Re: [RDD] Rivendell, Jack, Sample Rate
I've not really played with stereo tool but it seems like it outputs at
192khz (if I understand the conversation thread).
So on the output you'd need the sound card to be set to 192khz across
the board. The problem being the max Riv supports is 48khz.
You'd save yourself a lot of headaches by having two sound cards. Have
Riv output straight to the sound card (ALSA) and then run a line out
from that to line in on the other card.
JACK then runs the other card for stereo tool purposes?
Wayne Merricks
The Voice Asia
On 25/09/15 01:06, Aaron Horn wrote:
On 24/09/2015 21:33, Aaron Horn wrote:
Hello,
I'm trying to run RD with Jack on my laptop. I need to run Jack at
192khz sampling rate for FM processing.
RD doesn't seem to want to play ball. When I start caed -d, it
complains of a sample rate mismatch and all the music plays at the
wrong speed.
What am I doing wrong here?
I have made a little progress with this...
I have found I can run jackd at 192khz and then use this asound.conf
to create a 'virtual' interface from jack:
pcm.rawjack {
type jack
playback_ports {
0 system:playback_1
1 system:playback_2
}
capture_ports {
0 system:capture_1
1 system:capture_2
}
}
pcm.rd0 {
type plug
slave { pcm "rawjack" }
}
ctl.rd0 {
type hw
card 0
}
This works ok ish:
aaron@pl:~$ caed -d
HPI_DriverOpen error: No such file or directory
caed: Starting ALSA Play Device rd0:
caed: Format = 32 bit little-endian
caed: SampleRate = 48000
caed: Aggregate Channels = 16
caed: Periods = 4
caed: BufferSize = 4096 frames
caed: Device started successfully
caed: Starting ALSA Capture Device rd0:
caed: Format = 32 bit little-endian
caed: SampleRate = 48000
caed: Aggregate Channels = 16
caed: Periods = 4
caed: BufferSize = 4096 frames
caed: Device started successfully
caed: no control device found for rd0
ALSA lib pcm.c:2267:(snd_pcm_open_noupdate) Unknown PCM rd1
ALSA lib pcm.c:2267:(snd_pcm_open_noupdate) Unknown PCM rd1
caed: connected to JACK server
JACK sample rate mismatch!
caed: JACK sample rate mismatch!
caed: Found TwoLAME encoder library, MPEG L2 encoding supported
caed: Found MAD decoder library, MPEG L2 decoding supported
caed: using realtime scheduling, priority=79
caed: cae started
But I have two issues... It's complaining about no control device for
rd0 (but works anyway) and it's still connecting to jack as rd1.
Is there anyway to make it not try to do jack other than recompiling
it without jack support?
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Re: [RDD] Rivendell, Jack, Sample Rate
What about using alsa_in/out to pipe Rivendell into Jack?
You can keep Rivendell with plan ALSA, working at 44.1 or 48 kHz. Then
create an instance of Jack server at 192kHz. You can plug what goes out
from ALSA into Jack by launching alsa_out. I think it can resample on the
fly so you should have it working.
Not sure it's a safe/stable solution.
Just give it a try, I'm curious!
Alessio
Il giorno ven 25 set 2015 alle ore 12:42 Wayne Merricks <
waynemerri...@thevoiceasia.com> ha scritto:
> I've not really played with stereo tool but it seems like it outputs at
> 192khz (if I understand the conversation thread).
>
> So on the output you'd need the sound card to be set to 192khz across
> the board. The problem being the max Riv supports is 48khz.
>
> You'd save yourself a lot of headaches by having two sound cards. Have
> Riv output straight to the sound card (ALSA) and then run a line out
> from that to line in on the other card.
>
> JACK then runs the other card for stereo tool purposes?
>
> Wayne Merricks
> The Voice Asia
>
> On 25/09/15 01:06, Aaron Horn wrote:
> > On 24/09/2015 21:33, Aaron Horn wrote:
> >> Hello,
> >>
> >> I'm trying to run RD with Jack on my laptop. I need to run Jack at
> >> 192khz sampling rate for FM processing.
> >>
> >> RD doesn't seem to want to play ball. When I start caed -d, it
> >> complains of a sample rate mismatch and all the music plays at the
> >> wrong speed.
> >>
> >> What am I doing wrong here?
> >
> >
> > I have made a little progress with this...
