Re: [platform-dev] SWT Accessibility Documentation

[Eric Williams]

Hi Thomas,

On 3/29/23 11:24, Thomas Singer wrote:
That's what I've tried, but the spoken text still is taken from the 
TreeItem instead of my listener.





Is this on GTK?


Eric

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[platform-dev] Saying Goodbye To SWT

[Eric Williams]

Hello everyone,

I have some rather bittersweet news to share: as of this Wednesday I 
will no longer be working on the Eclipse/SWT team at Red Hat. I haven't 
left the company, but I will be moving to a new group where I'll be 
working on Eclipse Che (specifically Che plugins).


SWT was my first journey into professional software development, as was 
the Eclipse team at Red Hat. I have learned a lot over the years, and I 
hold very dear the experiences I have had. I'd also like to thank all of 
you who make SWT and the Eclipse community great -- there are some 
seriously talented people working on the Eclipse Platform, and I believe 
it is better off because of it. It's been an honour to work with all of 
you, and I have full confidence that SWT (and the Eclipse IDE in 
general) will continue to flourish in the future.


I'll be finishing up some Gerrits in the coming days, as well as 
unassigning myself from bugs. I'll keep an ear out for things that I can 
respond to quickly, and I'll still be keeping my commit rights. Other 
than that I'll be officially starting my new duties as of Wednesday 
December 18th.


I've really enjoyed my time here, and I wish you all the best. Don't be 
strangers!



Eric

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Re: [platform-dev] 4.15 milestones in Bugzilla

[Eric Williams]

On 11/8/19 11:47 AM, Daniel Megert wrote:

Hi Eric

I will do it on Monday.


Thanks! Enjoy the weekend.


Eric

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[platform-dev] 4.15 milestones in Bugzilla

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

Can we have 4.15 and its milestones in Bugzilla? It would be useful 
since we are nearing the end of 4.14 and I'd like to be able to target 
bugs against the next release.


Thanks,
Eric

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[platform-dev] SWT Development Tools Repository

[Eric Williams]

Hello everyone,

For awhile I've had a personal collection of compiled GTK libraries 
which I can feed to SWT in order to test on older GTK3 versions. It 
occurred to me the other day that other SWT developers may want to make 
use of them, or upload their own scripts/tools/compiled libs, etc.


It isn't really feasible to put these in the main SWT repository (hosted 
at Eclipse.org), so I've made a small GitLab repository. Feel free to 
submit PR's for anything you'd want included.



https://gitlab.com/ericwill/swt-development-tools


Thanks,

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat

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Re: [platform-dev] Eclipse on Linux

[Eric Williams]

On 10/17/19 2:10 PM, Thomas Singer wrote:

Hello,

What GTK - 2 or 3 - Eclipse is using on Linux?


4.8 and older have GTK2 support, but quite honestly SWT on GTK2 hasn't 
been actively maintained for awhile, probably not since 4.5/4.6.


As for GTK3 version, 3.10 is the minimum supported version, but I 
strongly recommend 3.22.30 or 3.24.x. Earlier versions of GTK3 were 
unstable and had bugs which we are not currently working around [1] in 
SWT, unless they are present in 3.22/3.24.



1: Patches are welcome, of course.



Thanks,

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Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat

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Re: [platform-dev] Is anybody monitoring new bug reports and forum posts?

[Eric Williams]

On 8/22/19 11:35 PM, Ed Merks wrote:

Guys,

Keep in mind that you might not actually want to turn this mailing list 
into a user question and answer mailing list; you'd probably want a 
separate one for that purpose.


But take note that it's super easy to set up a feed monitor for the 
forum(s), which are actively used, even if so few of you monitor them:


It's configured like this for Thunderbird:

In the end, monitoring this or a mailing list (that you'd likely want to 
filter into folder so you can manage your inbox effectively) is really 
not so entirely different. Perhaps this ought to be more a question of 
what's actually best for the people asking the questions rather than 
what's preferred by the people who might or might not choose to answer them.


Also note that many questions are of course directed to the Newcomers 
forum because users don't generally know where to go to ask questions.  
Nitin and I are effectively the only people (committers) who answer 
questions there, most often to direct people to the right forum, though 
I would never direct people to the Platform forum because I know it's 
generally not well monitored; if there is to be an answer there, it will 
likely come from me, so rather pointless to redirect people there.


This was really helpful, thanks! I'm going to integrate this into my 
workflow, especially now that I know I can see the incoming posts via 
Thunderbird.


