Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword)

[Troy A. Griffitts]

Right, there are currently no mappings in sword-tools.  This is where we
traditionally have kept our versification definitions, which I believe
is shared between SWORD and JSword.  We have tools to check and convert
these data files to our respective requirements in our software:

http://crosswire.org/svn/sword-tools/trunk/versification/

My suggestion was for us to eventually, if we can agree on a mapping
definition format, to keep those somewhere near the versification
mappings, for sharing in the same way.

Troy


On 5/10/20 11:30 AM, Костя Маслюк wrote:
>
> Sorry I do not remember all details of previous discussions, I have
> seen some text data with verse to verse mappings on last discussions,
> but I cant remember where. I would be happy if we approve cannon
> definition with mappings that is appropriate for JSword, for Sword
> cannon_*.h files ill be generated from them anyway, I would write such
> python converter or process existing data to that format.
>
>  
>
> Could you point me where sword-tools contain mapping definitions, I do
> not see.
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Blessings.
>
>  
>
> *From: *Troy A. Griffitts 
> *Sent: *10 мая 2020 г. 20:53
> *To: *SWORD Developers' Collaboration Forum
> 
> *Subject: *Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword)
>
>  
>
> Applied.  Thank you Костя!
>
> Do you remember if there was a particular obstacle preventing us from
> sharing mapping data between SWORD and JSword.  It's been so long and
> I wasn't deeply involved in those discussion.  It sure would be nice
> to keep these these mapping definitions in sword-tools in some format
> from which both SWORD and JSword can generate their necessary data
> structures.
>
> Blessings.  Hope you've been well.
>
> On 5/10/20 9:23 AM, Костя Маслюк wrote:
>
> Hi! All cannon files you mentioned are used to know, the only case
> is nrsva that was not finished probably because base v11n, nrsv
> was left for testing. I will review that v11ns again, in month or
> two.
>
>  
>
> By the way I see following patches not applied.
>
>  
>
> And it will be super helpful if someone point me the texts best to
> compare, for base v11n I use KJVA, but I do not sure about text to
> use for NRSVA (NRSV too)
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Blessings
>
>  
>
> *From: *Troy A. Griffitts 
> *Sent: *6 мая 2020 г. 22:28
> *To: *sword-devel@crosswire.org
> ; Костя Маслюк
> 
> *Subject: *Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword)
>
>  
>
> Dear John, Jamie, and Костя,
>
> First, I want to say that DM Smith has also a versification
> mapping implementation in JSword, which was, and likely still is a
> foundational part of STEP.  I don't know if STEP uses JSword's
> versification mapping facility or if it implements its own.  There
> were collaboration efforts around July 2014 to get SWORD and
> JSword to use the same data sources, but I am not sure how that
> ended up.
>
> I don't remember all the details of Костя's representation for a
> mapping system, but we pushed pretty hard to have it handle most
> all scenarios and doing a quick search it looks like Костя and
> others have built mappings for these systems:
>
> [scribe@localhost include]$ grep -l mapping sword/include/canon*
> canon_calvin.h
> canon_darbyfr.h
> canon_nrsv.h
> canon_segond.h
> canon_synodal.h
> canon_vulg.h
>
> If you are familiar with mapping systems (and it sounds like John
> and Jamie all are) and have a look at the mapping data in any of
> the above files as examples, I am sure you will understand how
> Костя is representing data for his implementation.
>
> All this to say, it would be really great if any of you might be
> interested in contributing mapping data to our other supported
> versification systems which don't yet have the mapping implemented:
>
> [scribe@localhost include]$ grep -L mapping sword/include/canon_*
> canon_abbrevs.h <- ignore this one
> canon_catholic2.h
> canon_catholic.h
> canon_german.h
> canon_kjva.h
> canon_leningrad.h
> canon_luther.h
> canon_lxx.h
> canon_mt.h
> canon_nrsva.h
> canon_null.h
> canon_orthodox.h
> canon_synodalprot.h
>
> http://crosswire.org/svn/sword/trunk/include/
>
> It would be a blessing to me and everyone who uses the engine.
>
> Serving together,
>
> Troy
>
>  
>
> On 5/6/20 10:20 AM, John Dudeck wrote:
>
> Greetings,
>
>  
>
> I have done quite a bit of content development for Logos,
> including Bibles that had versifications that did not fit any
> existing schemes in Logos.
>
>  
>
> Logos uses "verse maps", which are xml files that specify 

Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword)

[Костя Маслюк]

Sorry I do not remember all details of previous discussions, I have seen some text data with verse to verse mappings on last discussions, but I cant remember where. I would be happy if we approve cannon definition with mappings that is appropriate for JSword, for Sword cannon_*.h files ill be generated from them anyway, I would write such python converter or process existing data to that format. Could you point me where sword-tools contain mapping definitions, I do not see.  Blessings. From: Troy A. GriffittsSent: 10 мая 2020 г. 20:53To: SWORD Developers' Collaboration ForumSubject: Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword) Applied.  Thank you Костя!Do you remember if there was a particular obstacle preventing us from sharing mapping data between SWORD and JSword.  It's been so long and I wasn't deeply involved in those discussion.  It sure would be nice to keep these these mapping definitions in sword-tools in some format from which both SWORD and JSword can generate their necessary data structures.Blessings.  Hope you've been well.On 5/10/20 9:23 AM, Костя Маслюк wrote:Hi! All cannon files you mentioned are used to know, the only case is nrsva that was not finished probably because base v11n, nrsv was left for testing. I will review that v11ns again, in month or two.  By the way I see following patches not applied. And it will be super helpful if someone point me the texts best to compare, for base v11n I use KJVA, but I do not sure about text to use for NRSVA (NRSV too)  Blessings From: Troy A. GriffittsSent: 6 мая 2020 г. 22:28To: sword-devel@crosswire.org; Костя МаслюкSubject: Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword) Dear John, Jamie, and Костя,First, I want to say that DM Smith has also a versification mapping implementation in JSword, which was, and likely still is a foundational part of STEP.  I don't know if STEP uses JSword's versification mapping facility or if it implements its own.  There were collaboration efforts around July 2014 to get SWORD and JSword to use the same data sources, but I am not sure how that ended up.I don't remember all the details of Костя's representation for a mapping system, but we pushed pretty hard to have it handle most all scenarios and doing a quick search it looks like Костя and others have built mappings for these systems:[scribe@localhost include]$ grep -l mapping sword/include/canon*canon_calvin.hcanon_darbyfr.hcanon_nrsv.hcanon_segond.hcanon_synodal.hcanon_vulg.hIf you are familiar with mapping systems (and it sounds like John and Jamie all are) and have a look at the mapping data in any of the above files as examples, I am sure you will understand how Костя is representing data for his implementation.All this to say, it would be really great if any of you might be interested in contributing mapping data to our other supported versification systems which don't yet have the mapping implemented:[scribe@localhost include]$ grep -L mapping sword/include/canon_*canon_abbrevs.h <- ignore this onecanon_catholic2.hcanon_catholic.hcanon_german.hcanon_kjva.hcanon_leningrad.hcanon_luther.hcanon_lxx.hcanon_mt.hcanon_nrsva.hcanon_null.hcanon_orthodox.hcanon_synodalprot.hhttp://crosswire.org/svn/sword/trunk/include/It would be a blessing to me and everyone who uses the engine.Serving together,Troy On 5/6/20 10:20 AM, John Dudeck wrote:Greetings, I have done quite a bit of content development for Logos, including Bibles that had versifications that did not fit any existing schemes in Logos. Logos uses "verse maps", which are xml files that specify the mapping of every verse in a particular versification to every verse in each other versification. If a particular whole book matches the versification of some other existing versification, the verse map for that book can simply reference the existing versification. In use, the software is also able to infer mappings when going between two versifications that aren't referenced directly.  The verse maps have to be validated before they are incorporated, to avoid conflicting mappings. The verse maps can handle such things as verses that are split differently in different versifications, and the headings in Psalms. The downside of their system is that the verse maps have to be hard-compiled into a release of the software. They are not pluggable. I think pluggable verse maps is on their list of enhancements, but as far as I know the feature has never been developed. Maybe they aren't smart enough to figure it out. I don't know that I could figure it out either. John   Hi Tobias, Remember that any libraries for STEP Bible would likely be oriented towards JSword rather than SWORD per se. David Sent from ProtonMail Mobile  On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 17:04, Tobias Klein < cont...@tklein.info > wrote:Hi Jamie, Thanks. I had a look at the data, that’s quite complex! Even a bit intimidating ... I suppose STEPBible has some library functions that parse this data?Can you point me to any APIs? Best regards,Tobias  

Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword)

[Troy A. Griffitts]

Applied.  Thank you Костя!

