Re[2]: Empty Mail

[TBUDL]

Hi

Monday, October 18, 2004, 8:17:10 PM, you wrote:

> Dear Tbudl,

> @18-Oct-2004, 20:07 TBUDL [T] in
> mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to TBUDL:

T>> Can anyone explain why it is that when I receive an email that
T>> appears to be HTML only does TheBat! offer me an empty email? From
T>> what I can see it appears to be stripping out the HTML code that
T>> would link externally and provides me with a stripped email of
T>> everything except the headers.

> TB strips nothing. Nothing was sent. The message is nothing but a link
> to an external message. TB will not download any external content
> since this would amount to a security breach. This is probably why you
> think the message is "Empty".

> Have you checked the source data of the message? Is the content purely
> external or is the message, in fact, comprised of invalid /
> un-displayable HTML? If so it might be the result of a bug in either
> the sender's client or in TB's rendering system.


Below is the actual 'view source' of the said email. Can you unravel
the problem? TheBat displays a grey page of nothing. Looking at the
content of the mail there is of course nothing too display but I am
sure there was before TheBat got hold of it. It has been doing this a
lot with SPAM mail but I was not worried about those emails. I thought
it might be the BayesIt filter stripping code without me knowing about
it. By the way just for the record this email was not recognised as
JUNK::

X-Envelope-From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-Envelope-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-Delivery-Time: 1098112653
Received: from uk2mxarray2-2.uk2.net (uk2mxserver2-2.uk2.net [83.170.64.207])
by mail.skydsl.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA04939
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 17:17:32 +0200 (MET DST)
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Received: from host-132-244-27-217.poboxhosting.net ([217.27.244.132] 
helo=nsi-server2.modoracle)
by uk2mxarray2-2.uk2.net with esmtp (Exim 4.43)
id 1CJY4s-0004Jc-QP
for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 15:01:35 +0100
Received: from [127.0.0.1] by nsi-server2.hardtoforget.co.uk (GMS 
8.01.3088/NY8415.01.a508cfd1) with ESMTP id wgtjmfaa for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mon, 18 
Oct 2004 14:59:05 +0100
Date: Mon, 18 Oct 2004 14:59:04 +
To: Kevin Bridge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-Id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 217.27.244.132
X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Re[2]: RoSPA Test 28 Sept
X-Spam-Flag: YES
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.64 (2004-01-11) on 
uk2mxarray2-2.uk2.net
X-Spam-Level: *
X-Spam-Status: Yes, hits=5.6 required=5.0 tests=HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_08,
HTML_MESSAGE,HTML_MIME_NO_HTML_TAG,MIME_HEADER_CTYPE_ONLY,
MIME_HTML_NO_CHARSET,MIME_HTML_ONLY,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no 
version=2.64
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="--=_4173CCBF.D9B0C8A4"
X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.0 (built Sat, 24 Jul 2004 09:53:34 +0200)
X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on uk2mxarray2-2.uk2.net)

=_4173CCBF.D9B0C8A4--

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[TBUDL]

Hi

Monday, October 18, 2004, 8:55:07 PM, you wrote:

> Dear Tbudl,

> @18-Oct-2004, 20:31 TBUDL [T] in
> mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to Marck:

T would link externally and provides me with a stripped email of
T everything except the headers.

>>> TB strips nothing. Nothing was sent.
> .. 

T>> Below is the actual 'view source' of the said email. Can you unravel
T>> the problem?

> Yes. You received an empty message.

T>> TheBat displays a grey page of nothing.

> That because it's what TB was sent.

T>> Looking at the content of the mail there is of course nothing too
T>> display

> Correct.

T>> but I am sure there was before TheBat got hold of it.

> Why are you sure of that? I have never seen TB remove a single thing
> from a message. It's not something it is supposed to do.

T>> It has been doing this a lot with SPAM mail but I was not worried
T>> about those emails. I thought it might be the BayesIt filter
T>> stripping code without me knowing about it.

> Nope.

T>> By the way just for the record this email was not recognised as
T>> JUNK::

> Yes it was. SpamAssassin decided it was spam:

T>> X-Spam-Status: Yes

> Perhaps SpamAssassin stipped out the HTML. TB wouldn't.

T>> X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on uk2mxarray2-2.uk2.net)

> Also, Exim had a go at the message before TB got to see it.


Ok here is a prime example of the before and after TheBat has brought
the email in - following is the before i.e. sitting in my 127.0.0.1
folder before being requested by TheBat!

