Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[keith smith]

Thanks Eric!

Your question "Do you have a virtualization platform you'll be using for your 
server(s), or will you be putting this on bare iron?"  caused me to chuckle.  
I'm thinking of buying a netbook and using it for a LAMP server.  I like the 
small footprint, low heat output, and can't beat the price.  With a KVM I can 
share my flat screen, mouse and keyboard.  

I might not be ready by 8/16.  However I am interested in a Server InstallFest 
in the future.

Thanks again for your help!



Keith Smith

--- On Wed, 8/1/12, Eric Shubert  wrote:

From: Eric Shubert 
Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
Date: Wednesday, August 1, 2012, 8:32 AM

On 07/30/2012 08:11 AM, keith smith wrote:
> 
> Hi Eric,
> 
> You where one of the people that helped me when I had questions about
> configuring Qmail Toaster on CentOS 5.
> 
> I've been toying with the idea of configuring a server and taking
> another stab at running a server out of my home office.  I've done some
> brief research and it appears the way to configure Qmail Toaster on
> CentOS 6 is to follow the CentOS 5 install and configuration.  Am I on
> the right track?
> 
> Thank you for your help then and thank you for your help going forward.
> 
> 
> Keith Smith
> 

There are a couple community members who have cobbled together scripts that 
will handle installing QMT on COS6. Those have helped to lay the groundwork for 
what needs to be done to get things running on COS6. Some of these changes have 
already been incorporated into the stock packages. I hope to have the stock QMT 
and QTP COS6-capable by the end of this month, so if you're not in a hurry, I'd 
wait for that.

I'll try to have things ready for the 8/16 Server InstallFest if you'd like to 
build one there. Even if I don't have the stock stuff done by then, I'm sure we 
can get a QMT built for you on COS6.

Do you have a virtualization platform you'll be using for your server(s), or 
will you be putting this on bare iron?

-- -Eric 'shubes'



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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Eric Shubert]

On 07/30/2012 08:11 AM, keith smith wrote:


Hi Eric,

You where one of the people that helped me when I had questions about
configuring Qmail Toaster on CentOS 5.

I've been toying with the idea of configuring a server and taking
another stab at running a server out of my home office.  I've done some
brief research and it appears the way to configure Qmail Toaster on
CentOS 6 is to follow the CentOS 5 install and configuration.  Am I on
the right track?

Thank you for your help then and thank you for your help going forward.


Keith Smith



There are a couple community members who have cobbled together scripts 
that will handle installing QMT on COS6. Those have helped to lay the 
groundwork for what needs to be done to get things running on COS6. Some 
of these changes have already been incorporated into the stock packages. 
I hope to have the stock QMT and QTP COS6-capable by the end of this 
month, so if you're not in a hurry, I'd wait for that.


I'll try to have things ready for the 8/16 Server InstallFest if you'd 
like to build one there. Even if I don't have the stock stuff done by 
then, I'm sure we can get a QMT built for you on COS6.


Do you have a virtualization platform you'll be using for your 
server(s), or will you be putting this on bare iron?


--
-Eric 'shubes'



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Re: speakeasy/megapath (was RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV)

[Michael Butash]

I'm pretty particular about "outages", most instilled from business that 
there's a big different between 99.99 and 99.999 percent uptime on 
networks.  Modems locking up classify as that, but physical signal 
issues are more often where those are directed, or upstream headend 
equipment failures outside windows.  I hear from a few folks their 
modems do that, but it's a bit of a misnomer considering most dsl modems 
are also a router/firewall, and one of questionable performance.


Back when bittorrent wasn't being lorded by ambulance-chasing lawyers 
trying to sue everyone using it, I could crush my old pix firewall with 
connection amounts generated by it (+2000 at times naturally).  So much 
so, I actually imposed static limits on tcp/udp translations for it, but 
not easy to do when it began hiding in other ports and protocols.  Older 
or more cpu-bound consumer routers (or crappy code on them) can easily 
get crushed with a few-thousand connections tracked for nat purposes, so 
wouldn't surprise me if the "outages" are somewhat self-inflicted with 
cpu/memory for nat simply getting exhausted.  It's been years since I've 
had to reboot the cox modem that wasn't a somewhat planned outage (I 
usually ask one of their backbone guys that knows).  I'd rather it stay 
a dumb modem and let my asa handle the rest.


Bell telco's might as well equal government run, and sadly I find their 
union influence drags their quality down as they create more problem 
than they fix (and they don't/can't get fired).  When they have outages, 
it's usually pretty large and egregious, and i see this much more with 
business services.  Cox is _very_ anti-union, and I understand why, 
other than simple corporate greed.  Same could be said of Cox's 
residential contracted installers however being of questionable quality 
standards.  I have personal issues with the Belle's, but no less than 
with Cox or others - I simply have found cable internet over time to be 
superior in service offering, and not just pride of having helped build 
the tech, or Cox.


In the end, use what works for you, and what you find acceptable in your 
area.  Some parts of town simply have notoriously bad coax feeders, or 
2wire for dsl that cannot practically be fixed thus giving you little 
option in one over another.


Show me single-mode fiber in the ground at my house at a reasonable 
cost, I guarantee you my opinion, and isp would change.  mmm, optical.


-mb


On 07/30/2012 08:46 AM, Carruth, Rusty wrote:

However, you guys talking about 'outages' make me go - huh?  Outage?
I'm sure we've had some, but I haven't seen anything but the periodic
lockup of my DSL modem such that I have to power cycle it (no more than
once a month - in fact the last time I did that was probably 4 months
ago) - and I'm not sure I can blame them for that (it's my own modem -
previous one died and I just threw my own in there).  Well, ok I
remember there have been scheduled outages at times, but their scheduled
maintenance is almost always between midnight and 6am, as far as I
remember, so I don't remember ever being offline due to them.  I may
have been, but I don't remember it...)


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RE: speakeasy/megapath (was RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV)

[Carruth, Rusty]

Whichever you want to use.  I use ssh, of course :-)

(And I admit to being lazy and saying telnet when I am actually using
ssh.)

> -Original Message-
> 
> SSH is OK.
> Telnet is a self-destructing proposition.
> SSH or telnet?
> Hopefully SSH...
> ET

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Re: speakeasy/megapath (was RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV)

[kitepi...@kitepilot.com]

SSH is OK.
Telnet is a self-destructing proposition.
SSH or telnet?
Hopefully SSH...
ET 




Carruth, Rusty writes: 


Yep.  Rarely use it - oh, yes, forgot to mention - I have some amount of
storage there and can set up my own web stuff there on their server as
well.  That's part of the reason for having the telnet/ssh access.  The
public/www (or whatever it was) directory that is your own web page if
you know where to look (something like www.speakeasy.net/~userid if I
remember right, back when they were speakeasy) 

Rusty 


-Original Message-
 
> telnet access to a server there on their site...

Did I read this right?
Oh my, oh my...
ET 





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RE: speakeasy/megapath (was RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV)

[Carruth, Rusty]

Boy, the memory is bad today: I just remembered I also get like 10 email
addresses at speakeasy as well. Don't need them since I run my own mail
server...



