Re: [Talk-it-southtyrol] Hiking relations and mapping suggestions
Dear colleagues, Yes, it is like Martin says. We have already set up a new interadministrative geoportal named "Geoportal Südtirol" or "Geoportale Alto Adige" which is in a first moment able to deliver ca. 180 data sets coming from the Landesverwaltung, the Municipality of Bolzano and Eurac research. The participation of other southtyrolean administrations is planned. It offers an interactive download of the data (at this time vector and raster and in future point clouds too) in different formats and coordinate systems. Of course it exposes all the classical OGC services too, but with much more layers as before. The user will search and find the desired geodata through metadata which was revised in order to permit simple searches and a more understandable metadata look up. The data search, preview and download is performed by the catalog component of the geoportal. In the geoportal you will find also information about the services offered, the open data strategy adopted and much more. It was developed upon a large open source basis, it is widely open data oriented and has the target to be the central access point to southtirolean government geodata. As I say the geoportal is ready, but unfortunately we are still waiting the accompanying official statement of the Landesregierung. We are hopeful, that this statement - it will be a resolution - will be adopted soon. Best Regards Ivo Planötscher p.s.: routes for trekking, bike and MTB are offered by the geoportal as vector data and OGC service. IT GIS Competence Center Via Siemens – Str. 29 Tel. 0471 566180 Fax 0471 414819 -Original Message- From: Martin Raifer [mailto:tyr@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2014 8:21 PM To: Yuri D'Elia Cc: OSM talk-it-southtyrol; Planötscher, Ivo; Patrick Ohnewein Subject: Re: [Talk-it-southtyrol] Hiking relations and mapping suggestions On Fri, Dec 26, 2014 at 7:05 PM, Yuri D'Elia wrote: >> Did you know that we are allowed to use the maps from the provincial >> government [6] for mapping? There is a rather nice topografical map >> called "TOPOMAP" which shows the hiking routes. This has been a good >> help when I've mapped the hiking routes in Eppan. > > I didn't know. Very helpful. There's also a TRAILS_APB-PAB layer which > can be switched in png+alpha mode. > > Do we have also access to the raw/vectorial data? No, at least not yet. I'm probably not 100% up to date, but my latest info is that the province (who possesses the trails data) wants to release most of its geodata as open data (see [3]) in principle. However, some final decision still need to be taken, which takes its time. (I've cc-ed some people who should be better informed than me to this email.) > Especially in the woods, it looks like it's a higher resolution trace > than consumer-grade GPS receivers, though in some places I still > notice the typical star effect. Any idea on how it was acquired? If I remember correctly they had some kind of custom designed backpack containing specialized tracking hardware with large GPS antennas. I found some info about the "Wegeprojekt" online: [1] There is also a detailed report of the project [2] including some very interesting stats (chapter 6): Apparently, there are almost 4.000 hiking routes (3500 km total, 55%/25%/10% on paths/tracks/roads) in South Tyrol operated by 160 different organizations (mostly various local AVS and "Tourismusverein" - 40% and 30% respectively). At a quick glance, in OSM there are currently "only" about 640 hiking routes in South Tyrol, so there is still quite some work to do for us ;) Martin [1] http://www.trekking.suedtirol.info/index.php?perssite=539 [2] http://www.alpenverein.it/files/content/138946_16357_1_0/wegeabschluss.pdf [3] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/images/4/4e/Tagesordnungspunkt-CC0_Landesregierung-06-05-2013.pdf ___ Talk-it-southtyrol mailing list Talk-it-southtyrol@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it-southtyrol
Re: [Talk-it-southtyrol] Hiking relations and mapping suggestions
