Re: [Sursound] Sursound Digest, Vol 83, Issue 18

[Marc Lavallée]

On Mon, 29 Jun 2015 13:49:25 +0100
Stefan Schreiber  wrote:

> Hi...
> 
> http://www.sonicvr.com
> 
> 
> > The patented technology within Sonic VR headphones can turn 7.1 
> > surround sound into an even more immersive sound experience.
>
> ?

An interview reveals that there's a few drivers in the headphones,
placed around the ears, a technique used in some 5.1 gaming headphones.
Who's the target audience?

> http://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose4.html
> 
> > At the heart of the BACCH-SP is BACCH® 3D Sound technology
> > developed at Princeton University, which purifies stereo audio
> > signals from the crosstalk inherent in loudspeaker-based playback,
> > allowing the listener’s brain to receive the proper
> > psycho-acoustical cues that are needed to localize recorded sound
> > sources realistically in 3D space. 
> 
> see Ambiophonics etc. (binaural via loudspeakers...)

XTC is not specifically for binaural recordings; it expands the stereo
image of any stereo feed. It's a lot of fun to rediscover old record
collections... It helps to localize sounds in a complex stereo scene,
and I prefer it to headphones because it provides a frontal scene
instead of an "in head" scene.

The BACCH filters are excellent, but they are not free.

Impulse responses from David Wareing are free,
but EQ is required (more LF, less HF):
http://www.wareing77.plus.com/Filters/
I combined them as a "true stereo" filter for a reverb convolver.
I use it with my laptop and a pair of small USB speakers.
It's perfect for long computing sessions.

The best method is a physical barrier, something that very few people
on earth would install in their living/listening room (I did for a few
months).

> www.astoundholdings.com
> 
> > GenAudio created AstoundSound as a software solution. No special 
> > equipment is required, and the technology is compatible with all 
> > presentation formats. AstoundSound 3D audio can be heard and
> > perceived from as few as two speakers, but is also compatible with
> > multi-channel systems. Full 3D audio spatialization in gaming
> > brings a true-to-life experience over headphones. Music is breathed
> > new life with an unbelievably wide sound stage over stereo
> > speakers. Movies go beyond surround sound with the addition of
> > elevation cues over a multi-channel system. Even higher
> > multi-channel content can be faithfully reproduced in a lower
> > channel count system, like 7.1 content being heard the way it was
> > produced, over a 5.1 system. 
> 

The CEO explained (in an interview) that GenAudio is based on "Head
Related Brain Response". As in "pyscho-acoustics"?

> https://twobigears.com
> 
> > Interactive video needs interactive audio. 3Dception now natively 
> > supports Ambisonic B-format decoding, so that you can rest easy
> > while the audio automatically adjusts to the user's headtracked
> > information in real-time.

I just tried the demo. It works very well for interactive audio.

--
Marc
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Re: [Sursound] Sursound Digest, Vol 83, Issue 18

[Stefan Schreiber]

Hi...

http://www.sonicvr.com


The patented technology within Sonic VR headphones can turn 7.1 
surround sound into an even more immersive sound experience.



?


http://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose4.html


At the heart of the BACCH-SP is BACCH® 3D Sound technology developed 
at Princeton University, which purifies stereo audio signals from the 
crosstalk inherent in loudspeaker-based playback, allowing the 
listener’s brain to receive the proper psycho-acoustical cues that are 
needed to localize recorded sound sources realistically in 3D space. 



see Ambiophonics etc. (binaural via loudspeakers...)

www.draper.com


Provide some more specific link, means related to binaural recordings.

www.astoundholdings.com


GenAudio created AstoundSound as a software solution. No special 
equipment is required, and the technology is compatible with all 
presentation formats. AstoundSound 3D audio can be heard and perceived 
from as few as two speakers, but is also compatible with multi-channel 
systems. Full 3D audio spatialization in gaming brings a true-to-life 
experience over headphones. Music is breathed new life with an 
unbelievably wide sound stage over stereo speakers. Movies go beyond 
surround sound with the addition of elevation cues over a 
multi-channel system. Even higher multi-channel content can be 
faithfully reproduced in a lower channel count system, like 7.1 
content being heard the way it was produced, over a 5.1 system. 



https://twobigears.com



Interactive video needs interactive audio. 3Dception now natively 
supports Ambisonic B-format decoding, so that you can rest easy while 
the audio automatically adjusts to the user's headtracked information 
in real-time. 


---


Below is a list of just a few of the companies claiming capable of transforming 
binaural recordings into head tracking audio for VR applications



You have provided no evidence whatsoever for this claim...  

