Re: [talk-ph] intro to Kaart initiative in PH

[Erwin Olario]

Glen, thank you for sharing.

Road surface types, and lanes, is one of the attributes we hope to collect
and add into the the OSM database. The challenge of "how" to collect these,
is another matter altogether. We have limited street-level imagery (and
that's one way of doing that), and in many urban areas, users can use
aerial imagery to distinguish paved and unpaved roads.

/Erwin



On Wed, Jan 17, 2018 at 7:13 PM Glen Scott  wrote:

> Nothing to offer by my own personal experiences
>
> I'm a regular user of GPS for navigation at home (Australia) in urban and
> country environments.  I've noted in OSM (Philippines - specifically N-W
> Pangasinan) two things that are undefined in 99% of roads, but used by the
> routing engine - road surface and speed limit. With 99% of roads undefined
> for surface and speed limit the route chosen by the GPS will be a lottery
> as far as driving experience goes.  I guess the most critical would be the
> ability to chose to avoid unpaved roads?  I've had a number of Garmin GPSs
> and they always assume 80 km/h where the map has no defined limit.  Maybe
> 10+ years ago I had some experiences where the GPS would attempt to take me
> on "short-cuts" over long-unused dirt tracks (in preference to the
> highway!).  I guess this is the potential result of not defining the
> surface at the very least.  Hard to tell the speed limit from satellite
> imagery!
>
> In the urban environment the most common and frustrating errors (Garmin
> maps) would be undefined one-way streets.
>
> My one attempt to navigate in the Philippines on OSM (~2008-2009) led me
> into a military camp and some interested military personnel who directed me
> back out the way I came in!  Gates are important but no always so easy to
> see from space
>
> Cheers
> Glen
>
> On Wed, Jan 17, 2018 at 5:40 PM, Erwin Olario  wrote:
>
>>
>> Thank you for bringing this up, Maning. This is also a concern I've
>> discussed with other mappers in the past, and this doesn't just apply to
>> road navigation, but with other features, as well.
>>
>> The Mapbox data team is a pioneer in this road network initiatives in
>> OSM, and we look up to your team for inspiration. 
>>
>> Our current (in the next few months) interest in PH road network
>> improvement are low-hanging fruits (missing geometries, restrictions,
>> turning lanes, etc), but in due time, we'd like to explore how to further
>> improve road network data from OSM for naviation, etc. PH is only one of
>> the many countries we're working in, so we need a more inclusive
>> understanding of tagging nuances, too.
>>
>> I hope such a discussion can  attract more inputs from the wider
>> community, especially those who've been lurking in the background, who
>> follows the exchanges here, but for reasons known only to them, doesn't
>> engage publicly.
>>
>> /Erwin
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 8:35 PM maning sambale <
>> emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Erwin,
>>>
>>> Thanks for leading this work.  As many of you know, I work in Mapbox
>>> and my primary focus is to make OSM navigable.
>>> I wonder what would be the best approach in the context of driving in
>>> the Philippines.
>>> Would love to share notes and approaches.  One thing I have in mind (I
>>> shared this during the meetup), while every country
>>> has specific nuances tagging, there is a danger of making the tags too
>>> specific as its difficult to create routing engines for each country.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 11:58 AM, Erwin Olario  wrote:
>>> > Happy new year everyone.
>>> >
>>> > In case some of you are wondering about some of my recent changeset
>>> comments
>>> > with the phrase,  "Better PH data with #Kaart", I've recently linked
>>> up with
>>> > Kaart [0], and their initiative to improve OSM data in the Philippines.
>>> >
>>> > One of the things we'd like to tackle is road network improvement,
>>> initially
>>> > in Metro Manila, and later (maybe soon?), expanding to other regions.
>>> >
>>> > Improvements that are intended to be addressed include the following:
>>> > * Adding missing roads
>>> > * Improving road attributes (names, lanes, restrictions, etc.)
>>> > * Correcting road connectivity issues
>>> > * Improving road classification consistency according to OSM
>>> guidelines and
>>> > local convention
>>> > * Correcting road alignment issues
>>> > * Other one-off fixes
>>> >
>>> > Of course, we intend to work closely with the community, and other
>>> > stakeholders, especially at the local level.
>>> >
>>> > We also hope to organize, or lead, activities for developing technical
>>> > skills, and enhancing collaboration, and community mapa-thons.  Think
>>> of
>>> > this as an extension of my earlier MapAmore [1] initiatives.
>>> >
>>> > The tasking for Metro Manila [2] is now up, and is hosted by HOT
>>> Tasking
>>> > Manager instance, and open to all interested contributors.
>>> >
>>> > In tomorrow's 

