Re: [OSM-talk] Cyclofix project
Hi Joost Looks cool !I would like to discuss tagging issues and more with you, but during the next month I will be too busy... -- Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen Morten Lange, Oslo, Norway On Monday, 10 August 2020, 16:57:52 CEST, joost schouppe wrote: Hi Morten, The site works without a database, so requires very little upkeep. The team that worked on it is very enthusiastic about the project and at least four of the five people who built this during Open Summer of Code are still involved as volunteers. Our partners from the government also seem quite enthused to keep using it on some of their websites, and friends at the pro-cycle movement were also inspired. We are looking for ways to be able to keep working on this in a more structural way, but for now I suspect our enthusiasm will keep it afloat. The tool is now already in production for two "official" projects. For cyclofix, there's some things in my personal backlog:- add all the layers here: https://cyclofix.osm.be/docs/using-data-map/ (now there's an example for "where to buy a bike", but all the layers should be explained there)- add more info to the public wiki - most of our thinking is described here https://github.com/osmbe/cyclofix-website/issues/4 , and I have been editing the wiki to make some things clearer. I also aim to extend this page https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:service:bicycle With Pieter Fiers, we've also been thinking about creating a proposal for a pub subtag, which could be used to refine cafe and pub with a certain "style"; e.g. "an Irish pub" or a "cyclist oriented pub". For now we just say "if it is a pub/cafe and has cycle services or a cycling club, it's a cycle café" I believe Pieter Vander Vennet also has some ideas on how to make the overpass-queries behind the data more visible to end users, so the "real OSM people" can easily get an idea of our choices. We have tried to keep the entire Cyclofix project documented and easily replicable (including "how to organise a cyclofix mapping party") on https://cyclofix.osm.be/ If you want to be a little more closely involved: most of our team is included in community (at) osm.be , and we've also created a Matrix chatroom. Best,Joost Op ma 10 aug. 2020 om 16:07 schreef Morten Lange via talk : Thanks for your hepful response (below).And sorry that I "re-sent" my questions in a slightly different way. However, there were two new points. One question about the life expectancy of the current site and one suggestion or inspiration (By some possibly perceived as wishful thinking): I enjoyed testing your solution, and I would like to announce it to others to try. But I suppose continued operation of the current site is uncertain? That fact(?) holds me back a bit, except for "geeks" and bicycle+map affectionados. Ideally The European Cyclists Federation or even UNEP or some other big organisation would offer to support operations of such a site, and cater for large traffic loads and continued development for, say, a 10 year period :-) In the larger picture the costs would be quie low! -- Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen Morten Lange On Sunday, 9 August 2020, 16:25:52 CEST, Pieter Fiers wrote: > Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! > For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific map, including bicycle cafés. Thanks, us as well ;) > What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of how >you classify the nodes that are to be included in the different map "layers". > Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes > precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?) An excellent question, and something we want to improve in a future version (the discoverability and ease-of-use of the "layer" definitions). To answer the bicycle cafés question in the context of the current version: Take a look at https://github.com/pietervdvn/MapComplete/blob/master/Customizations/Layers/BikeCafes.ts#L23. That overpass filter/query can basically be written as: "a pub/bar/cafe with pub=cycling or any bicycle:service" (https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/WSU). With regards to precedence, both POI's would be shown (not ideal). With the current definitions this might happen if there's an overlap on shop=bicycle, amenity=pub/bar/cafe, amenity=bicycle_parking or amenity=bicycle_repair_station. > I agree with making a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and general > sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles. For "pure" bicycle shops we use shop=bicycle, for "other" shops (general sports equipment stores) we use shop=* + any bicycle:service:* tag. We're excited for the future and we're continuing work on making the project more user-friendly and approachable! Thanks for the kind words and with kind regards, Pieter Fiers On 05/08/2020 00:39, Morten Lange wrote:
Re: [OSM-talk] Cyclofix project
Hi Morten, The site works without a database, so requires very little upkeep. The team that worked on it is very enthusiastic about the project and at least four of the five people who built this during Open Summer of Code are still involved as volunteers. Our partners from the government also seem quite enthused to keep using it on some of their websites, and friends at the pro-cycle movement were also inspired. We are looking for ways to be able to keep working on this in a more structural way, but for now I suspect our enthusiasm will keep it afloat. The tool is now already in production for two "official" projects. For cyclofix, there's some things in my personal backlog: - add all the layers here: https://cyclofix.osm.be/docs/using-data-map/ (now there's an example for "where to buy a bike", but all the layers should be explained there) - add more info to the public wiki - most of our thinking is described here https://github.com/osmbe/cyclofix-website/issues/4 , and I have been editing the wiki to make some things clearer. I also aim to extend this page https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:service:bicycle With Pieter Fiers, we've also been thinking about creating a proposal for a pub subtag, which could be used to refine cafe and