Re: [Simh] 5 Questions (3 Questions Sire) About RSTS/E and Command Line.
First of all, the HECnet mailing list is restricted to subscribed members only, so you can't post there until you've subscribed. On 2017-10-06 21:29, Brett Bump wrote: This is mostly for Tim and Paul, but I figured to cross-post in case any one might have seen this before (before I lob thy Holy Hand Grenade). 1. In cleaning up some of my old paperwork, I stumbled across a fanfold . paper copy of "RSTS/E System Programmer's Notebook" page 3 (no 1-2) . followed by Chapters 1-5 and Appendix A, B pages 1-5. The bottom of . the Preface reads: . . "What follows is a sermon, it is not a Gospel." . . A section on the first page of Appendix A has a paragraph that says: . . CAUTION . The PPEK sequences described in this (sic. I presume PEEK) . document are not a part of the supported . functionality of RSTS/E V6C as described . in the RSTS/E Software Product Description. . Has anyone seen/read this before, know who wrote it, have a digital copy that could be distributed out, or am I destined to type it back in so all can read (it is good material on old yellowed crackly fanfold paper)??? I'm deferring this to Paul, who really is the best person to answer. (I saw that he did say something on the subject as well.) 2. I lost a very good friend (coworker) this week to MI (he was 66). We . were coteaching a class online Tuesday night and Wednesday morning he . was gone. :( I have inherited 2 of his classes and wish to do the . best job I can for his students, honor his legacy, and live up to the . praise and respect he gave me that he disclosed to his students. . One of these classes is on command line and the text is linux specific. While I love my linux machines, there has always been a natural flow when typing commands on pretty much any DEC OS (a person kind of has to acquire a little bit of tourette's tics to be competent with *nix). Can someone in the group provide me with a few accounts to connect to so his students can see something other than linux??? I think I used to have an account on CHIMPY, but that has been a while back. Sorry about the loss. There are a guest account on both MIM:: and MAGICA:: MIM:: is an emulated PDP-11/74, while MAGICA:: is a real PDP-11/70. Both are running RSX-11M-PLUS V4.6, and the guest account have name GUEST and password GUEST. They drop you into DCL, so it shouldn't be too hard. They are also accessible from the internet as Mim.Update.UU.SE and Magica.Update.UU.SE, with telnet access. One difference that might be relevant is that in RSX, when you connect you are not automatically thrown the login prompt. You are at a command prompt in logged out mode, where you can both get help, as well as log in. 3. Does anyone have a current HECnet map, so that said students could . see how HECnet is set up and navigate a couple of different machines? As far as I know, there is no current map. There have been a couple of attempts in the past, but it was a while since I last saw any, and they have never been very complete. The best "picture" is by going to http://mim.update.uu.se/nodedb, which is served from MIM (obviously) using Datatrieve, and the source of the nodename database, with some additional information. However, one have to be away that many machines in the last is not online most of the time. To explore a bit more, one can play with NCP and find out which areas are online, and at least some subset of which machines are online. But it becomes a question of knowing how to use NCP, how DECnet works, and some patience. Johnny -- Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: b...@softjar.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] 5 Questions (3 Questions Sire) About RSTS/E and Command Line.
