RE: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
To be clear, the discussion strikes me oddly. You can learn python without a computer. Of course to actually have people write code and try it out is another story. Python by itself is simply a program that can be typed into an interpreter or given a file to process and works just as well on LINUX, Windows and so on. I have half a dozen varieties on my machine from various modes/distributions. As some have pointed out, any RECENT version of python (presumably the 3 version unless your goal is to teach the older version) should be fine for teaching but obviously all kinds of tools can help. But there are online resources that may be adequate that require NOTHING but a browser: https://py3.codeskulptor.org/ The above URL allows you to create and run and save python files and is probably adequate for teaching basics and for sharing programs others have saved by sending you the URL. Of course, beyond a certain point, it fails to meet needs such as not supporting importing random modules. But as was discussed here before, you can find little time to teach python if you also have to teach every environment and editor and especially handle students using other choices. But to ask everyone to use the same LINUX distribution may also be a drastic step. The reality is that simple python programs can be handled with any standard text editor. Sure, lots of bells and whistles can be added and there may well be advantages to using systems ranging from anaconda to lately RSTUDIO but they often come with many superfluous features and lots of complexity. -Original Message- From: Python-list On Behalf Of Grant Edwards Sent: Thursday, August 4, 2022 10:35 AM To: python-list@python.org Subject: Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language? On 2022-08-04, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming wrote: > Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python > programming language? You can learn Python on any Linux distribution. First answer this question: * Whom are you going to ask for help when you run into Linux questions? Install the Linux distro that person uses. -- Grant -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On 2022-08-04, Christian Heimes wrote: > Fedora is an excellent choice for Python users. Fedora 36 already comes > with Python 3.11.0b5 in its main repository. In fact you have Python > 2.7, 3.5-3.11, PyPy 2.7, PyPy 3.7-3.9, and MicroPython at your fingertips. Except that real programmers use Python 1.52 because they depend on the assumption that integers are native word size and arithmatic is done modulo-maxunsigned the same way it is in assembly language... ;) Honestly, back when I was implementing netowrk protocols in Python on a 32-bit machine, it was very useful having 32-bit Python integers. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On 04/08/2022 20.12, Barry wrote: Noted with thanks Kushal. Since I can download FREE copies of RHEL 9.0, I will use it then. I consider rhel 9 is an old os. I would suggest using fedora over rhel. Fedora 36 has python 3.10 and the when fedora 37 is released it will have python 3.11. And fedora is free as well. Fedora is an excellent choice for Python users. Fedora 36 already comes with Python 3.11.0b5 in its main repository. In fact you have Python 2.7, 3.5-3.11, PyPy 2.7, PyPy 3.7-3.9, and MicroPython at your fingertips. Christian -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
> On 4 Aug 2022, at 09:48, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming > wrote: > > On Thu, 4 Aug 2022 at 13:02, Kushal Kumaran wrote: >> >>> On Thu, Aug 04 2022 at 10:22:41 AM, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming >>> wrote: >>> Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python >>> programming language? >>> >>> Good day from Singapore, >>> >>> May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the >>> Python programming language? >>> >>> Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription >>> (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise >>> Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? >>> >>> Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? >>> >>> I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive >>> for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out >>> there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro and >>> version. >>> >> >> The best one would be whatever you happen to have installed and for >> which you understand system administration. Beyond that, distribution >> choice matters very little. Every distribution I've used ships python3 >> packages, which was fine for learning the language. >> >> -- >> regards, >> kushal > > Noted with thanks Kushal. Since I can download FREE copies of RHEL > 9.0, I will use it then. I consider rhel 9 is an old os. I would suggest using fedora over rhel. Fedora 36 has python 3.10 and the when fedora 37 is released it will have python 3.11. And fedora is free as well. Barry > > Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming > Targeted Individual in Singapore > -- > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list > -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On 8/3/22 19:01, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming wrote: Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language? You might try Pythontu. Not really. Get the distro that looks appealing to you. One won't be better than the other with regard to learning python. Good day from Singapore, May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language? Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro and version. Thank you. Regards, Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore 4 Aug 2022 Thursday Blogs: https://tdtemcerts.blogspot.com https://tdtemcerts.wordpress.com -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On 2022-08-04, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming wrote: > Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python > programming language? You can learn Python on any Linux distribution. First answer this question: * Whom are you going to ask for help when you run into Linux questions? Install the Linux distro that person uses. -- Grant -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
Just be aware https://docs.python.org/3/ defaults to the latest Python version (3.10). When looking up a module, it’s best to explicitly set the documentation to the version you are using. It won’t matter the vast majority of the time but I have been burned by trying to use a function or parameter that was introduced with a later version. — Gerard Weatherby | Application Architect NMRbox | NAN | Department of Molecular Biology and Biophysics UConn Health 263 Farmington Avenue, Farmington, CT 06030-6406 uchc.edu On Aug 4, 2022, 5:00 AM -0400, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming , wrote: *** Attention: This is an external email. Use caution responding, opening attachments or clicking on links. *** On Thu, 4 Aug 2022 at 16:50, dn wrote: PS most of us will qualify for RedHat's Developer program[me] and free copies of software. I can download free copies of RHEL 7.x, 8.x, and 9.x :) Just that I dunno which RHEL version is better. Is RHEL 9.0 the best out of 7.x, 8.x and 9.x? RedHat is a stable OpSys. Accordingly, it doesn't much matter which version. The general assumption is that the more recent distribution has more advanced facilities, eg improved security features in RHEL9. As another post says, Fedora is closer to the bleeding-edge of Linux development. RHEL 9.0 is also quite close to the bleeding edge of Linux development. It has Linux kernel version 5.14.0. Be aware that there are many methods of adding Python. For example, if your training is based on the Anaconda [Python] distribution, then it is irrelevant which version of Python comes with the Linux distro. As mentioned before, if you advance to developing in [Python] virtual environments, then each of these could run a different version of Python. Similarly, using a VM... The question is relatively minor. More important to 'get going'! I am going to get going on learning Python with RHEL 9.0. (also mentioned previously: relatively easy to change (Python or distro) 'later'!) -- Regards, =dn Regards, Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore -- https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list__;!!Cn_UX_p3!mxIe1U15eEI7AomZUwIzjK0lVTfFXHto6Atu7jqaE58V0YUQc2K8s9LrjPDNjOXjQ5NB3Tu-cqbRDnx0pmu6$ -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On Thu, 4 Aug 2022 at 16:50, dn wrote: > > >> PS most of us will qualify for RedHat's Developer program[me] and free > >> copies of software. > > > > I can download free copies of RHEL 7.x, 8.x, and 9.x :) Just that I > > dunno which RHEL version is better. Is RHEL 9.0 the best out of 7.x, > > 8.x and 9.x? > > RedHat is a stable OpSys. Accordingly, it doesn't much matter which > version. The general assumption is that the more recent distribution has > more advanced facilities, eg improved security features in RHEL9. > > As another post says, Fedora is closer to the bleeding-edge of Linux > development. RHEL 9.0 is also quite close to the bleeding edge of Linux development. It has Linux kernel version 5.14.0. > > Be aware that there are many methods of adding Python. For example, if > your training is based on the Anaconda [Python] distribution, then it is > irrelevant which version of Python comes with the Linux distro. As > mentioned before, if you advance to developing in [Python] virtual > environments, then each of these could run a different version of > Python. Similarly, using a VM... > > The question is relatively minor. More important to 'get going'! I am going to get going on learning Python with RHEL 9.0. > (also mentioned previously: relatively easy to change (Python or distro) > 'later'!) > -- > Regards, > =dn Regards, Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
>> PS most of us will qualify for RedHat's Developer program[me] and free >> copies of software. > > I can download free copies of RHEL 7.x, 8.x, and 9.x :) Just that I > dunno which RHEL version is better. Is RHEL 9.0 the best out of 7.x, > 8.x and 9.x? RedHat is a stable OpSys. Accordingly, it doesn't much matter which version. The general assumption is that the more recent distribution has more advanced facilities, eg improved security features in RHEL9. As another post says, Fedora is closer to the bleeding-edge of Linux development. Be aware that there are many methods of adding Python. For example, if your training is based on the Anaconda [Python] distribution, then it is irrelevant which version of Python comes with the Linux distro. As mentioned before, if you advance to developing in [Python] virtual environments, then each of these could run a different version of Python. Similarly, using a VM... The question is relatively minor. More important to 'get