Re: [Biofuel] Bio diesel newbie q - How do I accurately measure 100+ litres of oil?

[Keith Addison]

Hello Nigel

>I suspect this is a complete newbie question - but being a newbie - 
>I feel entitled to ask.

Newbies aren't entitled to anything special that other members aren't 
also entitled to. What you're obliged to do however is to try to 
avoid asking newbie questions that have been asked and answered many 
times already, unless you've something to add.

>List resources
>
>Please make use of the resources listed at the Biofuel list home page:
>http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
>
>Especially the searchable list archives:
>http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
>
>The archives contains more than 50,000 messages over nearly five 
>years. The question you want to ask or the topic you're interested 
>in has probably already been covered. That's no reason not to ask it 
>again, but if you know what's gone before you'll ask a better 
>question and get better answers.

See: List rules
http://snipurl.com/mx7r

Just so you know.

Accuracy and scale have certainly been discussed before, but never mind.

>ok - picture this - I've been out and done the decent thing - found 
>myself a lot of Waste Veggie Oil that I want to convert to Bio 
>Diesel.. I do the titration, and get the exact amount of NzOH to add 
>to a litre... and now I need to multiply that by the amount of oil I 
>have.
>
>I expect to have approximately 100l... but how do I know... 
>accurately? How accurate do I need to be in order to get a good 
>result?

How accurate have you needed to be in order to get good results with 
one-litre test batches? What tolerances have you been working to with 
your one-litre tests with WVO? You can use the same tolerances or 
better with 100 litres.

Eg, you should have been using scales accurate to 0.1 grams or better 
to measure the lye for 1 litre of oil. For 100 litres of oil, 
multiply that by 100 and you get a margin of error of 10 grams. If 
your oil titrates at say 2.5 ml 0.1% NaOH solution that will total 
600 grams for 100 litres, 10 grams either way is a 3.3% margin. You 
should be able to improve on that.

>I have thought of setting up a simple balance beam, with a weight on 
>one side the exactly equals 100l of oil, + the drum weight. I then 
>add or tap off oil until I hit the exact 100l mark. There must be 
>other/better/standard ways of doing it though?

Volume seems the more obvious measure. Heat one litre of the oil to 
processing temperature and measure it again so you can adjust for the 
volume increase for measuring oil at room-temperature. Graduate the 
processor tank in convenient increments with marks you can see 
easily, or do that to the holding tank or pre-heating tank if you 
have one. Or use a bucket - add 10 measures of one litre from an 
accurate measuring flask and mark it as you go, then fill the 
processor in 10-litre batches. Do it carefully and you'll be fine.

It's much simpler if you always make standard-sized batches.

Um, have you made any successful test batches yet? Three weeks ago 
you were still sourcing chemicals.

Best

Keith Addison
Journey to Forever
KYOTO Pref., Japan
http://journeytoforever.org/
Biofuel list owner

 

>Tips and answers very welcome!
>Cheers
>Nigel


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Re: [Biofuel] Cross Posted, Re: World Energy Consumption

[Keith Addison]

>Oops!
>
>...my bad. Sorry.

No probs.

Keith

>Mike
>
>Keith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >I thought this might be of interest. I thought that Ken made a good
> >point but, before I posted it, he wanted to be sure that the reader
> >understood his method so, I included our dialog.
> >
> >Mike
>
>Thanks Mike. Ken's right, though I think we already did that, more or less.
>
>World energy use
>http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_404.html#energyuse
>
>World's top CO2 producers
>http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_404.html#co2
>
>The overpopulation myth:
>
>Re: [Biofuel] Overpopulation Off Limits?
>http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg57949.html
>
>Good analysis:
>
>Human Population - Global Issues
>http://www.globalissues.org/EnvIssues/Population.asp
>
>Best
>
>Keith


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Re: [Biofuel] automating titration

[Burak Cedetas]

There will be 2 parts to automate the titration,
1- Electrical&electronical
This will invove the sensors (ph meter) actuators and the controller which
all this equipment will be wired to.

2- Mechanical
The structure which will collect the sample and deliver it so it can be
titrated.  This may cost more than the electrical bit.

Unless you are going to work on larger quantities, it may not be practical
to invest on this sytem.

However the advantages are as you have mentioned in your later posts are;
- Consistent quality of the end BD
- The documentation of the quality of the product before and after the
titration ,n computer log files.

Regards

Burak


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jason & Katie
Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 4:53 AM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: [Biofuel] automating titration


hi everyone, haven't been posting for a couple months (points to old ISP &
retches) but i was messing around in my head a few weeks ago and was
wondering if there was any simple formula that could be used to digitize and
automate a titration of oil as compared to lye for fry-grease diesel. i have
been trying to think of a way to do this so i can automate the entire
process, but have been coming up blank. any help would be appreciated.

thank you,
jason


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Re: [Biofuel] Military Madness: How About a Little Common Sense?

[Rexis Tree]

Where do those money come from? $600 billion a year is pretty insane, each americans from new born babies to dying old people are paying 2000 US dollar just to let your country to continue bullying smaller nations while paying 33 bucks in R&D of renewable energy.
Oww, how to define common sense?
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[Biofuel] automating titration

[Jason & Katie]

i cant help but be aggravated, i have been searching for almost a week and a 
half for a formula that would result in a pH of 8.4-8.6, but of the hundreds 
of pages i have read, all the formulas are strictly neutralizing, and i dont 
have the math skills/intelligence to modify them, and noone posts chemistry 
help at a high school level- only graduate studies. i am totally lost on 
this one.

does anyone know how to modify, or at least explain pH/pOH formulas to be 
unbalanced like that?
i am trying to write a program that will help me automate the process, but 
im hung up on the titration stage. Anything would be helpful right now- 
anything at all. 


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Re: [Biofuel] [off topic]Autopsy: No Arabs on Flight 77

[lres1]

Flight by disc,
It was reported that the crash in the Antarctic was due to a 
last minute programming disc inserted into the flight control system. The disc 
had supposedly the wrong data and put the plane Air new Zealand flight 
901, into mount Erebus.
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Erebus_disaster#Official_accident_report
 
The pilots were acquitted on the second hearing/study. So why 
not the towers etc? The pilot has not the time to change/react as the 
path can be set before take off thus no one on board would 
know.