--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] Forums

[Eric Williams]

On 8/22/19 4:30 PM, Mickael Istria wrote:
On Thu, Aug 22, 2019 at 8:27 PM Eric Williams <mailto:ericw...@redhat.com>> wrote:


Are the forums active these days? I'm wondering if it makes sense to
still allow posts there, or if we should direct all questions onto
mailing lists, where they are likely to be seen by developers.


I also have concerns about those forums and having in our infrastructure 
such a support channel that we don't seem to monitor.
If we don't want to commit or give the impression of committing to user 
support, it would be better to shutdown the related channels and let 
people move to other unofficial channels like StackOverflow, as they 
already do by the way.


Agreed, I've never monitored the forums and I was under the impression 
that they were shutdown (though that could have been something else). I 
would prefer to keep it to mailing lists and BZ, though I'm planning to 
start monitoring Twitter and StackOverflow more regularly.



Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] Is anybody monitoring new bug reports and forum posts?

[Eric Williams]

On 8/22/19 3:47 AM, Rolf Theunissen wrote:> A similar situation applies 
to the Eclipse Community Forums, even

trivial questions do not get answers, for example:
- https://www.eclipse.org/forums/index.php/t/1100201/

I know it takes a lot of time if one person has to do this all. But as a 
community, I think we should be better, otherwise this will be bad for 
the overall reputation of the whole Eclipse Eco-system.


Are the forums active these days? I'm wondering if it makes sense to 
still allow posts there, or if we should direct all questions onto 
mailing lists, where they are likely to be seen by developers.



Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] Preparing SWT native code for building from a shell?

[Eric Williams]

On 7/7/19 7:25 PM, Torkild U. Resheim wrote:

Hi Platform developers,

I'm picking up an old project of mine again, building the Eclipse Platform for 
the Raspberry Pi[1].

The new Raspberry Pi 4 should be able to cope with the Eclipse IDE much better 
than the previous versions, although I'm mostly interested in using PiPlug as 
one can see in the screenshot[2] in a home automation project.

I wanted to write a script that did most of the job and came over an issue. In order to build the SWT 
binaries I first have to import the "eclipse.platform.swt" project into eclipse, rename the 
".classpath_gtk" file then do a build in order to prepare the code into the "bin" folder. 
So I am wondering whether you are aware of a way of doing this step without having to start Eclipse and 
invoke a build. I would prefer to be able to do everything from a bash script, including copying the files to 
an actual Raspberry Pi and do the compilation there.

I've looked at the "SWT Classpath Builder.launch" code, but I see no way of 
running that outside of Eclipse. Also replicating what these Ant scripts does, may be a 
bit of a hassle.

Best regards,
Torkild U. Resheim
Sadly I don't have an answer for you -- a colleague of mine looked into 
it awhile ago and wasn't able to find an answer. If you do find out, 
please post to the list as it would greatly improve my workflow as well!



Thanks,

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] [SWT] Input method switching

[Eric Williams]

On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 4:46 PM Nikita Nemkin  wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 26, 2019 at 12:03 AM Eric Williams 
> wrote:
>
>> My question: is this a thing on Windows and Mac? AFAICT it's not API, it
>> seems to be a platform implementation detail.
>>
>
> Windows and macOS don't have an equivalent menu. Input method switching is
> handled transparently by the system.
>
> GTK function that builds "Input Methods" menu is declared obsolete since
> 3.10, it's probably safe to remove.
>

Read my mind. :)
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[platform-dev] [SWT] Input method switching

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

I'm researching a bug that involves the input method switching mechanism 
in SWT. You can see an example of this by right clicking anywhere in a 
Java editor (on Linux), and observing the "Input Methods" menu item and 
sub-menu.


On Linux this type of input switching isn't supported anymore -- input 
methods are supposed to be changed using the global input selection 
(part of the desktop environment). The code we have in SWT for this is 
quite ancient to the point where I doubt it even works anymore.


My question: is this a thing on Windows and Mac? AFAICT it's not API, it 
seems to be a platform implementation detail.



Thanks,

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] [SWT] Bugzilla etiquette question

[Eric Williams]

On 6/18/19 8:45 AM, Becker, Matthias wrote:

Hi all,

I don't know how to do this: "Interested committers should register for bug updates 
or incoming Gerrits of there component."
Can you please explain?


