Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
Are the street names actually back at all levels? Can you expand on that one please, as I don't understand the implication? Steve Chilton, Learning Support Fellow Learning and Technical Support Unit Manager School of Health and Social Sciences Middlesex University phone/fax: 020 8411 5355 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.mdx.ac.uk/schools/hssc/staff/profiles/technical/chiltons.asp Chair of the Society of Cartographers: http://www.soc.org.uk/ SoC conference 2008: http://www.abdn.ac.uk/cartographers08/ One of the advantages of using greys and tonal variations of the road fill colours for the casings of the roads is that it enables black casings to be used exclusively for the bridge variants. I think that using black casings for roads would NOT help improve readability as it would make the text of road names more difficult to pick out and read. Sounds convincing; thanks for the background info. Are the street names actually back at all levels? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 07:55:02 +0100 (CET), Karl Eichwalder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Things not too important, we are rendering highly visible with the nice black color. They are also obfuscating tracks: Agreed! Look at this map view: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.38214lon=-0.14944zoom=15layers=B0FT I don't think they should even be visible in urban areas like this on our main street map, what use are they? I can see how they would be useful for a walking map in sparse rural areas, but otherwise they're: a) Not obvious (what other street map has power lines on it?) b) Too eye-catching (certainly in old countries where straight lines are otherwise very rare) c) Not of any use I'd favour removing them entirely, or failing that just making them much less prominent. Tata, Tom ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
Why not have them on a street map? They're highly visible features in real life, and you can use them as navigation features. Already they're the thinnest line on our maps (and yes, they're shown on OS maps of the area too) This is the pub on your map, showing how 'turn at the power lines' is a pretty good description of getting to middleton road: http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/24434 On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 9:10 AM, Tom Chance [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 07:55:02 +0100 (CET), Karl Eichwalder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Things not too important, we are rendering highly visible with the nice black color. They are also obfuscating tracks: Agreed! Look at this map view: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.38214lon=-0.14944zoom=15layers=B0FT I don't think they should even be visible in urban areas like this on our main street map, what use are they? I can see how they would be useful for a walking map in sparse rural areas, but otherwise they're: a) Not obvious (what other street map has power lines on it?) b) Too eye-catching (certainly in old countries where straight lines are otherwise very rare) c) Not of any use I'd favour removing them entirely, or failing that just making them much less prominent. Tata, Tom ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
Tom Chance schrieb: I don't think they should even be visible in urban areas like this on our main street map, what use are they? I can see how they would be useful for a walking map in sparse rural areas, but otherwise they're: a) Not obvious (what other street map has power lines on it?) On the other hand, what street map has post boxes, traffic signals and so on on it? b) Too eye-catching (certainly in old countries where straight lines are otherwise very rare) Making them visible only above certain zoom levels could be an option. c) Not of any use It *is* usefull information for orientation. I'd favour removing them entirely, or failing that just making them much less prominent. Maybe it's time to introduce some layers to hide / show some kind of information on demand? Greetings, Julian signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
Things not too important, we are rendering highly visible with the nice black color. They are also obfuscating tracks: http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=49.455373790593406lon=11.175777321956557zoom=14layers=F0B0F Er, I think you must have pasted the wrong link? I followed that one and got a very clear map with tracks and powerlines and no serious conflict between the two. Seriously, that map looks very good to me. Tom ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
Sven Grüner wrote: That once again throws up the general question which purpose the (official) maps displayed at openstreetmap.org should serve. A) Should they be a neat, beautiful (street-) map flattering the eyes of people who are used to the map-design of Google? or B) Should they be a show case of what OSM is really about, the data. Showing off what cool features we've got that no other map supplier can offer. We have two layers, Mapnik and Osmarender - we can do both. cheers Richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
