Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
Add over the wire smart meters [pulse style?] here due to the wireless smart meter scares in other locals. The wireless smart meters would not work with the mountains here. Dana Orzel Great Solar Works, Inc - NABCEP # 051112-136 d...@solarwork.com - www.solarwork.com O - 970.626.5253F - 970.626.4140 C - 970.209.4076 Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988 From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Hilton Dier III Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 8:30 PM To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters It's a sad fact of life that people will attribute their ills to whatever is new, strange, or emotionally unappealing to them. In Vermont right now the woo-woos are afraid of wireless internet routers, wireless smart meters, and wind turbines. You have several choices. Call their game - tell them that you are sorry that they feel ill but that scientifically speaking it can't be from the inverter. Inform them of all the studies showing that people can't actually feel EMF or any kind of RF (short of sitting inside a radar dish and cooking). They should look elsewhere for relief - like a good therapist. If they are offended by that then maybe they will find another installer to bother and your life will be improved. Play their game - Faraday cage the thing or whatever the quacks want you to do. Charge full boat and a half for that kind of nonsense. Play your game - figure out something easy to do, attribute the EMF to that, and do it. I once had a potential client (luckily I didn't get the job) ask for a copper box around the batteries to reduce the harmful waves. I assured her that she was somewhat misinformed; if there were any waves to be emitted, that they would come from the cables between the batteries and the inverter. All I would have to do is wrap the cables around each other in a spiral and the waves would be canceled out. She was satisfied with that. It was just my confidently expressed mumbo jumbo instead of hers, and it would cost her zero as opposed to a copper box. (Actually, widely spaced battery cables can be a source of RFI, so I wasn't totally spoofing her.) Good luck, Hilton -- Hilton Dier III Renewable Energy Design Partner, Solar Gain LLC 453 East Hill Rd. Middlesex, VT 05602 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
You can't mitigate someone's imagination. EMF is all around, imagine what they would be exposed to under power lines. But unless they have an extremely high level of iron in their blood, they are not ferrous and will not be affected. On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 3:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.comwrote: ** wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org -- Chris Mason President, Comet Systems Ltd www.cometenergysystems.com Cell: 264.235.5670 Skype: netconcepts ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
Have you used a gaus meter (http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
the customer had some guy come in with 'a meter'. there was no mention of frequency or scale for the ranges listed below. and of course... the man with the meter also sells the 'filters' which help the problem he finds - sigh. here is the pertinent paragraph in her letter to me: As you know, XXX has had a rough time health-wise over the past year. This is cause for concern, as his diet is pristine, as is his life-style. Dr. Lu feels that he is showing signs of toxic electromagnetic exposure. (XXX is electrically sensitive.) So, I had Neil Cohen over and he measured our frequencies. L-o-n-g story short: when the inverter is shut down, the house drops to normal. With it on, we are in the 2,000-3,000 range. Even with greenwave filters installed, it stays about 1,800 when the inverter is on. The minute the inverter is turned off, the reading is about 14. We have turned it off for the past few days and Kealey is beginning to show some preliminary signs of recovery. i wonder what his meter is reading? i know when my inverter is selling am radio reception is wiped out so there is some rfi coming out of it, not that this is necessarily harmful. these folks are also 'chem-trail' believers. oh, the joys of living in mount shasta... sigh todd On Saturday, April 13, 2013 12:52pm, Randy Brooks ra...@brookssolar.com said: Have you used a gaus meter ([http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter] http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory [mailto:toddc...@finestplanet.com] toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: [mailto:RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org] RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: [http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org] http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org Sent from Finest Planet WebMail. ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