On Fri, Dec 26, 2014 at 7:05 PM, Yuri D'Elia wrote: >> Did you know that we are allowed to use the maps from the provincial >> government [6] for mapping? There is a rather nice topografical map >> called "TOPOMAP" which shows the hiking routes. This has been a good >> help when I've mapped the hiking routes in Eppan. > > I didn't know. Very helpful. There's also a TRAILS_APB-PAB layer which > can be switched in png+alpha mode. > > Do we have also access to the raw/vectorial data? No, at least not yet. I'm probably not 100% up to date, but my latest info is that the province (who possesses the trails data) wants to release most of its geodata as open data (see [3]) in principle. However, some final decision still need to be taken, which takes its time. (I've cc-ed some people who should be better informed than me to this email.) > Especially in the woods, it looks like it's a higher resolution trace > than consumer-grade GPS receivers, though in some places I still notice > the typical star effect. Any idea on how it was acquired? If I remember correctly they had some kind of custom designed backpack containing specialized tracking hardware with large GPS antennas. I found some info about the "Wegeprojekt" online: [1] There is also a detailed report of the project [2] including some very interesting stats (chapter 6): Apparently, there are almost 4.000 hiking routes (3500 km total, 55%/25%/10% on paths/tracks/roads) in South Tyrol operated by 160 different organizations (mostly various local AVS and "Tourismusverein" - 40% and 30% respectively). At a quick glance, in OSM there are currently "only" about 640 hiking routes in South Tyrol, so there is still quite some work to do for us ;) Martin [1] http://www.trekking.suedtirol.info/index.php?perssite=539 [2] http://www.alpenverein.it/files/content/138946_16357_1_0/wegeabschluss.pdf [3] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/images/4/4e/Tagesordnungspunkt-CC0_Landesregierung-06-05-2013.pdf ___ Talk-it-southtyrol mailing list Talk-it-southtyrol@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it-southtyrol
Re: [Talk-it-southtyrol] Hiking relations and mapping suggestions
On 12/23/2014 10:53 AM, Martin Raifer wrote: > We could also think about creating a wiki-page for the hiking routes > in South Tyrol to keep track of partially finished mapping of hiking > routes—just like our colleagues from Trentino did: [5] This would be very nice to have! Any takers to start a page? > Did you know that we are allowed to use the maps from the provincial > government [6] for mapping? There is a rather nice topografical map > called "TOPOMAP" which shows the hiking routes. This has been a good > help when I've mapped the hiking routes in Eppan. I didn't know. Very helpful. There's also a TRAILS_APB-PAB layer which can be switched in png+alpha mode. Do we have also access to the raw/vectorial data? Especially in the woods, it looks like it's a higher resolution trace than consumer-grade GPS receivers, though in some places I still notice the typical star effect. Any idea on how it was acquired? In several places though it suffers from the same issue as many other maps I've used. While major routes are very nicely mapped, many smaller ones often are not updated. In the area around 46.5540499 11.3981239 (just a random example) the trail now coasts the entire property (which is not accessible to the public right now - and I doubt it ever was in the past). Not to mention, in the same place, that many hiking ways overlap. 32A/A share the same way in this spot and down to Vanga. In Vanga itself, the panel has both markings. Sometimes it also looks like they follow nearby tracks instead of following the actual trail (something I've also noticed in other commercial maps). > For inspecting hiking routes I've often used the following page: [7], > which lets you select individual route relations quite easily. The link I've provided uses the same layer. I also use waymarkedtrails to inspect the data. ___ Talk-it-southtyrol mailing list Talk-it-southtyrol@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it-southtyrol
Re: [Talk-it-southtyrol] Hiking relations and mapping suggestions
