Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP
I've run a 3 HP well pump off a pair of Outbacks, but make sure you have plenty of battery behind it. We had shut downs from low voltage, when the batteries were at 50% charge from the starting surge. My experience with Magnum has been good, and they have even more surge current than the Outbacks. Yet another thing to consider is changing the load. That saw might work just fine with a 2 Hp motor. Ray On 10/14/2012 6:54 AM, d...@foxfire-energy.com wrote: I like Outback because I can rebuild them on the wall. I'd be eying two VFX3648 (Or VFX7248 is what they used to call them).I suspect Magnum is similar, but I really haven't seen that many around. As for starting motor loads, NEC article 430 has gobs of info on projecting starting currents and sizing conductors (Check out the tables toward the end of the article). Keep in mind much has to do with conductors sizing.I'd be shooting for a max loss of 3% at full current draw.. especially in the low voltage conductors.As for installation, I like set ups where the inverters are inclosed in a closet and set up so that the main fresh inlet air to the building washes thru the closet (Powered by gravity - no fans). Good luck. db Dan Brown Foxfire Energy Corp. Renewable Energy Systems (802)-483-2564 www.Foxfire-Energy.com http://www.Foxfire-Energy.com NABCEP #092907-44 Original Message Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP From: bob ellison reelli...@gmail.com mailto:reelli...@gmail.com Date: Sat, October 13, 2012 7:01 pm To: 'RE-wrenches' re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org I have had inverters ruined by drywall dust, it literally filled them within a couple years as the owner worked on his house. Next thing I am getting a call that it would not work I doubt that sawdust would be any different. Later, Bob Ellison *From:*re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *jay peltz *Sent:* Saturday, October 13, 2012 5:28 PM *To:* RE-wrenches *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP HI Hilton, Before you go anywhere you need to know what the draw on this motor is. I've seen 3 hp motors not be able to start on a 15kw genny. Why? Just horrible motors thats all. jay peltz power On Oct 13, 2012, at 11:16 AM, Hilton Dier III wrote: I have an off-grid client who is having trouble with his aging Xantrex SW4024 inverter and is considering an upgrade. I need some advice. One of his problems with his present system is that he can't run his 3 HP 240VAC table saw on the 4024. He'd be content to run his generator for any long sessions of sawing, but he'd like the capability to do a cut or two without firing it up. I was thinking about stacking a couple of Outbacks. I'd like to know people's real-world experiences with the relationship between motor HP, rated inverter watts, and surge watts. How much wattage does he need to actually do the job? That is, without flailing the inverter(s) into a shortened life span. Also, how do Outbacks compare with Magnums or whatever? I have been using Outbacks for a while with good results, but I have been hearing murmurs and grumbling since they were bought out. I haven't used Xantrex/Schneider for a while and I have no experience with Magnums. I notice that the Magnums offer split phase 240. I should note that he has his inverter setup in his wood shop. I am theorizing that some of his inverter trouble could be from a tree's worth of sawdust in the case. He presently has a 24V system, but he is considering a battery replacement, which would be an opportunity to switch to 48V if necessary. The sawdust issue makes me lean towards the sealed Outbacks, but he does have a partially finished box for the inverter with filters and a fan. Opinions? Many thanks. Hilton -- Hilton Dier III Renewable Energy Design Partner, Solar Gain LLC 453 East Hill Rd. Middlesex, VT 05602 Tel: 802-223-6652 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org http://www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP
I like Outback because I can rebuild them on the wall. I'd be eying two VFX3648 (Or VFX7248 is what they used to call them). I suspect Magnum is similar, but I really haven't seen that many around. As for starting motor loads, NEC article 430 has gobs of info on projecting starting currents and sizing conductors (Check out the tables toward the end of the article). Keep in mind much has to do with conductors sizing. I'd be shooting for a max loss of 3% at full current draw.. especially in the low voltage conductors. As for installation, I like set ups where the inverters are inclosed in a closet and set up so that the main fresh inlet air to the building washes thru the closet (Powered by gravity - no fans). Good luck. dbDan BrownFoxfire Energy Corp.Renewable Energy Systems(802)-483-2564www.Foxfire-Energy.comNABCEP #092907-44 Original Message Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP From: "bob ellison" reelli...@gmail.com Date: Sat, October 13, 2012 7:01 pm To: "'RE-wrenches'" re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org I have had inverters ruined by drywall dust, it literally filled them within a couple years as the owner worked on his house. Next thing I am getting a call that it would not work….I doubt that sawdust would be any different.Later,Bob EllisonFrom: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of jay peltzSent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 5:28 PMTo: RE-wrenchesSubject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HPHI Hilton,Before you go anywhere you need to know what the draw on this motor is.I've seen 3 hp motors not be able to start on a 15kw genny.Why? Just horrible motors thats all.jaypeltz powerOn Oct 13, 2012, at 11:16 AM, Hilton Dier III wrote:I have an off-grid client who is having trouble with his aging Xantrex SW4024 inverter and is considering an upgrade. I need some advice.One of his problems with his present system is that he can't run his 3 HP 240VAC table saw on the 4024. He'd be content to run his generator for any long sessions of sawing, but he'd like the capability to do a cut or two without firing it up.I was thinking about stacking a couple of Outbacks. I'd like to know people's real-world experiences with the relationship between motor HP, rated inverter watts, and surge watts. How much wattage does he need to actually do the job? That is, without flailing the inverter(s) into a shortened life span.Also, how do Outbacks compare with Magnums or whatever? I have been using Outbacks for a while with good results, but I have been hearing murmurs and grumbling since