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RE: speakeasy/megapath (was RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV)

[Carruth, Rusty]

Yep.  Rarely use it - oh, yes, forgot to mention - I have some amount of
storage there and can set up my own web stuff there on their server as
well.  That's part of the reason for having the telnet/ssh access.  The
public/www (or whatever it was) directory that is your own web page if
you know where to look (something like www.speakeasy.net/~userid if I
remember right, back when they were speakeasy)

Rusty

> -Original Message-
>  
> > telnet access to a server there on their site...
> Did I read this right?
> Oh my, oh my...
> ET
> 
> 

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Re: speakeasy/megapath (was RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV)

[kitepi...@kitepilot.com]

telnet access to a server there on their site...

Did I read this right?
Oh my, oh my...
ET 




Carruth, Rusty writes: 

I use what used to be Speakeasy, now is megapath (bought out). 


I was VERY happy with Speakeasy - you call their tech line, they are
TECHNICAL folks.  I could talk routers, NAT, whatever with them and they
knew it. 


I have what I call the 'sysadmin at home' DSL package - 2 static IP
addresses, telnet access to a server there on their site, almost all
ports open, and 'minimal' tech support for $60 a month (I think I'm at
2.5Mb/s down, but I'd have to look - a while back they did a 'free'
upgrade from the 1.4 or whatever that I had before that). 


I end up calling them for something about once a year - usually because
I forgot a password.  Last week I had to call them because I was
installing a new firewall and the hard drive of the previous one died so
I had no idea of my static IP addresses OR my default route! (oops) They
weren't quite as quick and techy as I remembered, but then all they had
to do was look up my static ip addresses and default gw, so it really
didn't matter. 


I run mail server at home (which is why I chose them), I have run a web
server there (plan to set it back up 'real soon now' :-) ), both with no
issues. 


However, you guys talking about 'outages' make me go - huh?  Outage?
I'm sure we've had some, but I haven't seen anything but the periodic
lockup of my DSL modem such that I have to power cycle it (no more than
once a month - in fact the last time I did that was probably 4 months
ago) - and I'm not sure I can blame them for that (it's my own modem -
previous one died and I just threw my own in there).  Well, ok I
remember there have been scheduled outages at times, but their scheduled
maintenance is almost always between midnight and 6am, as far as I
remember, so I don't remember ever being offline due to them.  I may
have been, but I don't remember it...) 


Overall I've been very happy with them.  But then I've not had to really
deal with them since the MegaPath switch. 

Rusty 



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speakeasy/megapath (was RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV)

[Carruth, Rusty]

I use what used to be Speakeasy, now is megapath (bought out).

I was VERY happy with Speakeasy - you call their tech line, they are
TECHNICAL folks.  I could talk routers, NAT, whatever with them and they
knew it.

I have what I call the 'sysadmin at home' DSL package - 2 static IP
addresses, telnet access to a server there on their site, almost all
ports open, and 'minimal' tech support for $60 a month (I think I'm at
2.5Mb/s down, but I'd have to look - a while back they did a 'free'
upgrade from the 1.4 or whatever that I had before that).

I end up calling them for something about once a year - usually because
I forgot a password.  Last week I had to call them because I was
installing a new firewall and the hard drive of the previous one died so
I had no idea of my static IP addresses OR my default route! (oops) They
weren't quite as quick and techy as I remembered, but then all they had
to do was look up my static ip addresses and default gw, so it really
didn't matter.

I run mail server at home (which is why I chose them), I have run a web
server there (plan to set it back up 'real soon now' :-) ), both with no
issues.

However, you guys talking about 'outages' make me go - huh?  Outage?
I'm sure we've had some, but I haven't seen anything but the periodic
lockup of my DSL modem such that I have to power cycle it (no more than
once a month - in fact the last time I did that was probably 4 months
ago) - and I'm not sure I can blame them for that (it's my own modem -
previous one died and I just threw my own in there).  Well, ok I
remember there have been scheduled outages at times, but their scheduled
maintenance is almost always between midnight and 6am, as far as I
remember, so I don't remember ever being offline due to them.  I may
have been, but I don't remember it...)

Overall I've been very happy with them.  But then I've not had to really
deal with them since the MegaPath switch.

Rusty


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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[keith smith]

Hi Eric,

You where one of the people that helped me when I had questions about 
configuring Qmail Toaster on CentOS 5.

I've been toying with the idea of configuring a server and taking another stab 
at running a server out of my home office.  I've done some brief research and 
it appears the way to configure Qmail Toaster on CentOS 6 is to follow the 
CentOS 5 install and configuration.  Am I on the right track? 

Thank you for your help then and thank you for your help going forward.



Keith Smith

--- On Sun, 7/29/12, Eric Shubert  wrote:

From: Eric Shubert 
Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
Date: Sunday, July 29, 2012, 7:12 PM

On 07/28/2012 11:51 AM, keith smith wrote:
> I home office and twitched from a consumer package to a business package
> so I would have the ability to run a server.  I ran a server part time
> for testing only.  I was testing out the Qmail Toaster.
> 
> I had a bad experience running a server about 10 years ago.  I left the
> email relay open and was exploited.  Since then I have been leery of
> running server out of my house.

With Cox, you pretty much need a business account to run a mail server. 
Otherwise, you'd need to have DynDNS or some other service provider handle your 
DNS and both incoming and outbound email, which is still less expensive than a 
business account, but it gets to be a bit of a pain, especially if you plan to 
have more than a single domain. Cox residential used to block port 80 as well, 
so if you'll be doing web sites, you'll need a reverse proxy somewhere.

On the DSL side of things, I've been running Qmail Toaster on residential DSL 
since May'06 or so. I had a dynamic address, and used DynDNS for DNS and 
outbound email. When they started blocking port 25 a few weeks ago, I ponied up 
for a static address (still a residential account). The additional cost is 
pretty much offset by the savings in not having to use DynDNS for DNS and 
outbound email any more.

Sorry to hear about your open relay experience, Keith. That's not so easy to do 
any more, and there are numerous online checkers that will test your 
configuration for you. FWIW, I took over leadership of the Qmail Toaster 
project the beginning of this year, and we'd love to see anyone interested join 
us on the qmail-toaster email list. I know we have a few users in the Phoenix 
area, and hundreds others world wide. We just finished setting up our DNS 
infrastructure, and we have 13 DNS servers on 5 continents. Overkill, I know. 
It's nice to see what the community can do though. I'm eager to see what else 
is in store.

-- -Eric 'shubes'



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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Eric Shubert]

On 07/28/2012 11:51 AM, keith smith wrote:

I home office and twitched from a consumer package to a business package
so I would have the ability to run a server.  I ran a server part time
for testing only.  I was testing out the Qmail Toaster.

I had a bad experience running a server about 10 years ago.  I left the
email relay open and was exploited.  Since then I have been leery of
running server out of my house.


With Cox, you pretty much need a business account to run a mail server. 
Otherwise, you'd need to have DynDNS or some other service provider 
handle your DNS and both incoming and outbound email, which is still 
less expensive than a business account, but it gets to be a bit of a 
pain, especially if you plan to have more than a single domain. Cox 
residential used to block port 80 as well, so if you'll be doing web 
sites, you'll need a reverse proxy somewhere.


