[Texascavers] Cave gates saving bats :
Cave gates saving bats By Anne Paine, The Tennessean Monday October 11, 2010 NASHVILLE, Tenn. Kristen Bobo spent her off-time caving and her work hours as a seamstress until disaster struck. Vandals entered a cave she managed in Fentress County and killed dozens of the endangered bats inside. The shock sent her down a new path in life, one that required welding. She is among a band of specialists busy around the nation today building steel gates that control the public's access to caves and mines to protect people, bats and the remnants of other ages. Bobo just finished re-gating one of Tennessee's most sensitive sites, Big Bone Cave near Rock Island State Park, this summer. All it would take is one person going in there and building a fire and destroying all that history, said Bobo, 40, of Cookeville. The site, part of a state natural area, earned its name from the discovery of the prehistoric bones of a giant ground sloth found there in 1811 and taken to the Academy of Natural Sciences in Philadelphia. In its more than six miles of tunnels, cavers in 1971 came across the ancient bones of a jaguar that remain there along with Native American artifacts and pieces of a saltpeter mine from the War of 1812 and the Civil War. Some items have been destroyed or taken by souvenir- grabbing visitors, but wooden water pipes, vats used to dissolve nitrates from the cave earth for the production of black powder for weapons and other finds are still there, said caver Richard Finch, a retired Tennessee Tech professor and a member of the Tennessee Parks and Greenways Foundation advisory board. The foundation raised about $9,000, and the state gave $5,000 for the steel to lock off the cave that is a national natural landmark. The intention is to retain what wasn't harmed before the first gate was put up about 30 years ago, or since folks figured out it could be breached. Much has been learned since that early structure erected by Roy Powers, an engineer who has been dubbed the father of cave gating. That includes the need for vandal-proof, reinforced steel and openings that are right for bats. At Big Bone Cave, you could pick up a rock and bang on it and get a bar out of it if you were patient enough, said Powers, 71, of Lee County, Va. Powers, who taught Bobo and many others the trade, has built more than 300 cave gates, making improvements and sharing information leading to a U. S. Fish and Wildlife Service- approved design. Certain bats wouldn't accept the cave gates, Powers said. We had to figure out why. Designs have been put through wind tunnels and other tests and should not alter a cave's airflow or climate. Change by one degree can make a cave non- desirable for bats, said Chris Clark, with the American Cave Conservation Association in Horse Cave, Ky. The association formed in the 1980s after alarm grew at the increasing broken formations and spray-painting of caves, and now provides cave gating services. In 2000, Bobo was earning her living as a seamstress in Cookeville, making children's clothes and bridal gowns, when she became manager of nearby Wolf River Cave. The caving community has such volunteer positions to help private property owners who can't police caves on their land. Bobo was staggered one day to find about 50 endangered Indiana bats killed on purpose in her cave. The federal wildlife service, which oversees endangered species, funded Powers and an assistant to close the opening, and Bobo followed them for a summer, learning as they built. I really appreciated what they were doing, she said. She signed up at Tennessee Technology Center in Livingston to study welding. She was the only woman in the program. Welding proved the easier part. It takes a lot of math to get a gate right. You don't want to create eddies in the air, she said. A bad gate will run out the bat colony, if not kill them outright. It could keep bats from coming back, for instance, to hibernate in winter. Poorly aligned bars can also result in some dying if a large population is trying to leave through an opening that's not big enough. In the summer, cave-dwelling bats leave every night to feed. Night goggles are used to see which way bats are flying out of a cave before a chute is built as part of the gate. Gating of Wolf River Cave resulted in a jump in the number of bats there, with thousands showing up the next season, she said. The gates can be massive, 50 feet across, and the caves, often in woods, have sometimes required the bars to be flown in by helicopters, brought in by four-wheelers, dragged by mules, hauled with pulleys or carried by willing folks. Gate building, which has been steady in Tennessee and other Southeastern states heavy in limestone caverns, has more recently jumped in the West. _http://www.reformer.com/health/ci_16309853?source=rss_
