Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
Hi D and Mike...isn't homogenized milk whipped up into incredibly small particles that actually scar the lining of the esophagus and arteries, thereby, allowing cholesterol to more easily coagulate along the linings? Whether or not it does, I say "soy milk." I know I know...tastes terrible, to some. But I only use it on cereals and a couple of desserts. Plenty of other stuffto be drinking, likeuh, waterdistilled of course...I know I know minerals etc etc...hey...distilledperiod...and don't bother me about taste...if you can taste it, it ain't water you're tasting! Yeah, I'm closed minded on this one!! LOL Mike DuPree - Original Message - From: "D. Mindock" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 2:56 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Hi Mike, I think Weston Price would say to drink raw milk. When milk is pastuerized and homogenized, it becomes harmful to the body. So those drinking less of the bad milk in the Harvard study would actually be better off. Myself, I don't drink milk unless I can get it raw and organic. Also, even better, is to add kefir culture to it. I think the Hunzas drink their milk cultured, not straight up. Peace, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: "Mike Weaver" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 6:12 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia WasTestimonials as Evidence) From the can't-help-but-stick-my-toe-in dept. Caveat: No proof other than what I've read over the years. It has always seemed to me that the maladies that people suffer from are in large part due to environment/lifestyle. In the third world, disease is far more likely to be as a result of the lack of food and adequate nutrition, wheras in the developed world, we suffer from the diseaeses of affluence: diabetis being the one that comes to mind, along with obesity-related ailments such as heart disease, high blood pressure, strokes and so on. Smoking is another factor. Another interesting item, from Harvard University's website: In particular, these studies suggest that high calcium intake doesn't actually appear to lower a person's risk for osteoporosis. For example, in the large Harvard studies of male health professionals and female nurses, individuals who drank one glass of milk (or less) per week were at no greater risk of breaking a hip or forearm than were those who drank two or more glasses per week.(2, 3 http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/calcium.html#references) Other studies have found similar results. It is odd human beings are the only animal that develop "a disease" if they don't eat the milk of another species. Dogs don't need cat milk. bob allen wrote:Howdy Terry,Terry Dyck wrote:HI Bob,The Western world has the highest rate of Cancer, Heart disease, Diabetes,Respiratory problems and other ailments in the world.oh really, and your source for these "facts" is? are the data ageadjusted, etc. and just what "other" ailments are included. This is theissue I have with you and others, you make what I feel are overly broadstatements as fact, without little or no support. So give mereference or two so I can draw my own conclusions.or how about just statistic at a time to discuss. How about ageadjusted cancer rates? (age adjusting is necessary as cancer isessentially inevitable, the longer you live the more likely you are toget cancer. show me the data please. On the other handthere is a valley in the middle of the Himalayan mountains called Hunzalandthat is an almost disease free area.I have heard this canard before. I googled hunzaland and about the onlything I got were people hawking their particular "cure" The Apricot Kernel Anti-Cancer Theory http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/land_of_hunza.htmor how about 160+ year oldshttp://www.arthritis-nature-cure.com/people.htmdo really believe that? really, you don't think someone could be lessthan forthright to make a point about a product the promote?or maybe it's the magnetized waterhttp://www.stopcancer.com/magnetpHFoundation2.htm A pure organic food diet and almost nopollution could be the reason for people having good health.or it could all be a bunch of hype. How do we know with out betterdocumentation?--Bob Allen, http://ozarker.org/bob=The modern conservative is engaged in one of Man's oldest exercises inmoral philosophy; that is,the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness JKG ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