On the DSL side of things, I've been running Qmail Toaster on 
residential DSL since May'06 or so. I had a dynamic address, and used 
DynDNS for DNS and outbound email. When they started blocking port 25 a 
few weeks ago, I ponied up for a static address (still a residential 
account). The additional cost is pretty much offset by the savings in 
not having to use DynDNS for DNS and outbound email any more.


Sorry to hear about your open relay experience, Keith. That's not so 
easy to do any more, and there are numerous online checkers that will 
test your configuration for you. FWIW, I took over leadership of the 
Qmail Toaster project the beginning of this year, and we'd love to see 
anyone interested join us on the qmail-toaster email list. I know we 
have a few users in the Phoenix area, and hundreds others world wide. We 
just finished setting up our DNS infrastructure, and we have 13 DNS 
servers on 5 continents. Overkill, I know. It's nice to see what the 
community can do though. I'm eager to see what else is in store.


--
-Eric 'shubes'



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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Michael Butash]

I do, mostly my lab, but I have it running on a residential connection, 
and only the mid/20mb package.  I can ipsec or ssl-vpn to my asa, and do 
what I need to remotely when on business from my lte router from my 
internal network.


I don't use a lot of bandwidth (aside from personal usenet reaping), 
it's mostly internal stuff with vmware, various linux systems, ad 
controllers to play with, storage, and a host of other vm's, but it 
amounts to quite a few.  That mostly stays gige within my house though. 
 I nat everything out one address, and vpn in for everything else.


I'm planning to go business services once I actually need higher uptime 
than I get now (ie someone to come when it breaks asap), and they're 
good for it.


Pro-tip - If you have a relation with a cox account manager (or know 
someone at times) from bigger businesses with fiber connectivity or 
such, you can sometimes get a deal as a "teleworker" package personally, 
which amounts to "bulk" connectivity for business service cable to 
aggregate their workforce on cox connections with business-level mttr. 
Generally its the highest-service level package, business response, and 
~$80 dollar price tag at last check.


It's usually kind of a hook-up deal, but depends if your business 
account manager likes you spending money with them, and enough of it.  :)


-mb


On 07/28/2012 11:51 AM, keith smith wrote:

"I couldn't run the small datacenter in my house with it though.". --
Are you using Cox to do this?

I home office and twitched from a consumer package to a business package
so I would have the ability to run a server. I ran a server part time
for testing only. I was testing out the Qmail Toaster.

I had a bad experience running a server about 10 years ago. I left the
email relay open and was exploited. Since then I have been leery of
running server out of my house.

My cable connection has been very stable with just a couple of outages.
I think those outages where on my consumer connection. I do not think I
have had any outages since twitching.

I'd be interested to hear if you are using Cox for your home based data
center.


Keith Smith

--- On *Fri, 7/27/12, Michael Butash //* wrote:


From: Michael Butash 
Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
Date: Friday, July 27, 2012, 10:33 PM

Qwest/CL DSL has always proven spotty *at times* with anyone I've
ever known using it. As a network guy I inquire with fellow geeks I
know, and they let me know. Generally the residential side of
Qwest/CL fairly weak on troubleshooting most issues because of
simple physical problems that often cannot easily be overcome with
2wire systems. If you can get VDSL, it's decent from what I've
heard, as long as you have new wiring, in a new area, and live close
to where every they dropped the local dslam. Most fall NOT into this
category.

Data comes in the form of modulation, and consider 10baset requires
4 wires still, gig ethernet 8. 2-wire is poop compared to the
modulation and speed capable on _shielded_ coax. Qwest has simply
had to push the envelope with dsl tech to remain relevant in the
market, eventually resorting to new wiring (twisted-pair i think),
often with some shielding now to achieve it which is hardly
traditional for a telco outside of business service. Eventually they
had to begin to roll fiber as they were reaching unpractical
limitations in their 2wire tech to modulate data at *competitive
speeds*.

Fixed point-to-multipoint ala old sprint broadband and various
others operate in parts that do it too now, sometimes a decent
alternative where available I've heard (cave creek area). At least
until it is oversubscribed to hell. Sprint acquired independents
here in town setting them up, but ultimately they oversold it to
death, and finally shot it in the head to finish years later. Not
sure this isn't the eventual outcome of any wireless deployment.

Satellite is a last-resort option with as stated, latency and
bandwidth caps (extreme point-to-multipoint far, far away).

If celco's weren't so greedy/proud of wireless LTE tech, it would be
decent as a fixed solution as well as mobile as latency and
throughput is much improved. I couldn't run the small datacenter in
my house with it though. I can however get a LTE EHWIC for a Cisco
router now that customers can and do use as a "backup" solution when
someone back-hoe's your businesses fiber.

Qwest/CL fiber deployment, like fios is "pon", passive-optical
network based. These are not to be confused with anything like
optical ethernet, sonet, dwdm, etc that are "active" optics. Cable,
dsl, most non-optical (generally) are

Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[keith smith]

"I couldn't run the small datacenter in my house with it though.".  -- Are you 
using Cox to do this?

I home office and twitched from a consumer package to a business package so I 
would have the ability to run a server.  I ran a server part time for testing 
only.  I was testing out the Qmail Toaster.  

I had a bad experience running a server about 10 years ago.  I left the email 
relay open and was exploited.  Since then I have been leery of running server 
out of my house. 

My cable connection has been very stable with just a couple of outages.  I 
think those outages where on my consumer connection.  I do not think I have had 
any outages since twitching.

I'd be interested to hear if you are using Cox for your home based data 
center.  



Keith Smith

--- On Fri, 7/27/12, Michael Butash  wrote:

From: Michael Butash 
Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
Date: Friday, July 27, 2012, 10:33 PM

Qwest/CL DSL has always proven spotty *at times* with anyone I've ever known 
using it.  As a network guy I inquire with fellow geeks I know, and they let me 
know.  Generally the residential side of Qwest/CL fairly weak on 
troubleshooting most issues because of simple physical problems that often 
cannot easily be overcome with 2wire systems.  If you can get VDSL, it's decent 
from what I've heard, as long as you have new wiring, in a new area, and live 
close to where every they dropped the local dslam.  Most fall NOT into this 
category.

Data comes in the form of modulation, and consider 10baset requires 4 wires 
still, gig ethernet 8.  2-wire is poop compared to the modulation and speed 
capable on _shielded_ coax.  Qwest has simply had to push the envelope with dsl 
tech to remain relevant in the market, eventually resorting to new wiring 
(twisted-pair i think), often with some shielding now to achieve it which is 
hardly traditional for a telco outside of business service.  Eventually they 
had to begin to roll fiber as they were reaching unpractical limitations in 
their 2wire tech to modulate data at *competitive speeds*.

Fixed point-to-multipoint ala old sprint broadband and various others operate 
in parts that do it too now, sometimes a decent alternative where available 
I've heard (cave creek area).  At least until it is oversubscribed to hell.  
Sprint acquired independents here in town setting them up, but ultimately they 
oversold it to death, and finally shot it in the head to finish years later.  
Not sure this isn't the eventual outcome of any wireless deployment.

Satellite is a last-resort option with as stated, latency and bandwidth caps 
(extreme point-to-multipoint far, far away).