I don't knowI have perhaps three customers, over the past ~20 years, who claim to be 'allergic to electricity', for lack of a better term. As you can imagine, existing in our current society is actually painful for them. They've all bought (for example) propane 'fridges since they use no electricity and don't cause them to have that 'pins needles' feeling they get when they are near electrical fields. I try not to laugh at them, yet I believe they are sincere when they tell me, I can't stand to be near anything electrical. So perhaps there needs to be some sort of independent test to confirm what these folks claim to feel. Chris Daum Oasis Montana Inc. _ From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Randy Brooks Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:53 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Have you used a gaus meter (http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8 http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8; qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
Sounds an awful lot like "Wind Turbine Syndrome' And for that, tests are now showing that WTS is a "communicated" disease. The power of suggestion. Perhaps this is also a communicated disease.unfortunately, with psychosomatic symptoms manifesting in those affected. Roy Butler NABCEP Certified Small Wind Installer NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer NYSERDA eligible PV wind installer Four Winds Renewable Energy, LLC 8902 Route 46, Arkport, NY 14807 607-324-9747 www.four-winds-energy.com Join us at the 9th Annual Small Wind Conference A Gathering of Installers, Manufacturers, Dealers, Distributors June 18 and 19, 2013 in Stevens Point, Wisconsin www.smallwindconference.com Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced. On 4/13/2013 4:09 PM, Chris Daum wrote: I don't knowI have perhaps three customers, over the past ~20 years, who claim to be 'allergic to electricity', for lack of a better term. As you can imagine, existing in our current society is actually painful for them. They've all bought (for example) propane 'fridges since they use no electricity and don't cause them to have that 'pins needles' feeling they get when they are near electrical fields. I try not to laugh at them, yet I believe they are sincere when they tell me, "I can't stand to be near anything electrical". So perhaps there needs to be some sort of independent test to confirm what these folks claim to feel. Chris Daum Oasis Montana Inc. From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Randy Brooks Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:53 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Have you used a gaus meter (http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
http://www.greenwavefilters.com/health-risks/ A growing body of evidence points to connections between dirty electricity and a wide variety of physical, emotional, and cognitive health issues. Luckily, they a solution... On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 4:16 PM, Roy Butler r...@four-winds-energy.comwrote: Sounds an awful lot like Wind Turbine Syndrome' And for that, tests are now showing that WTS is a communicated disease. The power of suggestion. Perhaps this is also a communicated disease.unfortunately, with psychosomatic symptoms manifesting in those affected. Roy Butler NABCEP Certified Small Wind Installer® NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer® NYSERDA eligible PV wind installer Four Winds Renewable Energy, LLC 8902 Route 46, Arkport, NY 14807607-324-9747 www.four-winds-energy.com Join us at the 9th Annual Small Wind Conference A Gathering of Installers, Manufacturers, Dealers, Distributors June 18 and 19, 2013 in Stevens Point, Wisconsinwww.smallwindconference.com Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced. On 4/13/2013 4:09 PM, Chris Daum wrote: I don't knowI have perhaps three customers, over the past ~20 years, who claim to be 'allergic to electricity', for lack of a better term. As you can imagine, existing in our current society is actually painful for them. They've all bought (for example) propane 'fridges since they use no electricity and don't cause them to have that 'pins needles' feeling they get when they are near electrical fields. I try not to laugh at them, yet I believe they are sincere when they tell me, I can't stand to be near anything electrical. So perhaps there needs to be some sort of independent test to confirm what these folks *claim* to feel. Chris Daum Oasis Montana Inc. -- *From:* re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [ mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.orgre-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *Randy Brooks *Sent:* Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:53 PM *To:* RE-wrenches *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Have you used a gaus meter ( http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings:http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette:www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios:www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org -- Chris Mason President, Comet Systems Ltd www.cometenergysystems.com Cell: 264.235.5670 Skype: netconcepts ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
