Re: [Talk-GB] OSNI Open Data

[Colin Smale]

That sounds like great news, Owen. Thanks for your help!

Colin 

On 2019-08-21 15:10, Owen Boswarva wrote:

> OSNI have said in a Twitter discussion today that they will remove the link 
> to the LPS licence, to make it clear that normal OGL terms apply to this 
> data: 
> 
> https://twitter.com/owenboswarva/status/1164159795622043648 
> 
> If you source the NI administrative boundaries from the Open Data NI site 
> (instead of the OSNI site) it already says the plain OGL applies, e.g. 
> https://www.opendatani.gov.uk/dataset/osni-open-data-largescale-boundaries-county-boundaries1
>  
> 
> Owen 
> 
> On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 21:16, SK53  wrote: 
> 
> This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM 
> local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI). 
> 
> However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet) 
> compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open 
> Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was 
> certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open. 
> Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point 
> data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit [1] of street was 
> being questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed). 
> 
> It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI. 
> However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which would 
> be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick boundary 
> 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh district  
> (on umap here [2]) which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will 
> townland and other boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in. 
> 
> At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie [3] had a number of overlay layers sourced 
> from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the server 
> move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back in 2015. 
> 
> Jerry 
> 
> On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale  wrote: 
> 
> Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI make 
> available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way as the 
> OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, e.g. 
> http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2
>  
> 
> The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.Land & Property 
> Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland(R) 
> (OSNI(R)) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the 
> current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets - which include raster 
> and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland products 
> - are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with the OGL 
> symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the data; adapt 
> the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by sub-licensing it, 
> combining it with other data, or including it in your own product or 
> application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in any way and 
> for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the copyright and the 
> source of the data by including the following attribution statement: Contains 
> LPS Intellectual Property (c) Crown copyright and database right (year)  This 
> information is
licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence 
(http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You 
must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of 
the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the 
same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses 
you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or 
its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been 
released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence 
fee will be applied." 
> 
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb 
> ___
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> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
 

Links:
--
[1] https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/392283077
[2]
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/fermanagh-road-signs_290510#9/54.3614/-7.5142
[3] http://maps.openstreetmap.ie___
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Re: [Talk-GB] OSNI Open Data

[Owen Boswarva]

OSNI have said in a Twitter discussion today that they will remove the link
to the LPS licence, to make it clear that normal OGL terms apply to this
data:

https://twitter.com/owenboswarva/status/1164159795622043648

If you source the NI administrative boundaries from the Open Data NI site
(instead of the OSNI site) it already says the plain OGL applies, e.g.
https://www.opendatani.gov.uk/dataset/osni-open-data-largescale-boundaries-county-boundaries1

Owen

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 21:16, SK53  wrote:

This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM
> local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).
>
> However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet)
> compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open
> Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was
> certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open.
> Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point
> data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit
>  of street was being
> questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).
>
> It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI.
> However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which
> would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick
> boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh
> district  (on umap here
> )
> which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other
> boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.
>
> At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced
> from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the
> server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back
> in 2015.
>
> Jerry
>
> On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale  wrote:
>
>> Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI
>> make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way
>> as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries,
>> e.g.
>> http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2
>>
>> The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.Land &
>> Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern
>> Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms
>> of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which
>> include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and
>> townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly
>> marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and
>> transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially,
>> whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it
>> in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS
>> datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge
>> the copyright and the source of the data by including the following
>> attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright
>> and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of
>> the Open Government Licence (
>> http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3).
>> You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any
>> sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further
>> sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that
>> suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not
>> misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not
>> expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence
>> from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing list
>> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>>
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
___
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Re: [Talk-GB] OSNI Open Data

[Jez Nicholson]

Just for the record: NI has the unusual distinction in OSM of coming under
the UK and for practical reasons also being discussed under IE.

- Jez

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019, 21:25 Colin Smale,  wrote:

> Thanks Jerry, I had forgotten that NI comes under Ireland ;-)
>
> I will have a browse through the talk-ie archives and see if I can pick it
> up there.
>
> Colin
>
>
>
> On 2019-08-20 22:15, SK53 wrote:
>
> This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM
> local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).
>
> However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet)
> compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open
> Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was
> certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open.
> Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point
> data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit
>  of street was being
> questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).
>
> It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI.
> However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which
> would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick
> boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh
> district  (on umap here
> )
> which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other
> boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.
>
> At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced
> from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the
> server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back
> in 2015.
>
> Jerry
>
> On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale  wrote:
>
>> Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI
>> make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way
>> as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries,
>> e.g.
>> http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2
>>
>> The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.Land &
>> Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern
>> Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms
>> of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which
>> include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and
>> townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly
>> marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and
>> transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially,
>> whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it
>> in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS
>> datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge
>> the copyright and the source of the data by including the following
>> attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright
>> and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of
>> the Open Government Licence (
>> http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3).
>> You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any
>> sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further
>> sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that
>> suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not
>> misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not
>> expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence
>> from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing list
>> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
___
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Re: [Talk-GB] OSNI Open Data

[Colin Smale]

Thanks Jerry, I had forgotten that NI comes under Ireland ;-) 

I will have a browse through the talk-ie archives and see if I can pick
it up there. 