Re: [talk-ph] intro to Kaart initiative in PH

[Glen Scott]

Nothing to offer by my own personal experiences

I'm a regular user of GPS for navigation at home (Australia) in urban and
country environments.  I've noted in OSM (Philippines - specifically N-W
Pangasinan) two things that are undefined in 99% of roads, but used by the
routing engine - road surface and speed limit. With 99% of roads undefined
for surface and speed limit the route chosen by the GPS will be a lottery
as far as driving experience goes.  I guess the most critical would be the
ability to chose to avoid unpaved roads?  I've had a number of Garmin GPSs
and they always assume 80 km/h where the map has no defined limit.  Maybe
10+ years ago I had some experiences where the GPS would attempt to take me
on "short-cuts" over long-unused dirt tracks (in preference to the
highway!).  I guess this is the potential result of not defining the
surface at the very least.  Hard to tell the speed limit from satellite
imagery!

In the urban environment the most common and frustrating errors (Garmin
maps) would be undefined one-way streets.

My one attempt to navigate in the Philippines on OSM (~2008-2009) led me
into a military camp and some interested military personnel who directed me
back out the way I came in!  Gates are important but no always so easy to
see from space

Cheers
Glen

On Wed, Jan 17, 2018 at 5:40 PM, Erwin Olario  wrote:

>
> Thank you for bringing this up, Maning. This is also a concern I've
> discussed with other mappers in the past, and this doesn't just apply to
> road navigation, but with other features, as well.
>
> The Mapbox data team is a pioneer in this road network initiatives in OSM,
> and we look up to your team for inspiration. 
>
> Our current (in the next few months) interest in PH road network
> improvement are low-hanging fruits (missing geometries, restrictions,
> turning lanes, etc), but in due time, we'd like to explore how to further
> improve road network data from OSM for naviation, etc. PH is only one of
> the many countries we're working in, so we need a more inclusive
> understanding of tagging nuances, too.
>
> I hope such a discussion can  attract more inputs from the wider
> community, especially those who've been lurking in the background, who
> follows the exchanges here, but for reasons known only to them, doesn't
> engage publicly.
>
> /Erwin
>
> On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 8:35 PM maning sambale 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Erwin,
>>
>> Thanks for leading this work.  As many of you know, I work in Mapbox
>> and my primary focus is to make OSM navigable.
>> I wonder what would be the best approach in the context of driving in
>> the Philippines.
>> Would love to share notes and approaches.  One thing I have in mind (I
>> shared this during the meetup), while every country
>> has specific nuances tagging, there is a danger of making the tags too
>> specific as its difficult to create routing engines for each country.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 11:58 AM, Erwin Olario  wrote:
>> > Happy new year everyone.
>> >
>> > In case some of you are wondering about some of my recent changeset
>> comments
>> > with the phrase,  "Better PH data with #Kaart", I've recently linked up
>> with
>> > Kaart [0], and their initiative to improve OSM data in the Philippines.
>> >
>> > One of the things we'd like to tackle is road network improvement,
>> initially
>> > in Metro Manila, and later (maybe soon?), expanding to other regions.
>> >
>> > Improvements that are intended to be addressed include the following:
>> > * Adding missing roads
>> > * Improving road attributes (names, lanes, restrictions, etc.)
>> > * Correcting road connectivity issues
>> > * Improving road classification consistency according to OSM guidelines
>> and
>> > local convention
>> > * Correcting road alignment issues
>> > * Other one-off fixes
>> >
>> > Of course, we intend to work closely with the community, and other
>> > stakeholders, especially at the local level.
>> >
>> > We also hope to organize, or lead, activities for developing technical
>> > skills, and enhancing collaboration, and community mapa-thons.  Think of
>> > this as an extension of my earlier MapAmore [1] initiatives.
>> >
>> > The tasking for Metro Manila [2] is now up, and is hosted by HOT Tasking
>> > Manager instance, and open to all interested contributors.
>> >
>> > In tomorrow's meet-up, I'll take the opportunity to elaborate on this
>> > initiative tomorrow. I'm looking forward to hear your feedback, and to
>> > answer any questions here, or directly by email.
>> >
>> > I also hope for your usual helpful collaboration, and support.
>> >
>> > Kind regards,
>> > Erwin
>> >
>> >
>> > [0]: http://kaartgroup.com/
>> > [1]: https://github.com/mapamore
>> > [2]: https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/3997
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> >
>> > /Erwin Olario
>> >
>> > e: er...@ngnuity.xyz | v/m: https://t.me/GOwin | s:
>> https://mstdn.io/@GOwin
>> >
>> >
>> > 