going'! (also mentioned previously: relatively easy to change (Python or distro) 'later'!) -- Regards, =dn -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On Thu, 4 Aug 2022 at 13:02, Kushal Kumaran wrote: > > On Thu, Aug 04 2022 at 10:22:41 AM, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming > wrote: > > Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python > > programming language? > > > > Good day from Singapore, > > > > May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the > > Python programming language? > > > > Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription > > (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise > > Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? > > > > Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? > > > > I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive > > for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out > > there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro and > > version. > > > > The best one would be whatever you happen to have installed and for > which you understand system administration. Beyond that, distribution > choice matters very little. Every distribution I've used ships python3 > packages, which was fine for learning the language. > > -- > regards, > kushal Noted with thanks Kushal. Since I can download FREE copies of RHEL 9.0, I will use it then. Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On Thu, 4 Aug 2022 at 11:05, dn wrote: > > On 04/08/2022 14.31, Paul Bryan wrote: > > I wouldn't say any particular Linux distribution is appreciably better > > for Python development than another. I would suggest using a version of > > a Linux distribution that supports a recent Python release (e.g. 3.9 or > > 3.10). > > +1 > > As a Python-learner (there's no comment about current programming > expertise), it is unlikely to make any difference which Linux distro is > used. > > Answers to such open-ended questions are usually seated in bias - which > in-turn is mostly likely to be the same answer as 'which is the Linux > distro *I* use? > (I've used a number, with Python, over the years) > > The better alignment is to match the version of Python with the book or > course you are using as learning-materials. That way, there are unlikely > to be surprises. Noted on this. > > There are differences in Python implementations between Linux, Mac, and > Windows. However, I can't think of a book or course which spends any > time discussing them, or having a chapter which demands one or other OpSys. > > When you become more experienced two things will happen: firstly you > will start using tools which enable the use of different versions of > Python for different dev.projects; and secondly you will form your own > opinions of "best"! > (it's not difficult to change distro) > > > PS most of us will qualify for RedHat's Developer program[me] and free > copies of software. I can download free copies of RHEL 7.x, 8.x, and 9.x :) Just that I dunno which RHEL version is better. Is RHEL 9.0 the best out of 7.x, 8.x and 9.x? > -- > Regards, > =dn Regards, Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On Thu, 4 Aug 2022 at 10:47, orzodk wrote: > > Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming writes: > > > noted with thanks. I have been using Linux for more than 10 years already > > Ah, if you're familiar with Redhat (RPM) based distributions, consider > Fedora as you will have access to newer versions sooner. > > If you're more familiar with Debian (DEB) based distributions, consider > Ubuntu, again, as the new version release cycle is twice a year. > > (Also, my apologies -- I meant to CC the list but failed to do so.) I am actually quite familiar with many linux distros. I am familiar with RPM-based linux distros as well as DEB-based linux distros. Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On Thu, Aug 04 2022 at 10:22:41 AM, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming wrote: > Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python > programming language? > > Good day from Singapore, > > May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the > Python programming language? > > Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription > (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise > Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? > > Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? > > I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive > for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out > there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro and > version. > The best one would be whatever you happen to have installed and for which you understand system administration. Beyond that, distribution choice matters very little. Every distribution I've used ships python3 packages, which was fine for learning the language. -- regards, kushal -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