X-Envelope-From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-Envelope-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-Delivery-Time: 1098135622
Received: from uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net (uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net [83.170.64.208])
by mail.skydsl.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18976
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 23:40:21 +0200 (MET DST)
Received: from [210.127.79.162] (helo=83.170.64.208)
by uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net with smtp (Exim 4.43)
id 1CJfEk-0008Iu-GP
for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 22:40:16 +0100
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Received: from 164.110.36.149 by law0-hs22.law8.hotmail.com with DAV;
Mon, 18 Oct 2004 19:31:15 -0300
Reply-To: "Taylor Jaramillo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Taylor Jaramillo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 02:37:15 +0400
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 210.127.79.162
X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Vãlium and X.anax SuperSavings
X-Spam-Flag: YES
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.64 (2004-01-11) on 
uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net
X-Spam-Level: *
X-Spam-Status: Yes, hits=9.1 required=5.0 tests=HTML_40_50,HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_10,
HTML_MESSAGE,MIME_BOUND_DD_DIGITS,MSGID_FROM_MTA_HEADER,
RCVD_NUMERIC_HELO,SUBJECT_DRUG_GAP_X autolearn=no version=2.64
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="--=_41743840.F88CE9F3"
X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.0 (built Sat, 24 Jul 2004 09:53:34 +0200)
X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net)

823241037052079
Content-Type: text/plain;



823241037052079
Content-Type: text/html;
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable



Pha. rma






http://www.cizhder.info/110/";>http://a6.flatly9leng=
thy.info/m/0f.gif" border=3D"0">



Sa;ve 7_0% ord.ering onl/ine To`day!
http://www.cizhder.info/110/";>Vi=
!sit our Site and Sa!ve Big<=
/b>


external canada bald coastal erect indenture philology repeal vulnerable b=
odice gill egghead baylor doughnut prove drought pickup transposition gsa =
hopscotch vestigial chatham frenchmen inescapable ductwork lange calcify t=
wenty=20deject metabole tibet telltale commodity adjudge handel molal talc=
um coat dutchman discrete gifford wash bogey pinsky radiant rocco snail cr=
itter bogey christie dale drumhead worksheet ephraim hollister culture=20t=
attoo antiquarian avoid knutson lecture ire excusable berserk defocus homu=
nculus advisee skullduggery boat rockaway christoffel=20buyer alienate str=
addle umber rogers brushfire circle amelia establish cecilia hitachi harmo=
nious mitten restaurant seductive urge anyway villain abacus obituary broo=
dy composition degrade ambitious permeable brisk=20imposture arrogate ralp=
h omicron daly edward coalesce hornblower did trig observation aside prove=
rb converge irony elena decree=20lengthen addle dome winfield lexical back=
side flag paleozoic chevy opponent latvia agree sent shenandoah=20


http://www.cizhder.info/bye/?110";>removemeplease






823241037052079--

and now follows the version that TheBat! has stripped!

X-Envelope-From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-Envelope-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
X-Delivery-Time: 1098135622
Received: from uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net (uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net [83.170.64.208])
by mail.skydsl.de (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18976
for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 23:40:21 +0200 (MET DST)
Received: from [210.127.79.162] (helo=83.170.64.208)
by uk2mxserver2-3.uk2.net with smtp (Exim 4.43)
id 1CJfEk-0008Iu-GP
for

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[TBUDL]

Hi

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 10:37:34 AM, you wrote:


PF>> On 19-10-2004 00:44, you [MDP] wrote in
PF>> :
MDP>>> HEY!! Anyone else reading this thread who's seen TB empty a mail on
MDP>>> delivery? I've not seen that happen. Nobody's leaping in to say
MDP>>> "yeah, TB always does that".

> is it a HTML email ? various betas had trouble displaying html email
> and would just show a blank page. What do you see when you hit F9, do you
> see the source of the message ?

> cheers,
> davidp.   
> --
> David Pascoe, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED], Western Australia

> Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33  on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2




> 
> Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
> http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

I see the headers only with the rest of the email stripped out by
TheBat! and not by any third party spam filters at my ISP.

It is ridiculous I am now scanning every email using a text editor
before TheBat gets hold of it in case it is a reply from my friend cos
I told him I had lost his email. What a laborious task and if I do not
find an answer then TheBat! is not for me.


-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hi Marck

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 12:51:08 PM, you wrote:

> Dear Tbudl,

> @19-Oct-2004, 12:35 TBUDL [T] in
> mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to David:

T>> I see the headers only with the rest of the email stripped out by
T>> TheBat!