they were bought out. I haven't used Xantrex/Schneider for a while and I have no experience with Magnums. I notice that the Magnums offer split phase 240. I should note that he has his inverter setup in his wood shop. I am theorizing that some of his inverter trouble could be from a tree's worth of sawdust in the case. He presently has a 24V system, but he is considering a battery replacement, which would be an opportunity to switch to 48V if necessary. The sawdust issue makes me lean towards the sealed Outbacks, but he does have a partially finished box for the inverter with filters and a fan.Opinions?Many thanks.Hilton-- Hilton Dier IIIRenewable Energy DesignPartner, Solar Gain LLC453 East Hill Rd.Middlesex, VT 05602Tel: 802-223-6652___List sponsored by Home Power magazineList Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.orgOptions settings:http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.orgList-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.orgList rules etiquette:www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htmCheck out participant bios:www.members.re-wrenches.org___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP
HI Dan, The Radian from outback can be rebuilt. I don't know if they are sending out replacement guts or just replacement inverter modules however. Jay peltz power On Oct 14, 2012, at 5:54 AM, d...@foxfire-energy.com wrote: I like Outback because I can rebuild them on the wall. I'd be eying two VFX3648 (Or VFX7248 is what they used to call them). I suspect Magnum is similar, but I really haven't seen that many around. As for starting motor loads, NEC article 430 has gobs of info on projecting starting currents and sizing conductors (Check out the tables toward the end of the article). Keep in mind much has to do with conductors sizing. I'd be shooting for a max loss of 3% at full current draw.. especially in the low voltage conductors. As for installation, I like set ups where the inverters are inclosed in a closet and set up so that the main fresh inlet air to the building washes thru the closet (Powered by gravity - no fans). Good luck. db Dan Brown Foxfire Energy Corp. Renewable Energy Systems (802)-483-2564 www.Foxfire-Energy.com NABCEP #092907-44 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP
HI Hilton, Before you go anywhere you need to know what the draw on this motor is. I've seen 3 hp motors not be able to start on a 15kw genny. Why? Just horrible motors thats all. jay peltz power On Oct 13, 2012, at 11:16 AM, Hilton Dier III wrote: I have an off-grid client who is having trouble with his aging Xantrex SW4024 inverter and is considering an upgrade. I need some advice. One of his problems with his present system is that he can't run his 3 HP 240VAC table saw on the 4024. He'd be content to run his generator for any long sessions of sawing, but he'd like the capability to do a cut or two without firing it up. I was thinking about stacking a couple of Outbacks. I'd like to know people's real-world experiences with the relationship between motor HP, rated inverter watts, and surge watts. How much wattage does he need to actually do the job? That is, without flailing the inverter(s) into a shortened life span. Also, how do Outbacks compare with Magnums or whatever? I have been using Outbacks for a while with good results, but I have been hearing murmurs and grumbling since they were bought out. I haven't used Xantrex/Schneider for a while and I have no experience with Magnums. I notice that the Magnums offer split phase 240. I should note that he has his inverter setup in his wood shop. I am theorizing that some of his inverter trouble could be from a tree's worth of sawdust in the case. He presently has a 24V system, but he is considering a battery replacement, which would be an opportunity to switch to 48V if necessary. The sawdust issue makes me lean towards the sealed Outbacks, but he does have a partially finished box for the inverter with filters and a fan. Opinions? Many thanks. Hilton -- Hilton Dier III Renewable Energy Design Partner, Solar Gain LLC 453 East Hill Rd. Middlesex, VT 05602 Tel: 802-223-6652 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP
I have had inverters ruined by drywall dust, it literally filled them within a couple years as the owner worked on his house. Next thing I am getting a call that it would not work.. I doubt that sawdust would be any different. Later, Bob Ellison From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of jay peltz Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 5:28 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Off-grid 1nverter replacement for 3 HP HI Hilton, Before you go anywhere you need to know what the draw on this motor is. I've seen 3 hp motors not be able to start on a 15kw genny. Why? Just horrible motors thats all. jay peltz power On Oct 13, 2012, at 11:16 AM, Hilton Dier III wrote: I have an off-grid client who is having trouble with his aging Xantrex SW4024 inverter and is considering an upgrade. I need some advice. One of his problems with his present system is that he can't run his 3 HP 240VAC table saw on the 4024. He'd be content to run his generator for any long sessions of sawing, but he'd like the capability to do a cut or two without firing it up. I was thinking about stacking a couple of Outbacks. I'd like to know people's real-world experiences with the relationship between motor HP, rated inverter watts, and surge watts. How much wattage does he need to actually do the job? That is, without flailing the inverter(s) into a shortened life span. Also, how do Outbacks compare with Magnums or whatever? I have been using Outbacks for a while with good results, but I have been hearing murmurs and grumbling since they were bought out. I haven't used Xantrex/Schneider for a while and I have no experience with Magnums. I notice that the Magnums offer split phase 240. I should note that he has his inverter setup in his wood shop. I am theorizing that some of his inverter trouble could be from a tree's worth of sawdust in the case. He presently has a 24V system, but he is considering a battery replacement, which would be an opportunity to switch to 48V if necessary. The sawdust issue makes me lean towards the sealed Outbacks, but he does have a partially finished box for the inverter with filters and a fan. Opinions? Many thanks. Hilton -- Hilton Dier III Renewable Energy Design Partner, Solar Gain LLC 453 East Hill Rd. Middlesex, VT 05602 Tel: 802-223-6652 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Options settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
