Re: [Python-Dev] Adding c-api async protocol support
On Wed, Jun 24, 2015 at 9:48 PM, Stefan Behnel wrote: > > > I'd wait with that a bit, though, until after Py3.5 is finally released > and the actual needs for C code that want to use the new > features become clearer. > I strongly disagree. What we would end up with is 3rd party extension modules developed over the next 2-3 years including their own awaitable testing functions/macros, and in order to continue to provide 3.5 support into the future that code will persist for the next 5-10 years regardless to whether its later added in Python 3.6. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] Adding c-api async protocol support
A type slot for tp_as_async has already been added (which is good!) but we do not currently seem to have protocol functions for awaitable types. I would expect to find an Awaitable Protocol listed under Abstract Objects Layer, with functions like PyAwait_Check, PyAwaitIter_Check, and PyAwaitIter_Next, etc. Specifically its currently difficult to test whether an object is awaitable or an awaitable iterable, or use said objects from the c-api without relying on method testing/calling mechanisms. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Gsoc 2011 ideas
Hey Yeswanth Students who get involved with the projects they plan to work with early have a definite edge over students who don't, so certainly get involved now. While I would highly encourage you to get involved with python-dev (core projects are top in line), you may also want to consider 3rd party libraries for Python 3 or to help a Python 2 library port to 3. Python-dev has a list of bugs. Pick one and start, submit patches, join IRC (#python-dev on irc.freenode.net) and see if you can find someone who can help you get started. On Sat, Feb 12, 2011 at 7:44 AM, yeswanth swami wrote: > Hi everyone, > I am planning to apply for Gsoc 2011 for the PSF . I would like to know if > any of you have any ideas which can be implemented this summer. I guess the > gsoc 2011 ideas page has not been put up as yet. So I thought maybe any of > you can suggest some ideas . > > Thanks > Yeswanth > > ___ > Python-Dev mailing list > Python-Dev@python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev > Unsubscribe: > http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/arcriley%40gmail.com > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] #Python3 ! ? (was Python Library Support in 3.x)
Personally, I'd like to celebrate the upcoming Python 3.2 release (which will hopefully include 3to2) with moving all packages which do not have the 'Programming Language :: Python :: 3' classifier to a "Legacy" section of PyPI and offer only Python 3 packages otherwise. Of course put a banner at the top clearly explaining that Python 2 packages can be found in the Legacy section. Radical, I know, but at some point we really need to make this move. PyPI really needs a mechanism to cull out the moribund packages from being displayed next to the actively maintained ones. There's so many packages on there that only work on Python 2.2-2.4 (for example), or with a specific highly outdated version of another package, etc. On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 11:13 AM, Stephan Richter wrote: > On Monday, June 21, 2010, Nick Coghlan wrote: > > A decent listing of major packages that already support Python 3 would > > be very handy for the new Python2orPython3 page I created on the wiki, > > and easier to keep up-to-date. (the old Early2to3Migrations page > > didn't look particularly up to date, but hopefully we can keep the new > > list in a happier state). > > I really just want to be able to go to PyPI, Click on "Browse packages" and > then select "Python 3" (it can currently be accomplished by clicking > "Python" > and then "3"). Of course, package developers need to be encouraged to add > these Trove classifiers so that the listings are as complete as possible. > > Regards, > Stephan > -- > Entrepreneur and Software Geek > Google me. "Zope Stephan Richter" > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] #Python3 ! ? (was Python Library Support in 3.x)
I would suggest that if packages that do not have Python 3 support yet are listed, then their alternatives should also. PyQt has had Py3 support for some time. PostgreSQL and SQLite do (as does SQLAlchemy) CherryPy has had Py3 support for the last release cycle libxml2 does not, but lxml does. Also, under where it mentions that most OS's do not include Python 3, it should be noted which have good support for it. Gentoo (for example) has excellent support for Python 3, automatically installing Python packages which have Py3 support for both Py2 and Py3, and the python-based Portage package system runs cleanly on Py2.6, Py3.1 and Py3.2. Give credit where credit is due. :-) On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 8:33 AM, Nick Coghlan wrote: > On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 9:06 AM, Laurens Van Houtven > wrote: > > Okay cool, we fixed it: http://python-commandments.org/python3.html > > > > People are otherwise happy with the text? > > Yep, looks pretty good to me. > > I hope you don't mind, but I actually borrowed your text to seed a > corresponding page on the Python wiki: > http://wiki.python.org/moin/Python2orPython3 > > It turns out the beginner's guide on the wiki doesn't even acknowledge > the possibility of downloading Python 3.1 rather than 2.6 to start > experimenting with Python. > > The Wiki is probably a good place for this kind of material, anyway - > it makes it much easier for people to update as they identify major > third party libraries that do and don't have Py3k compatible versions > (and, some day, Python2 compatible versions). > > Cheers, > Nick. > > P.S. (We're going to have a tough decision to make somewhere along the > line where docs.python.org is concerned, too - when do we flick the > switch and make a 3.x version of the docs the default? We probably > won't need to seriously consider that question until the 3.3. time > frame though). > > -- > Nick Coghlan | ncogh...@gmail.com | Brisbane, Australia > ___ > Python-Dev mailing list > Python-Dev@python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev > Unsubscribe: > http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/arcriley%40gmail.com > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python Library Support in 3.x (Was: email package status in 3.X)
python-commandments.org is owned and hosted by the same person (Allen Short aka dash aka washort) as pound-python.org which is the "official" website for #Python and which links to it. #Python is co-managed by Stephen Thorne (aka Jerub) and Allen Short (aka dash aka washort). According to Freenode services, the channel operators include more than half the active Twisted Matrix developers, including yourself. Each of you has had the ability to change the topic at any time. I may have cast an overly broad net in including you, I don't have IRC logs to review. I do remember that you have contributed a great deal of time to helping people in #Python and that you were fairly active as a channel operator in #Python when the anti-Py3 rhetoric got started. Perhaps you can shine some light on who is actually responsible for promoting this? I'm sorry if we're in uncomfortable finger-pointing mode, but in the spirit of critical self-evaluation I think its time we take a long look at who is actually representing the Python community in operating our primary community help channel and whether that situation should continue. On Sat, Jun 19, 2010 at 10:28 AM, wrote: > On 01:09 pm, arcri...@gmail.com wrote: > >> [snip] >> >> It is not "critical self-evaluation" to repeat "Python 3 is not ready" as >> litany in #Python and your supporting website. I use the word "litany" >> here >> because #Python refers users to what appears to be a religious website >> http://python-commandments.org/python3.html >> > > It's not my website. I don't own the domain, I don't control the hosting, > I didn't generate the content, I have no access to change anything on it. > I've barely even frequent #python in the last three years. > > Perhaps you were directing those comments at Stephen Thorne though > (although I don't know if he's any more involved in it than I am so don't > take this as anything but idle speculation). > > I have further witnessed (and even been the other party to) you and other >> ops in #Python telling package developers, who have clearly said that they >> are working to port their legacy package to Py3, that "Python 3 is not >> ready". >> > > I'm not going to condone or condemn events which I didn't observe. > > However you've never witnessed me discouraging developers who were actively > porting software to Python 3 because I've never done it. I'm sure this was > an honest mistake and you simply confused me with someone else. > > Besides rally against it what have you, as a Twisted developer, done >> regarding the Python 3 migration process? >> > > This, however, I find extremely insulting. I don't answer to you. The > only reason I'm replying at all is to correct the two pieces of > misinformation in your message. > > I don't see how this discussion can go anywhere productive, so I'll do my > best to make this my last post on the subject. Obviously I made a mistake > posting to the thread at all. > > Jean-Paul > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python Library Support in 3.x (Was: email package status in 3.X)
