[RBW] Re: Suggestions for powerful, silver, light, 57 mm-reach front caliper brake for fixed gear

[Patrick Moore]

Sorry, Mitch, the toe strap is too minimalist and idiosyncratic even for
me.

As an aside, I could flip myself over the bar with the (properly set up)
RGCs with salmons, and I very much like the way they feel, so I suppose
they are all I really want.


On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 6:37 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> Thanks, all. I'm surprised that the response to the Grand Cru sidepulls
> has been so tepid, as they got rave reviews in BQ and by someone on this
> list -- Mark Chandler? -- on his gravel blog. But good warning about the
> aluminum torx nut.
>
> Before I remove these from the top of my list, does anyone else want to
> pipe up in their favor?
>
> I used Tektro 539s on the 2003 Riv, for a while, and was very
> underwhelmed. And I don't care for the extra hardware required for
> centerpulls, at least on this most spare of builds.
>
> Now that I corrected the silly problem that in turn allowed me to adjust
> the brake arm play and lock it in properly, I'm much more inclined just to
> stick with the RGCs, which are suprisingly powerful, modulate very well,
> look very nice and, more, fit the bike's aesthetic, and, well, don't
> require more $ or work. Yes, salmons.
>
> Again, thanks, all.
>
> On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 10:56 AM Patrick Moore 
> wrote:
>
>> I'm curious about alternatives to the RG Comp single pivot for the
>> (single, front) brake for my 1999 Riv fixed gear. The RGC stops well and
>> modulates well but has a habit of loosening, and the allen-head locknut is,
>> as I discovered again yesterday, very finicky to tighten correctly -- I
>> don't seem to be able to tighten firmly it against the pivot nut without
>> binding the arms; IOW, I have to leave the allen locknut loose (applied
>> blue Loctite, though).
>>
>> Therefore the question: If you were relying on a single front caliper,
>> and you like old fashioned and silver, what would you install?
>>
>> In particular, the VO G Cru long-reaches:
>> (
>> https://velo-orange.com/collections/brakes/products/grand-cru-long-reach-brakes
>> )
>>
>> Note: Prefer allen head, but nutted will be considered.
>>
>> I do like dual pivots overall for their power and ease of setup, but too
>> many look klunky and bulky. The VOs aren't bad; what do you-plural think of
>> them?
>>
>> And: If you each individually should have a nice such brake to sell,
>> please do tell me. In particular, if you have a front VO G Cru in silver to
>> sell, I'm interested; I don't want to buy a $170 pair if I don't have to.
>>
>> (And: Refresh my memory: Can I use a nutted rear in front with a longish
>> allen nut? I think I can, but please confirm.)
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> --
>>
>> ---
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>>
>
> --
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: Suggestions for powerful, silver, light, 57 mm-reach front caliper brake for fixed gear

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks, all. I'm surprised that the response to the Grand Cru sidepulls has
been so tepid, as they got rave reviews in BQ and by someone on this list
-- Mark Chandler? -- on his gravel blog. But good warning about the
aluminum torx nut.

Before I remove these from the top of my list, does anyone else want to
pipe up in their favor?

I used Tektro 539s on the 2003 Riv, for a while, and was very underwhelmed.
And I don't care for the extra hardware required for centerpulls, at least
on this most spare of builds.

Now that I corrected the silly problem that in turn allowed me to adjust
the brake arm play and lock it in properly, I'm much more inclined just to
stick with the RGCs, which are suprisingly powerful, modulate very well,
look very nice and, more, fit the bike's aesthetic, and, well, don't
require more $ or work. Yes, salmons.

Again, thanks, all.

On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 10:56 AM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I'm curious about alternatives to the RG Comp single pivot for the
> (single, front) brake for my 1999 Riv fixed gear. The RGC stops well and
> modulates well but has a habit of loosening, and the allen-head locknut is,
> as I discovered again yesterday, very finicky to tighten correctly -- I
> don't seem to be able to tighten firmly it against the pivot nut without
> binding the arms; IOW, I have to leave the allen locknut loose (applied
> blue Loctite, though).
>
> Therefore the question: If you were relying on a single front caliper, and
> you like old fashioned and silver, what would you install?
>
> In particular, the VO G Cru long-reaches:
> (
> https://velo-orange.com/collections/brakes/products/grand-cru-long-reach-brakes
> )
>
> Note: Prefer allen head, but nutted will be considered.
>
> I do like dual pivots overall for their power and ease of setup, but too
> many look klunky and bulky. The VOs aren't bad; what do you-plural think of
> them?
>
> And: If you each individually should have a nice such brake to sell,
> please do tell me. In particular, if you have a front VO G Cru in silver to
> sell, I'm interested; I don't want to buy a $170 pair if I don't have to.
>
> (And: Refresh my memory: Can I use a nutted rear in front with a longish
> allen nut? I think I can, but please confirm.)
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: Suggestions for powerful, silver, light, 57 mm-reach front caliper brake for fixed gear

