Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
"Lee K. Seitz" wrote: > > Jim Leonard boldly stated: > > > >..unless those archives go away. I have mirrored as much as Asimov as > >I can, but it won't be around forever... > > Now that's a scary thought. Life without Asimov, etc. Exactly my point. Think of it this way: Everyone uploaded their stuff to Asimov, an archive almost a decade old with (sometimes rare) contributions from all over the world. People uploaded their stuff 1. while they still could (while the disks were still readable) and 2. to help the cause. I would venture a strong guess that many of these people then gave up their collections, having done their part. Now guess what happens when Asimov goes away and no real mirrors exist? All those games are now PERMANENTLY gone as 1. the disks HAVE gone bad by now, and 2. the owners got rid of them after donating to the public. This is extreme, but in the realm of possibility. It's a very real threat, however, for less-popular/prolific platforms like BBC, TI 99/4A, Commodore Adam, etc. -- http://www.MobyGames.com/ The world's most comprehensive gaming database project. -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
Hugh Falk wrote: > > The DVD project sounds awesome...please let me know more! The quick answer (for the benefit of those on this list not directly interested in demos) is that ex-Hornet is creating a double-sided DVD of demos. Not the raw data files themselves, but video of the actual demos playing. One side of the disc will be modern eye-candy, and the other side will be old-school demos from 1995 and earlier. The motivation for the disc was the old-school side -- it is becoming increasingly impossible to run old demos on more modern hardware due to the nature of how demos interacted with the hardware. Also, no reliable IBM PC emulators exist for this kind of thing because, ironically, people only write emulators for extinct platforms and the IBM PC is still around. That's the short answer; the long answer, with many details, is coming in a website soon next week. > Hugh > > -Original Message- > From: Jim Leonard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2001 3:08 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable? > > Hugh Falk wrote: > > > > A large majority of them are uncracked. Most of the C-64 (and later) > stuff > > I've seen is cracked...but not Apple. > > Now, or earlier? I went bonkers when I discovered Asimov, and the 150 > or so images I tested out were at least 90-95% cracked. Maybe I got > lucky... or maybe they've been replaceing the images with "clean" ones > (still cracked, but without the messages). > > If you guys are interested in Demos or cracked games at all, you'll > enjoy the DemoDVD project -- I plan to show some footage of early early > cracktros, which led to the birth of the demoscene. Anyway, > off-topic... > > -- > This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to > the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' > Archives are available at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/ > > -- > This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to > the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' > Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/ -- http://www.MobyGames.com/ The world's most comprehensive gaming database project. -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
Jim Leonard boldly stated: > >..unless those archives go away. I have mirrored as much as Asimov as >I can, but it won't be around forever... Now that's a scary thought. Life without Asimov, etc. A few years ago, I took advantage of the fast connection and a new CD-ROM burner at work to make a copy of Asimov. I'll have to do it again when I get broadband at home. -- Lee K. Seitz * [EMAIL PROTECTED] * http://home.hiwaay.net/~lkseitz/ Wanted: | Visit the Classic Video Games Nexus Vintage Pac-M*n necktie| for all your classic link & news needs! |http://start.at/cvgnexus -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
RE: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
The DVD project sounds awesome...please let me know more! Hugh -Original Message- From: Jim Leonard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2001 3:08 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable? Hugh Falk wrote: > > A large majority of them are uncracked. Most of the C-64 (and later) stuff > I've seen is cracked...but not Apple. Now, or earlier? I went bonkers when I discovered Asimov, and the 150 or so images I tested out were at least 90-95% cracked. Maybe I got lucky... or maybe they've been replaceing the images with "clean" ones (still cracked, but without the messages). If you guys are interested in Demos or cracked games at all, you'll enjoy the DemoDVD project -- I plan to show some footage of early early cracktros, which led to the birth of the demoscene. Anyway, off-topic... -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/ -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
Hugh Falk wrote: > > Really Just look at the stuff pre-83. Especially SSI games, not cracked > at all. That's because they weren't protected, dude! :-) Plus, pre-1983 a lot of pirates were just hobbyists that cracked stuff because they themselves wanted to make backups. 1983 and later is when Pirate cabals started forming, so that's when you start seeing the crack messages. The SSI games were BASIC games, so I can't see how those were protected (easily). -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
RE: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
Really Just look at the stuff pre-83. Especially SSI games, not cracked at all. Hugh -Original Message- From: Jim Leonard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2001 3:06 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable? "Lee K. Seitz" wrote: > > Hugh Falk boldly stated: > > > >So there are two types of people here: Collectors (represented by Pedro) > >and Data Preservationists (represented by Jim). Both are noble causes that > >can keep you busy for a long time. > > >I don't know > >about DOS games, but just about every Apple game is already available on the > >Internet. So the need for data preservation will soon disappear. > > Question: Are most of the Apple games available on the 'net the > originals, or the cracked versions? In my limited experience, they're They are most certainly the cracked ones. All pirates are unwilling data historians ;-) In fact, I don't think I've ever come across something on Asimov that wasn't cracked. -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/ -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
