Re: [SLUG] Re: Two concurrent Gnome Desktops? (Shaun Butler)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi User a has a completely normal desktop. She is unaware that there is another. User b has a completely normal desktop. She is unaware that there is another. Choose which desktop you wish to own with ctrlalt and continue. The screen-saver even obeys the rules of the visible desktop, while the invisible DT is ignored. We do, and have for years, run with 4 desktops. This is how it does work, not a theory of how it may or may not work. The advantage of using gdmflexiserver is that it is dynamic (only invoke new X servers and greeters when required) and it integrates nicely into things like xscreensaver's locking functionality. You can set up multiple X servers manually, sure, but that's much further away from what XP has, and 'normal' users won't be looking to set things up like that. The beast is dead! but I still don't agree: For me: user c and d don't know, and don't want to know computer stuff. They do ctrlaltF3 and F4 and each has their familiar world: login, use, exit etc User a runs his session, starts other sessions on F5, F6 etc as required, can relinquish the console for a cuppa while b, c or d check mail and can continue at his lesuire. I contend that ctrlaltF3 is simpler than any mouse-menu-option. This is a way, if you like it, use it, if you don't ditch it. Even more so as c, d use kde, and gnome, a and b use icewm. James James and Jeff - Thankyou very much for your responses. I've tried both suggestions and they both work fine. Pressing crtlaltF8 is a hell of a lot easier than having to log out of one account and logging into the other! One thing I have noticed is that the second account (i.e. the user who logs in after the first user) seems to have trouble with the following: - Audio Device - Gnome says that there is no audio device on the second user whereas it is working fine one the desktop/session of the first user - Digital Camera - When I plugged my digital camera in and tried to download my photos using gtkam, I was unable to connect to the camera in the second user's session but I was able to successfully connect using gtkam in the first user' session Its almost as if the first user/session is capturing those items rendering them unable to be used by subsequent sessions? Any suggestions would be appreciated Shaun -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Re: Two concurrent Gnome Desktops? (Shaun Butler)
quote who=Shaun Butler - Audio Device - Gnome says that there is no audio device on the second user whereas it is working fine one the desktop/session of the first user This is either because the second user is not in the audio group or because the first user has already opened the device, and the hardware only supports a single writer. - Digital Camera - When I plugged my digital camera in and tried to download my photos using gtkam, I was unable to connect to the camera in the second user's session but I was able to successfully connect using gtkam in the first user' session Almost certainly also a group issue. - Jeff -- linux.conf.au 2005: Canberra, Australiahttp://linux.conf.au/ I can't imagine anyone telling Emma Bunton to shut up. It would be rather like slapping Bambi. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Anthony Gray's invitation
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Re: [SLUG] Skype report
* Alan L Tyree ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: RE: earlier problems with sound and Skype. I never did get Skype working on Debian Sarge, Worked out of the box here. Where are you having trouble? The microphone? Speakers? Or the gui just won't appear? Nick -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Linux rox...
Thanks Jeff, I have both installed. I find Gnome to be on the other extreme... a little lacking though admittedly far more polished, whereas KDE is more ad-hoc though vast in resources. The reason for sticking with KDE is Qt, which I quite like and plan to explore more. Marek Wawrzyczny On Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:29, Jeff Waugh wrote: quote who=Marek Wawrzyczny I've been working in a Mac only environment for 5 years now... I wish the Linux/KDE community takes more notice of what Apple has done with FreeBSD. (GNOME tends to pay more attention to sensible Apple stuff than KDE, if you're interested.) - Jeff -- GUADEC 2005: Stuttgart, Germany http://2005.guadec.org/ -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Two concurrent Gnome Desktops?
