Re: need PreferredMode troubleshooting help [solved]
On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 03:43 -0400, Felix Miata wrote: > On 2013-06-21 03:07 (GMT-0400) Adam Williamson composed: > > > KDE has a checkbox for *everything in the world*, so I'm sure you can > > reverse/reconfigure it somewhere. I haven't used it, but I'm assuming it > > can set resolution and refresh rate as well as multi-monitor > > positioning, hence useful for single monitors. > > This is the same A11Y problem you keep complaining I complain about. The > obstacle here repeated is it can be much harder or even impossible for people > faced with too small GUI text to make it big enough than it is the other way > around. Without the necessity of a mouse pointer too small to see, or > checkboxes too small to hit with limited dexterity, xorg.conf can be used to > reverse globally-forced 96 DPI even before KDM ever accepts its first login, > thus enabling fine tuning from within KDE using text legible to the > beneficiaries of competent A11Y design. > > KScreen in F19 currently is overriding xorg.conf, reverting text to > inadequate forced-to-96 size. Whether this is WAD or Fedora bug or upstream > bug is yet to be discovered by me, but I see a grand total of only 9 KScreen > bugs on bugs.kde.org. Based exclusively on their summaries, none seem to be > related to this behavior. It shouldn't override the systemwide config for anything you haven't explicitly set, no. I'd consider that a kscreen bug. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: need PreferredMode troubleshooting help [solved]
On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 04:19 -0700, T.C. Hollingsworth wrote: > On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Felix Miata wrote: > > That was it. 'yum remove kscreen' wanted to remove kde-workspace. 'rpm -e > > --nodeps kscreen' mostly fixed it. There's a strong flicker I can't recall > > ever seeing before from the Radeon's DVI output (also in SUSE) as if running > > below 60 refresh, while actually running 75, but its VGA and Intel's output > > work normally. 'zypper se -s reen' finds no similar 13.1 package for 4.10.4. > > You can just disable kscreen without resorting to forced rpm commands > if that's what you want: > qdbus org.kde.kded /kded org.kde.kded.unloadModule kscreen > qdbus org.kde.kded /kded org.kde.kded.setModuleAutoloading kscreen false > > > Now the questions have become: > > > > 1-why is it required for single display F19 KDE users? > > As Adam points out, it's very useful for single monitor setups as well. > > > 2-does it need to by default usurp xorg.conf directives? > > As I understand it, expecting X to handle anything more than one > display sanely is unpossible, I don't know quite what you mean by this, but it's not that difficult to specify a multi-monitor config in an Xorg config snippet if you take the time to read the documentation. I mean, it's not actively *fun* or anything, but it's not like setting up sendmail or something. =) What I'd say is simply that this is the logical and sensible design, and used for all sorts of other things. It's pretty much a *nix convention that user configuration trumps admin configuration which trumps defaults. So /etc/X11/xorg.conf(.d) trumps the X defaults, and any user configuration set in /home or via GNOME or KDE or any other desktop trumps the admin configuration in /etc . I don't see that that setup is at all radical or unusual. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: need PreferredMode troubleshooting help [solved]
On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 12:07 AM, Adam Williamson wrote: > KDE has a checkbox for *everything in the world*, KScreen actually "fixes" this. The old display config pretty much exposed every xrandr option under the sun, and just as tersely. (In fact, I think it just shelled out to xrandr and only did so if you configured something, which is why it never messed with Felix's config.) KScreen's config is much nicer and it mostly just Does The Right Thing. > so I'm sure you can > reverse/reconfigure it somewhere. System Settings > Display > I haven't used it, but I'm assuming it > can set resolution and refresh rate as well as multi-monitor > positioning, hence useful for single monitors. Yup. :-) -T.C. -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: need PreferredMode troubleshooting help [solved]
