Re: [sword-devel] Android SWORD
Also C++/JNI requires use of the Android NDK which only generates code for ARMv5 or ARMv7-A architectures (see http://developer.android.com/sdk/ndk/index.html) so not all Android devices would be supported. Regards Martin On 7 September 2010 15:40, DM Smith dmsm...@crosswire.org wrote: Some thoughts on whether to use JSword or SWORD: SWORD will be faster than JSword, but for the most part it won't matter. The primary work of a Bible application are: a) Convert a reference into a disk read. For a chapter of references, even Psalm 119, this is so fast for both that it won't be noticed. b) Read each reference from disk. The speed differences between the two are dwarfed by the IO costs. c) Render into HTML the raw data of a chapter. Here, I'll guess that SWORD will seem a bit snappier if Bible Desktop's method of rendering is used. If another method of rendering is done, I think it will be a nit. If BD's xslt mechanism is used, it is more flexible allowing for different style sheets. d) Do a search and get a list of hits. Presuming the use of Lucene, the cost will be several fold: Building an index (SWORD will be faster as it does less), searching an index (tie, as it is IO bound). JSword has a more feature laden index (e.g. verse text, notes, headers, xrefs, stemming, ...). Basically, I don't think that one needs to measure between the keystroke differences. One needs to measure user experience. Another major difference between the two is that JSword lags SWORD in module support. E.g. it lacks av11n. And at the moment it requires http download of zips. I have an old Win98 laptop with less than 400M of RAM and Bible Desktop runs on it just fine. My impression is that the smart phones are more capable than my old laptop. Of course, if I were to do it, I'd use JSword. In Him, DM On 09/06/2010 05:41 PM, Kenneth Arnold wrote: This thread got rather sidetracked by the version control issue; personally I use git daily but usually in a centralized workflow. I think between github and GUIs like TortoiseGit it's not a big burden for new users (just remember to Push). Also, many open-source projects I follow have switched from bzr/Launchpad to github. But I have no strong feelings on what direction the various projects here should go. Now back on topic... Once the libsword-JNI bindings are stabilized and the build process is smoothed out, the only significant difference between them and JSword for Android should be speed, so let's measure that. There may also be differences in formatting, so let's go with the one that formats better and is faster. (Caching and prefetch could smooth over most visible speed differences, so maybe it's just which one formats better.) I also once lamented the complexity of doing simple things with the libsword C++ API, but I wrote a Python ztext reader instead of what I should have done, which is: help improve the code :) It doesn't look like the current way and-bible uses WebView allows you to do much with the text besides display it. I'm considering replacing the static page with a Javascript viewer that calls Java methods using addJavascriptInterface [1]. This would theoretically allow accurate verse position information and continuous scrolling (assuming the ability to call Javascript from Java, which may be possible with loadUrl [2]), but would require some significant HTML and Javascript work. Are there any web-based SWORD viewers that might be adaptable to that purpose? Btw, PocketSword users, how do you like the interface? Should we just do the same thing on Android? For those that would prefer to pay now instead of waiting for open-source, CadreBible and Olive Tree's BibleReader both have nice (though not perfect) interfaces. So Martin, enjoy your holidays and see you when you get back. -Ken [1] http://developer.android.com/reference/android/webkit/WebView.html#addJavascriptInterface%28java.lang.Object,%20java.lang.String%29 [2] http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/6ed23efa4d22f7e6 On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 12:00 PM, Martin Denhammjden...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Bishop is real fast but I don't know if that is all due to C++ code or if it is not doing as much html processing/formatting as and-bible. I thought about switching to the C++ libs but there are various h/w restrictions if you use the ndk and also it is a long time since I use C++ and I just can't understand the Sword C++ code anymore and it seems from Troy's e-mails that the packaged ndk lib would need a fair bit more work. Jsword also needs some optimisations and tweaks but I am more confident with Java. So if you use C++ then feel free to continue Bishop or branch and-bible, but I always planned to create a pure java bible and JSword gave me a really good start. There is facade layer in and-bible that acts as an interface to JSword but realistically so many helper classes are
