Re: [OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Dave F]

On 18/01/2018 00:34, Mike N wrote:

On 1/17/2018 6:53 PM, Dave F wrote:
Have you been in contact with the two contributors to see if they can 
revoke/reupload?
I presume it came from a database. If it's still available it can be 
amended as required.


  At this point it would be much better to just manually fix anything 
that doesn't look right - it will be much more up to date than trying 
to conflate any new data with potentially edited data which could be a 
mix of nodes and areas.


" and have not been updated since." means they haven't bee edited. The 
update edits appears to just add unnecessary 'is_in' tags, but hey if 
you wish to waste hours of your time ticking them off one by one, knock 
yourself out.


DaveF.


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Re: [OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Mike N]

On 1/17/2018 6:53 PM, Dave F wrote:
Have you been in contact with the two contributors to see if they can 
revoke/reupload?
I presume it came from a database. If it's still available it can be 
amended as required.


  At this point it would be much better to just manually fix anything 
that doesn't look right - it will be much more up to date than trying to 
conflate any new data with potentially edited data which could be a mix 
of nodes and areas.


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Re: [OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-01-18 0:33 GMT+01:00 Kevin Broderick :

>  I'm leaning towards place=neighbourhood as being more correct than
> place=hamlet, although it clearly leaves room for improvement in the form
> of proper landuse polygons and local knowledge re: names.
>


+1, the examples are very clearly no hamlets.

Cheers,
Martin
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Re: [OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Dave F]

Have you been in contact with the two contributors to see if they can 
revoke/reupload?
I presume it came from a database. If it's still available it can be 
amended as required.


DaveF

On 17/01/2018 23:33, Kevin Broderick wrote:

In Annapolis, Maryland, for instance:

https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/158283000
https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/157577529
http://www.openstreetmap.org/node/150949243

All of the points for which I've reviewed the history were created ten 
years ago, edited nine years ago, by the same accounts, and have not 
been updated since.


It seems the same issue was brought up on the forum a couple of years 
ago (https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=53057), and the 
suggestion was that landuse polygons were probably most appropriate, 
and place=subdivision was next-best. I don't think I can effectively 
armchair-map landuse in cities, but hamlets in densely populated areas 
clearly don't meet the wiki definition (and, I'd argue, are distinct 
on-the-ground situations; an isolated hamlet in a rural area is very 
different than an urban neighbourhood or subdivision). I'm leaning 
towards place=neighbourhood as being more correct than place=hamlet, 
although it clearly leaves room for improvement in the form of proper 
landuse polygons and local knowledge re: names.


On Wed, Jan 17, 2018 at 4:14 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer 
> wrote:


can you post some examples?


cheers,
Martin




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Re: [OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Kevin Broderick]

In Annapolis, Maryland, for instance:

https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/158283000
https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/157577529
http://www.openstreetmap.org/node/150949243

All of the points for which I've reviewed the history were created ten
years ago, edited nine years ago, by the same accounts, and have not been
updated since.

It seems the same issue was brought up on the forum a couple of years ago (
https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=53057), and the suggestion
was that landuse polygons were probably most appropriate, and
place=subdivision was next-best. I don't think I can effectively
armchair-map landuse in cities, but hamlets in densely populated areas
clearly don't meet the wiki definition (and, I'd argue, are distinct
on-the-ground situations; an isolated hamlet in a rural area is very
different than an urban neighbourhood or subdivision). I'm leaning towards
place=neighbourhood as being more correct than place=hamlet, although it
clearly leaves room for improvement in the form of proper landuse polygons
and local knowledge re: names.

On Wed, Jan 17, 2018 at 4:14 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer  wrote:

> can you post some examples?
>
>
> cheers,
> Martin
>



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k...@kevinbroderick.com
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Re: [OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Mike N]

On 1/17/2018 5:55 PM, Kevin Broderick wrote:
Does anyone see a problem with armchair-mapping these to 
place:neighbourhood? I am not planning to do this in an automated 
fashion, but instead to pick away at it while reviewing areas of 
interest to some of my coworkers, who have noted that an appropriate 
rendering for an isolated hamlet doesn't make a lot of sense in a 
more-populated area.


 This happened quite a bit in the US.  I have been converting the 
hamlet points to area where I could identify a subdivision, and add the 
name if I knew it along with place=neighborhood.


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Re: [OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

can you post some examples?


cheers,
Martin 

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[OSM-talk] place=hamlet in cities

[Kevin Broderick]

It seems like a previous import resulted in a lot of place=hamlet for
smaller localities that clearly don't meet the hamlet definition on the
wiki. Some are mobile home parks (trailer parks); others are housing
developments/apartment complexes, and I think there are probably some that
are more properly subdivisions, but all are parts of larger, populated
areas, not isolated, rural places with populations less than 200.

Does anyone see a problem with armchair-mapping these to
place:neighbourhood? I am not planning to do this in an automated fashion,
but instead to pick away at it while reviewing areas of interest to some of
my coworkers, who have noted that an appropriate rendering for an isolated
hamlet doesn't make a lot of sense in a more-populated area.

Thanks,
Kevin

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Kevin Broderick
k...@kevinbroderick.com
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