Re: Off Topic

[TrotFox Greyfoot]

Oh, don't forget that it's good for your skin!

Yes, I am joking... but I do know of people who have used it almost as
a hand lotion.  : /

I understand it can be a decent cleaner so long as you clean it off
with something else like kerosene?  I think I'll just stick to Formula
409.  : ]

Trot, the rarely sure, fox...


On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:21:29 -0500, Keith Taylor
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Geoff!
> It's great for that! Just be sure it doesn't get on grandfatheras it
> may take care of him too!
> Keith
> - Original Message -
> From: "Geoff Spenceley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> >Keith,
> 
> >  I use WD40 for weed killer around the track,
> >none ever touches my locos or the grandfather
> >clock!
> 
> Geoff


-- 
|  /\_/\   TrotFox \ Always remember,
| ( o o ) AKA Landon Solomon \ "There is a
|  >\_/<   [EMAIL PROTECTED]   \ third alternative." 

Re: Off Topic

[Keith Taylor]

Hi Geoff!
It's great for that! Just be sure it doesn't get on grandfatheras it
may take care of him too!
Keith
- Original Message - 
From: "Geoff Spenceley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" 
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2005 12:03 PM
Subject: Re: Off Topic


>Keith,

>  I use WD40 for weed killer around the track,
>none ever touches my locos or the grandfather
>clock!

Geoff

>- Original Message -
>From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> In a different time, I was a gunsmith. In days of old, "Blueing"
>was actually
>>  "Browning", and was accomplished by promoting rust to the exterior
>finish of a
>>  firearm and then steaming the finish, etc., etc.. On the right
firearm
>(or
>>  small cannon) it's a really beautiful finish.
>Hello Trent,
>I agree with you and Harry as well! I aside from messing with live
steam
>locomotives, also enjoy working on old clocks. I now won't even look at
>a clock where the owner "got it running again" by squirting WD into the
>works! They will take an old clock that has been in an attic where the
>temps reach well over 100°F amd cooked the oil into a gummy mess, then
>without taking it apart to properly clean it, will hose it down with
WD.
>This will make the gears move and the clock will run for a day or two,
>then as dirt clings to the coating of WD that's been slathered on
>everywhere, it becomes a grinding paste that laps away the pivot points
>and enlarges the openings in the movement's plates. As the WD turns to
>an almost glass hard crust and the clock slows down, they will blithly
>squirt away with yet more WD. After several treatments like this, they
>will bring the clock to some poor soul saying how they had "restored"
>their treasure heirloom and had it running great. But, it has stopped
>now, and must need something else to make it go. They "know" it isn't
>lack of lubrication, because they've used a quart of WD on it already!
>Like I said, I won't even look at those clocks, not only because the WD
>is a bear to remove, but mostly because during the time it was there
>holding the abrasive grains of dirt and mundge in the bearings, it has
>worn away the pivot holes so you now cannot locate the center to center
>distances of the clock's wheels and arbors. Nasty stuff, at least
around
>any sort of precision machinery!
>Keith
>
>


 

Re: Off Topic

[Gary]

Well, I guess from previous remarks it does not mean "removes grit, grime,
and muck".
~ Gary

| At 06:16 AM 2/10/05 -0800, you wrote:
| >So what does "displacement" mean ?  I'm guessing that it must "get
| >between" water molecules and whatever the water is in "contact" with.
|
| Royce,
| That's close enough.
|
| >So how does it do this?
|
|I have no clue.
|
| Regards,
| Harry
|
 

Re: Off Topic

[Arthur S.Cohen]

Royce,
To me WD-10 is only a very light viscosity oil without any additives.  More
like an SAE 5 oil if such a thing exists.  The adhesives that are affected
by this oil are soluble in mineral oil.  Then there's the "blowing" action
of the oil that gets the oil under the tape to wet the adhesive and begin to
dissolve the adhesive.  There are many types or formulas of adhesives.  Not
all are soluble with mineral oils.
Arthur--Mexico City

 Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ?   royce

Re: Off Topic

[Geoff Spenceley]

Keith,

 I use WD40 for weed killer around the track, 
none ever touches my locos or the grandfather 
clock!
Geoff
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
In a different time, I was a gunsmith. In days of old, "Blueing"
was actually
 "Browning", and was accomplished by promoting rust to the exterior
finish of a
 firearm and then steaming the finish, etc., etc.. On the right firearm
(or
 small cannon) it's a really beautiful finish.
Hello Trent,
I agree with you and Harry as well! I aside from messing with live steam
locomotives, also enjoy working on old clocks. I now won't even look at
a clock where the owner "got it running again" by squirting WD into the
works! They will take an old clock that has been in an attic where the
temps reach well over 100°F amd cooked the oil into a gummy mess, then
without taking it apart to properly clean it, will hose it down with WD.
This will make the gears move and the clock will run for a day or two,
then as dirt clings to the coating of WD that's been slathered on
everywhere, it becomes a grinding paste that laps away the pivot points
and enlarges the openings in the movement's plates. As the WD turns to
an almost glass hard crust and the clock slows down, they will blithly
squirt away with yet more WD. After several treatments like this, they
will bring the clock to some poor soul saying how they had "restored"
their treasure heirloom and had it running great. But, it has stopped
now, and must need something else to make it go. They "know" it isn't
lack of lubrication, because they've used a quart of WD on it already!
Like I said, I won't even look at those clocks, not only because the WD
is a bear to remove, but mostly because during the time it was there
holding the abrasive grains of dirt and mundge in the bearings, it has
worn away the pivot holes so you now cannot locate the center to center
distances of the clock's wheels and arbors. Nasty stuff, at least around
any sort of precision machinery!
Keith

Re: Off Topic

[Walt Swartz]

