Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Peter Wendorff]

Hi.
While I think, that this kind of building number should go to the ref 
tag I agree, that it might often be tagged as name in osm and that the 
import therefore should be extra careful with it.


regards
Peter

Am 20.05.2012 19:12, schrieb Werner Hoch:

Hi,

Am Sonntag, den 20.05.2012, 19:46 +0300 schrieb Worst Fixer:


Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and
move "name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".


Maybe this is not the same.

Larger industrial plants or universities often have a single address but
multiple buildings.

In this case the name might be the building number.

Regards
Werner (werner2101)



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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Willi]

Worst Fixer [mailto:worstfi...@gmail.com] wrote at  Monday, May 21, 2012
2:31 AM
> This page also states it is only draft. It links to not existing examples
of Mechanical Edit pages.

> Existing pages do not follow this policy completely too (contact info
lacks, not in category Mechanical Edits).

> There are also some valid objections to this policy in talk page.

> Please discuss this policy on talk@ list before enforcing it. Remember you
need to get consensus.

 

When something isn't perfect (yet) this doesn't imply that it can be
disregarded completely and being replaced by one's own procedure. And an own
procedure needs consensus  too!

 

I can't resist to get the impression that he is what his chosen name says
the "worst fixer" I ever saw.

 

Willi

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Paul Norman]

You still have not provided the algorithm used to decide which objects are
changed how.

 

I have concerns that mechanical edits should only be undertaken by
experienced users and you are a 11 day user.

 

You may also want to review
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Automated_Edits_code_of_conduct

 

 

From: Worst Fixer [mailto:worstfi...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 12:31 PM
To: Paul Norman
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

 

Hello.

2012/5/20 Paul Norman 

The mechanical edit policy calls for a wiki page with the details of the
proposed upload, as well as contact info (i.e. main account).

 

Thanks. I created a wiki page on this:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edits/WorstFixer

 

I also updated overview to contain all tag changes being held:
http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/overview.html

  

Please provide documentation on all the points in
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanhttp://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-build
ing=levels/overview.htmlical_Edit_Policy#Document
<http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edit_Policy#Document> 

 

This page is out of sync with current OSMF practic. Please consider fixing.

 

It suggests that all discussion can be held in wiki.

 

DWG members point users only to mailing lists and require users to discuss
their edits on osm-hosted mailing lists only.

 

This page also states it is only draft. It links to not existing examples of
Mechanical Edit pages.

 

Existing pages do not follow this policy completely too (contact info lacks,
not in category Mechanical Edits).

 

There are also some valid objections to this policy in talk page.

 

Please discuss this policy on talk@ list before enforcing it. Remember you
need to get consensus.

 

-- 
WorstFixer, twitter: http://twitter.com/WorstFixer

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[sabas88]

Or post the algorithm :)
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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Thomas Davie]

On 20 May 2012, at 20:31, Worst Fixer wrote:

> Hello.
> 
> 2012/5/20 Paul Norman 
> The mechanical edit policy calls for a wiki page with the details of the 
> proposed upload, as well as contact info (i.e. main account).
> 
> 
> Thanks. I created a wiki page on this: 
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edits/WorstFixer

Thanks a lot – I can now actually see the documentation for this edit... 
However, there's still one major thing missing.  To make any sane decission we 
need a *concise* description of 1) What tags you're targetting 2) Why you think 
the current values are erroneous 3) What you are doing to fix the errors 4) Why 
you think this won't hit any valid data.

Please please please come back and give this simple short explanation.  I'm 
pretty sure you have good intentions at heart, but I can't tell what's going on 
until you give a description of what you're trying to do that doesn't involve 
101 tables with 0 explanation of what's in them.

Bob

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Vincent Pottier]

Le 20/05/2012 18:46, Worst Fixer a écrit :

Hello.

I ask you to review my planned mechanical edit.

There are 400+ ways tagged "building"="levels=N" in database.

I propose changing tags to building=yes; building:levels=N for these ways.

Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and 
move "name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".



Here are two different operations.
I hope they will not be treated together.

It's a good idea to improve quality of data in osm.
But to keep good quality, it is very important to see how the mistake came.

I think "building"="levels=N" mistake has few authors. Have you had 
contact with authors of the mistake? Have you asked them what they would 
meen putting such tag ?

--
FrViPofm

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Worst Fixer]

Hello.

2012/5/20 Paul Norman 

> The mechanical edit policy calls for a wiki page with the details of the
> proposed upload, as well as contact info (i.e. main account).
>

Thanks. I created a wiki page on this:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edits/WorstFixer

I also updated overview to contain all tag changes being held:
http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/overview.html


> Please provide documentation on all the points in
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanhttp://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/overview.htmlical_Edit_Policy#Document
>

This page is out of sync with current OSMF practic. Please consider fixing.

It suggests that all discussion can be held in wiki.

DWG members point users only to mailing lists and require users to discuss
their edits on osm-hosted mailing lists only.

This page also states it is only draft. It links to not existing examples
of Mechanical Edit pages.

Existing pages do not follow this policy completely too (contact info
lacks, not in category Mechanical Edits).