Howdy Mike, MK DuPree wrote: Hi D and Mike...isn't homogenized milk actually the lipid portion of milk, whipped up into incredibly small particles yes that actually scar the lining of the esophagus and arteries, no thereby, allowing cholesterol to more easily coagulate along the linings? no Whether or not it does, I say soy milk. I know I know...tastes terrible, to some. But I only use it on cereals and a couple of desserts. Plenty of other stuff to be drinking, likeuh, waterdistilled of course...I know I know minerals etc etc...hey...distilledperiod...and don't bother me about taste...if you can taste it, it ain't water you're tasting! Yeah, I'm closed minded on this one!! LOL Mike DuPree - Original Message - From: D. Mindock [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 2:56 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Hi Mike, I think Weston Price would say to drink raw milk. When milk is pastuerized and homogenized, it becomes harmful to the body. So those drinking less of the bad milk in the Harvard study would actually be better off. Myself, I don't drink milk unless I can get it raw and organic. Also, even better, is to add kefir culture to it. I think the Hunzas drink their milk cultured, not straight up. Peace, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 6:12 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia WasTestimonials as Evidence) From the can't-help-but-stick-my-toe-in dept. Caveat: No proof other than what I've read over the years. It has always seemed to me that the maladies that people suffer from are in large part due to environment/lifestyle. In the third world, disease is far more likely to be as a result of the lack of food and adequate nutrition, wheras in the developed world, we suffer from the diseaeses of affluence: diabetis being the one that comes to mind, along with obesity-related ailments such as heart disease, high blood pressure, strokes and so on. Smoking is another factor. Another interesting item, from Harvard University's website: In particular, these studies suggest that high calcium intake doesn't actually appear to lower a person's risk for osteoporosis. For example, in the large Harvard studies of male health professionals and female nurses, individuals who drank one glass of milk (or less) per week were at no greater risk of breaking a hip or forearm than were those who drank two or more glasses per week.(2, 3 http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/calcium.html#references) Other studies have found similar results. It is odd human beings are the only animal that develop a disease if they don't eat the milk of another species. Dogs don't need cat milk. bob allen wrote: Howdy Terry, Terry Dyck wrote: HI Bob, The Western world has the highest rate of Cancer, Heart disease, Diabetes, Respiratory problems and other ailments in the world. oh really, and your source for these facts is? are the data age adjusted, etc. and just what other ailments are included. This is the issue I have with you and others, you make what I feel are overly broad statements as fact, without little or no support. So give me reference or two so I can draw my own conclusions. or how about just statistic at a time to discuss. How about age adjusted cancer rates? (age adjusting is necessary as cancer is essentially inevitable, the longer you live the more likely you are to get cancer. show me the data please. On the other hand there is a valley in the middle of the Himalayan mountains called Hunzaland that is an almost disease free area. I have heard this canard before. I googled hunzaland and about the only thing I got were people hawking their particular cure The Apricot Kernel Anti-Cancer Theory http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/land_of_hunza.htm or how about 160+ year olds http://www.arthritis-nature-cure.com/people.htm do really believe that? really, you don't think someone could be less than forthright to make a point about a product the promote? or maybe it's the magnetized water http://www.stopcancer.com/magnetpHFoundation2.htm A pure organic food diet and almost no pollution could be the reason for people having good health. or it could all be a bunch of hype. How do we know with out better documentation? -- Bob Allen, http://ozarker.org/bob
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
i dont suppose anyone actually went and gave the cows a health exam? i really doubt that they were in any condition to be giving healthy milk to begin with. a typical dairy farm is usually a reeking, filthy, hell-hole with dirty cows on poorly drained concrete, and being fed the weakest of slop because its CHEAPER. i would be thankful for heat treated, sanitized (un)milk as long as places like that continue to operate the way they do. Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 8:25 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) D. Mindock wrote: Hi Mike, I think Weston Price would say to drink raw milk. When milk is pastuerized and homogenized, it becomes harmful to the body. So those drinking less of the bad milk in the Harvard study would actually be better off. Myself, I don't drink milk unless I can get it raw and organic. http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2006/10/13/food/0_03_1110_12_06.txt Raw organic milk that sickened California children now OK http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003280686_spinach29m.html Two children have been sickened in another episode of E. coli infection, this time from drinking raw milk from a Whatcom County dairy. A 5-year-old boy from Issaquah was still hospitalized with the illness Thursday, while an 8-year-old girl from Snohomish County