Re: [sugar] July 31 - Sucrose 0.81.6 Tarballs Due
Le mercredi 30 juillet 2008 à 19:25 +0200, Simon Schampijer a écrit : Dear maintainers, the next development release is tomorrow the 31th July. Please provide source code tarballs by the end of tomorrow for the following modules: Not code change in sugar-presence-service since 0.81.4. G. ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] Proposal: Activity developers mailing list
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 04:42, Bastien [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any follow-up on the idea of having a precise list of maintainers for all Sugar activities? Even just the email address from the git repo would be nice. I've raised the idea a couple of times to have a mailing list specifically for activity developers, which would be uncluttered by all the traffic on the devel and even sugar lists. That would hopefully have the result that people stay subscribed, or at least notice mails which are important to them. Currently, I'm not even sure which list out of devel and sugar is going to reach more activity developers, hence this cross-post and many others. There are a bunch of issues I'm aware of which need to be communicated clearly and widely: * A lot of activities need updating. There are a good number of us who can help, if we can get the attention of the original / most recent maintainers/authors. We would be willing to do new releases, and we will do so (technically forking) without their help if we don't get their attention. * There is a new activity updater in the control panel in joyride. There is a certain procedure to provide specific versions of the activity for specific builds, so that (future) stable builds get a certain version available, whereas development builds can get other versions of the activity. The exact procedures around that need to be communicated, in such a way that a significant number of activity developers *do* them. * It would be great to have a specific procedure for someone to say I developed this activity, I don't have time to maintain it against future releases, it's available for someone to take over. I suspect several interesting activities are in this position. * We need a way to communicate API changes, new resources, etc to activity developers without this getting lost in the noise of the existing lists. We need a way to get clear feedback on these without getting swamped by non activity developers. * We need to make it easier for new activity developers to get up to speed without having to wade through information they don't need. I am happy to take on making this communication happen but I really think we need this list. I know it's yet another mailing list, but I think it will help make our communication more focussed and effective. I'm adding this to the agenda of today's (tonight's for me) Sugar development meeting. Please comment here in advance of the meeting, or come to the meeting for a more immediate discussion. Morgan ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Browse 94
sources: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/web-activity/Browse-94.tar.bz2 bundled: http://dev.laptop.org/~erikos/bundles/Browse-94.xo = Closed tickets = * #6825 Problems with email webfrontend www.adinet.com.uy = Testcases = #6825 Send an email using the adinet.com.uy site. Make sure to test as well that attaching a document (photo) does work. Translation updates: - Dutch - Telugu --- A dependency of Browse is hulahop which latest version 0.4.3 can be found here: sources: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/hulahop/hulahop-0.4.3.tar.bz2 = Closed tickets = * #7645 Browse loses on comcast.net * #7530 google gears fail to register as a component in Browse = Testcases = #7645 Open browse and load the page comcast.net; the page should be able to load Best, Simon ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] Sugar mtg reminder, 31rd July 2008 --- 17.00 UTC --- irc.freenode.net, #sugar-meeting
On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 19:32, Simon Schampijer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: topics are: * Update of the week (e.g. process changes) * Roadmap * Status of bugfixing * introduction of new developers (optional) Additional agenda items added: * Proposal: Mailing list for activity developers: http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-July/007503.html * Activity Update system in control panel: Implications for activity developers: How to publish releases Regards Morgan ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] Programming environments on the XO
-Original Message- From: Eben Eliason [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thu 7/31/2008 2:29 AM To: Tomeu Vizoso Cc: Martin Edmund Sevior; Walter Bender; OLPC Development; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Chris Ball; Sugar Mailing List Subject: Re: [sugar] Programming environments on the XO On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 12:24 PM, Tomeu Vizoso [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 12:44 PM, Martin Sevior [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 2008-07-18 at 14:50 +1000, Martin Sevior wrote: On Thu, 2008-07-17 at 23:32 -0400, Brian Jordan wrote: The open source project Gobby also uses this sort of who-wrote-what text highlighting, SJ and I have recently (right before he left for Wikimania) been looking into getting similar functionality on the XO. Having this highlighting integrated with Write would be fantastic. OK Guys, I get the message :-) I'll look to see how this can be enabled by default in the most UI-easy way possible. OK Guys, Your wish is my command. See: http://msevior.livejournal.com/2008/07/29/ Awesome, anybody would like to expose this functionality in Write? Should be quite easy, but may involve adding API to abiwidget. The original mockups for Write have been waiting for this moment to arrive. For the reference of any who dare to take on the task (The button being clicked is a Highlight text by author button): http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Image:Activity_write_view.jpg Thanks Tomeu and Eben. Yes, we'll need to expand the abiwidget api. I'll look to do this if I can can get sugar-jhbuild to work again. BTW for those who recommend we abandon sugar-jhbuild, I definitely disagree. You definitely always want the fastest machine you can get for development work and for all it's problems, sugar-jhbuild gives the best way to get an up to the second snapshot of the development trees everywhere. Of course activities require regular testing on the xo hardware, which is now much more available. After I tried out Write on a B2 back in 2007 I realised that many speedups and optimizations were needed to get decent performance. Martin Sevior Thanks a lot, Tomeu ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] Proposal: Activity developers mailing list