pub with a certain "style"; e.g. "an Irish pub" or a "cyclist oriented pub". For now we just say "if it is a pub/cafe and has cycle services or a cycling club, it's a cycle café" I believe Pieter Vander Vennet also has some ideas on how to make the overpass-queries behind the data more visible to end users, so the "real OSM people" can easily get an idea of our choices. We have tried to keep the entire Cyclofix project documented and easily replicable (including "how to organise a cyclofix mapping party") on https://cyclofix.osm.be/ If you want to be a little more closely involved: most of our team is included in community (at) osm.be , and we've also created a Matrix chatroom. Best, Joost Op ma 10 aug. 2020 om 16:07 schreef Morten Lange via talk < talk@openstreetmap.org>: > Thanks for your hepful response (below). > And sorry that I "re-sent" my questions in a slightly different way. > > However, there were two new points. > One question about the life expectancy of the current site > and one suggestion or inspiration (By some possibly perceived as wishful > thinking): > > I enjoyed testing your solution, and I would like to announce it to others > to try. > But I suppose continued operation of the current site is uncertain? > That fact(?) holds me back a bit, except for "geeks" and bicycle+map > affectionados. > > Ideally The European Cyclists Federation or even UNEP or some other big > organisation would offer to support operations of such a site, and cater > for large traffic loads and continued development for, say, a 10 year > period :-) > In the larger picture the costs would be quie low! > > -- > Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen > Morten Lange > > > On Sunday, 9 August 2020, 16:25:52 CEST, Pieter Fiers > wrote: > > > > Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! > > For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair > specific map, including bicycle cafés. > > Thanks, us as well ;) > > > What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of > how you classify the nodes that are to be included in the different map > "layers". > > Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes > precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?) > > An excellent question, and something we want to improve in a future > version (the discoverability and ease-of-use of the "layer" definitions). > > To answer the bicycle cafés question in the context of the current > version: > Take a look at > https://github.com/pietervdvn/MapComplete/blob/master/Customizations/Layers/BikeCafes.ts#L23. > That overpass filter/query can basically be written as: "a pub/bar/cafe > with pub=cycling or any bicycle:service" (https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/WSU > ). > > With regards to precedence, both POI's would be shown (not ideal). With > the current definitions this might happen if there's an overlap on > shop=bicycle, > amenity=pub/bar/cafe, amenity=bicycle_parking or amenity= > bicycle_repair_station. > > > I agree with making a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and > general sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles. > > For "pure" bicycle shops we use shop=bicycle, for "other" shops (general > sports equipment stores) we use shop=* + any bicycle:service:* tag. > > We're excited for the future and we're continuing work on making the > project more user-friendly and approachable! > > > Thanks for the kind words and with kind regards, > Pieter Fiers > > > On 05/08/2020 00:39, Morten Lange wrote: > > Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! > > For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific > map, including bicycle cafés. > > What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an
Re: [OSM-talk] Cyclofix project
Thanks for your hepful response (below).And sorry that I "re-sent" my questions in a slightly different way. However, there were two new points. One question about the life expectancy of the current site and one suggestion or inspiration (By some possibly perceived as wishful thinking): I enjoyed testing your solution, and I would like to announce it to others to try. But I suppose continued operation of the current site is uncertain? That fact(?) holds me back a bit, except for "geeks" and bicycle+map affectionados. Ideally The European Cyclists Federation or even UNEP or some other big organisation would offer to support operations of such a site, and cater for large traffic loads and continued development for, say, a 10 year period :-) In the larger picture the costs would be quie low! -- Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen Morten Lange On Sunday, 9 August 2020, 16:25:52 CEST, Pieter Fiers wrote: > Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! > For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific map, including bicycle cafés. Thanks, us as well ;) > What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of how >you classify the nodes that are to be included in the different map "layers". > Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes > precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?) An excellent question, and something we want to improve in a future version (the discoverability and ease-of-use of the "layer" definitions). To answer the bicycle cafés question in the context of the current version: Take a look at https://github.com/pietervdvn/MapComplete/blob/master/Customizations/Layers/BikeCafes.ts#L23. That overpass filter/query can basically be written as: "a pub/bar/cafe with pub=cycling or any bicycle:service" (https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/WSU). With regards to precedence, both POI's would be shown (not ideal). With the current definitions this might happen if there's an overlap on shop=bicycle, amenity=pub/bar/cafe, amenity=bicycle_parking or amenity=bicycle_repair_station. > I agree with making a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and general > sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles. For "pure" bicycle shops we use shop=bicycle, for "other" shops (general sports equipment stores) we use shop=* + any bicycle:service:* tag. We're excited for the future and we're continuing work on making the project more user-friendly and approachable! Thanks for the kind words and with kind regards, Pieter Fiers On 05/08/2020 00:39, Morten Lange wrote: Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific map, including bicycle cafés. What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of how you classify the nodes that are to be included in the differewnt map "layers". Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?) I agree with making a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and general sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles. However, the way Cyclofix has decided to differentiate is not self-evident to me, after briefly checking your documentation. I must admit that I did not really consider looking at the source-code ;-) -- Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen Morten Lange On Wednesday, 29 July 2020, 19:43:38 CEST, Pieter Fiers wrote: Dear OSM community, My name is Pierre Barban. A team composed of three very motivated students, including myself, and lead by two active members of the OSMbe, have been mandated by the region of Brussels, Belgium, to create a map gathering all kind of data related to cycling. Without a doubt, OpenStreetMap was the perfect tool for us to create a powerful platform that would sustain over the years. In the framework of month-long online code camp organized by the non-profit Open Knowledge Belgium, we have been able to establish the first version of the tool, organized a mapathon to collect data, and create a complete website to document the entire making process. In accordance with the OSM core values, it would be very valuable for our project as well as our individual learning process to receive as many constructive comments from the community as possible. If you're interested in more details about the project, we will be giving an online presentation tomorrow July 30, 2020 at 1pm CEST. We will be available to directly discuss after the presentation to receive feedback in order to keep improving our project. Other related project from our program, Open Summer of Code, like the Bike Data Project - which aims to collect and share cyclist commute data in an opened way - will also be presented to you. Please do not hesitate to
Re: [OSM-talk] Cyclofix project
Hi, Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific map, including bicycle cafés. You were soliciting constructive feedback, so here is mine: What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of how you classify the nodes that are to be included in the different map "layers". Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?) Do you make a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and general sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles? If you do, the way Cyclofix has decided to differentiate is not self-evident to me, after briefly checking your documentation. I must admit that I did not really consider looking at the source-code ;-) The same goes for bicycle cafés (And public bookcases). In true collaborative fashion and in the spirit of open data, nodes that are to apear on your map should be editable (and addable) also in other tools with predictable results. I enjoyed testing your solution, and I would have liked to announce it to others. But I suppose continued operation of the current site is uncertain? That fact(?) holds me back a bit. Ideally The European Cyclists Federation or even UNEP or some other big organisation would offer to support operations for large traffic loads and continued development for, say, a 10 year period :-) P.S.Digging for some minutes into the code I found this, which does give me clues for how you search for and create bicycle cafés (or pubs really): https://github.com/pietervdvn/MapComplete/blob/master/Customizations/Layers/BikeCafes.ts -- Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen Morten Lange On Wednesday, 29 July 2020, 19:43:38 CEST, Pieter Fiers wrote: Dear OSM community, My name is Pierre Barban. A team composed of three very motivated students, including myself, and lead by two active members of the OSMbe, have been mandated by the region of Brussels, Belgium, to create a map gathering all kind of data related to cycling. Without a doubt, OpenStreetMap was the perfect tool for us to create a powerful platform that would sustain over the years. In the framework of month-long online code camp organized by the non-profit Open Knowledge Belgium, we have been able to establish the first version of the tool, organized a mapathon to collect data, and create a complete website to document the entire making process. In accordance with the OSM core values, it would be very valuable for our project as well as our individual learning process to receive as many constructive comments from the community as possible. If you're interested in more details about the project, we will be giving an online presentation tomorrow July 30, 2020 at 1pm CEST. We will be available to directly discuss after the presentation to receive feedback in order to keep improving our project. Other related project from our program, Open Summer of Code, like the Bike Data Project - which aims to collect and share cyclist commute data in an opened way - will also be presented to you. Please do not hesitate to contact me for further information, thank you for your time and help. Sincerely, Pierre Barban, from the Cyclofix project. Sent by Pieter Fiers , another student of the team. Pierre Barban University Panthéon-Sorbonne Paris I – Class of 2020 Masters in Economics of Sustainable Development pierre.bar...@gmail.com | +33 7 68 72 92 54 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Cyclofix project
> Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! > For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific > map, including bicycle cafés. Thanks, us as well ;) > What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of how you > classify the nodes that are to be included in the different map "layers". > Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes > precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?) An excellent question, and something we want to improve in a future version (the discoverability and ease-of-use of the "layer" definitions). To answer the bicycle cafés question in the context of the current version: Take a look at https://github.com/pietervdvn/MapComplete/blob/master/Customizations/Layers/BikeCafes.ts#L23. That overpass filter/query can basically be written as: "a pub/bar/cafe with pub=cycling or any bicycle:service" (https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/WSU). With regards to precedence, both POI's would be shown (not ideal). With the current definitions this might happen if there's an overlap on shop=bicycle, amenity=pub/bar/cafe, amenity=bicycle_parking or amenity=bicycle_repair_station. > I agree with making a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and general > sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles. For "pure" bicycle shops we use shop=bicycle, for "other" shops (general sports equipment stores) we use shop=* + any bicycle:service:* tag. We're excited for the future and we're continuing work on making the project more user-friendly and approachable! Thanks for the kind words and with kind regards, Pieter Fiers On 05/08/2020 00:39, Morten Lange wrote: > Congratulations on a nice project and a useful one ! > > For a long time I have wished for a user-friendly bicycle repair specific > map, including bicycle cafés. > > What I miss in the Cyclofix project is an easy-to find definition of how you > classify the nodes that are to be included in the differewnt map "layers". > Which search is it that produces the bicycle cafés. (And what takes > precedence if two or more criteria are fulfilled?) > > I agree with making a distinction between "pure" bicycle shops and general > sport shops that offer bicycles or repair of bicycles. > However, the way Cyclofix has decided to differentiate is not self-evident to > me, after briefly checking your documentation. I must admit that I did not > really consider looking at the source-code ;-) > > -- > Regards / Kveðja / Kila la heri / Hilsen > Morten Lange > > On Wednesday, 29 July 2020, 19:43:38 CEST, Pieter Fiers > [](mailto:pie...@pfiers.net) wrote: > > Dear OSM community, > > My name is Pierre Barban. A team composed of three very motivated students, > including myself, and lead by two active members of the OSMbe, have been > mandated by the region of Brussels, Belgium, to create a map gathering all > kind of data related to cycling. Without a doubt, OpenStreetMap was the > perfect tool for us to create a powerful platform that would sustain over the > years. > > In the framework of month-long online code camp organized by the non-profit > [Open Knowledge Belgium](https://be.okfn.org/), we have been able to > establish the first version of the [tool](https://cyclofix.osm.be/map/), > organized a [mapathon](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5dVjDt5QAE) to > collect data, and create a complete [website](https://cyclofix.osm.be/) to > document the entire making process. > > In accordance with the OSM core values, it would be very valuable for our > project as well as our individual learning process to receive as many > constructive comments from the community as possible. If you're interested in > more details about the project, we will be giving an [online > presentation](https://www.eventbrite.be/e/open-summer-of-code-2020-demo-day-live-streaming-registration-112787885602) > tomorrow July 30, 2020 at 1pm CEST. We will be available to directly discuss > after the presentation to receive feedback in order to keep improving our > project. Other related project from our program, [Open Summer of > Code](https://osoc.be/), like the Bike Data Project - which aims to collect > and share cyclist commute data in an opened way - will also be presented to > you. > > Please do not hesitate to contact me for further information, > > thank you for your time and help. > > Sincerely, > > Pierre Barban, from the Cyclofix project. > > Sent by Pieter Fiers [](mailto:pie...@pfiers.net), another > student of the team. > > Pierre Barban > > University Panthéon-Sorbonne Paris I – Class of 2020 > Masters in Economics of Sustainable Development > pierre.bar...@gmail.com | +33 7 68 72 92 54 > > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Cyclofix project
Dear OSM community, My name is Pierre Barban. A team composed of three very motivated students, including myself, and lead by two active members of the OSMbe, have been mandated by the region of Brussels, Belgium, to create a map gathering all kind of data related to cycling. Without a doubt, OpenStreetMap was the perfect tool for us to create a powerful platform that would sustain over the years. In the framework of month-long online code camp organized by the non-profit [Open Knowledge Belgium](https://be.okfn.org/), we have been able to establish the first version of the [tool](https://cyclofix.osm.be/map/), organized a [mapathon](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5dVjDt5QAE) to collect data, and create a complete [website](https://cyclofix.osm.be/) to document the entire making process. In accordance with the OSM core values, it would be very valuable for our project as well as our individual learning process to receive as many constructive comments from the community as possible. If you're interested in more details about the project, we will be giving an [online presentation](https://www.eventbrite.be/e/open-summer-of-code-2020-demo-day-live-streaming-registration-112787885602) tomorrow July 30, 2020 at 1pm CEST. We will be available to directly discuss after the presentation to receive feedback in order to keep improving our project. Other related project from our program, [Open Summer of Code](https://osoc.be/), like the Bike Data Project - which aims to collect and share cyclist commute data in an opened way - will also be presented to you. Please do not hesitate to contact me for further information, thank you for your time and help. Sincerely, Pierre Barban, from the Cyclofix project. Sent by Pieter Fiers [](mailto:pie...@pfiers.net), another student of the team. Pierre Barban University Panthéon-Sorbonne Paris I – Class of 2020 Masters in Economics of Sustainable Development pierre.bar...@gmail.com | +33 7 68 72 92 54___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