quote who=Peter Rundle I also never managed to solve the sound lock out problem. My system is running esd, and in theory esd sould manage/mix multiple audio out requests, but when the first user logs in and esd gets started, the esd process is owned by that user. Something also sets the permissions on the audio device to be u+rw only for that user, i.e no group prviledges. If as root you overrode the audio device to be g+rw, then the second user could play sound, but as soon as the first user logged out, esd died and the permissions of the audio device went back to root ownership. A better solution would obviously be for esd to be a system process started in /etc/init.d with a config somewhere that allowed the admin to define which users had access. Is this on a Red Hat like system? There are two problems involved here, and I think it's subtly different to the problem explained above. The first is that if your hardware doesn't support multiple writers, the second esd won't be able to open the device anyway. However, I don't think that's the problem you're seeing; I have a suspicion it might be related to consolehelper stuff in Red Hat like systems, which set special permissions for users who have logged in locally (at the console). I can't say for sure, but your problem is either a) you can't have a second writer with your hardware or audio driver, whether it's esd or not or b) consolehelper gives the first user exclusive access, blocking out the second. I never found out which bit of code was setting the privledges but it smacks of we know better something we all critise Microsoft of Whoa there... Now you're attributing systemic silliness to malice... And comparing it to Microsoft! Yowza. Let's stand back for a minute. The issue here is *caused by* either a) crappy modern audio hardware or b) sensible security policy defined by your distribution (which can be administered by you!). and an attitude that is detectable in Jeff's postings on this subject. I think jeff should take a few humility pills, and perhaps maybe accept that even if he does know better, as end users, that's not what we want. Dude, I don't make crappy modern audio hardware that doesn't do hardware mixing, nor do I define security policies for your distribution. Nowt to do with me, sorry to say (though it's nice to have a scapegoat). I've actually given up using Gnome because I just don't like the direction the development is going. This is of course a personal thing and others may love it but for me Gnome has just become annoying. Luckily, this issue is unrelated to GNOME, but regardless, I would love to hear more from you about what has turned you off about it. Whilst some of his arguments about dynamically running processes etc are somewhat valid, but we also know that when processes aren't in active use, the magic linux kernel tends to swap them out and recover the memory, which is so cheap and plentiful these days anyway that the whole argument is just so last centuary Providing a user interface that normal human beings can use is so last century? I think you may have misread my point... Also his just argued that we should get rid of the ctrl-alt-f1 etc to drop to a shell and include it into Gnome, because it's just another user session, and those mingettys man they must be chewing up CPU and memory! ;-) Ah, no, I did not say that at all. We were talking about different methods of providing multiple local X logins via GDM, which *does* provide a nicely dynamic way of doing it instead of having to configure it first (much like Windows XP and OS X). - Jeff -- GUADEC 2005: Stuttgart, Germany http://2005.guadec.org/ You gotta know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em, know when to walk away, and know when to run. - Kenny Rogers, The Gambler -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] video editing software
Hmmm. I'm about to start exploring video editing in Linux. Can anyone recommend any good sites and/or packages? Shaun Ashley Maher wrote: G'day, There are alot of good FOSS video editing software for linux. Does anybody know of any FOSS video editing software for the windows platform? Regards, Ashley -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Re: Two concurrent Gnome Desktops? (Shaun Butler)
Jeff Waugh wrote: quote who=Shaun Butler - Audio Device - Gnome says that there is no audio device on the second user whereas it is working fine one the desktop/session of the first user This is either because the second user is not in the audio group or because the first user has already opened the device, and the hardware only supports a single writer. - Digital Camera - When I plugged my digital camera in and tried to download my photos using gtkam, I was unable to connect to the camera in the second user's session but I was able to successfully connect using gtkam in the first user' session Almost certainly also a group issue. - Jeff You seem to have nailed it on the head. It is a permissions issue, though it keeps manifesting itself whenever a user logs out and back in again - somehow during the login process, the device has its ownership and permissions reset to 600. I'm going to do some further poking around to see what I can see... -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Two concurrent Gnome Desktops?