After WWII, thousands of German and Japanese long guns found there way to 
the US as the troops came home. My Dad fashioned a great "varmit" rifle 
chambered for .257 Roberts. A local 'old time' gunsmith helped Dad to 
formulate a blueing salts formula for the gun. I got involved in this. It 
was the hot boiling bath method and produced a fantastic patina. I don't 
know how many times we boiled and hand rubbed that piece of steel, but it 
took weeks to get the finish he wanted. That finish lasted for over 35 years 
and NEVER had WD on it - only Hoppee's(sp?)
There's a big difference between the depth and durability of the 'blue' you 
get with the cold method versus the hot boiling salts process.
Keep your steam up!
Mr. Lunkenheimer's associate, Walt
- Original Message - 
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Multiple recipients of sslivesteam" 
Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2005 11:17 PM
Subject: Re: Off Topic


Hello All,
  I was going to stay out of this conversation, but I second Harry's 
comments.
  Bear with me.
  In a different time, I was a gunsmith. In days of old, "Blueing" was 
actually
"Browning", and was accomplished by promoting rust to the exterior finish 
of a
firearm and then steaming the finish, etc., etc.. On the right firearm (or
small cannon) it's a really beautiful finish.
  When my mentor in the field taught me the process of "Browning", he used
aerosol type WD-40 to spray the surface. After a short period of time- 
sometimes
within a day or so- rust would start appearing. He said that without the 
WD-40,
the process was prolonged and the rust coverage would not be nearly as 
uniform.
I never doubted him, and never once deviated from the practice.
  At my job as a gunsmith, I regularly encountered firearms who's owners 
had
used WD-40 on them for *misguided* lubrication obtained from the back of 
the
can, or sometimes in attempt of a quick cleaning. Everything had a gummy,
tacky, varnish on it that was very difficult to remove.
  In my opinion, avoid WD-40 period. I've personally never seen a real use 
for
it. A perfect example of good marketing.
  If you need a lubricant, use a real lubricant. If you need a cleaner, 
use a
real cleaner. The CRC products are well engineered, as is the STIHL 
Penetrating
Oil. I get the STIHL product from my local chainsaw shop.

Later,
Trent
Quoting Harry Wade <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
At 01:36 PM 2/8/05 -0800, you wrote:
>Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ? - royce
Royce,
I used to . . .  but it wasn't important enough to remember for
very long.  Whatever it is its main quality, and what it was orginally
developed for, is "water displacement, thus "WD."  It has virtually no
lubricating qualities and very little protective qualities although it
certainly does displace moisture.  Unless something's been rained on I
don't know why anybody bothers to buy the stuff.
I have found what is a pretty good (and cheap) short-term
lubricant/preservative.  It's Pep Boys "Super Lubricant."  The best 
general
service penetrating preservative for the workshop I've found is CRC 
"3-36"
(#03005).

Regards,
Harry


-1wners had
used WD-40 on them for *misguided* lubrication obtained from the back of 
the
can, or sometimes in attempt of a quick cleaning. Everything had a gummy,
tacky, varnish on it that was very difficult to remove.
  In my opinion, avoid WD-40 period. I've personally never seen a real use 
for
it. A perfect example of good marketing.
  If you need a lubricant, use a real lubricant. If you need a cleaner, 
use a
real cleaner. The CRC products are well engineered, as is the STIHL 
Penetrating
Oil. I get the STIHL product from my local chainsaw shop.

Later,
Trent
Quoting Harry Wade <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
At 01:36 PM 2/8/05 -0800, you wrote:
>Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ? - royce
Royce,
I used to . . .  but it wasn't important enough to remember for
very long.  Whatever it is its main quality, and what it was orginally
developed for, is "water displacement, thus "WD."  It has virtually no
lubricating qualities and very little protective qualities although it
certainly does displace moisture.  Unless something's been rained on I
don't know why anybody bothers to buy the stuff.
I have found what is a pretty good (and cheap) short-term
lubricant/preservative.  It's Pep Boys "Super Lubricant."  The best 
general
service penetrating preservative for the workshop I've found is CRC 
"3-36"
(#03005).

Regards,
Harry




This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program.

Re: Off Topic

[Harry Wade]

At 06:16 AM 2/10/05 -0800, you wrote:
>So what does "displacement" mean ?  I'm guessing that it must "get 
>between" water molecules and whatever the water is in "contact" with. 

Royce,
That's close enough. 

>So how does it do this?

   I have no clue.

Regards,
Harry
 

Re: Off Topic

[Royce]

Harry Wade wrote:
  Whatever it is its main quality, and what it was orginally
developed for, is "water displacement, thus "WD."  . . . .  although it
certainly does displace moisture.  
Regards,
Harry
 

So what does "displacement" mean ?  I'm guessing that it must "get 
between" water molecules and whatever the water is in "contact" with. 
So how does it do this ?

And as another matter, how should such a product perform as opposed to 
just wiping off the water ?  I don't get it.  There seems to be some 
implied "rust preventative" property that would indicate that the 
product gets between the iron based substrate and oxides forming at the 
surface to prevent further rust ?

I should point out that my interest is not in it's rust prevention or 
lubricating properties, but as a release agent capable of "getting 
between" glass and vinyl caulking.

I have checked the MSDS but some categories such as "aliphatic Petroleum 
Distillates" cover a range of hydrocarbons ranging for CH10 to CH50 
(numbers are supposed to be subscript for the chemists among us).  Not 
much help if you are trying to understand what's going on at the 
molecular level.

And of course, I wonder how the Club owner "discovered" that WD40 
disolved cocaine ?

