Re: Your beloved python features
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Re: Your beloved python features
Bruce C. Baker wrote: Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote in message news:mailman.1929.1265328905.28905.python-l...@python.org... Iterators, and in particular, generators. A killer feature. Terry Jan Reedy Neither unique to Python. And then're the other killer features superfluous :s and rigid formatting! H Let's see. nope, I could not find the unique word neither in the subject or in the cited text. I've had a strange feeling last weeks. Two possible explanations come to mind : a) The list is under a concerted troll attack. b) Idiocy is contagious. I wonder which... P.S. : will the indentation of the choices be noticed? Shouldn't I put them within braces? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Steven D'Aprano wrote: On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 18:29:07 +0100, mk wrote: Ethan Furman wrote: http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/ choose_python.pdf Choose to get your difficult questions about threads in Python ignored. Oh well.. With an attitude like that, you're damn lucky if you don't get kill- filed. It was SIX MINUTES since you posted your question about timers, what did you expect? I didn't expect immediate answer to this particular question. I have repeatedly asked many questions about threads in the past, and IIRC every one of them was ignored. Threads are hard, and many people don't use them at all. You might never get an answer, even without alienating people. Complaining after six DAYS might be acceptable, if you do it with a sense of humour, but after six minutes? Well, it's 4 days now. I would be happy to get 50% response rate. Apparently nobody is really using threads. regards, mk -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 12:07 PM, mk mrk...@gmail.com wrote: Steven D'Aprano wrote: On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 18:29:07 +0100, mk wrote: Ethan Furman wrote: http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/ choose_python.pdf Choose to get your difficult questions about threads in Python ignored. Oh well.. With an attitude like that, you're damn lucky if you don't get kill- filed. It was SIX MINUTES since you posted your question about timers, what did you expect? I didn't expect immediate answer to this particular question. I have repeatedly asked many questions about threads in the past, and IIRC every one of them was ignored. Threads are hard, and many people don't use them at all. You might never get an answer, even without alienating people. Complaining after six DAYS might be acceptable, if you do it with a sense of humour, but after six minutes? Well, it's 4 days now. I would be happy to get 50% response rate. Apparently nobody is really using threads. regards, mk I use threads. Geremy Condra -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
geremy condra wrote: On Mon, Feb 8, 2010 at 12:07 PM, mk mrk...@gmail.com wrote: Steven D'Aprano wrote: On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 18:29:07 +0100, mk wrote: Ethan Furman wrote: http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/ choose_python.pdf Choose to get your difficult questions about threads in Python ignored. Oh well.. With an attitude like that, you're damn lucky if you don't get kill- filed. It was SIX MINUTES since you posted your question about timers, what did you expect? I didn't expect immediate answer to this particular question. I have repeatedly asked many questions about threads in the past, and IIRC every one of them was ignored. Threads are hard, and many people don't use them at all. You might never get an answer, even without alienating people. Complaining after six DAYS might be acceptable, if you do it with a sense of humour, but after six minutes? Well, it's 4 days now. I would be happy to get 50% response rate. Apparently nobody is really using threads. regards, mk I use threads. So do I, where appropriate. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
In article 28c6967f-7637-4823-aee9-15487e1ce...@o28g2000yqh.googlegroups.com, Julian maili...@julianmoritz.de wrote: I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. Readability -- Aahz (a...@pythoncraft.com) * http://www.pythoncraft.com/ import antigravity -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Mon, 08 Feb 2010 18:07:56 +0100, mk wrote: Threads are hard, and many people don't use them at all. You might never get an answer, even without alienating people. Complaining after six DAYS might be acceptable, if you do it with a sense of humour, but after six minutes? Well, it's 4 days now. I would be happy to get 50% response rate. Apparently nobody is really using threads. Please see my response to your post timer for a function. -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Julian maili...@julianmoritz.de writes: I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. Thanks for the hint, interesting stuff in there. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. For me as an electronics HW guy, I really like that I can easily handle binary data without doing tedious and error prone shifting and anding and oring. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote in message news:mailman.1929.1265328905.28905.python-l...@python.org... Iterators, and in particular, generators. A killer feature. Terry Jan Reedy Neither unique to Python. And then're the other killer features superfluous :s and rigid formatting! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
apeach a écrit : I love intuitive type recognition. no need to 'DIM everything AS Integer' etc.! not to mention the ever hilarious (that is, when you don't have to maintain it) typical Java idiom: EveryThing theEveryThing = new EveryThing(); -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Bruno Desthuilliers wrote: apeach a écrit : I love intuitive type recognition. no need to 'DIM everything AS Integer' etc.! not to mention the ever hilarious (that is, when you don't have to maintain it) typical Java idiom: EveryThing theEveryThing = new EveryThing(); http://www.artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=42242 regards Steve -- Steve Holden +1 571 484 6266 +1 800 494 3119 PyCon is coming! Atlanta, Feb 2010 http://us.pycon.org/ Holden Web LLC http://www.holdenweb.com/ UPCOMING EVENTS:http://holdenweb.eventbrite.com/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Steve Holden st...@holdenweb.com writes: EveryThing theEveryThing = new EveryThing(); http://www.artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=42242 Pretty cool! I see your blog post criticizing Java's lack of type inference, and then immediately adjacent to the post there's a banner ad for a book called Programming in Scala. I think I am getting a mixed message ;-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Feb 5, 8:49 am, Roald de Vries r...@roalddevries.nl wrote: My reasoning: I needed a language more powerful than bash, but more portable and faster to develop (at least small scripts) than C/C++. So I needed a scripting language. Python, Ruby, Perl, Tcl, ...? Python seems to be the language with the most libraries available, I like Python a lot. That said, it looks like Perl's CPAN currently has approximately double the number of packages in the Cheeseshop. I'm guessing the CPAN is still growing, but I don't know how fast it is growing compared to the Cheeseshop. I won't venture a guess as to which has a higher percentage of older unmaintained packages. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Julian wrote: Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. So, may you help me please? If there's a similar thread/blogpost/ whatever, please give it to me, google couldn't. Regards Julian http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/choose_python.pdf -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On 02/04/10 23:03, Julian wrote: cut For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. That it is ego-orientated programming ;-) http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-announce-list/2009-April/007419.html -- mph -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Ethan Furman wrote: Julian wrote: Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. So, may you help me please? If there's a similar thread/blogpost/ whatever, please give it to me, google couldn't. Regards Julian http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/choose_python.pdf Choose metaclasses if you don’t value your sanity. That remembers me the time when it took me 4 hours to write a ten lines metaclass :o) JM -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. So, may you help me please? If there's a similar thread/blogpost/ whatever, please give it to me, google couldn't. Regards Julian http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/choose_python.pdf This is effin hilarious! Should be either linked or stored on python.org Cheers, Daniel -- Psss, psss, put it down! - http://www.cafepress.com/putitdown -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
R Fritz rfritz...@gmail.com wrote in message news:e97ff208-d08e-4934-8e38-a40d668cd...@l24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... My favorite feature is its readability. It's as near to pseudo-code as any language we have, and that's valuable in open source projects or when I return to code to modify it. That might be true when used to code actual algorithms using basic features. But a lot of Pythonisms would appear mysterious to someone who doesn't know the language (for example, what does :: mean in an array index). Or perhaps pseudo-code is much more advanced these days... -- bartc -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Feb 5, 2010, at 12:03 AM, Julian wrote: Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. So, may you help me please? If there's a similar thread/blogpost/ whatever, please give it to me, google couldn't. My reasoning: I needed a language more powerful than bash, but more portable and faster to develop (at least small scripts) than C/C++. So I needed a scripting language. Python, Ruby, Perl, Tcl, ...? Python seems to be the language with the most libraries available, programs written in it, OS-support (even runs on my smartphone), has a good data-model, has a good interactive shell (iPython). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Julian a écrit : Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. My all-time favorite Python feature : it fits my brain. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Bruno Desthuilliers wrote: Julian a écrit : Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. My all-time favorite Python feature : it fits my brain. Python is simple ... no offense Bruno :D JM (sorry couldn't help) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On 2010-02-04, Julian maili...@julianmoritz.de wrote: I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. In the fine old tradition: Python: It sucks less. A lot less. -- Grant Edwards grante Yow! You should all JUMP at UP AND DOWN for TWO HOURS visi.comwhile I decide on a NEW CAREER!! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Jean-Michel Pichavant a écrit : Bruno Desthuilliers wrote: My all-time favorite Python feature : it fits my brain. Python is simple ... no offense Bruno :D !-) But FWIW, that's exactly the point : even a stoopid like me can manage to learn and use Python, and proceed to write working apps without spending more time reading the doc than actually solving the problem. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Ethan Furman wrote: http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/choose_python.pdf Choose to get your difficult questions about threads in Python ignored. Oh well.. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Julian wrote: For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. Dictionaries. A workhorse of Python, by far the most useful data structure. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
George Sakkis george.sak...@gmail.com wrote in message news:de06116c-e77c-47c4-982d-62b48bca5...@j31g2000yqa.googlegroups.com... I'll give the benefit of doubt and assume you're joking rather than trolling. George * Not trolling, my friend! GvR got it right when he discarded the superfluous semicolons from the ends of statements--and then he ADDS superfluous colons to the ends of control statements? It will probably be as much of a shock to you as it was to me when I learned after studying parsing that colons, semicolons, then's and do's, etc., are simply noise tokens that serve no purpose except to clutter up the source. As for enforced indentation, back in the late 60's when I was a programming newbie I remember thinking how cool it would be to just indent the statements controlled by for loops (we didn't have none of them fancy while loops in FORTRAN back then! :-) ) Not too long after that I saw the havoc that a buggy editor could wreak on nicely-formatted source. :-( Formatting held hostage to a significant, invisible whitespace char? An inevitable accident waiting to happen! Not good, Guido; not good at all. That'll do for starters. :-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
GvR got it right when he discarded the superfluous semicolons from the ends of statements--and then he ADDS superfluous colons to the ends of control statements? It will probably be as much of a shock to you as it was to me when I learned after studying parsing that colons, semicolons, then's and do's, etc., are simply noise tokens that serve no purpose except to clutter up the source. Some argue that the colon is a useful visual cue that aids in readability and that explicit is better than implicit. I think one can feel either way about it. For my part, I prefer to have colons at that point, because it serves as a mental primer that a certain type of block follows. Semi-colons at the end of statements don't seem to provide any mental priming for me that can't better be served by a line break. As for enforced indentation, back in the late 60's when I was a programming newbie I remember thinking how cool it would be to just indent the statements controlled by for loops (we didn't have none of them fancy while loops in FORTRAN back then! :-) ) Not too long after that I saw the havoc that a buggy editor could wreak on nicely-formatted source. :-( Formatting held hostage to a significant, invisible whitespace char? An inevitable accident waiting to happen! Not good, Guido; not good at all. First, why would you tolerate a buggy editor? I've had my share of challenges in learning Python, but indentation problems would be about 403rd down on the list. A simple indentation error is shown in my editor that immediately gets fixed. No havoc at all. And I also know that every piece of Python code I ever get from others *has* to be readable (at least in terms of the very visually helpful indented blocks). Che Che That'll do for starters. :-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 18:29:07 +0100, mk wrote: Ethan Furman wrote: http://www1.american.edu/academic.depts/cas/econ/faculty/isaac/ choose_python.pdf Choose to get your difficult questions about threads in Python ignored. Oh well.. With an attitude like that, you're damn lucky if you don't get kill- filed. It was SIX MINUTES since you posted your question about timers, what did you expect? Threads are hard, and many people don't use them at all. You might never get an answer, even without alienating people. Complaining after six DAYS might be acceptable, if you do it with a sense of humour, but after six minutes? Advice on public forums is free, but it doesn't come with an guaranteed response time. If you want a Service Level Agreement, you will need to pay somebody for it. -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 15:22:25 -0600, Bruce C. Baker wrote: GvR got it right when he discarded the superfluous semicolons from the ends of statements--and then he ADDS superfluous colons to the ends of control statements? They're not superfluous, they have a real, practical use. It will probably be as much of a shock to you as it was to me when I learned after studying parsing that colons, semicolons, then's and do's, etc., are simply noise tokens that serve no purpose except to clutter up the source. Incorrect, they do have a use. Hint: source code isn't just read by parsers. As for enforced indentation, back in the late 60's when I was a programming newbie I remember thinking how cool it would be to just indent the statements controlled by for loops (we didn't have none of them fancy while loops in FORTRAN back then! :-) ) Not too long after that I saw the havoc that a buggy editor could wreak on nicely-formatted source. :-( As opposed to how resistant source code is to buggy editors that make other changes to source code. If your editor flips the order of characters, or turns the digit 4 into 7, or deletes braces, or inserts # characters at the start of lines, you would dump the editor in a second. But if the editor inserts or removes whitespace, we're supposed to continue using the editor and change the language? Formatting held hostage to a significant, invisible whitespace char? It's not invisible. You can see it by noticing the space between the left margin and the start of non-whitespace text. Can you see the difference between these? hello world hello world Of course you can, unless your News reader or mail client is buggy. If it is deleting whitespace at the start of lines, how can you trust it not to delete anything else? Trailing spaces and tabs, on the other hand, *are* invisible. But they're also insignificant, and so don't matter. (Except for one little tiny corner case, which I shall leave as an exercise for the advanced reader.) -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Steven D'Aprano wrote: Trailing spaces and tabs, on the other hand, *are* invisible. But they're also insignificant, and so don't matter. (Except for one little tiny corner case, which I shall leave as an exercise for the advanced reader.) Drat, now I'm gonna be up at odd hours tonight dredging my brain for such corner cases. My catalog so far: - triple-quoted multi-line strings - \ line-continuations don't work with trailing whitespace (though Vim's syntax highlighting flags them, changing their color if there's whitespace afterwards) - files that read themselves (or perhaps depend on introspection/debugging modules to read themselves) Any others that I missed? -tkc -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Your beloved python features
Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. So, may you help me please? If there's a similar thread/blogpost/ whatever, please give it to me, google couldn't. Regards Julian -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
My favorite feature is its readability. It's as near to pseudo-code as any language we have, and that's valuable in open source projects or when I return to code to modify it. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Julian maili...@julianmoritz.de writes: I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. It's terrible, but all the alternatives are even worse. ;-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Iterators, and in particular, generators. A killer feature. Terry Jan Reedy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Feb 4, 3:03 pm, Julian maili...@julianmoritz.de wrote: Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. So, may you help me please? If there's a similar thread/blogpost/ whatever, please give it to me, google couldn't. Regards Julian I love list comprehensions, but am currently falling for 'with'. ~Sean -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On 4 Feb, 23:03, Julian maili...@julianmoritz.de wrote: Hello, I've asked this question at stackoverflow a few weeks ago, and to make it clear: this should NOT be a copy of the stackoverflow-thread hidden features of Python. I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. For those guys would be a poster quite cool which describes the most popular and beloved python features. So, may you help me please? If there's a similar thread/blogpost/ whatever, please give it to me, google couldn't. Regards Julian * simplicity * documentation - some criticise it, I love it. * duck typing * batteries included And lots more! -- Arnaud -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Personally, I love the fact that I can type in 2**25 in the intepreter without crashing my machine. ;) Cheers, -Xav -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
Julian maili...@julianmoritz.de writes: I want to design a poster for an open source conference, the local usergroup will have a table there, and in the past years there were some people that came to the python-table just to ask why should I use python?. - Very easy to learn, at least for the not-too-hairy fragment - some features like generators are advanced compared with some other languages, yet still easy to use - pleasant-to-use syntax (yes, the indentation stuff that everyone is freaked out by at first) and well-evolved library makes coding very productive and enjoyable - reasonably good documentation - large and friendly user/developer community -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Your beloved python features
On Feb 5, 2:45 am, Bruce C. Baker b...@undisclosedlocation.net wrote: Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote in message news:mailman.1929.1265328905.28905.python-l...@python.org... Iterators, and in particular, generators. A killer feature. Terry Jan Reedy +1, iterators/generators is among Python's best features for me too. Neither unique to Python. Can you name a single feature that is unique to a language, Python or other ? Every idea that's any good has been copied over, usually more than once. And then're the other killer features superfluous :s and rigid formatting! I'll give the benefit of doubt and assume you're joking rather than trolling. George -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