Re: [sword-devel] Android SWORD
Yeah - This should definitely use JSword. Negligible difference in performance, and much easier to maintain for other developers who want to get involved, etc. The Android NDK is definitely not somewhere you want to go unless you have to. :) On Tue, Sep 7, 2010 at 9:26 AM, Martin Denham mjden...@gmail.com wrote: Also C++/JNI requires use of the Android NDK which only generates code for ARMv5 or ARMv7-A architectures (see http://developer.android.com/sdk/ndk/index.html) so not all Android devices would be supported. Regards Martin On 7 September 2010 15:40, DM Smith dmsm...@crosswire.org wrote: Some thoughts on whether to use JSword or SWORD: SWORD will be faster than JSword, but for the most part it won't matter. The primary work of a Bible application are: a) Convert a reference into a disk read. For a chapter of references, even Psalm 119, this is so fast for both that it won't be noticed. b) Read each reference from disk. The speed differences between the two are dwarfed by the IO costs. c) Render into HTML the raw data of a chapter. Here, I'll guess that SWORD will seem a bit snappier if Bible Desktop's method of rendering is used. If another method of rendering is done, I think it will be a nit. If BD's xslt mechanism is used, it is more flexible allowing for different style sheets. d) Do a search and get a list of hits. Presuming the use of Lucene, the cost will be several fold: Building an index (SWORD will be faster as it does less), searching an index (tie, as it is IO bound). JSword has a more feature laden index (e.g. verse text, notes, headers, xrefs, stemming, ...). Basically, I don't think that one needs to measure between the keystroke differences. One needs to measure user experience. Another major difference between the two is that JSword lags SWORD in module support. E.g. it lacks av11n. And at the moment it requires http download of zips. I have an old Win98 laptop with less than 400M of RAM and Bible Desktop runs on it just fine. My impression is that the smart phones are more capable than my old laptop. Of course, if I were to do it, I'd use JSword. In Him, DM On 09/06/2010 05:41 PM, Kenneth Arnold wrote: This thread got rather sidetracked by the version control issue; personally I use git daily but usually in a centralized workflow. I think between github and GUIs like TortoiseGit it's not a big burden for new users (just remember to Push). Also, many open-source projects I follow have switched from bzr/Launchpad to github. But I have no strong feelings on what direction the various projects here should go. Now back on topic... Once the libsword-JNI bindings are stabilized and the build process is smoothed out, the only significant difference between them and JSword for Android should be speed, so let's measure that. There may also be differences in formatting, so let's go with the one that formats better and is faster. (Caching and prefetch could smooth over most visible speed differences, so maybe it's just which one formats better.) I also once lamented the complexity of doing simple things with the libsword C++ API, but I wrote a Python ztext reader instead of what I should have done, which is: help improve the code :) It doesn't look like the current way and-bible uses WebView allows you to do much with the text besides display it. I'm considering replacing the static page with a Javascript viewer that calls Java methods using addJavascriptInterface [1]. This would theoretically allow accurate verse position information and continuous scrolling (assuming the ability to call Javascript from Java, which may be possible with loadUrl [2]), but would require some significant HTML and Javascript work. Are there any web-based SWORD viewers that might be adaptable to that purpose? Btw, PocketSword users, how do you like the interface? Should we just do the same thing on Android? For those that would prefer to pay now instead of waiting for open-source, CadreBible and Olive Tree's BibleReader both have nice (though not perfect) interfaces. So Martin, enjoy your holidays and see you when you get back. -Ken [1] http://developer.android.com/reference/android/webkit/WebView.html#addJavascriptInterface%28java.lang.Object,%20java.lang.String%29 [2] http://groups.google.com/group/android-developers/browse_thread/thread/6ed23efa4d22f7e6 On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 12:00 PM, Martin Denhammjden...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Bishop is real fast but I don't know if that is all due to C++ code or if it is not doing as much html processing/formatting as and-bible. I thought about switching to the C++ libs but there are various h/w restrictions if you use the ndk and also it is a long time since I use C++ and I just can't understand the Sword C++ code anymore and it seems from Troy's e-mails that the packaged ndk lib would need a fair bit more work. Jsword also needs some optimisations and