One of the advantages of using greys and tonal variations of the road fill colours for the casings of the roads is that it enables black casings to be used exclusively for the bridge variants. I think that using black casings for roads would NOT help improve readability as it would make the text of road names more difficult to pick out and read. Cheers STEVE Steve Chilton, Learning Support Fellow Learning and Technical Support Unit Manager School of Health and Social Sciences Middlesex University phone/fax: 020 8411 5355 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.mdx.ac.uk/schools/hssc/staff/profiles/technical/chiltons.asp Chair of the Society of Cartographers: http://www.soc.org.uk/ SoC conference 2008: http://www.abdn.ac.uk/cartographers08/ -Original Message- I'd also like you to use black for the borders of residential ways and for the names of places and streets (instead of all these dirty greys). Better contrast would improve readability. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
Things not too important, we are rendering highly visible with the nice black color. They are also obfuscating tracks: http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=49.455373790593406lon=11.175777321956557zoom=14layers=F0B0F Er, I think you must have pasted the wrong link? I followed that one and got a very clear map with tracks and powerlines and no serious conflict between the two. Seriously, that map looks very good to me. Agreed, it looks much better on my Linux machine than on the Apple. Maybe an anti-aliasing issue. Nevertheless the lines are too visible, at least in farm areas: http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=49.49948648513156lon=11.006926936622994zoom=14layers=F0B0F Probably we also need more attributes to distinguish between main and minor power lines. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
the logical solution would be to use the overlays in openlayers make a nice (basic) basemap and add some transparent overlays - amenities - powerlines - and so on.. 2008/3/20, Richard Fairhurst [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Sven Grüner wrote: That once again throws up the general question which purpose the (official) maps displayed at openstreetmap.org should serve. A) Should they be a neat, beautiful (street-) map flattering the eyes of people who are used to the map-design of Google? or B) Should they be a show case of what OSM is really about, the data. Showing off what cool features we've got that no other map supplier can offer. We have two layers, Mapnik and Osmarender - we can do both. cheers Richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
Rob wrote: the logical solution would be to use the overlays in openlayers make a nice (basic) basemap and add some transparent overlays - amenities - powerlines - and so on.. bus line1, bus line2, etc... That's what I would like to do. It may prove a bit hard for larger areas. cycle network, walking network... Polyglot ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Karl Eichwalder wrote: | Things not too important, we are rendering highly visible with the nice | black color. They are also obfuscating tracks: | | http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=49.455373790593406lon=11.175777321956557zoom=14layers=F0B0F | Er, I think you must have pasted the wrong link? I followed that one and | got a very clear map with tracks and powerlines and no serious conflict | between the two. Seriously, that map looks very good to me. | | Agreed, it looks much better on my Linux machine than on the Apple. | Maybe an anti-aliasing issue. Nevertheless the lines are too | visible, at least in farm areas: | | http://www.informationfreeway.org/?lat=49.49948648513156lon=11.006926936622994zoom=14layers=F0B0F | | Probably we also need more attributes to distinguish between main and | minor power lines. That's what I was thinking. A main 275kV pylon is around 50m high, and visible for miles around. It won't cause a problem on a map because there is no way anything can be under it. You can see them clearly in the Yahoo Imagery. This is the only kind of power line I have been adding. E.g: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.75279lon=-1.31145zoom=16layers=B0FT A local power line connecting a couple of farmhouses at 240V or 415V is similar to a telegraph pole, and will typically be next to a farm track or something. It is likely that as it runs along one side of the track, it will be draw a line through the track at certain zoom levels. Robert (Jamie) Munro -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFH4oZ1z+aYVHdncI0RAmTPAJ9Q+DLXJT+ugT46puaSEnfSRc6OjwCg4CdF 56JxDZrLPDVGmoZ2RROw304= =hWsr -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 3:33 PM, Jo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rob wrote: the logical solution would be to use the overlays in openlayers make a nice (basic) basemap and add some transparent overlays - amenities - powerlines - and so on.. bus line1, bus line2, etc... That's what I would like to do. It may prove a bit hard for larger areas. cycle network, walking network... It might work quite well for some type of data, but to produce a nice map for things like walking or cycling you quite often want to de-emphasize the base map to a varying degree. So for a cycle network you really don't want the motorways showing up in bold blue. It's OSM though so you can always role your own like the cycle map. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Rendering power lines: black is beauty
I'm sure any paraglider folk using the map would be glad to see power line on there. Preferably as broad red lines! They are seriously bad news and surprisingly difficult to pick out when they're not silhouetted against the sky. elvin ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