The best to all.
royce 

Re: Off Topic

[Keith Taylor]

- Original Message - 
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>In a different time, I was a gunsmith. In days of old, "Blueing"
was actually
> "Browning", and was accomplished by promoting rust to the exterior
finish of a
> firearm and then steaming the finish, etc., etc.. On the right firearm
(or
> small cannon) it's a really beautiful finish.
Hello Trent,
I agree with you and Harry as well! I aside from messing with live steam
locomotives, also enjoy working on old clocks. I now won't even look at
a clock where the owner "got it running again" by squirting WD into the
works! They will take an old clock that has been in an attic where the
temps reach well over 100°F amd cooked the oil into a gummy mess, then
without taking it apart to properly clean it, will hose it down with WD.
This will make the gears move and the clock will run for a day or two,
then as dirt clings to the coating of WD that's been slathered on
everywhere, it becomes a grinding paste that laps away the pivot points
and enlarges the openings in the movement's plates. As the WD turns to
an almost glass hard crust and the clock slows down, they will blithly
squirt away with yet more WD. After several treatments like this, they
will bring the clock to some poor soul saying how they had "restored"
their treasure heirloom and had it running great. But, it has stopped
now, and must need something else to make it go. They "know" it isn't
lack of lubrication, because they've used a quart of WD on it already!
Like I said, I won't even look at those clocks, not only because the WD
is a bear to remove, but mostly because during the time it was there
holding the abrasive grains of dirt and mundge in the bearings, it has
worn away the pivot holes so you now cannot locate the center to center
distances of the clock's wheels and arbors. Nasty stuff, at least around
any sort of precision machinery!
Keith

 

Re: Off Topic

[Gary]

Like usual there always are good uses for those things we think have no good
use on earth for.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,145014,00.html  And this qualifies me
for a daily double off topic award I believe!
Steaming & Sparking over Terror Trestle in Eugene, Oregon ~ Gary
http://www.angelfire.com/or/trainguy
http://community.webshots.com/user/raltzenthor


Unless something's been rained on I don't know why anybody bothers to buy
the stuff.
Regards,
Harry

 

Re: Off Topic

[tdowler]

Hello All,

   I was going to stay out of this conversation, but I second Harry's comments.
   Bear with me.
   In a different time, I was a gunsmith. In days of old, "Blueing" was actually
"Browning", and was accomplished by promoting rust to the exterior finish of a
firearm and then steaming the finish, etc., etc.. On the right firearm (or
small cannon) it's a really beautiful finish.
   When my mentor in the field taught me the process of "Browning", he used
aerosol type WD-40 to spray the surface. After a short period of time- sometimes
within a day or so- rust would start appearing. He said that without the WD-40,
the process was prolonged and the rust coverage would not be nearly as uniform.
I never doubted him, and never once deviated from the practice.
   At my job as a gunsmith, I regularly encountered firearms who's owners had
used WD-40 on them for *misguided* lubrication obtained from the back of the
can, or sometimes in attempt of a quick cleaning. Everything had a gummy,
tacky, varnish on it that was very difficult to remove.
   In my opinion, avoid WD-40 period. I've personally never seen a real use for
it. A perfect example of good marketing.
   If you need a lubricant, use a real lubricant. If you need a cleaner, use a
real cleaner. The CRC products are well engineered, as is the STIHL Penetrating
Oil. I get the STIHL product from my local chainsaw shop.

Later,
Trent


Quoting Harry Wade <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> At 01:36 PM 2/8/05 -0800, you wrote:
> >Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ? - royce
>
> Royce,
> I used to . . .  but it wasn't important enough to remember for
> very long.  Whatever it is its main quality, and what it was orginally
> developed for, is "water displacement, thus "WD."  It has virtually no
> lubricating qualities and very little protective qualities although it
> certainly does displace moisture.  Unless something's been rained on I
> don't know why anybody bothers to buy the stuff.
> I have found what is a pretty good (and cheap) short-term
> lubricant/preservative.  It's Pep Boys "Super Lubricant."  The best general
> service penetrating preservative for the workshop I've found is CRC "3-36"
> (#03005).
>
> Regards,
> Harry
>
>



-1wners had
used WD-40 on them for *misguided* lubrication obtained from the back of the
can, or sometimes in attempt of a quick cleaning. Everything had a gummy,
tacky, varnish on it that was very difficult to remove.
   In my opinion, avoid WD-40 period. I've personally never seen a real use for
it. A perfect example of good marketing.
   If you need a lubricant, use a real lubricant. If you need a cleaner, use a
real cleaner. The CRC products are well engineered, as is the STIHL Penetrating
Oil. I get the STIHL product from my local chainsaw shop.

Later,
Trent


Quoting Harry Wade <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> At 01:36 PM 2/8/05 -0800, you wrote:
> >Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ? - royce
>
> Royce,
> I used to . . .  but it wasn't important enough to remember for
> very long.  Whatever it is its main quality, and what it was orginally
> developed for, is "water displacement, thus "WD."  It has virtually no
> lubricating qualities and very little protective qualities although it
> certainly does displace moisture.  Unless something's been rained on I
> don't know why anybody bothers to buy the stuff.
> I have found what is a pretty good (and cheap) short-term
> lubricant/preservative.  It's Pep Boys "Super Lubricant."  The best general
> service penetrating preservative for the workshop I've found is CRC "3-36"
> (#03005).
>
> Regards,
> Harry
>
>





This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. 

Re: Off Topic

[Mike Eorgoff]

Royce,
There are MSDS at wd40.com

Mike Eorgoff


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.6 - Release Date: 2/7/2005
 

RE: Off Topic

[Daniel McGrath]

Don't know what's in WD40 but I buy it by the gallon.. great stuff, right up there with Duct Tape.
Daniel J. McGrath
 >From: Royce Woodbury <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: sslivesteam@colegroup.com >To: Multiple recipients of sslivesteam  >Subject: Off Topic >Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 13:36:40 -0800 > > >Hi folks. > This may be off topic, but since it's been so slow, I thought >maybe it wouldn't be objectionable. > >Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ? Specifically, I'm >interested in the property that causes tape adhesive to release from >whatever it's stuck to. > >royce > >> >> > 
 

Re: Off Topic

[Harry Wade]

At 01:36 PM 2/8/05 -0800, you wrote:
>Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ? - royce

Royce,
I used to . . .  but it wasn't important enough to remember for
very long.  Whatever it is its main quality, and what it was orginally
developed for, is "water displacement, thus "WD."  It has virtually no
lubricating qualities and very little protective qualities although it
certainly does displace moisture.  Unless something's been rained on I
don't know why anybody bothers to buy the stuff.
I have found what is a pretty good (and cheap) short-term
lubricant/preservative.  It's Pep Boys "Super Lubricant."  The best general
service penetrating preservative for the workshop I've found is CRC "3-36"
(#03005).