(It is more the opposite: These companies provide HT binaural decoders 
for other formats; < not > HT binaural decoders for binaural recordings.)


Should I add that I feel a bit bored? Provide at least one valid link 
with some evidence, don't do company  "name dropping".


Best,

Stefan


Anthony Mattana wrote:


Hey Stefan,

Below is a list of just a few of the companies claiming capable of transforming 
binaural recordings into head tracking audio for VR applications:

-Two Big Ears (https://twobigears.com/ )
-AstoundSound (http://www.astoundholdings.com/ 
)
-Draper Labs (http://www.draper.com/ )
-BacchSP (http://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose4.html 
)
-Sonic VR (http://www.sonicvr.com/ )

VR is growing incredibly fast and companies are popping up daily! Most of them 
software, which is not entirely great news for hardware guys like us. They 
believe they can take the mono audio captured from your iPhone mic and make it 
head tracking capable! I honestly don;t believe it. But there’s a lot of code 
out there….
 


On Jun 28, 2015, at 12:00 PM, sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu wrote:

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Today's Topics:

 1. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)
 2. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)


--

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 01:28:44 +0100
From: Stefan Schreiber 
To: Surround Sound discussion group 
Subject: Re: [Sursound] Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone
Message-ID: <558f3fbc.9070...@mail.telepac.pt>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

len moskowitz wrote:

   


Anthony Mattana  wrote:


 

I apologize if this is not the way to post, but I'm looking for 
feedback on a product I've recently invented HOOKE (www.hookeaudio.com )
   



I 

Re: [Sursound] Sursound Digest, Vol 83, Issue 18

[Jon Honeyball]

Maybe I am just turning into a grumpy old man, but any company that claims

"We do the maths so you can focus on being awesome”

deserves an arched eyebrow, Spock-style

Jon




On 28/06/2015 17:04, "Sursound on behalf of Anthony Mattana" 
 wrote:

>Hey Stefan,
>
>Below is a list of just a few of the companies claiming capable of 
>transforming binaural recordings into head tracking audio for VR applications:
>
>-Two Big Ears (https://twobigears.com/ )
>-AstoundSound (http://www.astoundholdings.com/ 
>)
>-Draper Labs (http://www.draper.com/ )
>-BacchSP (http://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose4.html 
>)
>-Sonic VR (http://www.sonicvr.com/ )
>
>VR is growing incredibly fast and companies are popping up daily! Most of them 
>software, which is not entirely great news for hardware guys like us. They 
>believe they can take the mono audio captured from your iPhone mic and make it 
>head tracking capable! I honestly don;t believe it. But there’s a lot of code 
>out there….
>> On Jun 28, 2015, at 12:00 PM, sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu wrote:
>> 
>> Send Sursound mailing list submissions to
>>  sursound@music.vt.edu
>> 
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>  https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>  sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu
>> 
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>  sursound-ow...@music.vt.edu
>> 
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of Sursound digest..."
>> 
>> 
>> You are receiving the digest so when replying, please remember to edit your 
>> Subject line to that of the original message you are replying to, so it is 
>> more specific than "Re: Contents of Sirsound-list digest
>> " the subject should match the post you are replying to.
>> 
>> Also, please EDIT the quoted post so that it is not the entire digest, but 
>> just the post you are replying to - this will keep the archive useful and 
>> not polluted with extraneous posts.
>> 
>> Today's Topics:
>> 
>>   1. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)
>>   2. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 01:28:44 +0100
>> From: Stefan Schreiber 
>> To: Surround Sound discussion group 
>> Subject: Re: [Sursound] Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone
>> Message-ID: <558f3fbc.9070...@mail.telepac.pt>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>> 
>> len moskowitz wrote:
>> 
>>> Anthony Mattana  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
 I apologize if this is not the way to post, but I'm looking for 
 feedback on a product I've recently invented HOOKE (www.hookeaudio.com )
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I like your idea of adding bluetooth to the mix.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Long ago, in the late-60's or early 70's, when cassette Walkmen were 
>>> king, (Aiwa offered a low-cost combined stereo headphone/near-ear 
>>> binaural microphone set.  )
>> 
>> 
>> Wrong historical timing!
>> 
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walkman
>> 
>>> The original Walkman was marketed in 1979 as the Walkman in Japan and, 
>>> from 1980, the Soundabout in many other countries including the US, 
>>> Freestyle in Sweden and the Stowaway in the UK
>> 
>> 
>> In this sense, the Walkman is an early form of  the (now historical, 
>> "noughties") iPod, and belongs clearly to the "80s"...   ;-)
>> 
>> Best,
>> 
>> Stefan
>> 
>> P.S.: The iPod might still exist, but Walkmen/iPods are obsolete in the 
>> current environment.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 01:44:45 +0100
>> From: Stefan Schreiber 
>> To: Surround Sound discussion group 
>> Subject: Re: [Sursound] Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone
>> Message-ID: <558f437d.70...@mail.telepac.pt>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>> 
>> Anthony Mattana wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> We are currently in talks with software spatialization companies regarding 
>>> adding an algorithm that would allow Hooke to be used as a head tracking 
>>> audio playback option for VR scenarios. And this could be added to your 
>>> Hooke via a OTA software update months after you purchase the headphones :-)
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> And how can you apply head-tracking to a binaural recording?
>> 
>> Last time I have argued that B format recordings allow (easy) 
>> application of HT, binaural recordings actually not.
>> You can't reconstruct the real or B format sound field from a binaural 
>> recording. If not, I don't see how you could apply HRTF data sets to 
>> calculate a (new) binaural representation - corresponding to your 
>> current head orientation. I am 

