>Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[doctor]

Someone spoke of being a PhD and having better things to do with one's
life than fooling around with old Macs.

After having read the 3 or 4 Quadlists that came in from the weekend, I've
kind of lost track of who it was, but I thought I might reply just the
same.

First off I can speak from experience.  I am an advid collector of
computers.  My oldest being an IMSAI S-100 bus based computer, and going
up through the various Commodore, TRS-80, and Atari lines of machines that
were popular in the 1980's right on into the 90's with a Classic on the
low end and a PowerMac 8500 on the higher end, and a IIci, a couple of
IIvx's,  and various other Lowend PowerMac and high end 68040 machines in
between.

First off my collection is housed in a self-storage faciility the size of
a single car garage.  I do this for 2 reasons.  #1 it keeps the silly
things from over-running my home.  #2 it also gives me a place to work
with them.  I have a power-outlet and a bench out there.

I find that the collection is a nice diversion.  I work a lot.  I work as
a TV engineer for a local cable station.  Being able to come home and
induldge in my technical interests without having to worry about it being
some mission critical thing is, for me, a release.

Likewise, I find that working on the old equipment is actually helpful for
my skills.  The way I approach a problem with a piece of machinery is
different because of it.  I think about low-level events that may be going
on with a machine.  It creates a different mindset.

Now, to the person who mentioned the Macs taking over his life.  The only
thing I could recommend is that if its not fun anymore, stop doing it.  If
it is still fun, then there's nothing really wrong with it.  There are far
worse things in the universe than a garage full of Macintoshes that
actually give someone pleasure.

If you feel you're out of control, then make a list.  Inventory your
Macintoshes and list by them why you like that machine.  My list looks
something like this:

Computers in Use:

8500  - Edit Bay Computer
6100  - Home Desktop Computer
IIci w/ PPC upgrade   - Appletalk Server
636 w/ DOS- Work Desk Computer
630   - FTP Server
475   - Master Control Desk Computer
SE/30 - Recepie Computer
Classic   - Bathroom Terminal
IIcx w/ 68040 - Database Computer
IIcx  - Appletalk Router
486 Laptop- Test Bench Computer
486 Laptop- Portable Database Computer
Pentium 100   - Win95/DOS Machine
Compaq 486- MP3 Player (Stereo System)
Apple IIGS- Main Apple IIe compatible fun Computer
Commodore 128 - Main Commodore fun Computer
Commodore 64/SX   - Edit Bay Slate Display Computer
Atari 800 - C/G Backup Slate Display
286   - Display Controller
286   - LPD Server
386/20- Internet Router
386/40- Commodore / Atari Internet Router

Now this list doesn't even include every computer that I own, just the
one's I use on a regular basis.  You'll notice that some of the computers
are put to use in my job doing various things.  But that doesn't count for
all of them.  Several of the above are just listed as "fun" computers.
That means they serve no purpose other than I like them.

At any rate, by making a list you might figure out how you really use your
computers.  It would aid in culling some of your excess should you decide
to ween yourself from a room full of Macintoshes, or you might even
discover that you use more of them than you realize.

At any rate, I hope this rambling post gives some help.  I'm just giving
some suggestions as a collector on how to "manage" the addiction.

Good luck,
David

-P.S. now if only I could get that work Desk computer to behave itself
with Excel.



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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Rob]

Well, if you aren't worried about proving it, then they can hardly be
considered licensed copies...

I consider most app's like this abandonware, and there are definitely
companies that try to close down abandonware websites. But in most cases,
the companies in question have no product that can replace the
abandonware

I'm hoping that they don't come over here to check, it could be
embarassing...

- Original Message -
From: "Kyle Kinsey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Quadlist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2002 7:18 PM
Subject: Re: Mac Collection and Addiction


> >Did you get the install media for the programs with the computer?
> >Otherwise,
> >it's going to be difficult to prove they are licensed copies.
>
> Prove? To whom? You know of many companies that regularly check?
> WHAT WHAT!


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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Kyle Kinsey]

>Did you get the install media for the programs with the computer?
>Otherwise,
>it's going to be difficult to prove they are licensed copies.

Prove? To whom? You know of many companies that regularly check?
WHAT WHAT!


kyle.


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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Rob]

Did you get the install media for the programs with the computer? Otherwise,
it's going to be difficult to prove they are licensed copies.

Rob

- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Quadlist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2002 12:05 PM
Subject: Re: Mac Collection and Addiction


> Funny thing is it still had its hard disk intact, and there were licensed
> copies of just about every graphics design packages one could imagine on
that
> hard disk, too.


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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Paul Stamsen]

About 12:37 pm -0700, on 7/28/02, Paul Noss sagaciously queried or 
brilliantly elucidated:


(snip)
  I've got a Ph.D., and I can do
>   more with my life that this.  So, I'm just going to stop.