In Bugzilla preferences -> Email preferences -> User Watching, add the 
default assignee/project inbox email. For example if you wanted SWT 
updates you'd add  platform-swt-in...@eclipse.org as a user to watch.


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Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] [SWT] Bugzilla etiquette question

[Eric Williams]

On 6/18/19 7:22 AM, Nikita Nemkin wrote:

Hi all,

When I create a bug assigned to myself, should I CC platform-swt-inbox? 
Or the affected port maintainers? Or nobody at all?


Usually what I do is create the bug with the default assignee 
(platform-swt-inbox), and then assign myself the bug immediately after 
that. This way the maintainers/interested parties are aware of the work, 
and also that I intend to work on it.


Sometimes if it's something trivial/obscure, then I'll just assign it to 
myself directly to spare everyone the noise.


IMO it boils down to personal preference.


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Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] Shell.print() on Windows/Mac

[Eric Williams]

On Sun, Jun 16, 2019 at 11:27 AM Thomas Singer  wrote:

> Hi Eric,
>
> Out of curiosity: What does it do on GTK?
>


It prints the entire Shell, i.e. not just the client area, but also the
Shell trimmings (borders, window title/bar, etc.)

Eric
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[platform-dev] Shell.print() on Windows/Mac

[Eric Williams]

Hello fellow SWT developers,

I recently implemented Shell.print() for SWT-GTK, at least on GTK3 using 
X11. In my research I noticed that Windows/Mac have not implemented this 
functionality at all.


For any Windows/Mac experts here: do you think this is possible? IMO 
it's a useful part of the API, and it would be nice if we could have it 
implemented on all 3 platforms.



Thanks,

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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[platform-dev] SWT Gerrits failing

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

There seems to be some sort of issue with the Gerrit jobs failing (since 
yesterday it seems). I've opened bug 545892.



Thanks,

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Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] GTK3: prevent table header from getting focus

[Eric Williams]

On 3/18/19 12:19 PM, Thomas Singer wrote:
A table or tree is just 1 control (the table and tree) and clicking a 
column header just changes the sorting, but the focus never is changed 
(I'm not yet sure, but clicking the column header in a unfocused table 
or tree also might make the table or tree focused).


I noticed this behavior in SmartSynchronize's keyboard-centric file 
manager () because I 
could not move the selection up and down with the cursor keys after 
having clicked the table column header to just change the sorting.


There simply is no reason to change the focus if the table column header 
was clicked by mouse. Since there is no way to focus the table column 
header *button* controls from SWT programmatically, it makes no sense to 
have them focusable at all (in SWT).




I'll have to think about this more -- please file a bug in SWT and add 
me as CC so we can continue the conversation there.



Thanks,
Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] 32-bit code cleanup

[Eric Williams]

On 3/14/19 9:24 AM, Eric Williams wrote:

Hello everyone,

There are a number of 32-bit cleanup items still left to be completed. 
Some of these involve removing the long /*int*/ casts in the SWT source 
code, as well as tidying up any 32-bit cases in the build scripts, etc.


We dropped 32-bit support in 4.10 so there is no real need to have these 
around anymore. If anyone has any objections, please voice them now.


Thanks,


Last call! If no one has any objections I'll start such cleanup tasks 
sometime for M1.



Thanks,
Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] GTK3: prevent table header from getting focus

[Eric Williams]

On 3/15/19 6:04 AM, Thomas Singer wrote:

Hello,

I've noticed that clicking a table header on CentOS 7.6 (GTK 3.22.30) 
will put the focus on this header cell. Setting the environment variable 
GTK_DEBUG to "interactive" and then launching our application reveals 
that in GTK3 table controls actually are "treeview"s that consist of 
"button"s for the table column headers. How to prevent these "button"s 
to get the focus?




What is the behaviour like on Mac/Windows?


Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] 32-bit code cleanup

[Eric Williams]

On 3/14/19 9:57 AM, Nikita Nemkin wrote:

SWT WebKit support on Windows is 32-bit only, is it going away too?


I can't speak for the Windows side of things, on the Linux side we 
stopped producing 32-bit builds but the 32-bit code is there, just not 
maintained. Maybe this is the same on Windows?


Either way, if there are no 32-bit builds on Windows then I imagine 
Windows effectively has no WebKit support.


Niraj, do you know?


Eric

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[platform-dev] 32-bit code cleanup

[Eric Williams]

Hello everyone,

There are a number of 32-bit cleanup items still left to be completed. 
Some of these involve removing the long /*int*/ casts in the SWT source 
code, as well as tidying up any 32-bit cases in the build scripts, etc.