Colin

On 2019-08-20 22:15, SK53 wrote:

> This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM 
> local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI). 
> 
> However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet) 
> compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open 
> Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was 
> certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open. 
> Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point 
> data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit [1] of street was 
> being questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed). 
> 
> It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI. 
> However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which would 
> be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick boundary 
> 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh district  
> (on umap here [2]) which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will 
> townland and other boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in. 
> 
> At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie [3] had a number of overlay layers sourced 
> from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the server 
> move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back in 2015. 
> 
> Jerry 
> 
> On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale  wrote: 
> 
>> Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI 
>> make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way 
>> as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries, 
>> e.g. 
>> http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2
>>  
>> 
>> The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.Land & Property 
>> Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern Ireland(R) 
>> (OSNI(R)) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms of the 
>> current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets - which include raster 
>> and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and townland 
>> products - are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly marked with 
>> the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and transmit the 
>> data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially, whether by 
>> sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it in your own 
>> product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS datasets in 
>> any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge the 
>> copyright and the source of the data by including the following attribution 
>> statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property (c) Crown copyright and 
>> database right (year)  This information is
licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence 
(http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3). You 
must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any sub-licences of 
the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further sub-licences do the 
same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that suggests LPS endorses 
you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not misrepresent the data or 
its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not expressly state that it has been 
released under OGL will require a licence from LPS and the appropriate licence 
fee will be applied." 
>> 
>> ___
>> Talk-GB mailing list
>> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
 

Links:
--
[1] https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/392283077
[2]
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/fermanagh-road-signs_290510#9/54.3614/-7.5142
[3] http://maps.openstreetmap.ie___
Talk-GB mailing list
Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
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Re: [Talk-GB] OSNI Open Data

[SK53]

This query would actually be better directed at talk-ie as the Irish OSM
local chapter have been having discussions with OSNI (and OSI).

However, I think it's safe to say that the relevant licence is not (yet)
compatible with OSM: I did briefly discuss this point with one of the Open
Data NI people who organised OpenData Camp #5 in Belfast, and she was
certainly of the view that OSNI data (or any LPS data) was not very open.
Many of these datasets would be very useful, for instance there is a point
data set of streetnames (e.g., when the name of this bit
 of street was being
questioned, or just to do streetnames which are perhaps 10% completed).

It is for this reason why there are no local authority boundaries in NI.
However, at some point I used FHRS data to produce concave hulls which
would be a first approximation (and no worse than things like the Limerick
boundary 3-4 years ago). Also KDDA has some open data for the old Fermanagh
district  (on umap here
)
which may assist in working out the boundaries (as will townland and other
boundaries). But do check with talk-ie before leaping in.

At one point maps.openstreetmap.ie had a number of overlay layers sourced
from the OSI/OSNI data, but I think these never got restored after the
server move. I used OSNI townland boundaries to compare with OSM ones back
in 2015.

Jerry

On Tue, 20 Aug 2019 at 18:42, Colin Smale  wrote:

> Has anyone investigated if the data covering Northern Ireland which OSNI
> make available under OGL V3, is licence-compatible with OSM in the same way
> as the OSGB open data? I am particularly interested in admin boundaries,
> e.g.
> http://osni-spatial-ni.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/a55726475f1b460c927d1816ffde6c72_2
>
> The website says: "Open Government Data Licence applies.Land &
> Property Services (LPS) has made a number of Ordnance Survey of Northern
> Ireland® (OSNI®) branded datasets available free of charge under the terms
> of the current Open Government Licence (OGL). These datasets – which
> include raster and vector mapping, boundary, gazetteer, height, street and
> townland products – are available for download.  Each dataset is clearly
> marked with the OGL symbol. The OGL allows you to: copy, distribute and
> transmit the data; adapt the data; and exploit the data commercially,
> whether by sub-licensing it, combining it with other data, or including it
> in your own product or application. You are therefore able to use the LPS
> datasets in any way and for any purpose. We simply ask that you acknowledge
> the copyright and the source of the data by including the following
> attribution statement: Contains LPS Intellectual Property © Crown copyright
> and database right (year)  This information is licensed under the terms of
> the Open Government Licence (
> http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/doc/open-government-licence/version/3).
> You must also: include the same acknowledgement requirement in any
> sub-licences of the data that you grant, and a requirement that any further
> sub-licences do the same; ensure that you do not use the data in a way that
> suggests LPS endorses you or your use of the data; and make sure you do not
> misrepresent the data or its source. N.B. Any dataset that does not
> expressly state that it has been released under OGL will require a licence
> from LPS and the appropriate licence fee will be applied."
>
>
>
> ___
> Talk-GB mailing list
> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
>
___
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