thanks,
> Richard Miles
>
> On Sunday, February 19, 2017 at 7:59:11 PM UTC-6, Korvin Szanto wrote:
>
> Hi Richard,
> I took a really fast look at the repo since I'm currently waiting for a
> plane. I noticed that this seems to be more of an implementation than a set
> of interfaces to standardize on. Are you wanting to standardize the
> implementation?
>
> Thanks,
> Korvin
>
> On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 5:55 PM Richard T. Miles 
> wrote:
>
> Hello to everyone here at PHP-FIG!
>
> I have been working on 'Singleton' in my spare time and think it may have
> some use in this community.
> I am a Computer Science student at the University of North Texas so
> development starts and stops pretty
> sporadically ( 1 am and coffee ). I think it finally has enough content to
> be presentable under a 'Pre-draft'
> context.
>
> Singleton Github Repository:
> https://github.com/RichardTMiles/Singleton-Standard
>
> All comments and constructive criticism welcome!
>
> Thanks for your time,
> Richard Miles
>
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Re: WG for PSR-12

[Korvin Szanto]

I thank you for the initiation but we have not built a complete working
group yet.

Thank you,
Korvin
On Sat, Jun 24, 2017 at 11:43 PM 'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
Interoperability Group  wrote:

> We're forming a WG for PSR-12 after what it was before.  Initial members
> are:
>
> - Alexander Makarov
>
> - Robert Deutz
>
> Korvin Szanto is the Editor.
>
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FIG 3.0 Working Group for PSR12

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
Thank you to Alexander Makarov for getting the ball rolling on this! I
wanted to reiterate what he had written in a couple of replies; the
official working group we are putting forward is as follows:

Editor:
Korvin Szanto

Sponsor:
Chris Tankersley

Working Group:
Alexander Makarov
Michael Cullum
Robert Deutz

If anyone is interested in joining, please feel free to reach out to any of
us!

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE][CC] Entrance vote for HTTP Client

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

Thanks!
Korvin Szanto

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 9:28 AM Samantha Quiñones 
wrote:

> much +1 very yusss
>
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Re: [PSR-12] Function declarations with multiline arguments AND return type declaration

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Vinor,
I'm of the mind that having the closing parenthesis not indented provides
enough of a visual break.
That said the current PSR-12 spec allows for new lines after your opening
bracket in your function declaration so your last example is completely
valid.

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Wed, Sep 27, 2017 at 12:33 AM Vinor cola  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I'd like to argue against this syntax:
>
> function (
> string $foo,
> string $bar,
> int $baz
> ): string {
> echo 'foo';
> }
>
> It make code not easily readable since you cannot efficiently separate
> arguments from function body: there is no clear separate between them, and
> the whole function looks like a signle block. Instead, I'd propose:
>
> function (
> string $foo,
> string $bar,
> int $baz
> ): string
> {
> echo 'foo';
> }
>
>
> or
>
> function (
> string $foo,
> string $bar,
> int $baz
> ): string {
>
> echo 'foo';
> }
>
>
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[VOTE][CC] Entrance vote for PSR-12: Extended Coding Style Guide

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
PSR-12 was already accepted and assigned the number 12 back in FIG 2.0[0], 
however, it turns out that my post on the 30th of June[1] was way too late 
to qualify as a grandfathered recommendation. So in order to make sure we 
follow the process properly, we're holding an entrance vote and asking 
kindly that the CC allows us to keep the number 12. 

Our working group is as follows:

Editor:
Korvin Szanto

Sponsor:
Chris Tankersley

Working Group Members:
Alexander Makarov
Michael Cullum
Robert Deutz


If you'd like to read more about PSR-12, check out the completed draft[2] 
and the meta document[3] but please keep in mind that we are not voting on 
the content of this draft.

Thank you for your time!
Korvin Szanto

[0]: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/php-fig/P9atZLOcUBM/_jwkvlYKEAAJ
[1]: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/php-fig/iqLzVvj6C2c/2hEOAQFbAAAJ
[2]: 
https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/extended-coding-style-guide.md
[3]: 
https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/extended-coding-style-guide-meta.md

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Re: [VOTE][CC] Entrance vote for PSR-12: Extended Coding Style Guide

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 Korvin Szanto

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Re: [PSR-12] Function declarations with multiline arguments AND return type declaration

[Korvin Szanto]

Thank you for your efforts here Vinor, it's very much appreciated! I do 
disagree with the idea that we should require a new line, instead we should 
continue to leave it up to the implementor of PSR-12 whether they'd like a 
newline or not. I've added this discussion to the meta document for anyone 
that comes across this issue and is wondering what the best way to handle 
this is: https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/939

Best wishes,
Korvin


On Thursday, September 28, 2017 at 1:22:05 AM UTC-7, Vinor cola wrote:
>
> Please check this: https://youtu.be/ZsHMHukIlJY?t=1319 (watch few 
> minutes, especially where the guy replace the code with X)
>
> Understand that visualy, a parenthesis is not enough to quickly make a 
> block distinction. This is a matter of readability: you cannot at a glance 
> get where parameters ends and where code starts. You said PS-12 allow new 
> lines after opening bracket. I think in this particular context, it should 
> make the new line mandatory.
>

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Re: [VOTE] Secretary Election

[Korvin Szanto]

1. Alessandro Lai
2. Margret Staples
3. Mark Railton

On Thu, Oct 26, 2017 at 8:59 AM Beau Simensen  wrote:

> 1. Margret Staples
> 2. Alessandro Lai
> 3. Mark Railton
>
> On Thursday, October 19, 2017 at 4:17:12 PM UTC-5, Michael Cullum wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> We've been attempting to get more nominations so this has been delayed a
>> few times but we now have three candidates so we're rolling with it.
>>
>> Full information about the Secretary vote and role is visible in the
>> bylaws here:
>> http://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/mission-and-structure/#secretaries
>>
>> You can check out their nomination topics and ask questions there.
>>
>> *Votes may be cast by project reps or CC members.* If an individual is
>> both a rep and a CC member, they may one vote once.
>>
>> *Nominations List*
>>
>>- Margret Staples - Topic
>>
>>- Alessandro Lai - Topic
>>
>>- Mark Railton - Topic
>>
>>
>> *How to vote*
>> The voting system used is STV[1][2], so basically, *there is no tactical
>> voting possible* (like with FPTP); *vote for who you want*, even if they
>> are a less popular candidates as your vote will move down to a different
>> candidate if you back an unpopular candidate who doesn't have enough votes;
>> if a candidate is elected, their surplus votes are also re-allocated so you
>> are not punished for backing popular candidates either. There is no quorum,
>> you are of course entitled to not vote and it will not count as a missed
>> vote on the voting sheet. *Rank the candidates in order of preference *for
>> example*:*
>>
>> 1. Luke
>> 2. Leia
>> 3. Anakin
>> 4. Rey
>> 5. Padmé
>> 6. Finn
>>
>> *You may, if you wish, not rank all three candidates* (however this is
>> relatively pointless in STV, only do this if your bottom candidates are of
>> equal preference to you). For example:
>>
>> 1. Luke
>> 2. Anakin
>> 3. Padmé
>> 4. Leia
>>
>> *The vote ends at 23:59 UTC on the 2nd November,* and I will close the
>> vote and *announce the result at some point on the 3rd*. At any time,
>> any candidate or voting member may privately ask me to do a count and tell
>> them who would be elected to which term if the vote ended at that point.
>> Please be wary of 'STV calculators' on the internet as there are many
>> different ways of calculating the vote reallocation for STV and many are
>> inaccurate, our methods are dictated in the bylaws.
>>
>> Good luck to all the candidates!
>>
>> --
>> Many thanks,
>> Michael Cullum
>> FIG Secretary
>>
>> [1]: STV User-friendly Explanation
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8XOZJkozfI
>> [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_transferable_vote
>>
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[VOTE][WG] PSR-12 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
We in the PSR-12 working group believe we are ready to move forward with
our draft. To that end, we are holding a public vote amongst ourselves on
the mailing list in order to ensure the process is properly followed.

Please do not vote in this thread unless you are listed as a member of the
working group. A +1 vote means that you support moving forward into review,
and a -1 means that you think the working group should discuss this more.

As this is a readiness vote, quorum will be 50% and a majority of at least
2/3 is required for passage. Though I hope to see a unanimous decision
before we continue.

--
The current working group for PSR-12 is as follows:

Editor:
Korvin Szanto

Sponsor:
Chris Tankersley

Members:
Alexander Makarov
Michael Cullum
Robert Deutz

Please do not reply to this thread unless your name is listed above.

