Re: [Talk-GB] Importing Website Data

2017-12-19 Thread Ian Caldwell 
On 19 December 2017 at 15:20, Tom Hughes  wrote:

>
>
> The fundamental problem of imports that conflate with existing data is
> that you have way of knowing whether or not you are actually improving
> anything - you are making an assumption that an "official" source will be
> up to date and accurate but in the real world they are often anything but.
>
>
I don't think anybody is suggesting taking imports with out some form of
checking/validation first.  Tools that validate imports are a good idea.

The question should be "does it make the OSM database better".
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Re: [Talk-GB] Importing Website Data

2017-12-19 Thread Tom Hughes 

On 19/12/17 14:46, Brian Prangle wrote:

For those who decry the approach of using third party data, preferring 
instead the personally surveyed approach, I echo Ilya's and Warin's 
sentiments: Lloyds TSB demerged in 2013 and we still have 200 instances 
of Lloyds TSB, TA Centres became Army Reserve Centres at about the same 
time  and we  still have about 40 instances of TA Centre, Shell 
purchased Total filling stations in 2012, and during the recent 
validation exercise on Shell data, name=Total was the commonest error. 
What about the the wholesale closure and transfer  of Post Offices or 
the planned closure of thousands of BT phone boxes?  We don't have the 
number of motivated mappers to do this,  and expecting evrything to be 
ground surveyed might be a reason why we have such a high attrition 
rate; so we should emulate the rest of society and use automated IT 
methods to assist us and make our lives easier where appropriate. OSM is 
a balance between IT  imported data/automated edits and human ground 
surveys.


Which is exactly what everybody said about OSM when it started - that it 
couldn't possibly work and there'd never be enough people.


Pretty sure we proved them wrong.

The fundamental problem of imports that conflate with existing data is 
that you have way of knowing whether or not you are actually improving 
anything - you are making an assumption that an "official" source will 
be up to date and accurate but in the real world they are often anything 
but.


Tom

--
Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu)
http://compton.nu/

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Re: [Talk-GB] Importing Website Data

2017-12-19 Thread Brian Prangle 
Paul thank you for suggesting this, it's certainly something as a UK
community (and I guess more widely)we need to deal with. Unfortunately
website data can be problematic, as others have already indicated, for us
to use, but instead we should ask the organisations concerned to provide
the data in a compatible format. Now that we have a formal body
incorporated as the UK Local Chapter that should be a good vehicle for
making the requests. Do you have an suggestions for a priority list? Does
anyone else have any priorities?

For those who decry the approach of using third party data, preferring
instead the personally surveyed approach, I echo Ilya's and Warin's
sentiments: Lloyds TSB demerged in 2013 and we still have 200 instances of
Lloyds TSB, TA Centres became Army Reserve Centres at about the same time
and we  still have about 40 instances of TA Centre, Shell purchased Total
filling stations in 2012, and during the recent validation exercise on
Shell data, name=Total was the commonest error. What about the the
wholesale closure and transfer  of Post Offices or the planned closure of
thousands of BT phone boxes?  We don't have the number of motivated mappers
to do this,  and expecting evrything to be ground surveyed might be a
reason why we have such a high attrition rate; so we should emulate the
rest of society and use automated IT methods to assist us and make our
lives easier where appropriate. OSM is a balance between IT  imported
data/automated edits and human ground surveys.

Regards

Brian



On 18 December 2017 at 13:15,  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Reading all the talk of Walmart and Shell imports recently got me to
> wondering why we can't be doing more of this kind of thing.
>
> If store data can be pulled from directly from a company's public facing
> website ('store finder' page) is there any reason we can't do such imports
> without discussion with/permission from the company concerned?
>
> Paul
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap

2017-12-19 Thread Steven Abrams (Brook Street) 
Thanks very much. That is awesome.
Steven

-Original Message-
From: Ilya Zverev [mailto:i...@zverev.info] 
Sent: 19 December 2017 12:21
To: Steven Abrams (Brook Street) 
Cc: Paul Berry ; Talk GB 
Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap

https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fopenptmap.org%2F&data=02%7C01%7Ca-steva%40microsoft.com%7Ccc5b2a242c2646e11f4808d546db026c%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C1%7C636492828812634631&sdata=BEvl%2FCvUgB6f93rIBy5fGf9hTnMAnsLGIhZi%2B9xRH3Y%3D&reserved=0

Ilya

> 19 дек. 2017 г., в 13:23, Steven Abrams (Brook Street) 
>  написал(а):
> 
> Is there a similar map for bus routes and trams around the world?
>  
> From: Paul Berry [mailto:pmberry2...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: 18 December 2017 17:55
> To: Talk GB 
> Subject: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap
>  
> A nice little social media boost courtesy of Tim Dunn:
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FMrTimDunn%2Fstatus%2F942751174922555393&data=02%7C01%7Ca-steva%40microsoft.com%7Ccc5b2a242c2646e11f4808d546db026c%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C1%7C636492828812634631&sdata=XbqwbQBCDIXaiZYvqpGnjEH2tvsPYv9XD4ct2uQs%2FUs%3D&reserved=0
>  
> There's an Open Railway Map of the world and the level of detail is 
> incredible 
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.openrailwaymap.org%2F&data=02%7C01%7Ca-steva%40microsoft.com%7Ccc5b2a242c2646e11f4808d546db026c%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C1%7C636492828812634631&sdata=sNP1l2Xji2FYLHD82hIT8bZ3%2F9njJME1HvmEwbeLnTA%3D&reserved=0
>  
>  
> Regards,
> Paul
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Re: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap

2017-12-19 Thread Ilya Zverev 
http://openptmap.org/

Ilya

> 19 дек. 2017 г., в 13:23, Steven Abrams (Brook Street) 
>  написал(а):
> 
> Is there a similar map for bus routes and trams around the world?
>  
> From: Paul Berry [mailto:pmberry2...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: 18 December 2017 17:55
> To: Talk GB 
> Subject: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap
>  
> A nice little social media boost courtesy of Tim Dunn:
> https://twitter.com/MrTimDunn/status/942751174922555393
>  
> There's an Open Railway Map of the world and the level of detail is 
> incredible http://www.openrailwaymap.org/ 
>  
> Regards,
> Paul
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Re: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap

2017-12-19 Thread David Woolley 

On 19/12/17 10:23, Steven Abrams (Brook Street) wrote:


https://twitter.com/MrTimDunn/status/942751174922555393

[Talk-GB] Nottingham Pub Meeting tonight Lincs Poacher

2017-12-19 Thread SK53 
Usual time, usual venue:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nottingham/Pub_Meetup

Jerry
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Re: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap

2017-12-19 Thread Steven Abrams (Brook Street) 
Is there a similar map for bus routes and trams around the world?

From: Paul Berry [mailto:pmberry2...@gmail.com]
Sent: 18 December 2017 17:55
To: Talk GB 
Subject: [Talk-GB] OpenRailwayMap

A nice little social media boost courtesy of Tim Dunn:
https://twitter.com/MrTimDunn/status/942751174922555393

There's an Open Railway Map of the world and the level of detail is incredible 
http://www.openrailwaymap.org/ 


Regards,
Paul
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