On Mon, 2005-02-07 at 09:24 +1100, Peter Rundle wrote: I also never managed to solve the sound lock out problem. My system is running esd, and in theory esd sould manage/mix multiple audio out requests, And it does. But it won't open up access to your sound card for all users unless you ask it to. If you tell esd to be 'public' and listen on a tcp socket, this problem will go away. By default, however it listens on a unix domain socket, which essentially gets file-like permissions that are probably blocking out your other session. The other way to do this is to tell esd to close the connection to the audio device when it's not using it. Then, when you switch users the device will be unlocked and it will work like you'd expect (similarly, the first esd will be able to re-open the device after control has been relinquished by the second one). The mechanism setting the permissions of your audio device is almost certainly pam_console. If it bothers you, you can turn it off and fall-back to the old way of doing things by putting /dev/dsp in the audio group etc. And please, if you've got issues with GNOME (or anything else), take them to a sensible forum. Like their bugzilla. James. -- There is no I in TEAM but there is an i in Ninja -- http://www.ninjaburger.com/sekrit/ signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Two concurrent Gnome Desktops?
quote who=James Gregory On Mon, 2005-02-07 at 09:24 +1100, Peter Rundle wrote: I also never managed to solve the sound lock out problem. My system is running esd, and in theory esd sould manage/mix multiple audio out requests, And it does. But it won't open up access to your sound card for all users unless you ask it to. If you tell esd to be 'public' and listen on a tcp socket, this problem will go away. (More details for everyone's benefit...) Although, to make it entirely clear, esd normally runs as a particular user, so unless you've explicitly configured it to run as a system daemon with the right *permanent* privileges, it will still suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous misfortunes like consolehelper switching permissions around. This is most often done on thin client systems, listening on a public interface (so the central server can connect to them and play sounds without any kind of interruption). So it would make sense to configure esd (or better, polypaudio) to run as a mostly unprivileged system daemon, listening on localhost, with all the client apps configured to talk to it. The only thing you're stuck with here is *any* process being able to connect to esd and play sounds! Which, btw, is precisely what consolehelper is designed to avoid... :-) - Jeff -- GUADEC 2005: Stuttgart, Germany http://2005.guadec.org/ It's like having someone say to you, 'You should get back together with your first wife. You guys were good together'. It's not that simple. - David Byrne on Talking Heads -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Two concurrent Gnome Desktops?
The mechanism setting the permissions of your audio device is almost certainly pam_console. If it bothers you, you can turn it off and fall-back to the old way of doing things by putting /dev/dsp in the audio group etc. take a look at /etc/security/console.perms.. Dave. -- David Airlie, Software Engineer http://www.skynet.ie/~airlied / airlied at skynet.ie pam_smb / Linux DECstation / Linux VAX / ILUG person -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
RE: [SLUG] Exporting applications from windows?
Hi all, The way I have seen this done is pretty much the same as the way you do it Windows server to Windows client. I use Citrix mainly, and sometimes Rdesktop. 1) Citrix metaframe: the Linux client is free but the server costs. Exports a whole desktop. Uses a more efficient protocol to transmit than does VNC, so appears quicker. Requires a Windows Application server set up. Good graphical display, limited only by the amount of memory you put in the Windows server. I think in our case the license cost vs. Windows desktop maintenance trade-off was something like 60 people. YMMV. 2) VNC: You need to pay for a Windows CAL for the access, again exports the whole desktop. Tends to run a bit slow over network boundaries, probably too slow for a normal user. 3) Tarantella. Don't know what the cost is, but may be better if you have a lot of things (eg mainframes) to connect to. Haven't tried it. 4) Sun Ray. The windows session is emulated via an intermediate Unix server and the thin client terminal is updated with the display. Uses Citrix or Tarantella to connect to a remote Windows application server. Graphics are good, but needs to be on the same network subnet. 