> This is simply not true. TB is not stripping your mail. It doesn't. It
> won't. Nobody has come forward yet to support your reported
> experience. If TB were capable of doing this we would all have seen it
> happen at some time or another. Nobody here has. Whatever is sat on
> your 127.0.0.1 delivery system is doing it. You didn't tell us what
> you have on that.

> TB may fail to /display/ content, but a view of the message source
> always shows an intact receipt. Whatever TB is sent, it stores.
> Anything else is the influence of something external to TB.

> And please use a better alias than "TBUDL".

> And please trim your replies to context - your last included a list
> footer!

Seems like I have touched a nerve? First of all there has already been
support from others commenting on a similar thing happening to them.

My delivery system is a folder which receives my email from a
satellite connection and there it sits until I use an email client to
fetch it from the folder. When I view the raw message for the ones
that HAVE been stripped they are intact until TheBat! loads them so by
simple means of elimination it can only be either TheBat! and my
settings or BayesIT.

I have changed my alias to something more appropriate and I agree it
is confusing but never realised until I started to see my messages in
the list. Hopefully I have trimmed my list footers as well :-)

My thoughts now are that something has become corrupted and before I
scrap TheBat! perhaps I should uninstall and then reinstall to see if
I can eliminate the problem that way.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Alexander,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 4:10:33 PM, you wrote:

> Hello Morpheus,

> Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 2:07:26 PM, you wrote:

>> My delivery system is a folder which receives my email from a
>> satellite connection and there it sits until I use an email client to
>> fetch it from the folder

> Sorry to jump in here but I can't bear reading this any longer. :-)

> The IP address "127.0.0.1" is also called *localhost* - it (usually)
> is your OWN machine! Ping 127.0.0.1 will have your own computer answer
> your ping request.

> You *must* have something sitting in between TheBat! and your
> POP3/IMAP server, there's no way around that. Are you using a virus
> scanner that scans your email, or an additional local spam filter, or
> message mangling program (like xrayapp), or whatever.

> In essence, when you look up mails it may be something like

>TheBat! ->> virus scanner ->> POP3 server

> Or whatever...
   
Very pleased to have you jump in. Thank you for converting my message
to something Techies can understand rather than the IT illiterate
idiots like me ;-)

The only application that divides me from incoming mail is Kerio
Personal Firewall and I use AVG Anti Virus which is not capable of
recognising my incoming mail unless I try to open it and it contains a
virus it will then intercept.

I collect my mail by using 127.0.0.1 which you quite rightly point out
is my own machine. My satellite connection downloads mail without my
PC being directly connected to the internet via my ISP and dumps the
mail into a personal folder and using 127.0.0.1 successfully locates
this folder and gives me email.

There are NO additional local spam filters nor message mangling
programs although I have never heard of one of these and would surely
know if I had downloaded and installed one presumably.


-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Marck,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 5:15:57 PM, you wrote:

> Dear Morpheus,

> @19-Oct-2004, 16:23 Morpheus [M] in
> mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to Alexander:

> .. 

>>> Sorry to jump in here but I can't bear reading this any longer. :-)

>>> The IP address "127.0.0.1" is also called *localhost* - it
>>> (usually) is your OWN machine! Ping 127.0.0.1 will have your own
>>> computer answer your ping request.

> Correct.

>>> You *must* have something sitting in between TheBat! and your
>>> POP3/IMAP server, there's no way around that.

> 100% true.
   
M>> Very pleased to have you jump in. Thank you for converting my
M>> message to something Techies can understand rather than the IT
M>> illiterate idiots like me ;-)

> Well, you are clearly missing something that I have been trying to say
> and has now been said by someone else.

M>> The only application that divides me from incoming mail is Kerio
M>> Personal Firewall and I use AVG Anti Virus which is not capable of
M>> recognising my incoming mail unless I try to open it and it contains a
M>> virus it will then intercept.

> .. but wait ... there's more that *you* (clearly and sadly) don't
> realize about your own computer system ...

M>> I collect my mail by using 127.0.0.1 which you quite rightly point
M>> out is my own machine.

> Not only is it your machine, but it is a *piece of software* on your
> machine listening on TCP/IP port 110 (the POP3 port) to your requests
> for your email from The Bat! That software then digs it out of the
> "folder" and sends it to you. It is software. It is software that
> opens an email message from the folder and sends it to TB.