> >
> > I have found I can run jackd at 192khz and then use this asound.conf
> > to create a 'virtual' interface from jack:
> >
> > pcm.rawjack {
> > type jack
> > playback_ports {
> > 0 system:playback_1
> > 1 system:playback_2
> > }
> > capture_ports {
> > 0 system:capture_1
> > 1 system:capture_2
> > }
> > }
> >
> > pcm.rd0 {
> > type plug
> > slave { pcm "rawjack" }
> > }
> > ctl.rd0 {
> > type hw
> > card 0
> > }
> >
> > This works ok ish:
> >
> > aaron@pl:~$ caed -d
> > HPI_DriverOpen error: No such file or directory
> > caed: Starting ALSA Play Device rd0:
> > caed: Format = 32 bit little-endian
> > caed: SampleRate = 48000
> > caed: Aggregate Channels = 16
> > caed: Periods = 4
> > caed: BufferSize = 4096 frames
> > caed: Device started successfully
> > caed: Starting ALSA Capture Device rd0:
> > caed: Format = 32 bit little-endian
> > caed: SampleRate = 48000
> > caed: Aggregate Channels = 16
> > caed: Periods = 4
> > caed: BufferSize = 4096 frames
> > caed: Device started successfully
> > caed: no control device found for rd0
> > ALSA lib pcm.c:2267:(snd_pcm_open_noupdate) Unknown PCM rd1
> > ALSA lib pcm.c:2267:(snd_pcm_open_noupdate) Unknown PCM rd1
> > caed: connected to JACK server
> > JACK sample rate mismatch!
> > caed: JACK sample rate mismatch!
> > caed: Found TwoLAME encoder library, MPEG L2 encoding supported
> > caed: Found MAD decoder library, MPEG L2 decoding supported
> > caed: using realtime scheduling, priority=79
> > caed: cae started
> >
> > But I have two issues... It's complaining about no control device for
> > rd0 (but works anyway) and it's still connecting to jack as rd1.
> >
> > Is there anyway to make it not try to do jack other than recompiling
> > it without jack support?
> > ___
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> > Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org
> > http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
>
> ___
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>
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Re: [RDD] rdimport start/end date offsets
On Sep 24, 2015, at 19:32 59, John Edstrom wrote: > How does an input file "reference" start/end dates? The > metadata-pattern doesn't mention fields for this. CartChunk primarily, which has fields for this. Several file-over-satellite delivery systems (e.g. Amb-OS, ContentDepot) utilize this approach. > Does rdimport read ID3 tags or something? It does, but AFAICT ID3 has no standard scheme for encoding start/end dates as it is primarily aimed at consumer use cases. Cheers! |--| | Frederick F. Gleason, Jr. | Chief Developer | | | Paravel Systems | |--| | A room without books is like a body without a soul. | | -- Cicero| |--| ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell, Jack, Sample Rate
On Sep 24, 2015, at 16:33 02, Aaron Horn wrote: > RD doesn't seem to want to play ball. When I start caed -d, it complains of > a sample rate mismatch and all the music plays at the wrong speed. Indeed it will! 192k sample/sec is not supported on Rivendell (nor would you want it to be, as it would drive DSP processing overhead through the roof while giving you no real benefit). Cheers! |--| | Frederick F. Gleason, Jr. | Chief Developer | | | Paravel Systems | |--| | A room without books is like a body without a soul. | | -- Cicero| |--| ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell on CentOS 7 [WAS: Rivendell on Windows?]