5) Rdesktop. The Linux client is free but the server has to have a Windows Remote Desktop license enabled, plus an extra CAL for the user. Again, exports a whole desktop. This one is a lot easier to setup compared to Citrix, but the display is nowhere near as good. OK for remote maintenance but not really useful for running applications as the graphics gets spotty. Slightly better than using a KVM though! 6) Application available through a Portal, and the user just accesses it with a web browser. Requires something like a Tomcat server, and can involve lots of expensive software licenses. I have seen this run, although the demo application was an Excel Spreadsheet. Not useful for CAD or other graphical software but pretty impressive for ERP applications and other things that can be got running on the Internet. Come to think of it, I think you can run Open Office in server mode so theoretically you could use that to display to the server, and get the server to redirect the display as a web page. No, I have never tried this but it seems possible albeit limited to certain applications. Theoretically will work over WANs and international sites. Cheers, Jill. -Original Message- From: Karl Bowden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, 5 February 2005 10:13 PM To: slug-list Subject: Re: [SLUG] Exporting applications from windows? Yeah, I have seen them pop up quite a bit in terminal solutions. Has anybody had any experience with citrix? We already use VNC through the company for remote assistance, and for a few awked situations, but will not help in providing a smooth transition in this situation. I had also been thinking of using win4lin and exporting the win apps over X throught that means. Karl Bowden Ben de Luca wrote: I believe citrix makes this possible but its certainly not free($$$). On 05/02/2005, at 7:08 PM, Karl Bowden wrote: Is it possible to have an application running remotely on a Windows machine but appareing locally on a linux machine? I have been playing arround with rdesktop and a win2k machine. But I have only been able to export a complete desktop. What I am looking for is something more similar to the way X applications can be forwarded over a ssh session. If I am missing something obvious please clip me arround the ears, but a feature like this would much ease the transition to linux at my place of work. Karl Bowden -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- IMPORTANT NOTICES This email (including any documents referred to in, or attached, to this email) may contain information that is personal, confidential or the subject of copyright or other proprietary rights in favour of Aristocrat, its affiliates or third parties. This email is intended only for the named addressee. Any privacy, confidence, copyright or other proprietary rights in favour of Aristocrat, its affiliates or third parties, is not lost because this email was sent to you by mistake. If you received this email by mistake you should: (i) not copy, disclose, distribute or otherwise use it, or its contents, without the consent of Aristocrat or the owner of the relevant rights; (ii) let us know of the mistake by reply email or by telephone (+61 2 9413 6300); and (iii) delete it from your system and destroy all copies. Any personal information contained in this email must be handled in accordance with applicable privacy laws. Electronic and internet communications can be interfered with or affected by viruses
[SLUG] Re: slug Digest, Vol 23, Issue 17
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject: Re: [SLUG] video editing software From: Shaun Butler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 09:31:49 +1100 To: slug@slug.org.au To: slug@slug.org.au Hmmm. I'm about to start exploring video editing in Linux. Can anyone recommend any good sites and/or packages? Shaun, From LinuxJounal these maybe a bit dated now but: http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/6631 http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/5817 http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7794 just recently (Like November 2004) Kino was covered. http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7779 http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7615#comment-13492 Hope they help. Regards, Ashley -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Two concurrent Gnome Desktops?
