[Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[abhishek jain]

Hi,

Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request) contain a body ?
I would appreciate a quick response.

For example -
*Server to **Client **:*
MESSAGE 
:

Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml

Content-Length: ...


   

:

   


*Client to Server:*

SIP/2.0 200 OK

:

Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml

Content-Length: ...


   

:

   

Regards

Abhishek
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Re: [Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[abhishek jain]

I understand your point in the broadband environment, but actually, we have
very strict requirements of KPIs and limited bandwidth usage in the radio
environment in certain conditions that we would like to save every single
byte where possible.

I again appreciate your great help and time you gave me. It has been
awesome discussion with you.

Regards
Abhishek

On Sun, Apr 14, 2019 at 2:36 PM Paul Kyzivat  wrote:

> On 4/13/19 9:31 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
> > Thanks Paul for your great suggestions. Since, I don't want to add
> > traffic to network, so I don't want to use a separate set of SIP MESSAGE
> > request/response.
>
> I doubt that this would have any appreciable affect on your network
> traffic unless you are using MESSAGE is a really inappropriate way. If
> your traffic is that high then you probably ought to be establishing a
> direct channel for these messages.
>
> > Based on our requirements, I find your suggestion of
> > Content-ID header field option being really suitable. I am putting the
> > request/response snippet below as per my understanding from your
> > suggestion and various RFCs, please let me know if that looks good.
> >
> > For example -
> > *Server to Client :*
> > MESSAGE 
> > :
> > Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
> > Content-Length: ...
> > 
> > 
> >  :
> > 
> >
> > *Client to Server:*
> > SIP/2.0 200 OK
> > :
> > Call-Info: > >; purpose=info
> > Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
> > Content-Length: ...
> > content-ID:mailto:cn35t8j...@example.com>>
> > 
> > 
> >  :
> > 
>
> Why is the mailto stuff present above???
>
> I would expect just
>
> Call-Info:; purpose=info
> ...
> content-ID:
>
> Otherwise it looks reasonable.
>
> Thanks,
> Paul
>
> > Regards
> > Abhishek
> >
> > On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 4:36 PM Paul Kyzivat  > > wrote:
> >
> > On 4/13/19 4:43 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
> >  > Thanks Paul for your quick response on a Saturday. I really
> > appreciate.
> >  > I am wondering how to implement below without introducing another
> > pair
> >  > of SIP request/response, if you could suggest that would be great
> > with
> >  > SIP compliance -
> >  >
> >  > 1. My server sending some configurations to client using SIP
> MESSAGE
> >  > 2. Client may apply some of them, so client should respond back
> > with the
> >  > config that have been applied.
> >  >
> >  > Would you suggest to include a proprietary SIP header containing
> the
> >  > information to be conveyed to server ? What could be the max data
> a
> >  > header may contain ?
> >
> > I don't want to encourage you to use proprietary means. The most
> > straightforward way would be to use a separate MESSAGE in the reverse
> > direction.
> >
> > You *could* add a header field to the MESSAGE response. That wouldn't
> > violate the rules of MESSAGE. And you could have that header field
> > reference a body using a Content-ID URL (cid:). You can read about
> this
> > in RFC5621. But you then need to find a suitable header field that
> > contains a URL. (I don't recommend making up a new header field. It
> > won't be valid sip even though correct implementations should ignore
> > header fields they don't understand.)  You might be able to use
> > Call-Info with purpose=info because it is very loosely defined. In
> that
> > case you would use Content-Type to indicate the format of your body.
> > But
> > of course you then need your own MIME-type to use for that.
> >
> > If this is going to be an extended conversation then it would be
> better
> > to establish a dialog and then send your data within it. In that case
> > you could use INFO (RFC6086, *not* RFC2976). Note that this still
> > requires a separate request in each direction.
> >
> > Or, you could establish a media channel to send your data using MSRP.
> >
> > Or you could establish a data channel via
> > draft-ietf-mmusic-data-channel-sdpneg-25.
> >
> > There is no theoretical limit to the size of a header field or a
> body.
> > But once they get very big you will need a TCP or TLS connection
> rather
> > than UDP. And sip implementations may impose some limit.
> >
> >  Thanks,
> >  Paul
> >
> >
> >  > Regards
> >  > Abhishek
> >  >
> >  > On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 3:08 PM Paul Kyzivat
> > mailto:pkyzi...@alum.mit.edu>
> >  > >>
> wrote:
> >  >
> >  > On 4/13/19 3:58 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
> >  >  >>
> >  >  >> Hi,
> >  >  >> Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request)
> >  > contain a body ?
> >  >  >> I would appreciate a quick response.
> >  >
> >  > Sometimes. The rules vary depending on the type of mess

Re: [Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[Paul Kyzivat]

On 4/13/19 9:31 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
Thanks Paul for your great suggestions. Since, I don't want to add 
traffic to network, so I don't want to use a separate set of SIP MESSAGE 
request/response.