Just because legacy Python needs to be kept around for a bit longer for a few uses does not mean that "Python 3 is not ready yet". Any decent package system can have two or more versions of Python installed at the same time. It is not "critical self-evaluation" to repeat "Python 3 is not ready" as litany in #Python and your supporting website. I use the word "litany" here because #Python refers users to what appears to be a religious website http://python-commandments.org/python3.html I have further witnessed (and even been the other party to) you and other ops in #Python telling package developers, who have clearly said that they are working to port their legacy package to Py3, that "Python 3 is not ready". One of our Summer of Code students this year actually included in his application that he was told (strongly) in #Python that he shouldn't be working with Py3 - even after he expressed his intent to apply under the PSF to help with the Py3 migration effort as his project. Besides rally against it what have you, as a Twisted developer, done regarding the Python 3 migration process? On Sat, Jun 19, 2010 at 8:12 AM, wrote: > On 10:59 am, arcri...@gmail.com wrote: > >> You mean Twisted support, because library support is at the point where >> there are fewer actively maintained packages not yet ported than those >> which >> are. Of course if your Python experience is hyper-focused to one >> framework >> that isn't ported yet, it will certainly seem like a lot, and you guys who >> run #Python are clearly hyper-focused on Twisted. >> > > Arc, > > This isn't about Twisted. Let's not waste everyone's time by trying to > make it into a conflict between Twisted users and the rest of the Python > community. > > You listed six other major packages that you yourself use that aren't > available on Python 3 yet, so why are you trying to say here that this is > all about Twisted? > >> [snip] >> >> >> This anti-Py3 rhetoric is damaging to the community and needs to stop. >> We're moving forward toward Python 3.2 and beyond, complaining about it >> only >> saps valuable developer time (including your own) from getting these >> libraries you need ported faster. >> > > No, it's not damaging. Critical self-evaluation is a useful tool. Trying > to silence differing perspectives is what's damaging to the community. > > Jean-Paul > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Python Library Support in 3.x (Was: email package status in 3.X)
You mean Twisted support, because library support is at the point where there are fewer actively maintained packages not yet ported than those which are. Of course if your Python experience is hyper-focused to one framework that isn't ported yet, it will certainly seem like a lot, and you guys who run #Python are clearly hyper-focused on Twisted. Great example of the current state: about an hour ago I needed an inotify Python package for a Py3 project. I googled for "Python inotify", found pyinotify, saw that they have several recent releases but no mention of Py3, typed "sudo emerge -av pyinotify", and it installed pyinotify for Python 2.6, 3.1, and 3.2_pre at the same time. Run python interactively, imports and works great. Portage (Gentoo's package system, emerge being the primary command) is Python based and fully ported to Python 3. Most of my workstations and production servers report "/usr/bin/python --version" as "Python 3.1.2" (Python 2.6 is /usr/bin/python2), my Apache's mod_wsgi is compiled for Python 3 and save for a few Django and Trac sites (fastcgi) all of my Python-based webapps run on it. CherryPy and SQLAlchemy have had Py3 support for some time. I can name in a short list the legacy Python packages I use: - Django - Trac - Mercurial (they have a Summer of Code student working to port it now) - PIL (apparently will have a Python 3 release out soon) - pygtk (Python 3 support planned for Gnome 3 in a few months) - xmpppy The list of Python 3 packages I use regularly is at least 50 names long and I have only contributed to porting a dozen or so of those. This anti-Py3 rhetoric is damaging to the community and needs to stop. We're moving forward toward Python 3.2 and beyond, complaining about it only saps valuable developer time (including your own) from getting these libraries you need ported faster. On Fri, Jun 18, 2010 at 1:07 AM, Stephen Thorne wrote: > > Yes, #python keeps the text "It's too early to use Python 3.x" in its > topic. > Library support is the only reason. > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] email package status in 3.X
David and his Google Summer of Code student, Shashwat Anand. You can read Shashwat's weekly progress updates at http://l0nwlf.in/ or subscribe to http://twitter.com/l0nwlf for more micro updates. We have more than 30 paid students working on Python 3 tasks this year, most of them participating under the PSF umbrella but also a few with 3rd party projects such as Mercurial porting those various packages to Py3. Given all this "on the horizon" work, I think the Py3 package situation will look a lot brighter by Python 3.2's release. On Thu, Jun 17, 2010 at 10:32 PM, Steve Holden wrote: > > Lest the readership think that the PSF is unaware of this issue, allow > me to point out that we have already partially funded this effort, and > are still offering R. David Murray some further matching funds if he can > raise sponsorship to complete the effort (on which he has made a very > promising start). > > We are also attempting to enable tax-deductible fund raising to increase > the likelihood of David's finding support. > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] GSoC 2010 is on -- projects?