Thanks,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE][WG] PSR-12 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Tuesday, November 7, 2017 at 12:06:09 PM UTC-8, Korvin Szanto wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone,
> We in the PSR-12 working group believe we are ready to move forward with 
> our draft. To that end, we are holding a public vote amongst ourselves on 
> the mailing list in order to ensure the process is properly followed.
>
> Please do not vote in this thread unless you are listed as a member of the 
> working group. A +1 vote means that you support moving forward into review, 
> and a -1 means that you think the working group should discuss this more.
>
> As this is a readiness vote, quorum will be 50% and a majority of at least 
> 2/3 is required for passage. Though I hope to see a unanimous decision 
> before we continue.
>
> --
> The current working group for PSR-12 is as follows:
>
> Editor:
> Korvin Szanto
>
> Sponsor:
> Chris Tankersley
>
> Members:
> Alexander Makarov
> Michael Cullum
> Robert Deutz
>
> Please do not reply to this thread unless your name is listed above.
>
> Thanks,
> Korvin
>

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Re: [VOTE][WG] PSR-12 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
With a unanimous vote, we have decided to move into review!
https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/955

Thanks,
Korvin

On Wednesday, November 8, 2017 at 1:23:39 AM UTC-8, Michael Cullum wrote:
>
> +1
>
> Michael
>
> (This email is posted not as a FIG secretary but as a WG member)
>
> On 8 Nov 2017 4:13 am, "Shefik" > 
> wrote:
>
> +1 Zikula
>
> -
>
> Shefik
> +1 914-548-5033 mobile
> she...@shefik.info 
>
> Portfolio: http://shefik.info
> LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shefik
> Twitter: @shefik_info
> GitHub: https://github.com/shefik
>
> The information contained in this message and any attachment may 
> be proprietary, confidential, and privileged or subject to the work 
> product doctrine and thus protected from disclosure. If the reader of this 
> message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible 
> for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby 
> notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this 
> communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this 
> communication in error, please notify me immediately by replying to this 
> message, and deleting it and all copies and backups thereof.
>
> On Nov 7, 2017, at 10:31 PM, Chris > 
> wrote:
>
> +1
>
> -Chris Tankersley
>
> On Tue, 2017-11-07 at 20:05 +, Korvin Szanto wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone,
> We in the PSR-12 working group believe we are ready to move forward
> with our draft. To that end, we are holding a public vote amongst
> ourselves on the mailing list in order to ensure the process is
> properly followed.
>
> Please do not vote in this thread unless you are listed as a member
> of the working group. A +1 vote means that you support moving forward
> into review, and a -1 means that you think the working group should
> discuss this more.
>
> As this is a readiness vote, quorum will be 50% and a majority of at
> least 2/3 is required for passage. Though I hope to see a unanimous
> decision before we continue.
>
> --
> The current working group for PSR-12 is as follows:
>
> Editor:
> Korvin Szanto
>
> Sponsor:
> Chris Tankersley
>
> Members:
> Alexander Makarov
> Michael Cullum
> Robert Deutz
>
> Please do not reply to this thread unless your name is listed above.
>
> Thanks,
> Korvin
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Re: [WG][VOTE] PSR-15 Review

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Thu, Nov 30, 2017 at 12:06 PM Matthieu Napoli 
wrote:

> +1 :)
>
>
> Le jeudi 30 novembre 2017 17:39:19 UTC+1, Matthew Weier O'Phinney a écrit :
>
>> At this time, I'm opening a vote to enter the REVIEW period for
>> PSR-15. This vote is open only to PSR-15 Working Group members, which
>> include:
>>
>> - Woody Gilk (Editor)
>> - Matthew Weier O'Phinney (Sponsor)
>> - Stefano Torresi
>> - Matthieu Napoli
>> - Korvin Szanto
>> - Glenn Eggleton
>> - Oscar Otero
>>
>> The by-laws do not stipulate a time-frame for how long the vote must
>> run. As such, I will set a maximum time-frame of 1 week, and close it
>> sooner if all voters respond before then. Once the vote is closed, I
>> will post the results, and indicate next steps for the proposal.
>>
>> PLEASE DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS POST UNLESS YOU ARE ONE OF THE MEMBERS
>> LISTED ABOVE.
>>
>> --
>> Matthew Weier O'Phinney
>>
> mweiero...@gmail.com
>> https://mwop.net/
>>
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Re: [CC nomination] Korvin Szanto

[Korvin Szanto]

Thanks Adam,
I accept this nomination!

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Wed, Jan 10, 2018 at 1:21 PM Adam Culp  wrote:

> I would like to hereby nominate Korvin Szanto to the CC.
>
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[Secretary nomination] Robert Parker

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
I'd like to nominate Robert Parker for the position of PHP-FIG Secretary.
Robert is a member of the Portland PHP meetup and strikes me as a great fit
for this role.

Check out Robert's profiles:
https://github.com/diaboloshogunate
https://twitter.com/diaboloshogun

Best wishes,
Korvin

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Re: [ACCEPTANCE VOTE][CC] PSR-15 HTTP Server Request Handlers

[Korvin Szanto]

+1 Korvin Szanto

Thank you Matthew for your continued focus and dedication!

On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 8:07 AM Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:

> +1 from Matthew Weier O'Phinney
>
> On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Matthew Weier O'Phinney
>  wrote:
> > The REVIEW period for the proposed PSR-15, HTTP Server Request
> > Handlers, hit its minimum required length on 2 January 2018. We
> > continued the period since then to iron out additional clarifications
> > to the specification, which have all since been merged.
> >
> > At this time, I am opening an ACCEPTANCE VOTE. Per the by-laws, the
> > acceptance vote is limited to Core Committee members. The vote will
> > close either at 23:59:59 UTC on 26 January 2018, or when all CC
> > members have cast their vote, whichever comes earlier.
> >
> > The relevant materials are as follows:
> >
> > - Specification:
> >
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/tree/4b417c91b89fbedaf3283620ce432b6f51c80cc0/proposed/http-handlers/request-handlers.md
> > - Meta Document:
> >
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/tree/4b417c91b89fbedaf3283620ce432b6f51c80cc0/proposed/http-handlers/request-handlers-meta.md
> >
> > Implementations include those implementing only the
> > `MiddlewareInterface` (e.g., middleware providers) to those
> > implementing full middleware frameworks. Below is a list of some that
> > we feel are particularly representative:
> >
> > - https://github.com/northwoods/broker — Maintained by Woody Gilk, our
> > Editor, this is a middleware dispatcher.
> > - https://github.com/middlewares — Maintained by Oscar Otero, a
> > working group member, this is a suite of reusable PSR-15 middleware
> > implementations you can compose into an application.
> > - https://github.com/zendframework/zend-stratigility/pull/134 — This
> > is a patch to an upcoming 3.0 version of zend-stratigility (maintained
> > by Zend Framework) that demonstrates the project plans to implement a
> > pure PSR-15 middleware dispatcher (vs a hybrid dispatcher as we do in
> > version 2). It provides a hybrid request handler/middleware
> > implementation allowing creation of a queue of middleware, and uses an
> > intermediary request handler to manage and dispatch that queue.
> > -
> https://github.com/zendframework/zend-expressive-skeleton/tree/release-3.0.0
> > — This is a proposed version of Expressive that uses Stratigility v3,
> > and thus represents a full PSR-15 middleware framework. The Zend
> > Framework project also has around 2 dozen middleware packages that all
> > have branches dedicated to PSR-15 support at this time; these are
> > representative of reusable PSR-15 `MiddlewareInterface`
> > implementations.
> > - https://github.com/ellipsephp/dispatcher — Maintained by Pierre
> > Mallinjoud, this is a PSR-15 middleware dispatcher that recursively
> > decorates a middleware queue in request handlers.
> >
> > We identified around a half-dozen other projects as well, some of
> > which were still pinned to earlier revisions of the specification, but
> > theoretically compatible with little effort. As such, we more than
> > satisfy the minimum of 2 reference implementations. We can provide
> > additional links on request.
> >
> > --
> > Matthew Weier O'Phinney
> > mweierophin...@gmail.com
> > https://mwop.net/
>
>
>
> --
> Matthew Weier O'Phinney
> mweierophin...@gmail.com
> https://mwop.net/
>
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Re: [VOTE][Internals] Secretary election

[Korvin Szanto]

1. Robert Parker
2. Mark Railton

Thanks,
Korvin

On Fri, Jan 12, 2018 at 6:44 AM 'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
Interoperability Group  wrote:

> +1 for Mark Railton from Yii framework.
>
>
> On Friday, January 12, 2018 at 5:37:01 PM UTC+3, Alessandro Lai wrote:
>>
>> Hello everyone,
>> as specified in the previous thread (
>> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!topic/php-fig/EKDIoSHqMSo),
>> yesterday at midnight the nominations ended, and since today it's possible
>> to vote for the renewal of the terms that are up for this elections.
>>
>> These are the nominations results:
>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1u_Bi2EXJ47iC_xMAUjkJWjz7Gks_BCW15RDXy_qXR9c/
>>
>> Since we have 4 unopposed nominations for the CC spots (and the terms are
>> all equals, so no sorting is necessary), we will need to vote for the
>> secretary position only, for which we have two nominations:
>>
>>  - Mark Railton
>> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/php-fig/U5eaI90NOsc
>>  - Robert Parker
>> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!topic/php-fig/BjxM9CVZ3Bg
>>
>> Full information about the Secretary vote and role is visible in the
>> bylaws here:
>> http://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/mission-and-structure/#secretaries
>> 
>>
>> Normally we should use STV, but since we have just one term and two
>> candidates, it will be the same if we simply vote with one direct, single
>> preference. So, to recap:
>>
>> *Who can vote?*
>> As specified in the bylaws, *any Project Representative or Core
>> Committee member* is eligible to vote on Secretary candidates.
>>
>> *When can you vote?*
>> Voting will be open *until 26th January 23:59 UTC.*
>>
>> *How to vote*
>> The voting system used is STV[1][2], so basically, *there is no tactical
>> voting possible* (like with FPTP); *vote for who you want*, even if they
>> are a less popular candidates as your vote will move down to a different
>> candidate if you back an unpopular candidate who doesn't have enough votes;
>> if a candidate is elected, their surplus votes are also re-allocated so you
>> are not punished for backing popular candidates either. There is no quorum,
>> you are of course entitled to not vote and it will not count as a
>> missed vote on the voting sheet. *Rank the candidates in order of
>> preference *for example*:*
>>
>> 1. Luke
>> 2. Leia
>> 3. Anakin
>> 4. Rey
>> 5. Padmé
>> 6. Finn
>>
>> At the end of the voting phase I will be announcing the results, and all
>> the newly elected (both CC members and secretary) on the 28th, as announced
>> before.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Alessandro Lai
>> PHP-FIG Secretary
>>
>> [1]: STV User-friendly Explanation
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8XOZJkozfI
>> [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_transferable_vote
>>
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Re: [CC][VOTE] PSR-17 Working Group

[Korvin Szanto]

+1
On Sat, Feb 10, 2018 at 4:38 PM Sara Golemon  wrote:

> On Monday, February 5, 2018 at 1:22:37 PM UTC-5, Matthew Weier O'Phinney
> wrote:
>>
>> Last year, in May, I opened a discussion period regarding the PSR-17
>> working group, as the proposal pre-dated the latest by-laws... and
>> then evidently forgot to open a vote for it.
>>
>> So, I'm opening a vote as of today, 2018-02-05. Per the by-laws, this
>> vote is for Core Committee members only, and will run until all
>> members have voted, or 23:59:59 on 2018-02-19, whichever occurs
>> soonest.
>>
>> The proposed working group is as follows:
>>
>> - Editor: Woody Gilk
>> - Sponsor: myself
>> - Members: Stefano Torresi, Matthieu Napoli, Korvin Szanto, Glenn
>> Eggleton, Oscar Otero, and Tobias Nyholm.
>>
>>  +1
>
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Re: [PSR-6][Errata][Vote]

[Korvin Szanto]

+1
On Thu, Mar 15, 2018 at 6:23 AM Stefano Torresi  wrote:

> +1
>
> Il giorno gio 15 mar 2018 alle ore 12:53 Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
> mweierophin...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
>
>> +1
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 12, 2018, 4:22 PM Larry Garfield 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Take 3, or 4, or something...
>>>
>>> This is a Core Committee vote to merge the following Errata PR for PSR-6:
>>>
>>> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/915
>>>
>>> I believe all discussion that needs to be had has been had.
>>>
>>> Vote is open now for 2 weeks, and will close on 3/26.
>>>
>>> Core Committee, an up or down vote please.
>>>
>>> --Larry Garfield
>>>
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Re: [PSR-14][Entrance][VOTE]

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Sat, Apr 14, 2018 at 12:45 PM Larry Garfield 
wrote:

> On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 12:17:27 AM CDT Vilsa fur wrote:
> > +1
>
> You're not a member of the Core Committee.  We appreciate the voice of
> endorsement but this thread is just for CC members to vote.  Thanks.
>
> --Larry Garfield
>
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Re: [WG][VOTE] PSR-17 Review

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Tuesday, May 15, 2018 at 9:06:02 AM UTC-7, Matthew Weier O'Phinney wrote:
>
> Woody has delegated to me to open a vote to enter the REVIEW period for 
> PSR-17. This vote is open only to PSR-17 Working Group members; at this 
> time, that means: 
>
> - Woody Gilk (Editor) 
> - myself (Sponsor) 
> - Stefano Torresi 
> - Matthieu Napoli 
> - Korvin Szanto 
> - Glenn Eggleton 
> - Oscar Otero 
> - Tobias Nyholm 
>
> The by-laws do not stipulate a time-frame for how long the vote must 
> run, though 2 weeks is the standard period. As such, the vote will run 
> until 23:59:59 on 29 May 2018, or until all members have responded. Once 
> the vote is closed, I 
> will post the results, and indicate next steps for the proposal. 
>
> PLEASE DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS POST UNLESS YOU ARE ONE OF THE MEMBERS 
> LISTED ABOVE. 
>
> -- 
> Matthew Weier O'Phinney 
> mweiero...@gmail.com  
> https://mwop.net/ 
>

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Re: [ACCEPTANCE VOTE][CC] PSR-18 HTTP Client

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Mon, Oct 15, 2018 at 12:38 PM Samantha Quiñones 
wrote:

> +1
>
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[VOTE][WG] PSR-12 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
After a few revisions and additions, the PSR-12 working group is again
ready to transition out of draft and into review.

Please do not vote in this thread unless you are listed as a member of the
working group. A +1 vote means that you support moving forward into review,
and a -1 means that you think the working group should discuss this more.

As this is a readiness vote, quorum will be 50% and a majority of at least
2/3 is required for passage. Though I hope to see a unanimous decision
before we continue.

--
The current working group for PSR-12 is as follows:

Editor:
Korvin Szanto

Sponsor:
Chris Tankersley

Members:
Alexander Makarov
Michael Cullum
Robert Deutz

Please do not reply to this thread unless your name is listed above.

Thanks,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE][WG] PSR-12 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Monday, January 28, 2019 at 9:25:37 AM UTC-8, Korvin Szanto wrote:
>
> Hi Everyone,
> After a few revisions and additions, the PSR-12 working group is again 
> ready to transition out of draft and into review.
>
> Please do not vote in this thread unless you are listed as a member of the 
> working group. A +1 vote means that you support moving forward into review, 
> and a -1 means that you think the working group should discuss this more.
>
> As this is a readiness vote, quorum will be 50% and a majority of at least 
> 2/3 is required for passage. Though I hope to see a unanimous decision 
> before we continue.
>
> --
> The current working group for PSR-12 is as follows:
>
> Editor:
> Korvin Szanto
>
> Sponsor:
> Chris Tankersley
>
> Members:
> Alexander Makarov
> Michael Cullum
> Robert Deutz
>
> Please do not reply to this thread unless your name is listed above.
>
> Thanks,
> Korvin
>
>

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Re: [VOTE][WG] PSR-12 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

The entire group has had a chance to weigh in and it looks like we've
unanimously voted to move into review!

Just to make the record clear as I totally missed adding Alessandro in my
hasty copy/paste:

Editor:
Korvin Szanto: +1

Sponsor:
Chris Tankersley: +1

Members:
Alessandro Lai: +1
Alexander Makarov: +1
Michael Cullum: +1
Robert Deutz: +1

Thanks Everyone!

On Sun, Feb 3, 2019 at 7:30 AM 'Robert Deutz' via PHP Framework
Interoperability Group  wrote:

> +1
>
>
> Am Montag, 28. Januar 2019 18:25:37 UTC+1 schrieb Korvin Szanto:
>>
>> Hi Everyone,
>> After a few revisions and additions, the PSR-12 working group is again
>> ready to transition out of draft and into review.
>>
>> Please do not vote in this thread unless you are listed as a member of
>> the working group. A +1 vote means that you support moving forward into
>> review, and a -1 means that you think the working group should discuss this
>> more.
>>
>> As this is a readiness vote, quorum will be 50% and a majority of at
>> least 2/3 is required for passage. Though I hope to see a unanimous
>> decision before we continue.
>>
>> --
>> The current working group for PSR-12 is as follows:
>>
>> Editor:
>> Korvin Szanto
>>
>> Sponsor:
>> Chris Tankersley
>>
>> Members:
>> Alexander Makarov
>> Michael Cullum
>> Robert Deutz
>>
>> Please do not reply to this thread unless your name is listed above.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Korvin
>>
>> --
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Re: [ACCEPTANCE VOTE][CC] PSR-14 Event Dispatcher

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Wed, Mar 13, 2019, 9:10 AM Chris Tankersley 
wrote:

> +1
>
> -Chris Tankersley
>
> On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 2:31 PM Cees-Jan Kiewiet 
> wrote:
>
>> The REVIEW period for the proposed PSR-14, Event Dispatcher, hit its
>> minimum required length on 27 February 2019. We continued the period since
>> then to make sure nothing came up and some minor concerns where raised as
>> PR, which have all since been merged.
>>
>> At this time, I am opening an ACCEPTANCE VOTE. Per the by-laws, the
>> acceptance vote is limited to Core Committee members. The vote will close
>> either at 23:59:59 UTC on 24 March 2019, or when all CC members have cast
>> their vote, whichever comes first.
>>
>> The relevant materials are as follows:
>>
>> - Specification:
>> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/event-dispatcher.md
>>
>> - Metadocument:
>> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/blob/master/proposed/event-dispatcher-meta.md
>>
>>
>> PLEASE DO NOT VOTE UNLESS YOU ARE A CC MEMBER.
>> Current CC Members are as follows:
>>
>> Beau Simensen
>> Larry Garfield
>> Matthew Weier O’Phinney
>> Sara Golemon
>> Cees-Jan Kiewiet
>> Lukas Kahwe Smith
>> Samantha Quiñones
>> Chris Tankersley
>> Korvin Szanto
>> Stefano Torresi
>> Michael Cullum
>> Chuck Burgess
>>
>>
>> Cees-Jan Kiewiet, your friendly neighbourhood PSR-14 Sponsor
>>
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> http://ctankersley.com
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Re: [VOTE] Core Committee Election

[Korvin Szanto]

concrete5:

1. Matthew Weier O'Phinney
2. Larry Garfield
3. Woody Gilk
4. Matteo Beccati
5. Adam Englander
6. Beau Simensen
7. Benni Mack


On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 5:22 AM Stefano Torresi  wrote:

> 1. Matteo Beccati
> 2. Matthew Weier O'Phinney
> 3. Larry Garfield
> 4. Woody Gilk
> 5. Benni Mack
> 6. Adam Englander
> 7. Beau Simensen
>
> Ciau!
>
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Re: [BYLAW] Proposal: let PSRs evolve with the language

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
I'm glad to see this coming up, this is something I've seen discussed a lot
on and off the list.

It strikes me that asking an implementor to support multiple PSR versions
is too much if we're just using composer versions. The only way I can
imagine implementing something like that is by detecting the spec version
and loading different versions of your implementation with your class
loader.

I really like Stefano's thinking. The namespace bit isn't my favorite but I
understand why it could be important.

- The Revision number matches the Semver package version, but it's doesn't
> map exactly to the same concept. The most relevant part is obviously the
> major number because minor and patch should not break compatibility, thus
> releasing a new Revision will not be required.
>

What would distinguish a "minor" change from a "patch" change? Are you
thinking a minor change would be errata and a patch would be typo fixes?

Thanks,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE] [Accept] PSR-12 Extended Coding Style Guide

[Korvin Szanto]

Thanks for being our sponsor Chris!

+1

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Re: Revert inappropriate PSR-12 post-vote merge

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
I totally agree that merging #1183 was an overstep on my part, the bylaws
are clear that it should be a secretary managing merging and not the editor
of the PSR. I also agree that some of these changes would qualify for
errata, I appreciate you paying attention and holding me accountable.

That said I think our bylaws are a little too open when it comes to
managing these sorts of changes. Once a PSR is accepted, secretaries are
charged with managing "typos, changes or errata" with the optional help of
the editor:
> If the Acceptance Vote passes, ... the Working Group is automatically
dissolved, however the Editor’s input (or a nominated individual
communicated to the secretaries) may be called upon in the future should
typos, changes or Errata on the specification be raised.

The "typos" and "changes" portion of that is classified more specifically
in the Amendments bylaw as "formatting and typo" fixes:

> If formatting is broken for any reason then changing formatting must not
be considered a change to the document. These can be merged or pushed
without hesitation by a secretary, as long as they don’t change anything of
any meaning or syntax.

So secretaries are expected to ensure modifications are "not ... considered
a change to the document" and "don’t change anything of any meaning or
syntax" with the occasional help of the Editor as needed. In practice, as
demonstrated here these things are subjective and can be interpreted
differently by different individuals. In this case, both the Editor of the
PSR and current secretaries looked at these changes and agreed they could
be merged without errata votes.

I think we should consider changing the typos and formatting change process
so that it's less subjective and more likely to result in stable
specifications. Perhaps we could have a subcommittee in the CC that has to
give blessing to merge changes to any approved specification.

Thanks again for keeping an eye on these things Larry,
Korvin

On Wed, Sep 18, 2019 at 9:42 AM Larry Garfield 
wrote:

> Hi all.
>
> I noticed this morning that this PRs had been merged against PSR-12:
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1185
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183
>
> I do not believe the changes in them are appropriate for an
> already-voted-on PSR.  Changes post-vote are permitted in only very narrow
> circumstances:
>
> https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/psr-amendments/#3-acceptable-amendments
>
> The following changes in that PR go well beyond Annotations or Formatting
> & Typos:
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1185/files
>
> Changing "would not" (a non-binding term) to a "MUST NOT" (an RFC defined
> term with very specific meaning) is a substantive change.  The original
> "Would not" language is, in context, entirely adequate.
>
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183/files#diff-53ccbb40a68e167a66735993f78e0bb9L99
>
> This block changes the meaning of the spec, and thus is not allowed.
>
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183/files#diff-53ccbb40a68e167a66735993f78e0bb9L369
>
> Because capitalized MUST has a specific "legal" meaning, this is also
> technically a substantive change.
>
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183/files#diff-53ccbb40a68e167a66735993f78e0bb9L439
>
> Substantive change, and isn't even explained.
>
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183/files#diff-53ccbb40a68e167a66735993f78e0bb9L464
>
> While this is a net-zero impact change because the language already
> requires it, I would still say it's more than is allowed without an errata.
>
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183/files#diff-53ccbb40a68e167a66735993f78e0bb9L689
>
> These buts don't really add anything.  (Insert inappropriate joke here.)
>
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183/files#diff-53ccbb40a68e167a66735993f78e0bb9L885
>
> This change is even noted in the comments as being a substantive change.
> This is not acceptable post-vote.
>
>
> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1183/files#diff-53ccbb40a68e167a66735993f78e0bb9R918
>
> I... don't even know what this is about at all.
>
> As a result, what is currently published as PSR-12 is not what was
> approved by the Core Committee.  That situation must be corrected.
>
> I ask the Secretaries to revert both PRs promptly. Additionally, I do not
> believe PRs to approved specs should be merged by anyone other than the
> Secretaries, as they are the ones nominally responsible for typo-fix level
> changes.
>
> There are some non-substantive changes in the larger one that are fine
> (adding newlines and fixing some commas or capitalization), which can be
> resubmitted.  Any substantive changes must go through an Errata vote, and
> if approved added to the meta document.
>
> (Note: I am not making any statement here on the substance of those
> changes, and whether they're good or bad for the spec.  Just that they are
> inappropria

Re: A question about PSR-12

[Korvin Szanto]

PHP 7.1 added exception multicatch using a single pipe operator, so no we
wouldn't want to use an OR operator here

https://www.php.net/manual/en/language.exceptions.php

On Sun, Sep 22, 2019, 8:49 AM Chuck Burgess  wrote:

> That's not a pipeline from code... it's only an OR delimiter in the pseudo
> code of documenting.
> CRB
>
> On Sun, Sep 22, 2019, 10:47 Memo Chou  wrote:
>
>> Hi, everyone!
>>
>> This is a part of PSR-12.
>>
>> Can anybody tell me why use pipeline here? Is it should be an "or"(||)?
>>
>> OtherThrowableType | AnotherThrowableType
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> [image: 螢幕快照 2019-09-22 下午11.45.00.png]
>>
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Re: [VOTE][CC][BYLAW] PSR evolution

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Sun, Nov 24, 2019, 12:10 PM Michael Cullum  wrote:

> +1
>
> --
> Michael C
>
>
> On Mon, 11 Nov 2019 at 09:48, Alessandro Lai 
> wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone,
>> after a long review phase of my PR and multiple fixes and amendments, I
>> think it's now ready:
>>
>> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1195
>>
>> The PR adds a new document that addresses the issue of upgrading the code
>> of a PSR to leverage new language features. I started working on this draft
>> after a long discussion here on the ML (
>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/php-fig/OyC3plRYhqg/discussion), after
>> that the issue surfaced many times on our communication channels.
>>
>> The PR has been reviewed by multiple parties, and I consider it now ready
>> to be put to a vote. So I hereby call a bylaw vote, following our Voting
>> Protocol:
>>
>> https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/voting-protocol/
>>
>> THIS THREAD IS FOR VOTES OF THE CORE COMMITTEE ONLY; there will be
>> another thread for Project Representative; any other message or "vote" will
>> be ignored. As always, you can vote with a +1, +0 or -1, you will have a
>> period of two weeks to cast your vote, so this will be closed after
>> 23:59:59 UTC of Monday 25th.
>>
>> There is a 50% quorum for this vote, and a 2/3 majority is required for
>> it to pass.
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
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Re: [Nomination][CC] Korvin Szanto

[Korvin Szanto]

Thanks Chris, I accept this nomination and I'm excited for the opportunity 
to continue working in the CC!