Thanks Kevin, Actually, I will have them connect to the 2 linux clusters I have running at home (simh RSTS-V4A - RSTS/E V10.1, some RT-11 and DOS-11). There is also some RSTS zip kits they can work with, but I don't have any Vaxen running at home (nor any DECnet/HECnet). I would love the idea of an open source DCL shell. ;-) Anyone? On Fri, 6 Oct 2017, khandy21yo wrote: If all else rails, you can always have them run simh under Linux. Assuming they have their own Linux boxes, or vm ... Many versions of Linux have an old version of simh for easy install (apt-get install simh) for Debian and Ubuntu, for example. You would only need to hand out a pre-built image and startup file. Os/8? Dosbox is also available for a msdos she'll Linux has a boatload of shells to play with. Anyone written dcl for linux? Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A Original message From: Brett Bump Date: 10/6/17 1:29 PM (GMT-07:00) To: HECnet Cc: SIMH Subject: [Simh] 5 Questions (3 Questions Sire) About RSTS/E and Command Line. This is mostly for Tim and Paul, but I figured to cross-post in case any one might have seen this before (before I lob thy Holy Hand Grenade). 1. In cleaning up some of my old paperwork, I stumbled across a fanfold . paper copy of "RSTS/E System Programmer's Notebook" page 3 (no 1-2) . followed by Chapters 1-5 and Appendix A, B pages 1-5. The bottom of . the Preface reads: . . "What follows is a sermon, it is not a Gospel." . . A section on the first page of Appendix A has a paragraph that says: . . CAUTION . The PPEK sequences described in this (sic. I presume PEEK) . document are not a part of the supported . functionality of RSTS/E V6C as described . in the RSTS/E Software Product Description. . Has anyone seen/read this before, know who wrote it, have a digital copy that could be distributed out, or am I destined to type it back in so all can read (it is good material on old yellowed crackly fanfold paper)??? 2. I lost a very good friend (coworker) this week to MI (he was 66). We . were coteaching a class online Tuesday night and Wednesday morning he . was gone. :( I have inherited 2 of his classes and wish to do the . best job I can for his students, honor his legacy, and live up to the . praise and respect he gave me that he disclosed to his students. . One of these classes is on command line and the text is linux specific. While I love my linux machines, there has always been a natural flow when typing commands on pretty much any DEC OS (a person kind of has to acquire a little bit of tourette's tics to be competent with *nix). Can someone in the group provide me with a few accounts to connect to so his students can see something other than linux??? I think I used to have an account on CHIMPY, but that has been a while back. 3. Does anyone have a current HECnet map, so that said students could . see how HECnet is set up and navigate a couple of different machines? That's all. Sorry to be such a hermit. I rarely poke my head out into the world, but this time I felt it was for a just cause. :-) Brett ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] 5 Questions (3 Questions Sire) About RSTS/E and Command Line.
In the past, Sector7, Accelr8, and Boston Business Computing had “DCL shells” for Unix, DOS, and Windows. Usually they would do more and also map directory names etc. Some may still be available today. Tim N3QE > On Oct 7, 2017, at 10:32 AM, Brett Bump wrote: > > > Thanks Kevin, > > Actually, I will have them connect to the 2 linux clusters I have running > at home (simh RSTS-V4A - RSTS/E V10.1, some RT-11 and DOS-11). There is > also some RSTS zip kits they can work with, but I don't have any Vaxen > running at home (nor any DECnet/HECnet). > > I would love the idea of an open source DCL shell. ;-) Anyone? > >> On Fri, 6 Oct 2017, khandy21yo wrote: >> >> If all else rails, you can always have them run simh under Linux. >> Assuming they have their own Linux boxes, or vm ... >> Many versions of Linux have an old version of simh for easy install (apt-get >> install simh) for Debian and Ubuntu, for example. You would only need to >> hand out a >> pre-built image and startup file. Os/8? >> Dosbox is also available for a msdos she'll >> Linux has a boatload of shells to play with. Anyone written dcl for linux? >> Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A >> Original message >> From: Brett Bump >> Date: 10/6/17 1:29 PM (GMT-07:00) >> To: HECnet >> Cc: SIMH >> Subject: [Simh] 5 Questions (3 Questions Sire) About RSTS/E and Command Line. >> This is mostly for Tim and Paul, but I figured to cross-post in case any >> one might have seen this before (before I lob thy Holy Hand Grenade). >> 1. In cleaning up some of my old paperwork, I stumbled across a fanfold >> . paper copy of "RSTS/E System Programmer's Notebook" page 3 (no 1-2) >> . followed by Chapters 1-5 and Appendix A, B pages 1-5. The bottom of >> . the Preface reads: >> . >> . "What follows is a sermon, it is not a Gospel." >> . >> . A section on the first page of Appendix A has a paragraph that says: >> . >> . CAUTION >> . The PPEK sequences described in this (sic. I presume PEEK) >> . document are not a part of the supported >> . functionality of RSTS/E V6C as described >> . in the RSTS/E Software Product Description. >> . >> Has anyone seen/read this before, know who wrote it, have a digital copy >> that could be distributed out, or am I destined to type it back in so all >> can read (it is good material on old yellowed crackly fanfold paper)??? >> 2. I lost a very good friend (coworker) this week to MI (he was 66). We >> . were coteaching a class online Tuesday night and Wednesday morning he >> . was gone. :( I have inherited 2 of his classes and wish to do the >> . best job I can for his students, honor his legacy, and live up to the >> . praise and respect he gave me that he disclosed to his students. >> . >> One of these classes is on command line and the text is linux specific. >> While I love my linux machines, there has always been a natural flow when >> typing commands on pretty much any DEC OS (a person kind of has to acquire >> a little bit of tourette's tics to be competent with *nix). Can someone >> in the group provide me with a few accounts to connect to so his students >> can see something other than linux??? I think I used to have an account >> on CHIMPY, but that has been a while back. >> 3. Does anyone have a current HECnet map, so that said students could >> . see how HECnet is set up and navigate a couple of different machines? >> That's all. Sorry to be such a hermit. I rarely poke my head out into >> the world, but this time I felt it was for a just cause. :-) >> Brett >> ___ >> Simh mailing list >> Simh@trailing-edge.com >> http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh > ___ > Simh mailing list > Simh@trailing-edge.com > http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] 5 Questions (3 Questions Sire) About RSTS/E and Command Line.
