[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Kai Vierstra]

Thanks Jim,
Saddle's a Brooks B67 and the seatpost is a Nitto lugged lay back post, a 27.2 
with a shim (I know, shims are lame). I wanted a post with more setback, as the 
Brooks don't allow for much movement, and the choices in 29.8 are few and far 
between with zero options having any real layed back positioning. Already 
having the lugged post and an S83 post, I decided my Clem would suffer the 
injustice of a seatpost shim, mainly worrying about wasted post below the shim. 
Turns out that the shim was long enough to clear the end of the fairly short 
post, so no troubles there, and I did some hacking of the shim to follow the 
contours of the seat tube collar so's to look less awful. 
I should really take some better pictures to properly introduce my bikes to you 
all, but juggling regular job and freelance gigs while raising 2 & 5 year old 
boys has a way of taking up all that spare time, and I want to finish some 
custom racks in that no spare time... ..fortunately my regular job is 
overseeing sculpture shops, I just need to close my eyes and get bending.

Keep climbing!, whatever the bar
-Kai Vierstra 
Brooklyn NY 

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Jim D Massachusetts]

Kai,   Nice job on the set-up (and on the pictures). I like the color 
scheme and the functional choice of accessories. What saddle and seat post? 
 Jim  D   Massachusetts

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Bustini]

Nice setup! 

On Sunday, September 25, 2016 at 7:03:37 PM UTC-7, Kai Vierstra wrote:
>
>
> 
>
>
> 
>
> Bosco'd out of the box, then choco'd 
>
> -Kai
>
> On Saturday, September 24, 2016 at 11:51:53 AM UTC-4, Jim D Massachusetts 
> wrote:
>>
>> Kai,Thanks. Would love to see photo.   Jim  D   
>>  Massachusetts
>>
>> On Saturday, September 24, 2016 at 11:24:29 AM UTC-4, Kai Vierstra wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, I did (put choco-mooses on my Clem). They're great, wouldn't mind a 
>>> little more extension, but great regardless.
>>> Still plenty upright and comfy, and I love having the triangle to run a 
>>> cable through on extended lockups in the city. Never having to worry about 
>>> bar slippage or fussing with stem swaps in a quest for extension perfection 
>>> is another added bonus of the Bullmoose style. Will post a photo if that 
>>> helps your decision. 
>>> -Kai Vierstra 
>>> Brooklyn NY 
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Kai Vierstra]

Bosco'd out of the box, then choco'd 

-Kai

On Saturday, September 24, 2016 at 11:51:53 AM UTC-4, Jim D Massachusetts 
wrote:
>
> Kai,Thanks. Would love to see photo.   Jim  D   
>  Massachusetts
>
> On Saturday, September 24, 2016 at 11:24:29 AM UTC-4, Kai Vierstra wrote:
>>
>> Yes, I did (put choco-mooses on my Clem). They're great, wouldn't mind a 
>> little more extension, but great regardless.
>> Still plenty upright and comfy, and I love having the triangle to run a 
>> cable through on extended lockups in the city. Never having to worry about 
>> bar slippage or fussing with stem swaps in a quest for extension perfection 
>> is another added bonus of the Bullmoose style. Will post a photo if that 
>> helps your decision. 
>> -Kai Vierstra 
>> Brooklyn NY 
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Jim D Massachusetts]

Kai,Thanks. Would love to see photo.   Jim  D   
 Massachusetts

On Saturday, September 24, 2016 at 11:24:29 AM UTC-4, Kai Vierstra wrote:
>
> Yes, I did (put choco-mooses on my Clem). They're great, wouldn't mind a 
> little more extension, but great regardless.
> Still plenty upright and comfy, and I love having the triangle to run a 
> cable through on extended lockups in the city. Never having to worry about 
> bar slippage or fussing with stem swaps in a quest for extension perfection 
> is another added bonus of the Bullmoose style. Will post a photo if that 
> helps your decision. 
> -Kai Vierstra 
> Brooklyn NY 

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Kai Vierstra]