We dropped 32-bit support in 4.10 so there is no real need to have these 
around anymore. If anyone has any objections, please voice them now.


Thanks,

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] Regressions in 4.12

[Eric Williams]

On 3/12/19 5:52 AM, Andrey Loskutov wrote:

Hi all,

master is open, everyone starts to push changes and tests start to fail.

This is "usual" but it makes really no fun for me to keep the tests green by 
hunting after each new fail and bisecting who changed what and to which bug the fail 
belongs.
It would be great if the people contributing patches would also verify that the 
patches do not cause new regressions.


If you wait for the North American people to come to the office, they 
can do this for you. :)




ant.tests.ui : 6 new test fails on GTK3, see

https://download.eclipse.org/eclipse/downloads/drops4/I20190311-1800/testresults/html/org.eclipse.ant.tests.ui_ep412I-unit-cen64-gtk3-java8_linux.gtk.x86_64_8.0.html
https://download.eclipse.org/eclipse/downloads/drops4/I20190311-1800/testresults/html/org.eclipse.ant.tests.ui_ep412I-unit-cen64-gtk3-java11_linux.gtk.x86_64_11.html

ui.tests: 1 new test fail on GTK3, see

https://download.eclipse.org/eclipse/downloads/drops4/I20190311-1800/testresults/html/org.eclipse.ui.tests_ep412I-unit-cen64-gtk3-java8_linux.gtk.x86_64_8.0.html
https://download.eclipse.org/eclipse/downloads/drops4/I20190311-1800/testresults/html/org.eclipse.ui.tests_ep412I-unit-cen64-gtk3-java11_linux.gtk.x86_64_11.html


It looks like these failures all come from the same patch. Out of the 17 
patches I merged yesterday, 1 regression isn't a bad percentage IMO. Xi 
and I will take a look today.



Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] SWT-GTK theme support

[Eric Williams]

On 2/25/19 4:53 AM, Thomas Singer wrote:

Our application shows following information to the user:

*Old GTK3 version detected.*
Following GTK3 version was detected: 3.18.9. Version 3.20+ is strongly 
recommended.

If you experience some strange GUI problems, please remove the leading #
from line
#export SWT_GTK3=0
in smartgit.sh or try to switch to Adwaita theme.

Right now I've got an answer from a user:


I'm not switching my entire desktop theme for one uncooperative
application. And I don't particularly want to disable GTK 3 
altogether. Why

can't this just... work?


This is the typical answer from a user and he actually is right.


If there is a concrete bug you should file a ticket with the theme 
maintainer. Since they wrote the theme it should be easy for them to fix 
(or at least identify) such issues as it's usually a case of padding or 
margin being applied in the wrong area.


As Mickael pointed out from a support POV nothing is changing, we are 
simply codifying what has already been our position for quite some time.


--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] SWT-GTK theme support

[Eric Williams]

On 2/22/19 9:32 AM, Thomas Singer wrote:
The question remains how to get that running just for the SWT 
application without having to change a system theme, or without 
installing anything to the system or the user.




Well now we get into murkier waters of whether SWT should have a concept 
of theme at all. SWT really should just be emulating the look and feel 
of whatever is running on the user's system...so if SWT ships and 
enforces its own theme that does break that contract.


It's one thing to patch a theme that's already set on the user's system, 
it's another thing to enforce and use a completely different theme all 
together and ignore the user's system theme entirely.


--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] SWT-GTK theme support

[Eric Williams]

On 2/22/19 8:50 AM, Mike Wilson wrote:
I'm not averse to there being an "Eclipse" theme, but experience has 
shown that it takes significant investment to create/maintain GTK 
themes. Even if we were just repackaging an existing one, there would be 
significant testing overhead, since including a theme that wasn't known 
to work on the "variants that aren't shipping GTK3 default themes" would 
effectively defeat the purpose.
At this point, I don't see it happening, but if someone in the community 
wants to try, more power to them. Personally, I think we'd be better off 
convincing the distros themselves to move forward.

McQ.


+1. Andrey Loskutov and Simeon Andreev are already doing something 
similar, they don't like the aesthetics of the default GTK theme so they 
basically maintain their own theme. Well they didn't write a theme from 
scratch, but they have adopted the Clearlooks-Phenix theme and patch it 
to work with SWT. It is for this reason that we have the environment 
variable which allows clients to inject their own GTK theme CSS into SWT 
at run-time.