Thanks Johnny, On Sat, 7 Oct 2017, Johnny Billquist wrote: First of all, the HECnet mailing list is restricted to subscribed members only, so you can't post there until you've subscribed. There are 10,189 messages in my HECnet folder, starting on 09/11/2007 and most recent are your TCP/IP updates on April 30 and September 3rd. There is a big gap in my list from 2013 until your announcements, maybe I got lost in the list along the way. Sorry about the loss. There are a guest account on both MIM:: and MAGICA:: MIM:: is an emulated PDP-11/74, while MAGICA:: is a real PDP-11/70. Both are running RSX-11M-PLUS V4.6, and the guest account have name GUEST and password GUEST. They drop you into DCL, so it shouldn't be too hard. They are also accessible from the internet as Mim.Update.UU.SE and Magica.Update.UU.SE, with telnet access. One difference that might be relevant is that in RSX, when you connect you are not automatically thrown the login prompt. You are at a command prompt in logged out mode, where you can both get help, as well as log in. 3. Does anyone have a current HECnet map, so that said students could . see how HECnet is set up and navigate a couple of different machines? As far as I know, there is no current map. There have been a couple of attempts in the past, but it was a while since I last saw any, and they have never been very complete. The best "picture" is by going to http://mim.update.uu.se/nodedb, which is served from MIM (obviously) using Datatrieve, and the source of the nodename database, with some additional information. However, one have to be away that many machines in the last is not online most of the time. To explore a bit more, one can play with NCP and find out which areas are online, and at least some subset of which machines are online. But it becomes a question of knowing how to use NCP, how DECnet works, and some patience. Johnny -- Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus || on a psychedelic trip email: b...@softjar.se || Reading murder books pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
[Simh] Fanfold Photos.
Paul, (and anyone else that wants to take a look). http://www.rsts.org/~bbump/unknown_author It's not like it is that long, I will probably end up typing it in. Brett On Fri, 6 Oct 2017, Paul Koning wrote: On Oct 6, 2017, at 3:29 PM, Brett Bump wrote: This is mostly for Tim and Paul, but I figured to cross-post in case any one might have seen this before (before I lob thy Holy Hand Grenade). 1. In cleaning up some of my old paperwork, I stumbled across a fanfold . paper copy of "RSTS/E System Programmer's Notebook" page 3 (no 1-2) . followed by Chapters 1-5 and Appendix A, B pages 1-5. The bottom of . the Preface reads: . . "What follows is a sermon, it is not a Gospel." . . A section on the first page of Appendix A has a paragraph that says: . . CAUTION . The PPEK sequences described in this (sic. I presume PEEK) . document are not a part of the supported . functionality of RSTS/E V6C as described . in the RSTS/E Software Product Description. . Has anyone seen/read this before, know who wrote it, have a digital copy that could be distributed out, or am I destined to type it back in so all can read (it is good material on old yellowed crackly fanfold paper)??? That doesn't ring bells, and I don't seem to have that document in my files. I was part of RSTS/E development at that time, so if it came from there I might have seen it but let it slip my memory. Could you scan a few pages, perhaps the first few and a couple of pages of that appendix, so I can see more of the context? Just a simple photograph is probably good enough if you don't have a scanner. Typing it all in is hard work (I've done it for un-OCR-able listings, 300 pages). If the listing is clean, a scan plus OCR will cut the effort very considerably. Or just a scan, since scans are perfectly readable for humans. OCR is only necessary if it's code that you want to be able to compile/assemble or other kinds of data that need to be processed by some program. Not too long ago I sent an old listing of "BTSS" (RSTS v0) to another person on this list, who scanned it very skillfully. In other words, those capabilities are around. 2. I lost a very good friend (coworker) this week to MI (he was 66). ... I'm sorry to hear that. I don't have answers on your other two questions. paul ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] Fanfold Photos.