I doubt that this would have any appreciable affect on your network 
traffic unless you are using MESSAGE is a really inappropriate way. If 
your traffic is that high then you probably ought to be establishing a 
direct channel for these messages.


Based on our requirements, I find your suggestion of 
Content-ID header field option being really suitable. I am putting the 
request/response snippet below as per my understanding from your 
suggestion and various RFCs, please let me know if that looks good.


For example -
*Server to Client :*
MESSAGE 
:
Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
Content-Length: ...

    
     :
    

*Client to Server:*
SIP/2.0 200 OK
:
Call-Info:>; purpose=info

Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
Content-Length: ...
content-ID:mailto:cn35t8j...@example.com>>

    
     :
    


Why is the mailto stuff present above???

I would expect just

Call-Info:; purpose=info
...
content-ID:

Otherwise it looks reasonable.

Thanks,
Paul


Regards
Abhishek

On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 4:36 PM Paul Kyzivat > wrote:


On 4/13/19 4:43 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
 > Thanks Paul for your quick response on a Saturday. I really
appreciate.
 > I am wondering how to implement below without introducing another
pair
 > of SIP request/response, if you could suggest that would be great
with
 > SIP compliance -
 >
 > 1. My server sending some configurations to client using SIP MESSAGE
 > 2. Client may apply some of them, so client should respond back
with the
 > config that have been applied.
 >
 > Would you suggest to include a proprietary SIP header containing the
 > information to be conveyed to server ? What could be the max data a
 > header may contain ?

I don't want to encourage you to use proprietary means. The most
straightforward way would be to use a separate MESSAGE in the reverse
direction.

You *could* add a header field to the MESSAGE response. That wouldn't
violate the rules of MESSAGE. And you could have that header field
reference a body using a Content-ID URL (cid:). You can read about this
in RFC5621. But you then need to find a suitable header field that
contains a URL. (I don't recommend making up a new header field. It
won't be valid sip even though correct implementations should ignore
header fields they don't understand.)  You might be able to use
Call-Info with purpose=info because it is very loosely defined. In that
case you would use Content-Type to indicate the format of your body.
But
of course you then need your own MIME-type to use for that.

If this is going to be an extended conversation then it would be better
to establish a dialog and then send your data within it. In that case
you could use INFO (RFC6086, *not* RFC2976). Note that this still
requires a separate request in each direction.

Or, you could establish a media channel to send your data using MSRP.

Or you could establish a data channel via
draft-ietf-mmusic-data-channel-sdpneg-25.

There is no theoretical limit to the size of a header field or a body.
But once they get very big you will need a TCP or TLS connection rather
than UDP. And sip implementations may impose some limit.

         Thanks,
         Paul


 > Regards
 > Abhishek
 >
 > On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 3:08 PM Paul Kyzivat
mailto:pkyzi...@alum.mit.edu>
 > >> wrote:
 >
 >     On 4/13/19 3:58 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
 >      >>
 >      >> Hi,
 >      >> Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request)
 >     contain a body ?
 >      >> I would appreciate a quick response.
 >
 >     Sometimes. The rules vary depending on the type of message.
 >
 >     But not for MESSAGE. RFC3480 (section 7) says:
 >
 >          A 2xx response to a MESSAGE request MUST NOT contain a body.
 >
 >              Thanks,
 >              Paul
 >
 >
 >      >> For example -
 >      >> *Server to **Client **:*
 >      >> MESSAGE 
 >      >> :
 >      >>
 >      >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
 >      >>
 >      >> Content-Length: ...
 >      >>
 >      >> 
 >      >>     
 >      >>
 >      >>      :
 >      >>
 >      >>     
 >      >>
 >      >>
 >      >> *Client to Server:*
 >      >>
 >      >> SIP/2.0 200 OK
 >      >>
 >      >> :
 >      >>
 >      >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
 >      >>
 >      >> Content-Length: ...
 >     

Re: [Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[abhishek jain]

Thanks Paul for your great suggestions. Since, I don't want to add traffic
to network, so I don't want to use a separate set of SIP MESSAGE
request/response. Based on our requirements, I find your suggestion of
Content-ID header field option being really suitable. I am putting the
request/response snippet below as per my understanding from your suggestion
and various RFCs, please let me know if that looks good.

For example -
*Server to Client :*
MESSAGE 
:
Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
Content-Length: ...