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 11:47:56AM +0200, Morgan Collett wrote: On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 04:42, Bastien [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Any follow-up on the idea of having a precise list of maintainers for all Sugar activities? Even just the email address from the git repo would be nice. [...] * We need to make it easier for new activity developers to get up to speed without having to wade through information they don't need. I am happy to take on making this communication happen but I really think we need this list. I think this is a good idea too, especially given that you're motivated to do it. Morgan Martin PS - I'd say +1 but please remember http://kernelslacker.livejournal.com/125203.html pgptTEihPTtdG.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] Sugar Labs meeting reminder
We will have a Sugar Labs meeting tomorrow (Friday, August 1) at 14:00UTC, irc.freenode.net #sugar-meeting (Please note the time change). The tentative agenda is below (and at http://sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Labs/OversightBoard/Minutes#Friday_1_August_2008_-_14.00_.28UTC.29): Topic: Administrative * Review minutes from last meeting * Set next meeting date * Set date for election ** Solicit candidates for election Topic: Infrastructure status * Hardware * Hosting * etc. Topic: Key issues * Engineering o Stability o QA o Updates o growing the community of contributors * Learning o Outreach o Feedback o growing the community of contributors -walter ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] Reviews report
= New requests = Control panel sugar theme infelicities. http://dev.laptop.org/ticket/7641 = Approved requests = Can not set title in the journal http://dev.laptop.org/ticket/7718 ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] joyride-weekly: joyride-2230
On 31.07.2008, at 02:41, Michael Stone wrote: Dear world, This week's 'please test this joyride' is joyride-2230. Test group release notes, care of Charlie, are available at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/ Test_Group_Release_Notes#Build_Joyride_2230 olpc-update thinks that build does not exist. - Bert - ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] Notes from 7/29 Release Meeting(s)
1. We're going to begin nominating this week's 'joyride-weekly' tomorrow at 0900 EDT. If you have risky changes you want to contribute, please provide them _after_ we deliver our nomination. If you want to help more peoples' changes make the deadline, then please help smoke-test joyrides built close to the deadline. Please record your results on http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Test_Group_Release_Notes and file bugs liberally. When we deliver the build nomination, we will summarize the currently available testing notes in the announcement mail. This looks to be focussed on the wide testing of proposed changes. If you also want to wring out agreed-upon changes, why not every week create a new build version in the '8.2' stream? Then anyone who wants to verify how things behave in the latest 8.2 candidate can test that version. mikus ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] specifying what services Activities may use
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 12:40:39AM +0200, Bastien wrote: It's not that important anyway. It just occurred to me that the dependancies management challenge could be somehow dealt with by delivering a set of default activities. I'm not aware of any software distribution drawing such a strong line between the core system and the applications/activities. We have been managing the dependency issue by ensuring that the 'core' activities required for a given build all work on the system-level software packages we include. To my knowledge this verification has been done manually. We could better share our efforts by working to make sure that a given activity simply lists the correct set of dependencies, pushing this data to a package repository, and supporting deployments as they cherry-pick their requirements from it to construct new images and push their products back into it. The separation between system and application-level software is a core roadblock in our integration of more intelligent package management policies. How can an isolated user-level package management application be allowed to modify system-level, shared, code that will affect other applications from which it is supposed to be isolated? A unification of system and application-level software package management thus violates our security model. The user-level application isolation required by this security model serves to enable easier code sharing between children. It also makes it easier for sysadmins to accept the use of relatively untested software packages on the XO. We can probably all agree that the separation between system and application software is useful for security and the execution of untrusted code. Can we reasonably work around this distinction to allow the management of both sets of software as one whole? Erik ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] joyride-weekly: joyride-2230
On 31 Jul 2008, at 14:44, Bert Freudenberg wrote: On 31.07.2008, at 15:14, Bert Freudenberg wrote: On 31.07.2008, at 02:41, Michael Stone wrote: Dear world, This week's 'please test this joyride' is joyride-2230. Test group release notes, care of Charlie, are available at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/ Test_Group_Release_Notes#Build_Joyride_2230 olpc-update thinks that build does not exist. The error actually is unexpected server greeting: fakeroot Glad it's not just me then. I thought I had some random intermittent network issue (for the last week or two) so had given up with olpc- updates rsync attempts to the server. I defaulted back to manually downloading the .toc and .usb files from the web server, sticking them on a USB stick and using olpc-update --usb. --Gary ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] joyride-weekly: joyride-2230
On 31.07.2008, at 17:59, Gary C Martin wrote: On 31 Jul 2008, at 14:44, Bert Freudenberg wrote: On 31.07.2008, at 15:14, Bert Freudenberg wrote: On 31.07.2008, at 02:41, Michael Stone wrote: Dear world, This week's 'please test this joyride' is joyride-2230. Test group release notes, care of Charlie, are available at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/ Test_Group_Release_Notes#Build_Joyride_2230 olpc-update thinks that build does not exist. The error actually is unexpected server greeting: fakeroot Glad it's not just me then. I thought I had some random intermittent network issue (for the last week or two) so had given up with olpc- updates rsync attempts to the server. I defaulted back to manually downloading the .toc and .usb files from the web server, sticking them on a USB stick and using olpc-update --usb. SOmeone fixed it. I updated to 2233 just fine. - Bert - ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] Fwd: Art In All of Us game, identifying childrens' country of origin