On Thu, 24 Sep 2015, Cowboy wrote: There are several reasons CentOS is the supported platform. I don't see that changing any time real soon. ( although these gnome-isms may have an affect ) I was not suggesting Fred change his platform of choice, but only suggesting an easy way to avoid Gnome 3 for those who wish to do so. I've long toyed with the idea of writing another OS explicitly for Rivendell again. The problem would be that I'd have to support it. I've tried Rivendell with SuSE, Debian, Ubuntu, and CentOS, and it works well with all of them. Why does it need a special distribution? I appreciate what Fred is trying to do with the Appliance concept: make Rivendell sommething that is as easy to use as a Windows application (pay no attention to that Linux behind the curtain!). The problem, though, is hardware. More often than not, the Appliance won't install because of some hardware issue. Most recently, the installer told me it couldn't find my CD-ROM drive and asked me for the URL of a mirror. I gave it one, but it then installed a generic CentOS without asking me if I wanted Rivendell. That was no problem for me, but the average Windows user wouldn't be able to cope with that sort of thing... and yet that sort of thing is the rule, in my experience, not the exception. I've built a lot of Rivendell boxes.. at least twenty... since 2007. I don't think Rivendell will ever become reliably installable by the uninitiated. Rob ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell, Jack, Sample Rate
On Sep 25, 2015, at 09:56 31, David Klann wrote: > Which brings up the point from Aaron's original point claiming to need > to encode the audio at 192KHz. Aaron, why is it that you think you > need this high of a sample rate? 48KHz is better than CD quality which > has always been better than FM quality. Are you confusing sample rate > with compression bit-rate? AFAICT, he’s wanting to use StereoTool to generate MPX composite, which does require 192 ksample/sec because of the ultrasonic spectral components involved (up to around 48 kHz baseband, more if the RDS encoder feature is also used). Those who have been around here for awhile may remember Dan Mills, who was one of (might have even been *the* first) original developers of this concept. IIRC, his setup involved two sound cards, each bound to a separate instance of JACK (one operating at 48 ksamples/sec for Rivendell, and another at 192 ksample/sec for the MPX generation), along with appropriate sample clock interconnection to keep both cards operating in sync. His processor talked to *both* JACK graphs. The trick as I recall was getting the two cards to clock at a precise 4:1 ratio. Not a trivial setup. I suppose you could do something similar, using JACK’s ‘dummy’ backend for the Rivendell graph, but the devil will be in getting the clocks to sync. Cheers! |--| | Frederick F. Gleason, Jr. | Chief Developer | | | Paravel Systems | |--| | A room without books is like a body without a soul. | | -- Cicero| |--| ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell on CentOS 7 [WAS: Rivendell on Windows?]
On Sep 25, 2015, at 11:44 15, Rob Landry <41001...@interpring.com> wrote: > I don't think Rivendell will ever become reliably installable by the > uninitiated. I tend to agree. But then, I am not aware of *any* product in this class (full bore radio automation) of which that could be said. I’ve installed a fair number of “brand-X” automation systems from scratch myself. Most, frankly, are far worse. All of them assume (indeed, require) a “professional” context. Remember: *** snip snip *** Rivendell is a full-featured radio automation system targeted for use in professional broadcast environments. *** snip snip *** Rivendell is not intended for Aunt Tillie, nor will it ever be. With power comes responsibility. Cheers! |--| | Frederick F. Gleason, Jr. | Chief Developer | | | Paravel Systems | |--| | A room without books is like a body without a soul. | | -- Cicero| |--| ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell on CentOS 7 [WAS: Rivendell on Windows?]
On 09/25/2015 11:44 AM, Rob Landry wrote: Why does it need a special distribution? It doesn't. What a *supported* distro brings, is support ! The ability to know which libraries are included, which are not, what the user interface provides and what it looks like, etc. CentOS provides a very long ( in computer millenia ) support cycle for the OS itself. SuSE was originally chosen as having popular and commercial support, being the dominant OS of choice in Europe at the time. That's changed, obviously. All of the OS available at the time, including some not based on the Linux kernel were discussed. True, one can install this, or any open source package, on any OS one chooses, and may well for other reasons settle on some OS other than the "supported" OS. There's not a thing wrong with that. -- Cowboy http://cowboy.cwf1.com On the subject of C program indentation: "In My Egotistical Opinion, most people's C programs should be indented six feet downward and covered with dirt." -- Blair P. Houghton ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell on CentOS 7 [WAS: Rivendell on Windows?]
On 09/25/2015 12:53 PM, Frederick Gleason wrote: With power comes responsibility. Now, you're scaring me ! ;) -- Cowboy http://cowboy.cwf1.com On the subject of C program indentation: "In My Egotistical Opinion, most people's C programs should be indented six feet downward and covered with dirt." -- Blair P. Houghton ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell on CentOS 7 [WAS: Rivendell on Windows?]
I am still Chuckling over the Aunt Tillie Line... On Fri, 2015-09-25 at 14:06 -0400, Cowboy wrote: > On 09/25/2015 12:53 PM, Frederick Gleason wrote: > > With power comes responsibility. > > Now, you're scaring me ! > ;) > ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell on CentOS 7 [WAS: Rivendell on Windows?]
On 09/25/2015 02:42 PM, John Anderson wrote: I am still Chuckling over the Aunt Tillie Line... Have you never read ESR's dissertation on CUPS ? -- Cowboy http://cowboy.cwf1.com On the subject of C program indentation: "In My Egotistical Opinion, most people's C programs should be indented six feet downward and covered with dirt." -- Blair P. Houghton ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell on CentOS 7 [WAS: Rivendell on Windows?]