If celco's weren't so greedy/proud of wireless LTE tech, it would be decent as 
a fixed solution as well as mobile as latency and throughput is much improved.  
I couldn't run the small datacenter in my house with it though.  I can however 
get a LTE EHWIC for a Cisco router now that customers can and do use as a 
"backup" solution when someone back-hoe's your businesses fiber.

Qwest/CL fiber deployment, like fios is "pon", passive-optical network based.  
These are not to be confused with anything like optical ethernet, sonet, dwdm, 
etc that are "active" optics.  Cable, dsl, most non-optical (generally) are 
subject to async behavior as you have a small modem, and a very large cmts and 
active amplifier network driving very large coax feeds at headends and active 
optical from there.  Fiber doesn't have so much those physical limitations so 
long as the laser can use power in the diode to shoot your frames from here to 
there some ways (active zx single-mode optics can shoot 60km for gige, raman 
based dwdm amps much further).  PON is a cost-effective way of aggregating 
fiber in a controlled fashion as you somewhat would a copper plant, only now 
the techs roll with portable fusion splicers and otdr's instead of qam test kit 
for coax.

Cable is where it's at, when fiber is not.  I've too worked at cox, and 
actually back to @home and offshoot isp back in the day when they started the 
tech before cox as media whores figured out what IP was. The modulation and 
timing that drives docsis 3.0 is very scalable for a copper means, and it's 
nothing cox will need to dig up and replace anytime soon.  Other than being a 
bit proud of watching and working it along the way, it's solid tech.

I have some issues with Cox ultimately, but they are one of the less evil of 
the isp's out there, and generally have much improved stability over most 
anything else.  Generally speaking, the only time I call them is when truly 
something dies (arizona is hell on coax), as I don't require network support 
otherwise.  I've used them off and on a good 14 years for data, and as long as 
you have a clean physical connectio

Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Michael Havens]

yep a read the whole thing. woosh! right over my head!

On Fri, Jul 27, 2012 at 10:33 PM, Michael Butash  wrote:

> Qwest/CL DSL has always proven spotty *at times* with anyone I've ever
> known using it.  As a network guy I inquire with fellow geeks I know, and
> they let me know.  Generally the residential side of Qwest/CL fairly weak
> on troubleshooting most issues because of simple physical problems that
> often cannot easily be overcome with 2wire systems.  If you can get VDSL,
> it's decent from what I've heard, as long as you have new wiring, in a new
> area, and live close to where every they dropped the local dslam.  Most
> fall NOT into this category.
>
> Data comes in the form of modulation, and consider 10baset requires 4
> wires still, gig ethernet 8.  2-wire is poop compared to the modulation and
> speed capable on _shielded_ coax.  Qwest has simply had to push the
> envelope with dsl tech to remain relevant in the market, eventually
> resorting to new wiring (twisted-pair i think), often with some shielding
> now to achieve it which is hardly traditional for a telco outside of
> business service.  Eventually they had to begin to roll fiber as they were
> reaching unpractical limitations in their 2wire tech to modulate data at
> *competitive speeds*.
>
> Fixed point-to-multipoint ala old sprint broadband and various others
> operate in parts that do it too now, sometimes a decent alternative where
> available I've heard (cave creek area).  At least until it is
> oversubscribed to hell.  Sprint acquired independents here in town setting
> them up, but ultimately they oversold it to death, and finally shot it in
> the head to finish years later.  Not sure this isn't the eventual outcome
> of any wireless deployment.
>
> Satellite is a last-resort option with as stated, latency and bandwidth
> caps (extreme point-to-multipoint far, far away).
>
> If celco's weren't so greedy/proud of wireless LTE tech, it would be
> decent as a fixed solution as well as mobile as latency and throughput is
> much improved.  I couldn't run the small datacenter in my house with it
> though.  I can however get a LTE EHWIC for a Cisco router now that
> customers can and do use as a "backup" solution when someone back-hoe's
> your businesses fiber.
>
> Qwest/CL fiber deployment, like fios is "pon", passive-optical network
> based.  These are not to be confused with anything like optical ethernet,
> sonet, dwdm, etc that are "active" optics.  Cable, dsl, most non-optical
> (generally) are subject to async behavior as you have a small modem, and a
> very large cmts and active amplifier network driving very large coax feeds
> at headends and active optical from there.  Fiber doesn't have so much
> those physical limitations so long as the laser can use power in the diode
> to shoot your frames from here to there some ways (active zx single-mode
> optics can shoot 60km for gige, raman based dwdm amps much further).  PON
> is a cost-effective way of aggregating fiber in a controlled fashion as you
> somewhat would a copper plant, only now the techs roll with portable fusion
> splicers and otdr's instead of qam test kit for coax.
>
> Cable is where it's at, when fiber is not.  I've too worked at cox, and
> actually back to @home and offshoot isp back in the day when they started
> the tech before cox as media whores figured out what IP was. The modulation
> and timing that drives docsis 3.0 is very scalable for a copper means, and
> it's nothing cox will need to dig up and replace anytime soon.  Other than
> being a bit proud of watching and working it along the way, it's solid tech.
>
> I have some issues with Cox ultimately, but they are one of the less evil
> of the isp's out there, and generally have much improved stability over
> most anything else.  Generally speaking, the only time I call them is when
> truly something dies (arizona is hell on coax), as I don't require network
> support otherwise.  I've used them off and on a good 14 years for data, and
> as long as you have a clean physical connection (modem levels can tell
> you/them this), it's pretty damn solid.  Business services gets you someone
> out to fix your stuff asap vs. 2-3 bd, and open ports (cox blocks
> surprisingly less than you might think these days on residential - not even
> https).
>
> So far pon is driving speeds comparable to cable with qam docsis 3.0 now
> that they're channel-bonding to aggregate much as wireless tech does in
> 802.11n.  Pon is capable of 10g speed down, 2.5gb up.  That is why cox and
> other cable mso/isp's killed analog off, to reclaim huge/clean spectrum to
> reuse for wide-band operation across more spectrum to compete with this.
>  They're ability with modems and cmts channel/timing management to
> auto-provision docsis allows them to optimize channel/spectrum bonding/mimo
> usage, allowing them to simply keep adding more bandwidth.
>
> Data on cable used to be shoehorned into a small chunk of spectrum (what
> good is

Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Michael Butash]

Qwest/CL DSL has always proven spotty *at times* with anyone I've ever 
known using it.  As a network guy I inquire with fellow geeks I know, 
and they let me know.  Generally the residential side of Qwest/CL fairly 
weak on troubleshooting most issues because of simple physical problems 
that often cannot easily be overcome with 2wire systems.  If you can get 
VDSL, it's decent from what I've heard, as long as you have new wiring, 
in a new area, and live close to where every they dropped the local 
dslam.  Most fall NOT into this category.


Data comes in the form of modulation, and consider 10baset requires 4 
wires still, gig ethernet 8.  2-wire is poop compared to the modulation 
and speed capable on _shielded_ coax.  Qwest has simply had to push the 
envelope with dsl tech to remain relevant in the market, eventually 
resorting to new wiring (twisted-pair i think), often with some 
shielding now to achieve it which is hardly traditional for a telco 
outside of business service.  Eventually they had to begin to roll fiber 
as they were reaching unpractical limitations in their 2wire tech to 
modulate data at *competitive speeds*.