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  fox 
  mulder 
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Monday, March 13, 2006 5:21 
PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] [off 
  topic]Autopsy: No Arabs on Flight 77
  ***No virus was detected in the 
  attachment no filenameYour mail has been scanned by 
  InterScan.***-***Source:  http://www.physics911.net/olmsted.htmAutopsy: 
  No Arabs on Flight 77By Thomas R. Olmsted, M.DI am an ex 
  Naval line officer and a psychiatrist inprivate practice in New Orleans, a 
  Christian andhomeschool dad. It troubled me a great deal that werushed 
  off to war on the flimsiest of evidence. Iconsidered various ways to 
  provide a smoking gun ofwho and why Sept 11th happened. Astute 
  observersnoticed right away that there were no Arabic soundingnames on 
  any of the flight manifests of the planesthat "crashed" on that 
  day.A list of names on a piece of paper is not evidence,but an 
  autopsy by a pathologist, is. I undertook byFOIA request, to obtain that 
  autopsy list and you areinvited to view it below. Guess what? Still no 
  Arabson the list. In my opinion the monsters who plannedthis crime 
  made a mistake by not including Arabicnames on the original list to make 
  the ruse seem morebelievable.When airline disasters occur, 
  airlines will routinelyprovide a manifest list for anxious families. You 
  mayhave noticed that even before Sep 11th, airlines arepretty 
  meticulous about getting an accurate headcountbefore takeoff. It seems 
  very unlikely to me, thatfive Arabs sneaked onto a flight with weapons. 
  This isthe list provided by American of the 56 passengers. OnSeptember 
  27th, the FBI published photos of the"hijackers" of Flight 
  77.Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the Armed ForcesInstitute of 
  Pathology (AFIP), does a miraculous joband identifies nearly all the 
  bodies on November 16th2001.The AFIP suggest these numbers; 189 
  killed, 125 workedat the Pentagon and 64 were "passengers" on the 
  plane.The AA list only had 56 and the list just obtained has58. They 
  did not explain how they were able to tell"victims" bodies from "hijacker" 
  bodies. In fact, fromthe beginning NO explanation has been given for 
  theextra five suggested in news reports except that theFBI showed us 
  the pictures to make up the difference,and that makes it so.Now, 
  being the trusting sort, I figured that thegovernment would want to 
  quickly dispel any rumors sowe could get on with the chore of 
  kickingOsama/Sadaam's butt (weren't these originally twodifferent 
  people?). It seemed simple to me. . .producethe names of all the bodies 
  identified by the AFIP andcompare it with the publicized list of 
  passengers. So,I sent a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request 
  tothe AFIP and asked for an expedited response, becausewe were getting 
  ready to send our boys to war on thepretext that Osama/Saddam had done the 
  deed. Fourteenmonths later, a few US soldiers dead, many 
  Iraqicivilians pushing up daisies, and I finally get thelist. Believe 
  me that they weren't a bit happy to giveit up, and I really have no idea 
  why they choose nowto release it.No Arabs wound up on the morgue 
  slab; however, threeADDITIONAL people not listed by American 
  Airlinessneaked in. I have seen no explanation for theseextras. I did 
  American the opportunity to "revise"their original list, but they have not 
  responded. Thenew names are: Robert Ploger, Zandra Ploger, andSandra 
  Teague. The AFIP claims that the only"passenger" body that they were not 
  able to identifyis the toddler, Dana Falkenberg, whose parents 
  andyoung sister are on the list of those identified. Thesatanic 
  masterminds behind this caper may be feelingpretty smug about the perfect 
  crime, but they haveleft a raft of clues tying these 
  unfortunatestogether.The PassengersIn the foregoing, I 
  presented evidence from the ArmedForces Institute of Pathology (AFIP), 
  that there wereno Arabs on American Airlines Flight 77. This 
  doesn'treally jibe with the official story, so someone isn'ttelling 
  the truth. This list itself is suspect becausethere is a special group of 
  "bone guys" that arecalled in whenever the government needs 
  an"adjustment" to their story.About "bone guys": No, we're not 
  talking folks thathang around secret Ivy League fraternities. On May 
  31,2002, the Washington Post had this to say about 
  '

[Biofuel] Bio diesel newbie q - How do I accurately measure 100+ litres of oil?

[Nigel Kelly]

I suspect this is a complete newbie question - but 
being a newbie - I feel entitled to ask.
 
ok - picture this - I've been out and done the 
decent thing - found myself a lot of Waste Veggie Oil that I want to convert to 
Bio Diesel.. I do the titration, and get the exact amount of NzOH to add to a 
litre... and now I need to multiply that by the amount of oil I 
have.
 
I expect to have approximately 100l... but how do I 
know... accurately? How accurate do I need to be in order to get a good 
result?
 
I have thought of setting up a simple balance beam, 
with a weight on one side the exactly equals 100l of oil, + the drum weight. I 
then add or tap off oil until I hit the exact 100l mark. There must be 
other/better/standard ways of doing it though?
 
Tips and answers very welcome!
Cheers
Nigel
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[Biofuel] automating titration

[Jason & Katie]

Mr. Street,

how does semi local sound? there are almost a dozen towns of more than 1,000 
but less than 10,000 people spread over two counties in the (rather 
inaccurately named, i might add) Quad Cities, plus the original four cities, 
and until the eighties (surprise) there were large farm implement factories 
and a fairly big military stockpile/factory, the farms in the outer areas 
were prosperous and every one of 750,000 people had some form of a job. 
After the PREVIOUS recession all the factories shut down and moved overseas, 
the local crops were pretty well worthless, people got laid off in droves, 
and almost half the population packed up and left. my proposal is to try and 
automate the entire process with the utmost accuracy, make the equipment 
small enough to be space efficient, and produce enough to NEED help 
(shipping, inventory, etc.) besides, what better way to boost my 
neighborhood economy? 


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[Biofuel] Organic Food Goes Mainstream

[biofuel]

Well, I did a little searching on an organic brand that we've been buying
recently because it is the only "organic" food available in the stores nearby.
("O Organics" in Safeway, distributed through Omnibrands Inc.)

The prevailing logic from our consumer training is to support organic products
by buying them even if they are a little more expensive (justifiably?) in the
hope that the increased demand will encourage more products to be available.

But voting with your wallet doesn't really work when the money is just going to
the same big players and in fact may be supporting the lowering of standards.

The ideal solution is to buy local organic produce from small farms. And when
there are no local organic producers I suppose it is better to order something
over the internet from a small farm in another state rather than buy the big
brand at the store.

Actually the best solution is to grow/raise your own, which thankfully, we are
finally in the position to do, but it takes time.

BT

--
Phil Howard, post doctoral researcher from The Center for Agroecology &
Sustainable Food Systems
reveals the corporate players in the organic marketplace:
http://www.organicconsumers.org/organic/corporate_organic.cfm

--
Organic Food Goes Mainstream
http://www.organicconsumers.org/organic/mainstream060313.cfm

-
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/01/safeway_introdu.php

Hello,

I had a feeling 'O' was a Safeway brand and what most of us don't know or
remember is that Safeway was at the forefront of lowering organic standards. In
addition, shopping at the big markets does not support local farmers. I hope
folks can spread the word about this and maybe take the time to do more
research than I can at this time.

Here is a good article on what's wrong with BIG company organic:
http://www.eastbayexpress.com/issues/2005-01-05/news/feature_1.html

Thanks,

Fresh!

Posted by: Fresh | January 30, 2006 11:29 PM


Do your homework, folks. Already 2 products from the O Organic line have been
withdrawn because the alleged certification had not really been granted. Check
the labels. Where is it produced? In countries that have no certification
procedures and then brought in wholesale to this country? What are you feeding
your babies? Is it indeed organic? Says who? Do your homework. Blind trust can
be a dangerous thing.

Posted by: Wide Awake | February 16, 2006 10:07 PM


http://www.eastbayexpress.com/issues/2005-01-05/news/feature_1.html

The O Word
Kristie and Rick Knoll were early pioneers of organic farming. So why are they
now rebelling against organic?
By Will Harper
Article Published Jan 5, 2005
---


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Re: [Biofuel] automating titration

[Nigel Kelly]

Cheers Joe,
 
I'm working small but I'm an automation guy. If it 
can be, I like to do it (with processes such as these anyway.
 
That being said - there's a common sense limit. No 
point in spending $5,000 on gear to automate it, if the task only takes 5 
minutes anyway...
 
NK

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Joe Street 
  To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2006 7:10 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] automating 
  titration
  Hi Nigel;Yes I meant keep it manual.  To what 
  advantage?  Well simplicity mostly. Automation IMHO does not offer much 
  advantage unless it is for commercial reasons.  If you are looking to do 
  large scale production then you have a different paradigm than me so we are 
  talking at odds anyway, but for small scale local production I would consider 
  automation to be more of a liability than an asset.  I have a fair bit of 
  experience with industrial automation of complex systems and in order for a 
  machine to carry out even modestly complex processes it takes a plethora of 
  feedback loops and interlocks for it all to work safely without screwing 
  up.  Just look at how much waste is often created by something as 
  'supposedly' simple as a network printer in realitynot a tree saver.  
  Just imagine the oopsies and wasted chemicals, and oil that will result from 
  trying to automate biodiesel production.  Even if it is only the 
  titration you want to automate, consider that more and more I am hearing about 
  people who take the titration kit to the field, to decide on site whether or 
  not to use oil as a feedstock rather than taking it home and finding out then 
  what you've got to deal with.  A completely automated titrator would be a 
  cool project to be sure but it would be more likely to constrain you to 
  bringing samples to the machine instead of the other way around.Just 
  my two cents.JoeNigel Kelly wrote:
  Sorry - I don't follow...

You mean do it manually? And if so - to what advantage?

- Original Message - 
From: "Joe Street" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Saturday, March 11, 2006 6:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] automating titration


  
I think you should 'manualize' the process.

