[Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production
Hello all, I'm having trouble making biodiesel that won't gel in temps below 20 deg, either washed or unwashed. Is this normal or have I picked up some bad wvo? thanks Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production
That's as normal as the sun rising in the east. Expect to start having gel/solidification problems at around 40*F with WVO esters. The problem isn't that the oil is used, but that animal fats are generally present in WVO. Also, much WVO is partially hydrogenated (looks like veg shortening prior to its first use). This imparts some of the same properties as animal fats, as the carbon chains are more saturated. You might be able to push the useable temp for B-100 from WVO a few degrees lower than 40*F as long as that temp is a fleeting overnight low, not a steady state. Nasty business trying to get a diesel to start when it's got solidified crisco in its veins. Can sure wreck your plans for several hours, presuming you've got a tent or a garage you can roll your disabled car into. Longer if you don't. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: michael meeks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 2:06 PM Subject: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Hello all, I'm having trouble making biodiesel that won't gel in temps below 20 deg, either washed or unwashed. Is this normal or have I picked up some bad wvo? thanks Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production
Number one diesel like they sell up north has additives and some paraffin to keep it from gelling. You could buy some of the commercial anti-gelling agents to lower the temperature. I spoke with my brother in Alaska yesterday about this and he says they make a special additive you put in the diesel and it keeps it from gelling down to -40. They also use engine heaters and tank heaters there. mel -Original Message- From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 9:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Mike, That's as normal as the sun rising in the east. Expect to start having gel/solidification problems at around 40*F with WVO esters. The problem isn't that the oil is used, but that animal fats are generally present in WVO. Also, much WVO is partially hydrogenated (looks like veg shortening prior to its first use). This imparts some of the same properties as animal fats, as the carbon chains are more saturated. You might be able to push the useable temp for B-100 from WVO a few degrees lower than 40*F as long as that temp is a fleeting overnight low, not a steady state. Nasty business trying to get a diesel to start when it's got solidified crisco in its veins. Can sure wreck your plans for several hours, presuming you've got a tent or a garage you can roll your disabled car into. Longer if you don't. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: michael meeks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 2:06 PM Subject: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Hello all, I'm having trouble making biodiesel that won't gel in temps below 20 deg, either washed or unwashed. Is this normal or have I picked up some bad wvo? thanks Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.296 / Virus Database: 265.6.5 - Release Date: 12/26/2004 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.296 / Virus Database: 265.6.5 - Release Date: 12/26/2004 ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production
thanks for the reply Todd, when making biodiesel in my garage I normally boil the oil, then as its cooling down and it hits 135 or so I add the methoxide and mix for about an hour to an hour and a half (20 gal batches) then let it sit for two days, well at least when it was warmer than 32deg. I dont plan on heating the garage for two days while processing bio. Am I going to have problems in garage in 20deg temps thanks Mike - Original Message - From: Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 10:00 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Mike, That's as normal as the sun rising in the east. Expect to start having gel/solidification problems at around 40*F with WVO esters. The problem isn't that the oil is used, but that animal fats are generally present in WVO. Also, much WVO is partially hydrogenated (looks like veg shortening prior to its first use). This imparts some of the same properties as animal fats, as the carbon chains are more saturated. You might be able to push the useable temp for B-100 from WVO a few degrees lower than 40*F as long as that temp is a fleeting overnight low, not a steady state. Nasty business trying to get a diesel to start when it's got solidified crisco in its veins. Can sure wreck your plans for several hours, presuming you've got a tent or a garage you can roll your disabled car into. Longer if you don't. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: michael meeks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 2:06 PM Subject: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Hello all, I'm having trouble making biodiesel that won't gel in temps below 20 deg, either washed or unwashed. Is this normal or have I picked up some bad wvo? thanks Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production
