Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches]

Multiple battery banks of different topology work fine charging and 
discharging. Think about how you can do it and not how you can't.


Any takers?

-

John Blittersdorf via RE-wrenches [4] Thu, 06 Apr 2023 15:06:08 -0700 
[5]


Multiple battery banks work well as long as you are consuming.  When
charging the charge parameters change.  I'm running 8 Interstate L16's, 
1

Fortress e-flex, And 3 Simpliphi 3.8. With big switches between them.  I
was using all three but changing charge parameters on
My two controllers and inverter got to be too much trouble.  I ran all 
with
lithium settings but I'm retiring the L16s and putting in a second 
eFlex.
 2 eFlex or 3 Simpliphis do a great job replacing the 8.  The 3 
simpliphis

will be leaving for their summer home at a fishing club. Hi

John B

On 2023-04-06 8:43 am, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches 
wrote:


And the next step for hi reliability offgrid is to have both types of 
battery in there own independent inverter power systems. Just switch 
the DC bus from one power system or the other. I like the LFP just 
turned off sitting as a spare power system. You can rotate or do a 
monthly test like it is a genset.


This is also a good way to use up the old flooded and retire it when it 
becomes useless and ready to recycle. Some LFP manufactures do provide 
a spare BMS but probably better to just have an extra battery at the 
offgrid home.


Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2023-04-05 6:30 pm, Scot Arey via RE-wrenches wrote:

Just attended the NABCEP conference last week and took in CEU classes 
from Rolls and Midnite on battery charging and design. Just awesome 
classes and I walked away thinking the FLA were kind of like my old 7.3 
Powerstroke diesel…I could work on them and could see when issues were 
developing. The lithium batteries are kind of like my 6.7 PSD. Great 
power, fast but when something happens with a BMS…no idea except to go 
to the manufacturer.


Just wanted to share this after reading your awesome post.

Scot

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf 
Of Tump via RE-wrenches

Sent: Wednesday, April 5, 2023 6:24 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Tump 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery 
bank


I would suggest that adding additional batteries to increase battery 
voltages is fine 48 to 54V or what ever, I too have used this many 
times on very remote sites. Please also increase your inverters hi 
voltage cut out settings, as this can be a real bummer having the 
system shut down in full sun.


Another thing; IF you have battery strings,  cables of equal length 
from each string should be connected to a buss bar then buss bar to 
inverter or inverters, this will reduce wiring headaches, voltage drop 
as well as providing equal charging to all strings. (depending on 
internal resistance).


I would also suggest fewer batteries of bigger cells. My preference is 
2 volt cells, less holes to water, less copper interconnects. Yeah 
there heavy but for hi charging & discharging, a large battery is 
always my choice.  OR the Surrette 6CS25P has been the MOST reliable 
battery Surrette has put out. After almost 30 + years of installing 
their batteries this one has been the best. They do have a EX series 2 
Volt cell that has the same plate thickness as the 6 CS but I have had 
issues w/ them. IF you are using the EX 2 volt check the polarity PRIOR 
to installing them & mark the positive side. I have had the plastic 
covers installed incorrectly and it plays havoc on your install.


Yep LEADITE I am, refractometer and a DVOM and I have a client that can 
spot problems way before things become critical. AND that Surrette 
warrantee Pit BULL Mr. Higgins & your client will be very happy when 
Steve OKs a replacement because you have recorded your Spg readings.


My $.02 TUMP

On Apr 5, 2023, at 5:26 PM, greg egan via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


Danny, My experience is if you are careful and use equal length 
conductors for all 3 strings you can get good results.  The main 
problem I have with 3 strings of 6 V cells @ 48 vdc is leaving the 
customer with 72 cells to check and fill.  That's a lot of work if you 
don't have a watering system.


I totally get why you'd want to give them 2 strings in case they lose a 
battery or 2.  Most of my off grid customers live quite a ways from the 
battery store and it's not uncommon for it to take a month to get 
replacements - during the best of times.