[Drw]

First time using the new interface. apologies if it's weird. 

Ill concur that the paul racer's are definitely a step above. ive had a 
number of sidepulls, and they were all decent, but the pauls feel much 
grabbier (a good thing for center/sidepulls in my mind) and better at the 
lever. 

I like paul stuff, but try to be realistic about actual performance 
benefits. ex. ive had motolites and deore level shimano v brakes on a 
couple bikes and the differences are minor, for me. The racer centerpull 
definitely felt like a worthy upgrade from tektro sidepulls when i did it.

anecdotally, because the situation wasnt normal braking, the one time i 
almost launched myself over the bars was on a bike with Paul Racers. and i 
have bikes with v brakes and discs. 

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 1:49:59 PM UTC-7 Paul Brodek wrote:

> Reposting from ibob
>
> If you can deal with centerpull, Paul Racer Medium for the win. The 
> caliper itself is as light, or a tad lighter, than some of the dual-pivots, 
> though the extra cabling/stops likely makes it heavier overall. Still, no 
> beating that stopping.
>
> It has been a very long time since I rode with vintage centerpulls, so I 
> can't delve into that species.
>
> After centerpull, comes dual-pivot. My heirarchy for 49-59mm dual-pivot 
> calipers, in order of niceness/performance, is:
>
> 1. VO Grand Cru
> 2. TRP RG957
> 3. Shimano R650
> 4. Shimano R600
> 5. Tektro R539
>
> All of these, with equivalently good brake shoes, will stop better for me 
> than an equivalent single-pivot caliper.
>
> The two Shimano calipers are pretty much identical, the earlier R600 
> doesn't have brake shoe toe-in washers stock. I think maybe the qr mech is 
> a little different? 
>
> VO has the stiffest arms, TRP is close. Shimano not too far behind. Tektro 
> always seem kinda flexy and squishy to me, comparatively. And though the 
> Tektros definitely stop fine, they also feel cheaper overall, have a 
> clunkier/wonkier qr mech as well.
>
> To those who are sensitive to cable pull issues, you may want to explore 
> further which calipers work better with which levers. 
>
> Miche also made, or maybe still makes, a longer-reach dual-pivot caliper. 
> I remember thinking about snagging a set some years back, just to check 'em 
> out, but never did.
>
> Paul Brodek
> Hillsdale, NJ USA
>
> On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 12:57:10 PM UTC-4, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> I'm curious about alternatives to the RG Comp single pivot for the 
>> (single, front) brake for my 1999 Riv fixed gear. The RGC stops well and 
>> modulates well but has a habit of loosening, and the allen-head locknut is, 
>> as I discovered again yesterday, very finicky to tighten correctly -- I 
>> don't seem to be able to tighten firmly it against the pivot nut without 
>> binding the arms; IOW, I have to leave the allen locknut loose (applied 
>> blue Loctite, though). 
>>
>> Therefore the question: If you were relying on a single front caliper, 
>> and you like old fashioned and silver, what would you install?
>>
>> In particular, the VO G Cru long-reaches:
>> (
>> https://velo-orange.com/collections/brakes/products/grand-cru-long-reach-brakes
>> )
>>
>> Note: Prefer allen head, but nutted will be considered.
>>
>> I do like dual pivots overall for their power and ease of setup, but too 
>> many look klunky and bulky. The VOs aren't bad; what do you-plural think of 
>> them?
>>
>> And: If you each individually should have a nice such brake to sell, 
>> please do tell me. In particular, if you have a front VO G Cru in silver to 
>> sell, I'm interested; I don't want to buy a $170 pair if I don't have to.
>>
>> (And: Refresh my memory: Can I use a nutted rear in front with a longish 
>> allen nut? I think I can, but please confirm.)
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> ---
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Suggestions for powerful, silver, light, 57 mm-reach front caliper brake for fixed gear

[Paul Brodek]

Reposting from ibob

If you can deal with centerpull, Paul Racer Medium for the win. The caliper 
itself is as light, or a tad lighter, than some of the dual-pivots, though 
the extra cabling/stops likely makes it heavier overall. Still, no beating 
that stopping.