An update: Anthony Asael, of the awesome artinallofus project, has a nationality-guessing game with photos of children that could be generalized so that people can submit their own photosets... you can see the current flash app here: http://artinallofus.org/artimages/admin/plugins/quiz_eng/quiz.php If anyone is interested in helping out with a sugarizatoin, or just a generalization that lets children choose their own photosets, you can get in touch with simon suh : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cheers, SJ -- Forwarded message -- From: Anthony Asael [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 11:28 PM Subject: RE: Art In All of Us -- OLPC To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Samuel Klein [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Seth Woodworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi ! I am definitely open to more images. We have a 160,000+ number of images from 175+ countries. We have infinite options to have the kids entertain AND learn ! I think it is also a pretty simple game to develop for a developer. Does the OLPC have somebody in their team to help in that ? Best, Anthony -Mensaje original- De: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Enviado el: 29 July 2008 18:56 Para: Samuel Klein CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Seth Woodworth Asunto: Re: Art In All of Us -- OLPC Anthony is probably open to it, but in the end the installed games have a static image set. To start it might be better to use a generic imageset that works in most situations, just to keep it simple. Otherwise, different imageset or versions of the games would increase complexity. How about we start with a simple implementation and then move towards more options later...if there is popularity. What do you think? Simon On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 15:51:11 -0400, Samuel Klein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The country qiuz is great . Are there other imagesets? Can people suggest their own imagesets from their photos or from your archive? SJ On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 1:53 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Samuel, There are a lot of technical developments in discussion stages right now. However what you ask about requires a platform that we don't have: it entails upload capabilities that we can't support from a hardware or personnel standpoint. Then again, if its something as simple as a variation of the existing photo game, then there are some more immediate possibilities. Regarding the developer, he's still around but on a holiday vacation. In the meantime, please respond with some feedback on the games. If it's compatible with 'Sugar' are we ready to distribute? Thanks for all of your assistance. Simon On Fri, 25 Jul 2008 12:19:47 -0400, Samuel Klein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also, regarding online / offline versions of the art in all of us game, do you have games in the works for helping children capture images and writing in a way that you would be interested in posting/hosting online? SJ On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 12:16 PM, Samuel Klein [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Simon (and Anthony)! Here's a page describing how to emulate the Sugar environment on your windows (or other) machine: wiki.laptop.org/go/Emulation ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Sugar-artwork 0.81.3
sources: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/sugar-artwork/sugar-artwork-0.81.3.tar.bz2 - Add emblem-downlaods to the theme - Fix text color on white background - Add a special case for the SugarSectionView as it has a white background Best, Simon ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] sugar-datastore 0.8.4
Hi all, get the new datastore release from: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/sugar-datastore/sugar-datastore-0.8.4.tar.bz2 We have just one fix: #7234 Request all the results so we get an accurate entry count. Regards, Tomeu ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Sugar-base 0.81.3
sources: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/sugar-base/sugar-base-0.81.3.tar.bz2 - Make logger safe to full disk - translation updates Best, Simon ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Journal 96
Hi all, a new Journal has been release, get it here: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/journal-activity/journal-activity-96.tar.bz2 Changes: - #5907 resume activity when preview is clicked (Daniel Drake) - Dutch translation update (Myckel) - Telugu translation update (Satya) - Spanish translation update (Rafael Ortiz) - #7600 Discard palette when the jobject changes (Tomeu Vizoso) - Mongolian translation update (Odon) - #7718 Fix set title (Simon Schampijer) Thanks all! Tomeu ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Chat 44
I've release Chat-44, available at: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/chat-activity/Chat-44.tar.bz2 http://dev.laptop.org/~morgan/bundles/Chat-44.xo NEWS: 44 * #7633: Close the text channel when stopping a 1-1 chat (morgs) * #7717: Log incoming messages (morgs) * #7692: Don't show pending messages when joining a chat (morgs) * Updated translations: nl, te, es, mn Regards Morgan ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] [RELEASE] Chat 44
Morgan: The MANIFEST file lists several files under locale which are not in the package. Where should those be found? -- bk Morgan Collett wrote: I've release Chat-44, available at: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/chat-activity/Chat-44.tar.bz2 http://dev.laptop.org/~morgan/bundles/Chat-44.xo NEWS: 44 * #7633: Close the text channel when stopping a 1-1 chat (morgs) * #7717: Log incoming messages (morgs) * #7692: Don't show pending messages when joining a chat (morgs) * Updated translations: nl, te, es, mn Regards Morgan ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Terminal 14
Hello, I have released Terminal 14, available at http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/terminal-activity/Terminal-14.tar.bz2 http://dev.laptop.org/~sayamindu/bundles/terminal/Terminal-14.xo NEWS 14 * Translation updates for Chinese (Simplified), Dutch, Mongolian and Telugu Thanks, Sayamindu -- Sayamindu Dasgupta [http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings] ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] current network differentiation?