Joe

Jason & Katie wrote:


  hi everyone, haven't been posting for a couple months (points to old ISP &
retches) but i was messing around in my head a few weeks ago and was
wondering if there was any simple formula that could be used to digitize 
and
automate a titration of oil as compared to lye for fry-grease diesel. i 
have
been trying to think of a way to do this so i can automate the entire
process, but have been coming up blank. any help would be appreciated.

thank you,
jason


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  ___Biofuel mailing 
  listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel 
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[Biofuel] Biofuel conferences

[biofuel]

AOCS Announces 97th Annual Meeting & Expo in St. Louis, Missouri
http://www.soyatech.com/bluebook/news/sponsor.ldml?a=33421

http://www.aocs.org/meetings/annual_mtg/
http://www.aocs.org/meetings/biodiesel/am06/

Short Course on Biodiesel: Market Trends, Chemistry, and Production • April
29-30
   Option #1: Short Course registration only
 AOCS Member$495$595
 Nonmember  $595$695
 Student$165$195
   Option #2: Short Course registration plus The Biodiesel Handbook and
Industrial Uses of Vegetable Oils
 AOCS Member$575$675
 Nonmember  $685$785


Want to Participate in Latin America's Pioneering Biofuels Industry? Join the
Leaders at Biofuels Markets Americas
http://www.soyatech.com/bluebook/news/sponsor.ldml?a=33008

http://www.greenpowerconferences.com/events/Biofuelsamericas.htm

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Re: [Biofuel] automating titration

[Jack Schwartz]

Joe Street writes:
 ... If you are really well
coordinated you might be able to control the [titrating] solution with
one hand and stir with the other but I am waaay too clumsy for that
...  [versus using a magnetic stirrer]
Joe, you gave me a chuckle along with some pleasant nostalgia.  My
chemistry training in the 1950's predates magnetic stirrers to the time
when swirling the sample solution in an Erlenmeyer flask was the main
method for sample agitation during titration.
With all the awesome developments in instrumental analytical chemistry,
lab automation, etc., for me the two most useful tools developed for lab
work within the last 50 years or so are the magnetic stirrer and the
hand-held calculator.
  -- Jack


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[Biofuel] Military Madness: How About a Little Common Sense?

[biofuel]

Military Madness: How About a Little Common Sense?

MILITARY LUNACY: HOW ABOUT A BIT OF COMMON SENSE?
March 9, 2006

http://lists.essential.org/pipermail/corp-focus/2006/000233.html

By Russell Mokhiber and Robert Weissman

In a crazy place, even the most modest steps toward sanity can seem radical.

Thus, in Washington, the Common Sense Budget Act, introduced this week
by Representative Lynn Woolsey of California, seems like a far-reaching
move.

In fact, it might be better titled the "How About Just a Bit of Common
Sense Act."

The legislation would divert $60 billion from the Pentagon budget, and
allocate it to social investment, renewable energy and humanitarian aid.
Fifteen other members of the Progressive Caucus, of which Woolsey is
co-chair, are co-sponsoring the bill.

Sixty billion dollars obviously goes a long way when it comes to
people's needs, and the legislation promises to do a lot. Among the
programs that would benefit:

* $10 billion annually would go to provide health care coverage for
millions of uninsured children.

* $10 billion a year would be spent on modernizing schools.

* $10 billion would be invested annually in renewable energy.

* $13 billion would be spent every year on humanitarian foreign aid.

Yes, $60 billion is a tremendous amount of money.

But not for the Department of Defense. The Pentagon is seeking $463
billion for the next fiscal year. That figure excludes the amount
Rumsfeld and friends will request to fight the wars in Iraq and
Afghanistan (and anywhere else they might start fights). For
war-fighting, the administration is expected to seek an additional $115
billion in 2006. So we're approaching $600 billion a year in defense/war
spending.

The proposed cuts for the Pentagon follows recommendations from Reagan
Assistant Defense Secretary Lawrence J. Korb. In a report issued in
conjunction with the introduction of the Common Sense Budget Act, Korb
writes that, "without diminishing America's ability to fight extremists,
America can save $60 billion mostly by eliminating Cold War-era weapons
systems designed to thwart the former Soviet Union -- weapons and
programs that are not useful in defending our country from extremists or
the other threats we now face." Most of the proposed savings come from
reducing the size of the U.S. nuclear arsenal, cutting most spending for
the missile defense program, and scaling back or eliminating support for
weapons designed to fight perceived threats from the Soviet Union.

In other words, these are no-brainer cost savings. They aim to stop
spending on Cold War weaponry, but don't threaten the prevailing
war-fighting ideology at the Pentagon. The proposed cuts would upset
particular defense contractors and agencies, to be sure, but they don't
pose a fundamental challenge to the Pentagon's vice grip over the
federal budget and inside-the-beltway politics and culture.

By way of perspective, consider this: global military expenditures
soared past the $1 trillion mark in 2004, according to data compiled by
the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI) and
published in the Institute's 2005 Yearbook. In inflation-adjusted terms,
military spending is now rivaling the record total achieved during the
peak of Cold War expenditures in 1988-1989, according to SIPRI.

Since 1998, government military spending has jumped almost 6 percent
annually in real terms. "The major determinant of the world trend in
military expenditure is the change in the USA, which makes up 47 percent
of the world total," according to SIPRI's 2005 Yearbook.

By 2007, U.S. spending is expected to constitute more than half the
total global military expenditure.

There are roughly 300 million people living in the United States. There
are about 6.5 billion people on the planet, meaning the U.S. population
is about 4.6 percent of the global total.

One half the world's military spending. Under 5 percent of the world's
population.

Crazy.


Russell Mokhiber is editor of the Washington, D.C.-based Corporate Crime
Reporter, 

[Biofuel] Tallow

[Parraga Pablo-Francisco]

Hi,
 
Is there someone Who had worked Bio diesel from tallow?
 
I do Know the process but I am afraid I not sure about quantities.  What one should be the Ph for the trtation process?
 
Is OK KOH and Methanol?
 
Well any one Who Knows Would be helpful
 
Thanks
 
 
Pablo 
 
 
 
 
 
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[Biofuel] Combination Of Processes Results In Cleaner Petrol

[D. Mindock]

Source: Delft 
University of Technology
Posted: March 13, 2006
Combination Of Processes Results In Cleaner Petrol
One problem 
confronting the oil industry is that extracted mineral oil 
(due to increasing scarcity) is becoming heavier and 'dirtier'. This is 
reflected, for instance, in a higher content of aromatics 
(which among other things lead to soot emissions during combustion in diesel 
engines) and of sulphur (which among things causes acid rain). At the same time, 
the global ceilings for aromatics and sulphur content in fuels are becoming 
increasingly strict. 
The Delft-based PhD student Xander Dupain has investigated a method which 
produces cleaner petrol using the method of 'catalytic cracking'. Catalytic 
cracking, with a worldwide processing capacity of over 500 million tonnes of oil 
per year, is one of the most important processes applied in modern oil 
refineries and the prime method for making petrol from oil. In addition it is an 
important way of producing diesel blends and valuable products such as propene 
and butene. The disadvantage of catalytic cracking is that a further expensive 
process (hydrotreatment) is often required to render the petrol and diesel 
sufficiently clean and bring it into line with the necessary specifications. 

The 
core of Dupain's method is a combination of catalytic cracking with the 
Fischer-Tropsch Synthesis process. This chemical process was invented in the 
1920s by the German researchers Franz Fischer and Hans Tropsch and further 
developed in Germany during the Second World War for the production of synthetic 
fuels from coal. Due to the relatively low oil prices in the period following 
the Second World War this method then mostly went out of fashion, with the 
exception of South Africa where -- prompted by the international oil embargo -- 
it was applied by the Sasol company to meet fuel demands. In recent years, as 
oil prices rise, the process has been experiencing a revival: with the 
activities of Shell in Malaysia and Qatar, for instance. It is now primarily 
being applied to obtain relatively clean synthetic diesel from natural gas and 
to make a series of other products which contain extremely low concentrations of 
sulphur, nitrogen 
and aromatics. Dupain believes it can be economically and environmentally 
interesting to catalytically crack the fairly 'heavy' faction (waxes) which is 
created by the Fischer-Tropsch Synthesis process. At the moment this cracking is 
still done using expensive hydrocracking that focuses mainly on the production 
of diesel and that also involves high consumption of hydrogen. 