was recovering at home, said state health officials and a spokeswoman for a store that sold the milk. http://www.sciencedaily.com/upi/index.php?feed=Sciencearticle=UPI-1-20061013-01412200-bc-britain-tb.xml Small TB outbreak traced to raw milk Also, even better, is to add kefir culture to it. I think the Hunzas drink their milk cultured, not straight up. Peace, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 6:12 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia WasTestimonials as Evidence) From the can't-help-but-stick-my-toe-in dept. Caveat: No proof other than what I've read over the years. It has always seemed to me that the maladies that people suffer from are in large part due to environment/lifestyle. In the third world, disease is far more likely to be as a result of the lack of food and adequate nutrition, wheras in the developed world, we suffer from the diseaeses of affluence: diabetis being the one that comes to mind, along with obesity-related ailments such as heart disease, high blood pressure, strokes and so on. Smoking is another factor. Another interesting item, from Harvard University's website: In particular, these studies suggest that high calcium intake doesn't actually appear to lower a person's risk for osteoporosis. For example, in the large Harvard studies of male health professionals and female nurses, individuals who drank one glass of milk (or less) per week were at no greater risk of breaking a hip or forearm than were those who drank two or more glasses per week.(2, 3 http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/calcium.html#references) Other studies have found similar results. It is odd human beings are the only animal that develop a disease if they don't eat the milk of another species. Dogs don't need cat milk. bob allen wrote: Howdy Terry, Terry Dyck wrote: HI Bob, The Western world has the highest rate of Cancer, Heart disease, Diabetes, Respiratory problems and other ailments in the world. oh really, and your source for these facts is? are the data age adjusted, etc. and just what other ailments are included. This is the issue I have with you and others, you make what I feel are overly broad statements as fact, without little or no support. So give me reference or two so I can draw my own conclusions. or how about just statistic at a time to discuss. How about age adjusted cancer rates? (age adjusting is necessary as cancer is essentially inevitable, the longer you live the more likely you are to get cancer. show me the data please. On the other hand there is a valley in the middle of the Himalayan mountains called Hunzaland that is an almost disease free area. I have heard this canard before. I googled hunzaland and about the only thing I got were people hawking their particular cure The Apricot Kernel Anti-Cancer Theory http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/land_of_hunza.htm or how about 160+ year olds http://www.arthritis-nature-cure.com/people.htm do really believe that? really, you don't think someone could be less than forthright to make a point about a product the promote? or maybe it's the magnetized water http://www.stopcancer.com/magnetpHFoundation2.htm A pure organic food diet and almost no pollution
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
I don't see how skepticism can determine quality. I do agree that claims need to be backed up with sound studies. There has been a lot of studies done wrt to herbs, essential oils, and vitamins. If you examine the track record between drugs and alt remedies you will see that drugs are largely an empty promise, regardless of the studies done prior to their release by the FDA. The FDA is supported by Big Pharma so it is hard to imagine how they can ever be unbiased. And then there's the well known revolving door between the FDA and drug companies. About 200,000 people die each year from drugs that have supposedly been found to be safe. Big Pharma has at anytime thousands of lawsuits to contend with. See: http://www.newstarget.com/019497.html The main idea is that most drugs are dangerous to human health, regardless of the studies saying otherwise. Follow the money. I equate prescription drugs to soda. Both are very heavily promoted, billions of dollars per year, and both are detrimental to health. That said, there are some good drugs, like nootropics, for example. L-Deprenyl, hydergine, piracetum, etc., are actually helpful. Peace, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: Michael Friebel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 1:42 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Health care today is industrialized medicine, driven by profit focused on treating the symptom rather preventing the disease. It is up to the individual to apply skepticism to the claims of this industry to protect both health pocketbook. We must take full responsibility for our health if we wish to be truly healthy; we cannot trust government or industry to do it for us. The best way to do this is to rely on both the most effective cheapest healthcare known to Man---prevention, along with the judicious