Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Dwight A Corrin]

On Thursday, April 21, 2005, 8:12:37 PM, Chris wrote:

> However, Ritlabs has a semi-strict policy of not modifying messages
> after they have been received.

which is STUPID. It should be possible to modify subject lines,
correct threads and make notes in messages, or fix broken shortcuts,
or anything else one wants to do with the contents of a message.

Yes, I know there are cumbersome ways to work around some of these
problems, but the fact that some people think it would be wrong for
them to make changes in their mail boxes should not prevent the
addition of functionality which makes the program more useful, and
working with email more efficient for other users!

-- 
Dwight A. Corrin




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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Chris]

Miguel A. Urech @ 2005-Apr-21 8:39:32 PM
"Difference between threaded by subject and reference" 

>> How has it been implemented? What don't you like? Perhaps it can be
>> changed before it is released if a better solution is provided.

> I explained all of this in a long message in the TBBeta list on
> 22-March-2005. If you are interested, you can look in the TBBeta
> archives for Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> with
> Subject "Some thoughts about Threading, manual re-threading, etc."

This can be found at:
http://www.mail-archive.com/tbbeta@thebat.dutaint.com/msg59050.html

This thread is veering into beta territory, but I hope it still remains
pertinent.

From what I have read, your concerns are very real one; ones that I am
sure other users would have. I fully agree that there should be some
way to thread only by references.

You complaints about re-threading not being preserved is also valid.
However, Ritlabs has a semi-strict policy of not modifying messages
after they have been received. Perhaps a secondary "delta message
base" is needed that can store changes, like manual re-threading or
modifications to other headers like the date or the subject.

-- 
Chris
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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Miguel A. Urech]

Hello Chris,

I would prefer you reply to me on the list and not by PM.

>> Manual re-threading was introduced in beta 3.0.9.6 (we are currently
>> testing 3.0.9.17) and it works. Although, as I have written in the beta
>> list, I personally don't like or agree with the way they have
>> implemented it.
> 
> How has it been implemented? What don't you like? Perhaps it can be
> changed before it is released if a better solution is provided.

I explained all of this in a long message in the TBBeta list on
22-March-2005. If you are interested, you can look in the TBBeta
archives for Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> with
Subject "Some thoughts about Threading, manual re-threading, etc."

-- 
Best regards,

Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain)
Using The Bat! v3.0.9.17 Return



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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[MAU]

Hello Chris,

> Please add your support to this feature request so that we can fix
> broken treads easily.
> 
> https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=1440

Manual re-threading was introduced in beta 3.0.9.6 (we are currently
testing 3.0.9.17) and it works. Although, as I have written in the beta
list, I personally don't like or agree with the way they have
implemented it.

-- 
Best regards,

Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain)
Using The Bat! v3.0.2.10






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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[MAU]

Hello Chris,

> The Bat! needs some built-in functionality to add messages to a given
> thread or remove them from one for those instances when the incoming
> message is missing the appropriate headers.
> 
> It also needs some way to break a message out of a thread for those
> instances when someone simply replies and changes the subject when
> starting a new topic.

See my reply to your 

-- 
Best regards,

Miguel A. Urech (El Escorial - Spain)
Using The Bat! v3.0.2.10






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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Chris]

The Final Cut @ 2005-Apr-20 5:38:01 PM
"Difference between threaded by subject and reference" 

>> https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=1440

> I am not sure to understand this wish Can you elaborate? I might be
> interested to add my 2 cents too!

The Bat! needs some built-in functionality to add messages to a given
thread or remove them from one for those instances when the incoming
message is missing the appropriate headers.

It also needs some way to break a message out of a thread for those
instances when someone simply replies and changes the subject when
starting a new topic.

Hope this helps.

-- 
Chris
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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Alexander S. Kunz]

Hello Chris & everyone else,

on 20-Apr-2005 at 23:28 you (Chris) wrote:

> Please add your support to this feature request so that we can fix
> broken treads easily.

> https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=1440

I already did, on August 19th. :-)

-- 
Best regards,
 Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981)

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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[The Final Cut]

Hello Chris

On Wednesday, April 20, 2005, 5:28:06 PM +0400 GMT
You wrote:


C> Alexander S. Kunz @ 2005-Apr-20 3:02:33 PM
C> "Difference between threaded by subject and
C> reference" 

>> The wish to have all messages in a threaded view so you can come back later
>> and follow the flow of a conversation is nothing more than a wish... a wish
>> that can drive you insane. :-) Its a shame.

C> Please add your support to this feature request so that we can fix
C> broken treads easily.

C> https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=1440


I am not sure to understand this wish
Can you elaborate?
I might be interested to add my 2 cents too!

-- 
The Final Cut
  TheBat 3.0.2.10
  http://finalcut.ca/finalcut.asc
 

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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Chris]

Alexander S. Kunz @ 2005-Apr-20 3:02:33 PM
"Difference between threaded by subject and reference" 

> The wish to have all messages in a threaded view so you can come back later
> and follow the flow of a conversation is nothing more than a wish... a wish
> that can drive you insane. :-) Its a shame.

Please add your support to this feature request so that we can fix
broken treads easily.

https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=1440


-- 
Chris
Quoting when replying to this message is good for your karma.

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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Alexander S. Kunz]

Hello The Final Cut & everyone else,

on 20-Apr-2005 at 20:00 you (The Final Cut) wrote:

> Some ppl on that list talk about sorting emails by reference and I'm
> trying to know the difference between sorting by subject and sorting by
> references

> Can someone enlight me please?
> I have tried and I don't see the difference

Threading by reference is more precise than threading by subject, because
not only the subject, but the actual message that is replied to is used to
show the message in the thread. You'll notice the difference in threads
that are running longer. You can precisely see which message is the parent
of what reply, etc.

But... threading by reference is very likely to NOT work anywhere outside
of the TB lists because people use crappy webmailers that strip the
references and/or in-reply-to header (aol, yahoo, hotmail, 1und1, etc. etc.
all break the threading)

And... threading by subject is likely to not work very well either, on
other mailing lists it is a common habit to change the subject any time
whenever people feel like it... even the most simple threading mechanisms
stumble over those messages and can't sort them to a usable position in an
existing conversation.

The wish to have all messages in a threaded view so you can come back later
and follow the flow of a conversation is nothing more than a wish... a wish
that can drive you insane. :-) Its a shame.

-- 
Best regards,
 Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981)

If you should say, 'It is enough, I have reached perfection,' all is
lost. For it is the function of perfection to make one know one's
imperfection. -- St. Augustine



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Re: Difference between threaded by subject and reference

[Stuart Cuddy]

Hello The,
Wednesday, April 20, 2005, 1:00:30 PM, you wrote:

TFC> Some ppl on that list talk about sorting emails by
TFC> reference and I'm trying to know the difference between sorting
TFC> by subject and sorting by references

TFC> Can someone enlight me please?
TFC> I have tried and I don't see the difference

If  you  select  F9  while  viewing a message it will open the Message
source.  In  this source you will find a header called References:. If
you  thread  by References it will use the contents of this section to
thread  your  messages.  If  you  thread  by  subject it just uses the
contents of whatever is in your subject line.

In  a  lot of cases this looks the same, but if two people at separate
times  use the same subject they will thread on each other even though
they are not really related.

-- 
 Stuartmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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