Hi James and Jeff - Thankyou very much for your responses. I've tried both suggestions and they both work fine. Pressing crtlaltF8 is a hell of a lot easier than having to log out of one account and logging into the other! I've had this arrangement on my desktop for years so that the better half and myself can share the machine as Shuan described. One thing that I wanted to do was have the GDM login screen display which virtual screen it was running on, but never managed to get this to work. I was able to do it for the shell running on f1-f2, but I couldn't get which tty gdm was running on into the welcome message. GDM (and I'm not using at the mo, so this is a RFM) does that in the welcome message as Welcome to this.box:1 I had thin clients on my server and had myclient on myserver $DISPLAY is your friend. I also never managed to solve the sound lock out problem. My system is running esd, and in theory esd sould manage/mix multiple audio out requests, but when the first user logs in and esd gets started, the esd process is owned by that user. Something also sets the permissions on the audio device to be u+rw only for that user, i.e no group prviledges. If as root you overrode the audio device to be g+rw, then the second user could play sound, but as soon as the first user logged out, esd died and the permissions of the audio device went back to root ownership. A better solution would obviously be for esd to be a system process started in /etc/init.d with a config somewhere that allowed the admin to define which users had access. I never found out which bit of code was setting the privledges but it smacks of we know better something we all critise Microsoft of and an attitude that is The culprit is PAM. RedHat and SuSE do have (others must have) device-permission files in /etc. Find them and edit. (I have only SuSE boxen in front of me), there it is /etc/logindevperm usually stuff like :0 0600 /dev/amidi:/dev/amidi0:/dev/amidi1:/dev/amidi2:/dev/amidi3 :0 0600 /dev/audio:/dev/audio0:/dev/audio1:/dev/audio2:/dev/audio3:/dev/audioctl becomes :0 0666 /dev/amidi:/dev/amidi0:/dev/amidi1:/dev/amidi2:/dev/amidi3 :0 0666 /dev/audio:/dev/audio0:/dev/audio1:/dev/audio2:/dev/audio3:/dev/audioctl And any conflicts are not an issue, eg me and her both play a CD! Also SuSE is cunning: permissions / console eg :0 :1 etc. detectable in Jeff's postings on this subject. I think jeff should take a few humility pills, and perhaps maybe accept that even if he does know better, as end users, that's not what we want. I've actually given up using Gnome because I just don't like the direction the development is going. This is of course a personal thing and others may love it but for me Gnome has just become annoying. I can't get it to do what I want and I constantly have to battle to get it to stop doing things that I don't want it to do. Nautilus taking over my desktop is another example. I mostly use icewm, but for a few things I need a desktop and kde has the functionality (auto-mount your camera, display winders shares etc) and its perfect for my 80 yo grandmother who has no hope of being taught to keep Norton up to date, and not to open attachments ... she loves it. James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Exporting applications from windows?
Rowling, Jill wrote: Hi all, The way I have seen this done is pretty much the same as the way you do it Windows server to Windows client. I use Citrix mainly, and sometimes Rdesktop. 1) Citrix metaframe: the Linux client is free but the server costs. Exports a whole desktop. Uses a more efficient protocol to transmit than does VNC, so appears quicker. Requires a Windows Application server set up. Good graphical display, limited only by the amount of memory you put in the Windows server. I think in our case the license cost vs. Windows desktop maintenance trade-off was something like 60 people. YMMV. You can export just a single application with Citrix. Just 'publish' the app, and when people click the shortcut on their (linux) desktop, it authenticates, then opens the app. Works pretty well, shame you have to pay for citrix to get it dave -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Two concurrent Gnome Desktops?