use of only those treatments medicines whose efficacy undesired effects is backed by sufficient evidence. Neither conventional nor alternative medicine should be given a free ride, and while much of conventional medicine cannot be trusted, neither can most of the alternative. The safety of any treatment is completely depended upon proportional to the evidence we have regarding it. Until an alternative treatment is backed by sufficient evidence, and by more! than testimonial evidence or hearsay, its use is dangerous to some degree. Education skepticism are both critical to good health in today's information-glutted profit-driven world. We can only act to protect ourselves by the quality of the knowledge we possess, and while we gain our knowledge through education, we determine its quality through skepticism. Mike - Original Message From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 7:58:29 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia WasTestimonials as Evidence) The main edifice of conventional allopathic (cure-the-symptom) so-called Western medicine, ie industrialised medicine, is all the hospitals. Occupying very many of those hospital beds are patients suffering from iatrogenic illnesses, that is sickness caused by medical treatment (225,000 deaths per year in the US from iatrogenic causes - JAMA. 2000 Jul 26;284(4):483-5). Nonetheless a fairly august medical practitioner once got angry with my questions and shouted: Of COURSE we're more healthy now, we've got so many more hospital beds! LOL! At another time, at a meeting of the steering committee of a primary health care group working on development projects in 3rd World countries, I mentioned that there's more to health than just the absence of disease. There was a polite pause, one of the doctors said, Of course there is, and the discussion continued as if I hadn't said anything. The Western doctor who shouted at me didn't know what I was talking about when I told him that. What's the difference? The glaring difference is that there's no market in 3rd World people who earn less than $2 a day, it's just not worth all the spin and corruption. There's no money in health anyway, maintaining disease is much more profitable, whether you're Big Pharma or a GP. Twenty-five years ago after I first started working with organic growing, a young doctor who was working with me got the idea that eating properly grown food might have something to do with it. He was working in a fishing community, quite poor people, and got very enthusiastic about the success he was having with this approach (nothing new - see, eg, The Medical Testament http://journeytoforever.org/farm_library.html#medtest). But later he complained that healthy patients didn't visit the doctor very often. Eventually he moved back to the city and became a surgeon. Every health education council I've talked to has stressed
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
Hi D, Gustl and List...We keepthe daily Zen Calendar in plain view. Maybe some funky sayings every now and then, but it does provide some small, daily reminder of our center and source of true vision. Today's quote seems especially apropriate to this post: "Beginners, make your will firm and strong; twenty-four hours a day, wield the sword of positive energy to overcome demons and curses, cutting off psychological afflictions. Look continuously into a saying, and you will spontaneously discover the light of mind, containing heaven and earth, every land completely revealed."-- Chien-Ju. I don't know who was Chien-Ju, but it doesn't matter. The substance of the words are the point. Hope this helps. Mike DuPree - Original Message - From: "D. Mindock" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 2:01 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Hi Gustl, It really does not take much effort to experience the mystical. The less effort you put into it, the more readily it'll occur. I'm thinking of meditation, of course. I remember my first meditative experience. I was given a mantra to use, one specially for me. It was wonderfully relaxing and when I got up to leave, I could hardly walk, I was so relaxed. I had a huge amount of job stress in those days and that first experience got rid of a lot of it. Now, many years later, I know about those mystical experiences. There're not something abstract, but very real. Anyway, meditation is the most direct way to higher states of consciousness that I know. The effort required is minimal and the payoff is phenomenal. Only thing required is a desire to get to know your real Self. Peace light, D. Mindock . - Original Message - From: "Gustl Steiner-Zehender" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "Michael Friebel" biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 7:23 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia WasTestimonials as Evidence) Hallo Michael, I may be running on assumptions here and you appear to me to be running on some assumptions, but I do realize that assumptions are only that and nothing more and may be false. Perhaps it is just a matter of definitions