   
:
   

*Client to Server:*
SIP/2.0 200 OK
:
Call-Info:; purpose=info
Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
Content-Length: ...
content-ID:

   
:
   


Regards
Abhishek

On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 4:36 PM Paul Kyzivat  wrote:

> On 4/13/19 4:43 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
> > Thanks Paul for your quick response on a Saturday. I really appreciate.
> > I am wondering how to implement below without introducing another pair
> > of SIP request/response, if you could suggest that would be great with
> > SIP compliance -
> >
> > 1. My server sending some configurations to client using SIP MESSAGE
> > 2. Client may apply some of them, so client should respond back with the
> > config that have been applied.
> >
> > Would you suggest to include a proprietary SIP header containing the
> > information to be conveyed to server ? What could be the max data a
> > header may contain ?
>
> I don't want to encourage you to use proprietary means. The most
> straightforward way would be to use a separate MESSAGE in the reverse
> direction.
>
> You *could* add a header field to the MESSAGE response. That wouldn't
> violate the rules of MESSAGE. And you could have that header field
> reference a body using a Content-ID URL (cid:). You can read about this
> in RFC5621. But you then need to find a suitable header field that
> contains a URL. (I don't recommend making up a new header field. It
> won't be valid sip even though correct implementations should ignore
> header fields they don't understand.)  You might be able to use
> Call-Info with purpose=info because it is very loosely defined. In that
> case you would use Content-Type to indicate the format of your body. But
> of course you then need your own MIME-type to use for that.
>
> If this is going to be an extended conversation then it would be better
> to establish a dialog and then send your data within it. In that case
> you could use INFO (RFC6086, *not* RFC2976). Note that this still
> requires a separate request in each direction.
>
> Or, you could establish a media channel to send your data using MSRP.
>
> Or you could establish a data channel via
> draft-ietf-mmusic-data-channel-sdpneg-25.
>
> There is no theoretical limit to the size of a header field or a body.
> But once they get very big you will need a TCP or TLS connection rather
> than UDP. And sip implementations may impose some limit.
>
> Thanks,
> Paul
>
>
> > Regards
> > Abhishek
> >
> > On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 3:08 PM Paul Kyzivat  > > wrote:
> >
> > On 4/13/19 3:58 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
> >  >>
> >  >> Hi,
> >  >> Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request)
> > contain a body ?
> >  >> I would appreciate a quick response.
> >
> > Sometimes. The rules vary depending on the type of message.
> >
> > But not for MESSAGE. RFC3480 (section 7) says:
> >
> >  A 2xx response to a MESSAGE request MUST NOT contain a body.
> >
> >  Thanks,
> >  Paul
> >
> >
> >  >> For example -
> >  >> *Server to **Client **:*
> >  >> MESSAGE 
> >  >> :
> >  >>
> >  >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
> >  >>
> >  >> Content-Length: ...
> >  >>
> >  >> 
> >  >> 
> >  >>
> >  >>  :
> >  >>
> >  >> 
> >  >>
> >  >>
> >  >> *Client to Server:*
> >  >>
> >  >> SIP/2.0 200 OK
> >  >>
> >  >> :
> >  >>
> >  >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
> >  >>
> >  >> Content-Length: ...
> >  >>
> >  >> 
> >  >> 
> >  >>
> >  >>  :
> >  >>
> >  >> 
> >  >>
> >  >> Regards
> >  >>
> >  >> Abhishek
> >  >>
> >  >>
> >  >>
> >  >>
> >  > ___
> >  > Sip-implementors mailing list
> >  > Sip-implementors@lists.cs.columbia.edu
> > 
> >  > https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/sip-implementors
> >  >
> >
> > ___
> > Sip-implementors mailing list
> > Sip-implementors@lists.cs.columbia.edu
> > 
> > https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/sip-implementors
> >
>
>
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Sip-implementors@lists.cs.columbia.

Re: [Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[Paul Kyzivat]

On 4/13/19 4:43 PM, abhishek jain wrote:

Thanks Paul for your quick response on a Saturday. I really appreciate.
I am wondering how to implement below without introducing another pair 
of SIP request/response, if you could suggest that would be great with 
SIP compliance -


1. My server sending some configurations to client using SIP MESSAGE
2. Client may apply some of them, so client should respond back with the 
config that have been applied.


Would you suggest to include a proprietary SIP header containing the 
information to be conveyed to server ? What could be the max data a 
header may contain ?


I don't want to encourage you to use proprietary means. The most 
straightforward way would be to use a separate MESSAGE in the reverse 
direction.


You *could* add a header field to the MESSAGE response. That wouldn't 
violate the rules of MESSAGE. And you could have that header field 
reference a body using a Content-ID URL (cid:). You can read about this 
in RFC5621. But you then need to find a suitable header field that 
contains a URL. (I don't recommend making up a new header field. It 
won't be valid sip even though correct implementations should ignore 
header fields they don't understand.)  You might be able to use 
Call-Info with purpose=info because it is very loosely defined. In that 
case you would use Content-Type to indicate the format of your body. But 
of course you then need your own MIME-type to use for that.


