Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Matthias Loibl]

ABSTAIN as I don't feel strongly either way.
I would like to see this getting brought up again for Prometheus v3.0
though, whenever that will happen.

Am Di., 25. Jan. 2022 um 09:07 Uhr schrieb Ganesh Vernekar <
ganeshv...@gmail.com>:

> Abstain from voting. Same reason as Callum.
>
> On Tue, 25 Jan 2022 at 03:33, Callum Styan  wrote:
>
>> ABSTAIN
>>
>> I don't have a strong enough opinion to vote either way.
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 24, 2022 at 1:26 PM Richard Hartmann <
>> richih.mailingl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> PS: I would prefer if such a change would happen as part of a
>>> Prometheus 3.x -- but I don't know if that's realistic.
>>>
>>> --
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>>> .
>>>
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>> .
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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Chris Marchbanks]

NO

I generally agree with Goutham and would be okay with probe_exporter.

On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 7:53 AM Goutham Veeramachaneni
 wrote:
>
> NO
>
> I don't think prober is a good name and I think the change will cause a lot 
> of confusion longer-term. I might be okay with probe_exporter but prober is a 
> NO from me. I am sorry that I missed suggesting this and engaging with the 
> previous thread :/
>
> Thanks
> Goutham
>
> On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 3:41 PM Julien Pivotto  
> wrote:
>>
>> Dear Prometheans,
>>
>> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
>> Exporter to Prober.
>> This vote is based on the following thread:
>> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>>
>> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
>> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>>
>> Here is the content of the vote:
>>
>> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>>
>> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
>> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
>> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
>> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
>> give their input on the "how".
>>
>> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
>> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
>> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
>> mentioned github issue.
>>
>> --
>> Julien Pivotto
>> @roidelapluie
>>
>> --
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>
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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Bjoern Rabenstein]

NO

Not feeling strongly, actually. In general, I'm not sure if the
renaming itself will have a positive or negative effect (pretty much
along the lines of Marcelo's mail). Add to that the overhead and
confusion that comes with any renaming, I end up with a net-negative.

I explicitly don't want to make the call myself if "blackbox" has
negative connotations. From what I know and feel, it doesn't. More on
the contrary. But I think that call has to be made by those who would
be affected if there were negative connotations.

More generally, I think it is a good idea to avoid metaphors in
technical terms where possible, as attractive as they often
appear. It's the nature of metaphors that they can be understood in
various ways, and some of those might be unintended, distracting, or
even insulting. That's why I think the move from "master/slave" to
"primary/secondary" (or similar) is a great idea. However, "blackbox"
is as much a metaphor as "prober".

On 20.01.22 15:41, Julien Pivotto wrote:
> Dear Prometheans,
> 
> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
> Exporter to Prober.
> This vote is based on the following thread:
> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
> 
> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
> 
> Here is the content of the vote:
> 
> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
> 
> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
> give their input on the "how".
> 
> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
> mentioned github issue.
> 
> -- 
> Julien Pivotto
> @roidelapluie
> 
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-- 
Björn Rabenstein
[PGP-ID] 0x851C3DA17D748D03
[email] bjo...@rabenste.in

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Goutham Veeramachaneni]

NO

I don't think prober is a good name and I think the change will cause a lot
of confusion longer-term. I might be okay with *probe_exporter* but prober
is a NO from me. I am sorry that I missed suggesting this and engaging with
the previous thread :/

Thanks
Goutham

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 3:41 PM Julien Pivotto 
wrote:

> Dear Prometheans,
>
> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
> Exporter to Prober.
> This vote is based on the following thread:
>
> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>
> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>
> Here is the content of the vote:
>
> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>
> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
> give their input on the "how".
>
> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
> mentioned github issue.
>
> --
> Julien Pivotto
> @roidelapluie
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Prometheus Developers" group.
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> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/20220120144119.GA522055%40hydrogen
> .
>

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

['Marcelo Magallón' via Prometheus Developers]

NO

I'm actually on the fence on this, but my current position is closer to no
change.