or perception. I will give both of us the benefit of the doubt. :o) I was born into, raised as and am presently a member of a mystical religion, that being Friends (Quakers). We had a schism back in the early 1800's here in the states and my family ended up on the "Hicksite" side of the thing. Outwardly conservative and inwardly liberal. Hicks once stated the following: "Now I want these things to sink deep into the heart of every age, sex and condition. Be willing to investigate for yourselves; don't mind what I say, or what any one else may say, but bring things home to the truth in your own bosoms; turn them over and over, and see if there is not something in them worthy of preservation--and if there is not, leave them. I say, I want you to investigate for yourselves; for we have that liberty, in this land of liberty. We have a right to think for ourselves, about what we know to be the truth in ourselves, and nothing but the truth...Oh! then, that we may become willing to turn inward to what the light makes manifest...Whatsoever is wrong is reproved by this light, and all things that are reproveable we know, for they are made manifest by the light; clearly so. And it is reasonable to conclude that without light, nothing can be made manifest. But when we come into the light of the Lord, all things will be made manifest, when the mind is willing, and the heart is disposed to receive God in the way of his coming. I feel earnest in my desires for us, that we may this evening lay these things properly to heart. I hope you will take these things home, my friends, and not be hasty in deciding, but turn them over in your minds, and if you can find any thing in them, well, and if not leave them." (Gould 1830) If this isn't the mystical equivalent of the scientific method then I will eat my hat (either straw or felt). It uses operational terms, allows for experimental duplication and repeatability, calls for emperical observation and induction, uses analytic-synthetic thinking, allows for prediction and falsification and the conclusions come from a "scientific" public consensus of truth. While all of this is not readily observable from the small paragraph above, it is if one takes the time to get acquainted with Friends beliefs (or those of other branches of mystics). You should be able to get the sense of it from the paragraph above though. But brother, we haven't defined out terms. You claim mystical experience is unverifiable but it is verifiable to anyone with the right tools and interest. If I were to tell you that the existence of atoms is unverifiable you would tell me that I just
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
Hi Marylynn, Some do volunteer to be tested. I saw one woman, a psychic, from California in a documentary, I think on the Learning Channel. Anyway, she was filmed for the test. She was presented a person with a disease. That is all she knew. First she located the area of the disease. It was in the abdomen and she found the diseased area quickly. It was a cancerous tumor. Then she worked on the area using energy techniques (Reiki, Qi Gong?). The camera switched over to infrared. As she worked on the man, you could see the tumor shrinking. She did not touch the man. Within an hour the tumor had essentially disappeared. This is not science but it was very dramatic. This documentary was filmed in Japan, I believe. I don't remember the woman's name. Maybe someone else has details on this? It was perhaps three or four years ago when I saw this. I think being sick with a dis-ease happens to get our attention to teach us something. Peace, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: Marylynn Schmidt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 7:24 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Anyone who looks and listens at what is daily offered will have a life full of wonders and with wonders there comes something called gratitude for being even momentarily allowed to witness/experience that particular gift. But it's been my observation to observe that many people do not and/or can not accept what is placed before them. They do not and/or can not accept for a variety of reasons .. these reasons range from truly not being able to see/hear all the way to having placed their being-ness (other wo/men's opinions of him/her) into such a compromised situation that to acknowledge the existence of that gift would acknowledge their very life has been based upon lies/partial truths/and/or out right deceit. This, of course, would also include having built a life on a particular truth. Defending that life/truth would become necessary even if that life/truth were flawed .. it is a very courageous act that the physical form (human) that can say to their world .. opps .. I was mistaken. But, there have been a few. While I haven't read this book, I will consider it when I make out my next list .. so not understanding exactly what is encompassed under that title of morphic fields, I will say that while I do not consider myself a telepathic animal communicator, I believe anyone who works with any given field