On 04/08/2022 14.31, Paul Bryan wrote: > I wouldn't say any particular Linux distribution is appreciably better > for Python development than another. I would suggest using a version of > a Linux distribution that supports a recent Python release (e.g. 3.9 or > 3.10). +1 As a Python-learner (there's no comment about current programming expertise), it is unlikely to make any difference which Linux distro is used. Answers to such open-ended questions are usually seated in bias - which in-turn is mostly likely to be the same answer as 'which is the Linux distro *I* use? (I've used a number, with Python, over the years) The better alignment is to match the version of Python with the book or course you are using as learning-materials. That way, there are unlikely to be surprises. There are differences in Python implementations between Linux, Mac, and Windows. However, I can't think of a book or course which spends any time discussing them, or having a chapter which demands one or other OpSys. When you become more experienced two things will happen: firstly you will start using tools which enable the use of different versions of Python for different dev.projects; and secondly you will form your own opinions of "best"! (it's not difficult to change distro) PS most of us will qualify for RedHat's Developer program[me] and free copies of software. -- Regards, =dn -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language? Good day from Singapore, May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language? Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro and version. Thank you. Regards, Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore 4 Aug 2022 Thursday Blogs: https://tdtemcerts.blogspot.com https://tdtemcerts.wordpress.com -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
I actually did a Google search for "which linux distro is best for python". Link: https://www.google.com/search?q=which+linux+distro+is+best+for+python=1C1GCEA_enSG1005SG1005=ALiCzsYaL58MJsevR2Uc0nnWtmc7kWFbIg%3A1659580387580=4y_rYqWII8i7z7sPwPCtwAI=0ahUKEwjlhenbkqz5AhXI3XMBHUB4CygQ4dUDCA8=5=which+linux+distro+is+best+for+python_lcp=Cgdnd3Mtd2l6EAMyBQgAEIAEMgUIABCGAzIFCAAQhgMyBQgAEIYDMgUIABCGAzoECCMQJzoECAAQQzoLCAAQgAQQsQMQgwE6CAgAEIAEELEDOggILhCABBCxAzoFCAAQkQI6BQguEIAEOgsILhCABBDHARCvAToKCAAQgAQQhwIQFDoGCAAQHhAWSgQIQRgASgQIRhgAUABYljtg0D5oAXABeACAAesBiAG3E5IBBjM3LjAuMZgBAKABAcABAQ=gws-wiz Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore On Thu, 4 Aug 2022 at 10:31, Paul Bryan wrote: > > I wouldn't say any particular Linux distribution is appreciably better for > Python development than another. I would suggest using a version of a Linux > distribution that supports a recent Python release (e.g. 3.9 or 3.10). > > On Thu, 2022-08-04 at 10:22 +0800, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming wrote: > > Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python > programming language? > > Good day from Singapore, > > May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the > Python programming language? > > Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription > (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise > Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? > > Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? > > I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive > for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out > there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro and > version. > > Thank you. > > Regards, > > Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming > Targeted Individual in Singapore > 4 Aug 2022 Thursday > Blogs: > https://tdtemcerts.blogspot.com > https://tdtemcerts.wordpress.com > > -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
I wouldn't say any particular Linux distribution is appreciably better for Python development than another. I would suggest using a version of a Linux distribution that supports a recent Python release (e.g. 3.9 or 3.10). On Thu, 2022-08-04 at 10:22 +0800, Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming wrote: > Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python > programming language? > > Good day from Singapore, > > May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the > Python programming language? > > Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription > (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise > Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? > > Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? > > I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive > for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out > there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro > and > version. > > Thank you. > > Regards, > > Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming > Targeted Individual in Singapore > 4 Aug 2022 Thursday > Blogs: > https://tdtemcerts.blogspot.com > https://tdtemcerts.wordpress.com -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language?
Subject: Which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language? Good day from Singapore, May I know which linux distro is more conducive for learning the Python programming language? Since I have absolutely and totally FREE RHEL developer subscription (I don't need to spend a single cent), can I use Red Hat Enterprise Linux version 9.0 to learn Python? Is it the most popular linux distro for learning Python? I just want to know which linux distro and version is more conducive for learning Python. Because there are thousands of linux distros out there. And I just want to settle down on a particular linux distro and version. Thank you. Regards, Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming Targeted Individual in Singapore 4 Aug 2022 Thursday Blogs: https://tdtemcerts.blogspot.com https://tdtemcerts.wordpress.com -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Can I earn a lot of money by learning and mastering the Python programming language?
Subject: Can I earn a lot of money by learning and mastering the Python programming language? Good day from Singapore, I am an IT consultant with a System Integrator (SI)/computer firm in Singapore, specializing in Systems/Infrastructure and Computer Networking. I am thinking of creating an extra avenue/stream of income by learning extra skills and becoming a programmer or software developer/engineer. I hope it is not too late for a person of my age. Can I earn a lot of money by learning and mastering the Python programming language? Thought I would like to find out first before I jump into the bandwagon and investing my time into learning Python. Besides Python, what other programming languages can make me earn a lot of money? Are Python, Java and C++ the most popular and most sought after (by employers) programming languages in the world? I am looking forward to your advice. Thank you very much. Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming, 42 years old as of 21 Jan 2021 Thursday, is a TARGETED INDIVIDUAL living in Singapore. He is an IT Consultant with a System Integrator (SI)/computer firm in Singapore. He is an IT enthusiast. -BEGIN EMAIL SIGNATURE- The Gospel for all Targeted Individuals (TIs): [The New York Times] Microwave Weapons Are Prime Suspect in Ills of U.S. Embassy Workers Link: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/01/science/sonic-attack-cuba-microwave.html Singaporean Targeted Individual Mr. Turritopsis Dohrnii Teo En Ming's Academic Qualifications as at 14 Feb 2019 and refugee seeking attempts at the United Nations Refugee Agency Bangkok (21 Mar 2017), in Taiwan (5 Aug 2019) and Australia (25 Dec 2019 to 9 Jan 2020): [1] https://tdtemcerts.wordpress.com/ [2] https://tdtemcerts.blogspot.sg/ [3] https://www.scribd.com/user/270125049/Teo-En-Ming -END EMAIL SIGNATURE- -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Issues Download the Latest Version of Python Programming Language
On 7/24/20 12:05 AM, Ejiofor Chidinma Peace wrote: > Dear Sir/Madam, > I trust this email finds you well. > > I have been having issues downloading the latest version of Python > programming Language on my PC (windows 10 operating system). Kindly assist > in resolving this issue at your earliest convenience. > > Looking forward to hearing from you soon. Sorry to not be helpful, but you are going to have to be more descriptive. "Having issues downloading" tells us nothing that we can use to help you with. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Issues Download the Latest Version of Python Programming Language
Dear Sir/Madam, I trust this email finds you well. I have been having issues downloading the latest version of Python programming Language on my PC (windows 10 operating system). Kindly assist in resolving this issue at your earliest convenience. Looking forward to hearing from you soon. Yours sincerely, Ejiofor, Chidinma Peace. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python programming language vulnerabilities
CORRECTION. My sincere apologies to anyone that tried the link that I posted. The actual link is www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg23 follow the link to documents, or go directly there via www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg23/docs/documents.html I was informed that there are some broken links to documents. I believe that they are all fixed now. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python programming language vulnerabilities
These links work: * http://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG23/docs/ISO-IECJTC1-SC22-WG23_N0702-tr24772-4-draft-python-before-mtg-48-2017-03-10.pdf * http://open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG23/docs/ISO-IECJTC1-SC22-WG23_N0702-tr24772-4-draft-python-before-mtg-48-2017-03-10.docx Skip On Sun, Sep 10, 2017 at 4:14 PM, Skip Montanarowrote: > That link's not working for me, even after changing the double slash > to a single slash. > > Skip > > On Sun, Sep 10, 2017 at 1:45 PM, Stephen Michell > wrote: >> My apologies. I maintain that website. >> >> There should have been no broken links. I will fix that. >> >> The previous version of TR 24772 had annexes for language-specific material. >> We have split those out, so the main document (Tr 24772-1) only has language >> independent material. The last Python document is N0702 at >> open-std.org/sc22/wg23//docs/documents.html. This document was one that >> Serihy could not access. That link is fixed, so it can be accessed now. >> >> >> -- >> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python programming language vulnerabilities
That link's not working for me, even after changing the double slash to a single slash. Skip On Sun, Sep 10, 2017 at 1:45 PM, Stephen Michellwrote: > My apologies. I maintain that website. > > There should have been no broken links. I will fix that. > > The previous version of TR 24772 had annexes for language-specific material. > We have split those out, so the main document (Tr 24772-1) only has language > independent material. The last Python document is N0702 at > open-std.org/sc22/wg23//docs/documents.html. This document was one that > Serihy could not access. That link is fixed, so it can be accessed now. > > > -- > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
Sent from my android phone. On Feb 9, 2013 6:41 PM, Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote: On 2/9/2013 6:53 PM, Michael Torrie wrote: On 02/09/2013 04:26 PM, Tim Roberts wrote: Most people would call bash a scripting language, but it is also clearly a programming language. It has syntax, variables and expressions. I suspect it is Turing-complete, although I haven't seen a proof of that. I would assert that scripting languages are a proper subset of programming languages, not a separate category. I'm pretty sure Bash is turing complete. I know it's been shown that sed is turing complete, and awk probably is too! If I recall, the way to show a language is turing complete is to implement a turing machine If the language has arrays, conditional execution, and explicit (while) loops or recursion, you can be pretty sure it is Turing complete. I presume this covers awk and bash. Something like the game of Life, where the looping in implicit in the operation, is much harder to show Turing complete. I suspect sed is non-trivial also. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turing_completeness For proving something Turing-complete, you only need to prove equivalence to some other Turing-complete language. The simplest test involves three things: 1. Sequential flow 2. An if, while or recursive function/method call 3. An arbitrary number of variables - arrays are optional Strictly speaking, no language on a real computer is fully Turing-complete, because real computers don't have an infinitely large memory, while TM's do. But it's common to handwaive past that part of the definition. Terry Jan Reedy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
Grant Edwards invalid@invalid.invalid wrote: IMO, a scripting language is used to automate tasks that would otherwise be done by a human sitting at a keyboard typing commands. [Perhaps that definition should be extended to include tasks that would otherwise by done by a human sitting and clicking on a GUI.] I think that definition is a little too neat and clean. Most people would call bash a scripting language, but it is also clearly a programming language. It has syntax, variables and expressions. I suspect it is Turing-complete, although I haven't seen a proof of that. I would assert that scripting languages are a proper subset of programming languages, not a separate category. -- Tim Roberts, t...@probo.com Providenza Boekelheide, Inc. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On 02/09/2013 04:26 PM, Tim Roberts wrote: Most people would call bash a scripting language, but it is also clearly a programming language. It has syntax, variables and expressions. I suspect it is Turing-complete, although I haven't seen a proof of that. I would assert that scripting languages are a proper subset of programming languages, not a separate category. I'm pretty sure Bash is turing complete. I know it's been shown that sed is turing complete, and awk probably is too! If I recall, the way to show a language is turing complete is to implement a turing machine in it. I'm pretty sure bash could handle that, though maybe with help from a standard set of unix tools one always finds used in conjunction with the shell. Here's one implementation: https://github.com/thulsadum/bash-turing-machine/blob/master/turing.sh I would say that scripting language isn't a definition of a type of language, but rather a description of how a language is put to use in a particular case. For example, when embedded in a game, lua is used as a scripting language to automate and extend the game in certain ways, by exposing game objects to the lua engine and allowing interpreted lua code to manipulate (script) them. Javascript is the same thing in other programs. But whether you call javascript a scripting language in firefox, or something much more (as it's actualy required for firefox to function at all), is a matter of personal preference really. I've seen python embedded in apps to act as a scripting language before. I've also seen full-blown apps written in python. So yes, the distinction, as made by the original poster, isn't really necessary. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On 2/9/2013 6:53 PM, Michael Torrie wrote: On 02/09/2013 04:26 PM, Tim Roberts wrote: Most people would call bash a scripting language, but it is also clearly a programming language. It has syntax, variables and expressions. I suspect it is Turing-complete, although I haven't seen a proof of that. I would assert that scripting languages are a proper subset of programming languages, not a separate category. I'm pretty sure Bash is turing complete. I know it's been shown that sed is turing complete, and awk probably is too! If I recall, the way to show a language is turing complete is to implement a turing machine If the language has arrays, conditional execution, and explicit (while) loops or recursion, you can be pretty sure it is Turing complete. I presume this covers awk and bash. Something like the game of Life, where the looping in implicit in the operation, is much harder to show Turing complete. I suspect sed is non-trivial also. -- Terry Jan Reedy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On 2/9/2013 6:26 PM, Tim Roberts wrote: Grant Edwards invalid@invalid.invalid wrote: IMO, a scripting language is used to automate tasks that would otherwise be done by a human sitting at a keyboard typing commands. [Perhaps that definition should be extended to include tasks that would otherwise by done by a human sitting and clicking on a GUI.] I think that definition is a little too neat and clean. Most people would call bash a scripting language, but it is also clearly a programming language. It has syntax, variables and expressions. I suspect it is Turing-complete, although I haven't seen a proof of that. I would assert that scripting languages are a proper subset of programming languages, not a separate category. To me, 'scripting languages' include some non-Turing-complete languages and I would not call those 'programming languages'. -- Terry Jan Reedy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On 02/09/2013 07:40 PM, Terry Reedy wrote: If the language has arrays, conditional execution, and explicit (while) loops or recursion, you can be pretty sure it is Turing complete. I presume this covers awk and bash. Something like the game of Life, where the looping in implicit in the operation, is much harder to show Turing complete. I suspect sed is non-trivial also. All you have to do to show a language is turing complete is to implement a turing machine in it. Here's one in sed that I found: http://www.catonmat.net/blog/proof-that-sed-is-turing-complete/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
* gmspro gms...@yahoo.com [2013-02-08 05:03:51 -0800]: Hello all, One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? Thanks. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list What's the difference ? http://openerp.com OpenERP is written with Python and this is an ERP, Youtube is written with Python and used by Google. -- Stéphane Wirtel - http://wirtel.be - @matrixise -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
gmspro, 08.02.2013 14:03: One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? Apples and oranges. It's a bit like asking if C is an embedded systems language or if JavaScript is a 3D graphics language. Well, no, but you can use them for that if you want. That doesn't render them any less Turing complete. In the same way, Python is a programming language that can be used for scripting, as well as lots of other things, from web programming to number crunching. Stefan -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On Feb 8, 6:03 pm, gmspro gms...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello all, One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? Thanks. One said: English is the language spoken in England. Another One said: English is the language internationally used for commerce, academics and much else. Who is 'true'? Is one false because the other is true? [Amusing that this is being said at the same time as a necroposted thread about the multi-meanings of bool in python] More seriously: Python is one of the first serious programming languages and scripting languages. Those who think that one excludes the other are probably learnt their programming/CS half a century ago and stopped learning soon after. For many such mis-takes in CS education see my: http://blog.languager.org/2011/02/cs-education-is-fat-and-weak-1.html and its sequel http://blog.languager.org/2011/02/cs-education-is-fat-and-weak-2.html -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
Am 08.02.2013 14:03, schrieb gmspro: One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? That depends on your definition of scripting language and programming language. Python's not a language but an animal. Uli -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
gmspro wrote: Hello all, One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? Python is a high-level, object-oriented, strongly-typed programming language with garbage collection, byte-code compilation, dynamic types, and syntax that includes OOP, procedural and functional styles. It is an excellent glue language for libraries written in C, C++, Fortran, Java and CLR (dot-Net). It is also good for scripting. But that doesn't mean it is only a scripting language. Calling Python a scripting language is like calling an iPad a clock, just because it has a clock app. Yes, you can use your iPad to tell the time, and that makes it a clock. But it's not *just* a clock, and Python is not *just* a scripting language. -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