Yes, I did (put choco-mooses on my Clem). They're great, wouldn't mind a little 
more extension, but great regardless.
Still plenty upright and comfy, and I love having the triangle to run a cable 
through on extended lockups in the city. Never having to worry about bar 
slippage or fussing with stem swaps in a quest for extension perfection is 
another added bonus of the Bullmoose style. Will post a photo if that helps 
your decision. 
-Kai Vierstra 
Brooklyn NY 

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Jim D Massachusetts]

I do not care for the look of the bosco bulls that came with my Clem (H). I 
like the look of the choco moose bars on the Joe Appaloosa much better. I 
like that the choco bars are flatter with less rise. I have contemplated a 
switch. However, in the riding I have done so far, I have found the 
standard bosco bars to be very comfortable and I will probably stay with 
them for a while. I am concerned that Riv is going to stop carrying the 
bosco bull bars because they say they are hard to ship. Has anyone put 
choco bars (moose or normal) on their Clem?  

 Jim  DMassachusettss

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

['Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Although my Clementine was a naturally comfortable fit out of the blocks, I 
did give myself time to adapt to the upright position and the Bosco Bulls. 
I have no issues with getting up out of the saddle to honk up a hill with 
this setup. And of course it it no problem to gear down and spin up. I will 
not be touring any time soon, I look forward to reading about your 
experiences out on the long road with a Clementine. Bon voyage.

On Friday, September 23, 2016 at 10:02:51 AM UTC-4, anniebikes wrote:
>
> I'm about to tour on my Clementine and have decided to trust the Boscos. 
> With the purchase of the Clementine I need to get used to two things: 
> upright seating and an unusual bar. I figure Grant specked the builds for a 
> reason so I will be positive, plan to have a great time, and will report 
> the outcome on my blog.
>
> On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 6:44:41 PM UTC-4, Bustini wrote:
>>
>> I'm close to buying an Appaloosa, to be used for everything including 
>> loaded touring. There will be plenty of climbing to be done, so my question 
>> is this: Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward 
>> lean to make for a decent (for me) climbing position? And how about a stiff 
>> headwind? Is the position too upright? I really like a rather upright 
>> riding position for most conditions, but I like to crouch when necessary. 
>> Should I consider putting drops on the bike? I know this is all somewhat 
>> subjective, but I could use some sage advice that is based in actual 
>> experience. Thank you all!
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[anniebikes]

I'm about to tour on my Clementine and have decided to trust the Boscos. 
With the purchase of the Clementine I need to get used to two things: 
upright seating and an unusual bar. I figure Grant specked the builds for a 
reason so I will be positive, plan to have a great time, and will report 
the outcome on my blog.

On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 6:44:41 PM UTC-4, Bustini wrote:
>
> I'm close to buying an Appaloosa, to be used for everything including 
> loaded touring. There will be plenty of climbing to be done, so my question 
> is this: Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward 
> lean to make for a decent (for me) climbing position? And how about a stiff 
> headwind? Is the position too upright? I really like a rather upright 
> riding position for most conditions, but I like to crouch when necessary. 
> Should I consider putting drops on the bike? I know this is all somewhat 
> subjective, but I could use some sage advice that is based in actual 
> experience. Thank you all!
>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Garth]

  This is quite impossible to say as what feels "right" to one does not to 
another.  Hand and body positioning have as much if not more to do with the 
fit of the bike , your own distinct sense of being centered in the bike, 
than the bar.  The bar also requires a stem , both selections vital in the 
fine tuning of bike feel as a *whole. *Notice how a bike that just feels 
"right" is one you don't even think about, you are free from any sense of 
"it" being apart from you, as if you are "riding an object". Rather, you 
find yourself moving effortlessly and without explanation or thought of 
one, not unlike flying effortlessly where everything is just one whole 
experience. Time and distance and space have no meaning here :) 

 If this seems just too "far out" and far fetched , I can only say it is 
any sense of limitation, isolation and separation that is what makes no 
sense. How can one be, and that being be limited, separated from itself ? 
That's double talk, either you are, or you are not , period, infinitum. If 
you are here, you be :)