Brett, I remember from DECUS announcements that Martin Minow was author of the RSTS/E System's Programmer Notebook. Thanks for the pictures! Tim On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 11:24 AM, Brett Bump wrote: > > Paul, (and anyone else that wants to take a look). > > http://www.rsts.org/~bbump/unknown_author > > It's not like it is that long, I will probably end up typing it in. > > Brett > > On Fri, 6 Oct 2017, Paul Koning wrote: > > >> On Oct 6, 2017, at 3:29 PM, Brett Bump wrote: >>> >>> >>> This is mostly for Tim and Paul, but I figured to cross-post in case any >>> one might have seen this before (before I lob thy Holy Hand Grenade). >>> >>> 1. In cleaning up some of my old paperwork, I stumbled across a fanfold >>> . paper copy of "RSTS/E System Programmer's Notebook" page 3 (no 1-2) >>> . followed by Chapters 1-5 and Appendix A, B pages 1-5. The bottom of >>> . the Preface reads: >>> . >>> . "What follows is a sermon, it is not a Gospel." >>> . >>> . A section on the first page of Appendix A has a paragraph that says: >>> . >>> . CAUTION >>> . The PPEK sequences described in this (sic. I presume PEEK) >>> . document are not a part of the supported >>> . functionality of RSTS/E V6C as described >>> . in the RSTS/E Software Product Description. >>> . >>> Has anyone seen/read this before, know who wrote it, have a digital copy >>> that could be distributed out, or am I destined to type it back in so all >>> can read (it is good material on old yellowed crackly fanfold paper)??? >>> >> >> That doesn't ring bells, and I don't seem to have that document in my >> files. I was part of RSTS/E development at that time, so if it came from >> there I might have seen it but let it slip my memory. >> >> Could you scan a few pages, perhaps the first few and a couple of pages >> of that appendix, so I can see more of the context? Just a simple >> photograph is probably good enough if you don't have a scanner. >> >> Typing it all in is hard work (I've done it for un-OCR-able listings, 300 >> pages). If the listing is clean, a scan plus OCR will cut the effort very >> considerably. Or just a scan, since scans are perfectly readable for >> humans. OCR is only necessary if it's code that you want to be able to >> compile/assemble or other kinds of data that need to be processed by some >> program. Not too long ago I sent an old listing of "BTSS" (RSTS v0) to >> another person on this list, who scanned it very skillfully. In other >> words, those capabilities are around. >> >> 2. I lost a very good friend (coworker) this week to MI (he was 66). >>> ... >>> >> >> I'm sorry to hear that. I don't have answers on your other two questions. >> >> paul >> >> >> ___ > Simh mailing list > Simh@trailing-edge.com > http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
Re: [Simh] Fanfold Photos.
You brain cells are working better than mine. ;-) I'll get it typed in. Brett On Sat, 7 Oct 2017, Tim Shoppa wrote: Brett, I remember from DECUS announcements that Martin Minow was author of the RSTS/E System's Programmer Notebook. Thanks for the pictures! Tim On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 11:24 AM, Brett Bump wrote: Paul, (and anyone else that wants to take a look). http://www.rsts.org/~bbump/unknown_author It's not like it is that long, I will probably end up typing it in. Brett ___ Simh mailing list Simh@trailing-edge.com http://mailman.trailing-edge.com/mailman/listinfo/simh
