Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting-(man_made=mineshaft)
The feature is now approved. So let's start mapping mineshafts. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dmineshaft lesi ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting -(man_made=mineshaft)
So let's start voting: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Mineshaft lesi It is planed to close the voting tomorrow. So vote now. Preliminary result: 7 times approved, 1 time opposed, one fun vote. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Mineshaft#Voting Due to David mds we now also have a really great resource list, which can be used for other features too: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Mineshaft#Suggestion_for_resource_list lesi ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal -Voting- (man_made=mineshaft)
Lesi writes: If you think voting is silly, why do you not change the procedure of approving new features in the wiki? Because some people think that we should vote, and would be upset if I removed the voting mechanism. Based on what facts a feature will be approved then. Well, the http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features page claims two ends for the result of voting: first, that something will be listed on http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Map_features, and second, that once voted on, it will be a standard way to tag map features. Rule #2: before setting out a solution you should decide what problem you are trying to solve. Should Map_features contain a link to every map feature? Should we be directing people towards mapping in certain ways? Or should we let people map however they want as long as they document their method? Or do you want to abolish proposed features completely? Yes. If you want a certain Key or Tag to mean a certain thing, then just start using it that way AND document it in the wiki. If it's already documented with a different meaning, then you must MUST not change that documentation. Instead, use a similar but different Key or Tag and create a wikilink from the one you'd like to use to the different one. What's important is that the meaning of everything in the database is documented. By having two sources of meanings (wiki/ and wiki/Proposed_features/) people have to look in two places to find documentation. Undocumented mapping is almost completely worthless except to say Hey there's something interesting here, but I'll be damned if I can figure out what it is from the frimfraz=pirkle OSM tagging. What the hell is a pirkle anyway?? -- --my blog is athttp://blog.russnelson.com Crynwr supports open source software 521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315-323-1241 Potsdam, NY 13676-3213 | Sheepdog ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal -Voting - (man_made=mineshaft)
Lesi writes: I do not know which discussion you mean? According to the wiki voting is still neccessary to approve a new feature. What negative result do you fear would occur if somebody used[1] an unapproved feature? [1] That is, they tagged something as documented in the wiki, even if the documentation is to be found in Proposed Features? I'm not a big fan of chaotic mapping, where people apply tags randomly without understanding how they're documented in the wiki, or apply tags without documenting their meaning in the wiki. IMHO, everything underneath Proposed_features should be moved into the real wiki (e.g. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Key:stop should be moved to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:stop) and the feature should be labelled with 1) its current level of usage and 2) a measure of its controversiality (red / yellow / green). That would make it easier for OSM editors to point people to documentation. -- --my blog is athttp://blog.russnelson.com Crynwr supports open source software 521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315-323-1241 Potsdam, NY 13676-3213 | Sheepdog ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal -Voting- (man_made=mineshaft)
What negative result do you fear would occur if somebody used[1] an unapproved feature? [1] That is, they tagged something as documented in the wiki, even if the documentation is to be found in Proposed Features? I'm not a big fan of chaotic mapping, where people apply tags randomly without understanding how they're documented in the wiki, or apply tags without documenting their meaning in the wiki. IMHO, everything underneath Proposed_features should be moved into the real wiki (e.g. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Key:stop should be moved to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:stop) and the feature should be labelled with 1) its current level of usage and 2) a measure of its controversiality (red / yellow / green). That would make it easier for OSM editors to point people to documentation. I do not fear anything. I have nothing against another system of approving. But at the moment approving by voting is described as the way to go. If there would be a consensus about another procedure I would be quite happy about that. But at the moment only some guys on talk said voting is silly, but that is not enough. If you think voting is silly, why do you not change the procedure of approving new features in the wiki? But it is not enough to say, that you want to abolish voting. Based on what facts a feature will be approved then. Or do you want to abolish proposed features completely? BTW the role of talk is too important. Why should new features be discussed on talk, IMO they should be discussed in the forum, a place which is much more accessible and modern and not so outdated like a mailing list. Some of the people here can not even handle it. Most discussion get completely off topic after 3 posts. A moderated forum with an integrated voting mechanism would be the best to introduce new features. lesi ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting - (man_made=mineshaft)
In the last days no further problems appeared and it seems that all helpful suggestions are included now. So let's start voting: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Mineshaft lesi ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting -(man_made=mineshaft)
In the last days no further problems appeared and it seems that all helpful suggestions are included now. So let's start voting: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Mineshaft lesi It would be nice if further votes would be more serious. If you do not like voting, do not take part in them. There are people, who do not think that total anarchy is the way to go. lesi ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting -(man_made=mineshaft)
Lesi writes: In the last days no further problems appeared and it seems that all helpful suggestions are included now. So let's start voting: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Mineshaft It would be nice if further votes would be more serious. If you do not like voting, do not take part in them. There are people, who do not think that total anarchy is the way to go. You already have a consensus that no further need for changes is needed. What more do you want? A pony? A lollipop? A vote? How is voting once the document has been approved by everyone going to change anything? Don't vote. Just start using the tag. Do we really need to revisit this discussion again so soon? -- --my blog is athttp://blog.russnelson.com Crynwr supports open source software 521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315-323-1241 Potsdam, NY 13676-3213 | Sheepdog ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - Voting -(man_made=mineshaft)
Hi, Russ Nelson wrote: You already have a consensus that no further need for changes is needed. What more do you want? A pony? A lollipop? A vote? How is voting once the document has been approved by everyone going to change anything? +1. Maybe we should set a precedent and move the feature to approved features and put approved by broad consensus on talk? Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal -Voting - (man_made=mineshaft)
You already have a consensus that no further need for changes is needed. What more do you want? A pony? A lollipop? A vote? How is voting once the document has been approved by everyone going to change anything? Don't vote. Just start using the tag. Do we really need to revisit this discussion again so soon? I do not know which discussion you mean? According to the wiki voting is still neccessary to approve a new feature. If there have been any changes to this, they are not documented in the wiki. lesi ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