> *THAT* is the software that is eating your messages. Sorry, but you
> don't seem to be understanding this basic and fundamental point I (and
> others) are making here.

M>> My satellite connection downloads mail without my PC being directly
M>> connected to the internet via my ISP

> "downloads"? By magic? Not really. It uses the POP3 protocol on an
> open TCP/IP connection. And it's not the "satellite connection" that
> does it. It is software that uses the open connection to do it.
> Software provided by your ISP. Faulty software, IMHO.

M>> and dumps the mail into a personal folder and using 127.0.0.1
M>> successfully locates this folder and gives me email.

> That is not correct. It seems to me that you don't understand the
> process quite enough.

> 127.0.0.1 is the IP address of a *Mail Server* - a mail server program
> running on your computer itself. Your satellite software includes a
> local mail server and tries to blind you with non-science by calling
> it "a folder". It's not a folder. It's a local mail server - a piece
> of software (whether or not you previously knew that).

M>> There are NO additional local spam filters nor message mangling
M>> programs

> But there is. It's the software from your satellite ISP. The one that
> calls itself a "mail folder". I believe that is what is mangling your
> mail on delivery. I have no idea why it should do that. Contact your
> ISP and check that you have the latest version and start ranting to
> them about POP3 compatibility, because IMHO you are calling the wrong
> kettle "black".

M>> although I have never heard of one of these and would surely know
M>> if I had downloaded and installed one presumably.

> Well, it seems to me that you actually don't know ... and without
> realising it ... you did!


I have decided not to snip as I dont know what bits would be best to
snip :-)

You really are very abrupt Marck. We or should I say I am not as
literate in these matters as you so obviously are but that does not
mean I am a dunce, nor does it prevent me from wishing to learn more
so chill dude.

Using my language I can see inside 'the folder' the raw messages so if
anything was going to 'mangle' it as you poetically put it, would it
not have done so already? Yet when I look at the raw message in my
TEXTEDITOR I see the whole and not the stripped message TheBat!
offers up to me. When I open TheBat! and ask to see my messages it
pulls them from the folder and does its thing. If the satellite
software was going to strip the emails why would it not have done so
already. Your logic to me at least makes no sense.

After my uninstall and reinstall the problem has not disappeared but I
may well do so you will be pleased to know.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Alexander,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 7:27:05 PM, you wrote:

> Hello Thomas Fernandez & everyone else

> 19-Okt-2004 18:59, you wrote:

>> Morpheus, what happens if you make TB not connect to localhost but
>> directly to the ISP's POP server?

> I'd that this cannot work on a satellite connection: the upstream to his
> ISP goes on a regular phoneline, the downstream over his satellite
> connection.


I can connect directly and will give this a try.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Alexander,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 5:37:46 PM, you wrote:

> Hello Morpheus & everyone else

> 19-Okt-2004 17:23, you wrote:

>> Very pleased to have you jump in. Thank you for converting my message
>> to something Techies can understand rather than the IT illiterate
>> idiots like me ;-)

> I just felt that you and Marck could not "connect" somehow... :)

> Sorry, only to germans: Hölle, was heisst "aneinander vorbeireden" auf
> Englisch? (it is only a question on how to express a certain phrase so any
> non-germans do not miss a thing, no hidden jokes, no nothing, promised!)


>> I collect my mail by using 127.0.0.1 which you quite rightly point out
>> is my own machine. My satellite connection downloads mail without my
>> PC being directly connected to the internet via my ISP and dumps the
>> mail into a personal folder and using 127.0.0.1 successfully locates
>> this folder and gives me email.

> So, as Marck already said, some sorta software *must* be installed on your
> PC. It listens on port 110 for any POP3 requests and then feeds the mail
> that it temporarily stored, whichever way, to the program that made the
> POP3 request - that program happens to be TheBat!, and it gets something
> that is already on your system, and possibly got mangled somehow on its way
> there, either on the satellite route, or by the software that buffers the
> content locally on your end.

> Now, I don't know much about satellite technique, but I assume it is some
> sort of proxy. Who configured the machine for you when you got that
> satellite connection?


There was no config the CD software did it all for me illieterate as
I am.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Thomas,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 5:59:05 PM, you wrote:

> Hello Alexander,

> On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 18:37:46 +0200 GMT (19/10/2004, 23:37 +0700 GMT),
> Alexander S. Kunz wrote:


ASK>> Sorry, only to germans: Hölle, was heisst "aneinander vorbeireden" auf
ASK>> Englisch?