Catalytic cracking of the products from Fischer-Tropsch Synthesis results in 
clean and high-quality petrol. Moreover, it is possible to produce good diesel 
as a by-product -- and the process also creates relatively large quantities of 
propene and butene. Is it above all this latter aspect that leads Dupain to 
think that the combination of a Fischer-Tropsch installation with a catalytic 
cracker can also be interesting in economic terms. After all, propene is an 
important raw material for the plastics industry. Demand for propene is set to 
rise in the coming years. 
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Re: [Biofuel] automating titration

[Joe Street]

Ok if that's all you are after then forget about the automation.  Make
yourself up a stock titration solution so that it is always
consistent.  I made a 1 liter stock of 1% KOH and then take 100 mls of
that and make a liter of 0.1% and it is lasting a long while. 
Measuring 10 grams or 100 ml allows good accuracy with average
equipment.  Get yourself a graduated pipette and a bulb which allows
consistent fine control.  An investment of about 30 bucks.  My pipette
is 10 ml with 0.1 ml graduations.  Make something to stir the titration
solution constantly for you.  You can do it with a little magnetic
stirrer like I did or use your imagination.  The main thing is the
solution should be kept warm and well agitated so oil does not drop out
while you are in the process.  If you are really well coordinated you
might be able to control the solution with one hand and stir with the
other but I am waaay too clumsy for that so I made something to help me
out.  Automation is not needed IMHO. As an afterthought (but maybe not
obvious to some) be sure your glassware is consistently clean before
starting.  A little dried caustic residue can go a long way to screwing
things up if you are not thinking about things.

Joe

Jason & Katie wrote:

  that is the whole problem, i am trying to automate the entire process, a 
computer will always be more consistent than a human, so with the proper 
sensing equipment, the only input needed would be the contact of two 
seperate digital pH meters with the oil/IPA and lye solutions, the program 
would allow for the pH variables to be incorporated into a formula that will 
calculate the appropriate amount of base to bring the oil to pH 8.4 and the 
process would continue-accurately, automatically, and consistently.

I am not trying to remove the labor or take an easy way out, im trying to 
give myself the ability to do good work consistently.

jason

- Original Message - 
From: "Joe Street" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Friday, March 10, 2006 11:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] automating titration


  
  
I think you should 'manualize' the process.

Joe

  
  

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Re: [Biofuel] hybrid efficiency

[Joe Street]

Good points E.Allen;

I haven't seen that one.  I'll have to look for it.  Since you say Faye
looked so gorgeous but I take it that was from a better time when
actresses didn't have to get naked in order to elicit such a reaction. 
But then maybe there will be a remake with Halley Berry..?  Ya neva
know!

Joe

E. C. wrote:

  Hey Joe
When's the last time you saw the movie "Chinatown"
(Faye Dunaway was gorgeous)?
point: been there, done that -- as with most
corporatocracy scams -- but time's running out!  If We
The People don't get up on our hind legs and seriously
do things to change to a sustainable lifestyle SOON
(and the task is 'way too enormous to be entrusted to
the elites), it isn't going to matter: Ma Nature will
take care of it; she's the only one who has eternity
as a time-frame!
E. Allen Cartwright 

--- Joe Street <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

  
  
Hey Andrew don't forget we are sitting on a virtual
goldmine in terms of 
fresh water here in Canada.  In many places in the
USA I've heard they 
are already feeling the pinch for water and it is
getting worse.  I'm 
wondering if we could set something up where maybe
we could use beavers 
as a slave labour force in the water trade.  What do
you say?

Joe

Andrew Netherton wrote:



  I'll bet that research would show a mighty quick
  

return on investment


  if they had done the study based on European fuel
  

costs, and not our


  cheaper-than-bottled-water fuel here in North
  

America.


  Andrew Netherton


On 3/9/06, AltEnergyNetwork
  

<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


   

  
  
Research Shows Only two out Six Hybrid Cars Recoup

  

Cost Within 5 Years


  
<

  

  
  http://www.alternate-energy.net/N/news.php?detail=n1141917443.news
  
  

  
Yonkers, NY - Consumer Reports is revising the

  

cost analysis


  
in a story that examines the ownership costs and

  

financial


  
 benefits associated with hybrid cars. The story,

  

titled


  
 "The dollars and sense of hybrids," appears in

  

the Annual April


  
  Auto issue of CR, on newsstands now.

Consumer Reports is correcting a calculation error

  

involving


  
the depreciation for the six hybrid vehicles

  

that, in the


  
story, were compared to their conventionally

  

powered


  
counterparts. The error led the publication to

  

overstate


  
 how much extra money the hybrids will cost

  

owners during


  
  the first five years.



full article

<

  

  
  http://www.alternate-energy.net/N/news.php?detail=n1141917443.news
  
  

  




Get your daily alternative energy news

Alternate Energy Resource Network
  1000+ news sources-resources
updated daily

http://www.alternate-energy.net


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  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/
  
  

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http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/


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  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/
  
  


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Re: [Biofuel] automating titration

[Joe Street]

Hi Nigel;

Yes I meant keep it manual.  To what advantage?  Well simplicity
mostly. Automation IMHO does not offer much advantage unless it is for
commercial reasons.  If you are looking to do large scale production
then you have a different paradigm than me so we are talking at odds
anyway, but for small scale local production I would consider
automation to be more of a liability than an asset.  I have a fair bit
of experience with industrial automation of complex systems and in
order for a machine to carry out even modestly complex processes it
takes a plethora of feedback loops and interlocks for it all to work
safely without screwing up.  Just look at how much waste is often
created by something as 'supposedly' simple as a network printer in
realitynot a tree saver.  Just imagine the oopsies and wasted
chemicals, and oil that will result from trying to automate biodiesel
production.  Even if it is only the titration you want to automate,
consider that more and more I am hearing about people who take the
titration kit to the field, to decide on site whether or not to use oil
as a feedstock rather than taking it home and finding out then what
you've got to deal with.  A completely automated titrator would be a
cool project to be sure but it would be more likely to constrain you to
bringing samples to the machine instead of the other way around.

Just my two cents.
Joe

Nigel Kelly wrote:

  Sorry - I don't follow...

You mean do it manually? And if so - to what advantage?

- Original Message - 
From: "Joe Street" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Saturday, March 11, 2006 6:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] automating titration


  
  
I think you should 'manualize' the process.

Joe

Jason & Katie wrote:



  hi everyone, haven't been posting for a couple months (points to old ISP &
retches) but i was messing around in my head a few weeks ago and was
wondering if there was any simple formula that could be used to digitize 
and
automate a titration of oil as compared to lye for fry-grease diesel. i 
have
been trying to think of a way to do this so i can automate the entire
process, but have been coming up blank. any help would be appreciated.

thank you,
jason


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Re: [Biofuel] Cross Posted, Re: World Energy Consumption

[Michael Redler]

Oops!     ...my bad. Sorry.     MikeKeith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  >I thought this might be of interest. I thought that Ken made a good >point but, before I posted it, he wanted to be sure that the reader >understood his method so, I included our dialog.>>MikeThanks Mike. Ken's right, though I think we already did that, more or less.World energy usehttp://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_404.html#energyuseWorld's top CO2 producershttp://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_404.html#co2The overpopulation myth:Re: [Biofuel] Overpopulation Off Limits?http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg57949.htmlGood analysis:Human Population - Global
 Issueshttp://www.globalissues.org/EnvIssues/Population.aspBestKeith___
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Re: [Biofuel] Cross Posted, Re: World Energy Consumption

[Keith Addison]

>I thought this might be of interest. I thought that Ken made a good 
>point but, before I posted it, he wanted to be sure that the reader 
>understood his method so, I included our dialog.
>
>Mike

Thanks Mike. Ken's right, though I think we already did that, more or less.