Fixed point-to-multipoint ala old sprint broadband and various others 
operate in parts that do it too now, sometimes a decent alternative 
where available I've heard (cave creek area).  At least until it is 
oversubscribed to hell.  Sprint acquired independents here in town 
setting them up, but ultimately they oversold it to death, and finally 
shot it in the head to finish years later.  Not sure this isn't the 
eventual outcome of any wireless deployment.


Satellite is a last-resort option with as stated, latency and bandwidth 
caps (extreme point-to-multipoint far, far away).


If celco's weren't so greedy/proud of wireless LTE tech, it would be 
decent as a fixed solution as well as mobile as latency and throughput 
is much improved.  I couldn't run the small datacenter in my house with 
it though.  I can however get a LTE EHWIC for a Cisco router now that 
customers can and do use as a "backup" solution when someone back-hoe's 
your businesses fiber.


Qwest/CL fiber deployment, like fios is "pon", passive-optical network 
based.  These are not to be confused with anything like optical 
ethernet, sonet, dwdm, etc that are "active" optics.  Cable, dsl, most 
non-optical (generally) are subject to async behavior as you have a 
small modem, and a very large cmts and active amplifier network driving 
very large coax feeds at headends and active optical from there.  Fiber 
doesn't have so much those physical limitations so long as the laser can 
use power in the diode to shoot your frames from here to there some ways 
(active zx single-mode optics can shoot 60km for gige, raman based dwdm 
amps much further).  PON is a cost-effective way of aggregating fiber in 
a controlled fashion as you somewhat would a copper plant, only now the 
techs roll with portable fusion splicers and otdr's instead of qam test 
kit for coax.


Cable is where it's at, when fiber is not.  I've too worked at cox, and 
actually back to @home and offshoot isp back in the day when they 
started the tech before cox as media whores figured out what IP was. 
The modulation and timing that drives docsis 3.0 is very scalable for a 
copper means, and it's nothing cox will need to dig up and replace 
anytime soon.  Other than being a bit proud of watching and working it 
along the way, it's solid tech.


I have some issues with Cox ultimately, but they are one of the less 
evil of the isp's out there, and generally have much improved stability 
over most anything else.  Generally speaking, the only time I call them 
is when truly something dies (arizona is hell on coax), as I don't 
require network support otherwise.  I've used them off and on a good 14 
years for data, and as long as you have a clean physical connection 
(modem levels can tell you/them this), it's pretty damn solid.  Business 
services gets you someone out to fix your stuff asap vs. 2-3 bd, and 
open ports (cox blocks surprisingly less than you might think these days 
on residential - not even https).


So far pon is driving speeds comparable to cable with qam docsis 3.0 now 
that they're channel-bonding to aggregate much as wireless tech does in 
802.11n.  Pon is capable of 10g speed down, 2.5gb up.  That is why cox 
and other cable mso/isp's killed analog off, to reclaim huge/clean 
spectrum to reuse for wide-band operation across more spectrum to 
compete with this.  They're ability with modems and cmts channel/timing 
management to auto-provision docsis allows them to optimize 
channel/spectrum bonding/mimo usage, allowing them to simply keep adding 
more bandwidth.


Data on cable used to be shoehorned into a small chunk of spectrum (what 
good is data? cox, circa 1996).  Now that wastful tech is off, it gives 
them more channels to use from 200khz to 6.4mhz.  Things like qam at 128 
now allows for huge modular data streams, and diver

Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[jill]

I have to think my experience is probably atypical or they'd be rioting
in the streets.  But, you asked I answer.  :)  

We switched to Qwest about a year and a half ago when they ran new fiber
through our neighborhood in Chandler.  No TV, just data on a business
account for static IP and all ports.  It was actually decent for a good
long while, never had to call in for support.  When we called for basic
account stuff they were easy to work with.  Speed varied quite a bit
from the advertised 'up to' we paid for, but eh - shared dsl/cable,
don't expect much.  Then from 6/12 to 7/15 we had 6 (known) outages in
excess of 60 minutes.  Everything from failed DSLAM cards and gateways
to 'oops we botched a vlan tag' and 'gee we don't know but hey it's
working now'.  Trying to deal with them on any of those was painful at
best and terribly enlightening.  There is nowhere in all of CL a DSL
subscriber, including a business account, can ever sit and talk face to
face about their account.  Only fiber/t1/pri circuit accounts get that.
Stores can only do sales, no account access at all.  I had one call
where I was transferred 8 times before being told that all departments
who could do account support were closed (at 6:30pm on a weekday, having
initiated the call at 4:40).  Their policy is to cold transfer calls so
you're constantly re-explaining - been told this policy by I think it's
been 3 different CL reps.  We're actively switching back to Cox right
now.  It's a bit pricier, but I know as both business or residential I
can go into stores and get help if I need to and on a business cable
account you get a real live human account rep.  So if that's the sort of
that's important to you, it's worth considering.  (full disclosure
disclaimer: I am also a former Cox employee, but we're talking 6 years
ago.  I've also worked for 2 other cable companies over the years prior
to that, so I recognize my ISP standards may be excessively high!)

I don't know if something might have changed at CL recently, especially
with Eric's experience that they changed residential port blocking in
June.  Your mileage of course may vary, but I'd hesitate to sign a
contract at least at first if you decide to try it out.

-- 
Jill


On 2012-07-26 01:19, Mark Astrauskas wrote:
> CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new 
> Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with 
> CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I 
> could save a good amount every month and could even get a faster speed, 
> so I'm strongly considering it.
> 
> Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current 
> provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.
> 
> Thanks,
> Mark
> ---
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> 
>

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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[James Dugger]

I'm on CL DSL with a static IP, (Residential plan, in Mesa, East Valley).
My plan is 5Mbps up and 40Mbps down (These are theoretical max's), in speed
tests I would say it averages 2.3-4.3Mbps up and between 21-34 Mbps down.
CL DSL claims 40Mbps as their max download bandwidth.  I believe Cox claims
a max of 50Mbps down and 5Mbps up.

Though I am no expert I believe the biggest difference between DSL and
Cable in bandwidth behaviour is how each handles load balancing during peak
use.  I have had my DSL go offline for a split second and reinitialize
during extreme peak conditions, When I had cable in the past it didn't lose
link status.  While this may not sound like a big deal, I work from home
through a VPN connection to a datacenter where my companies servers are
co-located.  During extended backups (I have a local mirror) I have noticed
that sometimes the VPN connection goes down, causing a backup failure.
Most of our other employees are on Cox and have not noticed this issue. I
can't say for sure it is the DSL but suspect it.

-- 
James
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RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[keith smith]

Wouldn't requiring a business license severely limit their business?  



Keith Smith

--- On Thu, 7/26/12, ChasM Marshall  wrote:

From: ChasM Marshall 
Subject: RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV
To: "plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us" 

Date: Thursday, July 26, 2012, 6:11 PM





"Dallas" ... "fiber with Internet/TV/Phone all"  I'd bet that is Verizon.  
Sounds like their biz model.

My nearby neighbors say that when they ask CL for DSL service, a business 
license is required.
Along with a huge start-up deposit.