Another option I've done is give them a string of 25 - 2V cells for a 
48V system.   You just set the charging parameters accordingly and go.  
That way if they lose a cell or two, the remaining battery bank should 
be able to keep them limping along until the r

Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[John Blittersdorf via RE-wrenches]

Multiple battery banks work well as long as you are consuming.  When
charging the charge parameters change.  I’m running 8 Interstate L16’s, 1
Fortress e-flex, And 3 Simpliphi 3.8. With big switches between them.  I
was using all three but changing charge parameters on
My two controllers and inverter got to be too much trouble.  I ran all with
lithium settings but I’m retiring the L16s and putting in a second eFlex.
 2 eFlex or 3 Simpliphis do a great job replacing the 8.  The 3 simpliphis
will be leaving for their summer home at a fishing club. Hi

John B




On Thu, Apr 6, 2023 at 11:50 AM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches
 wrote:

> And the next step for hi reliability offgrid is to have both types of
> battery in there own independent inverter power systems. Just switch the DC
> bus from one power system or the other. I like the LFP just turned off
> sitting as a spare power system. You can rotate or do a monthly test like
> it is a genset.
>
> This is also a good way to use up the old flooded and retire it when it
> becomes useless and ready to recycle. Some LFP manufactures do provide a
> spare BMS but probably better to just have an extra battery at the offgrid
> home.
>
>
>
> *Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
> "we go where powerlines don't"
> http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ <http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/>
> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net 
> text 209 813 0060*
>
>
> On 2023-04-05 6:30 pm, Scot Arey via RE-wrenches wrote:
>
> Just attended the NABCEP conference last week and took in CEU classes from
> Rolls and Midnite on battery charging and design. Just awesome classes and
> I walked away thinking the FLA were kind of like my old 7.3 Powerstroke
> diesel…I could work on them and could see when issues were developing. The
> lithium batteries are kind of like my 6.7 PSD. Great power, fast but when
> something happens with a BMS…no idea except to go to the manufacturer.
>
>
>
> Just wanted to share this after reading your awesome post.
>
>
>
> Scot
>
>
>
> *From:* RE-wrenches  *On
> Behalf Of *Tump via RE-wrenches
> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 5, 2023 6:24 PM
> *To:* RE-wrenches 
> *Cc:* Tump 
> *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery
> bank
>
>
>
> I would suggest that adding additional batteries to increase battery
> voltages is fine 48 to 54V or what ever, I too have used this many times on
> very remote sites. Please also increase your inverters hi voltage cut out
> settings, as this can be a real bummer having the system shut down in full
> sun.
>
> Another thing; IF you have battery strings,  cables of equal length from
> each string should be connected to a buss bar then buss bar to inverter or
> inverters, this will reduce wiring headaches, voltage drop as well as
> providing equal charging to all strings. (depending on internal resistance).
>
> I would also suggest fewer batteries of bigger cells. My preference is 2
> volt cells, less holes to water, less copper interconnects. Yeah there
> heavy but for hi charging & discharging, a large battery is always my
> choice.  OR the Surrette 6CS25P has been the MOST reliable battery Surrette
> has put out. After almost 30 + years of installing their batteries this one
> has been the best. They do have a EX series 2 Volt cell that has the same
> plate thickness as the 6 CS but I have had issues w/ them. IF you are using
> the EX 2 volt check the polarity PRIOR to installing them & mark the
> positive side. I have had the plastic covers installed incorrectly and it
> plays havoc on your install.
>
> Yep LEADITE I am, refractometer and a DVOM and I have a client that can
> spot problems way before things become critical. AND that Surrette
> warrantee Pit BULL Mr. Higgins & your client will be very happy when Steve
> OKs a replacement because you have recorded your Spg readings.
>
> My $.02 TUMP
>
>
>
> On Apr 5, 2023, at 5:26 PM, greg egan via RE-wrenches <
> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> Danny, My experience is if you are careful and use *equal length
> conductors* for all 3 strings you can get good results.  The main problem
> I have with 3 strings of 6 V cells @ 48 vdc is leaving the customer with 72
> cells to check and fill.  That's a lot of work if you don't have a watering
> system.
>
> I totally get why you'd want to give them 2 strings in case they lose a
> battery or 2.  Most of my off grid customers live quite a ways from the
> battery store and it's not uncommon for it to take a month to get
> replacements - during the best of times.
>
> Another option I've done is give them a string of 25 - 2V cells for a 48V
> system.   Y

Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches]

And the next step for hi reliability offgrid is to have both types of 
battery in there own independent inverter power systems. Just switch the 
DC bus from one power system or the other. I like the LFP just turned 
off sitting as a spare power system. You can rotate or do a monthly test 
like it is a genset.


This is also a good way to use up the old flooded and retire it when it 
becomes useless and ready to recycle. Some LFP manufactures do provide a 
spare BMS but probably better to just have an extra battery at the 
offgrid home.


Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2023-04-05 6:30 pm, Scot Arey via RE-wrenches wrote:

Just attended the NABCEP conference last week and took in CEU classes 
from Rolls and Midnite on battery charging and design. Just awesome 
classes and I walked away thinking the FLA were kind of like my old 7.3 
Powerstroke diesel…I could work on them and could see when issues were 
developing. The lithium batteries are kind of like my 6.7 PSD. Great 
power, fast but when something happens with a BMS…no idea except to go 
to the manufacturer.


Just wanted to share this after reading your awesome post.

Scot

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf 
Of Tump via RE-wrenches

Sent: Wednesday, April 5, 2023 6:24 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Tump 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery 
bank


I would suggest that adding additional batteries to increase battery 
voltages is fine 48 to 54V or what ever, I too have used this many 
times on very remote sites. Please also increase your inverters hi 
voltage cut out settings, as this can be a real bummer having the 
system shut down in full sun.


Another thing; IF you have battery strings,  cables of equal length 
from each string should be connected to a buss bar then buss bar to 
inverter or inverters, this will reduce wiring headaches, voltage drop 
as well as providing equal charging to all strings. (depending on 
internal resistance).


I would also suggest fewer batteries of bigger cells. My preference is 
2 volt cells, less holes to water, less copper interconnects. Yeah 
there heavy but for hi charging & discharging, a large battery is 
always my choice.  OR the Surrette 6CS25P has been the MOST reliable 
battery Surrette has put out. After almost 30 + years of installing 
their batteries this one has been the best. They do have a EX series 2 
Volt cell that has the same plate thickness as the 6 CS but I have had 
issues w/ them. IF you are using the EX 2 volt check the polarity PRIOR 
to installing them & mark the positive side. I have had the plastic 
covers installed incorrectly and it plays havoc on your install.


Yep LEADITE I am, refractometer and a DVOM and I have a client that can 
spot problems way before things become critical. AND that Surrette 
warrantee Pit BULL Mr. Higgins & your client will be very happy when 
Steve OKs a replacement because you have recorded your Spg readings.


My $.02 TUMP

On Apr 5, 2023, at 5:26 PM, greg egan via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


Danny, My experience is if you are careful and use equal length 
conductors for all 3 strings you can get good results.  The main 
problem I have with 3 strings of 6 V cells @ 48 vdc is leaving the 
customer with 72 cells to check and fill.  That's a lot of work if you 
don't have a watering system.


I totally get why you'd want to give them 2 strings in case they lose 
a battery or 2.  Most of my off grid customers live quite a ways from 
the battery store and it's not uncommon for it to take a month to get 
replacements - during the best of times.


Another option I've done is give them a string of 25 - 2V cells for a 
48V system.   You just set the charging parameters accordingly and go. 
 That way if they lose a cell or two, the remaining battery bank 
should be able to keep them limping along until the replacement 
battery(s) show up.  Need to check and make sure your charge 
controller and inverter can charge at the slightly higher V but 
usually that's not a problem.


Best,

Greg Egan
Remote Power Inc.

g...@remotepowerinc.com

Message: 1

Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 20:45:44 +

From: Daniel Young 

To: "offgridso...@sti.net" , RE-wrenches



Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

Message-ID:



Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a 
different battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I 
researched it and asked my peers.


The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really 
want to go down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two Rolls 
under the prorated warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful years 
out of the bank before planning to replace.


Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays 
pric

Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Scot Arey via RE-wrenches]

Just attended the NABCEP conference last week and took in CEU classes from
Rolls and Midnite on battery charging and design. Just awesome classes and I
walked away thinking the FLA were kind of like my old 7.3 Powerstroke
diesel.I could work on them and could see when issues were developing. The
lithium batteries are kind of like my 6.7 PSD. Great power, fast but when
something happens with a BMS.no idea except to go to the manufacturer.

 

Just wanted to share this after reading your awesome post.

 

Scot

 

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of
Tump via RE-wrenches
Sent: Wednesday, April 5, 2023 6:24 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Tump 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

 

I would suggest that adding additional batteries to increase battery
voltages is fine 48 to 54V or what ever, I too have used this many times on
very remote sites. Please also increase your inverters hi voltage cut out
settings, as this can be a real bummer having the system shut down in full
sun. 

Another thing; IF you have battery strings,  cables of equal length from
each string should be connected to a buss bar then buss bar to inverter or
inverters, this will reduce wiring headaches, voltage drop as well as
providing equal charging to all strings. (depending on internal resistance).