I'm sure we can find you a mentor. On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 1:16 PM, Joe Amenta wrote: > On Fri, Mar 19, 2010 at 2:45 AM, Terry Reedy wrote: > >> On 3/19/2010 2:23 AM, Laurent Gautier wrote: >> >>> On 3/19/10 3:36 AM, C. Titus Brown wrote: >>> Hi all, once again, the PSF has been accepted as a mentoring foundation for the Google Summer of Code! This year, we're going to emphasize python 3 porting, so please think of projects you'd like to see tackled. >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> >>> Does this mean that any other python project could potentially see >>> itself ported to Python 3 in the course of this SoC ? >>> >> >> The theme should include both general porting tools and specific projects, >> especially infrastructure projects like numeric, which are blocking the >> porting of other projects. It would be nice if those doing specific projects >> contributed their experience/knowledge to a central pool. >> >> >> If so, can any project owner submit a request for help, >>> >> >> Any project owner is *always* free to ask for help (on python-list, but >> now here in this thread). Those who can also mentor might be more likely to >> get it. If I were a student, I would consider serious interest from a >> project owner (and a promise to distribute a port, when ready), a >> prerequisite. >> >> >> > or is there going to be a list >> >>> of projects that would nice to port, or will a voting system of some >>> sort be put in place ? >>> >> >> Like most contributors, students choose projects, within the limits of >> what they can get mentors for, that scratch their itches. They may or may >> not otherwise be swayed by requests and opinions. >> >> My views. >> >> Terry Jan Reedy >> >> > > Would anyone be interested in mentoring further lib3to2 work? I'm planning > on applying again as a student. > > --Joe Amenta > > ___ > Python-Dev mailing list > Python-Dev@python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev > Unsubscribe: > http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/arcriley%40gmail.com > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] GSoC 2010 is on -- projects?
Hi Laurent If your community project would like help porting to Python 3, and you feel this work is enough for a student to work full time for several weeks on, then please do add it to the GSoC ideas page on the wiki. There will be another program running for high school students which is more suitable for smaller tasks (2-3 days each), more on-par with the actual time it takes to port most Python packages. On Fri, Mar 19, 2010 at 2:23 AM, Laurent Gautier wrote: > > Hi, > > > Does this mean that any other python project could potentially see itself > ported to Python 3 in the course of this SoC ? If so, can any project owner > submit a request for help, or is there going to be a list of projects that > would nice to port, or will a voting system of some sort be put in place ? > > > Best, > > > Laurent > > ___ > Python-Dev mailing list > Python-Dev@python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev > Unsubscribe: > http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/arcriley%40gmail.com > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] [RELEASED] Python 2.7 alpha 2
after all these years, some people still run AmigaOS. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PyPI comments and ratings, *really*?
> +1 > > Having a "Repository-URL", "Repository-Browse-URL" and a > "Bug-Tracker-URL" field in PyPI would be a lot more usefule then > comments and ratings. > > +1 ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] PyPI comments and ratings, *really*?
Nobody is claiming right to censor what people say about their software. This is the Internet. There are blogs. Google and other search engines find blogs quickly, and people who agree with the viewpoints expressed link to them thus making the blog postings more visible. There are countless other social networks and outlets for people to flame and slander (or praise and promote, in a much less common case) software. It would be more useful to provide a PyPI mechanism to publish a link to file bugs on the project's own website and leave project ratings the work of other sites such as Ohloh. On Thu, Nov 12, 2009 at 8:38 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: > > No, what's absurd is thinking that the act of publishing software > somehow gives you the right to demand control over what others say > about your software. > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 2.7 Release? 2.7 == last of the 2.x line?