Regards,
Harry
 

Off Topic

[Royce Woodbury]

Hi folks.
   This may be off topic, but since it's been so slow, I thought maybe 
it wouldn't be objectionable.

Does anybody out there know what's in WD-40 ?  Specifically, I'm 
interested in the property that causes tape adhesive to release from 
whatever it's stuck to.

royce
 

Re: Off topic: Hamster-Powered Night Light

[Geoff Spenceley]

jeffrey Williams wrote:

Live steamers aren't the only maniac tinkerers in the world!
>
>http://www.otherpower.com/hamster.html


  Amazing--we need about 4 billion hamsters in California--if the animal
rights people don't get there first!

Geoff.


 

Off topic: Hamster-Powered Night Light

[Jeffrey Williams]

Live steamers aren't the only maniac tinkerers in the world!
http://www.otherpower.com/hamster.html

Re: Lucas /off topic

[Phil. Paskos]

I had an MG-B. The windshield wipers worked great until it rained. Then they
didn't work at all.

Enough already;
Phil



>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Phil. Paskos" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > Ahh Yes;
> >
> > The only reason the Brits drink warm beer is because they have Lucas
> > refrigerators. o:)
> > Phil
> Oh yes! I remember well my encounters with "The Prince of Darkness!" My
> MGB-GT was cursed with Lucas Electrics
> Keith Taylor
>
>

 

Way off Topic: Double Dog Dare!

[Terry Griner]

I know this is off topic but I think you all will enjoy it, I did!
Terry Griner
Columbus Ohio USA

>From Blacksmiths Virtual Junkyard:

The DOUBLE DOG DARE... Close your eyes.And go back in time Before the 
Internet or the MAC, Before semi automatics and crack Before SEGA or Super 
Nintendo... Way back I'm talking about hide and seek at dusk. The Good 
Humor man, Red light, green light. The corner store. Hopscotch, butterscotch, 
double dutch, jacks, kickball, dodge ball. Mother May I? Red Rover and Roly Poly 
Hula Hoops Running through the sprinkler The smell of the sun and licking salty 
lips Wax lips and mustaches An ice cream cone on a warm summer night 
Chocolate or vanilla or strawberry or maybe butter pecan. A cherry coke from 
the fountain at the corner drug store Wait.. 

Watching Saturday Morning cartoons... short commercials Fat Albert, Road Runner, 
He-Man, The Three Stooges, and Bugs, Or staying up for Gunsmoke Or back 
further, listening to Superman on the radio When around the corner 
seemed far away, And going downtown seemed like going somewhere. A million 
mosquito bites. Sticky fingers. Cops and Robbers, Cowboys and Indians, Zorro. 
Climbing trees, Building igloos out of snow banks Walking to school, no matter 
what the weather. Running till you were out of breath Laughing so hard that your 
stomach hurt Jumping on the bed. Pillow fights Spinning around, getting dizzy 
and falling down was cause for giggles. Being tired from playing Remember 
that? The worst embarrassment was being picked last for a team. War was a card 
game. Water balloons were the ultimate weapon. Baseball cards in the spokes 
transformed any bike into a motorcycle. 

I'm not finished just yet... eating Kool-aid powder Remember when... there were 
two types of sneakers for girls and boys (Keds & PF Flyers) and the only time 
you wore them at school, was for "gym." It wasn't odd to have two or three 
"best" friends. When nobody owned a purebred dog. When a quarter was a decent 
allowance, and another quarter a miracle. When milk went up one cent and 
everyone talked about it for weeks? When you'd reach into a muddy gutter for a 
penny. When you got your windshield cleaned, oil checked, and gas pumped, 
without asking, for free, every time. And, you didn't pay for air. And, you got 
trading stamps to boot! When laundry detergent had free glasses, dishes or 
towels hidden inside the box. When nearly everyone's mom was at home when 
the kids got there. When it took five minutes for the TV to warm up, if you even 
had one. When your Mom wore nylons that came in two pieces. It was magic when 
dad would "remove" his thumb. When it was considered a great privilege to be 
taken out to dinner at a real restaurant with your parents. When girls neither 
dated nor kissed until late high school, if then. When all of your male 
teachers wore neckties and female teachers had their hair done. When any parent 
could discipline any kid, or feed him or use him to carry groceries, and nobody, 
not even the kid, thought a thing of it. When they threatened to keep kids back 
a grade if they failed, and did! When being sent to the principal's office was 
nothing compared to the fate that awaited a misbehaving student at home. 
Basically, we were in fear for our lives but it wasn't because of drive -by 
shootings, drugs, gangs, etc. Our parents and grandparents were a much bigger 
threat! And some of us are still afraid of them!!!

Didn't that feel good.. just to go back and say, Yeah, I remember that! 
Remember when Decisions were made by going "eeny-meeny-miney-mo." 
Mistakes were corrected by simply exclaiming, "do over!" "Race issue" meant 
arguing about who ran the fastest. Money issues were handled by whoever was the 
banker in "Monopoly." The worst thing you could catch from the opposite 
sex was cooties. It was unbelievable that dodge ball wasn't an Olympic event. 
Having a weapon in school, meant being caught with a slingshot. Nobody was 
prettier than Mom. Scrapes and bruises were kissed and made better. 
Taking drugs meant orange-flavored chewable aspirin. Ice cream was considered a 
basic food group. Getting a foot of snow was a dream come true. Abilities were 
discovered because of a "double-dog-dare." Older siblings were the 
worst tormentors, but also the fiercest protectors.