I had one lady in tears when I suggested that she lead her kids into the 21st century an not the other way around.. An I was just trying to get her to wear a digital watch. No, diplomacy is not one of my strong points. But it was an eye opener for me. Original Message Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters From: Chris Mason cometenergysyst...@gmail.com Date: Sat, April 13, 2013 4:32 pm To: RE-wrenches re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org http://www.greenwavefilters.com/health-risks/ A growing body of evidence points to connections between dirty electricity and a wide variety of physical, emotional, and cognitive health issues. Luckily, they a solution... On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 4:16 PM, Roy Butler r...@four-winds-energy.comwrote: Sounds an awful lot like Wind Turbine Syndrome' And for that, tests are now showing that WTS is a communicated disease. The power of suggestion. Perhaps this is also a communicated disease.unfortunately, with psychosomatic symptoms manifesting in those affected. Roy Butler NABCEP Certified Small Wind Installer® NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer® NYSERDA eligible PV wind installer Four Winds Renewable Energy, LLC 8902 Route 46, Arkport, NY 14807607-324-9747 www.four-winds-energy.com Join us at the 9th Annual Small Wind Conference A Gathering of Installers, Manufacturers, Dealers, Distributors June 18 and 19, 2013 in Stevens Point, Wisconsinwww.smallwindconference.com Although no trees were killed in the sending of this message, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced. On 4/13/2013 4:09 PM, Chris Daum wrote: I don't knowI have perhaps three customers, over the past ~20 years, who claim to be 'allergic to electricity', for lack of a better term. As you can imagine, existing in our current society is actually painful for them. They've all bought (for example) propane 'fridges since they use no electricity and don't cause them to have that 'pins needles' feeling they get when they are near electrical fields. I try not to laugh at them, yet I believe they are sincere when they tell me, I can't stand to be near anything electrical. So perhaps there needs to be some sort of independent test to confirm what these folks *claim* to feel. Chris Daum Oasis Montana Inc. -- *From:* re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [ mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.orgre-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *Randy Brooks *Sent:* Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:53 PM *To:* RE-wrenches *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Have you used a gaus meter ( http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings:http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette:www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios:www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org -- Chris Mason President, Comet Systems Ltd www.cometenergysystems.com Cell: 264.235.5670 Skype: netconcepts ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
Hi guys, While I agree that its probably crazy talk. There is one story I have to share. Just like this one, the customer was complaining of the emf's. then she called the install company to say that they were gone!. She didn't know that just that morning the install guys had put a faraday cage around the inverter, put in extra grounds etc. No way she could have known, but she did notice the difference. So don't discount everyone, just almost everyone. jay peltz power On Apr 13, 2013, at 1:09 PM, Chris Daum wrote: I don't knowI have perhaps three customers, over the past ~20 years, who claim to be 'allergic to electricity', for lack of a better term. As you can imagine, existing in our current society is actually painful for them. They've all bought (for example) propane 'fridges since they use no electricity and don't cause them to have that 'pins needles' feeling they get when they are near electrical fields. I try not to laugh at them, yet I believe they are sincere when they tell me, I can't stand to be near anything electrical. So perhaps there needs to be some sort of independent test to confirm what these folks claim to feel. Chris Daum Oasis Montana Inc. From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of Randy Brooks Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:53 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Have you used a gaus meter (http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
