Re: [Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens
Sorry--once again, now _with_ the promised attachment ...
Am 18.08.2011 schrieb Rainer Dunker:
Hello Dirk!
Am 16.08.2011 schrieb Dirk Laurie:
On Tue, Aug 16, 2011 at 03:55:06PM +0200, Rainer Dunker wrote:
[...]
\\\def\atnextline{\mtxLyricsAdjust{1}{-9}}\ a4 } a a a |
Ouch! This is definitely the sort of thing that M-Tx was designed
to avoid. Would it in other situations also be right to do that,
or only in this one?
I'd say it would be wrong to do that always. See the Winter ade
example in the musixlyr documentation: There, a double-line lyrics
section is continued with a single lyrics line in mid-system; you can't
delay the vertical shift up to the system end in this case.
If not so, can one identify the situation
automatically so that M-Tx itself puts this in when needed?
On the one hand, yes: If the vertical lyrics shift occurs after the last
note of the pending system, it should be synchonized with the system
break. But, as far as I unterstand, M-Tx doesn't know where the system
break will happen--PMX is the earliest processing stage where this
information is available. Therefore, the M-Tx processor itself has no
chance to detect the situation. (Right?)
But maybe the \mtxLyricsAdjust command could be empowered to detect
its own calling context. This TeX macro, inserted by M-Tx into the
output literally, is executed by TeX _after_ PMX has decided about the
system breaks. Maybe, with a bit of luck, it could grasp this
information somehow and use it for a proper vertical lyrics shift.
I had a look in the .tex file resulting from Simon's problem example and
noticed that both \mtxLyricsAdjust calls (generated by M-Tx) occur right
before the \alaligne calls (generated by PMX). Assumed that this is
always the case, \mtxLyricsAdjust could look ahead for the TeX command
directly following it (using TeX's \futurelet command), and if it finds
\alaligne, it knows that the lyrics shift occurs at a system break,
otherwise not.
Although this appears to be a really dirty and fragile solution, at
least I managed to put it all together into a working example
(attached to this message). But I'm far from sure whether this would
work in every case and would not raise unwanted side effects
(especially due to the uncumulative use of \atnextline).
Could you please have a look at it and evaluate whether it is generally
feasible? If you conclude that it's not, I may dig into musixlyr again
to see whether it can be made more aware of such vertical shifts and to
react properly itself, but I guess this would be so intricate that a
workaround for those rare problematic cases would still be more
appropriate.
Best regards,
Rainer
Systems: 2
Style: Singer
%%\let\mtxLyricsAdjustOrig\mtxLyricsAdjust
%%\def\mtxLyricsAdjust#1#2{%
%% \def\mtxLyricsAdjustArgOne{#1}%
%% \def\mtxLyricsAdjustArgTwo{#2}%
%% \futurelet\mtxLyricsAdjustNextToken\mtxLyricsAdjustInternal
%%}
%%\def\mtxLyricsAdjustInternal{%
%% \ifx\mtxLyricsAdjustNextToken\alaligne
%%\def\atnextline{%
%% \mtxLyricsAdjustOrig\mtxLyricsAdjustArgOne\mtxLyricsAdjustArgTwo}%
%% \else
%%\mtxLyricsAdjustOrig\mtxLyricsAdjustArgOne\mtxLyricsAdjustArgTwo%
%% \fi
%%}
@-2 g g g g | g @+4 g g g | @-4 g g g g | g g g g
L: bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla-bla bla bla bla bla bla bla bla
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Re: [Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 04:02:43PM +0200, Rainer Dunker wrote:
Am 16.08.2011 schrieb Dirk Laurie:
On Tue, Aug 16, 2011 at 03:55:06PM +0200, Rainer Dunker wrote:
[...]
\\\def\atnextline{\mtxLyricsAdjust{1}{-9}}\ a4 } a a a |
Ouch! This is definitely the sort of thing that M-Tx was designed
to avoid. Would it in other situations also be right to do that,
or only in this one?
I'd say it would be wrong to do that always.
...
Although this appears to be a really dirty and fragile solution, ...