Hugh Falk wrote: > > A large majority of them are uncracked. Most of the C-64 (and later) stuff > I've seen is cracked...but not Apple. Now, or earlier? I went bonkers when I discovered Asimov, and the 150 or so images I tested out were at least 90-95% cracked. Maybe I got lucky... or maybe they've been replaceing the images with "clean" ones (still cracked, but without the messages). If you guys are interested in Demos or cracked games at all, you'll enjoy the DemoDVD project -- I plan to show some footage of early early cracktros, which led to the birth of the demoscene. Anyway, off-topic... -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
"Lee K. Seitz" wrote: > > Hugh Falk boldly stated: > > > >So there are two types of people here: Collectors (represented by Pedro) > >and Data Preservationists (represented by Jim). Both are noble causes that > >can keep you busy for a long time. > > >I don't know > >about DOS games, but just about every Apple game is already available on the > >Internet. So the need for data preservation will soon disappear. > > Question: Are most of the Apple games available on the 'net the > originals, or the cracked versions? In my limited experience, they're They are most certainly the cracked ones. All pirates are unwilling data historians ;-) In fact, I don't think I've ever come across something on Asimov that wasn't cracked. -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
Hugh Falk wrote: > > The difference is that once the data is preserved (copied onto other media) > it is no longer a collector's item...there can be unlimited copies made > (legality is another issue, of course, but I won't cover that here). > Everyone can have it and the game data can forever be preserved. That is a > noble cause, and Jim is right to want to do it. But once Jim or someone > else has done that, there is no reason to care if the disk works or not. Agreed. The stuff I collect and search for has generally limited availablity. > So there are two types of people here: Collectors (represented by Pedro) > and Data Preservationists (represented by Jim). Both are noble causes that > can keep you busy for a long time. And of course, we all do a little of > both. Jim is also a collector, for example. However, Jim's data > preservation is probably the more noble cause in the short term. It is > important that these games are saved for posterity. Once that happens for > all of the games, though, he becomes a mere collector as well. I don't know > about DOS games, but just about every Apple game is already available on the > Internet. So the need for data preservation will soon disappear. ..unless those archives go away. I have mirrored as much as Asimov as I can, but it won't be around forever... > In summary, once a game's data has been copied somewhere in the world, it is > no longer important that an original game disk functions. Every game disk > will eventually fail...at least if you ever intend to use it. And if you > never intend to use it, why does it matter if it works or not? Very true. I intend to use them. Most of the collecting world does not. I guess that makes me a freak ;-) -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
RE: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
A large majority of them are uncracked. Most of the C-64 (and later) stuff I've seen is cracked...but not Apple. -Original Message- From: Lee K. Seitz [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2001 11:50 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable? Hugh Falk boldly stated: > >So there are two types of people here: Collectors (represented by Pedro) >and Data Preservationists (represented by Jim). Both are noble causes that >can keep you busy for a long time. >I don't know >about DOS games, but just about every Apple game is already available on the >Internet. So the need for data preservation will soon disappear. Question: Are most of the Apple games available on the 'net the originals, or the cracked versions? In my limited experience, they're the cracked ones. I'd say (with my Data Preservationist hat on), that until they're all archived in their original forms, the need is still there. However, the Players (people who just want to be able to play the games, which I believe have been the dominant force behind many preservation efforts), don't really care. -- Lee K. Seitz * [EMAIL PROTECTED] * http://home.hiwaay.net/~lkseitz/ Wanted: | Visit the Classic Video Games Nexus Vintage Pac-M*n necktie| for all your classic link & news needs! |http://start.at/cvgnexus -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/ -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
Re: [SWCollect] Data or Packaging...which is more valuable?
Hugh Falk boldly stated: > >So there are two types of people here: Collectors (represented by Pedro) >and Data Preservationists (represented by Jim). Both are noble causes that >can keep you busy for a long time. >I don't know >about DOS games, but just about every Apple game is already available on the >Internet. So the need for data preservation will soon disappear. Question: Are most of the Apple games available on the 'net the originals, or the cracked versions? In my limited experience, they're the cracked ones. I'd say (with my Data Preservationist hat on), that until they're all archived in their original forms, the need is still there. However, the Players (people who just want to be able to play the games, which I believe have been the dominant force behind many preservation efforts), don't really care. -- Lee K. Seitz * [EMAIL PROTECTED] * http://home.hiwaay.net/~lkseitz/ Wanted: | Visit the Classic Video Games Nexus Vintage Pac-M*n necktie| for all your classic link & news needs! |http://start.at/cvgnexus -- This message was sent to you because you are currently subscribed to the swcollect mailing list. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of 'unsubscribe swcollect' Archives are available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/swcollect@oldskool.org/