ALL THE WAY THROUGH, no, but i did scan it..enough to follow it..but I guess I missed Aunt Tillie! On Fri, 2015-09-25 at 14:47 -0400, Cowboy wrote: > ESR's dissertation on CUPS ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
[RDD] Where's The Metadata????
Hi; I just upgraded to 2.11. And my metadata is not working! Looks like the folder that the rlm_shoutcast1.conf file has vanished. Where has it been moved to or how do we get it back. Anyone see this one? Best Joe Joe Panarello Engineer WFIT 89.5 570.881.7170 -Original Message- From: rivendell-dev-boun...@lists.rivendellaudio.org [mailto:rivendell-dev-boun...@lists.rivendellaudio.org] On Behalf Of Frederick Gleason Sent: Friday, September 25, 2015 9:13 AM To: User discussion about the Rivendell Radio Automation System Subject: Re: [RDD] rdimport start/end date offsets On Sep 24, 2015, at 19:32 59, John Edstrom wrote: > How does an input file "reference" start/end dates? The > metadata-pattern doesn't mention fields for this. CartChunk primarily, which has fields for this. Several file-over-satellite delivery systems (e.g. Amb-OS, ContentDepot) utilize this approach. > Does rdimport read ID3 tags or something? It does, but AFAICT ID3 has no standard scheme for encoding start/end dates as it is primarily aimed at consumer use cases. Cheers! |--| | Frederick F. Gleason, Jr. | Chief Developer | | | Paravel Systems | |--| | A room without books is like a body without a soul. | | -- Cicero| |--| ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
Re: [RDD] Rivendell, Jack, Sample Rate
I seem to have missed out some of the posts including David's but yes I need to process audio at 192 kHz. I have no desire to actually store any audio at 192 kHz but I understand RD does not convert between sample rates. The reason is as Fred points out, FM MPX has a bandwidth of 56 kHz including RDS subcarrier so you have to sample at at least twice that (Nyquist!) to be able to produce the full spectrum needed. I could of course use 112 kHz but I suspect that would be even more problematic to get working given 192 kHz is a fairly standard sample rate. You've answered my question though - RD does not run at 192 kHz. I have noticed high caed usage at 48 kHz so can imagine it'd be worse at higher rates (although it's a little better with the pr43 debian packages which include a fix for high CPU usage in caed (44% to 30%)). What I cannot fathom is why RD is trying to connect to the jack server and the ALSA interface... It connects ALSA to rd0 and then connects the running jack instance to rd1. Is there any way to just to have it use ALSA and not jack? I wanted to avoid two cards because I want to take a microphone input and mix it all on one jack instance which I can do with my current set up reasonably well. But I may end up doing it anyway to provide the ability to monitor 'off air'. This would be trivial if I had a couple of clockable cards but I don't, I have some prosumer interfaces only. Aaron On 25/09/2015 17:29, Frederick Gleason wrote: On Sep 25, 2015, at 09:56 31, David Klann wrote: Which brings up the point from Aaron's original point claiming to need to encode the audio at 192KHz. Aaron, why is it that you think you need this high of a sample rate? 48KHz is better than CD quality which has always been better than FM quality. Are you confusing sample rate with compression bit-rate? AFAICT, he’s wanting to use StereoTool to generate MPX composite, which does require 192 ksample/sec because of the ultrasonic spectral components involved (up to around 48 kHz baseband, more if the RDS encoder feature is also used). Those who have been around here for awhile may remember Dan Mills, who was one of (might have even been *the* first) original developers of this concept. IIRC, his setup involved two sound cards, each bound to a separate instance of JACK (one operating at 48 ksamples/sec for Rivendell, and another at 192 ksample/sec for the MPX generation), along with appropriate sample clock interconnection to keep both cards operating in sync. His processor talked to *both* JACK graphs. The trick as I recall was getting the two cards to clock at a precise 4:1 ratio. Not a trivial setup. I suppose you could do something similar, using JACK’s ‘dummy’ backend for the Rivendell graph, but the devil will be in getting the clocks to sync. Cheers! |--| | Frederick F. Gleason, Jr. | Chief Developer | | | Paravel Systems | |--| | A room without books is like a body without a soul. | | -- Cicero| |--| ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev -- Kind regards Aaron Horn Demon FM Ltd --- Demon FM is a limited company registered in England and Wales. Registered number: 06455647. Registered office: First Floor, Campus Centre Building, Mill Lane, LEICESTER, LE2 7DR. ___ Rivendell-dev mailing list Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