Re: [Sursound] Sursound Digest, Vol 83, Issue 18

[Dave Malham]

Actually, a mono recording is in one sense easier, since you could assume
that in *most* circumstances (at least for DWMM) assume that anything
important is at the front and just pan the whole of the thing into the
front of the B format (with a bit of spreading so it wasn't too point-like.
At least then it would be fixed in outside space (when head-tracked) rather
than inside space

 Best
   Dave

PS. Oh, all right then, for those who weren't on the group a few years ago,
DWMM is " Dead White Mens' Music" which is music presented on a stage at
the front, a format that only really emerged with opera in the middle of
the last millenia. I can't give a proper credit as my memory won't reveal
who first used the term :-(

On 28 June 2015 at 17:04, Anthony Mattana  wrote:

> Hey Stefan,
>
> Below is a list of just a few of the companies claiming capable of
> transforming binaural recordings into head tracking audio for VR
> applications:
>
> -Two Big Ears (https://twobigears.com/ )
> -AstoundSound (http://www.astoundholdings.com/ <
> http://www.astoundholdings.com/>)
> -Draper Labs (http://www.draper.com/ )
> -BacchSP (http://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose4.html <
> http://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose4.html>)
> -Sonic VR (http://www.sonicvr.com/ )
>
> VR is growing incredibly fast and companies are popping up daily! Most of
> them software, which is not entirely great news for hardware guys like us.
> They believe they can take the mono audio captured from your iPhone mic and
> make it head tracking capable! I honestly don;t believe it. But there’s a
> lot of code out there….
> > On Jun 28, 2015, at 12:00 PM, sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu wrote:
> >
> > Send Sursound mailing list submissions to
> >   sursound@music.vt.edu
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >   https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >   sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> >   sursound-ow...@music.vt.edu
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Sursound digest..."
> >
> >
> > You are receiving the digest so when replying, please remember to edit
> your Subject line to that of the original message you are replying to, so
> it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Sirsound-list digest
> > " the subject should match the post you are replying to.
> >
> > Also, please EDIT the quoted post so that it is not the entire digest,
> but just the post you are replying to - this will keep the archive useful
> and not polluted with extraneous posts.
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> >   1. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)
> >   2. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 01:28:44 +0100
> > From: Stefan Schreiber 
> > To: Surround Sound discussion group 
> > Subject: Re: [Sursound] Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone
> > Message-ID: <558f3fbc.9070...@mail.telepac.pt>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> >
> > len moskowitz wrote:
> >
> >> Anthony Mattana  wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> I apologize if this is not the way to post, but I'm looking for
> >>> feedback on a product I've recently invented HOOKE (www.hookeaudio.com
> )
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I like your idea of adding bluetooth to the mix.
> >>
> >>
> >> Long ago, in the late-60's or early 70's, when cassette Walkmen were
> >> king, (Aiwa offered a low-cost combined stereo headphone/near-ear
> >> binaural microphone set.  )
> >
> >
> > Wrong historical timing!
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walkman
> >
> >> The original Walkman was marketed in 1979 as the Walkman in Japan and,
> >> from 1980, the Soundabout in many other countries including the US,
> >> Freestyle in Sweden and the Stowaway in the UK
> >
> >
> > In this sense, the Walkman is an early form of  the (now historical,
> > "noughties") iPod, and belongs clearly to the "80s"...   ;-)
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Stefan
> >
> > P.S.: The iPod might still exist, but Walkmen/iPods are obsolete in the
> > current environment.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 01:44:45 +0100
> > From: Stefan Schreiber 
> > To: Surround Sound discussion group 
> > Subject: Re: [Sursound] Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone
> > Message-ID: <558f437d.70...@mail.telepac.pt>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
> >
> > Anthony Mattana wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> We are currently in talks with software spatialization companies
> regarding adding an algorithm that would allow Hooke to be used as a head
> tracking audio playback opti