is it intentional that the currently-connected network is no longer differentiated in the neighborhood view? the outer ring of that network icon used to be white -- it no longer is. it's been pointed out that you can see your current network on the frame, but somehow that's not quite the same (to me). i'm also not sure how to disconnect from that network -- there's no disconnect option in the popup anymore. i'll trac these if they're bugs -- but they might just be misunderstandings on my part. paul =- paul fox, [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Sugar 0.81.8
sources: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/sugar/sugar-0.81.8.tar.bz2 There has been many translation updates in the last cycle! And the usual bugfixes... = Closed tickets = * #7248 Speaker device has inconsistent behavior * #7625 alt+tab switching is slow because activities are notified unneccessary * #7560 cp: Inconsistent behavior after changing the xo color * #7641 Control panel sugar theme infelicities. * #6136 No feedback from 'register' request. = Testcases = #7248 7248.0: Show the speaker icon and click on the slider/adjustment widget to the left of its handle. It should move an amount to the left and stop. Start an application playing that generates sound, so the volume changes in subsequent tests can be verified. |TestCase| 7248.1: Show the speaker icon and click on the slider/adjustment widget to the left of its handle until the handle is more than halfway to the left. The icon should display as partially, but not entirely, full. |TestCase| 7248.1: Show the speaker icon and click on the slider/adjustment widget to the left of its handle until it is most of the way to the left. The icon should display as mostly, but not entirely, empty. |TestCase| 7248.1: Show the speaker icon and move the slider/adjustment widget's handle all the way to the left. The icon should become white and the Mute text icon should change to Unmute. |TestCase| 7248.1: Show the speaker icon and move the slider/adjustment widget's handle all the way to the left. The icon should become white and the Mute text icon should change to Unmute. Now move the handle to the right one increment (by clicking or the right arrow key). The icon should become un-white and the Unmute text icon should change to Mute. |TestCase| 7248.2: Show the speaker icon and click Mute. The icon should become white and the Mute text icon should change to Unmute. |TestCase| 7248.2: Show the speaker icon and click Mute. The icon should become white and the Mute text icon should change to Unmute. Hide the speaker icon. Show it again. The icon should remain white and with the Unmute text/icon shown. Repeat hiding and showing the icon three (3) times. |TestCase| 7248.3: Show the speaker icon and move its slider's handle to somewhere near the middle. Click Mute. The icon should become white and the Mute text icon should change to Unmute. Now move the slider/adjustment widget's handle to the left or right and the icon should become un-white and the Unmute text icon should change to Mute. |TestCase| 7248.4: Show the speaker icon and note its slider/adjustment's handle's position. Press the XO volume up and volume down keys (F8, F9, IIRC) a few times to verify that those keys affect the slider. #7248 7248.4: Show the speaker icon and note how full it is. Press the XO volume up and volume down keys (F8, F9, IIRC) a few times to verify that those keys affect the fullness. |TestCase| 7248.4: Show the speaker icon's popup menu and lower the volume slider. Close the popup menu. Press the XO increase volume/volume up button. Bring up the popup menu. Verify the slider has moved higher. #7248 Set the volume to less than 100%. The icon should not be full. #7625 Start some activities and switch between them. Switching should be reasonably fast. Activities should only do something, if their window is raised. (eg. the Microphone LED will not turn on when one tabs over Measure activity anymore.) #7560 Open 'aboutme' section in the control panel. After modifying one option (e.g. nick) hit the valid button. You will be prompted with an alert that states that a sugar restart is needed. It should only have a 'cancel' and a 'restart now' button. ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Sugar-toolkit 0.81.8
sources: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/sugar-toolkit/sugar-toolkit-0.81.8.tar.bz2 There has been many translation updates in the last cycle! And the usual bugfixes... * #7566 sugar-shell enters in infinite loop after a failed shutdown * #7534 Safer to always install, rather than comparing versions * #7494 Updates to Browse-92 fail. = Testcases = #7566 Start sugar, log into a console session, shutdown from the sugar home page (hover the XO guy in the home and click shutdown in the palette). Start terminal. Go back to the text console and check with top that sugar CPU usage is normal. #7534 Download, install, and run attached clock activity. Right click. Arabic numerals should appear on the clock. Download, install, and run attached OtherClock activity. Right click. Roman numerals should appear on the clock. If arabic numerals appear, the second activity silently failed. ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:14 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: is it intentional that the currently-connected network is no longer differentiated in the neighborhood view? the outer ring of that network icon used to be white -- it no longer is. This is intentional. The colors of the stroke/fill serve as the visual representation of the identity of the network; changing them effectively strips this identity. The new design does not make any indication of which network is presently associated in the Neighborhood view; perhaps we can find an alternative method. Thoughts? it's been pointed out that you can see your current network on the frame, but somehow that's not quite the same (to me). Yes, that's the preferred model. The Frame serves as a perpetual status element, and is instantly accessible no matter where you are within the UI. I'm open to improvements on the model. i'm also not sure how to disconnect from that network -- there's no disconnect option in the popup anymore. Well, that's a bug, but not really. The problem is that there is no notion of disconnect in network manager at all. The old behavior used to switch into mesh mode, which disassociated with the network itself. However, we now have a more direct means of accomplishing this, via turning the mesh device on or off explicitly. It doesn't make sense to compound these. The more conventional option is something like turn wireless off to disassociate with the current network, but that assumes that there is no other potential use for the wireless at all. In our case we still have the mesh to worry about, so that again doesn't map onto our circumstances. - Eben ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] [RELEASE] Chat 44