> "Talking about different things".

> I side with Marck. I receive messages in the office that fit the
> description posted by Morpheus, and they were "cleaned" by NAV. (Sorry
> Marck, that's what the IT people decided to use.)

> Morpheus, what happens if you make TB not connect to localhost but
> directly to the ISP's POP server?


Aha thanks Thomas a man with a sensible suggestion and yes I can
connect directly with the satellite ISP for my mail it is just very
convenient not to have to connect to collect mail but it is worth
trying this option to see if it makes a difference.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Marck,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 10:02:31 PM, you wrote:

> Dear Morpheus,

> @19-Oct-2004, 20:40 Morpheus [M] in
> mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to Marck:

M>> Using my language I can see inside 'the folder' the raw messages so
M>> if anything was going to 'mangle' it as you poetically put it,
M>> would it not have done so already?

> No. It gets changed as it is *sent* from the "folder" you can see
> inside (and it is not a folder - it is the pre-transmission mail
> store).

M>> Yet when I look at the raw message in my TEXTEDITOR I see the whole
M>> and not the stripped message TheBat! offers up to me.

> The stripped message is what the "folder" (it is *not* a folder) gives
> to The Bat!. The folder does not store the message stripped. It strips
> it *while passing it to The Bat!*. The Bat! does not strip it. Please
> stop saying it is The Bat! and you might start moving towards a
> solution. Downloading direct from the ISP server instead of this silly
> "folder" (it is NOT a folder - it is just a poorly written local email
> server) should prove that once and for all.

M>> When I open TheBat! and ask to see my messages it pulls them from
M>> the folder and does its thing.

> No it doesn't "do its thing". It receives. It doesn't pull anything
> from any folder like you do with your TEXTEDITOR. It asks the silly
> folder thing to send it the messages. The silly folder thing sends. It
> doesn't sit back and say "here's my folder, help yourself". It sends.
> That's where it goes wrong. The silly folder thing is *sending it
> wrong*.

> I'm not being condescending rude or abrupt here but I'm finding it
> very hard to put this in terms you are likely to understand.

M>> If the satellite software was going to strip the emails why would
M>> it not have done so already.

> Why? It hasn't *sent* them yet.

M>> Your logic to me at least makes no sense.

> It makes a great deal of sense. Please think a bit deeper and try to
> understand what I (and many others) have been trying to explain to you
> about how this works. Your calling it a "folder" and looking in the
> temporary message store is doing nothing but confusing you. Even if
> you don't know what we're talking about, accept that we actually do.


Eureka now I understand what you are trying to force down my
illiterate throat and I thank you for being so patient. I will now as you
suggest switch to direct download and see if that cures it.

Still at least we got off the subject of installing 3.001 for a
few minutes.

Thanks Marck :-)


-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Marck,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 10:02:31 PM, you wrote:

snipped

> The stripped message is what the "folder" (it is *not* a folder) gives
> to The Bat!. The folder does not store the message stripped. It strips
> it *while passing it to The Bat!*. The Bat! does not strip it. Please
> stop saying it is The Bat! and you might start moving towards a
> solution. Downloading direct from the ISP server instead of this silly
> "folder" (it is NOT a folder - it is just a poorly written local email
> server) should prove that once and for all.

more snipping

M>> Your logic to me at least makes no sense.

> It makes a great deal of sense. Please think a bit deeper and try to
> understand what I (and many others) have been trying to explain to you
> about how this works. Your calling it a "folder" and looking in the
> temporary message store is doing nothing but confusing you. Even if
> you don't know what we're talking about, accept that we actually do.

It gives me no pleasure to report that requesting the emails direct
has made no difference at all to the appearance of some emails, they
are still being stripped. I will not bore you or anyone else withis
any further as it is obviously something specific to my set up or ISP
so I will live with it for a while and C.

The only other option to try is to have my mails routed through a
completely different MailServer to see if that makes a difference
which I will try.

I will only report if I find an answer to the mystery so you can put
your kill file filters away :-)


-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Allie,

Wednesday, October 20, 2004, 12:03:42 PM, you wrote:

> On Wednesday, October 20, 2004 at 1:21:44 AM [GMT -0500], Morpheus
> wrote:

>> It gives me no pleasure to report that requesting the emails direct
>> has made no difference at all to the appearance of some emails, they
>> are still being stripped.

> Have you tried another e-mail client to see what happens?