Re: [talk-ph] intro to Kaart initiative in PH

[Erwin Olario]

Thank you for bringing this up, Maning. This is also a concern I've
discussed with other mappers in the past, and this doesn't just apply to
road navigation, but with other features, as well.

The Mapbox data team is a pioneer in this road network initiatives in OSM,
and we look up to your team for inspiration. 

Our current (in the next few months) interest in PH road network
improvement are low-hanging fruits (missing geometries, restrictions,
turning lanes, etc), but in due time, we'd like to explore how to further
improve road network data from OSM for naviation, etc. PH is only one of
the many countries we're working in, so we need a more inclusive
understanding of tagging nuances, too.

I hope such a discussion can  attract more inputs from the wider community,
especially those who've been lurking in the background, who follows the
exchanges here, but for reasons known only to them, doesn't engage publicly.

/Erwin

On Mon, Jan 15, 2018 at 8:35 PM maning sambale 
wrote:

> Hi Erwin,
>
> Thanks for leading this work.  As many of you know, I work in Mapbox
> and my primary focus is to make OSM navigable.
> I wonder what would be the best approach in the context of driving in
> the Philippines.
> Would love to share notes and approaches.  One thing I have in mind (I
> shared this during the meetup), while every country
> has specific nuances tagging, there is a danger of making the tags too
> specific as its difficult to create routing engines for each country.
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 11:58 AM, Erwin Olario  wrote:
> > Happy new year everyone.
> >
> > In case some of you are wondering about some of my recent changeset
> comments
> > with the phrase,  "Better PH data with #Kaart", I've recently linked up
> with
> > Kaart [0], and their initiative to improve OSM data in the Philippines.
> >
> > One of the things we'd like to tackle is road network improvement,
> initially
> > in Metro Manila, and later (maybe soon?), expanding to other regions.
> >
> > Improvements that are intended to be addressed include the following:
> > * Adding missing roads
> > * Improving road attributes (names, lanes, restrictions, etc.)
> > * Correcting road connectivity issues
> > * Improving road classification consistency according to OSM guidelines
> and
> > local convention
> > * Correcting road alignment issues
> > * Other one-off fixes
> >
> > Of course, we intend to work closely with the community, and other
> > stakeholders, especially at the local level.
> >
> > We also hope to organize, or lead, activities for developing technical
> > skills, and enhancing collaboration, and community mapa-thons.  Think of
> > this as an extension of my earlier MapAmore [1] initiatives.
> >
> > The tasking for Metro Manila [2] is now up, and is hosted by HOT Tasking
> > Manager instance, and open to all interested contributors.
> >
> > In tomorrow's meet-up, I'll take the opportunity to elaborate on this
> > initiative tomorrow. I'm looking forward to hear your feedback, and to
> > answer any questions here, or directly by email.
> >
> > I also hope for your usual helpful collaboration, and support.
> >
> > Kind regards,
> > Erwin
> >
> >
> > [0]: http://kaartgroup.com/
> > [1]: https://github.com/mapamore
> > [2]: https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/3997
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > /Erwin Olario
> >
> > e: er...@ngnuity.xyz | v/m: https://t.me/GOwin | s:
> https://mstdn.io/@GOwin
> >
> >
> > ___
> > talk-ph mailing list
> > talk-ph@openstreetmap.org
> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
> >
>
>
>
> --
> cheers,
> maning
> --
> "Freedom is still the most radical idea of all" -N.Branden
> https://epsg4253.wordpress.com/
> http://twitter.com/maningsambale
> --
>


-- 

/Erwin Olario

e: er...@ngnuity.xyz | v/m: https://t.me/GOwin | s: https://mstdn.io/@GOwin
___
talk-ph mailing list
talk-ph@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph

Re: [talk-ph] intro to Kaart initiative in PH

[maning sambale]

Hi Erwin,

Thanks for leading this work.  As many of you know, I work in Mapbox
and my primary focus is to make OSM navigable.
I wonder what would be the best approach in the context of driving in
the Philippines.
Would love to share notes and approaches.  One thing I have in mind (I
shared this during the meetup), while every country
has specific nuances tagging, there is a danger of making the tags too
specific as its difficult to create routing engines for each country.