I can't say for sure, but your problem is either a) you can't have a second writer with your hardware or audio driver, whether it's esd or not or b) consolehelper gives the first user exclusive access, blocking out the second. Now why on earth would I run two versions of esd when one is more than capable of accepting multiple concurrent connections? Why was esd written in the first place? so that crappy modern audio hardware could be shared amoung processes. So the logical and simple solution would be to start a single esd, not at the time the first user logs in, but as a permanetly running system deamon, and have all audio processes talk to esd. I.e esd provides the sound sevice missing from the original X-server architecture. If I recall that was Rasters original idea but somehow it got lost along the way. Mostly no doubt because certainly applications didn't support esd or decided that they prefered to invent their own alternate approach. Reading through the other postings it appears that with a bit of bashing I might be able to get my system to function in this manner. Providing a user interface that normal human beings can use is so last century? I think you may have misread my point... In this specific case, Your point was that the ctrl-alt-f7/f8 solution meant two X servers permanently running which you implied was a bad thing. My point was, that the other alternate (text based) logins where done using ctrl-alt-f1/f2...f6, so if your argument is valid that ctrl-alt-f7/f8 is the wrong way to go about it then you must also be arguing that the mingettys running to support all those mostly unused tty logins was also the wrong solution. However with todays massive amounts of memory and the kernels ability to swap out un-used processes, who cares? Not me actually. P. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] support for open source
After reading this poorly written article: http://analysis.itmanagersjournal.com/article.pl?sid=05/02/03/1918223tid=107tid=112 a friend asked me what was the most acceptable way to profit from open source. Having been sufficiently confused by the article it took some time to straighten him out, in which time I had mentioned providing support as a business model. Which got me thinking about a recent debacle at my current place of employ involving CVS. We use CVS. We find it more than adequate for our use. At some point something broke on the CVS server. I don't know if it was something related to CVS or something stupid about the platform it was deployed on (windows). I never experienced the problem in question. During the process of fixing this IT broke something else which was squared blamed on CVS and the Subversion advocates in the office took this as an opportunity for a revolution. IT had a go at Subversion I think, but nothing came of it. Meanwhile, weeks and weeks past where this problem with CVS wasn't fixed, and that ment the managers got involved. When they asked IT why no-one had fixed the problem yet, IT reluctantly admitted that none of them knew how to fix it. Managers being managers they immediately ordered IT to find someone who could fix the problem. That is, it was time to bring in the commercial support. IT found a company that did open source support in the US. They emailed them, they got no reply. In an amazing feat of persistence, they found a second company: Ximbiot. They replied offering a US$35,000/year support contract. IT knew they weren't going to pull this off, so they asked for a per incident price, none was offered. Ok fine. IT decided that switching to Subversion might not be such a bad thing after all.. maybe there's commercial support for it. Nope. There's commercial support for some suite of software that includes subversion, but not for subversion on its own. After more weeks and weeks management decided to fix the problem themselves. They called a proprietary revision control software company. Unfortunately it was one that engineering had used before and knew to suck. After much in-fighting, the decision was made to go with Perforce instead - which is actually pretty good. But seeing it was left in the hands of management it never got done. Last week I heard we'd signed a deal with Seapine. I have no idea how good that is, but apparently they have great commercial support. It's too late for my employer, we'll be using one proprietary system or another for the rest of our solvency. How about the rest of you? Does anyone know a good, preferably Australian, CVS support company? I wonder how hard it would be to start one. Most all software support I have seen for open source has been email based. Australia is pretty centralized, all you would need is a few techs per capital city to provide good on-site support. Trent -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] support for open source
quote who=QuantumG It's too late for my employer, we'll be using one proprietary system or another for the rest of our solvency. How about the rest of you? Does anyone know a good, preferably Australian, CVS support company? Man, unhappy story. :-( A huge part of the problem here is your last three words, and how well the industry is trained to think in those terms. You're looking for a product support company for a product that does not have a single company behind it [ let's not get into ownership and how it relates to copyright here ;-) ]. It is *really* hard to break that cycle: I ran into the same problem at a previous job, in an industry where do it yourself is the name of the game. Mind boggling. I can think of a few local consultants and consultancy shops who have expert knowledge of CVS - mostly because they use it intensively themselves - who almost certainly could have solved your problem. But they're not those CVS guys with the 1800-FIX-MY-CVS number. ;-) Major lesson to learn here: Use your local community resources, because they will either know the answer, or you'll have the cream of the commercial support crop at your fingertips (given that most are involved with, or at least read, their local community lists). - Jeff -- linux.conf.au 2005: Canberra, Australiahttp://linux.conf.au/ Building a Kernel is a requirement for Securing Servers. - Oscar Plameras -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] support for open source