  Where do you live? Can we help you? Perhaps you'd rather just use 
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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[william ahearn]

Paul Stamsen wrote:
> 

> or the DSM (I think)?

The current edition is DSM IV, I believe. Damn, no
pictures . . .

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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Paul Stamsen]

About 5:08 pm +0100, on 7/28/02, edjones sagaciously queried or 
brilliantly elucidated:


>   Does mac addiction have an ICD10 classification ?
>
or the DSM (I think)?
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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Ed Murphy]

--- william ahearn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> 
> Paul Noss wrote:
> > 
> > An addiction is when a person spends more time and
> > money on something than he or she can afford.  
> 
> Oh. So Keith Richard wasn't addicted to heroin because
> he had the time and money to afford it? I have to admit
> to a bias against the psycho-therapy establishment and
> as a result hesitate to jump in but I find Pual Noss's
> statement difficult to grasp. Especially by one who has

I took Paul's statement less literally.  I interpreted it more
generally as meaning addictions interfere with or damage other
important parts of your life; relationships, finances, career, etc. 
Paul was giving the examples of time or money as things that could be
impared by the addiction.  In this regard, my Mac collecting could be
construed as an addiction because I keep the extent of it from my wife,
because I know she would not approve.  Ultimately, this is a bad thing
for our relationship.  I guess I should fess up.  Thanks for the help
Paul.



=
-
Ed Murphy
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[greatful]

>A very economical way to feed that addiction is to buy from Goodwill Industries 
>"Bargain Barn" (were available).
>

Here the partnership with Goodwill Industries is called "Computer Works" ~ Lots of 
good bargains. And when all else fails... eBay ;) We have another organization that 
collects unwanted equipment and distributes to others in need (their's is a 
Federal/State connection)

greatful
 


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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[william ahearn]

Paul Noss wrote:
> 

> I collect these Macs, justify it, but I really know deep down that it's just
> a waste of time to work on pieces of junk.  (And, a $1 Mac is a piece of
> junk, and a $400 Mac is a piece of junk, and I'm a teacher, and no it's not
> worth anything to a school.  Get Real!!)  I've got a Ph.D., and I can do
> more with my life that this.  So, I'm just going to stop.
> 
And you wonder why I have problems with people in the
therapy business? Oh, yeah, don't forget to hold your
breath until you turn blue.

William

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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Paul Noss]

On 7/28/02 12:19 PM, "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>> 
>> I'd say it sounds more like Obsessive/Compulsive than an
>> addiction.
>> 
>> ;)
>> Mike
> The 2 frequently go hand in hand.
> 
> Lee
> 
> A computer without Windows is like a dog without bricks tied to its head.
> 
I didn't start this discussion; I merely started a new thread, and added to
what others have said before.  After thinking about it a few days, I decided
that I have a problem with Mac collecting and it does interfere with my
life.  (So whatever you call it?  Who cares? In my case it's a problem.)
I've spent over $10,000 on used Macs, I spend too much time working on them.
I collect these Macs, justify it, but I really know deep down that it's just
a waste of time to work on pieces of junk.  (And, a $1 Mac is a piece of
junk, and a $400 Mac is a piece of junk, and I'm a teacher, and no it's not
worth anything to a school.  Get Real!!)  I've got a Ph.D., and I can do
more with my life that this.  So, I'm just going to stop.

Paul  


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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[suignrs]

>
>I'd say it sounds more like Obsessive/Compulsive than an
>addiction.
>
>;)
>Mike
The 2 frequently go hand in hand.

Lee

A computer without Windows is like a dog without bricks tied to its head.


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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[edjones]

I can relate to this.
Mac addiction for me is having at least 10 Macs and countless nubus cards
sitting around, with technical skills that are dated.
At least it is a *safe* addiction. That and 68k Macs in the UK are next to
worthless now.

Ed

> Mine is an addiction, of some form or another - it's a replacement for
> my smoking habit... I gave up a 2-pack-a-day habit a bit over  a year
> ago, in exchange for going mental with the collection. It's a cheaper
> habit than smoking, so I can afford it financially, and it's a cheap
> habit healthwise (unless chewing on pram batteries somehow turns into a
> health risk.. j/k :). It's a cheap habit timewise, in one sense - in
> that it's my hobby and passion, and is part of the dozens of things that
> keep life enjoyable :). Where it's damaging, is my skills as a tech type
> are becoming more and more refined to point back around 10 years or so.
> That's an expense in its own, more than in a simple monetary or time
> sense.



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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[edjones]

Does mac addiction have an ICD10 classification ?

>
> I was surprised at how many posts were about people feeling they had too
> many Macs and some people wondering if it was some sort of addiction.
>
> I have this problem myself.  I'm a psychology professor and one of my
areas
> of expertise is drug addiction.