On Thu, Jan 11, 2018 at 11:58 AM, Erwin Olario  wrote:
> Happy new year everyone.
>
> In case some of you are wondering about some of my recent changeset comments
> with the phrase,  "Better PH data with #Kaart", I've recently linked up with
> Kaart [0], and their initiative to improve OSM data in the Philippines.
>
> One of the things we'd like to tackle is road network improvement, initially
> in Metro Manila, and later (maybe soon?), expanding to other regions.
>
> Improvements that are intended to be addressed include the following:
> * Adding missing roads
> * Improving road attributes (names, lanes, restrictions, etc.)
> * Correcting road connectivity issues
> * Improving road classification consistency according to OSM guidelines and
> local convention
> * Correcting road alignment issues
> * Other one-off fixes
>
> Of course, we intend to work closely with the community, and other
> stakeholders, especially at the local level.
>
> We also hope to organize, or lead, activities for developing technical
> skills, and enhancing collaboration, and community mapa-thons.  Think of
> this as an extension of my earlier MapAmore [1] initiatives.
>
> The tasking for Metro Manila [2] is now up, and is hosted by HOT Tasking
> Manager instance, and open to all interested contributors.
>
> In tomorrow's meet-up, I'll take the opportunity to elaborate on this
> initiative tomorrow. I'm looking forward to hear your feedback, and to
> answer any questions here, or directly by email.
>
> I also hope for your usual helpful collaboration, and support.
>
> Kind regards,
> Erwin
>
>
> [0]: http://kaartgroup.com/
> [1]: https://github.com/mapamore
> [2]: https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/3997
>
>
> --
>
> /Erwin Olario
>
> e: er...@ngnuity.xyz | v/m: https://t.me/GOwin | s: https://mstdn.io/@GOwin
>
>
> ___
> talk-ph mailing list
> talk-ph@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
>



-- 
cheers,
maning
--
"Freedom is still the most radical idea of all" -N.Branden
https://epsg4253.wordpress.com/
http://twitter.com/maningsambale
--

___
talk-ph mailing list
talk-ph@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph

[talk-ph] intro to Kaart initiative in PH

[Erwin Olario]

Happy new year everyone.

In case some of you are wondering about some of my recent changeset
comments with the phrase,  "Better PH data with #Kaart", I've recently
linked up with Kaart [0], and their initiative to improve OSM data in the
Philippines.

One of the things we'd like to tackle is road network improvement,
initially in Metro Manila, and later (maybe soon?), expanding to other
regions.

Improvements that are intended to be addressed include the following:
* Adding missing roads
* Improving road attributes (names, lanes, restrictions, etc.)
* Correcting road connectivity issues
* Improving road classification consistency according to OSM guidelines and
local convention
* Correcting road alignment issues
* Other one-off fixes

Of course, we intend to work closely with the community, and other
stakeholders, especially at the local level.

We also hope to organize, or lead, activities for developing technical
skills, and enhancing collaboration, and community mapa-thons.  Think of
this as an extension of my earlier MapAmore [1] initiatives.

The tasking for Metro Manila [2] is now up, and is hosted by HOT Tasking
Manager instance, and open to all interested contributors.

In tomorrow's meet-up, I'll take the opportunity to elaborate on this
initiative tomorrow. I'm looking forward to hear your feedback, and to
answer any questions here, or directly by email.

I also hope for your usual helpful collaboration, and support.

Kind regards,
Erwin


[0]: http://kaartgroup.com/
[1]: https://github.com/mapamore
[2]: https://tasks.hotosm.org/project/3997


-- 

/Erwin Olario

e: er...@ngnuity.xyz | v/m: https://t.me/GOwin | s: https://mstdn.io/@GOwin
___
talk-ph mailing list
talk-ph@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph