Re: [OSM-talk] Voting
Andy Robinson (blackadder) wrote:
>Frederik Ramm wrote:
>
>
>>
>>
>>I've been critcised for not suggesting an alternative. So here's my
>>suggestion:
>>
>>* Continue your discussion and voting as before
>>
>>* Give yourselves a name ("OSM Tagging Task Force" or whatever) and
>>create a mailing list.
>>
>>* Do not talk about "approved", "rejected", or "deprecated" features;
>>instead, if something is voted in favour, it becomes a "recommended by
>>OSMTTF" feature.
>>snip>
>>
>>
>I haven't expressed my view too much on this aspect of late. I think most
>know that I'm an advocate of the "let it evolve" approach.
>
>
As a OSM Newbie, this seems like one of those old timer arguments you
see in the back of the pub, where everyone involved knows their point of
view, and everyone elese point of view, and knows no-one will change,
but discusses anyway for old time sake. Normally I stay away from those
discussions, but this time I'll wade in (to knowing glances between the
old timers, I'm sure...)
I like the way that new tags can be written up on the wiki, and then any
users can show their feelings on them. I think it's quite clear from
the wiki that you don't have to use 'approved' tags, or that the
approval is set in stone (it's a wiki after all), but I think it helps
new user to see how new tags are being thought of by everyone, and for
people with an idea to document their idea and show it to the world.
Without something like this you will get fifty different types of subtly
different tags. I see the proposal / voting / approval process as
something to do with the documentation on the wiki, and not nessarily to
do with the map.
Maybe what's required is getting more users to look at the proposals and
give their opinion (maybe putting the latest proposal thats being voted
on on the front page ?)
Just my two penneth,
Paul.
--
Paul Hurley http://www.paulhurley.co.uk/
The knack of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.
Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy
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Re: [OSM-talk] Voting
Sven Grüner wrote: Frederik Ramm schrieb: I've been critcised for not suggesting an alternative. So here's my suggestion: * [...] Okay, slowly I realize that I took all this for granted while you didn't. While I'm not yet certain wether you seriously propose such a task force it's no good idea I believe. That would inevitably become a "closed" group at that others would point their fingers saying "It's all their fault". In contrast our current system is truly open: Anybody can drop by in the wiki write one or two lines to a proposal and leave again. In this discussion, I find myself on their side: Our project is so open, and I have the impression that you are trying to *reduce* that openness by setting up a voting process. I have the suspicion that in the end you want a project where new tags aren't even allowed unless they underwent discussion and voting. And that's where my fierce opposition comes from. Naturally I can only speak for myself but I'm almost certain this applies to others as well: I don't want to allow or disallow anything! When I spent time with proposals I consider that a service to others. Those others are free to chose wether they want to use my service of neatly structured and described tags or not. I'm a mechanical engineer and see on a daily basis how industrial norms like ISO, DIN, etc. make things easier by allowing you to concentrate on your core business rather than worrying if other people will now what I mean by a M6x40 bolt. Take ISO 5457 for example: You are free to use whatever paperformat you like but isn't it also comfortable to walk into any shop and ask for DIN A4 paper sheets, that every printer and every desktop application will know what you mean without the need to say that it's a piece of paper with the dimensions 210x297mm? Even when there are several competing norms that's fine as long each one clearly defines it's meaning and one knows which one applies. There are of course laws and alike which enforce people to meet such norms but it's false to blame the resulting hassle on those who created the norm. So we should try to scatter the illusion that tags as they can be found in the wiki are obligatory in any kind. I'll be glad to do so when you point me to such places. regards, Sven +1 Paul. -- Paul Hurley http://www.paulhurley.co.uk/ The knack of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Osmarender and coastlines
Hello. As part of my new found obsession^D hobby I'm mapping parts of Northumberland, and updating some wiki pages around that area (like http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Northumberland and http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Tyne_and_Wear ). I'm trying to render images for these two pages and running into a few problems. I've downloaded a uk planet file and done some test renders, tweaking the files to show what I want, but the coastline is rendering in a funny way. It render what I assume is each individual way on the coastline as a closed polygon in blue, so there's a wiggly line (coast) and a straight line (the bot closing the polygon) which sometimes cuts off the coast. Am I missing something ? Is there a magic way to do this (maybe render as a line, not filled, and then fill the 'sea' somehow ? Any ideas welcome Thanks Paul. -- Paul Hurley http://www.paulhurley.co.uk/ The knack of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Osmarender an area over time
Hello. Huge apologies if this is explained somewhere, but how do the 'time-lapse' images of areas get rendered that appear in places like the Wiki featured image ? I'm a bit new, but have succesfully rendered a few areas, and would love to show how some of Northumberland is growing. I could try to remember to download data files every couple of days and then render them, but maybe the api can deliver the equivalent of a 'diff' ? Thanks in advance Paul. -- Paul Hurley http://www.paulhurley.co.uk/ The knack of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] [Fwd: [OpenStreetMap] GPX Import failure]