World energy use
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_404.html#energyuse

World's top CO2 producers
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_404.html#co2

The overpopulation myth:

Re: [Biofuel] Overpopulation Off Limits?
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg57949.html

Good analysis:

Human Population - Global Issues
http://www.globalissues.org/EnvIssues/Population.asp

Best

Keith



>Ken Boak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>From: "Ken Boak" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "Michael Redler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: Re: [wastewatts] RE: The population bomb
>Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2006 07:58:54 -
>
>Mike,
>
>I hastily put together the figures from the first two sources that 
>had the right data.
>
>I summed the total energy consumption for the last 10 years 
>(actually 1994-2003) and divided by the population, to give a figure 
>of quad BTU per million population.
>
>These figures were then multiplied by 10, so that the US figure was 
>about 34, and the others accordingly, purely for illustrative 
>purposes using the electricity consumption analogy.
>
>Whilst my method was quick and dirty, it did give the relative 
>figures purely for illustration of the real per capita consumptions.
>
>Perhaps this point should be noted when you copy to Journey to 
>Forever, saying that the figures are illustrative only, but 
>recommending that those interested should dig deeper and do their 
>own calculations.
>
>
>Ken
>
>- Original Message -
>From: Michael Redler
>To: 
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>e.freeserve.co.uk
>Sent: Sunday, March 12, 2006 11:32 PM
>Subject: Re: [wastewatts] RE: The population bomb
>
>Ken,
>
>May I cross post your message verbatim to a biofuels discussion 
>group sponsored by 
>www.journeytoforever.org?
>
>I think it would get a lot of (positive) attention.
>
>Regards,
>
>Mike
>
>Ken Boak 
><[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>ce.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:
>
>List,
>
>I really think that before you start blaming the developing 
>countries for the problems of the world, energy, food resources, 
>drinking water, that perhaps you ought first to look at per capita 
>figures for consumption.
>
>Having lived and worked in the modern industrial towns of southern 
>China, I am not denying them anything.
>
>Every citizen of the world is entitled to the basics of life, be it 
>food, water or energy regardless of their country of birth.
>
>China has four times the population of the USA, in a land area that 
>is actually 99.65 % that of the United States, but their energy 
>consumption is currently only half of that of the US.
>
>Looking back at the figures since 1994, the US has consumed 953 
>Quadrillion BTU in those ten years (pop 280 million), China only 383 
>quads (pop 1.284 billion), India 124.44 quads for a population of 
>1.045 billion. Britain  97.3 quads in ten years, population 59.7 
>million.
>
>http://www.eia.doe. 
>gov/emeu/aer/txt/ptb1103.html
>
>So expressed as an electricity consumption analogy, a typical 34kWh 
>per day per household in the US, in United Kingdom 16.3kWh,  is 
>2.98kWh per household per day in China, and India 1.19kW, and 
>clearly there will be many millions in China and India who have yet 
>to turn on their first electric light bulb.
>
>Did I mention Canada?   42kWh/day  - oops.
>
>
>regards,
>
>
>Ken


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Re: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House

[Andy Karpay]

I just viewed the DVD movie "Why we fight".  Look for it either via the
internet for purchase, or to be viewed locally at independent theaters.
It is illustrative and informative.  Should be viewed by all earthlings,
especially those from the United States.


Andy Karpay

-Original Message-
From: Hakan Falk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Monday, March 13, 2006 6:05 AM
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House


Tom,

It would be positive, if the oil was an US asset, 
but it is not. Money is an instrument, at the end 
secured by the assets of the country of origin. A 
higher oil price does mean that US have to pay 
more, but other currencies move higher against 
the dollar. The Euro have strengthen from around 
0.89 to over 1.20, which means that US assets 
have lowered its value and are cheaper to buy. US 
assets are moving at a lower value and it is a 
current reversal of the international strengths 
that US built, when the dollar had a high value 
and they bought up a lot of international assets.

Yes, US can cause a lot of havoc, but do not have 
neither the military nor the financial strength 
to maintain a long term occupation and a US 
empire. This means that it is expensive 
fireworks, not a solid long term business. The 
corporations are stateless, in fact the large 
ones are today comparable to a nation. The 
corporations are gaining, not the American people, who are getting
poorer.

Hakan


At 10:57 13/03/2006, you wrote:
>Hi Hakan,
>
>Can you explain how the dollar debt is effected 
>negatively by higher oil prices? If the value of 
>the dollar is pegged to the price of oil doesn´t 
>a doubling in the price of oil halve the 
>effective dollar debt? I imagine that the 
>treasury is working overtime to print up all 
>those hundred dollar bills so the rest of the world can buy oil.
>
>I also imagine that you can cordone off Iran´s 
>southern oil fields with a long term radioactive 
>kill zone. I wonder what Iran´s air strength is?
>
>Tom
>
>
>
>--
>From: Hakan Falk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
>Sent: Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:22:40 -0300
>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House
>
>
>Hi Tom,
>
>The dollar debt is effected negatively by higher
>oil prices. However, the only real support that
>the dollar have today, is that it is the oil
>trading currency. If oil would be traded in Euro,
>the dollar would lose its base and US economy
>would be in severe trouble. That is why an oil
>bourse with oil traded in Euro, is worse than any physical attacks and
war.
>
>An attack on Iran is many times more dangerous
>than the Iraq venture. Iran is far more capable
>and motivated, than Iraq ever was. Iraq would be
>the first situation to explode, when the Shiites
>would directly attack. The US presence in Iraq
>and a popular armed resistance, will not be
>possible to "shock and awe" with terror bombings,
>as was possible in the previous Iraq war. Iraq
>will again be the battle field and US will face
>both an uprising and troops from Iran. US will
>again resort to terror bombing, both within Iraq
>and in Iran. It will under no circumstances be a short war.
>
>If US thought that they had some major incident
>in other Arab countries. It will be nothing,
>compared with the guerilla attacks that will
>follow in all Arab countries. If you then
>consider the lack of oil deliveries, that all
>developed countries will suffer, it will be
>difficult for US to wage a war. A very large part
>of the military would be locked up in securing
>deliveries of the scarce oil resources that they
>could get their hands on, only to maintain the
>war effort. The whole world will be hit by an
>economic depression and US will never be able to recover its current
standing.
>
>I really hope that Bush is capable to some
>logical reasoning and common sense, but I am not
>overly optimistic. This time he cannot even hope
>for a token support from the international
>community, which probably will turn against him instead.
>
>Hakan
>
>
>At 23:20 12/03/2006, you wrote:
> >Hi Keith and All,
> >
> >There is little doubt that the U.S. will hit
> >Iran. That oil bourse is supposed to open in a
> >week or two. The only open question is will the
> >U.S. hit before or after it opens. I also think
> >that the U.S. will use nukes albiet low yield
> >ones. Their detonation underground will cause
> >but a small nuclear signature and given the
> >target is allegedly a nuclear facility I imagine
> >and radioactive spillover will be blamed on the
> >facility. I foresee cruise missiles raining on
> >Iraq´s air force, followed by U.S. air attacks
> >and no fly zones. We´ll steal the oil rich zone
> >adjacent to Iraq for ¨security ¨reasons and give
> >it to the Brits. The folks in Washington don´t
> >care how high oil prices go. Remember that
> >they´re all oil folks. Higher prices equate to
> >greater profit for the companies. Also higher
> >oil 

Re: [Biofuel] [SPAM] Re: Logic out the window at the White House

[Gary L. Green]

Federal Reserve.  It isn't federal and there are no reserves.  There are no assets to back up your money, just the BELIEF that there is.Believe brother, believe!On  13Mar, 2006, at 7:05 PM, Hakan Falk wrote:Money is an instrument, at the end  secured by the assets of the country of origin ___
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Re: [Biofuel] Scientists Racing to Ease Painful PTSD Memories

[Michael Redler]