Eric
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[platform-dev] SWT-GTK theme support

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

I'd like to propose an addition to the SWT planning documents, 
specifically the target environments section wrt. to GTK3.



Some background information:

On the Linux side of things we often encounter users running custom GTK 
themes (i.e. themes not shipped with GTK itself) reporting issues 
against SWT. These issues are not actual bugs in SWT but simply issues 
with the user's theme.


SWT exposes bugs in GTK themes quite often because we support widgets of 
all sizes, meaning themes that use padding/margin in odd places will 
usually see visual glitches (as an example). Native GTK applications 
usually don't expose such issues because they do not allow users to 
resize widgets below the GTK minimum size, which is a nice luxury we 
cannot offer due to API contracts.


For years the position has been that SWT-GTK will support the default 
themes shipped with GTK itself. We *do* patch theme issues that SWT 
exposes against the default themes, but they are pretty rare as the 
default GTK themes are well supported.


Now, some users are very attached to their custom themes and would 
prefer to maintain their own theme at their own cost. We have given 
users the option to do so via an environment variable that allows for 
injection of custom GTK CSS into SWT. Our only caveat here is that users 
who choose to go down this road are on their own -- SWT developers will 
not be fixing bugs in a user's custom GTK theme.


This is a problem unique to Linux due to the nature of theming in GTK. 
Mac and Windows don't really have to deal with this, as by-and-large 
they do not support themes other than the default.



My proposal:

We should add some comment in the platform plan target environments 
section about GTK themes, namely: that we only support the default GTK 
themes shipped with GTK (not a desktop environment), and that users are 
more than welcome to use their own custom GTK theme at their own risk. I 
will also be happy to link to a wiki article (which I'll write very 
soon) which explains all of this in detail and what avenues are 
available to users who want to use custom GTK themes.


The reason I bring this up is that there is often quite a bit of back 
and forth in Bugzilla about such topics, and having the position 
explained in a planning document will save SWT developers quite some 
time when this topic arises.



Thoughts?

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] Eclipse editor and StyledText selection events

[Eric Williams]

Hi Dani,

On 2/15/19 9:51 AM, Daniel Megert wrote:

Hello Eric

Sorry, I don't have time right now to test this, but you might. Does it 
send the event when selecting via Shitf+Right/Left Arrow?


It does send selection events in this case, but still not for Shift + 
End. So:


Shift + Right = selection event
(still holding shift) Shift + End = no selection event.

I'll open a bug report.

Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] Eclipse editor and StyledText selection events

[Eric Williams]

Yeah it's also the cause of: 
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=424983


Eric

On 2/14/19 10:24 AM, Mickael Istria wrote:
This could very well be the cause of 
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=541415


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[platform-dev] Eclipse editor and StyledText selection events

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

I am not sure about certain behaviour in the Eclipse Java editor so I am 
writing to this list for clarification.


I am dealing with an issue where StyledText is not sending SWT.Selection 
events when doing selecting text in a certain way while using the 
Eclipse Java editor. Specifically, StyledText.sendSelectionEvent() is 
not being triggered.


For example:
1) Open any Java file in the IDE
2) Press Ctrl + Home
3) Press Shift + End

This will select an entire line, but StyledText.sendSelectionEvent() is 
not called. If I hit the down arrow (moving the caret one line down and 
clearing the selection), I see the method being called. But doing Shift 
+ End on any line is not triggering it at all.


Is this expected behaviour? Using pure SWT StyledText snippets shows 
that Shift + End is indeed triggering the sendSelectionEvent() method, 
but for some reason the Eclipse Java editor is not doing that.


Thoughts?

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] Linux: handle problematic GTK3 themes

[Eric Williams]

On 1/7/19 11:13 AM, Thomas Singer wrote:
In my Linux Mint installation I can select, e.g. "Clearlooks" in the 
GUI for the controls. Adding


export GTK_THEME=Clearlooks

before launching SmartGit has no effect - it still uses the system 
setting of Mint-X.


I'm running now an Ubuntu Mate 18.04 and setting GTK_THEME seems to have 
some visual effect, but the org.eclipse.swt.internal.gtk.theme seems to 
report the system theme, not the actually used one. Is this expected 
behavior? Am I logging the wrong option?





This is a bug, that property should consider the GTK_THEME environment 
variable -- right now it just queries the OS blindly.


Please open a ticket and add me as CC, thanks.


Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] Linux: handle problematic GTK3 themes

[Eric Williams]

On 1/7/19 10:29 AM, Thomas Singer wrote:

Hi Eric,
On 07/01/2019 16:21, Eric Williams wrote:

Hi Thomas,

On 1/7/19 4:30 AM, Thomas Singer wrote:

Hello,

It looks like some GTK themes cause more problems on Linux than 
others, e.g. we have a couple of problems with Mint-X on Linux Mate 
17.1.


According to <https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/3.20/gtk-running.html> 
it should be possible to change the theme of a certain application by 
setting the environment variable GTK_THEME before launching the 
application (ours usually is launched from a .sh script so adding the 
"export GTK_THEME=..." line would be no problem). Unfortunately, this 
does not work - it simply uses the default Mint-X theme.


We have support in SWT to read the GTK_THEME environment variable, so 
this should work. How are you using it? IIRC the theme has to be 
installed on the system in order for GTK_THEME to work.


In my Linux Mint installation I can select, e.g. "Clearlooks" in the GUI 
for the controls. Adding


export GTK_THEME=Clearlooks

before launching SmartGit has no effect - it still uses the system 
setting of Mint-X.


This should be working, does it work with native applications? Maybe 
Linux Mint forces the system theme somehow.



How do you actually manage the problems of different themes in 
combination with SWT? Do you suggest the users to switch their system 
theme? Do you abort the application with an error if a known buggy 
theme is detected?


SWT only officially supports the default GTK theme (Adwaita). A lot of 
themes follow the Adwaita style of declaring colors and other such 
things so it's usually not an issue, however there are exceptions. In 
these cases we do not try to fix issues in broken themes as there are 
no manpower/resources to do so. It's not really SWT's responsibility 
to fix broken GTK themes anyways.


 From the user perspective it looks like the SWT-based applications are 
broken, because native applications simply work. Usually, users also 
don't want to change the system theme because it looks good for them and 
they might have selected it because they like it.


That said, if your theme is "difficult" and causes issues in SWT, you 
can feed some GTK CSS to SWT via the 
org.eclipse.swt.internal.gtk.cssFile property. SWT will load the CSS 
in this file at startup. I believe bug 527729 had some discussion on 
this matter.


Thanks you.

Quite related: why some controls, e.g. buttons, in native GTK 
applications look so different than the ones in a SWT application?


GTK has a concept of "minimum size", i.e. if you try to resize an app 
below a certain size it will just deny the resize all together. SWT has 
API for absolute sizes regardless of minimum size, which can cause some 
conflict in GTK.


Some themes really exacerbate this disparity by having large padding 
around widgets like buttons, text entries, etc. They look good in native 
GTK because they never get shrunk small enough, but in SWT they do and 
then you see the ugliness.



Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] Linux: handle problematic GTK3 themes

[Eric Williams]

Hi Thomas,

On 1/7/19 4:30 AM, Thomas Singer wrote:

Hello,

It looks like some GTK themes cause more problems on Linux than others, 
e.g. we have a couple of problems with Mint-X on Linux Mate 17.1.


According to <https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/3.20/gtk-running.html> it 
should be possible to change the theme of a certain application by 
setting the environment variable GTK_THEME before launching the 
application (ours usually is launched from a .sh script so adding the 
"export GTK_THEME=..." line would be no problem). Unfortunately, this 
does not work - it simply uses the default Mint-X theme.


We have support in SWT to read the GTK_THEME environment variable, so 
this should work. How are you using it? IIRC the theme has to be 
installed on the system in order for GTK_THEME to work.



How do you actually manage the problems of different themes in 
combination with SWT? Do you suggest the users to switch their system 
theme? Do you abort the application with an error if a known buggy theme 
is detected?


SWT only officially supports the default GTK theme (Adwaita). A lot of 
themes follow the Adwaita style of declaring colors and other such 
things so it's usually not an issue, however there are exceptions. In 
these cases we do not try to fix issues in broken themes as there are no 
manpower/resources to do so. It's not really SWT's responsibility to fix 
broken GTK themes anyways.


That said, if your theme is "difficult" and causes issues in SWT, you 
can feed some GTK CSS to SWT via the 
org.eclipse.swt.internal.gtk.cssFile property. SWT will load the CSS in 
this file at startup. I believe bug 527729 had some discussion on this 
matter.



MfG,

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] 4.11 milestone tags in Bugzilla

[Eric Williams]

Okay, no problem!

