Re: [talk-au] Bus, tram and train stop data license change

[Andrew Laughton]

Get Firefox if you have not already got it, then get the "Scrapbook"
add on, then copy the cached version to a local scrapbook, just in
case it changes again.
Might not make much difference, but every little bit helps.


On 4 March 2010 12:20, Alex Lum  wrote:
> Very disappointing... I was browsing the http://data.vic.gov.au
> website yesterday and noticed that Metlink and the Department of
> Transport  had released two datasets: the TransNET database of routes,
> stops and timetables, and a file of bus, tram and train stops. The
> TransNET file was under the DoT's restrictive license: only to be used
> for the 'App My State' competition, no commercial use, etc., however I
> was delighted to see that the stop information including very accurate
> lat/long coordinates was released under a CC - Attribution 2.5
> Australia license! I spent much of the day preparing to import it and
> producing a wiki page to document the process and data...
>
> However, I returned to the site
> (http://data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/bus-tram-and-train-stops/123) today
> to find the license has been changed to the restrictive TransNET
> license!
>
> Google still has the CC-A2.5 version cached:
> http://74.125.153.132/search?q=cache:ZFC_fGJMI4MJ:data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/bus-tram-and-train-stops/123+metlink+site:data.vic.gov.au&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=au
>
> Now according to the Creative Commons FAQ: "Creative Commons licenses
> are non-revocable. This means that you cannot stop someone, who has
> obtained your work under a Creative Commons license, from using the
> work according to that license."
>
> Any thoughts? I'm inclined not to proceed with importing or deriving
> from the data if it's likely to be an issue, even though it's probably
> on pretty safe ground given that the data actually was released under
> a CC license albeit for a ten day window, and I retrieved it under
> those terms and the Terms of Use of the website.
>
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> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
>

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[talk-au] Bus, tram and train stop data license change

[Alex Lum]

Very disappointing... I was browsing the http://data.vic.gov.au
website yesterday and noticed that Metlink and the Department of
Transport  had released two datasets: the TransNET database of routes,
stops and timetables, and a file of bus, tram and train stops. The
TransNET file was under the DoT's restrictive license: only to be used
for the 'App My State' competition, no commercial use, etc., however I
was delighted to see that the stop information including very accurate
lat/long coordinates was released under a CC - Attribution 2.5
Australia license! I spent much of the day preparing to import it and
producing a wiki page to document the process and data...

However, I returned to the site
(http://data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/bus-tram-and-train-stops/123) today
to find the license has been changed to the restrictive TransNET
license!

Google still has the CC-A2.5 version cached:
http://74.125.153.132/search?q=cache:ZFC_fGJMI4MJ:data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/bus-tram-and-train-stops/123+metlink+site:data.vic.gov.au&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=au

Now according to the Creative Commons FAQ: "Creative Commons licenses
are non-revocable. This means that you cannot stop someone, who has
obtained your work under a Creative Commons license, from using the
work according to that license."

Any thoughts? I'm inclined not to proceed with importing or deriving
from the data if it's likely to be an issue, even though it's probably
on pretty safe ground given that the data actually was released under
a CC license albeit for a ten day window, and I retrieved it under
those terms and the Terms of Use of the website.

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Re: [talk-au] Overland Track added

[Lachlan Rogers]

> Heh, I was wondering if that might happen. Anyway, I have a few gaps
> in it (mostly forgetting to turn the gps on after a break), so
> hopefully your trace will plug that. The biggest holes are around the
> waterfalls (after Du Cane Hut).

I think I have some decent traces from that area.  I was also
recording my GPS trace for geotagging photos.  I got right down to the
bottom of the D'Alton falls - but the canyon was so steep that I was
unable to lock onto any satellites from the bottom!

I'll try to add my traces to the map soon.

- Lachlan

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[talk-au] SA boating hazards data

[John Smith]

I've converted the boating hazards data set into OSM format, email me
if you want a copy:

http://data.australia.gov.au/33

Although I wasn't sure how to tag these, nothing useful came up
searching, so I used marine=hazard

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[talk-au] Victorian courts and libraries

[John Smith]

I have converted these from CSV to OSM, email me for a copy.

http://data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/court-locations/87

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[talk-au] SA Boat Ramps

[John Smith]

I finally converted the xml file from http://data.australia.gov.au/99
into OSM format, just email me if you want a copy.