If you can remember most or all of these, then you have LIVED Pass this on 
to anyone who may need a break from their "grown up" life... I Double Dog dare 
ya! 

Off Topic Train Joke

[Terry Griner]

My wife told me this joke, and I thought you all would get a laugh...

While on a train a little boy asks his mother, If big dogs have little dogs, and big 
cats have little cats, why don't big trains have little trains?
Well his mother couldn't answer this, so she told the little boy to ask the conductor.
The little boy told the conductor, My mommy says you can tell me why if big dogs have 
little dogs and big cats have little cats, why don't big trains have little trains?
The conductor answered, Tell your mommy the reason is that the Sante Fe always pulls 
out on time!

Terry Griner
Columbus Ohio USA

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Mike Chaney]

Trent asked:-

> The reason that I mention this is to ask a question. Has
> anyone ever built a working dynamo for a one of our small steamers? I've
seen
> several on the larger scales but none smaller than on a 1" scale
locomotive. .

Yes, it's been done.  A young and tiresome friend of mine arrived at a
steam-up some years ago with a Mamod with a simple oscillator on the
footplate driving a Portescap motor.  These motors are so efficient that
they can be used as dynamos and this one was powering a small headlight.

I said he was tiresome - the oscillator used so much of the Mamod's valuable
steam that he spent most of his time blocking the main line waiting to
regain enough pressure to move the loco.  The headlight worked a treat,
though!

Mike
 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Keith Manison]

Trent Dowler wrote:
> 
> don't even remember who sent me the pic. Somehow, I can imagine Chip Rosenblum (sp?) 
>being involved. 


Trent,

I sent Chip a copy and asked him if he was the culprit. His reply:

>No, but I sure wish I had!!!

Cheers

Keith

-- 
===
Keith Manison   Phone (876)702-0337
7 Mulberry CloseFax   (876)702-0661
Jacks Hill P.A.Email [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Kingston 6, Jamaica W.I. 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Trent Dowler]

Does anyone know who I can give credit to for the design of the "Pisser" locomotive?
I don't even remember who sent me the pic. Somehow, I can imagine Chip Rosenblum
(sp?) being involved. 

Later,
Trent


[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> That'a friggin' hilarious!!!
> > 
 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Trent Dowler]

Royce,

  I know your message was to Dave, but I too used the term "sexual
content" when describing the picture.
  Not meaning to bring the posting of the picture completely off
subject...  Although not typically considered "sexual", it is not usually
acceptible for public display due to the nudity aspect of the event. That,
and we do have at least one lady that is a list subscriber.
  Just covering my own butt. (Pun intended. )

Later,
Trent


Royce Woodbury wrote:

> I don't want to split hairs, but in MOST cases, pissing is not sexual.
 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[trotfox]

That'a friggin' hilarious!!!

Trot, the impressed, fox...  ;]

On Fri, 29 Jun 2001, Dave Cole wrote:

> At 11:32 AM -0500 6/28/01, Trent Dowler wrote:
> >   I have a picture that someone gave me of a very simple steam turbine
> >locomotive design that I would be happy to share with the list if it is not
> >deemed inappropriate by the list mom. It is VERY comical, but is of bad taste
> >and has a strong sexual content. I know that you all think I'm kidding (or
> >crazy) but it's the truth.
>
> trent's picture -- which is reminiscent of the garden statuary where
> the little boy is filling the fountain, if you get my drift (and for
> those that don't, look at the name of the picture file) -- is at:
>
> 


 /\_/\TrotFox\ Always remember,
( o o )  AKA Landon Solomon   \ "There is a
 >\./< [EMAIL PROTECTED] \ third alternative."
 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Royce Woodbury]

I don't want to split hairs, but in MOST cases, pissing is not sexual.

royce

Dave Cole wrote:
has a strong sexual content.

> -- is at:
>
> 
>
 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Dave Cole]

At 11:32 AM -0500 6/28/01, Trent Dowler wrote:
>   I have a picture that someone gave me of a very simple steam turbine
>locomotive design that I would be happy to share with the list if it is not
>deemed inappropriate by the list mom. It is VERY comical, but is of bad taste
>and has a strong sexual content. I know that you all think I'm kidding (or
>crazy) but it's the truth.

trent's picture -- which is reminiscent of the garden statuary where 
the little boy is filling the fountain, if you get my drift (and for 
those that don't, look at the name of the picture file) -- is at:




-- 
^^^
Dave Cole
Gen'l Sup't:  Grand Teton & Everglades Steam Excursion Co.
   Pacifica, Calif. USA  
List Mom: sslivesteam, the list of small-scale live steamers
   
Editor:   TRELLIS & TRESTLE, the newsletter of the
   Bay Area Garden Railway Society 
   
Webconductor: Pacific Coast Live Steamers 
   
^^^ 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Trent Dowler]

Hello Steve,

  "Elmer's Engines" is a book that has about 50 or so engine plans from the late
Elmer Verburg. He wasn't Greek.  He wrote a lot of articles for Modeltec
magazine and if I understand correctly, all the engines in the book were once
published in the magazine. The book has been out of print for several years now
and is rather hard to find.
  The chapter with the turbine plans also has a centrifugal pump. I never built
the pump but it looks like a neat and unusual project. My turbine powers a small
dynamo and a light. The reason that I mention this is to ask a question. Has
anyone ever built a working dynamo for a one of our small steamers? I've seen
several on the larger scales but none smaller than on a 1" scale locomotive. I'm
thinking perhaps a scaled down turbine coupled to a vibrator motor out of a
beeper (pager). I've never messed with one of the little motors so it may not be
well suited to be used as a dynamo. Ideas from the gallery?