On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 6:44:41 PM UTC-4, Bustini wrote:
>
> I'm close to buying an Appaloosa, to be used for everything including 
> loaded touring. There will be plenty of climbing to be done, so my question 
> is this: Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward 
> lean to make for a decent (for me) climbing position? And how about a stiff 
> headwind? Is the position too upright? I really like a rather upright 
> riding position for most conditions, but I like to crouch when necessary. 
> Should I consider putting drops on the bike? I know this is all somewhat 
> subjective, but I could use some sage advice that is based in actual 
> experience. Thank you all!
>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Eric Karnes]

I haven't ridden the Choco-Moose as it's a bit too wide for my tastes (and 
narrow shoulders). But I use a VO Porteur bar, which is (kind of) a 
narrower version. They share a similar forward position, which when 
wrapped, I find fantastic for climbing. They remind me of gripping the 
bar-ends on my old mountain bike. Also a great position for stretched-out 
cruising on the flats. 

Eric

On Tuesday, September 13, 2016 at 1:57:58 AM UTC-4, Bustini wrote:
>
> Thanks, Val!
>
> On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:23:07 PM UTC-7, Valerie Yates wrote:
>>
>> I did a loaded tour with a lot of climbing (the San Juan Skyway clockwise 
>> from Durango) on my Joe and I quite enjoyed the seated, upright climbing 
>> position. It was completely comfortable and the views were amazing. I think 
>> the handlebars would allow a more downward angle but, for me, it was the 
>> saddle that made that position undesirable. A saddle that is comfortable 
>> sitting upright is not, for me, comfortable leaning forward due to back of 
>> thigh chafing. So while I normally ride a Brooks B17 Imperial on my drop 
>> bar bikes, I prefer the Brooks B67 on the Joe -- but only if I am seated 
>> fairly upright.  I hope that helps!
>>
>> Val in Boulder, CO
>>
>>
>>
>> On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:44:41 PM UTC-6, Bustini wrote:
>>>
>>> Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward lean to 
>>> make for a decent (for me) climbing position? 
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Bustini]

Thanks, Val!

On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:23:07 PM UTC-7, Valerie Yates wrote:
>
> I did a loaded tour with a lot of climbing (the San Juan Skyway clockwise 
> from Durango) on my Joe and I quite enjoyed the seated, upright climbing 
> position. It was completely comfortable and the views were amazing. I think 
> the handlebars would allow a more downward angle but, for me, it was the 
> saddle that made that position undesirable. A saddle that is comfortable 
> sitting upright is not, for me, comfortable leaning forward due to back of 
> thigh chafing. So while I normally ride a Brooks B17 Imperial on my drop 
> bar bikes, I prefer the Brooks B67 on the Joe -- but only if I am seated 
> fairly upright.  I hope that helps!
>
> Val in Boulder, CO
>
>
>
> On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:44:41 PM UTC-6, Bustini wrote:
>>
>> Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward lean to 
>> make for a decent (for me) climbing position? 
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Bustini]

Thanks for the great reply and information, Patrick!

On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:47:40 PM UTC-7, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> Dear Bustini, congrats on soon lulling the trigger on an Appaloosa! Sweet! 
> I can't speak to choco-moose bars (though I've come across 
> choco-moose-muffins on occation, but they are another thing entirely. 
> Useful for starting fires in a pinch, once dried though). Grin. Here is 
> some generic bar advice based on my experience with riding drops, Albatross 
> (including inverted), Moustache, Albastache, Boscos, and watching my 
> daughters ride Boscos on their old bikes and now their Clementines.
>
> 1) Arm bend will get you however low you need to go, and the percentage of 
> "need" a low position in a given day on the road/trail is usually pretty 
> low (but headwinds on the open planes are a real buggaboo!). As Valerie 
> alludes to, comfort in the saddle and with the relationship between saddle 
> and bars is more important than getting low. Dial that in, then figure out 
> how to get low when you need to. You'll be stunned how seldom that is, and 
> then how brief it is (again, barring a day riding next to Laura, Mary, Ma, 
> and Pa in their wagon). Grin.
>
> 2) The "wrong" bars from Rivendell are generally "right" or at least 
> workable most of the time. If you find they aren't in enough situations 
> that you are motivated to experiment with your cockpit setup, that's it's 
> own amazing adventure. Mean road, get the bike you want, ride the bars it 
> comes with, get to know them, love what they do well, discover what you 
> wish they did better, scratch your head, and go from there. Grin.
>
> 3) All Grant bars have climbing and descending positions. He and the rest 
> of the elves ride up and down Mount Diablo until Satan's grin looks like 
> Mr. Ed's it's so rutted. Play with them. You'll find them. Where they are 
> may surprise you, but you'll find them.
>
> 4) Have fun!
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
> On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:44:41 PM UTC-6, Bustini wrote:
>>
>> I'm close to buying an Appaloosa, to be used for everything including 
>> loaded touring. There will be plenty of climbing to be done, so my question 
>> is this: Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward 
>> lean to make for a decent (for me) climbing position? And how about a stiff 
>> headwind? Is the position too upright? I really like a rather upright 
>> riding position for most conditions, but I like to crouch when necessary. 
>> Should I consider putting drops on the bike? I know this is all somewhat 
>> subjective, but I could use some sage advice that is based in actual 
>> experience. Thank you all!
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Deacon Patrick]