But I'm far from sure whether this would work in every case and
would not raise unwanted side effects...
Could you please have a look at it and evaluate whether it is generally
feasible?
...
From a pure M-Tx point of view, I'd rather introduce syntax for
postponing something to the next line than special-case code that
may itself have exceptions. E.g. `!@-9` to make `@-9` act later.
In PMX `!` occurs only inside comments, in M-Tx only on uptext
lines.
Would this not be a more versatile solution, maybe even at the PMX
level? Could I have some feedback from people who write a lot of
scores? Just grep for `atnextline` in your .mtx and/or .pmx files.
I know there is a lot of them in André van Ryckeghem's edition of
the Deutsche Messe.
Dirk
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Re: [Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens
On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 05:52:45PM +0200, Don Simons wrote: I believe you're right that PMX doesn't now use ! at all. And I'd be glad to help however I can. But I'm very unclear on what you are proposing at the PMX level. Would the stuff after ! be PMX command(s), in-line TeX to be put into \atnextline, or something else? And if it is just stuff to go in \atnextline, what would be the advantage over simply using inline TeX within PMX? Maybe in PMX there isn't anything except TeX that one would like to take effect only at the next line, in which case there is no argument. Dirk --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music
Re: [Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens
Hello Simon!
Am 01.08.2011 schrieb Simon Dreher:
I get a strange behavior of the lyrics placement when I adjust the
vertical position at a new line:
The hyphens or melisma at the end of the old line already gets shifted
as if it were on the new line after the vertical shift. You can see this
in the example below at the end of the 4th and 5th system. How can I
correct this strange behavior?
This is due to a quite fundamental difficulty concerning the
synchronization of lyrics layout changes at system breaks. Recently,
Hermann Hinsch had similar problems with the same cause.
In every such case, this is the situation: You want to change the lyrics
layout at the beginning of a new system. You thus place the respective
command (e.g., \setsongraise) _after_ the last note of the pending
system but _before_ the system break command (normally \alaligne). This
seems correct only at the first glance; instead, musixlyr has to act on
the lyrics of the pending system even _after_ the final note is
processed. More precisely, it adds trailing hyphen sequences and lyrics
extension underlines, and it does so during the processing of the
\alaligne command. If the \setsongraise-or-whatever has occurred already
before \alaligne, the hyphens or underlines appear at the new vertical
position that is meant only for the next system.
Using plain MusiXTeX, the proper solution is easy: Wrap the lyrics
layout change in \def\atnextline{...}--that way, the change is made
effective at exactly the right processing stage.
But what to do using M-Tx? Since vertical lyrics shifting is a built-in
language element, you can't influence its function directly. From my
point of view, M-Tx itself should use \atnextline here (but that would
be more complicated since such vertical shifting could also occur in the
middle of a system; a distinction would thus be necessary). For you
as the M-Tx user, the only workaround I can think of is: Instead of
M-Tx's lyrics shifting command @+x, use PMX inline-TeX commands
properly. For example, change your M-Tx input line
@-2 a4 } a a a |
to:
\\\def\atnextline{\mtxLyricsAdjust{1}{-9}}\ a4 } a a a |
(This works for me, at least.) \mtxLyricsAdjust{1}{-9} is
literally what M-Tx outputs for @-2, so it should do the right thing;
putting it into \atnextline makes it perform at the right moment.
However, you do have to pay attention to the shifting amount. M-Tx's '@'
command uses relative numbers and translates them to absolute
positioning numbers for \mtxLyricsAdjust. In the example case, the
absolute position was -7 before the change, and the relative change by
-2 turns it into -9. Later in your input file, when shifting back by
@+2, you have to specify absolute position -7 again.
Hope that works,
Rainer
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Re: [Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens
On Tue, Aug 16, 2011 at 03:55:06PM +0200, Rainer Dunker wrote:
For example, change your M-Tx input line
@-2 a4 } a a a |
to:
\\\def\atnextline{\mtxLyricsAdjust{1}{-9}}\ a4 } a a a |
Ouch! This is definitely the sort of thing that M-Tx was designed
to avoid. Would it in other situations also be right to do that,
or only in this one? If not so, can one identify the situation
automatically so that M-Tx itself puts this in when needed?