Later,
Trent


"Ciambrone, Steve @ OS" wrote:

> I am not familiar with "Elmers Engine", at first I thought you made a
> mistake and meant "Hero's Engine" you know the ancient Greek Dude.
 

Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Charles Brumbelow]

Volume 2 of "Steam and Stirling" has another turbine . . . one based on
Tesla's design, FWIW.  Charles

From: "Trent Dowler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

>   Steam and Stirling. I've been going to get that book but just never
broke down
> and ordered it. Now I have a reason. 
>   The turbine that I made was not reversible but now I can see how it
could be
> built in that configuration quite easily if the blades were made straight
> instead of angled or curved. Mine is quite a bit smaller that the one that
you
> built but could be scaled up and have more blades. The turbine blades were
> machined on a CNC and didn't have a balance problem. If there had been a
balance
> problem I planned to make shallow "peck drills" on the heavy side of the
disk to
> balance it.
>   From memory, mine has a series of 24 holes, of 3/32" diameter, drilled
on a 1"
> (+/-) bolt circle, on a 1.1/4" (+/-) disk, that is about 1/8" (+/-) thick.
The
> holes have a slot machined from the holes to the edge of the disk at an
angle.
> The exact angle escapes me right now but it's around 7 to 10 degrees.
>   My turbine followed the "Elmer's Engines" design very closely with only
a
> couple of minor changes due to material on hand. Pictures of my turbine
would be
> rather plain looking without disassembling everything and I really don't
have
> much of a way to get pictures on the web right now anyway.

 

RE: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Ciambrone, Steve @ OS]

I am not familiar with "Elmers Engine", at first I thought you made a
mistake and meant "Hero's Engine" you know the ancient Greek Dude.  

Sincerely
Steve Ciambrone
Sr. Test Engineer
L-3 Ocean Systems

-Original Message-
From:   Trent Dowler [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:   Thursday, June 28, 2001 9:32 AM
To: Multiple recipients of sslivesteam
Subject:Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off
topic alittle !  ?

Hello Steve,

  Steam and Stirling. I've been going to get that book but just
never broke down
and ordered it. Now I have a reason. 
  The turbine that I made was not reversible but now I can see how
it could be
built in that configuration quite easily if the blades were made
straight
instead of angled or curved. Mine is quite a bit smaller that the
one that you
built but could be scaled up and have more blades. The turbine
blades were
machined on a CNC and didn't have a balance problem. If there had
been a balance
problem I planned to make shallow "peck drills" on the heavy side of
the disk to
balance it.
  From memory, mine has a series of 24 holes, of 3/32" diameter,
drilled on a 1"
(+/-) bolt circle, on a 1.1/4" (+/-) disk, that is about 1/8" (+/-)
thick. The
holes have a slot machined from the holes to the edge of the disk at
an angle.
The exact angle escapes me right now but it's around 7 to 10
degrees.
  My turbine followed the "Elmer's Engines" design very closely with
only a
couple of minor changes due to material on hand. Pictures of my
turbine would be
rather plain looking without disassembling everything and I really
don't have
much of a way to get pictures on the web right now anyway.
  I have a picture that someone gave me of a very simple steam
turbine
locomotive design that I would be happy to share with the list if it
is not
deemed inappropriate by the list mom. It is VERY comical, but is of
bad taste
and has a strong sexual content. I know that you all think I'm
kidding (or
crazy) but it's the truth. If the list mom decides against it being
posted (very
likely) I'll see if I can grab some web space somewhere and post it
for a few
days.

Later,
Trent
 

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Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Trent Dowler]

Hello Steve,

  Steam and Stirling. I've been going to get that book but just never broke down
and ordered it. Now I have a reason. 
  The turbine that I made was not reversible but now I can see how it could be
built in that configuration quite easily if the blades were made straight
instead of angled or curved. Mine is quite a bit smaller that the one that you
built but could be scaled up and have more blades. The turbine blades were
machined on a CNC and didn't have a balance problem. If there had been a balance
problem I planned to make shallow "peck drills" on the heavy side of the disk to
balance it.
  From memory, mine has a series of 24 holes, of 3/32" diameter, drilled on a 1"
(+/-) bolt circle, on a 1.1/4" (+/-) disk, that is about 1/8" (+/-) thick. The
holes have a slot machined from the holes to the edge of the disk at an angle.
The exact angle escapes me right now but it's around 7 to 10 degrees.
  My turbine followed the "Elmer's Engines" design very closely with only a
couple of minor changes due to material on hand. Pictures of my turbine would be
rather plain looking without disassembling everything and I really don't have
much of a way to get pictures on the web right now anyway.
  I have a picture that someone gave me of a very simple steam turbine
locomotive design that I would be happy to share with the list if it is not
deemed inappropriate by the list mom. It is VERY comical, but is of bad taste
and has a strong sexual content. I know that you all think I'm kidding (or
crazy) but it's the truth. If the list mom decides against it being posted (very
likely) I'll see if I can grab some web space somewhere and post it for a few
days.

Later,
Trent
 

RE: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Dave Cole]

At 12:46 PM -0400 6/27/01, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>I don't know...  Seems on topic to me so long as you run it on steam!  };]

agreed.

\dmc

-- 
^^^
Dave Cole
Gen'l Sup't:  Grand Teton & Everglades Steam Excursion Co.
   Pacifica, Calif. USA  
List Mom: sslivesteam, the list of small-scale live steamers
   
Editor:   TRELLIS & TRESTLE, the newsletter of the
   Bay Area Garden Railway Society 
   
Webconductor: Pacific Coast Live Steamers 
   
^^^ 

RE: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[trotfox]

I don't know...  Seems on topic to me so long as you run it on steam!  };]

At least keep me updated, this sound really interesting!  Got any pix?

Trot, the fox who likes phunky stuf...