On Thu, Jun 20, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Felix Miata wrote: > That was it. 'yum remove kscreen' wanted to remove kde-workspace. 'rpm -e > --nodeps kscreen' mostly fixed it. There's a strong flicker I can't recall > ever seeing before from the Radeon's DVI output (also in SUSE) as if running > below 60 refresh, while actually running 75, but its VGA and Intel's output > work normally. 'zypper se -s reen' finds no similar 13.1 package for 4.10.4. You can just disable kscreen without resorting to forced rpm commands if that's what you want: qdbus org.kde.kded /kded org.kde.kded.unloadModule kscreen qdbus org.kde.kded /kded org.kde.kded.setModuleAutoloading kscreen false > Now the questions have become: > > 1-why is it required for single display F19 KDE users? As Adam points out, it's very useful for single monitor setups as well. > 2-does it need to by default usurp xorg.conf directives? As I understand it, expecting X to handle anything more than one display sanely is unpossible, so if the desktops want to provide a sane experience in this regard, they need to handle things themselves. I'm sure that GNOME and KDE both wouldn't be doing this if they didn't have a good reason. -T.C. -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: need PreferredMode troubleshooting help [solved]
On 2013-06-21 03:07 (GMT-0400) Adam Williamson composed: KDE has a checkbox for *everything in the world*, so I'm sure you can reverse/reconfigure it somewhere. I haven't used it, but I'm assuming it can set resolution and refresh rate as well as multi-monitor positioning, hence useful for single monitors. This is the same A11Y problem you keep complaining I complain about. The obstacle here repeated is it can be much harder or even impossible for people faced with too small GUI text to make it big enough than it is the other way around. Without the necessity of a mouse pointer too small to see, or checkboxes too small to hit with limited dexterity, xorg.conf can be used to reverse globally-forced 96 DPI even before KDM ever accepts its first login, thus enabling fine tuning from within KDE using text legible to the beneficiaries of competent A11Y design. KScreen in F19 currently is overriding xorg.conf, reverting text to inadequate forced-to-96 size. Whether this is WAD or Fedora bug or upstream bug is yet to be discovered by me, but I see a grand total of only 9 KScreen bugs on bugs.kde.org. Based exclusively on their summaries, none seem to be related to this behavior. P.S. I did find out openSUSE is holding KScreen back from standard repos until 4.11. -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: need PreferredMode troubleshooting help [solved]
On Fri, 2013-06-21 at 01:15 -0400, Felix Miata wrote: > On 2013-06-20 21:03 (GMT-0700) T.C. Hollingsworth composed: > > Thank you!!! :-D > > > What desktop are you using, then? > > On 2013-06-20 22:56 (GMT-0400) Felix Miata composed: > ... > > .fonts > > .gstreamer-0.10 > > .gtkrc-2.0-kde4 > > .kde > > .kderc > > .local > ... > > KDE moved to kscreen for F19 and that might cause similar issues. > > That was it. 'yum remove kscreen' wanted to remove kde-workspace. 'rpm -e > --nodeps kscreen' mostly fixed it. There's a strong flicker I can't recall > ever seeing before from the Radeon's DVI output (also in SUSE) as if running > below 60 refresh, while actually running 75, but its VGA and Intel's output > work normally. 'zypper se -s reen' finds no similar 13.1 package for 4.10.4. > > Now the questions have become: > > 1-why is it required for single display F19 KDE users? > > 2-does it need to by default usurp xorg.conf directives? KDE has a checkbox for *everything in the world*, so I'm sure you can reverse/reconfigure it somewhere. I haven't used it, but I'm assuming it can set resolution and refresh rate as well as multi-monitor positioning, hence useful for single monitors. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora http://www.happyassassin.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: need PreferredMode troubleshooting help [solved]
On 2013-06-20 21:03 (GMT-0700) T.C. Hollingsworth composed: Thank you!!! :-D What desktop are you using, then? On 2013-06-20 22:56 (GMT-0400) Felix Miata composed: ... .fonts .gstreamer-0.10 .gtkrc-2.0-kde4 .kde .kderc .local ... KDE moved to kscreen for F19 and that might cause similar issues. That was it. 'yum remove kscreen' wanted to remove kde-workspace. 'rpm -e --nodeps kscreen' mostly fixed it. There's a strong flicker I can't recall ever seeing before from the Radeon's DVI output (also in SUSE) as if running below 60 refresh, while actually running 75, but its VGA and Intel's output work normally. 'zypper se -s reen' finds no similar 13.1 package for 4.10.4. Now the questions have become: 1-why is it required for single display F19 KDE users? 2-does it need to by default usurp xorg.conf directives? -- "The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation) Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks! Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