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 21:03, Bryan Kearney [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Morgan: The MANIFEST file lists several files under locale which are not in the package. Where should those be found? In the .xo, I don't see anything in MANIFEST in locale which isn't actually there - could you be more specific? Thanks Morgan ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 03:23:47PM -0400, Eben Eliason wrote: The new design does not make any indication of which network is presently associated in the Neighborhood view; perhaps we can find an alternative method. Thoughts? Perhaps the currently-associated network's icon can appear below the XO icon, as the Journal does initially in the Home view. i'm also not sure how to disconnect from that network -- there's no disconnect option in the popup anymore. Well, that's a bug, but not really. The problem is that there is no notion of disconnect in network manager at all. cjb suggested to me on IRC that Disconnect/Turn Off (for wireless/mesh, respectively) could just cut power to the radio. I then suggested that this would work if the restoration of power was quick enough that switching to the Neighborhood view could power back on the radio and update the icons in some acceptable lag. I have implemented[1] and tested this behavior (as part, but not a necessary part, of #6995) and I believe it fast enough for further investigation and testing. The only problem is that it's very cumbersome to bring back up the msh0 interface correctly, and would require some code changes in a variety of places in sugar. This problem (and it affects Extreme power mode too) is recorded in #7690. The old behavior used to switch into mesh mode, which disassociated with the network itself. This is much less desirable than powering off the wireless, IMO. However, we now have a more direct means of accomplishing this, via turning the mesh device on or off explicitly. This is spec'd but subject to #7690, IIUC. - Eben Martin 1. Some example entry points: wlan_radio.py: http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=users/mdengler/sugar;a=blob;f=src/hardware/wlan_radio.py;h=47b70474fe503e90d74c4aecf5ed4cd1992f8412;hb=4a455159e61ac2ce1ed47059dccf5a8ba18ebd80 MeshBox.py changes (last last diff block): http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=users/mdengler/sugar;a=commitdiff;h=4a455159e61ac2ce1ed47059dccf5a8ba18ebd80 pgpmZMGKeb4xv.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Read 48
Hello, I have released Read version 48, which can be downloaded from http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/read-activity/Read-48.tar.bz2 http://dev.laptop.org/~sayamindu/bundles/read/Read-48.xo NEWS 48 * Translation updates Thanks, Sayamindu -- Sayamindu Dasgupta [http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings] ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] [RELEASE] Pippy 23
sources: http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/pippy-activity/Pippy-23.tar.bz2 bundled: http://dev.laptop.org/~erikos/bundles/0.81.6/Pippy-23.xo - many great translations - more sugar thanks Best, Simon ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
eben wrote: On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:14 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: is it intentional that the currently-connected network is no longer differentiated in the neighborhood view? the outer ring of that network icon used to be white -- it no longer is. This is intentional. The colors of the stroke/fill serve as the visual representation of the identity of the network; changing them effectively strips this identity. The new design does not make any indication of which network is presently associated in the Neighborhood view; perhaps we can find an alternative method. Thoughts? i get the color thing, though those colors are all arbitrary, right? but i guess you can say connect to the green/orange network as a means of identification, and if the ring is white, you can't do that. but it still feels like the connected network should be special in that view. maybe little radio waves emanating from it or something. :-) it's been pointed out that you can see your current network on the frame, but somehow that's not quite the same (to me). Yes, that's the preferred model. The Frame serves as a perpetual status element, and is instantly accessible no matter where you are within the UI. I'm open to improvements on the model. it wasn't until charlie came over and showed me the icon in the frame that i'd had the frame up at all today. but it's certainly a good place to go for status information. i'm also not sure how to disconnect from that network -- there's no disconnect option in the popup anymore. Well, that's a bug, but not really. The problem is that there is no notion of disconnect in network manager at all. The old behavior used to switch into mesh mode, which disassociated with the network itself. However, we now have a more direct means of accomplishing this, via turning the mesh device on or off explicitly. It doesn't make sense to compound i'm not sure what you mean by turning the mesh device on or off explicitly, at least in terms of the current UI. is that the Radio: checkbox in the Network control panel? these. The more conventional option is something like turn wireless off to disassociate with the current network, but that assumes that there is no other potential use for the wireless at all. In our case we still have the mesh to worry about, so that again doesn't map onto our circumstances. i guess i'm thinking of it in traditional terms. if i'm browsing available nets, i might connect to a network by mistake, and want to disconnect without necessarily connecting to something else, and now it feels (rightly or wrongly) like i can't do that. i guess it's not very important, though. paul - Eben =- paul fox, [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] Programming environments on the XO
On Thu, 2008-07-31 at 21:37 +1000, Martin Edmund Sevior wrote: Thanks Tomeu and Eben. Yes, we'll need to expand the abiwidget api. I'll look to do this if I can can get sugar-jhbuild to work again. That, or we could just add an 'EditMethod', so we can invoke it using a 'well known' function name. Not sure what the nicest approach is. I'm inclined to expand the api though. Marc ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] Sugar mtg minutes, 31th July 2008
Notes full logs: http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/Meetings#Thursday_July_31_2008_-_17.00_.28UTC.29 = Update = The usual bugfixing for the upcoming release. Morgs and david spoke with the ubuntu and debian people in order to get the packaging processes going so potential developers have something to look at. Walter has been in discussion with GNOME and a few education groups - more on those topics in tomorrows sugarlabs meeting: http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-July/007508.html = Roadmap = action items: * need to form triage squad * need to form testing team * keep trac under control so that we have a good view of where we are * make sure to get the new release in Fedora * write down the points for the 9.1 release = Status of bugfixing = we need more testing! = Introducing the new developers = Maybe next week :) = Move meeting to an earlier time = The next meeting will be at 14.00 UTC = Proposal: Mailing list for activity developers = Will be discussed next week or via the mailing lists = Activity Update system in control panel = Will be discussed next week or via the mailing lists ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:42 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: eben wrote: On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:14 