That's not going to happen. Stop trolling the python-dev list. On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 1:20 PM, sstein...@gmail.com wrote: > Maybe the 3.x line should just be put out of our misery, merged back to > 2.7, 2.8, 2.9, and proceed as Glyph suggested in passing with increasing > levels of deprecation until it just turns into 3.x on its own by running out > of numbers. > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 2.7 Release? 2.7 == last of the 2.x line?
I'm not aware of any currently active project that isn't in the process of adding Py3 support (or who has already done so). By "most maintainers" I'm referring to the long tail; the hundreds of 3rd party modules used in niche cases and can be easily replaced by those who need the functionality they provide. Free software is an evolutionary process. Evolution dictates that those who cannot adapt will die when faced with a changing environment. It's better for us all that they do. Thus, I am not attempting to persuade anyone to upgrade their package, rather, I'm explaining why it's best we ignore them and get on with doing productive work. On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 4:05 PM, Mike Klaas wrote: > > Be that as it may, the only way python 3 will be widely adopted if people > have motivation to (need to be compatible with other libs, pressure from > users, their own interest in fostering python 3.0, etc.). Deriding them as > "lazy" accomplishes nothing and obscures the fact that it is the python > maintainers responsibility to bring about this motivation if they want > python 3.0 to be adopted. No-one is going to convert to python 3.0 because > you called them lazy. > > -Mike > >> > > > ___ > Python-Dev mailing list > Python-Dev@python.org > http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev > Unsubscribe: > http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/arcriley%40gmail.com > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 2.7 Release? 2.7 == last of the 2.x line?
+1 on ending with 2.6. I'm the maintainer of 3rd party Python 3-only packages and have ported a few modules that we needed with some help from the 2to3 tool. It's really not a big deal - and Py3 really is a massive improvement. The main thing holding back the community are lazy and/or obstinate package maintainers. If they spent half the time they've put into complaining about Py3 into actually working to upgrade their code they'd be done now. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] eggs now mandatory for pypi?
I'll make the argument that feedback is useful, comments are much less so and a lot more work. It would be more useful to allow package users post feedback, visible only to the package maintainer, and also add support for bugtracker links/etc. Is the intention of Pypi really to turn it into a social networking site? ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] 3to2 0.1 alpha 1 released
How about moving it to a new repository on hg.python.org? Give it more of an "official" feel without the burden of being in theb cpython tree? On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 7:43 PM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote: > > Ok, so then it should be easy to generate some real interest out of > it, right? E.g. a somebody actually running the tool, or perhaps even > a bug report? > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] [RELEASED] Python 3.1 final
On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 6:59 PM, Christian Heimes wrote: > > Gratulations! You did a fantastic job! :) +1 ! ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] FINAL PROPULSION OPEN SOURCE ENGINE VARIANT FOR THE F-35 JOINT STRIKE FIGHTER
Enough is enough guys. As entertaining as this thread has been, shouldn't we be focused on the 3.1 release? Don't feed the trolls. Ok so one wandered in, but nobody needed to respond and it can only get worse from here. Please just flag the offending address(es) for moderation and ask them politely to keep their posts to this list on-topic for core Python development. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] GSoC: Core Python development tools
> Oh, I heartily endorse his suggestions! I just want to make sure that we > make maximum use of students (and their code doesn't get tossed at the > end of the summer, which has serious morale consequences ;) This is my concern as well. One of my past students pitched a core project and ended up spending most of his SoC time in the PEP process (http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0368/). Given how frustrating the experience was for him, I'd rather have future SoC students be able to focus on code. Let's at least have rough consensus on brainstormed ideas before they hit the ideas page. Existing PEPs that have had a time to air and evolve are much better for this reason. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