grows and/or enhances their subtle awareness within those areas. .. I work with animals so sometimes I just get it, but if I need specific detailed information I'll go to those I happen to know have true talent down to the fine toning and are for real. Because I do accept these areas as being helpful I have, with the help of talented communicator and a dog been able to find poison that was known to be near a children's playing field (within 500 feet), and thanks to the dog we got it. For those not familiar with telepathic animal communication this skill is absolutely wonderful with autistic and comma. I also work with a group of talented people who do things like map dowsing .. and can and do work with those law enforcement agencies that don't want to rush out and arrest someone in the midwest, canada, or india for a murder that took place in london .. but these people can/and do provide GPS data for missing people, dead/alive, people lost in snow storms. I tend to go with what works .. I guess that's why I like biofuel .. I consider me a jack of many trades but because I do what I do, I generally know where to find the Masters. I'll chose to go mentally .. if possible .. into the snow storm and locate and rescue those who may be facing extreme difficulty if not more .. I'll chose to go mentally into other situations when I can. .. I can only hope that those skeptics do not jeopardise lives while waiting to prove and/or understand exactly how it works .. because with what they are working with, they will not be able to understand. If those who wish to prove it's NOT possible and/or want to spend some time trying to figure out the what and why of the whole thing ..sorry, there is usually a time constraint going on here .. You simply need get out of the way. .. and before it's asked .. no one I know will sit down and be tested because someone else wants to know if it works. It truly isn't important to us that you can gather data. Mary Lynn Rev. Mary Lynn Schmidt, Ordained Minister ONE SPIRIT ONE HEART TTouch . Reiki . Pet Loss Grief Counseling . Animal Behavior Modification . Shamanic Spiritual Travel . Behavior Problems . Psionic Energy Practitioner . Radionics . Herbs . Dowsing . Nutrition . Homeopathy . Polarity . The Animal Connection Healing Modalities http://members.tripod.com/~MLSchmidt/
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
Mike, I think you're referring to the twisted use of science by corporationsbeing the objective force slowly destroying the planet. I agree. (Disclaimer: Science itself is innocent being merely a method.) WRT the connection of all things, you're referring to the Unity experience, that we're all One. I think unless a person meditates regularly and eventually experiences the epiphany (satori) of Oneness, that he/she will have a hard time accepting the idea of all being connected. Perhaps someone well-versed in the new quantum physics, like a Brian Greene, http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/elegant/greene.html will be able to come to this conclusion without the benefit of meditation. I think that meditation should be taught to all kids in schools here in the U.S. and world-wide. It is non-religious, leads to very sharp minds, and makes the desire for peace bloom. Oncekids eachdeeply realize that we're connected to every other person on the planet, every animal, every flower, and every drop of water, etc., living in harmony with all peoples and the planet will follow naturally and very quickly. Peace gratitude, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: MK DuPree To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 6:06 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Gustl...I'm not the "Michael" to whom you have addressed your words, but that doesn't matter. Your words ring true...true...with me nonetheless. Thank you. To "Michael" and "Bob" and whomever has decided to be strictly "scientific"in the sense thatthe "scientific"might exclude the "mystical" or, more specifically, what can only be verified subjectively: Will you doubt that everything is connected? If you will, enjoy your masturbation. If you will not, then what might be the implications? What might be not only the probabilities but also the possibilities? Our world is constantly subjected...subjected...to the objective for purely, I am convinced,selfish purposes. But, if you have accepted that all is connected, then the objective must be an illusion. So now what? I don't know...but I want to know. The objective path has led our world to ruin. Consequently, I am personally disinclined to allow my personal history to be a repeat of this unexamined history.Whether or not anyone else does, somehow I don't believe it really matters...because we are all connected, not just with each other, but with every star and the void that engulfs them, not just now, but forever now. Perhaps one day our schools will devote a portion of the curriculum to that whereby we are all connected. Classrooms of extreme quietude, whereby each individual is awakened in meditation. Perhaps these classrooms exist already, as I'm