[symfony-users] Re: Offbeat: open source vs closed source technologies

2010-01-09 Thread Fred Grott(shareme)
I would like to point out Enterprise Java used to be closed source.
We all saw what the IBM(IBM came up with EJB) price point did
as far as pricing solutions right out of the marketplace.

MS.NET has similar problems. and the amount of
failed IT projects using Enterprise java or MS.NEt is somewhat
large. Some have put it at 25%.

2010 is the decade of transition from Enterprise Java and Enterprise
MS.NET to webprise, which is web scripting enterprise apps and
infrastructure.

Jobs in web scripting is about to overtake the number of java jobs
in the US for the first time.







On Jan 8, 2:46 am, Parijat Kalia kaliapari...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hey guys,

 Just lighting up everyone's day, would like to get as many as possible
 arguments on this. Me and a friend of mine, had a debate last evening, about
 open source(PHP) vs closed source technologies(DOT NET).He raised the
 following points:

 1. He feels that open source is not reliable whereas closed source is. The
 logic being that, once the application is developed and sold, if it runs
 into some kind of a bug or an error, there is support team for closed source
 technologies who are going to come and help you fix it, whereas this is not
 a guarantee in open source technologies.

 2. Development for a successful open source technology is community
 dependent, implying the choice is still on a faithful group of users,
 whereas in closed source technologies it is more reliable because it is
 being backed by a company (microsoft for .NET and SAP for SAP). f

  3. The third point that was raised is, closed source technologies enforce
 quality control as opposed to open source technologies, where the onus on
 quality control in case of the latter, is more on the developer himself.

 The reasoning I could offer was that big companies such as Yahoo ( symfony),
 facebook (php), and Twitter (rails) rely on open source technologies, surely
 they are aware of the above points but still choose to go with open source
 rather than closed source technologies. Money is not the most important
 criteria for these companies, and there definitely is a better reason why
 they choose open rather than closed source technologies.

 However, it is still not convincing me for I found myself agreeing to the
 points my friend raised in favor of closed source technologies. Can anyone
 shed a light on this?

 Thanks!!!
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[symfony-users] Re: Offbeat: open source vs closed source technologies

2010-01-08 Thread Massimiliano Arione
I think the major point is: a closed product is depending on a
company. if that company decides to stop support, or do any else bad
decistion, you're finished.
With open source, you can at last do it yourself, but also (and
better) pay any other company or single developer to help you.
In a closed product, you can be stuck with bugs that company don't
want to fix (this is a real case with ms office), while in an open one
you can DIY (or get it done by someone else, same as above).

On 8 Gen, 11:27, Lee Bolding l...@leesbian.net wrote:
 I think these days, the line between open source and closed source  
 is somewhat blurred - and this is a good thing.

 You now have premium open source - with the likes of RHEL, SugarCRM,  
 MySQL and Magento. Microsoft technologies are no longer exclusively  
 closed - I'm currently working with a team of 9 .net/wpf/silverlight  
 developers that are all using open source technology, along with big  
 ticket items such as BizTalk. Pragmatism at it's best - using the  
 correct tool for the job.

 MySQL may be free, but my database on this project is going to have  
 half a billion rows - I can't see relying on community support for  
 solving scalability issues to be clever - intact, it's a massive risk  
 on the project risk register. Luckily, as I mentioned already - there  
 are MySQL professional services.

 The whole IIS/windows server licensing issue is also beginning to  
 disappear - if you want a well supported, enterprise grade, stable and  
 scalable PHP environment, you'll likely want Zend Server - which costs  
 around the same as a Windows Server license. Apache, lighttp, nginx  
 etc are all free, but who actually supports them? If your server goes  
 bump in the night, who you gonna call?

 As always, you get what you pay for. This is true regardless of open  
 source vs closed. If you do open source on the cheap you'll get bad  
 coders that will produce crap, then disappear. Spend more and you'll  
 get a better application, that requires less maintenance and because  
 it's built well, easier to maintain and the developers won't disappear  
 because they're terrified of supporting their own bad code.

 Open source vs closed? IMHO, makes no difference unless you hire bad  
 developers or are unable to maintain a good relationship with your  
 developers.

 Sent from my iWheel

 On 8 Jan 2010, at 08:46, Parijat Kalia kaliapari...@gmail.com wrote:

  Hey guys,

  Just lighting up everyone's day, would like to get as many as  
  possible arguments on this. Me and a friend of mine, had a debate  
  last evening, about open source(PHP) vs closed source technologies
  (DOT NET).He raised the following points:

  1. He feels that open source is not reliable whereas closed source  
  is. The logic being that, once the application is developed and  
  sold, if it runs into some kind of a bug or an error, there is  
  support team for closed source technologies who are going to come  
  and help you fix it, whereas this is not a guarantee in open source  
  technologies.

  2. Development for a successful open source technology is community  
  dependent, implying the choice is still on a faithful group of  
  users, whereas in closed source technologies it is more reliable  
  because it is being backed by a company (microsoft for .NET and SAP  
  for SAP). f

   3. The third point that was raised is, closed source technologies  
  enforce quality control as opposed to open source technologies,  
  where the onus on quality control in case of the latter, is more on  
  the developer himself.

  The reasoning I could offer was that big companies such as Yahoo  
  ( symfony), facebook (php), and Twitter (rails) rely on open source  
  technologies, surely they are aware of the above points but still  
  choose to go with open source rather than closed source  
  technologies. Money is not the most important criteria for these  
  companies, and there definitely is a better reason why they choose  
  open rather than closed source technologies.

  However, it is still not convincing me for I found myself agreeing  
  to the points my friend raised in favor of closed source  
  technologies. Can anyone shed a light on this?

  Thanks!!!
  --
  You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google  
  Groups symfony users group.
  To post to this group, send email to symfony-us...@googlegroups.com.
  To unsubscribe from this group, send email to 
  symfony-users+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com
  .
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  athttp://groups.google.com/group/symfony-users?hl=en
  .
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