Dear Bustini, congrats on soon lulling the trigger on an Appaloosa! Sweet! 
I can't speak to choco-moose bars (though I've come across 
choco-moose-muffins on occation, but they are another thing entirely. 
Useful for starting fires in a pinch, once dried though). Grin. Here is 
some generic bar advice based on my experience with riding drops, Albatross 
(including inverted), Moustache, Albastache, Boscos, and watching my 
daughters ride Boscos on their old bikes and now their Clementines.

1) Arm bend will get you however low you need to go, and the percentage of 
"need" a low position in a given day on the road/trail is usually pretty 
low (but headwinds on the open planes are a real buggaboo!). As Valerie 
alludes to, comfort in the saddle and with the relationship between saddle 
and bars is more important than getting low. Dial that in, then figure out 
how to get low when you need to. You'll be stunned how seldom that is, and 
then how brief it is (again, barring a day riding next to Laura, Mary, Ma, 
and Pa in their wagon). Grin.

2) The "wrong" bars from Rivendell are generally "right" or at least 
workable most of the time. If you find they aren't in enough situations 
that you are motivated to experiment with your cockpit setup, that's it's 
own amazing adventure. Mean road, get the bike you want, ride the bars it 
comes with, get to know them, love what they do well, discover what you 
wish they did better, scratch your head, and go from there. Grin.

3) All Grant bars have climbing and descending positions. He and the rest 
of the elves ride up and down Mount Diablo until Satan's grin looks like 
Mr. Ed's it's so rutted. Play with them. You'll find them. Where they are 
may surprise you, but you'll find them.

4) Have fun!

With abandon,
Patrick

On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:44:41 PM UTC-6, Bustini wrote:
>
> I'm close to buying an Appaloosa, to be used for everything including 
> loaded touring. There will be plenty of climbing to be done, so my question 
> is this: Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward 
> lean to make for a decent (for me) climbing position? And how about a stiff 
> headwind? Is the position too upright? I really like a rather upright 
> riding position for most conditions, but I like to crouch when necessary. 
> Should I consider putting drops on the bike? I know this is all somewhat 
> subjective, but I could use some sage advice that is based in actual 
> experience. Thank you all!
>

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[RBW] Re: Bars for Climbing

[Valerie Yates]

I did a loaded tour with a lot of climbing (the San Juan Skyway clockwise 
from Durango) on my Joe and I quite enjoyed the seated, upright climbing 
position. It was completely comfortable and the views were amazing. I think 
the handlebars would allow a more downward angle but, for me, it was the 
saddle that made that position undesirable. A saddle that is comfortable 
sitting upright is not, for me, comfortable leaning forward due to back of 
thigh chafing. So while I normally ride a Brooks B17 Imperial on my drop 
bar bikes, I prefer the Brooks B67 on the Joe -- but only if I am seated 
fairly upright.  I hope that helps!

Val in Boulder, CO



On Monday, September 12, 2016 at 4:44:41 PM UTC-6, Bustini wrote:
>
> Does the Choco-Moose bar allow for enough forward and downward lean to 
> make for a decent (for me) climbing position? 
>

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