Eric

On 12/11/18 12:04 PM, Daniel Megert wrote:

I was on it, but there's

_Bug 542677_ <https://bugs.eclipse.org/542677>: Can't Edt Bugzilla Data

Dani



From: Eric Williams 
To: platform-dev@eclipse.org
Date: 11.12.2018 17:56
Subject: [platform-dev] 4.11 milestone tags in Bugzilla
Sent by: platform-dev-boun...@eclipse.org




Hello,

Would it be possible to create these so that we can start tagging 4.11
fixes? We have already had some merges this morning.

Thanks,
Eric
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[platform-dev] 4.11 milestone tags in Bugzilla

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

Would it be possible to create these so that we can start tagging 4.11 
fixes? We have already had some merges this morning.


Thanks,
Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] [platform-swt-dev] SWT-GTK3 bugs for 4.9

[Eric Williams]

Hi,

On 06/11/2018 03:21 AM, Robert Zenz wrote:

On 08.06.2018 17:51, Eric Williams wrote:

Are you referring to "interim" GTK3 releases like GTK3.16/3.18/3.20?


I'm talking about the whole GTK+ release cycle. At least the last thing I've
heard is that a new GTK+ version is being released every two years, that means
that one version is dropped every two years. That means that you get two years
of instability (with the interim versions) and then two years of stability,
afterwards it's deprecated, dead and gone. I've already seen people calling for
removing GTK+2 from distribution repositories because it will be
deprecated...this whole thing is absolutely insane considering we are talking
about a toolkit! Imagine if libc, or the Linux kernels public API, had such a
release cycle. It's madness in my eyes and pretty much removes GTK+ from the
list of viable platforms to build upon.


This is incorrect, the deprecation scheme in GTK (at least GTK3) was 
quite aggressive but not quite as bad as you've listed it here.


GTK2.24 was released in 2011. That is the final and stable version of 
GTK2. This is (roughly) when GTK3 development began. GTK3 deprecated a 
lot of the API from GTK2, and while they are deprecated they will not be 
removed until GTK4. This means GTK2 API support should (in theory) work 
until GTK4 released, which is now roughly 7-8 years. During this 7-8 
years of GTK3 development, you have the option to use the interim 
releases of GTK3, or continue to use GTK2. The same will be true when 
GTK4 is released -- API deprecated by GTK4 won't be removed until GTK5, 
and so on.


In reality, GTK3 broke a lot of API even though the GTK devs guaranteed 
it would work. IMO they have received a lot of flak about this, and not 
all of it unjustified. However, updating a toolkit to be more modern is 
quite an undertaking so I can also see their POV a little bit. The gap 
between GTK2 and GTK3 is quite large, and I don't think it will be quite 
as large for future GTK releases. However even with GTK2 -> GTK3, the 
GTK2 API has been working for ~8 years or so.


Bottom line: the GTK release scheme is aggressive but not quite as bad 
as losing API every 2 years.


Of course this is beyond the control of SWT, so we just have to live 
with it and make do with what we can. We are in touch with the GTK devs 
semi regulary, and they do help us out with patches from time-to-time. :)



Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] [platform-swt-dev] SWT-GTK3 bugs for 4.9

[Eric Williams]

On 06/08/2018 10:23 AM, Robert Zenz wrote> I guess I still can't wrap

my head around the idea to have GTK+ releases being deprecated the moment they
have stabilized, and practically only getting 2 years of stable life out of a
release. That is still a thought that is absolutely insane to me.


Are you referring to "interim" GTK3 releases like GTK3.16/3.18/3.20?

In a perfect world we could support all of these versions. But with the 
limited manpower we have combined with the volatility of GTK3 API 
pre-GTK3.22, this is not feasible. There is no point (in fact it's even 
detrimental) to spend time fixing older GTK3 bugs in SWT when they have 
already been fixed in a newer, more stable GTK3 version.


Why Ubuntu decided to pick GTK3.18 for an LTS release is questionable, 
but ultimately out of my control. And now with Ubuntu 18.04 LTS out 
there are other options for 16.04 users. I am also open to reviewing 
patches that fix bugs for individual GTK3 versions, and in fact there 
have been some cases of this already. [1] However from my POV, new 
development efforts will only target bugs that affect GTK3.22.


1: https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=533241


Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] [platform-swt-dev] SWT-GTK3 bugs for 4.9

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

On 06/08/2018 08:01 AM, Robert Zenz wrote:

On 01.06.2018 17:24, Eric Williams wrote:


In practice, GTK3 bugs specific to Ubuntu 16.04 are already ignored -- we will
accept patches for them but otherwise no time is spent on these issues.