On Wednesday, January 8, 2020 at 8:58:31 AM UTC-8, Chris Tankersley wrote:
>
> Hello everyone!
>
> Since his term is coming up per the notification[1], I'd like to 
> re-nominate Korvin Szanto for the CC position. Korvin has been a major part 
> of the Core Committee for years, and has helped on various PSRs including 
> PSR-11 as the sponsor and PSR-12 as the editor. I think he's done a great 
> job in his tenure, and would like to see him continue.
>
> --
> Chris Tankersley
> Sculpin Representative, CC member
>
> [1] https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/php-fig/te-IAmuZte0
>
>

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Re: [PSR-12] Anonymous classes

[Korvin Szanto]

I'd argue what is confusing here is the lack of parenthesis on the 
anonymous class in the example and not that section 4 doesn't cover 
anonymous classes explicitly. If we do anything, it would be that we add 
adjust the code sample and describe the change in errata.

On Friday, January 24, 2020 at 3:35:55 AM UTC-8, Alex Makarov wrote:
>
> I'd prefer errata as well. 
>
> On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 2:23 PM Alessandro Lai 
> > wrote: 
> > 
> > First we need the opinion of the editor (Korvin Szanto), to decide if we 
> want to correct course or just clarify our intention. 
> > 
> > IMHO, looking at the code example, it seems that we're not requiring the 
> parentheses, but it would be inconsistent, so I would prefer an errata that 
> requires them. 
> > 
> > This PR contains my proposed fix, minus the errata text that should be 
> added in the meta: https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1206 
> > 
> > Il giorno venerdì 24 gennaio 2020 11:12:59 UTC+1, Alex Makarov ha 
> scritto: 
> >> 
> >> How would you word it instead? 
> >> 
> >> On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 11:46 AM Alessandro Lai 
> >> > wrote: 
> >> > 
> >> > While following PSR-12 implementation on PHP-CS-Fixer, a comment 
> indicated a possible inconsistency in the PSR-12 text: 
> https://github.com/FriendsOfPHP/PHP-CS-Fixer/issues/4502#issuecomment-578006523
>  
> >> > 
> >> > The issue is in the fact that chapter 4 says: 
> >> > 
> >> > The term “class” refers to all classes, interfaces, and traits. 
> >> > [...] 
> >> > When instantiating a new class, parentheses MUST always be present 
> even when there are no arguments passed to the constructor. 
> >> > 
> >> > But chapter 8 for anonymous classes says: 
> >> > 
> >> > Anonymous Classes MUST follow the same guidelines and principles as 
> closures in the above section. 
> >> > 
> >> >  >> > 
> >> > $instance = new class {}; 
> >> > 
> >> > 
> >> > Should we make this clearer? 
> >> > 
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Re: PSR Evolution, PSR-13, and nuance

[Korvin Szanto]

On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 9:00 AM Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Sun, Feb 23, 2020 at 1:58 PM Larry Garfield 
> wrote:
>
>> OK, this has been sitting far too long now.  Mostly my fault, but no one
>> else seems to be pressing the issue, either...
>>
>> Background: Back in December I filed a pair of PRs to update PSR-13 to
>> use type hints, per the recently-passed evolution bylaw.  I figured it
>> would make a good test case to flush out edge cases, and I was right.
>>
>> PRs:
>> https://github.com/php-fig/link/pull/6
>> https://github.com/php-fig/link/pull/7
>>
>> From the discussion here, there, and elsewhere (musical references FTW),
>> I've identified two primary concerns that should be *globally* resolved for
>> any spec updating in this fashion, not just PSR-13, although PSR-13 is the
>> case in point.
>>
>> 1) string parameters are a potential BC break in strict mode; does that
>> require a v2 rather than v1.1?
>>
>> This is an issue that Symfony ran into when upgrading some of its own
>> libraries, and prompted the "Stringable" RFC from Nicolas for PHP 8. (cf
>> https://wiki.php.net/rfc/stringable, currently in voting as I write
>> this, and seems likely to pass but not overwhelmingly.)
>>
>> The specific issue is that if a method takes an untyped string parameter,
>> right now that implicitly means `string` or "object with __toString"... at
>> least most of the time.
>>
>> If it is typed `string`, then in weak mode it means the same, although
>> the object will get cast to a real string at call time rather than sometime
>> later; in strict mode, a Stringable object is no longer allowed.  That
>> means a nominal API change, which should necessitate a new major of the
>> interface package (v2, not v1.1).  (According to Nicolas on the PHP
>> Internals News podcast (https://phpinternals.news/39), Symfony missed
>> this implication originally and inadvertently broke Drupal, which was
>> passing a stringable object to a method to which they'd added a string type
>> hint.  That was the impetus for the Stringable RFC.)
>>
>> Example (try flipping the declare statement on and off):
>>
>> https://3v4l.org/0dpsJ
>>
>> It's been pointed out that since by design an implementation can continue
>> to omit the parameter type, it's a BC break by the implementer, not the
>> spec, and thus the spec has only a non-breaking change and can be a 1.1.  I
>> disagree; for one, I don't expect most implementers to be thinking of that
>> sort of nuance.  Honestly I likely wouldn't until it tripped someone up.
>> For another, we *want* implementers to be, in the long run, fully
>> implementing the spec and not dropping random parameters, even if the
>> language allows it.  That would result in some implementations accepting
>> stringable objects and others not, which is directly contrary to the goal
>> of interoperability.
>>
>
> I disagree with this analysis.
>
> If the specification indicates that an argument should be a string, then
> passing anything other than a string for that argument is an error on the
> part of the user. If the particular implementation allows it, then that
> implementation is coded incorrectly.
>
> While I understand and appreciate the issue that Symfony has experienced,
> I'd argue that their change to use strict_types fixed an issue with their
> code, and Drupal then discovered they were incorrectly consuming the
> Symfony API. If Symfony type-hinted as "string", but allowed non-strings
> previously, this change is a bugfix. Yes, Drupal is left needing to change
> their code after a minor release, but they should have been using it
> correctly previously, and either casting to string ((string) $value) or
> calling the object's `__toString()` method.
>
> Yes, PHP has allowed munging types when undefined or in weak mode.
> Generally speaking, if the type is important, the implementation should:
>
> - when untyped, check the type explicitly
> - when weakly typed, assume that the consumer is casting
> - when strictly typed, require the consumer to cast
>
> It's that second point where I can see the potential argument around
> "well, PHP will cast objects that define __toString()"; that is in fact
> exactly what happens when an object defining __toString is encountered when
> passed to a parameter defining a string typehint when strict_types is not
> enabled. That said, _doing so is counter to the type hint_, and even your
> IDE will tell you there's an error (e.g., intelephense raises "Expected
> type 'string' Found '{Object type}'"); as a consumer, you shouldn't rely on
> PHP's value munging _as you cannot know that strict_types is NOT enabled_,
> unless your tests pass without munging. And even then, that's an indication
> that you're passing a value that might be considered invalid in the future,
> and you shouldn't rely on it.
>
> The problem with that second option (weak types, string typehint) is more
> difficult from the _implementation_ aspect. Because PHP wi

Re: [VOTE][CC] TYPO3 Membership vote

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Fri, Jul 3, 2020, 8:58 AM Larry Garfield  wrote:

> +1
>
> --
>   Larry Garfield
>   la...@garfieldtech.com
>
> On Fri, Jul 3, 2020, at 2:16 AM, Alessandro Lai wrote:
> > This thread is to collect votes on the TYPO3 Membership vote.
> >
> > Details:
> >  - membership request:
> > https://groups.google.com/d/topic/php-fig/qDOyOuLuoKc/discussion
> >  - proposed project representative: Benni Mack, which is project lead
> >  - request sponsored by Matteo Beccati 2 weeks ago:
> > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/php-fig/qDOyOuLuoKc/HtwMXZ_jBgAJ
> >
> >
> > Quorum: 50%
> > Majority: 50%
> > https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/voting-protocol/#membership-vote
> >
> > ONLY CORE COMMITTEE MEMBERS CAN VOTE HERE
> >
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Re: [VOTE][CC] Errata bylaw update

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 8:46 AM Woody Gilk  wrote:

> +1
>
> On Thursday, July 9, 2020 at 3:46:46 AM UTC-5 alessand...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Since the mandatory two weeks are passed on the discussion (
>> https://groups.google.com/g/php-fig/c/CObJmc5jDcE), I'm hereby calling a
>> CC vote for this bylaw change.
>>
>> As always, quorum is 50%, majority 2/3.
>> Vote will end July 23rd, 23:59:59 UTC.
>>
>> THIS THREAD IS FOR CORE COMMITTEE VOTES ONLY
>>
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Re: [Vote] [PSR-6] Type updates

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Sat, Jan 16, 2021, 9:09 AM Larry Garfield  wrote:

> I hereby call a vote of the Core Committee to approve the following PRs to
> update PSR-6 to use modern PHP typing capabilities, as previously discussed.
>
> This is a Core Committee vote requiring a 50% quorum and 2/3 majority,
> with voting ending on 30 January.
>
> CC members, please cast your votes.
>
> Spec: https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1220
> Step 1: https://github.com/php-fig/cache/pull/23
> Step 2: https://github.com/php-fig/cache/pull/24
>
> --
>   Larry Garfield
>   la...@garfieldtech.com
>
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Re: [Vote] [PSR-13] updates