Building a Kernel is a requirement for Securing Servers. - Oscar Plameras Oooh! Cheeky sig :-) On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:24:55 +1100, Jeff Waugh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: quote who=QuantumG It's too late for my employer, we'll be using one proprietary system or another for the rest of our solvency. How about the rest of you? Does anyone know a good, preferably Australian, CVS support company? Man, unhappy story. :-( A huge part of the problem here is your last three words, and how well the industry is trained to think in those terms. You're looking for a product support company for a product that does not have a single company behind it [ let's not get into ownership and how it relates to copyright here ;-) ]. It is *really* hard to break that cycle: I ran into the same problem at a previous job, in an industry where do it yourself is the name of the game. Mind boggling. I can think of a few local consultants and consultancy shops who have expert knowledge of CVS - mostly because they use it intensively themselves - who almost certainly could have solved your problem. But they're not those CVS guys with the 1800-FIX-MY-CVS number. ;-) Major lesson to learn here: Use your local community resources, because they will either know the answer, or you'll have the cream of the commercial support crop at your fingertips (given that most are involved with, or at least read, their local community lists). - Jeff -- linux.conf.au 2005: Canberra, Australiahttp://linux.conf.au/ Building a Kernel is a requirement for Securing Servers. - Oscar Plameras -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- Rob Sharp e: [EMAIL PROTECTED] w: quannum.co.uk j: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] support for open source
On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 12:42:59 +1000 QuantumG [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After much in-fighting, the decision was made to go with Perforce instead - which is actually pretty good. In comparison to CVS maybe. I'm using GNU Arch at home and Perforce at work using Perforce has made me *VERY* aware of just how good Arch really is. Does anyone know a good, preferably Australian, CVS support company? Back in the late 1990s I worked for a company that did all its development by way of tarballs emailed from developer to developer (however scary that may sound). When we moved to CVS, we had a guy come in, set it up on a Solaris box, and document how the developers were supposed to use it. We paid for about a month's worth of consulting for the setup and the developers maintained it after that. I wonder how hard it would be to start one. Probably not too hard, but I wonder how big the market is. Most companies seem pretty proficient at maintaining revsision control systems themselves. Erik -- +---+ Erik de Castro Lopo [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Yes it's valid) +---+ C++ : You won't live long enough to learn it all from experience. -- Peter Miller (author of Aegis) -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] prn - pdf
Is there a simple way to convert a scanned prn file to a pdf? Thanks, Alan -- Alan L Tyree http://www2.austlii.edu.au/~alan Tel: +61 2 4782 2670 Mobile: +61 405 084 990 Fax: +61 2 4782 7092 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] prn - pdf
Alan L Tyree wrote: Is there a simple way to convert a scanned prn file to a pdf? A prn file is usually either a PostScript file or a PCL file. See http://www.frogmorecs.com/arts/what_is_a_prn_file.html Try renaming the file to have an extension .ps and view it in ghostview (or less the file and see if it starts with Postscript at the top) If so you can convert it to PDF using ps2pdf. If its a PCL file the search google for PCL file viewer, download the software and see if you can export it to either PDF, PS or some image format. Then convert to PDF from there. Mike -- Michael Lake Chemistry, Materials Forensic Science, UTS Ph: 9514 1725 Fx: 9514 1460 [pls ignore idiot lawyer's msg below] -- UTS CRICOS Provider Code: 00099F DISCLAIMER: This email message and any accompanying attachments may contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient, do not read, use, disseminate, distribute or copy this message or attachments. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this message. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender expressly, and with authority, states them to be the views the University of Technology Sydney. Before opening any attachments, please check them for viruses and defects. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] prn - pdf
On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 16:46:02 +1100 Alan L Tyree [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a simple way to convert a scanned prn file to a pdf? You'll want to use prn2ps from the package sdf (Simple Document Parser). You'll be able to find it in debian fairly easily. Once you have a Postscript file, just run that through ps2pdf and presto. These docs will be helpful too: http://search.cpan.org/src/IANC/sdf-2.001/doc/ref/prn2ps.html Lindsay -- http://asymmetrics.net/~auxesis/ -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