Wouldn't that be a reason to keep it around, to make sure that these systems can
switch to the GTK+2 implementation to circumvent bugs?


I would rather people upgrade to Ubuntu 18.04 LTS than still use 16.04. 
Apart from an up-to-date GTK3, Ubuntu 18.04 uses GNOME which also 
resolves a lot of Ubuntu specific bugs. There were also a lot of theme 
fixes for 18.04 which make quite a difference IIRC.




Though, giving this some more thought, my previous arguments are pretty much
moot, as you and Aleksandar have pointed out. I might be one of the few which
are using SWT with the GTK+2 implementation because the biggest part of my DE is
still GTK+2.


Is this the only reason? Or are there some other SWT GTK3 bugs which 
prevent you from using SWT-GTK3? The DE being GTK2 shouldn't be an issue 
when running SWT-GTK3.



Eric
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Re: [platform-dev] [platform-swt-dev] SWT-GTK3 bugs for 4.9

[Eric Williams]

Hello,

On 06/01/2018 11:16 AM, Mickael Istria wrote:



On Fri, Jun 1, 2018 at 5:06 PM, Robert Zenz <mailto:robert.z...@sibvisions.com>> wrote:


So completely dropping GTK+2 support
will have an impact on these environments which are still supported.


I guess Eclipse Project would announce that Ubuntu 16.04 is not 
supported by the project team anymore (ie bug specific to Ubuntu 16.04 
would be ignored by the team). 


In practice, GTK3 bugs specific to Ubuntu 16.04 are already ignored -- 
we will accept patches for them but otherwise no time is spent on these 
issues.


The reason is that Ubuntu 16.04 LTS uses GTK3.18 which has been obsolete 
for 3 years. There is no point in fixing bugs that only affect this GTK3 
version, as the final and stable release of GTK3 is 3.22. Furthermore 
Ubuntu 16.04 LTS is the only distro that uses this GTK3 version, even 
Ubuntu 18.04 LTS has GTK3.22 and an up-to-date GNOME stack.


That said: issues that are reproducible on GTK3.22 are always a 
priority, and any such bugs should be filed/pointed out ASAP.



Thanks,

--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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[platform-dev] SWT-GTK3 bugs for 4.9

[Eric Williams]

Hello everyone,

4.8 is almost done and many GTK3 bugs have been fixed. For 4.9, we are 
again focusing on GTK3 bugs and performance issues.


If you are running SWT/Eclipse on GTK2, please try with GTK3 as we are 
trying to root out all SWT bugs which prevent GTK2 users from switching 
to GTK3. If you already filed a bug awhile ago, please feel free to 
email/CC me as a reminder -- we have a backlog of old bugs so sometimes 
these things slip through the cracks.


We also have the 4.9 GTK3 bug tracker which can be found here: 
https://bugs.eclipse.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=535255


Thanks,


--
Eric Williams
Software Engineer - Eclipse/SWT Team
Red Hat
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Re: [platform-dev] Nomination of Alexander Kurtakov as Eclipse Platform lead

[Eric Williams]

+1!


Eric

On 10/13/2017 10:14 AM, Lars Vogel wrote:

Friends of the Eclipse Platform,

we all know Alex as he is all over the Eclipse top-level project code.

He is currently the most active committer of the platform project, see 
https://projects.eclipse.org/projects/eclipse.platform/who He is also 
very actively in the cleanup and modernization of our code base to 
reduce warnings and the like and delivers high-quality code.


Following the principle of meritocracy, I would like to suggest Alex as 
additional project lead for Eclipse Platform. Current leads are Szymon 
Ptaszkiewicz, Sravan Kumar Lakkimsetti, Lakshmi Shanmugam, Dani Megert 
and myself.


I confirmed with Alex that he is interested in becoming an official 
project lead.


Please cast your vote on this mailing list, as we have no official tool 
for that.


Best regards, Lars
--
Eclipse Platform UI and e4 project co-lead
CEO vogella GmbH

Haindaalwisch 17a, 22395 Hamburg
Amtsgericht Hamburg: HRB 127058
Geschäftsführer: Lars Vogel, Jennifer Nerlich de Vogel
USt-IdNr.: DE284122352
Fax (040) 5247 6322, Email: lars.vo...@vogella.com 
, Web: http://www.vogella.com




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