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Sat, Jan 16, 2021, 9:07 AM Larry Garfield  wrote:

> I hereby call a vote of the Core Committee to approve the following PRs to
> update PSR-13 to use modern PHP typing capabilities, as previously
> discussed.
>
> This is a Core Committee vote requiring a 50% quorum and 2/3 majority,
> with voting ending on 30 January.
>
> CC members, please cast your votes.
>
> Step 1: https://github.com/php-fig/link/pull/6
> Step 2: https://github.com/php-fig/link/pull/7
> Spec: https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1199
>
> --
>   Larry Garfield
>   la...@garfieldtech.com
>
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Re: [VOTE][PSR-11] Type Updates

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Wed, Mar 3, 2021, 7:22 AM Chris Tankersley  wrote:

> +1
>
> -Chris
>
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 9:31 AM Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
> mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi, everyone!
>>
>> On 2021-01-25, I opened the discussion period around updating PSR-11 per
>> the PSR Evolution bylaw (https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/psr-evolution/).
>> The discussion centers around three related proposals:
>>
>> - https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1215 (the errata for the
>> specification)
>> - https://github.com/php-fig/container/pull/20 (the first step of the
>> evolution, adding argument typehints, and modifying defined exception
>> interfaces to extend Throwable)
>> - https://github.com/php-fig/container/pull/28 (the second step of the
>> evolution, adding return typehints where reasonable)
>>
>> Since opening the discussion period, the main question was whether the
>> second step should have the specification target PHP 8 in order to pick up
>> the "mixed" type. Consensus is that we should target PHP 7 releases at this
>> time, as this will allow libraries to adopt the changes faster. (As an
>> example, we're only just now getting around to having
>> laminas-servicemanager typehint explicitly against PSR-11 and not
>> container-interop; we'll be able to jump to the latest versions of the spec
>> immediately as a result.)
>>
>> As the discussion period has passed the two-week minimum threshold, I now
>> hereby open the vote.
>>
>> +1 to merge the patches and create the new releases
>> -1 to leave things as-is
>> +0 to abstain
>>
>> Thanks in advance, everyone!
>>
>> --
>> Matthew Weier O'Phinney
>> mweierophin...@gmail.com
>> https://mwop.net/
>> he/him
>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> --
> Chris Tankersley
> http://ctankersley.com
>
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> .
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Re: [Vote] PSR-13 Link Errata

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 12:13 AM cees...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> +1
>
> On Friday, March 5, 2021 at 9:09:18 AM UTC+1 Matteo Beccati wrote:
>
>> +1
>>
>> On 24/02/2021 22:50, Larry Garfield wrote:
>> > Since there seems to be no dissension, no sense waiting any longer.
>> >
>> > I am hereby calling an Errata vote on the following Link fixes,
>> including the linked (no pun intended) PRs.
>> >
>> > https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1222
>> >
>> > This is a CC Vote, requiring 2/3 to pass. Voting will remain open until
>> 10 March, unless all 11 CC members vote before then. (Hint hint, folks. :-)
>> )
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Matteo Beccati
>>
>> Development & Consulting - http://www.beccati.com/
>>
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Re: [ENTRANCE] [VOTE] [CC] Clock Interface PSR

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Monday, March 15, 2021 at 4:35:58 PM UTC-7 demon...@gmail.com wrote:

> As the Sponsor for this new candidate PSR, I hereby call the Entrance Vote.
>
>
> Proposal PR: https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1224 
>
>
> Editor: Chris Seufert
> Sponsor:  Chuck Burgess - PHP-FIG
> Working Group:
> - Jérôme Gamez (kreait/clock)
> - Andreas Möller (ergebnis/clock)
> - Luís Cobucci (lcobucci/clock)
> - Pol Dellaiera
> - Ben Edmunds
> - Andreas Heigl (ergebnis/clock)
>
>
> Please do not reply to this topic if you are not a CC member. 
> --
>

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Re: [VOTE][Projects] Bylaw CS update

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Sat, Apr 3, 2021 at 9:57 AM 'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
Interoperability Group  wrote:

>
> +1 from Yii framework.
> On Friday, April 2, 2021 at 7:31:06 PM UTC+3 ni...@niden.net wrote:
>
>> +1
>>
>> Phalcon Framework
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 31, 2021 at 3:16:33 AM UTC-4 alessand...@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Hello everyone,
>>> this my seem a small formality, but we need a vote for a small bylaw
>>> amendment: https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1203
>>>
>>> Basically, we need to update the guidelines to follow PSR-12, since it
>>> deprecated PSR-2.
>>>
>>> As per our voting protocol:
>>> https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/voting-protocol/
>>>
>>> This is a vote for the Project Representative only.
>>> If a PR is serving as a Core Committee too, he's not elegible to vote
>>> here.
>>> There's no quorum.
>>> A 2/3 majority is required for passage.
>>> Voting ends in two weeks, at midnight UTC between 14th & 15th of April.
>>>
>>> For CC, there's already another thread:
>>> https://groups.google.com/g/php-fig/c/GK-fjLdQFBk
>>>
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Re: [VOTE] Core Committee Election

[Korvin Szanto]

1. Larry Garfield
2. Michelle Sanver
3. Alessandro Chitolina
4. Matthew Weier O'Phinney
5. Woody Gilk

On Fri, Jun 11, 2021, 8:26 AM Jason Coward  wrote:

> 1) Michelle Sanver
> 2) Matthew Weier O'Phinney
> 3) Woody Gilk
> 4) Alessandro Chitolina
> 5) Larry Garfield
>
> Regards,
>
> *Jason Coward*
> *Slim Framework Project Representative*
> On Thursday, June 10, 2021 at 9:42:31 AM UTC-6 alessand...@gmail.com
> wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone,
>> as specified in the previous thread (
>> https://groups.google.com/g/php-fig/c/9Xeon2rP4SE), yesterday the
>> nominations ended, and since today it's possible to vote for the renewal of
>> the terms that are up for this elections.
>>
>> We have *5 spots on the Core Committee* up for reelection, four with a
>> full two year term and a shorter one, that will end in August 2021, due to
>> Beau Simensen stepping down; we also have one full-term spot for secretary.
>>
>> Since we have only one unopposed nomination for the secretary election,
>> we will need to vote for the Core Committee positions only, for which we
>> have five nominations (listed in chronological order of nomination):
>>
>>  - Larry Garfield
>>  - Matthew Weier O'Phinney
>> 
>>  - Michelle Sanver
>>  - Alessandro Chitolina
>>  - Woody Gilk
>> 
>>
>> Full information about the Core Committee vote and role is visible in the
>> bylaws here:
>> https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/mission-and-structure/#the-core-committee
>>
>> *Who can vote?*
>> As specified in the bylaws, any Project Representative or any participant
>> in the PHP-FIG ML can vote on the CC elections. A ML participant is defined
>> in the bylaws as follows:
>> "Any individual that has posted a non-trivial message in the official FIG
>> venue (mailing list, forum, etc.) at least five (5) times within the past
>> calendar year as of the start of nominations [...] is eligible to vote on
>> Core Committee candidates."
>>
>>  *When can you vote?*
>> Voting will be open in this thread until June 24th 23:59 UTC.
>>
>> *How to vote*
>> The voting system used is STV[1][2], so basically, there is no tactical
>> voting possible (like with FPTP); vote for who you want, even if they are a
>> less popular candidates as your vote will move down to a different
>> candidate if you back an unpopular candidate who doesn't have enough votes;
>> if a candidate is elected, their surplus votes are also re-allocated so you
>> are not punished for backing popular candidates either. There is no quorum,
>> you are of course entitled to not vote and it will not count as a missed
>> vote on the voting sheet. Rank the candidates in order of preference for
>> example:
>>
>> 1. Luke
>> 2. Leia
>> 3. Anakin
>> 4. Rey
>> 5. Padmé
>> 6. Finn
>>
>> At the end of the voting phase I will be announcing the results, and all
>> the newly elected (both CC members and secretary), as announced before.
>> Vote ordering will be also used to assign the terms, so the last of the
>> elected will take the shorter one.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Alessandro Lai
>> PHP-FIG Secretary
>>
>> [1]: STV User-friendly Explanation
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8XOZJkozfI
>> [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_transferable_vote
>>
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Re: PSR-12 question about "endif" "endwhile" etc

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Liam,
We discussed alternative control syntax at least once[0] (I recall a few
times) and decided that we wanted to leave them unspecified for fear of
needing to codify mixed PHP and HTML where they are primarily used. That
says PSR-12 specifically requires control structures use brackets in the
section you quoted but there's nothing stopping you from using PSR-12 and
allowing them in your own projects.