Re: [sword-devel] PocketSword v1.3.2
That will go a long way, thank you. Johan -Original Message- From: Nic Carter [mailto:niccar...@mac.com] Sent: 07 September 2010 03:39 AM To: SWORD Developers' Collaboration Forum Subject: Re: [sword-devel] PocketSword v1.3.2 Hoping that Notes, improved Bookmarks improved search UI are going to be the next version... That's the plan right now, but we'll see what ends up happening. :) Thanks, ybic nic... :) Nic Carter PocketSword Developer - an iPhone Bible Study app www: http://crosswire.org/pocketsword iTunes: http://itunes.apple.com/app/Pocketsword/id341046078 Twitter: http://twitter.com/pocketsword On 03/09/2010, at 2:40 PM, Johan Marais (joha...@absa.co.za) wrote: Good news, thank you Nic. When do you plan to add the functionality to add notes to verses please? In His Name, Johan Marais ___ sword-devel mailing list: sword-devel@crosswire.org http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page ___ sword-devel mailing list: sword-devel@crosswire.org http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page
Re: [sword-devel] PocketSword v1.3.2 (Johan Marais)
Nic, sometimes in the future, perhaps we(translators) can translate the Search Help text that explains how to search in PocketSword, (i.e loved one, loved one, love*, etc.) Currently it is only in English, I'd figure it could be helpful to non-English folks to know about the powerful ways that the Bible can be searched. Any other translators interested in translating that? If there is interest, then Nic, just send a text in the format that is best for you. (Also, the term loved one that is used as an example, is that in a context of a verb or a description?, which makes a difference how to word it and explain it in the translation. So that we stay consistant with the example used across the many translations). Thanks and God Bless~ - Pypsik --- On Tue, 9/7/10, sword-devel-requ...@crosswire.org sword-devel-requ...@crosswire.org wrote: From: sword-devel-requ...@crosswire.org sword-devel-requ...@crosswire.org Subject: sword-devel Digest, Vol 78, Issue 12 To: sword-devel@crosswire.org Date: Tuesday, September 7, 2010, 7:00 PM Send sword-devel mailing list submissions to sword-devel@crosswire.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to sword-devel-requ...@crosswire.org You can reach the person managing the list at sword-devel-ow...@crosswire.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of sword-devel digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: PocketSword v1.3.2 (Johan Marais) -- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 7 Sep 2010 19:50:43 +0200 From: Johan Marais johan.mar...@messianic.co.za To: 'SWORD Developers' Collaboration Forum' sword-devel@crosswire.org Subject: Re: [sword-devel] PocketSword v1.3.2 Message-ID: b3923b38ab644ec7a5b5638ea6a1d...@isrjohan Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii That will go a long way, thank you. Johan -Original Message- From: Nic Carter [mailto:niccar...@mac.com] Sent: 07 September 2010 03:39 AM To: SWORD Developers' Collaboration Forum Subject: Re: [sword-devel] PocketSword v1.3.2 Hoping that Notes, improved Bookmarks improved search UI are going to be the next version... That's the plan right now, but we'll see what ends up happening. :) Thanks, ybic nic... :) Nic Carter PocketSword Developer - an iPhone Bible Study app www: http://crosswire.org/pocketsword iTunes: http://itunes.apple.com/app/Pocketsword/id341046078 Twitter: http://twitter.com/pocketsword On 03/09/2010, at 2:40 PM, Johan Marais (joha...@absa.co.za) wrote: Good news, thank you Nic. When do you plan to add the functionality to add notes to verses please? In His Name, Johan Marais ___ sword-devel mailing list: sword-devel@crosswire.org http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page -- ___ sword-devel mailing list sword-devel@crosswire.org http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel End of sword-devel Digest, Vol 78, Issue 12 *** ___ sword-devel mailing list: sword-devel@crosswire.org http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page
Re: [sword-devel] PocketSword v1.3.2 (Johan Marais)
(Also, the term loved one that is used as an example, is that in a context of a verb or a description?, which makes a difference how to word it and explain it in the translation. So that we stay consistant with the example used across the many translations). Loved one would end up as one word for Estonian. But I don't think the example word pair has to be the same over languages, it is just an example. IMHO it would be enough, if it gave different results for all different showcases it represents. It could be related as well to something everybody recognizes, like John 3:16 or similar (but there are also good arguments against it). Mattias ___ sword-devel mailing list: sword-devel@crosswire.org http://www.crosswire.org/mailman/listinfo/sword-devel Instructions to unsubscribe/change your settings at above page