gmspro wrote: One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? I forgot to mention, there is a FAQ about this: http://docs.python.org/2/faq/general.html#what-is-python-good-for -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On Fri, Feb 8, 2013, at 08:03 AM, gmspro wrote: Hello all, One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? According to Wikipedia[1] a scripting languages are a subset of programming languages so it goes that any scripting language is, be definition, a programming language. It also says that scripting is not so much an attribute of the language, but an attribute of the interpreter, so one could say that C++ is a scripting language if one were to use a C++ interpreter. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scripting_language -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 2:28 AM, Albert Hopkins mar...@letterboxes.org wrote: ... one could say that C++ is a scripting language if one were to use a C++ interpreter. And if one is sufficiently sadistic to actually use C++ in that way. ChrisA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 4:40 PM, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 2:28 AM, Albert Hopkins mar...@letterboxes.org wrote: ... one could say that C++ is a scripting language if one were to use a C++ interpreter. And if one is sufficiently sadistic to actually use C++ in that way. ChrisA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list Did you mean: And if one is sufficiently sadistic to actually use C++ in any way. -- Kwpolska http://kwpolska.tk | GPG KEY: 5EAAEA16 stop html mail| always bottom-post http://asciiribbon.org| http://caliburn.nl/topposting.html -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On 02/08/2013 10:46 AM, Kwpolska wrote: On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 4:40 PM, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 2:28 AM, Albert Hopkins mar...@letterboxes.org wrote: ... one could say that C++ is a scripting language if one were to use a C++ interpreter. And if one is sufficiently sadistic to actually use C++ in that way. ChrisA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list Did you mean: And if one is sufficiently sadistic to actually use C++ in any way. I suspect he meant masochistic. -- DaveA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 2:58 AM, Dave Angel da...@davea.name wrote: On 02/08/2013 10:46 AM, Kwpolska wrote: On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 4:40 PM, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 2:28 AM, Albert Hopkins mar...@letterboxes.org wrote: ... one could say that C++ is a scripting language if one were to use a C++ interpreter. And if one is sufficiently sadistic to actually use C++ in that way. ChrisA Did you mean: And if one is sufficiently sadistic to actually use C++ in any way. I suspect he meant masochistic. Kinda both. Personally, I don't like to inflict torture on my hardware any more than on myself. http://xkcd.com/371/ Your C++ interpreter is grinning and holding a spatula. ChrisA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On 2013-02-08, Stephane Wirtel steph...@wirtel.be wrote: * gmspro gms...@yahoo.com [2013-02-08 05:03:51 -0800]: Hello all, One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? Thanks. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list What's the difference ? IMO, a scripting language is used to automate tasks that would otherwise be done by a human sitting at a keyboard typing commands. [Perhaps that definition should be extended to include tasks that would otherwise by done by a human sitting and clicking on a GUI.] http://openerp.com OpenERP is written with Python and this is an ERP, Youtube is written with Python and used by Google. IMO, neither one of those is replacing a person typing commands or clicking buttons, so neither of those are scripting applications. -- Grant Edwards grant.b.edwardsYow! I want EARS! I want at two ROUND BLACK EARS gmail.comto make me feel warm 'n secure!! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python programming language?
On 08/02/2013 13:38, rusi wrote: On Feb 8, 6:03 pm, gmspro gms...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello all, One said, Python is not programming language, rather scripting language, is that true? Thanks. One said: English is the language spoken in England. Wrong, English is spoken in some parts of England but I've no idea what you'd call the language used in Newcastle upon Tyne. -- Cheers. Mark Lawrence -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
New book The Python Programming Language by Guido van Rossum
The Python Programming Language by Guido van Rossum, Raymond Hettinger, Jack Diedrich, David Beazley, David Mertz, Nicholas Coghlan to be published. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Python-Programming-Language-Guido-Rossum/dp/0132299690 Anyone found the TOC of this? Thanks, -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: New book The Python Programming Language by Guido van Rossum
Akira Kitada akit...@gmail.com writes: The Python Programming Language by Guido van Rossum, Raymond Hettinger, Jack Diedrich, David Beazley, David Mertz, Nicholas Coghlan to be published. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Python-Programming-Language-Guido-Rossum/dp/0132299690 Wow! But it says the pub date is 28 Aug 2009. Anyone found the TOC of this? Chances are, it's still being written and the final TOC is not yet known. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list