sure they must. When they become public, however, then we will know thatwhat is true has broken through the void in some fundamental way perhaps never known throughout the universe. Maybe that will happen here on planet earth...maybe it is happening alreadyelsewhere, although somehow I doubt it because when it does, the universe will have somehow fundamentally changed and become something it has never been before, another step in the real evolution, the evolutionof consciousness and curiosity. Mike DuPree - Original Message - From: "Gustl Steiner-Zehender" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "Michael Friebel" biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 7:23 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia WasTestimonials as Evidence) Hallo Michael, I may be running on assumptions here and you appear to me to be running on some assumptions, but I do realize that assumptions are only that and nothing more and may be false. Perhaps it is just a matter of definitions or perception. I will give both of us the benefit of the doubt. :o) I was born into, raised as and am presently a member of a mystical religion, that being Friends (Quakers). We had a schism back in the early 1800's here in the states and my family ended up on the "Hicksite" side of the thing. Outwardly conservative and inwardly liberal. Hicks once stated the following: "Now I want these things to sink deep into the heart of every age, sex and condition. Be willing to investigate for yourselves; don't mind what I say, or what any one else may say, but bring things home to the truth in your own bosoms; turn them over and over, and see if there is not something in them worthy of preservation--and if there is not, leave them. I say, I want you to investigate for yourselves; for we have that liberty, in this land of liberty. We have a right to think for ourselves, about what we know to be the truth in ourselves, and nothing but the
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
Yo Mike, I'm a night owl. I go to bed at dawn. Four years working rotating shifts as a weather forecaster has totally screwed up whatever body clock I had. I was a preemie and the lights were on all the time. That was the first assault on my body clock. Bob is Bob (did Joe say that first?) is all I can say. He doesn't seem to give much credence to people's experience or opinions based on experience and at the same time he has too much faith in science. These are my opinions and I know they don't adequately express what is percolating in the back of my head. But I do like Bob. I think he does help us as we try to formulate our beliefs and feelings in things far more important than scientific data. Peace, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: MK DuPree [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 3:59 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Love your sense of humor D, ie Bob's love of data etc at times being awe inspiring. But Bob might consider your comments awful. It's 4am as I write this, and I'm awfully tired. Mike DuPree - Original Message - From: D. Mindock [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 2:33 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia WasTestimonials as Evidence) Yep, I too admire scientists, real truth seeking ones, not those who can be bought to produce desired outcomes. My degree is in science, atmospheric. Basically I am trained to run computer models of the atmosphere and to enhance the models so they correlate more closely to reality. Reality, aka Nature, is the gold standard. Bob is wound a bit tight but that might come from trying to pour knowledge into hung-over college students. His love of data, results from scientific studies, is awe inspiring at times. Peace, D. Mindock - Original Message - From: Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, October 05, 2006 8:34 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as Anesthesia Was Testimonials as Evidence) Hi Kurt; Pardon my snipping style but. Kurt Nolte wrote: snip On the other side we have his opponents, among them Joe Street, Terry Dyck, Mike Dupree and D. Mindock, to name a few off the top of my head. These people seem to be, to the best of my knowledge, claiming that herbs (The topic at hand) are the /only/ things that are truly efficacious as medicinal compounds, and that pharmaceuticals produced by synthetic processes just don't hack it. Actually I don't believe I ever said that! I am opposing Bob to some degree but that doesn't mean I said what you are attributing to me, or I guess more correctly that you should be lumping me in with what you are saying about the others. I am very scientifically inclined, I run a university lab for pete's sake as well but I am also a sceptic of the idea that science is the be all and end all or that it has all the answers. I still have great respect for science and believe that one day it may encompass things that it currently can't explain. All I am suggesting to Bob is that even though science cannot explain something at the present time, that does not mean it must necessarily be rejected. I think this is the only point on which Bob and I are in dissagreement. I also wouldn't say it is fair to be calling Bob closed minded. Stubborn yes but narrow or closed minded, no. Joe ___ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence)