It has been a very long time since I rode with vintage centerpulls, so I 
can't delve into that species.

After centerpull, comes dual-pivot. My heirarchy for 49-59mm dual-pivot 
calipers, in order of niceness/performance, is:

1. VO Grand Cru
2. TRP RG957
3. Shimano R650
4. Shimano R600
5. Tektro R539

All of these, with equivalently good brake shoes, will stop better for me 
than an equivalent single-pivot caliper.

The two Shimano calipers are pretty much identical, the earlier R600 
doesn't have brake shoe toe-in washers stock. I think maybe the qr mech is 
a little different? 

VO has the stiffest arms, TRP is close. Shimano not too far behind. Tektro 
always seem kinda flexy and squishy to me, comparatively. And though the 
Tektros definitely stop fine, they also feel cheaper overall, have a 
clunkier/wonkier qr mech as well.

To those who are sensitive to cable pull issues, you may want to explore 
further which calipers work better with which levers. 

Miche also made, or maybe still makes, a longer-reach dual-pivot caliper. I 
remember thinking about snagging a set some years back, just to check 'em 
out, but never did.

Paul Brodek
Hillsdale, NJ USA

On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 12:57:10 PM UTC-4, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> I'm curious about alternatives to the RG Comp single pivot for the 
> (single, front) brake for my 1999 Riv fixed gear. The RGC stops well and 
> modulates well but has a habit of loosening, and the allen-head locknut is, 
> as I discovered again yesterday, very finicky to tighten correctly -- I 
> don't seem to be able to tighten firmly it against the pivot nut without 
> binding the arms; IOW, I have to leave the allen locknut loose (applied 
> blue Loctite, though). 
>
> Therefore the question: If you were relying on a single front caliper, and 
> you like old fashioned and silver, what would you install?
>
> In particular, the VO G Cru long-reaches:
> (
> https://velo-orange.com/collections/brakes/products/grand-cru-long-reach-brakes
> )
>
> Note: Prefer allen head, but nutted will be considered.
>
> I do like dual pivots overall for their power and ease of setup, but too 
> many look klunky and bulky. The VOs aren't bad; what do you-plural think of 
> them?
>
> And: If you each individually should have a nice such brake to sell, 
> please do tell me. In particular, if you have a front VO G Cru in silver to 
> sell, I'm interested; I don't want to buy a $170 pair if I don't have to.
>
> (And: Refresh my memory: Can I use a nutted rear in front with a longish 
> allen nut? I think I can, but please confirm.)
>
> Thanks.
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Suggestions for powerful, silver, light, 57 mm-reach front caliper brake for fixed gear

[Shoji Takahashi]

Hi Patrick,
For my AHH, I've used Tektro/Silver long reach from Riv and Paul Racer 
(Center Pull). I really like the Pauls for brake feel and setup... but 
those are even $$$pendier(?) than VO Gran Cru!

Good luck,
Shoji



On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 12:57:10 PM UTC-4, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> I'm curious about alternatives to the RG Comp single pivot for the 
> (single, front) brake for my 1999 Riv fixed gear. The RGC stops well and 
> modulates well but has a habit of loosening, and the allen-head locknut is, 
> as I discovered again yesterday, very finicky to tighten correctly -- I 
> don't seem to be able to tighten firmly it against the pivot nut without 
> binding the arms; IOW, I have to leave the allen locknut loose (applied 
> blue Loctite, though). 
>
> Therefore the question: If you were relying on a single front caliper, and 
> you like old fashioned and silver, what would you install?
>
> In particular, the VO G Cru long-reaches:
> (
> https://velo-orange.com/collections/brakes/products/grand-cru-long-reach-brakes
>  
> 
> )
>
> Note: Prefer allen head, but nutted will be considered.
>
> I do like dual pivots overall for their power and ease of setup, but too 
> many look klunky and bulky. The VOs aren't bad; what do you-plural think of 
> them?
>
> And: If you each individually should have a nice such brake to sell, 
> please do tell me. In particular, if you have a front VO G Cru in silver to 
> sell, I'm interested; I don't want to buy a $170 pair if I don't have to.
>
> (And: Refresh my memory: Can I use a nutted rear in front with a longish 
> allen nut? I think I can, but please confirm.)
>
> Thanks.
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Suggestions for powerful, silver, light, 57 mm-reach front caliper brake for fixed gear