This appears to be the answer http://www.powerservice.com/arcticexpress_biodiesel_antigel.asp mel -Original Message- From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 11:49 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Hi Mel Petro-diesel antigels/pour point depressants don't work very well with biodiesel. See Additives: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_winter.html Biodiesel in winter Best Keith Number one diesel like they sell up north has additives and some paraffin to keep it from gelling. You could buy some of the commercial anti-gelling agents to lower the temperature. I spoke with my brother in Alaska yesterday about this and he says they make a special additive you put in the diesel and it keeps it from gelling down to -40. They also use engine heaters and tank heaters there. mel -Original Message- From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 9:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Mike, That's as normal as the sun rising in the east. Expect to start having gel/solidification problems at around 40*F with WVO esters. The problem isn't that the oil is used, but that animal fats are generally present in WVO. Also, much WVO is partially hydrogenated (looks like veg shortening prior to its first use). This imparts some of the same properties as animal fats, as the carbon chains are more saturated. You might be able to push the useable temp for B-100 from WVO a few degrees lower than 40*F as long as that temp is a fleeting overnight low, not a steady state. Nasty business trying to get a diesel to start when it's got solidified crisco in its veins. Can sure wreck your plans for several hours, presuming you've got a tent or a garage you can roll your disabled car into. Longer if you don't. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: michael meeks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 2:06 PM Subject: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Hello all, I'm having trouble making biodiesel that won't gel in temps below 20 deg, either washed or unwashed. Is this normal or have I picked up some bad wvo? thanks Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.296 / Virus Database: 265.6.5 - Release Date: 12/26/2004 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.296 / Virus Database: 265.6.5 - Release Date: 12/26/2004 ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production
Petro-diesel antigels/pour point depressants don't work very well with biodiesel. See Additives: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_winter.html Biodiesel in winter Best Keith Number one diesel like they sell up north has additives and some paraffin to keep it from gelling. You could buy some of the commercial anti-gelling agents to lower the temperature. I spoke with my brother in Alaska yesterday about this and he says they make a special additive you put in the diesel and it keeps it from gelling down to -40. They also use engine heaters and tank heaters there. mel -Original Message- From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 9:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Mike, That's as normal as the sun rising in the east. Expect to start having gel/solidification problems at around 40*F with WVO esters. The problem isn't that the oil is used, but that animal fats are generally present in WVO. Also, much WVO is partially hydrogenated (looks like veg shortening prior to its first use). This imparts some of the same properties as animal fats, as the carbon chains are more saturated. You might be able to push the useable temp for B-100 from WVO a few degrees lower than 40*F as long as that temp is a fleeting overnight low, not a steady state. Nasty business trying to get a diesel to start when it's got solidified crisco in its veins. Can sure wreck your plans for several hours, presuming you've got a tent or a garage you can roll your disabled car into. Longer if you don't. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: michael meeks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 2:06 PM Subject: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Hello all, I'm having trouble making biodiesel that won't gel in temps below 20 deg, either washed or unwashed. Is this normal or have I picked up some bad wvo? thanks Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production
You might find that you'll get equal dewatering results by just heating the oil and letting it settle at a steady temp of ~120*F. Heating it beyond 212*F to drive off water is a large expense of energy and can actually difuse water into your oil. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: michael meeks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 11:56 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production thanks for the reply Todd, when making biodiesel in my garage I normally boil the oil, then as its cooling down and it hits 135 or so I add the methoxide and mix for about an hour to an hour and a half (20 gal batches) then let it sit for two days, well at least when it was warmer than 32deg. I dont plan on heating the garage for two days while processing bio. Am I going to have problems in garage in 20deg temps thanks Mike - Original Message - From: Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 10:00 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Mike, That's as normal as the sun rising in the east. Expect to start having gel/solidification problems at around 40*F with WVO esters. The problem isn't that the oil is used, but that animal fats are generally present in WVO. Also, much WVO is partially hydrogenated (looks like veg shortening prior to its first use). This imparts some of the same properties as animal fats, as the carbon chains are more saturated. You might be able to push the useable temp for B-100 from WVO a few degrees lower than 40*F as long as that temp is a fleeting overnight low, not a steady state. Nasty business trying to get a diesel to start when it's got solidified crisco in its veins. Can sure wreck your plans for several hours, presuming you've got a tent or a garage you can roll your disabled car into. Longer if you don't. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: michael meeks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 2:06 PM Subject: [Biofuel] cold climate biodiesel production Hello all, I'm having trouble making biodiesel that won't gel in temps below 20 deg, either washed or unwashed. Is this normal or have I picked up some bad wvo? thanks Mike ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