Do you remember if there was a particular obstacle preventing us from
sharing mapping data between SWORD and JSword.  It's been so long and I
wasn't deeply involved in those discussion.  It sure would be nice to
keep these these mapping definitions in sword-tools in some format from
which both SWORD and JSword can generate their necessary data structures.

Blessings.  Hope you've been well.

On 5/10/20 9:23 AM, Костя Маслюк wrote:
>
> Hi! All cannon files you mentioned are used to know, the only case is
> nrsva that was not finished probably because base v11n, nrsv was left
> for testing. I will review that v11ns again, in month or two.
>
>  
>
> By the way I see following patches not applied.
>
>  
>
> And it will be super helpful if someone point me the texts best to
> compare, for base v11n I use KJVA, but I do not sure about text to use
> for NRSVA (NRSV too)
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Blessings
>
>  
>
> *From: *Troy A. Griffitts 
> *Sent: *6 мая 2020 г. 22:28
> *To: *sword-devel@crosswire.org ;
> Костя Маслюк 
> *Subject: *Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword)
>
>  
>
> Dear John, Jamie, and Костя,
>
> First, I want to say that DM Smith has also a versification mapping
> implementation in JSword, which was, and likely still is a
> foundational part of STEP.  I don't know if STEP uses JSword's
> versification mapping facility or if it implements its own.  There
> were collaboration efforts around July 2014 to get SWORD and JSword to
> use the same data sources, but I am not sure how that ended up.
>
> I don't remember all the details of Костя's representation for a
> mapping system, but we pushed pretty hard to have it handle most all
> scenarios and doing a quick search it looks like Костя and others have
> built mappings for these systems:
>
> [scribe@localhost include]$ grep -l mapping sword/include/canon*
> canon_calvin.h
> canon_darbyfr.h
> canon_nrsv.h
> canon_segond.h
> canon_synodal.h
> canon_vulg.h
>
> If you are familiar with mapping systems (and it sounds like John and
> Jamie all are) and have a look at the mapping data in any of the above
> files as examples, I am sure you will understand how Костя is
> representing data for his implementation.
>
> All this to say, it would be really great if any of you might be
> interested in contributing mapping data to our other supported
> versification systems which don't yet have the mapping implemented:
>
> [scribe@localhost include]$ grep -L mapping sword/include/canon_*
> canon_abbrevs.h <- ignore this one
> canon_catholic2.h
> canon_catholic.h
> canon_german.h
> canon_kjva.h
> canon_leningrad.h
> canon_luther.h
> canon_lxx.h
> canon_mt.h
> canon_nrsva.h
> canon_null.h
> canon_orthodox.h
> canon_synodalprot.h
>
> http://crosswire.org/svn/sword/trunk/include/
>
> It would be a blessing to me and everyone who uses the engine.
>
> Serving together,
>
> Troy
>
>  
>
> On 5/6/20 10:20 AM, John Dudeck wrote:
>
> Greetings,
>
>  
>
> I have done quite a bit of content development for Logos,
> including Bibles that had versifications that did not fit any
> existing schemes in Logos.
>
>  
>
> Logos uses "verse maps", which are xml files that specify the
> mapping of every verse in a particular versification to every
> verse in each other versification. If a particular whole book
> matches the versification of some other existing versification,
> the verse map for that book can simply reference the existing
> versification. In use, the software is also able to infer mappings
> when going between two versifications that aren't referenced
> directly.  The verse maps have to be validated before they are
> incorporated, to avoid conflicting mappings.
>
>  
>
> The verse maps can handle such things as verses that are split
> differently in different versifications, and the headings in Psalms.
>
>  
>
> The downside of their system is that the verse maps have to be
> hard-compiled into a release of the software. They are not
> pluggable. I think pluggable verse maps is on their list of
> enhancements, but as far as I know the feature has never been
> developed. Maybe they aren't smart enough to figure it out. I
> don't know that I could figure it out either.
>
>  
>
> John
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Hi Tobias,
>
>  
>
> Remember that any libraries for STEP Bible would likely be
> oriented towards JSword rather than SWORD per se.
>
>  
>
> David
>
>  
>
> Sent from ProtonMail Mobile
>
>  
>
>  
>
> On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 17:04, Tobias Klein  > wrote:
>
> Hi Jamie,
>
>  
>
> Thanks. I had a look at the data, that’s quite complex! Even a bit
> intimidating ...
>
>  
>
> I suppose STEPBible has some library functions that 

Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword)

[Костя Маслюк]

Hi! All cannon files you mentioned are used to know, the only case is nrsva that was not finished probably because base v11n, nrsv was left for testing. I will review that v11ns again, in month or two.  By the way I see following patches not applied. And it will be super helpful if someone point me the texts best to compare, for base v11n I use KJVA, but I do not sure about text to use for NRSVA (NRSV too)  Blessings From: Troy A. GriffittsSent: 6 мая 2020 г. 22:28To: sword-devel@crosswire.org; Костя МаслюкSubject: Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping (SWORD + JSword) Dear John, Jamie, and Костя,First, I want to say that DM Smith has also a versification mapping implementation in JSword, which was, and likely still is a foundational part of STEP.  I don't know if STEP uses JSword's versification mapping facility or if it implements its own.  There were collaboration efforts around July 2014 to get SWORD and JSword to use the same data sources, but I am not sure how that ended up.I don't remember all the details of Костя's representation for a mapping system, but we pushed pretty hard to have it handle most all scenarios and doing a quick search it looks like Костя and others have built mappings for these systems:[scribe@localhost include]$ grep -l mapping sword/include/canon*canon_calvin.hcanon_darbyfr.hcanon_nrsv.hcanon_segond.hcanon_synodal.hcanon_vulg.hIf you are familiar with mapping systems (and it sounds like John and Jamie all are) and have a look at the mapping data in any of the above files as examples, I am sure you will understand how Костя is representing data for his implementation.All this to say, it would be really great if any of you might be interested in contributing mapping data to our other supported versification systems which don't yet have the mapping implemented:[scribe@localhost include]$ grep -L mapping sword/include/canon_*canon_abbrevs.h <- ignore this onecanon_catholic2.hcanon_catholic.hcanon_german.hcanon_kjva.hcanon_leningrad.hcanon_luther.hcanon_lxx.hcanon_mt.hcanon_nrsva.hcanon_null.hcanon_orthodox.hcanon_synodalprot.hhttp://crosswire.org/svn/sword/trunk/include/It would be a blessing to me and everyone who uses the engine.Serving together,Troy On 5/6/20 10:20 AM, John Dudeck wrote:Greetings, I have done quite a bit of content development for Logos, including Bibles that had versifications that did not fit any existing schemes in Logos. Logos uses "verse maps", which are xml files that specify the mapping of every verse in a particular versification to every verse in each other versification. If a particular whole book matches the versification of some other existing versification, the verse map for that book can simply reference the existing versification. In use, the software is also able to infer mappings when going between two versifications that aren't referenced directly.  The verse maps have to be validated before they are incorporated, to avoid conflicting mappings. The verse maps can handle such things as verses that are split differently in different versifications, and the headings in Psalms. The downside of their system is that the verse maps have to be hard-compiled into a release of the software. They are not pluggable. I think pluggable verse maps is on their list of enhancements, but as far as I know the feature has never been developed. Maybe they aren't smart enough to figure it out. I don't know that I could figure it out either. John   Hi Tobias, Remember that any libraries for STEP Bible would likely be oriented towards JSword rather than SWORD per se. David Sent from ProtonMail Mobile  On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 17:04, Tobias Klein < cont...@tklein.info > wrote:Hi Jamie, Thanks. I had a look at the data, that’s quite complex! Even a bit intimidating ... I suppose STEPBible has some library functions that parse this data?Can you point me to any APIs? Best regards,Tobias  Am 06.05.2020 um 15:04 schrieb Jamie < a...@critos.co.uk>: Hi Tobias, Not sure that this exactly answers your question, but just in case it’s relevant, Tyndale House have various public domain information available, including material on alternative versification schemes.  The reversification material gives details of how to map LXX, MT and Vulgate schemes on to NRSVA (and also addresses some other schemes which are perhaps less frequently encountered).  It also caters for common variants which basically follow one of these schemes, but which have certain verses split up into subverses.  You can find the data at :- https://github.com/tyndale/STEPBible-Data/blob/master/TVTMS%20-%20Tyndale%20Versification%20Traditions%20with%20Methodology%20for%20Standardisation%20for%20Eng%2BHeb%2BLat%2BGrk%2BOthers%20-%20TyndaleHouse.com%20STEPBible.org%20CC%20BY-NC.txt If you do want to make use of it, I’d be very happy to try to answer any questions. Regards, ARA “Jamie” Jamieson   From: Tobias Klein [ mailto:cont...@tklein.info ] Sent: 05 May 2020 21:19To: SWORD Developers' Collaboration Forum < 