Todd, I know that you didn't say that the customer was getting headaches, but maybe that is what is making him/her sick ? If so, then may I suggest that what is causing the problem is, instead of EMF, (which I am highly skeptical of), that it may be that the customer is getting sick from the high frequency sound emanating from the inverters. It's high, but may still be in the range of hearing for some people. You might see if this customer can hear or detect up to around 20 kHz ? Some people, especially the younger and some sensitive older people can hear pretty high. Just a suggestion. Also, if it is EMF that is a problem, then make sure they don't ever go out into the sun ! That's around 1000 watts per square meter of ionizing electromagnetic radiation !! It'll cause cancer and burn your skin ! boB On 4/13/2013 3:58 PM, jay peltz wrote: Hi guys, While I agree that its probably crazy talk. There is one story I have to share. Just like this one, the customer was complaining of the emf's. then she called the install company to say that they were gone!. She didn't know that just that morning the install guys had put a faraday cage around the inverter, put in extra grounds etc. No way she could have known, but she did notice the difference. So don't discount everyone, just almost everyone. jay peltz power On Apr 13, 2013, at 1:09 PM, Chris Daum wrote: I don't knowI have perhaps three customers, over the past ~20 years, who claim to be 'allergic to electricity', for lack of a better term. As you can imagine, existing in our current society is actually painful for them. They've all bought (for example) propane 'fridges since they use no electricity and don't cause them to have that 'pins needles' feeling they get when they are near electrical fields. I try not to laugh at them, yet I believe they are sincere when they tell me, I can't stand to be near anything electrical. So perhaps there needs to be some sort of independent test to confirm what these folks /claim/ to feel. Chris Daum Oasis Montana Inc. *From:* re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of *Randy Brooks *Sent:* Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:53 PM *To:* RE-wrenches *Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Have you used a gaus meter (http://www.amazon.com/Gen-El-Gauss-Master/dp/B0004IR6J6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8qid=1365882645sr=8-2keywords=gaus+meter) to measure the EMF near the inverters and other places? Might put it in perspective. Randy On Apr 13, 2013, at 12:17 PM, Todd Cory toddc...@finestplanet.com mailto:toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote: wrenches... put on our tin foil hats... i have a customer who claims the emf from their grid tied gvfx3648 is making them sick. does anyone know the switching frequency of the inverter and has anyone else reported this? also any ideas on how to mitigate it? thanks, todd ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
I used to be able to hear 20K HZ no longer am able to, too much great music and dam tools. I have neighbors who live 200' from my array that claimed it was making them sick I had an EMF guy do some readings at the tracker while still reading was 0MG, moving it reading was 12 MG, and moving at 8' away it read 0MG. So the motor did produce a very minor milli-gaus reading. I kind of question the validity as I asked how he calibrated it and when was the last time it was calibrated and I got a blank look. It was an analog meter. The readings appear to drop off logarithmically with distance. I think this may be a case of, remember back when TVs were accused of causing radiation? And every one boohooed the idea initially. At the time there were no monitoring instruments capable of reading the output from a TV monitor. Now there are. I have folks I soak with at the hot springs who claim they cannot be anywhere around electricity but they sure are selective about what is OK and not OK. I cannot seem to see the difference. I guess my point is - just because we cannot see it or feel it ourselves that it does not exist. I have been under power lines in NH in a fog where the lines were literally humming like a diesel engine in the fog. The hair on our heads was standing up. And hey we were completely sober! It was very real. Dana Orzel Great Solar Works, Inc - NABCEP # 051112-136 d...@solarwork.com - www.solarwork.com O - 970.626.5253F - 970.626.4140 C - 970.209.4076 Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988 From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of boB Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 5:41 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Todd, I know that you didn't say that the customer was getting headaches, but maybe that is what is making him/her sick ? If so, then may I suggest that what is causing the problem is, instead of EMF, (which I am highly skeptical of), that it may be that the customer is getting sick from the high frequency sound emanating from the inverters. It's high, but may still be in the range of hearing for some people. You might see if this customer can hear or detect up to around 20 kHz ? Some people, especially the younger and some sensitive older people can hear pretty high. Just a suggestion. Also, if it is EMF that is a problem, then make sure they don't ever go out into the sun ! That's around 1000 watts per square meter of ionizing electromagnetic radiation !! It'll cause cancer and burn your skin ! boB ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