Hey Yuri, nice work! I guess you could upload your georeferenced photos to mapillary[0]. Mapillary explicitly allows its images to be used for OpenStreetMap [1] and the service is directly integrated in the iD editor [2] (for JOSM there seems to exist a workaround: [3]). Manually uploading pictures instead of using their smartphone app should also be possible [4]. We could also think about creating a wiki-page for the hiking routes in South Tyrol to keep track of partially finished mapping of hiking routes—just like our colleagues from Trentino did: [5] Did you know that we are allowed to use the maps from the provincial government [6] for mapping? There is a rather nice topografical map called "TOPOMAP" which shows the hiking routes. This has been a good help when I've mapped the hiking routes in Eppan. For inspecting hiking routes I've often used the following page: [7], which lets you select individual route relations quite easily. Martin [0] http://www.mapillary.com/map/im/RYWRD2SGaUs4q-qwaYofOg [1] http://www.mapillary.com/osm.html [2] http://blog.mapillary.com/update/2014/10/21/iD-and-mapillary.html [3] http://osm.lyrk.de/mapillary2JOSM/ - http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/ubahnverleih/diary/21485 [4] http://blog.mapillary.com/update/2014/02/21/manual-upload.html [5] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Trentino/Sentieri [6] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/AltoAdige_-_S%C3%BCdtirol#Provincia_Autonoma_di_Bolzano_-_Autonome_Provinz_Bozen [7] http://hiking.waymarkedtrails.org/en/?zoom=15&lat=46.56744&lon=11.41277#routes On Sun, Dec 21, 2014 at 10:53 PM, Yuri D'Elia wrote: > On 12/21/2014 08:30 PM, Yuri D'Elia wrote: >> I was able to map all the hiking relations starting from Oberinn/Wangen: >> >> http://map.gegg.us/?zoom=12&lat=46.49848&lon=11.3355&layers=BFFTTFF > > Real position: > > http://map.gegg.us/?zoom=15&lat=46.56744&lon=11.41277&layers=F0B000FFFTFFFT > > > ___ > Talk-it-southtyrol mailing list > Talk-it-southtyrol@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it-southtyrol ___ Talk-it-southtyrol mailing list Talk-it-southtyrol@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it-southtyrol
Re: [Talk-it-southtyrol] Hiking relations and mapping suggestions
On 12/21/2014 08:30 PM, Yuri D'Elia wrote: > I was able to map all the hiking relations starting from Oberinn/Wangen: > > http://map.gegg.us/?zoom=12&lat=46.49848&lon=11.3355&layers=BFFTTFF Real position: http://map.gegg.us/?zoom=15&lat=46.56744&lon=11.41277&layers=F0B000FFFTFFFT ___ Talk-it-southtyrol mailing list Talk-it-southtyrol@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it-southtyrol
[Talk-it-southtyrol] Hiking relations and mapping suggestions
[since the last conversation switched to english, I'll start directly with it] This is a rather practical question about keeping details/data to map hiking relations. I'd like to know how others are doing it and see if there's a better way. I was able to map all the hiking relations starting from Oberinn/Wangen: http://map.gegg.us/?zoom=12&lat=46.49848&lon=11.3355&layers=BFFTTFF this includes also many other partial relations from Oberinn towards Tann/Klobenstein/Oberbozen/... of which I still don't have enough knowledge to verify the entire relation. Whenever I pass in front of a hiking guidepost and/or a relevant detail of the hiking trail I take a geotagged photo. So far, I have more than 250 photos of the area (~100 guideposts), including countless gps tracks. Whenever I can see (from the previous guideposts photos) that I have the entire hiking path (verified from start to finish) I add the hiking relation and complete it. I've also started to add partial relations for guideposts I've passed-by, since I realized it's easier for others to see where the hiking paths are going through. In this case I mark the relation with a fixme, and I also started to mark with a fixme the last known node of the relation. Unfortunately, without the photos themselves, it's sometimes still hard, for somebody else, to understand where exactly a path ends. I've also uploaded several gps tracks, though I found later that without photos they are also mostly useless due to the poor resolution of the gps, and also due to the massive editing required for a meaningful track (I've taken the habit to just cut-through the woods/terrain to go towards the regions I'm mapping). That being said, I upload them if I followed a known path from start to finish. At this point I'm wondering if there's something we can do to upload these geotagged photos somewhere. They are incredibly useful for those that are willing to complete the hiking relations. Not to mention that it's also countless hours of actual hiking involved... Ideas? ___ Talk-it-southtyrol mailing list Talk-it-southtyrol@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it-southtyrol