Excellent link Keith. Thank you.     You wrote: "It's not like there's not enough BS to get a person all fired up after all."     Although there's a sad flip side to this observation, I like to think of the amazing effect a struggle has on the human condition.     You might be right. We might not be there yet. I'm certainly not wondering where my next meal is coming from and whether or not I'll have clothes or shelter in the foreseeable future.     Mike    Keith Addison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  Hi Mike>There is a lot of dissent growing here but, no real characters to >motivate the people (yet). Although intellectuals like Chomsky are >vital to educating the movement, I would
 give anything to bring back >the Chicago Seven.Do you think they still make them that way Mike? Hope springs eternal but it's a little hard to imagine a neo-Chicago Seven just sitting there quietly in the background waiting for someone to press the button. It's not like there's not enough BS to get a person all fired up after all. Maybe they don't make acid anymore, that's the trouble.>So far, the NSA and Homeland Security (the new COINTELPRO) hasn't >knocked on my door. I suppose they are preoccupied with supporting >the (as of yet undocumented) "Arab Exclusion Act".>>In solidarity,>>Mike>>Steal this email!>>:-)Ta-daah!!!http://www.tenant.net/Community/steal/steal.htmlSteal This BookBy Abbie Hoffman:-)Hm. It lacks a certain something when you don't have to steal it, you can just download it and no need to strike a blow for
 freedom. LOL!BestKeith>"Gary L. Green" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:>>Dude!>>Without writing a 20 page response of minutia into the heart of your >feelings, let me just say I'm glad to hear from someone who feels >like I do.>>The heros of the Vietnam conflict are now all Canadian citizens.>>The current Christo-fascists have made me so ill that I left my own >country. Hope to go back one day and lend a voice to reason and >light. Most likely though that won't happen. Married a woman from >another country and she doesn't want anything to do with the USA >after living there for 4 years.>>Peace bro.>>Gary___
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Re: [Biofuel] Scientists Racing to Ease Painful PTSD Memories

[Keith Addison]

Hi Marilyn

>Keith at Biofuel@sustainablelists.org wrote:
>"Does anything know anything about soldiers being given drugs
>before going into combat, as has been alleged?"
>
>Several US militiary men returning from Iraq have become violent
>against their wives, some wives being killed by these husbands
>in a California base. There has been a lot of speculation that this
>violence was brought on by reactions to drugs in their systems,
>but I haven't heard of any studies confirming this. If such studies
>did exist, we probably wouldn't hear about them anyway.
>
>There were news reports in England, where I lived at the time,
>that the Chinese troops who mowed down the protesters in
>Tiannamin Square were given drugs to make them aggressive,
>and this, in addition to being told that the students in the Square
>had been extremely violent, made them willing to kill their own
>people. Did US news sources report this?

I saw those reports, I was also in England then. Google finds some 
smatterings, "unofficial" stuff, eg: "Junior XNA [Xinhua News Agency] 
staffers stopped work after editors suppressed a report, based on 
hospital accounts, that soldiers had been given amphetamines prior to 
clearing out Tiananmen and protesters had been shot with dum dum 
bullets forbidden by the Geneva convention."

Another: "The soldiers had obviously been drugged because sedatives 
were ineffective on them. The doctors believed that military 
personnel had been given amphetamines before being sent into the 
square. As wounded students began streaming back onto the university 
campus, they confirmed the bizarre behavior of the soldiers who they 
reported had been laughing hysterically as they mowed down the 
students..."

This is from The Age, not just about Tiananmen Square:

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/01/20/1042911325152.html
More than once were warriors out of their tiny minds - theage.com.au

I keep hearing about it, but never enough to pin it down. It goes 
back to the WW2 research findings that most soldiers wouldn't pull 
the trigger even under direct attack, not quite the good news the 
military wanted to hear. How to make them kill on demand, so they're 
"capable of violent acts without guilt feelings", ie turn them into 
psychopaths? It seems it's not so easy, the Milgram experiment etc to 
the contrary. Little pills might help though.

Best

Keith



>Marilyn


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[Biofuel] Cross Posted, Re: World Energy Consumption

[Michael Redler]

I thought this might be of interest. I thought that Ken made a good point but, before I posted it, he wanted to be sure that the reader understood his method so, I included our dialog.     MikeKen Boak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  From: "Ken Boak" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: "Michael Redler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Subject: Re: [wastewatts] RE: The population bombDate: Mon, 13 Mar 2006 07:58:54 -Mike,     I hastily put together the figures from the first two sources that had the right data.    
 I summed the total energy consumption for the last 10 years (actually 1994-2003) and divided by the population, to give a figure of quad BTU per million population.     These figures were then multiplied by 10, so that the US figure was about 34, and the others accordingly, purely for illustrative purposes using the electricity consumption analogy.     Whilst my method was quick and dirty, it did give the relative figures purely for illustration of the real per capita consumptions.     Perhaps this point should be noted when you copy to Journey to Forever, saying that the figures are illustrative only, but recommending that those interested should dig deeper and do their own
 calculations.        Ken- Original Message -   From: Michael Redler   To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]   Sent: Sunday, March 12, 2006 11:32 PM  Subject: Re: [wastewatts] RE: The population bombKen,     May I cross post
 your message verbatim to a biofuels discussion group sponsored by www.journeytoforever.org?     I think it would get a lot of (positive) attention.     Regards,     MikeKen Boak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  List,I really think that before you start blaming the developing countries for the problems of the world, energy, food resources, drinking water, that perhaps you ought first to look at per capita figures for consumption.Having lived and worked in the modern industrial towns of southern China, I am not denying them anything.Every citizen of the world is entitled to the basics of life, be it food, water or energy
 regardless of their country of birth.China has four times the population of the USA, in a land area that is actually 99.65 % that of the United States, but their energy consumption is currently only half of that of the US.Looking back at the figures since 1994, the US has consumed 953 Quadrillion BTU in those ten years (pop 280 million), China only 383 quads (pop 1.284 billion), India 124.44 quads for a population of 1.045 billion. Britain  97.3 quads in ten years, population 59.7 million.http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/aer/txt/ptb1103.htmlSo expressed as an electricity consumption analogy, a typical 34kWh per day per household in the US, in United Kingdom 16.3kWh,  is 2.98kWh per household per day in China, and India 1.19kW, and clearly there will be many millions in China and India who have yet to turn on their first electric light bulb.Did I mention Canada?  
 42kWh/day  - oops.regards,Ken___
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Re: [Biofuel] [off topic]Autopsy: No Arabs on Flight 77

[fox mulder]

Source:  http://www.physics911.net/olmsted.htm





Autopsy: No Arabs on Flight 77


By Thomas R. Olmsted, M.D

I am an ex Naval line officer and a psychiatrist in
private practice in New Orleans, a Christian and
homeschool dad. It troubled me a great deal that we
rushed off to war on the flimsiest of evidence. I
considered various ways to provide a smoking gun of
who and why Sept 11th happened. Astute observers
noticed right away that there were no Arabic sounding
names on any of the flight manifests of the planes
that "crashed" on that day.

A list of names on a piece of paper is not evidence,
but an autopsy by a pathologist, is. I undertook by
FOIA request, to obtain that autopsy list and you are
invited to view it below. Guess what? Still no Arabs
on the list. In my opinion the monsters who planned
this crime made a mistake by not including Arabic
names on the original list to make the ruse seem more
believable.

When airline disasters occur, airlines will routinely
provide a manifest list for anxious families. You may
have noticed that even before Sep 11th, airlines are
pretty meticulous about getting an accurate headcount
before takeoff. It seems very unlikely to me, that
five Arabs sneaked onto a flight with weapons. This is
the list provided by American of the 56 passengers. On
September 27th, the FBI published photos of the
"hijackers" of Flight 77.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the Armed Forces
Institute of Pathology (AFIP), does a miraculous job
and identifies nearly all the bodies on November 16th
2001.

The AFIP suggest these numbers; 189 killed, 125 worked
at the Pentagon and 64 were "passengers" on the plane.
The AA list only had 56 and the list just obtained has
58. They did not explain how they were able to tell
"victims" bodies from "hijacker" bodies. In fact, from
the beginning NO explanation has been given for the
extra five suggested in news reports except that the
FBI showed us the pictures to make up the difference,
and that makes it so.

Now, being the trusting sort, I figured that the
government would want to quickly dispel any rumors so
we could get on with the chore of kicking
Osama/Sadaam's butt (weren't these originally two
different people?). It seemed simple to me. . .produce
the names of all the bodies identified by the AFIP and
compare it with the publicized list of passengers. So,
I sent a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request to
the AFIP and asked for an expedited response, because
we were getting ready to send our boys to war on the
pretext that Osama/Saddam had done the deed. Fourteen
months later, a few US soldiers dead, many Iraqi
civilians pushing up daisies, and I finally get the
list. Believe me that they weren't a bit happy to give
it up, and I really have no idea why they choose now
to release it.