On Tue, 26 Jun 2001, Ciambrone, Steve @ OS wrote:

> I have since bought a lathe/mill and am planning to build an all metal
> version when time allows.  I will see what I can do about pictures.
>
> Sincerely
> Steve Ciambrone
> Sr. Test Engineer
> L-3 Ocean Systems


 /\_/\TrotFox\ Always remember,
( o o )  AKA Landon Solomon   \ "There is a
 >\./< [EMAIL PROTECTED] \ third alternative."
 

RE: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off topic alittle ! ?

[Ciambrone, Steve @ OS]

I got the idea from a book titled "Steam and Sterling"  it showed a simple
turbine with just a half a dozen blades on it which is very inefficient,
also some inspiration from the new Wilesco Turbine Steam toy.  My turbine is
as stated 3" in diameter it uses two brass disks with band saw cuts made in
them every 10 degrees.  The disks were then offset 5 degrees and then the
blades were twisted 90 degrees.   This gives me a total of 72 blades far
more efficient than just 6.   I have been flying electric powered R/C planes
for 10 years so this stuff came from my scrap box.   Shaft and bearings from
an electric motor, 6:1 gear box from Model Electronics Corp., and a
propeller adapter from Astroflight.  I made a prototype housing of plywood
and hardwood, coated with epoxy.  The steam jets are at the bottom of the
housing pointed in opposite directions, one forward and one reverse.   The
exhaust is at the top and vents to atmosphere.  The turbine was balanced by
applying solder to the discs on the high side and spinning the turbine in
the bearings checking the balance.  When it stopped in no particular place
it was considered balanced.  Hey, this was just a proof of concept model.

Spool valves are used in Hydraulic controls and could also be considered
piston valves similar to the lower priced Locos like the Ruby.  Sliding the
spool or piston ports the steam to different outlets.  I made this on a
Unimat I borrowed from work, this is when I decided I did not want a Unimat.

I have since bought a lathe/mill and am planning to build an all metal
version when time allows.  I will see what I can do about pictures.

Sincerely
Steve Ciambrone
Sr. Test Engineer
L-3 Ocean Systems

-Original Message-
From:   Trent Dowler [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent:   Tuesday, June 26, 2001 4:22 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:Re: [SSSM] A Combined Cycle Locomotive? Sorry off
topic alittle ! ?

Steve,

  I'm intrigued with the turbine that you built. I've built a simple
turbine ("Elmer's
Engines" version) but really never saw a way to provide motive power
with it.
  Please enlighten me about the method that you used for the 6:1
reduction and the "spool
valve" that you built. I don't think I know what a spool valve is.
  Sounds like a great project. Any pictures available?

Later,
Trent

"Ciambrone, Steve @ OS" wrote:

>  I devised a simple spool valve for forward and
> reverse throttle control.  My turbine is fitted with a
> 6:1 gear reduction.


Promote this list to your friends who are interested in small scale
live steam trains.

The address for subscribing is:
www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/small_scale_steam_models 

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 


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Re: off-topic; on-topic ...

[Cgnr]

In a message dated 5/16/01 9:44:01 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

<< my Roundhouse Sammie is ordered, I'm 
 attending the Queen Mary >>
Be sure to bring it with you and run on my portable track!!
Bob 

Re: off-topic; on-topic ...

[Bruce Gathman]

On Wed, 16 May 2001 12:42:00 EDT, you wrote:

>Dear "mom" and all,
>
>I signed onto this list, oh, a couple of months ago, and just want to say 
>that it has been immensely helpful to me.  Just four months ago I knew 
>nothing about model railroading but was intrigued with the idea of a live 
>steam loco train running in my garden.  Thanks in large part to the on-list 
>and off-list help of all of you, my Roundhouse Sammie is ordered, I'm 
>attending the Queen Mary show to learn more, and I'm ready to buy my track, a 
>lot of track, and I'm happily building rolling stock.+
Make sure to take your loco to the show and I'm sure Bob will help you learn the
proper steamup procedures.
>
>All I have to do is move 20 tons of dirt in the backyard (funny, no one 
>mentioned that).
The assumption was that you know why they make Skidsteers or Bobcats.
>
>Thanks to all of you.
>
>Be of Good Cheer,
>
>Don +
>
>Fr Donald O. Cram
>Brandywine Railway & Navigation Company
>SM32, Fn3 and G Scales, Live Steam and Electric
>Rio Rancho, New Mexico, USA
>Wednesday, May 16, 2001 at 10:41:52 AM Mountain Time 

Re: off-topic; on-topic ...

[Jesse Grimmer]

Don,
I am just now completing my first track.  The one thing that I learned more
than anything about laying track is this:
DON'T BE AFRAID TO MESS UP!!  If you put something in the wrong place, just
cover it up and try again.  It is all part of the learning curve.  Speaking
of curves, steamers don't like anything less than the 16000 series curves,
and they don't like grades.  Keep it level, and keep your curves as wide as
possible.  Have fun.
Jess

 

Re: off-topic; on-topic ...

[Pipstow]

Dear "mom" and all,

I signed onto this list, oh, a couple of months ago, and just want to say 
that it has been immensely helpful to me.  Just four months ago I knew 
nothing about model railroading but was intrigued with the idea of a live 
steam loco train running in my garden.  Thanks in large part to the on-list 
and off-list help of all of you, my Roundhouse Sammie is ordered, I'm 
attending the Queen Mary show to learn more, and I'm ready to buy my track, a 
lot of track, and I'm happily building rolling stock.

All I have to do is move 20 tons of dirt in the backyard (funny, no one 
mentioned that).

Thanks to all of you.

Be of Good Cheer,

Don +

Fr Donald O. Cram
Brandywine Railway & Navigation Company
SM32, Fn3 and G Scales, Live Steam and Electric
Rio Rancho, New Mexico, USA
Wednesday, May 16, 2001 at 10:41:52 AM Mountain Time 

off-topic; on-topic ...