I would also suggest fewer batteries of bigger cells. My preference is 2
volt cells, less holes to water, less copper interconnects. Yeah there heavy
but for hi charging & discharging, a large battery is always my choice.  OR
the Surrette 6CS25P has been the MOST reliable battery Surrette has put out.
After almost 30 + years of installing their batteries this one has been the
best. They do have a EX series 2 Volt cell that has the same plate thickness
as the 6 CS but I have had issues w/ them. IF you are using the EX 2 volt
check the polarity PRIOR to installing them & mark the positive side. I have
had the plastic covers installed incorrectly and it plays havoc on your
install.

Yep LEADITE I am, refractometer and a DVOM and I have a client that can spot
problems way before things become critical. AND that Surrette warrantee Pit
BULL Mr. Higgins & your client will be very happy when Steve OKs a
replacement because you have recorded your Spg readings.

My $.02 TUMP

  

On Apr 5, 2023, at 5:26 PM, greg egan via RE-wrenches
mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> > wrote:

 

Danny, My experience is if you are careful and use equal length conductors
for all 3 strings you can get good results.  The main problem I have with 3
strings of 6 V cells @ 48 vdc is leaving the customer with 72 cells to check
and fill.  That's a lot of work if you don't have a watering system.  

I totally get why you'd want to give them 2 strings in case they lose a
battery or 2.  Most of my off grid customers live quite a ways from the
battery store and it's not uncommon for it to take a month to get
replacements - during the best of times.  

Another option I've done is give them a string of 25 - 2V cells for a 48V
system.   You just set the charging parameters accordingly and go.  That way
if they lose a cell or two, the remaining battery bank should be able to
keep them limping along until the replacement battery(s) show up.  Need to
check and make sure your charge controller and inverter can charge at the
slightly higher V but usually that's not a problem.  

Best,

Greg Egan
Remote Power Inc.

g...@remotepowerinc.com <mailto:g...@remotepowerinc.com> 






Message: 1
Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 20:45:44 +
From: Daniel Young  <mailto:da...@sesre.com> 
To:  <mailto:offgridso...@sti.net> "offgridso...@sti.net"
<mailto:offgridso...@sti.net> , RE-wrenches
   <mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>

Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank
Message-ID:
 
<mailto:bl1pr12mb5921cde5991f65fa842bc82cbb...@bl1pr12mb5921.namprd12.prod.o
utlook.com>

  
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
 
Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a different
battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I researched it and
asked my peers.
 
The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really want to
go down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two Rolls under the
prorated warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful years out of the bank
before planning to replace.
 
Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays prices. So
he knows roughly where he is heading.
 
Side note: I am in the camp of trying for 2 x strings when possible (agree
that 3 x strings is the absolute limit, and not the best option), simply
because if a single cell goes bad, I don?t want a client with essentially
nothing available until we can get a replacement and get on site. With 2
strings, they can make due at least. That?ll go out the window with Lithium
though. Looking at Fortress Powe

Re: [RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Tump via RE-wrenches]

I would suggest that adding additional batteries to increase battery voltages 
is fine 48 to 54V or what ever, I too have used this many times on very remote 
sites. Please also increase your inverters hi voltage cut out settings, as this 
can be a real bummer having the system shut down in full sun. 
Another thing; IF you have battery strings,  cables of equal length from each 
string should be connected to a buss bar then buss bar to inverter or 
inverters, this will reduce wiring headaches, voltage drop as well as providing 
equal charging to all strings. (depending on internal resistance).
I would also suggest fewer batteries of bigger cells. My preference is 2 volt 
cells, less holes to water, less copper interconnects. Yeah there heavy but for 
hi charging & discharging, a large battery is always my choice.  OR the 
Surrette 6CS25P has been the MOST reliable battery Surrette has put out. After 
almost 30 + years of installing their batteries this one has been the best. 
They do have a EX series 2 Volt cell that has the same plate thickness as the 6 
CS but I have had issues w/ them. IF you are using the EX 2 volt check the 
polarity PRIOR to installing them & mark the positive side. I have had the 
plastic covers installed incorrectly and it plays havoc on your install.
Yep LEADITE I am, refractometer and a DVOM and I have a client that can spot 
problems way before things become critical. AND that Surrette warrantee Pit 
BULL Mr. Higgins & your client will be very happy when Steve OKs a replacement 
because you have recorded your Spg readings.
My $.02 TUMP
  
