Re: [RE-wrenches] Inverter On/Off Switch use Outback FX

[Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches]

We have used Dwyer Instrument coils in the past. They detect AC current flow 
and have contacts you can wire for operation of other circuitry. They have 
quite a range of devices and you may find one suitable for your needs.

Good luck!

 

 

Best regards,

 

Glenn Burt

glb, Consulting Company

1949 East Road

Bennington, VT 05201

glenn.b...@glbcc.com  

(518) 681-2274

 

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional TM

VT Special Electrician EL-06979

Microsoft Certified Professional

Member IEEE

 

 

 

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of 
Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
Sent: Sunday, July 30, 2023 12:37 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Inverter On/Off Switch use Outback FX

 

Do you have a source for voltage sensing coils? I only know about using the 
Morningstar relay driver. 

 

Thank you,

 

Drake 

 

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810

CO Master Electrician’s License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

 

 

On 2023-07-21 07:10, Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches wrote:

To avoid power relay, how about adding a voltage sensing coil on the AC input 
and have an NC contactor that opens on voltage in series with the inverter 
shutdown circuit.  This should interrupt the inverter shutdown any time the 
generator is on.

 

On Thu, Jul 20, 2023 at 6:00 PM Ray Walters via RE-wrenches 
mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> > 
wrote:

I've done the AC relay idea as well, on Schneider that didn't have the easy off 
switching like the Outbacks.  The problems are:
1) Much bigger relay, much higher current on the control side as well.  It 
required a relay for the relay.
2) If there's a malfunction, you are messing with the main feeders for the 
home. 
3) The inverters are still on with their no load draw, a pair of VFX inverters, 
would be 45 to 50 watts, so you could still shut the batteries down. 

I think in your case without AGS, the trick might be to add a bypass control 
switch parallel to the relay, so they can manually turn the inverters back on.  

Ray

On 7/20/2023 5:15 PM, Jay wrote:

Hi Ray

 

This house won't have an AGS, manual start only. 

 

And your comments exactly, having to wait until the next day when hopefully 
there is enough sun to charge the battery is iffy. 

 

Or they could do the inverter bypass switch. 

 

Again I'm back to why is it a worse idea to install a relay on the AC? 

 

Thx

 

Jay

 

As to the sol ark which I never thought about it being in a sense an AC coupled 
system. IE if the inverter is off it won't charge. 

I guess you'll have to install an external  battery charger?

 

 

 





On Jul 20, 2023, at 5:08 PM, Ray Walters via RE-wrenches  
  
wrote:

The aux off is only if the generator doesn't start.  You need to set the gen 
start voltage higher. Aux off is last ditch shut down, set for 44v for lead 
acid, or 47 to 49v, depending on the battery and inverter.   Hopefully DC 
coupled PV will raise the voltage enough to turn the inverters back on the next 
day.  

This is my concern on Solark installs, I just noticed that the inverter won't 
pass through PV, if it hits its LVD set point.  

On 7/20/2023 3:04 PM, jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

HI All, 

 

I wanted to revisit this thread for one reason.

 

If you turn off the inverter at the remote on/off with the AUX relay, then 
starting the generator won't have any impact as the inverter is off.  

So someone will have to go and reset the AUX relay.

 

Vs

 

If you do a relay on the AC output, when you start the generator, it will start 
charging, raising the battery volts, causing the AUX relay to close AC output 
relay and you'll have power in the house.

 

Am I missing something?

 

thanks

 

jay

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here is the last email I think:

 

Mac,
 

I think you've got an elegant solution to the problem. All you need is an 
inexpensive relay and to program the Aux output for loadshed. I believe 
shutting down the inverter with the remote on/off contacts is actually less 
stressful on the inverter than opening a relay or contactor on the load side. 

Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar
 
 
On 7/11/2023 5:19 PM, Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hello Wrenches,
 

I'm trying to solve an issue with an older Outback FX system.  It's a quad 
stack of Outback 3648 FX inverters and he has a couple of Fortress eVault and 
an unreliable generator. The LBCO setting can't go high enough to cut out 
before the eVaults cut out so he occasionally will have to direct charge the 
eVault to get things running again.I'd like to use a 12V Aux relay logic to 
trip the primary inverter on/off contacts before we go into battery shutdown so 
the solar has a chance to recover the system.  Pretty simple overall but I 
wanted to see if there are any known ill effects of doing this with substantial 
load on the system. 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Sol-Ark 15k Conduit Entries

[Lou Russo via RE-wrenches]

Hello All,

Super impressive install, Michael. Almost worth a flight, and a site visit!
Back to Jason's initial question

If you are using the 15kW Outdoor Sol-Ark they vent from the top and bottom
with a required 6" minimum spacing on both the top and bottom.

A 12kW Outdoor with 8x8 gutter and 1" offset nipples have worked great for
us.

Aloha,

Lou Russo
(808) 345 6762



On Thu, Aug 3, 2023 at 7:09 AM Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches <
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:

> Hi Drake,
> Those are single phase combiner panels. I would have loved to set this up
> as a three phase system, but there was already a mile of underground single
> phase run throughout the property. We ended up running a half mile 15KV
> line from the power site to the estate. This is an aside, it's kind of hard
> to see, but for seperation, we attached  the pv circuits to the back of the
> gutter using through bolted adhesive backed cable tie holders. Often we use
> gutter dividers. They originate in the tall cabinet at the end which houses
> controls, secondary PV disconnects, AC and DC egauges, Tigo hub, Battery
> hub and (Lynk II). On the opposite end is a similar cabinet for the
> collection and distribution of AC circuits. Also, above and below the
> batteries are small gutters for communications and CT wires that run from
> the transfer switches to eguage. One transfer switch to alternate usage
> (alternating relay) or bypass between Gen 1 and Gen 2, and the other switch
> to select inverter or generator power, locally or remotely. In the AC
> cabinet there is a 400a contactor and time delay relay to achieve a
> generator cooldown as the janky Sol-Arks don't do that and it's hell on new
> diesels not to have that function.
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2023 at 7:50 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches <
> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>
>> That looks really nice. How were you able to put 8 Sol Arc inverters on a
>> 3 phase panel? Tech support told me that inverters had to be connected in
>> groups of 3.
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Drake
>>
>>
>> *Drake Chamberlin*
>>
>> *Athens Electric LLC*
>>
>> *Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810*
>>
>> *CO Master Electrician’s License 4526*
>>
>> *NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional*
>> ---
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2023-08-02 14:19, Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches wrote:
>>
>> 10x10 gutter. Notice within, a 2.5x2.5 gutter for comms. 1 x 2.5" nipples
>> work well. Chase nipples wont due to door clearance. I've also cut the
>> bottoms out of the Sol-Arks and a corresponding square window in the
>> gutter,  placed a 1/4" rubber gasket between the two. We do that when we
>> have many VFD's over a gutter. Someone a while ago asked for a picture
>> showing how we make long bussbars. This one is 24' long.
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 2, 2023 at 10:08 AM Jerry Shafer via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> Jason
>> In plenty of applications l will use couplers with chase nipples, height
>> is one issue but installed working height is very important. I use a 8"x8"x
>> X gutter and sometimes even off set that from the wall, l have had AHJ not
>> want to see mixed cables LVDC and AC in the same conduit so pass through
>> the battery conductors right out the bottom and to the battery. I just
>> create a template for punching into the gutter, looks clean and is safe
>> with easy access to the display
>> Fun times
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 2, 2023, 8:04 AM Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> I see a lot of pictures with conduit nipples coming out of a gutter that
>> are fairly long. I have a height limit issue and I'm wondering if there are
>> any negative implications of using very short nipples between a wireway
>> below and the inverter. I'm thinking about using close nipples or perhaps
>> 2-in nipples if I have enough room.
>>
>> If there are any practical reasons that this will not work well, please
>> let me know.
>>
>> Jason Szumlanski
>> Florida Solar Design Group
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