No Arabs wound up on the morgue slab; however, three
ADDITIONAL people not listed by American Airlines
sneaked in. I have seen no explanation for these
extras. I did American the opportunity to "revise"
their original list, but they have not responded. The
new names are: Robert Ploger, Zandra Ploger, and
Sandra Teague. The AFIP claims that the only
"passenger" body that they were not able to identify
is the toddler, Dana Falkenberg, whose parents and
young sister are on the list of those identified. The
satanic masterminds behind this caper may be feeling
pretty smug about the perfect crime, but they have
left a raft of clues tying these unfortunates
together.

The Passengers

In the foregoing, I presented evidence from the Armed
Forces Institute of Pathology (AFIP), that there were
no Arabs on American Airlines Flight 77. This doesn't
really jibe with the official story, so someone isn't
telling the truth. This list itself is suspect because
there is a special group of "bone guys" that are
called in whenever the government needs an
"adjustment" to their story.

About "bone guys": No, we're not talking folks that
hang around secret Ivy League fraternities. On May 31,
2002, the Washington Post had this to say about 'bone
guys':

"...When remains of the Waco dead or 9/11 Pentagon
victims or Desert Storm casualties -- or most recently
Chandra Levy -- need to be studied, the bone guys at
the Smithsonian are called in. The bone guys read
skeletons like intricate topological maps. Sometimes
they can make identification from a skull fragment the
size of a quarter. They can read race in the teeth and
gender in the brow. They can tell you who had an
asymmetric nose. They can tell you who may have been a
factory worker, because bones grow more pronounced to
accommodate certain muscles, and who may have been a
weaver or a tailor, based on grooves in the teeth
where thread was held"

In other words, these were the fellows who helped tidy
up the government's story at Waco and are "studying"
the Sept 11th remains as well.

By now you have probably heard that many of the
"hijackers" named by the FBI are alive and well. The
Information Times, an on-line publication, reported

Re: [Biofuel] [off topic]How Islamic inventors changed the world

[fox mulder]

Source: The Independent
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/science_technology/article350594.ece



How Islamic inventors changed the world


 From coffee to cheques and the three-course 
meal, the Muslim world has given us many 
innovations that we take for granted in daily 
life. As a new exhibition opens, Paul Vallely 
nominates 20 of the most influential- and 
identifies the men of genius behind them


Published: 11 March 2006

1 The story goes that an Arab named Khalid was 
tending his goats in the Kaffa region of southern 
Ethiopia, when he noticed his animals became 
livelier after eating a certain berry. He boiled 
the berries to make the first coffee. Certainly 
the first record of the drink is of beans 
exported from Ethiopia to Yemen where Sufis drank 
it to stay awake all night to pray on special 
occasions. By the late 15th century it had 
arrived in Mecca and Turkey from where it made 
its way to Venice in 1645. It was brought to 
England in 1650 by a Turk named Pasqua Rosee who 
opened the first coffee house in Lombard Street 
in the City of London. The Arabic qahwa became 
the Turkish kahve then the Italian caffé and then
English coffee.

2 The ancient Greeks thought our eyes emitted 
rays, like a laser, which enabled us to see. The 
first person to realise that light enters the 
eye, rather than leaving it, was the 10th-century 
Muslim mathematician, astronomer and physicist 
Ibn al-Haitham. He invented the first pin-hole 
camera after noticing the way light came through 
a hole in window shutters. The smaller the hole, 
the better the picture, he worked out, and set up 
the first Camera Obscura (from the Arab word 
qamara for a dark or private room). He is also 
credited with being the first man to shift 
physics from a philosophical activity to an
experimental one.

3 A form of chess was played in ancient India but 
the game was developed into the form we know it 
today in Persia. From there it spread westward to 
Europe - where it was introduced by the Moors in 
Spain in the 10th century - and eastward as far 
as Japan. The word rook comes from the Persian rukh,
which means 
chariot.

4 A thousand years before the Wright brothers a 
Muslim poet, astronomer, musician and engineer 
named Abbas ibn Firnas made several attempts to 
construct a flying machine. In 852 he jumped from 
the minaret of the Grand Mosque in Cordoba using 
a loose cloak stiffened with wooden struts. He 
hoped to glide like a bird. He didn't. But the 
cloak slowed his fall, creating what is thought 
to be the first parachute, and leaving him with 
only minor injuries. In 875, aged 70, having 
perfected a machine of silk and eagles' feathers 
he tried again, jumping from a mountain. He flew 
to a significant height and stayed aloft for ten 
minutes but crashed on landing - concluding, 
correctly, that it was because he had not given 
his device a tail so it would stall on landing. 
Baghdad international airport and a crater on the Moon
are named after 
him.

5 Washing and bathing are religious requirements 
for Muslims, which is perhaps why they perfected 
the recipe for soap which we still use today. The 
ancient Egyptians had soap of a kind, as did the 
Romans who used it more as a pomade. But it was 
the Arabs who combined vegetable oils with sodium 
hydroxide and aromatics such as thyme oil. One of 
the Crusaders' most striking characteristics, to 
Arab nostrils, was that they did not wash. 
Shampoo was introduced to England by a Muslim who 
opened Mahomed's Indian Vapour Baths on Brighton 
seafront in 1759 and was appointed Shampooing 
Surgeon to Kings George IV and William IV.

6 Distillation, the means of separating liquids 
through differences in their boiling points, was 
invented around the year 800 by Islam's foremost 
scientist, Jabir ibn Hayyan, who transformed 
alchemy into chemistry, inventing many of the 
basic processes and apparatus still in use today 
- liquefaction, crystallisation, distillation, 
purification, oxidisation, evaporation and 
filtration. As well as discovering sulphuric and 
nitric acid, he invented the alembic still, 
giving the world intense rosewater and other 
perfumes and alcoholic spirits (although drinking 
them is haram, or forbidden, in Islam). Ibn 
Hayyan emphasised systematic experimentation and 
was the founder of modern chemistry.

7 The crank-shaft is a device which translates 
rotary into linear motion and is central to much 
of the machinery in the modern world, not least 
the internal combustion engine. One of the most 
important mechanical inventions in the history of 
humankind, it was created by an ingenious Muslim 
engineer called al-Jazari to raise water for 
irrigation. His 1206 Book of Knowledge of 
Ingenious Mechanical Devices shows he also 
invented or refined the use of valves and 
pistons, devised some of the first mechanical 
clocks driven by water and weights, and was the 
father of robotics. Among his 50 other inventions was
the combination 
lock.

8 Q

Re: [Biofuel] Scientists Racing to Ease Painful PTSD Memories

[Keith Addison]

Hi Mike



>There is a lot of dissent growing here but, no real characters to 
>motivate the people (yet). Although intellectuals like Chomsky are 
>vital to educating the movement, I would give anything to bring back 
>the Chicago Seven.

Do you think they still make them that way Mike? Hope springs eternal 
but it's a little hard to imagine a neo-Chicago Seven just sitting 
there quietly in the background waiting for someone to press the 
button. It's not like there's not enough BS to get a person all fired 
up after all. Maybe they don't make acid anymore, that's the trouble.

>So far, the NSA and Homeland Security (the new COINTELPRO) hasn't 
>knocked on my door. I suppose they are preoccupied with supporting 
>the (as of yet undocumented) "Arab Exclusion Act".
>
>In solidarity,
>
>Mike
>
>Steal this email!
>
>:-)

Ta-daah!!!

http://www.tenant.net/Community/steal/steal.html
Steal This Book
By Abbie Hoffman

:-)

Hm. It lacks a certain something when you don't have to steal it, you 
can just download it and no need to strike a blow for freedom. LOL!