Anyone who looks and listens at what is daily offered will have a life full of wonders and with wonders there comes something called gratitude for being even momentarily allowed to witness/experience that particular gift. But it's been my observation to observe that many people do not and/or can not accept what is placed before them. They do not and/or can not accept for a variety of reasons .. these reasons range from truly not being able to see/hear all the way to having placed their being-ness (other wo/men's opinions of him/her) into such a compromised situation that to acknowledge the existence of that gift would acknowledge their very life has been based upon lies/partial truths/and/or out right deceit. This, of course, would also include having built a life on a particular truth. Defending that life/truth would become necessary even if that life/truth were flawed .. it is a very courageous act that the physical form (human) that can say to their world .. opps .. I was mistaken. But, there have been a few. While I haven't read this book, I will consider it when I make out my next list .. so not understanding exactly what is encompassed under that title of morphic fields, I will say that while I do not consider myself a telepathic animal communicator, I believe anyone who works with any given field grows and/or enhances their subtle awareness within those areas. .. I work with animals so sometimes I just get it, but if I need specific detailed information I'll go to those I happen to know have true talent down to the fine toning and are for real. Because I do accept these areas as being helpful I have, with the help of talented communicator and a dog been able to find poison that was known to be near a children's playing field (within 500 feet), and thanks to the dog we got it. For those not familiar with telepathic animal communication this skill is absolutely wonderful with autistic and comma. I also work with a group of talented people who do things like map dowsing .. and can and do work with those law enforcement agencies that don't want to rush out and arrest someone in the midwest, canada, or india for a murder that took place in london .. but these people can/and do provide GPS data for missing people, dead/alive, people lost in snow storms. I tend to go with what works .. I guess that's why I like biofuel .. I consider me a jack of many trades but because I do what I do, I generally know where to find the Masters. I'll chose to go mentally .. if possible .. into the snow storm and locate and rescue those who may be facing extreme difficulty if not more .. I'll chose to go mentally into other situations when I can. .. I can only hope that those skeptics do not jeopardise lives while waiting to prove and/or understand exactly how it works .. because with what they are working with, they will not be able to understand. If those who wish to prove it's NOT possible and/or want to spend some time trying to figure out the what and why of the whole thing ..sorry, there is usually a time constraint going on here .. You simply need get out of the way. .. and before it's asked .. no one I know will sit down and be tested because someone else wants to know if it works. It truly isn't important to us that you can gather data. Mary Lynn Rev. Mary Lynn Schmidt, Ordained Minister ONE SPIRIT ONE HEART TTouch . Reiki . Pet Loss Grief Counseling . Animal Behavior Modification . Shamanic Spiritual Travel . Behavior Problems . Psionic Energy Practitioner . Radionics . Herbs . Dowsing . Nutrition . Homeopathy . Polarity . The Animal Connection Healing Modalities http://members.tripod.com/~MLSchmidt/ http://allcreatureconnections.org From: Thomas Kelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Closed-Mindedness (Was Hypnosis as AnesthesiaWasTestimonials as Evidence) Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2006 13:23:01 -0400 Marylynn, A friend recently told me of a book dealing with the very thing you are speaking about; he referred to morphic fields. The reason the book came up is because we were talking about my dog. I have a dog that gets very agitated several minutes before a particular person even comes into sight on her walk past my house. My dog's response to other people range from total indifference to barking with tail wagging. This happens when they are in the driveway, or at least in sight. Recently a young man stopped by to see my biodiesel setup. He is a veterinarian. As he played with my dog I told him about the walker as we call her. She thinks the dog is ferocious. He just laughed at the idea. He said the dog is friendly/playful, not ferocious. A few minutes later my dog began to pace and become agitated. We were outside. My visitor asked what's going on? I had seen this numerous times before. I said that the woman is coming. He looked up the road. There was