I recently transferred my mail from Poco Mail to TheBat! I had not
experienced this problem with mail before this exchange...
however there is more to this than this simple statement..if I may
explain-

When I heard about the wondrous things TheBat! could do with handling
spam I decided to lift all my redirection email addresses which were
currently going into an account at mailinator.com and have them once
again bombard me with spam so that I could try and teach BayesIT how
to recognise an avalanche of spam. 95% of my spam was going unseen but
there were odd iems that kept getting through the net and as I like to
tinker I thought I could get TheBat! to spamate them once and for all.

So to tell the truth Poco Mail has never received any spam mail so I
cannot say for certain that it did not have this problem before the
installation.

I have had my domain name for several years and as such I am have been
found by up to 50 spammers a day so TheBat! gets a good workout :-) I
have only lost one email that I did not want to lose all the rest that
have been stripped have been crap mail. Bonafide mail does not seem to
be affected at all. In fact I opened a hotmail account and sent myself
a message to see if it was stripped and it was not so I
suspect it is those emails that contain only a HREF to an external
image and no content. And this leads me to suspect BayesIT is the
guilty party with some internal flag to render this type of email
harmless.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail

[Morpheus]

Hello Marck,

Wednesday, October 20, 2004, 2:34:09 PM, you wrote:

> Dear Thomas,

> @20-Oct-2004, 20:20 +0700 (20-Oct 14:20 UK time) Thomas Fernandez [TF]
> in mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to Morpheus:

M>>> Using my language I can see inside 'the folder' the raw messages so if
M>>> anything was going to 'mangle' it as you poetically put it, would it
M>>> not have done so already? Yet when I look at the raw message in my
M>>> TEXTEDITOR I see the whole and not the stripped message TheBat!
M>>> offers up to me.

TF>> How do you open the messages in the text editor?

> The Satellite software is downloading the messages into a holding
> folder external to TB and driver by its own virtual POP handler. The
> holding folder is a simple disk folder that contains .msg files. These
> files can be viewed with a text editor.

TF>> Over here, the mails are downloaded into the .tbb files, and these
TF>> show garbage in the text editor. So what file are you opening?

> The satellite offline message folder contents external to TB - prior to
> receiving the messages in TB.

> .. 

TF>> No apparently it is not your satellite software,

> Actually - it seem that there is possibly something amiss with the
> message body format before it even arrives in the offline folder.
> Although the whole message can be seen in a text editor, once it is
> transmitted by POP protocol to TB, the body has been removed. Morpheus
> has said this happens with or without the middle-man offline folder's
> intervention. Telling TB to grab the messages from the Satellite ISP's
> POP server directly by changing the account settings in TB still
> resulted in truncated messages. Unless, of course, Morpheus simply
> opened the connection and downloaded, expecting the messages to come
> direct from the ISP without changing any settings... in which case, we
> still don't know.

TF>> you do have the full message on your computer. But where, I
TF>> wonder. The message body gets lost on the way from that file which
TF>> you can open in the text editor to the import into TB.

> Yes - and POP3 is the import method.


No I am stupid but not that stupid :-) I changed my settings from
pop3server 127.0.0.1 to mail.skydsl.de and this requires an open
internet connection to pull (did I say that right) the mail to my PC.

I said in an earlier email that this stripping appears to be very
selective and far more intelligent than I. It only appears to strip
spam but I do recall the emails I viewed intact before DID contain
text and not just an external reference to an image or site elsewhere.

Something on my computer seems to be leaping in at the transfer stage
from localhost folder to TheBat! to kill the content. Could it be
SPYBOT? It is not designed to do this as far as I know but apart from
that and AVG and Kerio is the only stuff I have running except of
course my satellite software which always running.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re[2]: Empty Mail Update

[Morpheus]

Hello Jeff,

Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 5:18:35 PM, you wrote:

> Hello Group

> On Tuesday, October 19, 2004, 4:05:20 PM,  wrote:

>> Hello

>> I have uninstalled everything and removed all traces (that I can find)
>> from the Register. Reinstalled everything and fed BayesIT with 500
>> good and 500 bad emails.

>> I will let you know (if you are interested) if I find any further
>> email stripping.


> Let us know if you want any of us to send you test emails of any type.


Thanks for the offer Jeff but the problem still persists and 99.9% of
the emails it does this with are SPAM sp perhaps I should just let it
get on with it and thank my lucky stars I dont have to look at the
crap they are sending to me.

-- 
Morpheus



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html