Best

Keith

 

>"Gary L. Green" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>Dude!
>
>Without writing a 20 page response of minutia into the heart of your 
>feelings, let me just say I'm glad to hear from someone who feels 
>like I do.
>
>The heros of the Vietnam conflict are now all Canadian citizens.
>
>The current Christo-fascists have made me so ill that I left my own 
>country.  Hope to go back one day and lend a voice to reason and 
>light.  Most likely though that won't happen.  Married a woman from 
>another country and she doesn't want anything to do with the USA 
>after living there for 4 years.
>
>Peace bro.
>
>Gary
>
>
>On  12Mar, 2006, at 2:39 AM, Michael Redler wrote:
>
>>By the way, does anyone think that development of this 
>>drug represents a failure in root-cause analysis for people 
>>effected by killing for their country?
>>
>>Hmmm...What else could we do to treat traumatic events? Maybe NOT 
>>HAVE THEM by not adopting a policy of preemptive strikes toward 
>>unproven, "eminent attacks"!
>>
>>But then again, maybe I'm missing the point here. People wanting to 
>>change their career to something that involves dispensing pain and 
>>suffering now have something to treat those pesky messages from 
>>their conscience.
>>
>>One final note: There is an epidemic of kidnapping in Africa for 
>>the purpose of building armies of children. This is partly because 
>>they haven't fully developed the concept of right and wrong (by 
>>enlarge, a ta ught behavior). Could this be an indication that the 
>>US military is running out of teen-age recruits?
>>
>>...just a thought.
>>
>>Mike


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Re: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House

[Hakan Falk]

Tom,

It would be positive, if the oil was an US asset, 
but it is not. Money is an instrument, at the end 
secured by the assets of the country of origin. A 
higher oil price does mean that US have to pay 
more, but other currencies move higher against 
the dollar. The Euro have strengthen from around 
0.89 to over 1.20, which means that US assets 
have lowered its value and are cheaper to buy. US 
assets are moving at a lower value and it is a 
current reversal of the international strengths 
that US built, when the dollar had a high value 
and they bought up a lot of international assets.

Yes, US can cause a lot of havoc, but do not have 
neither the military nor the financial strength 
to maintain a long term occupation and a US 
empire. This means that it is expensive 
fireworks, not a solid long term business. The 
corporations are stateless, in fact the large 
ones are today comparable to a nation. The 
corporations are gaining, not the American people, who are getting poorer.

Hakan


At 10:57 13/03/2006, you wrote:
>Hi Hakan,
>
>Can you explain how the dollar debt is effected 
>negatively by higher oil prices? If the value of 
>the dollar is pegged to the price of oil doesn´t 
>a doubling in the price of oil halve the 
>effective dollar debt? I imagine that the 
>treasury is working overtime to print up all 
>those hundred dollar bills so the rest of the world can buy oil.
>
>I also imagine that you can cordone off Iran´s 
>southern oil fields with a long term radioactive 
>kill zone. I wonder what Iran´s air strength is?
>
>Tom
>
>
>
>--
>From: Hakan Falk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
>Sent: Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:22:40 -0300
>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House
>
>
>Hi Tom,
>
>The dollar debt is effected negatively by higher
>oil prices. However, the only real support that
>the dollar have today, is that it is the oil
>trading currency. If oil would be traded in Euro,
>the dollar would lose its base and US economy
>would be in severe trouble. That is why an oil
>bourse with oil traded in Euro, is worse than any physical attacks and war.
>
>An attack on Iran is many times more dangerous
>than the Iraq venture. Iran is far more capable
>and motivated, than Iraq ever was. Iraq would be
>the first situation to explode, when the Shiites
>would directly attack. The US presence in Iraq
>and a popular armed resistance, will not be
>possible to "shock and awe" with terror bombings,
>as was possible in the previous Iraq war. Iraq
>will again be the battle field and US will face
>both an uprising and troops from Iran. US will
>again resort to terror bombing, both within Iraq
>and in Iran. It will under no circumstances be a short war.
>
>If US thought that they had some major incident
>in other Arab countries. It will be nothing,
>compared with the guerilla attacks that will
>follow in all Arab countries. If you then
>consider the lack of oil deliveries, that all
>developed countries will suffer, it will be
>difficult for US to wage a war. A very large part
>of the military would be locked up in securing
>deliveries of the scarce oil resources that they
>could get their hands on, only to maintain the
>war effort. The whole world will be hit by an
>economic depression and US will never be able to recover its current standing.
>
>I really hope that Bush is capable to some
>logical reasoning and common sense, but I am not
>overly optimistic. This time he cannot even hope
>for a token support from the international
>community, which probably will turn against him instead.
>
>Hakan
>
>
>At 23:20 12/03/2006, you wrote:
> >Hi Keith and All,
> >
> >There is little doubt that the U.S. will hit
> >Iran. That oil bourse is supposed to open in a
> >week or two. The only open question is will the
> >U.S. hit before or after it opens. I also think
> >that the U.S. will use nukes albiet low yield
> >ones. Their detonation underground will cause
> >but a small nuclear signature and given the
> >target is allegedly a nuclear facility I imagine
> >and radioactive spillover will be blamed on the
> >facility. I foresee cruise missiles raining on
> >Iraq´s air force, followed by U.S. air attacks
> >and no fly zones. We´ll steal the oil rich zone
> >adjacent to Iraq for ¨security ¨reasons and give
> >it to the Brits. The folks in Washington don´t
> >care how high oil prices go. Remember that
> >they´re all oil folks. Higher prices equate to
> >greater profit for the companies. Also higher
> >oil prices make dollar debt disappear.
> >
> >Tom
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >--
> >From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
> >Sent: Sun, 12 Mar 2006 07:42:58 -0300
> >Subject: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House
> >
> >"U.S. ambassador to the United Nations John Bolton was calmly
> >proposing an illegal attack on a sovereign state, possibly involving
> >nuclear weapons."

Re: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House

[Tom Irwin]

Hi Hakan,
 
Can you explain how the dollar debt is effected negatively by higher oil prices? If the value of the dollar is pegged to the price of oil doesn´t a doubling in the price of oil halve the effective dollar debt? I imagine that the treasury is working overtime to print up all those hundred dollar bills so the rest of the world can buy oil. 
 
I also imagine that you can cordone off Iran´s southern oil fields with a long term radioactive kill zone. I wonder what Iran´s air strength is?
 
Tom
 


From: Hakan Falk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:22:40 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White HouseHi Tom,The dollar debt is effected negatively by higher oil prices. However, the only real support that the dollar have today, is that it is the oil trading currency. If oil would be traded in Euro, the dollar would lose its base and US economy would be in severe trouble. That is why an oil bourse with oil traded in Euro, is worse than any physical attacks and war.An attack on Iran is many times more dangerous than the Iraq venture. Iran is far more capable and motivated, than Iraq ever was. Iraq would be the first situation to explode, when the Shiites would directly attack. The US presence in Iraq and a popular armed resistance, will not be possible to "shock and awe" with terror bombings, as was possible in the previous Iraq war. Iraq will again be the battle field and US will face both an uprising and troops from Iran. US will again resort to terror bombing, both within Iraq and in Iran. It will under no circumstances be a short war.If US thought that they had some major incident in other Arab countries. It will be nothing, compared with the guerilla attacks that will follow in all Arab countries. If you then consider the lack of oil deliveries, that all developed countries will suffer, it will be difficult for US to wage a war. A very large part of the military would be locked up in securing deliveries of the scarce oil resources that they could get their hands on, only to maintain the war effort. The whole world will be hit by an economic depression and US will never be able to recover its current standing.I really hope that Bush is capable to some logical reasoning and common sense, but I am not overly optimistic. This time he cannot even hope for a token support from the international community, which probably will turn against him instead.HakanAt 23:20 12/03/2006, you wrote:>Hi Keith and All,>>There is little doubt that the U.S. will hit >Iran. That oil bourse is supposed to open in a >week or two. The only open question is will the >U.S. hit before or after it opens. I also think >that the U.S. will use nukes albiet low yield >ones. Their detonation underground will cause >but a small nuclear signature and given the >target is allegedly a nuclear facility I imagine >and radioactive spillover will be blamed on the >facility. I foresee cruise missiles raining on >Iraq´s air force, followed by U.S. air attacks >and no fly zones. We´ll steal the oil rich zone >adjacent to Iraq for ¨security ¨reasons and give >it to the Brits. The folks in Washington don´t >care how high oil prices go. Remember that >they´re all oil folks. Higher prices equate to >greater profit for the companies. Also higher >oil prices make dollar debt disappear.>>Tom>>-->From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]>To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org>Sent: Sun, 12 Mar 2006 07:42:58 -0300>Subject: [Biofuel] Logic out the window at the White House>>"U.S. ambassador to the United Nations John Bolton was calmly>proposing an illegal attack on a sovereign state, possibly involving>nuclear weapons.">___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


 
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