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: is it intentional that the currently-connected network is no longer differentiated in the neighborhood view? the outer ring of that network icon used to be white -- it no longer is. This is intentional. The colors of the stroke/fill serve as the visual representation of the identity of the network; changing them effectively strips this identity. The new design does not make any indication of which network is presently associated in the Neighborhood view; perhaps we can find an alternative method. Thoughts? i get the color thing, though those colors are all arbitrary, right? but i guess you can say connect to the green/orange network as a means of identification, and if the ring is white, you can't do that. but it still feels like the connected network should be special in that view. maybe little radio waves emanating from it or something. :-) They're arbitrary, but the colors are chosen as a hash of the essid, which makes them consistently arbitrary. Your favorite network will always be the same colors, and a given network will be the same colors on everyone's machine. It's just a hint of an identifier, but it's a lot better than nothing. it's been pointed out that you can see your current network on the frame, but somehow that's not quite the same (to me). Yes, that's the preferred model. The Frame serves as a perpetual status element, and is instantly accessible no matter where you are within the UI. I'm open to improvements on the model. it wasn't until charlie came over and showed me the icon in the frame that i'd had the frame up at all today. but it's certainly a good place to go for status information. I hope that the Frame will see much more use as a result of the redesign; it's meant to be a crucial interface element, but until now hasn't had much utility. It will help when the notification system is integrated, since the act of connecting to a network will invoke a pulsing network icon in the corner of the screen, which will then slide into the Frame as a hint at where to go to find it later. i'm also not sure how to disconnect from that network -- there's no disconnect option in the popup anymore. Well, that's a bug, but not really. The problem is that there is no notion of disconnect in network manager at all. The old behavior used to switch into mesh mode, which disassociated with the network itself. However, we now have a more direct means of accomplishing this, via turning the mesh device on or off explicitly. It doesn't make sense to compound i'm not sure what you mean by turning the mesh device on or off explicitly, at least in terms of the current UI. is that the Radio: checkbox in the Network control panel? There has been lots of confusion about the difference between mesh and APs. They're really not the same at all, apart from the fact that they both depend on the radio. The new design no longer treats the mesh channels as objects in the Neighborhood view. Instead, there will be (is? not sure if the patch landed yet) a mesh device in the Frame, which you can turn on (and off?) at whim. these. The more conventional option is something like turn wireless off to disassociate with the current network, but that assumes that there is no other potential use for the wireless at all. In our case we still have the mesh to worry about, so that again doesn't map onto our circumstances. i guess i'm thinking of it in traditional terms. if i'm browsing available nets, i might connect to a network by mistake, and want to disconnect without necessarily connecting to something else, and now it feels (rightly or wrongly) like i can't do that. i guess it's not very important, though. I'm trying to point out that your assumption isn't actually true. I'm not aware of a disconnect option which strictly disconnects from the current network. Instead, there is usually a turn off my ability to connect to any network, disconnecting from the current one in the process option. This isn't what we want, because one may want to disconnect from a network but remain on the mesh. - Eben ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:37 PM, Martin Dengler [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 03:23:47PM -0400, Eben Eliason wrote: The new design does not make any indication of which network is presently associated in the Neighborhood view; perhaps we can find an alternative method. Thoughts? Perhaps the currently-associated network's icon can appear below the XO icon, as the Journal does initially in the Home view. Could be tricky, since (hopefully soon) the view will be fixed so that the current activity is beneath the XO, consistent with the Home view. There may be other options, though. i'm also not sure how to disconnect from that network -- there's no disconnect option in the popup anymore. Well, that's a bug, but not really. The problem is that there is no notion of disconnect in network manager at all. cjb suggested to me on IRC that Disconnect/Turn Off (for wireless/mesh, respectively) could just cut power to the radio. I then suggested that this would work if the restoration of power was quick enough that switching to the Neighborhood view could power back on the radio and update the icons in some acceptable lag. Again, I don't think this is really the desired semantic. It's /almost/ right, and is the traditional means of achieving this, but that also turns off the ability to be on the mesh, which isn't necessarily what one means by disconnect from this AP. They should be independent. I realize this isn't as crucial right now, since we can't be on both mesh and AP at the same time, but in the future it's pretty clear that they need to be orthogonal. I have implemented[1] and tested this behavior (as part, but not a necessary part, of #6995) and I believe it fast enough for further investigation and testing. The only problem is that it's very cumbersome to bring back up the msh0 interface correctly, and would require some code changes in a variety of places in sugar. Interesting. This problem (and it affects Extreme power mode too) is recorded in #7690. The old behavior used to switch into mesh mode, which disassociated with the network itself. This is much less desirable than powering off the wireless, IMO. I agree. That's why there's no longer a disconnect option. We thought it was better to remove it until it has a proper semantic, rather than implement it in a peculiar and not readily understandable way. - Eben However, we now have a more direct means of accomplishing this, via turning the mesh device on or off explicitly. This is spec'd but subject to #7690, IIUC. - Eben Martin 1. Some example entry points: wlan_radio.py: http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=users/mdengler/sugar;a=blob;f=src/hardware/wlan_radio.py;h=47b70474fe503e90d74c4aecf5ed4cd1992f8412;hb=4a455159e61ac2ce1ed47059dccf5a8ba18ebd80 MeshBox.pyhttp://dev.laptop.org/git?p=users/mdengler/sugar;a=blob;f=src/hardware/wlan_radio.py;h=47b70474fe503e90d74c4aecf5ed4cd1992f8412;hb=4a455159e61ac2ce1ed47059dccf5a8ba18ebd80MeshBox.pychanges (last last diff block): http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=users/mdengler/sugar;a=commitdiff;h=4a455159e61ac2ce1ed47059dccf5a8ba18ebd80 ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
[sugar] Please help test our new weekly test build!