I've had a few GPC import failures recently, but the email with the error seems to be an error in the code. When I resubmit the gpx files they usually import fine. Any ideas ? Thanks Paul. -- Paul Hurley http://www.paulhurley.co.uk/ The knack of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy --- Begin Message --- Hi, It looks like your GPX file 20080314_1629_alnwick_felton_widdrington_2.gpx failed to import. Here's the error: Bad file descriptor - /usr/bin/file -bz /home/osm/gpx/84186.gpx /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.0.1/lib/active_support/core_ext/kernel/agnostics.rb:7:in ``' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/activesupport-2.0.1/lib/active_support/core_ext/kernel/agnostics.rb:7:in ``' /var/www/rails/app/models/trace.rb:141:in `xml_file' /var/www/rails/app/models/trace.rb:177:in `import' /var/www/rails/lib/daemons/gpx_import.rb:21 /var/www/rails/lib/daemons/gpx_import.rb:15 /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/application.rb:159:in `start_load' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/application.rb:236:in `start' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/monitor.rb:51:in `watch' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/monitor.rb:51:in `watch' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/monitor.rb:45:in `watch' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/monitor.rb:44:in `watch' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/monitor.rb:84:in `start_with_pidfile' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/monitor.rb:64:in `start_with_pidfile' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/monitor.rb:111:in `start' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/application_group.rb:111:in `create_monitor' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/application.rb:223:in `start' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/controller.rb:69:in `run' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons.rb:136:in `run' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons/cmdline.rb:105:in `catch_exceptions' /usr/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/daemons-1.0.9/lib/daemons.rb:135:in `run' lib/daemons/gpx_import_ctl:20 More information about GPX import failures and how to avoid them can be found at: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/GPX_Import_Failures --- End Message --- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] How do we tag passing/slow lanes?
Andy Robinson (blackadder) wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My understanding is (was?) that the lane tag indicated how many lanes there were in each direction, so '1' would indicate a road which was 2 lanes, 1 in each direction. The definitive answer is rather blank on the matter: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php?title=Key:lanes&action=edit That needed fixing then - Done. Because when originally conceived it was always intended to apply to the number of physical lanes on the way. Cheers Andy As I'm new to this game, but very impressed by the bredth and depth of the documentation for OSM, I'm quite surprised that lanes isn't better described. I assumed it was the number of lanes in each direction, and started tagging normal residential roads as lanes=1, then I found two spots where there's onyl room for traffic in one direction at a time (over a narrow bridge and through an ancient arch or folly). I was stumped how to tag these, but when I saw someone say lanes was the total number of lanes on that way (so in both directions for a non one way way) thought this was great. Would it be too forward to suggest a Proposed features/lanes page. My proposal would be that lanes is the total number of lanes on the way, so ; Two Way residential road with one lane in either direction: lanes=2 One way road: lanes=1 individual carriageway for three lane motorway: lanes=3 With a rationale that this would then clear up confusion, and help with recording information such as single lane width restrictions, passing places etc. I then assume that some of the highway tags could then assume a lanes value (residential, unclassified, tertiary: lanes=2) I'll happily edit the page, but don't want to step on decorum ! Thanks Paul. -- Paul Hurley http://www.paulhurley.co.uk/ The knack of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] How to use lanes= for two way single track roads?
Alex Mauer wrote: DavidD wrote: According to map features the value for the lanes key should be. "Number of travel lanes in each (or only permitted) direction" I've been tagging to this definition. "Number of travel lanes on the way" This makes more sense to me because you can tag two way single lane roads with lanes = 1. The map features definition on the other hand doesn't give an obvious way to tag these roads. lanes = 0.5 perhaps. It also runs into trouble with 3- and 5-lane roads. Tagging the total number of lanes makes a lot more sense to me. (per carriageway if applicable, since each should be mapped separately) I have recently posted a similar question to the newbies list. There are two roads I've mapped recently where a short section has a width restriction meaning cars can only pass in one direction at a time, and I don't know how to map it. If lanes is the total lanes for a way this would work, but how does osmarender render this ? Thanks Paul. -- Paul Hurley http://www.paulhurley.co.uk/ The knack of flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss. Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