If this is going to be an extended conversation then it would be better 
to establish a dialog and then send your data within it. In that case 
you could use INFO (RFC6086, *not* RFC2976). Note that this still 
requires a separate request in each direction.


Or, you could establish a media channel to send your data using MSRP.

Or you could establish a data channel via 
draft-ietf-mmusic-data-channel-sdpneg-25.


There is no theoretical limit to the size of a header field or a body. 
But once they get very big you will need a TCP or TLS connection rather 
than UDP. And sip implementations may impose some limit.


Thanks,
Paul



Regards
Abhishek

On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 3:08 PM Paul Kyzivat > wrote:


On 4/13/19 3:58 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
 >>
 >> Hi,
 >> Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request)
contain a body ?
 >> I would appreciate a quick response.

Sometimes. The rules vary depending on the type of message.

But not for MESSAGE. RFC3480 (section 7) says:

     A 2xx response to a MESSAGE request MUST NOT contain a body.

         Thanks,
         Paul


 >> For example -
 >> *Server to **Client **:*
 >> MESSAGE 
 >> :
 >>
 >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
 >>
 >> Content-Length: ...
 >>
 >> 
 >>     
 >>
 >>      :
 >>
 >>     
 >>
 >>
 >> *Client to Server:*
 >>
 >> SIP/2.0 200 OK
 >>
 >> :
 >>
 >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
 >>
 >> Content-Length: ...
 >>
 >> 
 >>     
 >>
 >>      :
 >>
 >>     
 >>
 >> Regards
 >>
 >> Abhishek
 >>
 >>
 >>
 >>
 > ___
 > Sip-implementors mailing list
 > Sip-implementors@lists.cs.columbia.edu

 > https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/sip-implementors
 >

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Re: [Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[abhishek jain]

Thanks Paul for your quick response on a Saturday. I really appreciate.
I am wondering how to implement below without introducing another pair of
SIP request/response, if you could suggest that would be great with SIP
compliance -

1. My server sending some configurations to client using SIP MESSAGE
2. Client may apply some of them, so client should respond back with the
config that have been applied.

Would you suggest to include a proprietary SIP header containing the
information to be conveyed to server ? What could be the max data a header
may contain ?

Regards
Abhishek

On Sat, Apr 13, 2019 at 3:08 PM Paul Kyzivat  wrote:

> On 4/13/19 3:58 PM, abhishek jain wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >> Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request) contain a
> body ?
> >> I would appreciate a quick response.
>
> Sometimes. The rules vary depending on the type of message.
>
> But not for MESSAGE. RFC3480 (section 7) says:
>
> A 2xx response to a MESSAGE request MUST NOT contain a body.
>
> Thanks,
> Paul
>
>
> >> For example -
> >> *Server to **Client **:*
> >> MESSAGE 
> >> :
> >>
> >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
> >>
> >> Content-Length: ...
> >>
> >> 
> >> 
> >>
> >>  :
> >>
> >> 
> >>
> >>
> >> *Client to Server:*
> >>
> >> SIP/2.0 200 OK
> >>
> >> :
> >>
> >> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
> >>
> >> Content-Length: ...
> >>
> >> 
> >> 
> >>
> >>  :
> >>
> >> 
> >>
> >> Regards
> >>
> >> Abhishek
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> > ___
> > Sip-implementors mailing list
> > Sip-implementors@lists.cs.columbia.edu
> > https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/sip-implementors
> >
>
> ___
> Sip-implementors mailing list
> Sip-implementors@lists.cs.columbia.edu
> https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/sip-implementors
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Re: [Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[Paul Kyzivat]

On 4/13/19 3:58 PM, abhishek jain wrote:


Hi,
Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request) contain a body ?
I would appreciate a quick response.


Sometimes. The rules vary depending on the type of message.

But not for MESSAGE. RFC3480 (section 7) says:

   A 2xx response to a MESSAGE request MUST NOT contain a body.

Thanks,
Paul



For example -
*Server to **Client **:*
MESSAGE 
:

Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml

Content-Length: ...




 :




*Client to Server:*

SIP/2.0 200 OK

:

Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml

Content-Length: ...




 :



Regards

Abhishek





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[Sip-implementors] XML Body in the 200 OK SIP Response of SIP MESSAGE

[abhishek jain]

>
> Hi,
> Can a Sip Response (to a Non-Dialog creating SIP Request) contain a body ?
> I would appreciate a quick response.
>
> For example -
> *Server to **Client **:*
> MESSAGE 
> :
>
> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
>
> Content-Length: ...
>
> 
>
>
> :
>
>
>
>
> *Client to Server:*
>
> SIP/2.0 200 OK
>
> :
>
> Content-Type: application/chat-info+xml
>
> Content-Length: ...
>
> 
>
>
> :
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> Abhishek
>
>
>
>
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