  (-:  Chas.M.  :-)

> To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> From: e...@shubes.net
> Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
> Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2012 07:42:38 -0700
> 
> I can't say I've had any experience with CL's fiber in particular.
> 
> I can say that I'm favorably impressed with DSL service since CL took 
> over. While they decided to start blocking port 25 on consumer accounts 
> recently (6/27 to be specific), I recently converted to a static IP 
> address and things couldn't have gone more smoothly. It was *all* done 
> through the web, with no need for any contact with a human (sounds bad, 
> but is typically good). The new address was picked up automagically by 
> pppoe. I was then able to unblock port 25 and even set rDNS with the web 
> interface. All for $25 setup fee plus $5.95 per month extra. Not bad 
> considering with Cox you need a business account (starts at about $88/mo 
> incl taxes) in order to have a static address.
> 
> As far as fiber's concerned, I visited a relative in Dallas recently who 
> had fiber with Internet/TV/Phone all over the fiber. I don't think their 
> provider was CL, but they said the service was flawless (and they're not 
> technical at all).
> 
> I would definitely give CL's fiber serious consideration.
> 
> -- 
> -Eric 'shubes'
> 
> On 07/25/2012 07:07 PM, Mark Astrauskas wrote:
> > I saw such reviews online, but all seemed to be regarding when they ran
> > as Qwest. I'm hoping to hear from a recent customer that knows if the
> > new management/rebranding has improved anything.
> >
> > Putting aside the billing problems, how was the service itself?
> >
> > On 7/25/2012 6:31 PM, Stephen wrote:
> >>
> >> My experience dates back to the qwest/uswest says where "features"
> >> would magically appear on my account. Things like vm and long distance
> >> on my modem line ect. So i have really had very little interest in
> >> going back.
> >>
> >> On Jul 25, 2012 6:26 PM, "Mark Astrauskas"  >> <mailto:ap...@cox.net>> wrote:
> >>
> >> CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their
> >> new Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience
> >> with CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It
> >> looks like I could save a good amount every month and could even
> >> get a faster speed, so I'm strongly considering it.
> >>
> >> Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
> >> provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Mark
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> <mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list -PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---
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> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
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RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[ChasM Marshall]

"Dallas" ... "fiber with Internet/TV/Phone all"  I'd bet that is Verizon.  
Sounds like their biz model.

My nearby neighbors say that when they ask CL for DSL service, a business 
license is required.
Along with a huge start-up deposit.

  (-:  Chas.M.  :-)

> To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> From: e...@shubes.net
> Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
> Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2012 07:42:38 -0700
> 
> I can't say I've had any experience with CL's fiber in particular.
> 
> I can say that I'm favorably impressed with DSL service since CL took 
> over. While they decided to start blocking port 25 on consumer accounts 
> recently (6/27 to be specific), I recently converted to a static IP 
> address and things couldn't have gone more smoothly. It was *all* done 
> through the web, with no need for any contact with a human (sounds bad, 
> but is typically good). The new address was picked up automagically by 
> pppoe. I was then able to unblock port 25 and even set rDNS with the web 
> interface. All for $25 setup fee plus $5.95 per month extra. Not bad 
> considering with Cox you need a business account (starts at about $88/mo 
> incl taxes) in order to have a static address.
> 
> As far as fiber's concerned, I visited a relative in Dallas recently who 
> had fiber with Internet/TV/Phone all over the fiber. I don't think their 
> provider was CL, but they said the service was flawless (and they're not 
> technical at all).
> 
> I would definitely give CL's fiber serious consideration.
> 
> -- 
> -Eric 'shubes'
> 
> On 07/25/2012 07:07 PM, Mark Astrauskas wrote:
> > I saw such reviews online, but all seemed to be regarding when they ran
> > as Qwest. I'm hoping to hear from a recent customer that knows if the
> > new management/rebranding has improved anything.
> >
> > Putting aside the billing problems, how was the service itself?
> >
> > On 7/25/2012 6:31 PM, Stephen wrote:
> >>
> >> My experience dates back to the qwest/uswest says where "features"
> >> would magically appear on my account. Things like vm and long distance
> >> on my modem line ect. So i have really had very little interest in
> >> going back.
> >>
> >> On Jul 25, 2012 6:26 PM, "Mark Astrauskas"  >> <mailto:ap...@cox.net>> wrote:
> >>
> >> CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their
> >> new Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience
> >> with CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It
> >> looks like I could save a good amount every month and could even
> >> get a faster speed, so I'm strongly considering it.
> >>
> >> Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
> >> provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Mark
> >> ---
> >> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> >> <mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us>
> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---
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> >> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> >> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ---
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Eric Shubert]

I can't say I've had any experience with CL's fiber in particular.

I can say that I'm favorably impressed with DSL service since CL took 
over. While they decided to start blocking port 25 on consumer accounts 
recently (6/27 to be specific), I recently converted to a static IP 
address and things couldn't have gone more smoothly. It was *all* done 
through the web, with no need for any contact with a human (sounds bad, 
but is typically good). The new address was picked up automagically by 
pppoe. I was then able to unblock port 25 and even set rDNS with the web 
interface. All for $25 setup fee plus $5.95 per month extra. Not bad 
considering with Cox you need a business account (starts at about $88/mo 
incl taxes) in order to have a static address.


As far as fiber's concerned, I visited a relative in Dallas recently who 
had fiber with Internet/TV/Phone all over the fiber. I don't think their 
provider was CL, but they said the service was flawless (and they're not 
technical at all).


I would definitely give CL's fiber serious consideration.

--
-Eric 'shubes'

On 07/25/2012 07:07 PM, Mark Astrauskas wrote:

I saw such reviews online, but all seemed to be regarding when they ran
as Qwest. I'm hoping to hear from a recent customer that knows if the
new management/rebranding has improved anything.

Putting aside the billing problems, how was the service itself?

On 7/25/2012 6:31 PM, Stephen wrote:


My experience dates back to the qwest/uswest says where "features"
would magically appear on my account. Things like vm and long distance
on my modem line ect. So i have really had very little interest in
going back.

On Jul 25, 2012 6:26 PM, "Mark Astrauskas" mailto:ap...@cox.net>> wrote:

CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their
new Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience
with CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It
looks like I could save a good amount every month and could even
get a faster speed, so I'm strongly considering it.

Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.

Thanks,
Mark
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Derek Trotter]

The latency of satellite internet will never change.  The satellite is 
some 22,300 miles above the equator.  Because you're not on the equator, 
the distance to your home will be more than that.  The same goes for the 
facility that sends up what you download and receives what you upload.  
The speed the data moves at is limited to the speed of light.  As long 
as satellite based internet uses satellites in geostationary orbit, 
latency will be high.


My sister had satellite internet last  year and complained of the high 
price and quota.  She was allowed only 2GB of data per day. If she went 
over that, her download speeds were restricted for the rest of the day 
to something that made dialup look fast.

On 7/25/2012 22:20, Ken wrote:



What's the scoop on satellite interwebz these days? Still pricey & 
high latency?