We are thrilled to announce a new joyride-weekly test image, joyride-2230, valid until Wednesday, August 6. Please help test it according to the detailed instructions at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Friends_in_testing while we still have time to fix issues you might find! Our specific interest this week is on activity compatibility: Does your favorite activity still run on joyride-2230? Currently known issues are recorded at: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Test_Group_Release_Notes#Build_Joyride_2230 New issues should be filed in our bug-tracking system (dev.laptop.org) according to http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Submitting_bugs or by notifying us by other means. Thanks! Michael ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 05:42:26PM -0400, Eben Eliason wrote: On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:37 PM, Martin Dengler [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote: On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 03:23:47PM -0400, Eben Eliason wrote: The new design does not make any indication of which network is presently associated in the Neighborhood view; perhaps we can find an alternative method. Thoughts? Perhaps the currently-associated network's icon can appear below the XO icon, as the Journal does initially in the Home view. Could be tricky, since (hopefully soon) the view will be fixed so that the current activity is beneath the XO, consistent with the Home view. There may be other options, though. It could also be made bigger (for a while I kept patching my MeshBox.py to make favorite icons bigger) than the others. Or a 128/128/128 rgb ring could be drawn around it. Well, you asked for ideas :). cjb suggested to me on IRC that Disconnect/Turn Off (for wireless/mesh, respectively) could just cut power to the radio. I then suggested that this would work if the restoration of power was quick enough that switching to the Neighborhood view could power back on the radio and update the icons in some acceptable lag. Again, I don't think this is really the desired semantic. It's /almost/ right, and is the traditional means of achieving this, but that also turns off the ability to be on the mesh, which isn't necessarily what one means by disconnect from this AP. They should be independent. I realize this isn't as crucial right now, since we can't be on both mesh and AP at the same time, but in the future it's pretty clear that they need to be orthogonal. I guess if they won't be independent for 8.1.2 it seems like it's exactly the right thing to do - whether I'm on the mesh or the AP, if I want to disconnect from the wireless and connect to the mesh I just hit the mesh channel in the mesh palette, so if I select disconnect I don't want to do that and thus have no use for the radio; and if I disconnect from the mesh I definitely don't need an AP (if I did, I would've chosen it). We thought about just doing a NetworkManager sleep, but then, well, again, what is the radio then good for barring drawing 1W of power :)? This problem (and it affects Extreme power mode too) is recorded in #7690. The old behavior used to switch into mesh mode, which disassociated with the network itself. This is much less desirable than powering off the wireless, IMO. I agree. That's why there's no longer a disconnect option. We thought it was better to remove it until it has a proper semantic, rather than implement it in a peculiar and not readily understandable way. Again, Disconnect and turn off the wireless and mesh (respectively) seem to have quite intuitive semantics (to those not familiar with MPP usage): turn off the radio, since I don't want to use what it's providing (wireless or mesh connectivity). - Eben Martin pgpU69izE0xtJ.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 11:13:23PM +0100, Martin Dengler wrote: Again, Disconnect and turn off the wireless and mesh (respectively) seem to have quite intuitive semantics (to those not familiar with MPP usage): turn off the radio, since I don't want to use what it's providing (wireless or mesh connectivity). Martin That'll work as long as there isn't a noticable delay when visiting the network view (time between viewing and network survey) -FFM ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] current network differentiation?