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Re: [talk-au] answers to difficult questions

[John Smith]

On 3 March 2010 20:42, Ian Callahan  wrote:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Mile_Island_accident

>From what I remember, this was very similar but due to better safety
design it didn't containment an area the size of Europe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Nuclear_Events_Scale

The 2nd worst incident was also in the former soviet union.

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Re: [talk-au] CC-BY-A data released for Victoria

[John Smith]

On 3 March 2010 19:25, Liz  wrote:
> The data isn't John's, so I wouldn't call it 'protective' but 'cautious'.
> IF the list discusses the ins and outs and decides for importing that is fine
> - but this time JS has decided to wait for the list to talk about it.

And it's not like someone else suitably skilled can't just convert it
and import it anyway.

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Re: [talk-au] answers to difficult questions

[Liz]

On Wed, 3 Mar 2010, Ian Callahan wrote:
> John Smith  wrote:
> > >  options as well, the only major nuclear accident was due to Russian
> > >  [management]
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Mile_Island_accident
> 
> 

the japanese have had a go as well


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Re: [talk-au] answers to difficult questions

[Ian Callahan]

John Smith  wrote:

> >  options as well, the only major nuclear accident was due to Russian
> >  [management]
>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Mile_Island_accident




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[talk-au] Fwd: A.Word.A.Day--potlatch

[Jim Croft]

always wondered what a potlatch was...

jim

-- Forwarded message --
From: Wordsmith 
Date: Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 6:11 PM
Subject: A.Word.A.Day--potlatch
To: jim.cr...@gmail.com


* Wordsmith.org*The Magic of Words
 Mar 3, 2010
*This week's theme*
Words borrowed from various languages

*This week's words*
goulash 
cabal 
potlatch 

Potlatch
 [image: potlatch] 
(Artist: James Gilchrist Swan)
--
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 potlatch

PRONUNCIATION:
(POT-lach) 

MEANING:
*noun:*
1. A party or get-together.
2. A ceremonial festival among American Indians of the Pacific Northwest
involving feasts, lavish gift giving, dances, etc.

ETYMOLOGY:
>From Chinook Jargon, from Nootka patshatl (to give, gift).

USAGE:
"'[The youth ambassadors] were coming to the biggest potlatch in the world,
sharing and developing a sense of pride in who they are,' Diane Strand
says."
Shelley Fralic; World's Biggest Potlatch Changing Attitudes; Vancouver Sun
(Canada); Feb 24, 2010.

Explore "potlatch " in the Visual
Thesaurus.

A THOUGHT FOR TODAY:
Twin Mystery. To many people artists seem / undisciplined and lawless. /
Such laziness, with such great gifts, / seems little short of crime. / One
mystery is how they make / the things they make so flawless; / another, what
they're doing with / their energy and time. -Piet Hein, poet and scientist
(1905-1996)

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Jim Croft ~ jim.cr...@gmail.com ~ +61-2-62509499 ~
http://www.google.com/profiles/jim.croft
'A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of
doubtful sanity.'
- Robert Frost, poet (1874-1963)
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Re: [talk-au] CC-BY-A data released for Victoria

[Liz]

On Wed, 3 Mar 2010, Roy Wallace wrote:
> Another possibility (that I much prefer) is that the available data
> is used in the same was as, say, aerial imagery - i.e. not bulk
> imported, but used directly and interactively by mappers. This is why
> I think John is wrong to be "protective" of data that could be useful
> - I see it as analogous to being "protective" of, say, aerial imagery.
> 
The data isn't John's, so I wouldn't call it 'protective' but 'cautious'.
IF the list discusses the ins and outs and decides for importing that is fine 
- but this time JS has decided to wait for the list to talk about it.

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Re: [talk-au] Overland Track added

[Liz]

On Wed, 3 Mar 2010, John Henderson wrote:
> > My old man's a surveyor so I've played chainman plenty of times too.
> > These days it's less about the chain and more about carrying the prism
> > to the benchmark and to each spot. You don't expect the surveyor to do
> > the walking, do you?
> 
> It was a surveyor I met in the field recently who told me that the 
> chainman job had been abolished.
> 
> I didn't ask her how she cuts down the trees that are in the way.
> 
It's called fieldhand now. As a fieldhand my son has bogged the ute
sorry as a fieldhand he has dug all the holes with a crowbar and hammered in 
the pegs.
Someone still has to do the hard work
He is now qualified but still looking for a job.
He talks about mm accuracy, not a few centimetres.
(Of course, in the 19th century, there were some very famous surveying 
mistakes)

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