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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Dana Sibera]

On Sunday, July 28, 2002, at 05:35  AM, Paul Noss wrote:

> I agree, the money element is only a small part of it, as I think I 
> said in
> my original post.  For some people who collect too many Macs, it's 
> money,
> for others it's probably time or some other psychological element, but 
> for
> others it's probably many different things.

Mine is an addiction, of some form or another - it's a replacement for 
my smoking habit... I gave up a 2-pack-a-day habit a bit over  a year 
ago, in exchange for going mental with the collection. It's a cheaper 
habit than smoking, so I can afford it financially, and it's a cheap 
habit healthwise (unless chewing on pram batteries somehow turns into a 
health risk.. j/k :). It's a cheap habit timewise, in one sense - in 
that it's my hobby and passion, and is part of the dozens of things that 
keep life enjoyable :). Where it's damaging, is my skills as a tech type 
are becoming more and more refined to point back around 10 years or so. 
That's an expense in its own, more than in a simple monetary or time 
sense.

(...and linux on a Quadra isn't so bad :)

dana
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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[william ahearn]

Paul Noss wrote:
> 
> On 7/27/02 11:26 AM, "william ahearn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> Dear William, I hope you and everyone take what I say in the helpful way
> that I intended it.  I was just seeing a similarity among responses, and
> felt I should comment.
> 
It *was* taken that way and I intended no animousity is
my response. That's what discussion lists are for: To
share information. Sometimes disagreements arise.
That's normal and part of the process. It sometimes
leads to better understanding of numerous things.
Perhaps it is a minor point but what we are discussing
is an obsession and not an addiction. 

William

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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[Paul Noss]

On 7/27/02 11:26 AM, "william ahearn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Dear William, I hope you and everyone take what I say in the helpful way
that I intended it.  I was just seeing a similarity among responses, and
felt I should comment.


> 
> 
> Paul Noss wrote:
>> 
>> An addiction is when a person spends more time and
>> money on something than he or she can afford.
> 
> Oh. So Keith Richard wasn't addicted to heroin because
> he had the time and money to afford it?
Of course not!  Who would say that?  Addictions are more psychological than
physiological, although heroin is a drug with a strong physiological
dependence.

It's how much time, money, or both.  But, in the Mac addiction issue, it's
probably more about time for many people. It's probably about not having
enough balance in life between the Mac collecting and other activities.  I
guess I could have stated that more clearly.

 I have to admit
> to a bias against the psycho-therapy establishment and
> as a result hesitate to jump in but I find Pual Noss's
> statement difficult to grasp.

Boy, you seem to be against me just because I'm a psychologist.  If I said
what I did as a non-psychologist, you would probably would have reacted with
less criticism.

Look, I am also biased against the psychotherapy establishment; that's why
I'm a teacher and researcher.  I've based my life on the assumption that we
can make things better in the world of psychotherapy, but I'm disappointed
that after 20 years, things seem even worse.

I'm not saying people have a real Mac collecting addiction, but merely
saying that based on what many posted, some people on the Quad list see some
similarities between Mac collecting and addiction.  And, I see some also.

Especially by one who has
> published on the subject. I'm getting over my addiction
> to Macs. The money element is only a small part of the
> whole pathology.

I agree, the money element is only a small part of it, as I think I said in
my original post.  For some people who collect too many Macs, it's money,
for others it's probably time or some other psychological element, but for
others it's probably many different things.  I just thought I would share my
impressions.  Because, I feel a little worried that I'm spending too much
time collecting old Macs, and I'm not sure why.
 


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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[william ahearn]

Paul Noss wrote:
> 
> An addiction is when a person spends more time and
> money on something than he or she can afford.  

Oh. So Keith Richard wasn't addicted to heroin because
he had the time and money to afford it? I have to admit
to a bias against the psycho-therapy establishment and
as a result hesitate to jump in but I find Pual Noss's
statement difficult to grasp. Especially by one who has
published on the subject. I'm getting over my addiction
to Macs. The money element is only a small part of the
whole pathology.

William

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Re: Mac Collection and Addiction

[PeterH5322]

In a message dated 7/27/02 10:40:02 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

<<
What are the roots of the my addiction to collecting Macs?  At first it was 
just like a drug. I would see an old Mac for $100 and want to see what it 
could do ...
>>

A very economical way to feed that addiction is to buy from Goodwill 
Industries "Bargain Barn" (were available).

A brief and unscheduled trip to the Bargain Barn yesterday turned up a very 
nice 7200/90 for ONE DOLLAR.

Funny thing is it still had its hard disk intact, and there were licensed 
copies of just about every graphics design packages one could imagine on that 
hard disk, too.

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