i wish i knew what this guy was measuring... rfi, emi, emf, af? it could even be the pwm off the fm80. i dont think an inverter could change any emf to the house as that (gauss) is dependent on current flow. but if there is some rfi from the inverter/cc, riding the 60 hZ ac cables... that could be radiating throughout the whole house and i guess? it could make someone sick (kind of like living next to rf broadcast transmitter). the inverter wipes out hf ham signals so i know there is some 'dirt' coming out of them. does anyone know what frequencies we are looking at (i wish i had a spectrum analyzer) have experience filtering that out? i think it would require clamshell filters on the ac lines and probably a grounded faraday cage surrounding the inverter. todd On Saturday, April 13, 2013 5:05pm, Dana d...@solarwork.com said: I used to be able to hear 20K HZ no longer am able to, too much great music and dam tools. I have neighbors who live 200’ from my array that claimed it was “making them sick” I had an EMF guy do some readings at the tracker while still reading was 0MG, moving it reading was 12 MG, and moving at 8’ away it read 0MG. So the motor did produce a very minor milli-gaus reading. I kind of question the validity as I asked how he calibrated it and when was the last time it was calibrated and I got a blank look. It was an analog meter. The readings appear to drop off logarithmically with distance. I think this may be a case of, remember back when TVs were accused of causing radiation? And every one boohooed the idea initially. At the time there were no monitoring instruments capable of reading the output from a TV monitor. Now there are. I have folks I soak with at the hot springs who claim they cannot be anywhere around electricity but they sure are selective about what is OK and not OK. I cannot seem to see the difference. I guess my point is – just because we cannot see it or feel it ourselves that it does not exist. I have been under power lines in NH in a fog where the lines were literally humming like a diesel engine in the fog. The hair on our heads was standing up. And hey we were completely sober! It was very real. Dana Orzel Great Solar Works, Inc - NABCEP # 051112-136 d...@solarwork.com - www.solarwork.com O - 970.626.5253F - 970.626.4140 C - 970.209.4076 Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988 From: re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf Of boB Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 5:41 PM To: RE-wrenches Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters Todd, I know that you didn't say that the customer was getting headaches, but maybe that is what is making him/her sick ? If so, then may I suggest that what is causing the problem is, instead of EMF, (which I am highly skeptical of), that it may be that the customer is getting sick from the high frequency sound emanating from the inverters. It's high, but may still be in the range of hearing for some people. You might see if this customer can hear or detect up to around 20 kHz ? Some people, especially the younger and some sensitive older people can hear pretty high. Just a suggestion. Also, if it is EMF that is a problem, then make sure they don't ever go out into the sun ! That's around 1000 watts per square meter of ionizing electromagnetic radiation !! It'll cause cancer and burn your skin ! boB Sent from Finest Planet WebMail. ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
Re: [RE-wrenches] outback fx series inverters
It's a sad fact of life that people will attribute their ills to whatever is new, strange, or emotionally unappealing to them. In Vermont right now the woo-woos are afraid of wireless internet routers, wireless smart meters, and wind turbines. You have several choices. Call their game - tell them that you are sorry that they feel ill but that scientifically speaking it can't be from the inverter. Inform them of all the studies showing that people can't actually feel EMF or any kind of RF (short of sitting inside a radar dish and cooking). They should look elsewhere for relief - like a good therapist. If they are offended by that then maybe they will find another installer to bother and your life will be improved. Play their game - Faraday cage the thing or whatever the quacks want you to do. Charge full boat and a half for that kind of nonsense. Play your game - figure out something easy to do, attribute the EMF to that, and do it. I once had a potential client (luckily I didn't get the job) ask for a copper box around the batteries to reduce the harmful waves. I assured her that she was somewhat misinformed; if there were any waves to be emitted, that they would come from the cables between the batteries and the inverter. All I would have to do is wrap the cables around each other in a spiral and the waves would be canceled out. She was satisfied with that. It was just my confidently expressed mumbo jumbo instead of hers, and it would cost her zero as opposed to a copper box. (Actually, widely spaced battery cables can be a source of RFI, so I wasn't totally spoofing her.) Good luck, Hilton -- Hilton Dier III Renewable Energy Design Partner, Solar Gain LLC 453 East Hill Rd. Middlesex, VT 05602 ___ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org Change email address settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