[0]
https://groups.google.com/g/php-fig/c/q5B_f0WQsOA/m/vC5ZpV5CBwAJ?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer

Best wishes,
Korvin

On Thu, Jul 15, 2021, 2:20 PM Liam Hennessy  wrote:

> Greetings!
>
> According to Section 5 of PSR-12  
> (Control
> Structures):
>
> *The body of each structure MUST be enclosed by braces. This standardizes
> how the structures look and reduces the likelihood of introducing errors as
> new lines get added to the body.*
>
> Does this mean that *endif, endwhile, endfor, endforeach, *and *endswitch*
> are not permitted by PSR-12?
>
> It would be helpful if PSR-12 was more explicit about this, even if the
> consensus is that you MAY use them, as it is easy to overlook this point
> completely or misinterpret this point as a strict exclusion.
>
> As a new member, please accept my thanks for your time and effort.
>
> Regards,
>
> Liam
>
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Re: [VOTE][CC] AzuraCast Membership vote

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Sat, Jul 31, 2021, 8:38 AM Nikolaos Dimopoulos  wrote:

> +1
>
> Phalcon Framework
>
> On Saturday, July 31, 2021 at 11:05:07 AM UTC-4 vin...@delau.nl wrote:
>
>> This thread is to collect votes on the AzuraCast Membership vote.
>>
>> Details:
>>  - membership request:
>> https://groups.google.com/g/php-fig/c/0fVYv0ha4Lo/m/SN7_aviaBAAJ
>>  - proposed project representative: Felix Bachmann, which is the second
>> lead developer.
>>  - disclosure: Current Secretary Buster Neese is a project lead for
>> AzureCast. He will continue to be secretary and thus will not represent
>> AzuraCast.
>>  - request sponsored by Larry Garfield 2 weeks ago:
>> https://groups.google.com/g/php-fig/c/0fVYv0ha4Lo/m/SN7_aviaBAAJ
>>
>> Voting ends by 2021-08-14 17:00 UTC
>>
>> Voting options:  For (+1), Against (-1), or Abstain (+0)
>> Quorum: 50%
>> Majority: 50%
>> https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/voting-protocol/#membership-vote
>>
>> ONLY CORE COMMITTEE MEMBERS CAN VOTE HERE
>
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Re: [VOTE][CC] Bylaw change: introduce PHP Evolving Recommendations (PERs)

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Tue, Sep 7, 2021 at 8:28 PM Chris Tankersley 
wrote:

> +1
>
> --
> Chris Tankersley
>
> On Tue, Sep 7, 2021 at 1:06 PM Vincent de Lau  wrote:
>
>> This is the voting thread for the Core Committee only. There is a
>> separate thread for Project Representative
>>
>> Larry Garfield has created a proposal for a change to the bylaws to
>> introduce PHP Evolving Recommendations. As part of that proposal, some
>> restructuring of the bylaws has been performed to be streamline the PSR,
>> PER and AR processes.
>>
>> The discussion thread can be found here:
>> https://groups.google.com/g/php-fig/c/gLNKg9jpRCU and some additional
>> discussions on Discord.
>>
>> The proposed change can be seen in the pull request:
>> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1235 *(commit on day of
>> voting fdadde82c28d517b515b6aa87d42cb71daded4b4)*
>>
>>
>> Per the voting protocol: https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/voting-protocol/
>>
>>- Voting options are For (+1), Against (-1), or Abstain (+0)
>>- Quorum is 50%, a 2/3 majority is required for passage.
>>- Voting ends in two weeks, 2021-09-21 17:00:00 UTC
>>
>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> --
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> http://ctankersley.com
>
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Re: [VOTE][CC] PSR-16 (simple-cache) evolution

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Sunday, October 24, 2021 at 10:52:42 PM UTC-7 Michelle Sanver wrote:

> +1
> On 24 Oct 2021, 22:56 +0200, cees...@gmail.com , wrote:
>
> +1
>
> On Tuesday, October 19, 2021 at 4:19:42 PM UTC+2 ezimuel wrote:
>
>> +1
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Enrico Zimuel
>>
>> Il giorno gio 14 ott 2021 alle ore 09:12 Alessandro Lai <
>> alessand...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
>>
>>> Hello everyone,
>>> I hereby call a CC vote for the approval of the evolution of PSR-16 - 
>>> Simple Cache.
>>>
>>> The change in the spec is reviewable in this PR: 
>>> https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1252
>>> Inside the PR description you'll find the links to the two PR containing 
>>> the code changes:
>>>  - v2 adds parameters types, and makes CacheException extend \Throwable
>>>  - v3 (which obviously builds upon the previous) adds return types
>>>
>>> Both require PHP 8 at a minimum, since mixed and union types were 
>>> needed, and also to avoid issues when extending \Throwable (as it happened 
>>> with the evolution of PSR-11, see 
>>> https://github.com/php-fig/container/issues/33).
>>>
>>> As per our bylaws:
>>>  - only Core Committee members may vote
>>>  - either For (+1), Against (-1), or Abstain (+0)
>>>  - quorum is 50%
>>>  - a 2/3 majority is required for passage.
>>>
>>> Votes take place over a period of two weeks (or at the reaching of 100% 
>>> quorum), so votes will be accepted up to 2021-10-28 10:00:00 UTC.
>>>
>>> --
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
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Re: In PSR-12, what are lines 255 and 256 actually referring to?

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Shawn,
You can trust the section header, those lines are referring to style when
dealing with implements and extends.

The reason we are so verbose in this spot is partly because some of this is
left verbatim from PSR-2 as we added around it and partly because we want
to be sure we cover all bases when dealing with single line vs multi-line
class declaration lines.

On Mon, Nov 29, 2021, 10:16 AM Shawn Corrigan 
wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> I tried to find an answer to this in the existing conversations here but I
> couldn't seem to find anything, I apologize if it's already been discussed.
>
> I'm reading PSR-12 and trying to understand what these two lines mean.
> They seem to be disconnected from the subsection they're in, so it's hard
> to tell what it's referring to exactly.
>
> Lines 255 and 256
> 
>  are
> under subsection 4.1 -  *Extends and Implements. *They are also under
> section 4 -
>
> *Classes, Properties, and Methods.*They say...
>
> > Opening braces MUST be on their own line and MUST NOT be preceded or
> followed by a blank line
> > Closing braces MUST be on their own line and MUST NOT be preceded by a
> blank line.
>
> There are no opening or closing braces directly associated with the
> "extends" or "implements" keywords, just for the class.
>
> Above that, in the same section, it says “The opening brace *for the
> class* MUST […]”. That line explicitly specifies the brace is for the
> class, but the two lines in question don't specify what the braces are for.
>
> Are those lines referring to the class, just as the line above it is? Or
> is it referring to the section title; *Classes, Properties, and Methods*?
> (leaving out properties).
>
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Re: [Entrance Vote]{CC] Localization PSR

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Wed, Dec 8, 2021, 9:42 PM Michelle Sanver  wrote:

> +1
>
> On 8 Dec 2021, at 23:23, Woody Gilk  wrote:
>
> +1
>
> --
> Woody Gilk
> https://www.shadowhand.com
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 8, 2021 at 4:04 PM Larry Garfield 
> wrote:
>
>> +1
>>
>> --
>>   Larry Garfield
>>   la...@garfieldtech.com
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 8, 2021, at 4:03 PM, Larry Garfield wrote:
>> > After a great deal of offlist discussion, I hereby call an Entrance
>> > Vote on a Code Localization PSR.
>> >
>> > Specifically, the charter is here:
>> >
>> > https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1259/files
>> >
>> > Little has been firmly defined yet, of course.  That's why we're
>> > building a Working Group. :-)  But we have narrowed the scope to
>> > something we believe is manageable.
>> >
>> > We are open to, and still soliciting, additional WG members who have
>> > particular experience with major projects that have existing code
>> > localization systems.  Additional personnel MAY be added in the future,
>> > therefore.
>> >
>> > This is a Core Committee vote only.  Non-CC members, please sit tight.
>> :-)
>> >
>> > --
>> >   Larry Garfield
>> >   la...@garfieldtech.com
>> >
>> > --
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>> >
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Re: Add rule for PHP 8 promotion constructor in PSR-12?

[Korvin Szanto]

I don't plan to lead this through the PER process but I'd be happy to be on
the WG under your leadership Alex.


On Wed, Dec 15, 2021, 12:43 PM Alex Makarov  wrote:

> I can be part of the group. If there will be a lack of editor role, I
> can handle it.
>
> On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 5:53 PM Larry Garfield 
> wrote:
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 15, 2021, at 8:45 AM, Alex Makarov wrote:
> > > What's needed to do it? A list of new shiny stuff and rules for it?
> > > Could be done. What else?
> > >
> > > On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 5:34 PM Alessandro Lai
> > >  wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Hello and welcome!
> > >> PSR-12 is unfortunately not up to date with the latest shiny stuff
> that we got with PHP 8+. We recently approved the PER workflow, so we could
> try to migrate PSR-12 to a PER, and make it easier to update.
> > >>
> > >> Anyone willing to help on this?
> >
> > Process wise, here's how it should happen:
> >
> > * A new working group gets together and petitions the CC to get
> recognized for a "coding standards" per.  I am going to request that it be
> a full-size group (5 member including CC Sponsor) not a mini-group, given
> its importance.
> >
> > * The first thing the new WG does is copy-paste PSR-12 to a new doc and
> release it as CodingStandards v1.  (Or maybe we can get away with tagging
> it v2?  Either/or.)  The exact process for that is noted in the byalws, and
> will require another CC vote.
> >
> > * Once that's done, the WG can start debating/accepting PRs for coding
> standards updates; when there's "enough" (as defined by the Editor), they
> can release either a 1.1 or a 2.0 (or 2.1/3.0), with the exact process
> again noted in the bylaws.  This MAY require a CC vote, depending on how
> the CC feels about it.  Again, all explained in the bylaws.
> >
> > I would encourage the Editor to be someone who was involved in PSR-12,
> but beyond that it's the same "anyone interested and dedicated" as any
> other WG.
> >
> > --Larry Garfield
> >
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Re: [Nomination][CC] Korvin Szanto

[Korvin Szanto]

Thank you Alex! I accept this nomination.