There are also some valid objections to this policy in talk page.

Please discuss this policy on talk@ list before enforcing it. Remember you
need to get consensus.

-- 
WorstFixer, twitter: http://twitter.com/WorstFixer
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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[John F. Eldredge]

Worst Fixer  wrote:

> Hello.
> 
> I ask you to review my planned mechanical edit.
> 
> There are 400+ ways tagged "building"="levels=N" in database.
> 
> I propose changing tags to building=yes; building:levels=N for these
> ways.
> 
> Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and
> move
> "name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".
> 
> Here is overview of affected objects:
> 
> http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/overview.html
> 
> Here is file with edits I plan to upload:
> 
> http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/edits-to-upload.osm.bz2
> 
> If no valid objections or improvement proposals are raised, I will
> upload
> this change file on 2012-05-27.
>
Have you reviewed all 400+ ways to make sure that all of the name= tags have 
addresses, rather than containing building names?

-- 
John F. Eldredge --  j...@jfeldredge.com
"Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better than not to 
think at all." -- Hypatia of Alexandria

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Paul Norman]

The mechanical edit policy calls for a wiki page with the details of the
proposed upload, as well as contact info (i.e. main account). 

 

Please provide documentation on all the points in
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Mechanical_Edit_Policy#Document

 

From: Worst Fixer [mailto:worstfi...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 9:47 AM
To: talk@openstreetmap.org
Subject: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

 

Hello.

 

I ask you to review my planned mechanical edit.

 

There are 400+ ways tagged "building"="levels=N" in database.

 

I propose changing tags to building=yes; building:levels=N for these ways.

 

Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and move
"name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".

 

Here is overview of affected objects:

 

http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/overview.html

 

Here is file with edits I plan to upload:

 

http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/edits-to-upload.osm.bz2

 

If no valid objections or improvement proposals are raised, I will upload
this change file on 2012-05-27.

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Werner Hoch]

Hi,

Am Sonntag, den 20.05.2012, 19:46 +0300 schrieb Worst Fixer:

> Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and
> move "name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".
> 
Maybe this is not the same.

Larger industrial plants or universities often have a single address but
multiple buildings.

In this case the name might be the building number.

Regards
Werner (werner2101)



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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Robert Whittaker (OSM)]

On 20 May 2012 17:46, Worst Fixer  wrote:
> There are 400+ ways tagged "building"="levels=N" in database.
>
> I propose changing tags to building=yes; building:levels=N for these ways.

This seems reasonable. But is there evidence (wiki page, taginfo
stats, etc) that this is the preferred way of tagging a building with
N levels? If so, it would be helpful if you were to provide details of
it in your post. This would save everyone evaluating the merits of
your proposal from having to look it up themselves.

> Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and move
> "name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".

I presume that N stands for a number here. If so, I can see the logic
in moving name=N to addr:housenumber=N where there is currently no
addr:housenumber key on the object. (Though again a link to the wiki
page describing the addressing tagging would be helpful.)

But I'm not so sure why you would want to remove an existing
addr:housenumber=? tag. Why would you presume in the event of a
conflict between a name=N and an addr:housenumber=? that the "N" is
the correct house number, while the "?" is worthless and should be
thrown away? I think that your rational here needs to be explained
further before you proceed, perhaps with some typical data to
illustrate the problem you're attempting to correct. (You can't expect
people to look through the .osm file to find this out.)

However, if I'm interpreting your summary/overview page correctly, the
number of objects that would have their addr:housenumber=? tag
removed, is very small. So why don't you just evaluate and edit these
manually before proceeding with any automated edits?

> http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/overview.html

Robert.

-- 
Robert Whittaker

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Toby Murray]

On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 11:50 AM, John Sturdy  wrote:
> On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 5:46 PM, Worst Fixer  wrote:
>
>> Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and move
>> "name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".
>
> I think that should be done only when the "name=N" is actually a number.

Yes... be particularly careful with this change. I would suggest
reviewing each object manually.

I don't have a problem with the building=levels=N change.

Also, there are two large unclosed ways that you are planning to
modify which shouldn't be building=yes at all. They appear to be a
fenced in area, not a building.

Toby

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[Cartinus]

Have you tried communicating with user Vostok90 about the data he
uploaded just a few days ago? Explained to him why you think it should
be different and asked him to fix it himself?

You talk about how demotivating it is how everybody reacts to what you
are doing. Now try to imagine how demotivating it is when you work on
something en someone else stomps over it a few days later without
telling why.

On 05/20/2012 06:46 PM, Worst Fixer wrote:
> Here is overview of affected objects:
> 
> http://worstfixer.000a.biz/03-building=levels/overview.html

---
m.v.g.,
Cartinus

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Re: [OSM-talk] Edit review: "building"="levels=N"

[John Sturdy]

On Sun, May 20, 2012 at 5:46 PM, Worst Fixer  wrote:

> Also I propose removal of "addr:housenumber=?" on these objects, and move
> "name=N" to "addr:housenumber=N".

I think that should be done only when the "name=N" is actually a number.

__John

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