*From:* ChasM Marshall 
*To:* parabell...@yahoo.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, July 25, 2012 7:30 PM
*Subject:* RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV

Hiya,
  Here's my rural viewpoint:

DirecTV:
We use DirecTV on two Satellite recievers, one dish.
Our premium bundle includes HBO.
Last week there was a Viacom blackout (which included Comedy Channel.)
I do not expect to be reimbursed at all.
The Texas-based 800 Phone service has outright lied to us regarding 
charges
we incurred to re-adjust dish pointing.  Prior to service I was told 
that the

standard $50.00 visit would be waived, but it wasn't. Naturally,
they called back to invite us to do a survey.  (I almost cussed at em.)
Our DirecTV does not include Internet-anything (THAT would DOUBLE our 
costs).
Being that Tonopah has NO cable, and NO Fiber for residents, it's a 
monopoly.


CenturyLink/QWest:
We have a CAT3 land line with QWest/CenturyLink and are lucky to get a 
dial tone.
For fifteen years phone service, the fail rate is about four days 
every two years.

Years ago, lightening killed my DirecTV receiver through the phone line.
Seems that windy wet weather can kill equipment at my local substation 
too.
The station is less than a mile away, but they cannot offer us DSL 
service.  huh?

It has multiple fiber T-1 links from local schools ten miles away.
A new housing sub-division, 15 miles distant, recently began offering 
DSL service.

Nearby folks have dumped ALL telco services for one DSL connection.
Our Unified School District is five hundred square miles.
Being that Tonopah has only 7 thousand residents, it's a monopoly too.
Side notes:
There is a QWest CFO in Federal jail today for pension embezzelment.
There WAS a national Uniform Service Fund that telcos should be using, but
the FCC is now TWO YEARS behind in accounting for state expenditures.
Arizona is only one state that FCC regulation ignores.
Should I mention that the FCC operates like a monopoly?
I wouldn't know who to complain to, and have to chalk it up to rural life.

If you think a new name or new management would change my opinion ...

  (-:  Chas.M.  :-)


Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2012 19:08:39 -0700
From: parabell...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us

Nice thing about DSL is you can pick your ISP. We used FastQ when we 
lived in Mesa, it was good. Didn't have the peak speeds Cox did but it 
was much more consistent and reliable. And, we had static IP's and 
could run home servers, unlike cocks. Your results may vary, but 
should be good performance if fiber is in your hood. Century Link 
Customer Service is a sea of menus and sri lanka help-desk people.


The DirecTV installers butchered the dish install, put lag bolts right 
through the roof, big nasty leaking holes and splinters of wood and it 
still wobbled in the wind. I would have been pissed had we not been 
doing a roof job a few months later anyway. I re-installed it 
proper-like, it's easy enough to do it yourself. More & better music 
channels, roomie liked the sports line-up better.


-Ken




*From:* Mark Astrauskas 
*To:* Main PLUG discussion list 
*Sent:* Wednesday, July 25, 2012 6:19 PM
*Subject:* CenturyLink/DirectTV

CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new 
Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with 
CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I 
could save a good amount every month and could even get a faster 
speed, so I'm strongly considering it.


Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current 
provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.


Thanks,
Mark
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Stephen]

Not sure about price bit physics says the latency will be there regardless.
Just rakes that long to bounce a signal.
On Jul 25, 2012 10:20 PM, "Ken"  wrote:

> 
>
> What's the scoop on satellite interwebz these days? Still pricey & high
> latency?
>
>
>   --
> *From:* ChasM Marshall 
> *To:* parabell...@yahoo.com
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 25, 2012 7:30 PM
> *Subject:* RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV
>
>  Hiya,
>   Here's my rural viewpoint:
>
> DirecTV:
> We use DirecTV on two Satellite recievers, one dish.
> Our premium bundle includes HBO.
> Last week there was a Viacom blackout (which included Comedy Channel.)
> I do not expect to be reimbursed at all.
> The Texas-based 800 Phone service has outright lied to us regarding charges
> we incurred to re-adjust dish pointing.  Prior to service I was told that
> the
> standard $50.00 visit would be waived, but it wasn't.  Naturally,
> they called back to invite us to do a survey.  (I almost cussed at em.)
> Our DirecTV does not include Internet-anything (THAT would DOUBLE our
> costs).
> Being that Tonopah has NO cable, and NO Fiber for residents, it's a
> monopoly.
>
> CenturyLink/QWest:
> We have a CAT3 land line with QWest/CenturyLink and are lucky to get a
> dial tone.
> For fifteen years phone service, the fail rate is about four days every
> two years.
> Years ago, lightening killed my DirecTV receiver through the phone line.
> Seems that windy wet weather can kill equipment at my local substation too.
> The station is less than a mile away, but they cannot offer us DSL
> service.  huh?
> It has multiple fiber T-1 links from local schools ten miles away.
> A new housing sub-division, 15 miles distant, recently began offering DSL
> service.
> Nearby folks have dumped ALL telco services for one DSL connection.
> Our Unified School District is five hundred square miles.
> Being that Tonopah has only 7 thousand residents, it's a monopoly too.
> Side notes:
> There is a QWest CFO in Federal jail today for pension embezzelment.
> There WAS a national Uniform Service Fund that telcos should be using, but
> the FCC is now TWO YEARS behind in accounting for state expenditures.
> Arizona is only one state that FCC regulation ignores.
> Should I mention that the FCC operates like a monopoly?
> I wouldn't know who to complain to, and have to chalk it up to rural life.
>
> If you think a new name or new management would change my opinion ...
>
>   (-:  Chas.M.  :-)
>
> --
> Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2012 19:08:39 -0700
> From: parabell...@yahoo.com
> Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
> To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
>
> Nice thing about DSL is you can pick your ISP. We used FastQ when we lived
> in Mesa, it was good. Didn't have the peak speeds Cox did but it was much
> more consistent and reliable. And, we had static IP's and could run home
> servers, unlike cocks. Your results may vary, but should be good
> performance if fiber is in your hood. Century Link Customer Service is a
> sea of menus and sri lanka help-desk people.
>
> The DirecTV installers butchered the dish install, put lag bolts right
> through the roof, big nasty leaking holes and splinters of wood and it
> still wobbled in the wind. I would have been pissed had we not been doing a
> roof job a few months later anyway. I re-installed it proper-like, it's
> easy enough to do it yourself. More & better music channels, roomie liked
> the sports line-up better.
>
> -Ken
>
>
>
>   --
> *From:* Mark Astrauskas 
> *To:* Main PLUG discussion list 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 25, 2012 6:19 PM
> *Subject:* CenturyLink/DirectTV
>
> CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new
> Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with
> CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I
> could save a good amount every month and could even get a faster speed, so
> I'm strongly considering it.
>
> Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
> provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.
>
> Thanks,
> Mark
> ---
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss<http://lists.plug.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss>
>
>
>
> --- PLUG-discuss mailing
> list - PLUG-discuss

Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Ken]

 


What's the scoop on satellite interwebz these days? Still pricey & high latency?





 From: ChasM Marshall 
To: parabell...@yahoo.com 
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 7:30 PM
Subject: RE: CenturyLink/DirectTV
 

 
Hiya,
  Here's my rural viewpoint:

DirecTV:
We use DirecTV on two Satellite recievers, one dish.  
Our premium bundle includes HBO. 
Last week there was a Viacom blackout (which included Comedy Channel.)
I do not expect to be reimbursed at all.  
The Texas-based 800 Phone service has outright lied to us regarding charges
we incurred to re-adjust dish pointing.  Prior to service I was told that the
standard $50.00 visit would be waived, but it wasn't.  Naturally,
they called back to invite us to do a survey.  (I almost cussed at em.)
Our DirecTV does not include Internet-anything (THAT would DOUBLE our costs).
Being that Tonopah has NO cable, and NO Fiber for residents, it's a monopoly.