Dirk
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Re: [Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens
Hello Simon! -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: Simon Dreher simon.dre...@gmx.net Gesendet: 01.08.11 00:47:44 An: Werner Icking Music Archive tex-music@tug.org Betreff: [Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens Hello, I get a strange behavior of the lyrics placement when I adjust the vertical position at a new line: The hyphens or melisma at the end of the old line already gets shifted as if it were on the new line after the vertical shift. [...] I'm sure I can tell something meaningful about that, but since I'm on holiday for two weeks, please be patient a bit ... Best regards, Rainer --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music
[Tex-music] Wrong lyrics adjustments with hyphens
Hello,
I get a strange behavior of the lyrics placement when I adjust the
vertical position at a new line:
The hyphens or melisma at the end of the old line already gets shifted
as if it were on the new line after the vertical shift. You can see this
in the example below at the end of the 4th and 5th system. How can I
correct this strange behavior?
Viele Grüße,
Simon
PS: I also get the strange problem with the missing repeat in this
example...
--888888888888--
Title: Lieber Freist\adtler
Composer: W.~A.~Mozart
Style: SINGER
Meter: C
Sharps: 2
Pages: 1
Systems: 7
%Bars/line:8
%Space: -18
%%\input musixtmr
%%\twelverm
%\input musixlth
%\hlthick.5pt% staff line thickness
%\stemthick.5pt % stem thickness
%\blthick.5pt % normal bar line thickness
%\Blthick.6\Interligne% bold bar line thickness (repeat, etc.)
%
%Default-Werte:
%\hlthick.4pt% staff line thickness
%\stemthick.4pt % stem thickness
%\blthick.4pt % normal bar line thickness
%\Blthick.6\Interligne% bold bar line thickness (repeat, etc.)
{S1}
Lie-ber Frei-st\adt-ler, lie-ber Gau-li-mau-li,
lie-ber Sta-chel-schwein, wo gehn Sie hin, wo gehn Sie hin, wo gehn Sie hin?
Et-wa zum Fin-to, o-der zum Scul-tet-ti? Ha, wo-hin, wo-hin?
Zum Scul-tet-ti, zum Fin-to, zum Fin-to, zum Scul-tet-ti. Ei,
zu kein'm von bei-den, ei, zu kein'm von bei-den, nein, son-dern zum
Kit-scha
geht der Herr von Li-lien-feld, und nicht der Frei-st\adt-ler, nein,
auch nicht der Gau-li-mau-li,
we-der der Sta-chel-schwein, son-dern der Herr von Li-lien-feld.
%%h170m
%%It150ipi
%%B
%%Apl+t+seb
%%\\nobarnumbers\
%\\def\writebarno{\ifnum\barno1\llap{\oldstyle\the\barno\barnoadd}\fi}\
%\\def\shiftbarno{1\Interligne}\
%\\def\raisebarno{2\Interligne}\
U:1.
@-7 f2 f | g e4 e | f f f f | g2 e | c2+.a | \\\scale{1.3}\ d4 [ c8 b ]
a4 b | \\\scale{1}\
L:{S1}
%%L2
f2 e | d8 c d e f e f g |
U:@ @ 2.~~
a2 of d4- d8 d | e2 a- | a4+.d- d d | e2 a- | a+ r4 e | f d d+ r | r a8
a [ a b ] g a |
[ f e ] d c d c d e |
U:@ @ 3.~~
f4 of d a2+ | r4 a a a | a a- { a2+ |
%%L5
Space: +3
@-2 a4 } a a a |
a a- g2+ | f f4 g |
C: ~ ~ g- f- f- g-
a0 |
C: a-
d4- a8+ g f g f e |
Space: -3
U:@ @ 4~~
@+2 d4 of d+ { d2 | d4 } [ c8 b ] c4 b8 a | d4 d- { d2 |
d8 } d c b c4 a |
e4+ e8 e g c- c4 | [ d8 f ] a g f4 e | d2 c | d4 r r2 of :|
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