Re: [Sursound] Sursound Digest, Vol 83, Issue 18

[Anthony Mattana]

Hey Stefan,

Below is a list of just a few of the companies claiming capable of transforming 
binaural recordings into head tracking audio for VR applications:

-Two Big Ears (https://twobigears.com/ )
-AstoundSound (http://www.astoundholdings.com/ 
)
-Draper Labs (http://www.draper.com/ )
-BacchSP (http://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/PureStereo/Pure_Stereose4.html 
)
-Sonic VR (http://www.sonicvr.com/ )

VR is growing incredibly fast and companies are popping up daily! Most of them 
software, which is not entirely great news for hardware guys like us. They 
believe they can take the mono audio captured from your iPhone mic and make it 
head tracking capable! I honestly don;t believe it. But there’s a lot of code 
out there….
> On Jun 28, 2015, at 12:00 PM, sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu wrote:
> 
> Send Sursound mailing list submissions to
>   sursound@music.vt.edu
> 
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>   https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>   sursound-requ...@music.vt.edu
> 
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>   sursound-ow...@music.vt.edu
> 
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Sursound digest..."
> 
> 
> You are receiving the digest so when replying, please remember to edit your 
> Subject line to that of the original message you are replying to, so it is 
> more specific than "Re: Contents of Sirsound-list digest
> " the subject should match the post you are replying to.
> 
> Also, please EDIT the quoted post so that it is not the entire digest, but 
> just the post you are replying to - this will keep the archive useful and not 
> polluted with extraneous posts.
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)
>   2. Re: Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone (Stefan Schreiber)
> 
> 
> --
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 01:28:44 +0100
> From: Stefan Schreiber 
> To: Surround Sound discussion group 
> Subject: Re: [Sursound] Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone
> Message-ID: <558f3fbc.9070...@mail.telepac.pt>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> 
> len moskowitz wrote:
> 
>> Anthony Mattana  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> I apologize if this is not the way to post, but I'm looking for 
>>> feedback on a product I've recently invented HOOKE (www.hookeaudio.com )
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> I like your idea of adding bluetooth to the mix.
>> 
>> 
>> Long ago, in the late-60's or early 70's, when cassette Walkmen were 
>> king, (Aiwa offered a low-cost combined stereo headphone/near-ear 
>> binaural microphone set.  )
> 
> 
> Wrong historical timing!
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walkman
> 
>> The original Walkman was marketed in 1979 as the Walkman in Japan and, 
>> from 1980, the Soundabout in many other countries including the US, 
>> Freestyle in Sweden and the Stowaway in the UK
> 
> 
> In this sense, the Walkman is an early form of  the (now historical, 
> "noughties") iPod, and belongs clearly to the "80s"...   ;-)
> 
> Best,
> 
> Stefan
> 
> P.S.: The iPod might still exist, but Walkmen/iPods are obsolete in the 
> current environment.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2015 01:44:45 +0100
> From: Stefan Schreiber 
> To: Surround Sound discussion group 
> Subject: Re: [Sursound] Hooke: First Bluetooth Binaural Microphone
> Message-ID: <558f437d.70...@mail.telepac.pt>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
> 
> Anthony Mattana wrote:
> 
>> 
>> We are currently in talks with software spatialization companies regarding 
>> adding an algorithm that would allow Hooke to be used as a head tracking 
>> audio playback option for VR scenarios. And this could be added to your 
>> Hooke via a OTA software update months after you purchase the headphones :-)
>> 
>> 
> 
> And how can you apply head-tracking to a binaural recording?
> 
> Last time I have argued that B format recordings allow (easy) 
> application of HT, binaural recordings actually not.
> You can't reconstruct the real or B format sound field from a binaural 
> recording. If not, I don't see how you could apply HRTF data sets to 
> calculate a (new) binaural representation - corresponding to your 
> current head orientation. I am very open for smart algorithms, but still...
> 
> No way, IMO!
> 
> Best,
> 
> Stefan
> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
> Subject: Digest Footer
> 
> ___
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> 
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