> On Apr 5, 2023, at 5:26 PM, greg egan via RE-wrenches 
>  > wrote:
> 
> Danny, My experience is if you are careful and use equal length conductors 
> for all 3 strings you can get good results.  The main problem I have with 3 
> strings of 6 V cells @ 48 vdc is leaving the customer with 72 cells to check 
> and fill.  That's a lot of work if you don't have a watering system.  
> 
> I totally get why you'd want to give them 2 strings in case they lose a 
> battery or 2.  Most of my off grid customers live quite a ways from the 
> battery store and it's not uncommon for it to take a month to get 
> replacements - during the best of times.  
> 
> Another option I've done is give them a string of 25 - 2V cells for a 48V 
> system.   You just set the charging parameters accordingly and go.  That way 
> if they lose a cell or two, the remaining battery bank should be able to keep 
> them limping along until the replacement battery(s) show up.  Need to check 
> and make sure your charge controller and inverter can charge at the slightly 
> higher V but usually that's not a problem.  
> 
> Best,
> 
> Greg Egan
> Remote Power Inc.
> 
> g...@remotepowerinc.com 
> 
> 
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 20:45:44 +
> From: Daniel Young  
> To: "offgridso...@sti.net"  
>  , RE-wrenches
>
> 
> Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank
> Message-ID:
>   
> 
>  
> 
>   
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a different 
> battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I researched it and 
> asked my peers.
> 
> The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really want to 
> go down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two Rolls under the 
> prorated warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful years out of the bank 
> before planning to replace.
> 
> Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays prices. So 
> he knows roughly where he is heading.
> 
> Side note: I am in the camp of trying for 2 x strings when possible (agree 
> that 3 x strings is the absolute limit, and not the best option), simply 
> because if a single cell goes bad, I don?t want a client with essentially 
> nothing available until we can get a replacement and get on site. With 2 
> strings, they can make due at least. That?ll go out the window with Lithium 
> though. Looking at Fortress Power for the next battery bank for this client. 
> But we will see what changes in the market by the time it?s needed.
> 
> With Regards,
> --
> 
> Danny Young
> NABCEP PV Installation Professional #031508-90
> Engineering Team Lead
> Solar Energy Solutions
> Lexington | Louisville | Bloomington | Cincinnati | Evansville | Indianapolis
> 513-448-5176 (mobile)
> 877-312-7456 (Main Office)
> da...@sesre.com  
> ___
> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
> 
> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org 
> 
> 
>

[RE-wrenches] RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[greg egan via RE-wrenches]

Danny, My experience is if you are careful and use _equal length 
conductors_ for all 3 strings you can get good results.  The main 
problem I have with 3 strings of 6 V cells @ 48 vdc is leaving the 
customer with 72 cells to check and fill.  That's a lot of work if you 
don't have a watering system.


I totally get why you'd want to give them 2 strings in case they lose a 
battery or 2.  Most of my off grid customers live quite a ways from the 
battery store and it's not uncommon for it to take a month to get 
replacements - during the best of times.


Another option I've done is give them a string of 25 - 2V cells for a 
48V system.   You just set the charging parameters accordingly and go.  
That way if they lose a cell or two, the remaining battery bank should 
be able to keep them limping along until the replacement battery(s) show 
up.  Need to check and _make sure_ your charge controller and inverter 
can charge at the slightly higher V but usually that's not a problem.


Best,

Greg Egan
Remote Power Inc.

g...@remotepowerinc.com



Message: 1
Date: Tue, 4 Apr 2023 20:45:44 +
From: Daniel Young
To:"offgridso...@sti.net"  , RE-wrenches

Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank
Message-ID:



Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a different 
battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I researched it and 
asked my peers.

The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really want to go 
down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two Rolls under the prorated 
warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful years out of the bank before 
planning to replace.

Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays prices. So he 
knows roughly where he is heading.

Side note: I am in the camp of trying for 2 x strings when possible (agree that 
3 x strings is the absolute limit, and not the best option), simply because if 
a single cell goes bad, I don?t want a client with essentially nothing 
available until we can get a replacement and get on site. With 2 strings, they 
can make due at least. That?ll go out the window with Lithium though. Looking 
at Fortress Power for the next battery bank for this client. But we will see 
what changes in the market by the time it?s needed.

With Regards,
--

Danny Young
NABCEP PV Installation Professional #031508-90
Engineering Team Lead
Solar Energy Solutions
Lexington | Louisville | Bloomington | Cincinnati | Evansville | Indianapolis
513-448-5176 (mobile)
877-312-7456 (Main Office)
da...@sesre.com
___
List sponsored by Redwood Alliance

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