If it's organized in time we could scoop up some of the SoC applicants who we'll like to have but we won't have slots for Honestly I like the idea of competitions. Better publicity, the greater prizes will draw out some better minds from the community, and competitions based on quality will help ensure usable code. They could vary in reward based on how difficult the problem is and perhaps have some Python swag as runner-up prizes. It'd also be a great way to promote Python 3. On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 10:00 PM, Steve Holden wrote: > Arc Riley wrote: > > > > That makes it a much better candidate for GHOP that SoC, which > requires > > projects with a little more meat on them. > > > > > > Yes it does. > > > > Though many organizations have taken to funding their own GHOPs. > > Perhaps this year PSF can use the SoC funds ($500/student) to host a > > bounty-sprint program much like GHOP? > > > > IIRC, GHOP paid $100 per 3 tasks. With the economy in the tank this > > could attract a lot more than highschool students. Honestly I wish SoC > > was structured more like GHOP, it seemed much more effective and for the > > same funding could run year-round. > > > > Or the same funds could be used to host various optimization > > competitions, replacement Py3 extension/type/function must match API and > > pass unit testing. Fastest solution wins (ie) $1000 and fame for the > > person or team that submitted it. > > > > Something to keep in mind and for the PSF board to ponder for this Fall. > > > Why wait until Fall if it's a good idea? The summer vacation would > surely be the ideal time for this, and that would mean we should start > planning soon. > > Anyway, the first requirement would be some enthusiasm from the > developer team for mobilizing such a potential source of assistance. > > regards > Steve > -- > Steve Holden +1 571 484 6266 +1 800 494 3119 > Holden Web LLC http://www.holdenweb.com/ > Want to know? Come to PyCon - soon! http://us.pycon.org/ > > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
> That makes it a much better candidate for GHOP that SoC, which requires > projects with a little more meat on them. Yes it does. Though many organizations have taken to funding their own GHOPs. Perhaps this year PSF can use the SoC funds ($500/student) to host a bounty-sprint program much like GHOP? IIRC, GHOP paid $100 per 3 tasks. With the economy in the tank this could attract a lot more than highschool students. Honestly I wish SoC was structured more like GHOP, it seemed much more effective and for the same funding could run year-round. Or the same funds could be used to host various optimization competitions, replacement Py3 extension/type/function must match API and pass unit testing. Fastest solution wins (ie) $1000 and fame for the person or team that submitted it. Something to keep in mind and for the PSF board to ponder for this Fall. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
Feel free to email wi...@bluesock.org or me with your ideas if the markup is difficult to work with. We've been on wiki duty all afternoon. description, any specific skills they'll need (special library, compiler theory, etc), what mentor should they talk to if they're interested. The markup complexity makes it much easier for students to navigate while including the info Google suggested. I'm hoping someone from the python web team will add the CSS class we need to greatly simplify it. On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 8:16 PM, Daniel (ajax) Diniz wrote: > Arc Riley wrote: > > The process is as follows; we're compiling ideas for > > http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/2009 and getting mentors signed > up > > at http://socghop.appspot.com/ > > Any chance that we can keep > http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/2009 light on markup? I > simply can't add a 'tidy struct and finish buffer interface/bytearray > details' proposal as it is :/ > > Daniel > ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Non-Core project: IDLE
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 7:53 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: > IDLE needs lots of attention -- more than any one experienced person is > likely to have > > I've actually heard this from several people, IDLE on Py3 etc Who would be a good person to mentor such a project? ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 6:26 PM, Raymond Hettinger wrote: > Without help, it is going to take a long time to get many packages > converted to 3.x. I don't disagree, I just don't want to volunteer projects for something they don't want. Unless I misunderstand the situation, PIL doesn't seem applicable for SoC given that their development tree is closed/proprietary (only free releases are available under a free license). Does anyone here work with PIL or can provide further insight into their Py3 plans? Note also that some of the largest Python-based projects, Django, Mercurial, Plone/Zope, Scons, etc, are setup as their own SoC mentoring orgs. Only Mercurial has Py3 migration on their ideas list. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Brett Cannon wrote: > > I would double-check Benjamin can do this since I don't think he will be > 18 by the time GSoC starts. The FAQ at > http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/program/google/gsoc2009/faqs#mentor_eligibilityseems > to suggest it won't be an issue, but you never know. > > Also be aware that a university student might not like being told what to > do by someone in high school (although if they want $4500 they better). > This isn't a problem. Drupal had a GHOP (SoC for highschool students) mentor who was too young to be a student (11 or 12 at the time), I believe Dmitri also served them as a SoC mentor, I know several SoC mentors are teenagers. I'd rather we find a different primary mentor for each student, it'd be best if every student had a backup mentor in-place from the start as well, but one person can be a contact point for many ideas. Ben, would you be OK with being a contact point for 3to2 as well? We'll figure out who's mentoring who once we see student apps and decide which ones we want mentored this year. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 5:59 PM, Maciej Fijalkowski wrote: > I think we need to ask first guys who spend their live maintaining > libraries instead of just proposing "let's make some poor student port > it to py3k", but I might be just wrong, I don't know. I agree. Part of Summer of Code is about getting students involved so they stick around, and heck my second SoC student is still with our project as the #2 committer, but he's an exception. Also, we need the projects involved to want the tasks done by a student. As a project maintainer I wouldn't want an intern being the most familiar person with our Py3 migration, I'd rather students stick with new features or optimization and coordinate the migration process as a group-wide effort. I added the 2to3 improvement idea to the list, a good start :-) We need a couple more at least. If a 3to2 tool (for backporting Py3 code to Py2, so projects can develop primarily in Py3?) is something that's wanted, who would be a good mentor for it? ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
> > > Note the SoC timeline; > > > http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/program/google/gsoc2009/timeline > > > > So maybe it won't work for 3.1, but perhaps 3.1.1? 3.2? > > Well, there won't be any major changes in 3.1.1, but 3.2 is definitely > open. Cool, these are of course details you can work out with interested students. Would you be willing to field questions from prospective students and possibly mentor one? The process is as follows; we're compiling ideas for http://wiki.python.org/moin/SummerOfCode/2009 and getting mentors signed up at http://socghop.appspot.com/ Students are already starting to look over the different organizations ideas pages and connect with mentors. Student application period opens next week. All the mentors for PSF read and review them and we assign mentors to them (often whatever mentor the student worked with to build the proposal). Do you want prospective students contacting the list or the mentor they're interested in working with directly? ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
I've heard from four people that improving 2to3 would be a great project (plus many more suggesting "port X to Python 3" as project ideas). Note the SoC timeline; http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/program/google/gsoc2009/timeline So maybe it won't work for 3.1, but perhaps 3.1.1? 3.2? We should have many ideas up for students to consider. The more student who apply and the more mentors we have ready determines how many students we get total. As part of this I should add, we need at least one mentor per student, preferably two. These should be people familiar with and actively working in the area the student would be. We're putting mentor contact info on the wiki so potential students can hash out the details with them before applying. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Python-Dev] Core projects for Summer of Code
Hey guys/gals Summer of Code is ramping up. Every year the common complaint is that not enough Python core projects get proposed by students, and of course a big reason for that is often the only encouragement we offer prospective students is a link to the PEP index. So let's make this year different. Accepted students are paid a total of $4500 to work for roughly 30 hours a week, 12 weeks, on their proposed project. The challenge is finding project ideas for them that could reasonably occupy them for the entire Summer and which the results of their work can be demonstrated. They're being paid for specific projects so "Spend the Summer fixing bugs on the tracker" is a no-go, and Google has outlined that Summer of Code is about code, not documentation. I've seen and heard that a lot of work is still needed on http://svn.python.org/view/python/trunk both during the 3.1 release cycle, optimization possible all over the place. It'd be great if those of you working closely with this can shout out some ideas, brainstorm a bit. PSF was announced as one of the mentoring orgs today, this week before student applications are open is for students to talk to their prospective mentors and iron out the wrinkles in their plans, so there's not much time to get core project ideas together. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