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 06:26:52PM -0400, FFM wrote: On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 11:13:23PM +0100, Martin Dengler wrote: [...] turn off the radio [...] That'll work as long as there isn't a noticable delay when visiting the network view (time between viewing and network survey) Exactly[1]. I believe it could easily be fast enough to detect APs, but I'm not sure about joining a mesh (because I've never joined one and I don't know how it feels vis-a-vis AP scanning - which is fast). I believe (on vague memory) that NM only scans for APs every so often (20s? 40s?), so even what we're showing people now might be a bit inaccurate; in which case, to be sneaky[2], we could just leave all the icons in the MeshBox as-is when we disconnect, and then the user would see them all update one or so second later when the radio and NM came back online. Alternately, some UI could be introduced in the Mesh view (think like the Journal is empty or Journal shows no matching items) to indicate that the radio was coming back online. -FFM Martin 1. On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 3:37 PM, Martin Dengler wrote: I then suggested that this would work if the restoration of power was quick enough that switching to the Neighborhood view could power back on the radio and update the icons in some acceptable lag. ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar pgpVDTVrE0J2u.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] patch for a first boot launch of a Help activity
I don't think we want it to auto launch, but perhaps it should be the first icon on the left. Thoughts on that? Kim On Jul 29, 2008, at 10:30 AM, Eben Eliason wrote: My personal opinion on the matter is that we shouldn't be doing the launch automatically, but others are welcome to disagree. =) I think the presence of a nice, clean, question mark icon on the Home screen after boot will be plenty for those that want to jump into help right away, and instilling the Home zoom level as just what it is -- Home -- is equally important. Particularly because of the fullscreen nature of the activities (and the new launcher itself), I actually think it would be more disorienting to be driven directly into the help activity. I'm not sure the decision was finalized, as the ticket you worked from didn't make it clear one way or the other. Thanks for your hard work, either way! - Eben On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 10:12 AM, Bobby Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 5:42 AM, Marco Pesenti Gritti [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think the agreement when we met about this was to *not* autolaunch the activity. Eben? that could certainly be. it was a fun little project for an hour, and I wasn't aware a decision was reached on whether or not to autolaunch it. bobby Marco On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 5:57 AM, Bobby Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, after talking with Seth this evening, I whipped together a small patch (against the current git heads of sugar and sugar-toolkit) to launch an activity with the service name of org.laptop.Help on the first boot of the XO. It checks the user profile for a field called 'ShowHelp' in a category 'FirstBoot', which doesn't exist on the first launch. I know this has been talked about for G1G1, does anyone have any better ideas of how to do this? yours, Bobby ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] Random observations with joyride-2225 and latest activities
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 12:36 AM, Michael Stone [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, Jul 30, 2008 at 03:05:18PM -0400, Daniel Drake wrote: On Tue, 2008-07-29 at 09:32 +0200, Christoph Derndorfer wrote: a) Record: using v56 the activity starts up fine, the display shows whatever the camera is capturing, I can go into fullscreen-mode, switch to different tabs, etc. However once I press the capture-button the whole thing basically freezes, sometimes I was still able to move the mouse but clicking wouldn't have any impact, at other times Sugar completely froze and I had to do a hard reset of the XO. Your save-nand image loaded onto my XO just fine, but Record worked fine. Must be something hardware related. very odd. It could also be hardware independent but non-deterministic. Or deterministic but triggered under input that you didn't give. Michael Hey guys, thanks a lot for all the feedback. Unfortunately I haven't been able to submit any tickets about the issues I encountered as I've been busy with getting ready for flying back across the pond. This has been somewhat painful due to by my flight being canceled today thanks to strikes at Lufthansa. (Oh the fun of last-minute re-booking) Anyway, I hope to be back on speed by Tuesday or something and will submit the respective tickets then. Best regards, Christoph -- Christoph Derndorfer Co-Editor, OLPCnews url: www.olpcnews.com e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] Your journal is empty
On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 2:26 PM, Mikus Grinbergs [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Recently, I have on two occasions with Joyride (2229+, 2232) pressed ctl-alt-erase in order to restart Sugar. Both times. when Sugar came up, the Journal screen told me 'Your journal is empty'. If unwanted emptying of the Journal were to be experienced by others (in addition to me), then I think this problem should be a SERIOUS blocker to 8.2. You might know this - but just in case and for others reading: if the datastore fails to come up for any reason, the datastore storage dir (~/.sugar/default/datastore) gets moved aside and a new one is created. If you lost your journal this way, the files are in ~/.sugar/default/datastore.XXX . It will be interesting to know why ds failed to come up and file it as a bug if relevant. Do the logs in .sugar/default/logs say anything interesting? cheers, m -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Re: [sugar] patch for a first boot launch of a Help activity
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 11:29 PM, FFM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Maybe somewhere in the frame (forever, thus able to provide contextual assistance in the future), or as a throbbing icon on the home view (just for the first launch)? All of our initial discussions on help focused around a contextual help system, and I still hope that this is where we'll be taking this in the future. By embedding (?) icons within the secondary palette menus for various devices, objects, activities, and even individual buttons and controls, we can provide a way to launch into the help activity and dive directly to the relevant info for the activity, control, etc. selected. In addition, I'd like to support a community driven help system by which, in addition to the activity/olpc provided help, it's possible for kids to add tips, tricks, images, tutorials, and other info to these sections for later consumption by peers. This is a noble, but ambitious goal, which is why a simple and static help activity is the present solution, and why it's only integrated into the system at a single point - the activity itself. - Eben ___ Sugar mailing list Sugar@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