[Brian Campbell]

These look to be in ballpark

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tektro-R737-Long-Reach-Road-Caliper-Set-47-57mm-Silver/174333486467?epid=1137973691=item289715e583:g:NUMAAOSwelhe-1or

If
On Tuesday, July 28, 2020 at 1:37:13 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:

> This just in: Fixed loosening locknut problem by fixing another. What it 
> is I am ashamed to reveal on list. But the RGC caliper seems to be back to 
> design normal.
>
> But, still interested in hearing your opinions about your favorite front 
> calipers, and about the VO GC dual pivot in particular.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Patrick "Learning about his mistakes again, and again, and again, and 
> again, and again ..." Moore
>
> On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 10:56 AM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
>> I'm curious about alternatives to the RG Comp single pivot for the 
>> (single, front) brake for my 1999 Riv fixed gear. The RGC stops well and 
>> modulates well but has a habit of loosening, and the allen-head locknut is, 
>> as I discovered again yesterday, very finicky to tighten correctly -- I 
>> don't seem to be able to tighten firmly it against the pivot nut without 
>> binding the arms; IOW, I have to leave the allen locknut loose (applied 
>> blue Loctite, though). 
>>
>> Therefore the question: If you were relying on a single front caliper, 
>> and you like old fashioned and silver, what would you install?
>>
>> In particular, the VO G Cru long-reaches:
>> (
>> https://velo-orange.com/collections/brakes/products/grand-cru-long-reach-brakes
>> )
>>
>> Note: Prefer allen head, but nutted will be considered.
>>
>> I do like dual pivots overall for their power and ease of setup, but too 
>> many look klunky and bulky. The VOs aren't bad; what do you-plural think of 
>> them?
>>
>> And: If you each individually should have a nice such brake to sell, 
>> please do tell me. In particular, if you have a front VO G Cru in silver to 
>> sell, I'm interested; I don't want to buy a $170 pair if I don't have to.
>>
>> (And: Refresh my memory: Can I use a nutted rear in front with a longish 
>> allen nut? I think I can, but please confirm.)
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> ---
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Suggestions for powerful, silver, light, 57 mm-reach front caliper brake for fixed gear

[Patrick Moore]

This just in: Fixed loosening locknut problem by fixing another. What it is
I am ashamed to reveal on list. But the RGC caliper seems to be back to
design normal.

But, still interested in hearing your opinions about your favorite front
calipers, and about the VO GC dual pivot in particular.

Thanks.

Patrick "Learning about his mistakes again, and again, and again, and
again, and again ..." Moore

On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 10:56 AM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I'm curious about alternatives to the RG Comp single pivot for the
> (single, front) brake for my 1999 Riv fixed gear. The RGC stops well and
> modulates well but has a habit of loosening, and the allen-head locknut is,
> as I discovered again yesterday, very finicky to tighten correctly -- I
> don't seem to be able to tighten firmly it against the pivot nut without
> binding the arms; IOW, I have to leave the allen locknut loose (applied
> blue Loctite, though).
>
> Therefore the question: If you were relying on a single front caliper, and
> you like old fashioned and silver, what would you install?
>
> In particular, the VO G Cru long-reaches:
> (
> https://velo-orange.com/collections/brakes/products/grand-cru-long-reach-brakes
> )
>
> Note: Prefer allen head, but nutted will be considered.
>
> I do like dual pivots overall for their power and ease of setup, but too
> many look klunky and bulky. The VOs aren't bad; what do you-plural think of
> them?
>
> And: If you each individually should have a nice such brake to sell,
> please do tell me. In particular, if you have a front VO G Cru in silver to
> sell, I'm interested; I don't want to buy a $170 pair if I don't have to.
>
> (And: Refresh my memory: Can I use a nutted rear in front with a longish
> allen nut? I think I can, but please confirm.)
>
> Thanks.
>
> --
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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