[Dave Cole]

from the list mom:

i'm of mixed emotions here ...

with little message traffic on the list over the last week, i was 
happy to see the exchanges of the last couple of days ...

but, i noticed something: a guy who had signed up for the list last 
week (he and i exchanged e-mail, so i know he's interested in the 
topic) signed off the list this morning. i haven't asked, but i bet a 
part of it was the issue that the messages of the last couple of days 
have had little to do with live steam.

in the time that the guy was on the list, he received 22 messages -- 
21 having nothing to do with live steam and one message only 
marginally relevant.

so, while i like to see messages, i think we need to keep focused.

and though people leave lists for many reasons, it is my experience 
that a high "signal-to-noise ratio" is the leading culprit.

please, keep your messages on topic and please avoid chiming in on 
off-topic discussions.

thanks.

\dmc


-- 
^^^
Dave Cole
Gen'l Sup't:  Grand Teton & Everglades Steam Excursion Co.
   Pacifica, Calif. USA <http://45mm.com/> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
List Mom: sslivesteam, the list of small-scale live steamers
   <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Editor:   TRELLIS & TRESTLE, the newsletter of the
   Bay Area Garden Railway Society <http://www.bagrs.org/>
   <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Webconductor: Pacific Coast Live Steamers <http://p-c-l-s.com/>
   <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
^^^ 

Re: Bit of info off topic but true

[Paul Trevaskis]

I carry locos in a saxaphone case, anything else is too short, with oil, no
gas.
Paul
Sydney Morning Herald
Monday, June 15th 1999:

"An employee for Ansett Australia, who happened to have the last name of
GAY, got on a plane recently using one of his company's "Free Flight"
programs.
However, when Mr. Gay tried to take his seat, he found it being occupied by
a paying passenger. So, not to make a fuss, he simply chose another seat.
Unknown to Mr. Gay, another Ansett Australia flight at the airport
experienced mechanical problems.
The passengers of this other flight were being rerouted to various
airplanes.
A few were put on Mr. Gay's flight and anyone who was holding a "free"
ticket was being "bumped".

Ansett officials, armed with a list of these "freebee" ticket holders
boarded the plane to remove the free ticket holders.
Of course, our Mr. Gay was not sitting in his assigned seat as you may
remember.
So when the Ticket Agent approached the seat where Mr.Gay was supposed to be
sitting,
she asked a startled customer "Are you Gay?".
The man, shyly nodded that he was, at which point she demanded: "Then you
have to get off the plane".
Mr. Gay, overhearing what the Ticket Agent had said, tried to clear up the
situation:
"You've got the wrong man. I'm Gay!".
This caused an angry third passenger to yell "Hell, I'm gay too! They can't
kick us all off!"
Confusion reined as more an more passengers began yelling that Ansett
Australia had no right to  remove gays from their flights.
Ansett refused to comment on the incident.

Kevin Strong wrote:

> After my last flight, I think they have banned people - and replaced
> them with two-legged cattle. I haven't run into any trouble transporting
> steam oil though. (I carry mine in an Elmer's glue bottle. The dispenser
> tip allows for easy filling of lubricators, too!)
>
> Later,
>
> K
>
> P.S. Empty the glue from the bottle first, though - otherwise things get
> a bit "sticky."
 

Re: Bit of info/off topic

[VR Bass]

> Un- believable; I can see it now. The airlines ultimately will ban people
> aboard their air planes. It's much to dangerous to allow human beings there.

We are significant producers of methane, after all, a highly flammable gas!

-vance- 

Re: Bit of info/off topic

[Phil. Paskos]

Un- believable; I can see it now. The airlines ultimately will ban people
aboard their air planes. It's much to dangerous to allow human beings there.
Hi to Geoff the happy riveter.

Phil.P. Reading,PA.



> I can understand the policy of the air lines on butane but not steam
> oil!!--It''s less flammable than the booze they carry on board, probably a
> lot less flammable than the airplane seats too! In the future I will put
> mine in a castor oil bottle and tell security it is because I am full of
> it!!
>
> Incidentally, fellow steamers, I have been quiet,  (lucky for you) cos I
am
> assembling an OS 3/4" scale Britannia Pacific for my 3-1/2" track  which
> is a larger scale than ssslivesteam.   But--but-- 45mm is still my
> favourite gauge!
>
>  Lubricated Geoff.

 

Re: Was windows/off topic

[Phil. Paskos]

Mike you hang in there. I know you will, but just remember that any small
victory you get  will taste that much better. If I'd do windows and I think
I will, I'll just use clear plastic about .015 thick.

Phil.P. Reading,Pa.



> Good Morning Carl ...
>
> Thanks for the info - I'm sorry to have taken so long to get back to you,
> but I've been working my socks off to get some more Shays finished in time
> for Diamondhead.  I'm managing to snatch a few minutes while the workshop
> heats up after last night's heavy frost (you wouldn't know about that in
> Texas!) to catch up with my mail.
>
> I took a look at the pics - the glazing certainly makes a difference to
the
> loco.  The glass looks quite thin: my memory of  picture glass is that
it's
> about 1/8" thick, but you've obviously found something much more delicate.
>
> If I do glaze the next loco, I think I shall design holders into the
> platework so the  glass slots in from the top with just a dab of adhesive
to
> stop it rattling.  No doubt you'll expect sliding windows and opening
doors
> next!
>
> Many thanks for the highly complimentary write-up in SitG - it should help
> to persuade those whose patience couldn't cope with my extended illness to
> think again.  The last year has been a bit of a nightmare - not just for
me,
> Ron has suffered alongside me - but I seem to be on the mend at long last.
>
> If this posting seems just a tad terse, it's because I'm teaching myself
to
> touch-type and the best I can manage so far without looking at the
keyboard
> is about 10wpm.  The most used key is the Backspace - when I can find it!
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Mike
>
>
>