CenturyLink/QWest:
We have a CAT3 land line with QWest/CenturyLink and are lucky to get a dial 
tone.
For fifteen years phone service, the fail rate is about four days every two 
years.
Years ago, lightening killed my DirecTV receiver through the phone line.
Seems that windy wet weather can kill equipment at my local substation too.
The station is less than a mile away, but they cannot offer us DSL service.  
huh?  
It has multiple fiber T-1 links from local schools ten miles away.
A new housing sub-division, 15 miles distant, recently began offering DSL 
service.
Nearby folks have dumped ALL telco services for one DSL connection.
Our Unified School District is five hundred square miles.
Being that Tonopah has only 7 thousand residents, it's a monopoly too.
Side notes:  
There is a QWest CFO in Federal jail today for pension embezzelment.
There WAS a national Uniform Service Fund that telcos should be using, but
the FCC is now TWO YEARS behind in accounting for state expenditures.
Arizona is only one state that FCC regulation ignores.
Should I mention that the FCC operates like a monopoly?
I wouldn't know who to complain to, and have to chalk it up to rural life.

If you think a new name or new management would change my opinion ...

  (-:  Chas.M.  :-)




Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2012 19:08:39 -0700
From: parabell...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV
To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us


Nice thing about DSL is you can pick your ISP. We used FastQ when we lived in 
Mesa, it was good. Didn't have the peak speeds Cox did but it was much more 
consistent and reliable. And, we had static IP's and could run home servers, 
unlike cocks. Your results may vary, but should be good performance if fiber is 
in your hood. Century Link Customer Service is a sea of menus and sri lanka 
help-desk people. 


The DirecTV installers butchered the dish install, put lag bolts right through 
the roof, big nasty leaking holes and splinters of wood and it still wobbled in 
the wind. I would have been pissed had we not been doing a roof job a few 
months later anyway. I re-installed it proper-like, it's easy enough to do it 
yourself. More & better music channels, roomie liked the sports line-up better. 


-Ken





 From: Mark Astrauskas 
To: Main PLUG discussion list  
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 6:19 PM
Subject: CenturyLink/DirectTV
 
CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new 
Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with 
CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I could 
save a good amount every month and could even get a faster speed, so I'm 
strongly considering it.

Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current provider), so 
I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.

Thanks,
Mark
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Ken]

Nice thing about DSL is you can pick your ISP. We used FastQ when we lived in 
Mesa, it was good. Didn't have the peak speeds Cox did but it was much more 
consistent and reliable. And, we had static IP's and could run home servers, 
unlike cocks. Your results may vary, but should be good performance if fiber is 
in your hood. Century Link Customer Service is a sea of menus and sri lanka 
help-desk people. 


The DirecTV installers butchered the dish install, put lag bolts right through 
the roof, big nasty leaking holes and splinters of wood and it still wobbled in 
the wind. I would have been pissed had we not been doing a roof job a few 
months later anyway. I re-installed it proper-like, it's easy enough to do it 
yourself. More & better music channels, roomie liked the sports line-up better. 


-Ken





 From: Mark Astrauskas 
To: Main PLUG discussion list  
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 6:19 PM
Subject: CenturyLink/DirectTV
 
CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new 
Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with 
CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I could 
save a good amount every month and could even get a faster speed, so I'm 
strongly considering it.

Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current provider), so 
I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.

Thanks,
Mark
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Mark Astrauskas]

I saw such reviews online, but all seemed to be regarding when they ran 
as Qwest. I'm hoping to hear from a recent customer that knows if the 
new management/rebranding has improved anything.


Putting aside the billing problems, how was the service itself?

On 7/25/2012 6:31 PM, Stephen wrote:


My experience dates back to the qwest/uswest says where "features" 
would magically appear on my account. Things like vm and long distance 
on my modem line ect. So i have really had very little interest in 
going back.


On Jul 25, 2012 6:26 PM, "Mark Astrauskas" > wrote:


CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their
new Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience
with CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It
looks like I could save a good amount every month and could even
get a faster speed, so I'm strongly considering it.

Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.

Thanks,
Mark
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Stephen]

Wire the old ones up to your wifi and have fun...
On Jul 25, 2012 6:51 PM, "Michael Havens"  wrote:

> you want a dish on your house? If there is already one there make sure you
> instruct the tech to take the old one(s) down. WHen I was training to be an
> installer we went to one house with three dishes already up. My trainer
> just put a fourth in place.
>
> On Wed, Jul 25, 2012 at 6:31 PM, Stephen  wrote:
>
>> My experience dates back to the qwest/uswest says where "features" would
>> magically appear on my account. Things like vm and long distance on my
>> modem line ect. So i have really had very little interest in going back.
>>  On Jul 25, 2012 6:26 PM, "Mark Astrauskas"  wrote:
>>
>>> CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new
>>> Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with
>>> CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I
>>> could save a good amount every month and could even get a faster speed, so
>>> I'm strongly considering it.
>>>
>>> Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
>>> provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Mark
>>> --**-
>>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - 
>>> plug-disc...@lists.plug.**phoenix.az.us
>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.**us/mailman/listinfo/plug-**discuss
>>>
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> :-)~MIKE~(-:
>
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Michael Havens]

you want a dish on your house? If there is already one there make sure you
instruct the tech to take the old one(s) down. WHen I was training to be an
installer we went to one house with three dishes already up. My trainer
just put a fourth in place.

On Wed, Jul 25, 2012 at 6:31 PM, Stephen  wrote:

> My experience dates back to the qwest/uswest says where "features" would
> magically appear on my account. Things like vm and long distance on my
> modem line ect. So i have really had very little interest in going back.
> On Jul 25, 2012 6:26 PM, "Mark Astrauskas"  wrote:
>
>> CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new
>> Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with
>> CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I
>> could save a good amount every month and could even get a faster speed, so
>> I'm strongly considering it.
>>
>> Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
>> provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Mark
>> --**-
>> PLUG-discuss mailing list - 
>> plug-disc...@lists.plug.**phoenix.az.us
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
>> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.**us/mailman/listinfo/plug-**discuss
>>
>
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-- 
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Re: CenturyLink/DirectTV

[Stephen]

My experience dates back to the qwest/uswest says where "features" would
magically appear on my account. Things like vm and long distance on my
modem line ect. So i have really had very little interest in going back.
On Jul 25, 2012 6:26 PM, "Mark Astrauskas"  wrote:

> CenturyLink recently laid fiber in my area and is pitching their new
> Internet/DirectTV service. Does anyone have recent experience with
> CenturyLink's fiber offering or with DirectTV as well? It looks like I
> could save a good amount every month and could even get a faster speed, so
> I'm strongly considering it.
>
> Yelp reviews are awful, but so are the Cox Cable ones (my current
> provider), so I'm seeking any firsthand comments or experiences.
>
> Thanks,
> Mark
> --**-
> PLUG-discuss mailing list - 
> plug-disc...@lists.plug.**phoenix.az.us
> To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings:
> http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.**us/mailman/listinfo/plug-**discuss
>
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