Reading thru https://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-knodel-terminology-00.html and
following the link to
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-bad-is-black-effect/ I can
follow an argument like "black has a societal association with bad, and we
should work towards fixing this". The bit I'm not convinced about is that
scrubbing the word "black" everywhere moves us towards that goal, and I
would even say that it does the opposite.

In "blacklist" such an association is obvious, since that's a list of bad
actors, and therefore that word is problematic because it reinforces the
stereotype. In "blackbox" no such association is intended or exists, as it
simply means "opaque" or "hidden".

That said, I can concede that because of the connotation that "black" has
for some people, they could interpret the term "blackbox" in the negative,
communicating that a blackbox test is somehow inferior to the alternatives.
If the goal is to fix _that_ perception, it should be stated clearly.

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 8:41 AM Julien Pivotto 
wrote:

> Dear Prometheans,
>
> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
> Exporter to Prober.
> This vote is based on the following thread:
>
> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>
> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>
> Here is the content of the vote:
>
> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>
> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
> give their input on the "how".
>
> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
> mentioned github issue.
>
> --
> Julien Pivotto
> @roidelapluie
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Prometheus Developers" group.
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> .
>


-- 
Marcelo Magallón

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Ganesh Vernekar]

Abstain from voting. Same reason as Callum.

On Tue, 25 Jan 2022 at 03:33, Callum Styan  wrote:

> ABSTAIN
>
> I don't have a strong enough opinion to vote either way.
>
> On Mon, Jan 24, 2022 at 1:26 PM Richard Hartmann <
> richih.mailingl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> PS: I would prefer if such a change would happen as part of a
>> Prometheus 3.x -- but I don't know if that's realistic.
>>
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>> .
>>
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Callum Styan]

ABSTAIN

I don't have a strong enough opinion to vote either way.

On Mon, Jan 24, 2022 at 1:26 PM Richard Hartmann <
richih.mailingl...@gmail.com> wrote:

> PS: I would prefer if such a change would happen as part of a
> Prometheus 3.x -- but I don't know if that's realistic.
>
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> .
>

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Richard Hartmann]

PS: I would prefer if such a change would happen as part of a
Prometheus 3.x -- but I don't know if that's realistic.

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Richard Hartmann]

No.

I am not even certain if you mean `prober` or `blackbox_prober`. I
felt that `blackbox_exporter` was a misnomer from day 1, but I don't
think I can vote yes without at least some sort of plan and "how".

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

['Sylvain Rabot' via Prometheus Developers]

No.

> On 20 Jan 2022, at 15:41, Julien Pivotto  wrote:
> 
> Dear Prometheans,
> 
> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
> Exporter to Prober.
> This vote is based on the following thread:
> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
> 
> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
> 
> Here is the content of the vote:
> 
>> We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
> 
> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
> give their input on the "how".
> 
> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
> mentioned github issue.
> 
> -- 
> Julien Pivotto
> @roidelapluie
> 
> -- 
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> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/20220120144119.GA522055%40hydrogen.

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Julius Volz]

NO (just think the pain will be large for such a rename)

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 3:41 PM Julien Pivotto 
wrote:

> Dear Prometheans,
>
> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
> Exporter to Prober.
> This vote is based on the following thread:
>
> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>
> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>
> Here is the content of the vote:
>
> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>
> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
> give their input on the "how".
>
> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
> mentioned github issue.
>
> --
> Julien Pivotto
> @roidelapluie
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Prometheus Developers" group.
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> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/20220120144119.GA522055%40hydrogen
> .
>

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

['Fabian Stäber' via Prometheus Developers]

YES

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 3:41 PM Julien Pivotto 
wrote:

> Dear Prometheans,
>
> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
> Exporter to Prober.
> This vote is based on the following thread:
>
> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>
> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>
> Here is the content of the vote:
>
> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>
> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
> give their input on the "how".
>
> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
> mentioned github issue.
>
> --
> Julien Pivotto
> @roidelapluie
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Prometheus Developers" group.
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> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/20220120144119.GA522055%40hydrogen
> .
>

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Bartłomiej Płotka]

YES

On Thursday, January 20, 2022 at 3:59:56 PM UTC+1 matt...@prometheus.io 
wrote:

> YES
>
> On Thu, Jan 20, 2022, 14:59 Ben Kochie  wrote:
>
>> YES
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 3:41 PM Julien Pivotto  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Prometheans,
>>>
>>> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
>>> Exporter to Prober.
>>> This vote is based on the following thread:
>>>
>>> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>>>
>>> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
>>> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>>>
>>> Here is the content of the vote:
>>>
>>> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>>>
>>> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
>>> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
>>> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
>>> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
>>> give their input on the "how".
>>>
>>> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
>>> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
>>> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
>>> mentioned github issue.
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Julien Pivotto
>>> @roidelapluie
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "Prometheus Developers" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to prometheus-devel...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/20220120144119.GA522055%40hydrogen
>>> .
>>>
>> -- 
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>>
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/CABbyFmpyFGGv5amrq4EoftRRLEbzZ5zFVpuR8CKhge5iMicmBw%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Matthias Rampke]

YES

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022, 14:59 Ben Kochie  wrote:

> YES
>
> On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 3:41 PM Julien Pivotto 
> wrote:
>
>> Dear Prometheans,
>>
>> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
>> Exporter to Prober.
>> This vote is based on the following thread:
>>
>> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>>
>> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
>> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>>
>> Here is the content of the vote:
>>
>> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>>
>> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
>> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
>> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
>> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
>> give their input on the "how".
>>
>> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
>> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
>> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
>> mentioned github issue.
>>
>> --
>> Julien Pivotto
>> @roidelapluie
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "Prometheus Developers" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to prometheus-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/20220120144119.GA522055%40hydrogen
>> .
>>
> --
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> "Prometheus Developers" group.
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> email to prometheus-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/CABbyFmpyFGGv5amrq4EoftRRLEbzZ5zFVpuR8CKhge5iMicmBw%40mail.gmail.com
> 
> .
>

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Re: [prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Ben Kochie]

YES

On Thu, Jan 20, 2022 at 3:41 PM Julien Pivotto 
wrote:

> Dear Prometheans,
>
> As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
> Exporter to Prober.
> This vote is based on the following thread:
>
> https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ
>
> Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
> community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.
>
> Here is the content of the vote:
>
> > We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.
>
> I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
> a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
> explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
> make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
> give their input on the "how".
>
> The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
> next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
> summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
> mentioned github issue.
>
> --
> Julien Pivotto
> @roidelapluie
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Prometheus Developers" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to prometheus-developers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/prometheus-developers/20220120144119.GA522055%40hydrogen
> .
>

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[prometheus-developers] [VOTE] Rename blackbox_exporter to prober

[Julien Pivotto]

Dear Prometheans,

As per our governance, I'd like to cast a vote to rename the Blackbox
Exporter to Prober.
This vote is based on the following thread:
https://groups.google.com/g/prometheus-developers/c/advMjgmJ1E4/m/A0abCsUrBgAJ

Any Prometheus team member is eligible to vote, and votes for the
community are welcome too, but do not formally count in the result.

Here is the content of the vote:

> We want to rename Blackbox Exporter to Prober.

I explicitly leave out the "how" out of this vote. If this vote passes,
a specific issue will be created in the blackbox exporter repository
explaining how I plan to work and communicate on this change. I will
make sure that enough time passes so that as many people as possible can
give their input on the "how".

The vote is open until February 3rd. If the vote comes positive before
next week's dev summit, the "how" can also be discussed during the dev
summit, and I would use that discussion as input for the previously
mentioned github issue.

-- 
Julien Pivotto
@roidelapluie

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