Re: [sword-devel] Xiphos repository down?

[Karl Kleinpaste]

On 5/10/20 10:41 AM, Tobias Klein wrote:
> Xiphos repository seems to be down
Not down.  DNS entries have been mangled, so inaccessible.  I'll contact
Simon.
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[sword-devel] Xiphos repository down?

[Tobias Klein]

Hi,

While refreshing my SWORD remote sources I noticed that the Xiphos 
repository seems to be down.


In this case the call of installMgr->refreshRemoteSource took a rather 
long time. Would it be possible to add a timeout parameter to that 
function? I feel like the default timeout right now is rather long.


Best regards,
Tobias


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[sword-devel] How to get translated book abbreviations with LocaleMgr?

[Tobias Klein]

Hi,

how can I use the LocaleMgr to get a translated book abbreviation?

For some reason this code did not work for me:

sword::SWLocale* locale = this->_localeMgr->getLocale(localeCode);
std::string translatedAbbreviation = 
std::string(locale->translate(bookTerm));


I was using "de" as a locale and "Gen" as the term to be translated, but 
I did not get the german variant of "Gen", but rather the exact same 
term "Gen" as a result.


Best regards,
Tobias

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Re: [sword-devel] Chapter descriptions

[David Haslam]

Chapter descriptions or indices containing verse numbers could be suitably 
enhanced by using the \xt_…\xt* marker to mark each of the verse numbers and 
employing the extended attribute syntax to provide the full target reference.

This was first outlined to me by Jeff Klassen of UBS ICAP.

Best regards,

David

Sent from ProtonMail Mobile

On Sat, May 9, 2020 at 17:43, Michael H  wrote:

> Reading the list of provided tags, these chapter descriptions should be 
> marked ".index" when they provide reference information, and ".summary" where 
> they do not.  That is, the original KJV1611 has chapter indexes.  The 
> original Douay Rheims Challoner has Chapter summaries. The recent update to 
> the CPDV includes chapter summaries. The AKJV update includes Chapter indexes 
> (which is ready, but I haven't heard from Peter on how to proceed.)
>
> CPDV with chapter summaries:
> https://gitlab.com/cmahte/cpdv/-/blob/master/usfm/08-RUT-ENG%5BB%5DCPDV2009%5Bpd%5D.p.sfm
>
> AKJV with chapter indexes:
> https://github.com/BibleCorps/ENG-B-AKJV2018-pd-PSFM/blob/master/p.sfm/ENG%5BB%5DAKJV2018%5BPD%5D08-RUT.p.sfm
>
> On Sat, May 9, 2020 at 10:51 AM DM Smith  wrote:
>
>> See the wiki!!! 
>> https://wiki.crosswire.org/Osis2mod#Handling_of_Introductions.2C_Titles_and_Inter-Verse_Material
>>
>> DM
>>
>>> On May 9, 2020, at 2:14 AM, David Haslam  wrote:
>>>
>>> Discussion starter
>>>
>>> OSIS has no dedicated element specifically for a chapter description.
>>>
>>> These are not section titles per se but they come before verse 1.
>>>
>>> In printed Bibles, they are typically in italics and are never in bold. 
>>> Usually centred and often contain verse numbers that could be thought of as 
>>> references to locate the text described following. They can flow onto more 
>>> than one line in pages with two columns of text. In some editions these are 
>>> allowed to be full page width rather than column width. The text size is 
>>> never larger than verse text.
>>>
>>> The Blayney 1769 Oxford edition of the KJV has such chapter descriptions.
>>>
>>> How best to mark these ?
>>>
>>> Best regards
>>>
>>> David
>>>
>>> Sent from ProtonMail Mobile
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