On Sat, Dec 25, 2021, 5:42 AM 'Alexander Makarov' via PHP Framework
Interoperability Group  wrote:

> Korvin is a core commitee member since 2016. In the past he helped getting
> PSR-12 and PSR-11 done and overall moved the group to the right direction.
> His term ends soon so as a representative of Yii framework, I'd like to
> re-nominte him for the core commitee position.
>
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Re: [PER-Coding-Style] Editor Change

[Korvin Szanto]

Glad to hear from you Alex!

> I'll get back in a month or so
Sounds good, I'll be happy to work with you to get you back in the editor
seat once you're able to be more active.

On Wed, Apr 13, 2022 at 2:15 PM Alex Makarov  wrote:

> Thanks Chris. I was unable to cope with my feelings and work on the PER as
> well as to access Discord (some tech difficulties). I'll get back in a
> month or so.
>
> ср, 13 апр. 2022 г., 23:26 Chris Tankersley :
>
>> As per https://www.php-fig.org/bylaws/elections-and-vacancies/, the
>> original editor Alexander Makarov has been inactive and unreachable for the
>> last 60 days. While all of us in the working group hope everything is OK,
>> as Sponsor I have decided to name a new Editor.
>>
>> Korvin Szanto will be taking over the Editor duties for the time being,
>> and if Alexander returns we will look into reinstating him as the Editor.
>>
>> --
>> Chris Tankersley
>> http://ctankersley.com
>>
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Re: [VOTE][PSR-7] Header validation errata

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Wed, Apr 20, 2022 at 10:35 AM Larry Garfield 
wrote:

> +1
>
> --
>   Larry Garfield
>   la...@garfieldtech.com
>
> On Wed, Apr 20, 2022, at 9:27 AM, Matthew Weier O'Phinney wrote:
> > Hi, all!
> >
> > The two week discussion period regarding proposed errata on PSR-7
> > related to validation of header fields has completed. We had some
> > feedback basically immediately, and that feedback was incorporated. For
> > reference:
> >
> > - https://github.com/php-fig/fig-standards/pull/1274
> >
> > The tl;dr: PSR-7 implementations SHOULD strictly validate header names
> > and contents according to the most recent HTTP specification ([RFC
> > 7230#3.2][1] at the time of writing). The implementation SHOULD reject
> > invalid values and SHOULD NOT make any attempt to automatically correct
> > the provided values. The errata provides more specific details about
> > this validation, but it's primarily around line wrapping of headers.The
> > changes are suggested to ensure that implementations provide a minimum
> > amount of security for end-users.
> >
> > At this time, I am opening a VOTE for inclusion of this errata in
> > PSR-7. The vote is open to CC members only, and requires a 50% quorum,
> > and a 2/3 approval to pass. The vote will end 2 weeks from the time I
> > send this.
> >
> > --
> > Matthew Weier O'Phinney
> > mweierophin...@gmail.com
> > https://mwop.net/
> > he/him
> >
> > --
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> > <
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/php-fig/CAJp_myVoiiH2qd_HwTxT5UgSeGqNVqmsQ4sDur1Km%2BYuqccigQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer
> >.
>
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Re: [Vote] Maintainer for log-util library

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Wed, May 18, 2022 at 5:44 PM Matthew Weier O'Phinney <
mweierophin...@gmail.com> wrote:

> +1 from me.
>
> On Wed, May 18, 2022, 1:36 PM Larry Garfield 
> wrote:
>
>> I hereby open a Core Committee Vote to appoint Ralf Lang as Maintainer
>> for a new log-util library that kinda-sorta exists but has no releases yet.
>> :-)
>>
>> https://github.com/php-fig/log-util/
>>
>> This is an Approval Vote, Core Committee only, quorum is 50%, passage is
>> 2/3.  The vote will end on 1 June or when all of the CC has voted,
>> whichever occurs first.
>>
>> --
>>   Larry Garfield
>>   la...@garfieldtech.com
>>
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[VOTE][WG] Coding Style 1.0.0 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
The Coding Style PER is ready for a 1.0.0 tag! This version is effectively
the
same as PSR-12 with only basic updates to terminology, naming, and
formatting.
You can review the full list of changes here:
https://github.com/php-fig/per-coding-style/compare/8201676...master

This vote is limited to the members of the working group:

- Editor: Me
- Sponsor: Chris Tankersley
- Alexander Makarov
- Kathryn Reeve
- Ken Guest
- Larry Garfield
- Luke Diggins
- Woody Gilk

This is a readiness vote so quorum is 50% and 2/3 majority is required to
pass.
If this vote passes, another vote will begin for the Core Committee's
approval.

Thanks,
Korvin

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Re: [VOTE][WG] Coding Style 1.0.0 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

+1

On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 9:21:48 AM UTC-7 Korvin Szanto wrote:

> Hi Everyone,
> The Coding Style PER is ready for a 1.0.0 tag! This version is effectively 
> the
> same as PSR-12 with only basic updates to terminology, naming, and 
> formatting.
> You can review the full list of changes here: 
> https://github.com/php-fig/per-coding-style/compare/8201676...master 
>
> This vote is limited to the members of the working group:
>
> - Editor: Me
> - Sponsor: Chris Tankersley
> - Alexander Makarov
> - Kathryn Reeve
> - Ken Guest
> - Larry Garfield
> - Luke Diggins
> - Woody Gilk
>
> This is a readiness vote so quorum is 50% and 2/3 majority is required to 
> pass.
> If this vote passes, another vote will begin for the Core Committee's 
> approval.
>
> Thanks,
> Korvin
>

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Re: [VOTE][WG] Coding Style 1.0.0 Readiness Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Everyone has weighed in and we have voted to move forward with a CC
readiness vote!

Votes are as follows:
- Korvin Szanto: +1
- Chris Tankersley: +1
- Alexander Makarov: +1
- Kathryn Reeve: +1
- Ken Guest: +1
- Larry Garfield: +1
- Luke Diggins: +0
- Woody Gilk: +1

I'll open the CC readiness vote tomorrow morning, thanks everyone!

On Tue, May 24, 2022 at 5:11 AM Luke Diggins  wrote:

> +0
>
> On Tuesday, 24 May 2022 at 17:21:37 UTC+10 ezimuel wrote:
>
>> +1
>>
>> Enrico Zimuel
>>
>> Il giorno gio 19 mag 2022 alle ore 18:21 Korvin Szanto <
>> korvin...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
>>
>>> Hi Everyone,
>>> The Coding Style PER is ready for a 1.0.0 tag! This version is
>>> effectively the
>>> same as PSR-12 with only basic updates to terminology, naming, and
>>> formatting.
>>> You can review the full list of changes here:
>>> https://github.com/php-fig/per-coding-style/compare/8201676...master
>>>
>>> This vote is limited to the members of the working group:
>>>
>>> - Editor: Me
>>> - Sponsor: Chris Tankersley
>>> - Alexander Makarov
>>> - Kathryn Reeve
>>> - Ken Guest
>>> - Larry Garfield
>>> - Luke Diggins
>>> - Woody Gilk
>>>
>>> This is a readiness vote so quorum is 50% and 2/3 majority is required
>>> to pass.
>>> If this vote passes, another vote will begin for the Core Committee's
>>> approval.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Korvin
>>>
>>> --
>>>
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>>> "PHP Framework Interoperability Group" group.
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>>> an email to php-fig+u...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/php-fig/CANeXGWVA94Fq3R71J5yP9L8xZjf%2BCgfyxJqd4R8t6KcMONG-4w%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
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[VOTE][CC] Coding Style 1.0.0 Approval Vote

[Korvin Szanto]

Hi Everyone,
The Coding Style PER 1.0.0 tag has been voted ready by the working group.
This
version of the Coding Style PER is effectively the same as PSR-12 with only
basic updates to terminology, naming, and formatting so any project
compatible with PSR-12 today will also be compatible with this proposed
1.0.0.
Please review the full list of changes here:
https://github.com/php-fig/per-coding-style/compare/8201676...b5cac84

This is an approval vote limited to Core Committee members, so quorum is 50%
and 2/3 majority is required to pass. If this vote passes, `b5cac84` will be
tagged as `1.0.0`.

Thanks,
Korvin

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