texascavers Digest 13 Oct 2010 07:39:23 -0000 Issue 1167
texascavers Digest 13 Oct 2010 07:39:23 - Issue 1167 Topics (messages 16276 through 16298): Texas Cavers Reunion 2010! 16276 by: Allan Cobb TSS work session 16277 by: Ron Ralph Date correction 16278 by: Ron Ralph Second correcton 16279 by: Ron Ralph TCR 2010 --Correction for Directions to TCR 16280 by: Allan Cobb French cave diver drowns 16281 by: David October NSS News 16282 by: David Saturday Night dinner at TCR... Help needed! 16283 by: Stefan Creaser back issues of The Texas Caver at TCR 16284 by: Logan McNatt 16285 by: Mark.Alman.L-3com.com IMPORTANT CHANGE Texas Cavers Reunion -- After Hours Arrival 16286 by: Allan Cobb WNS makes the financial news 16287 by: germanyj.aol.com More TCR cook help! 16288 by: Stefan Creaser 16289 by: Stefan Creaser The Chilean mine rescue 16290 by: David 16295 by: SS Chilean Miner Rescue happening right now 16291 by: Logan McNatt 16293 by: Brian Riordan 16294 by: David 16296 by: Antonio AA 16297 by: Fofo Re: TCMA fundraiser 16292 by: Geary Schindel Cave gates saving bats : 16298 by: JerryAtkin.aol.com Administrivia: To subscribe to the digest, e-mail: texascavers-digest-subscr...@texascavers.com To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail: texascavers-digest-unsubscr...@texascavers.com To post to the list, e-mail: texascavers@texascavers.com -- ---BeginMessage--- Howdy y'all TCR will be at Hidden Falls Adventure Park (http://www.hiddenfallsadventurepark.com ) 5 miles east of Marble Falls on FM1431 THIS WEEKEND! Come on out and enjoy all the usual fun and activities. The hot tub and sauna will be up and running Friday and Saturday nights. Friday night, the Bexar Grotto is be having a Fish Fry available for a small donation. Stefan and the cooks are planning some great food got Saturday night! Saturday night, we have a bunch of great door prizes and we will have live music from the Terminal Syphons. If you aren't there, you will miss ALL the fun! Information about TCR is available at www.oztotl.com/tcr, t...@oztotl.com, or by phone at 210-338-0TCR. See y'all there, Allan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Cavers, There is a scheduled second Wednesday work session of the Texas Speleological Survey August 11th at the JJ Pickle Research Center on Burnet Road north of highway 183. We will continue working files and maybe scan and clean a few regular sized maps. This will be the last meeting before TCR and a chance to pack those last items for sale and display. Both publication sales and the library will be open. The door will be open at 5:00 p.m. and stay open till we adjourn. The TSS office phone has been removed so if you get lost or stopped by the guard, call me or someone you think might be there. Remember it is best to arrive before 6:00 pm, or the gate guards might not let you in! If you have questions or problems, please contact me at mailto:ronra...@austin.rr.com ronra...@austin.rr.com or the office manager, Jim Kennedy. Please go to http://www.utexas.edu/tmm/sponsored_sites/tss/tsscalendar.htm http://www.utexas.edu/tmm/sponsored_sites/tss/tsscalendar.htm for additional information. Ron Ralph Cell: 797-3817 Map to the place is at: http://www.utexas.edu/maps/prc/ On PRC map 2 (NW Area), 18-A is the little building just above the ra in Granberry. Park to the south in the PETEX lot across the street (Read Granberry Trail) from building 18-A ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Cavers, Make that September 13 for the TSS work session. Ron ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Cavers, Or was that October 13th? Too much else going on. Ron ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- Howdy y'all, It was pointed out to me that there is a small mistake in the directions. That is what I get for copying and pasting straight from the Hidden Falls website! The site is located east of Marble Falls on FM 1431. If you are coming up 281 from San Antonio, you will turn EAST or RIGHT onto 1431. IF you follow the map, you will do fine! See y'all there... Allan ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- The body of Eric Establie was found today. ---End Message--- ---BeginMessage--- This month's issue features a lot of articles pertaining to CaveTex readers. On page 2 is a very nice black white photo of Joe Datri on rope, taken by Dr. Jean Krejca. Next, is a 7 page article by Dr. Mark Minton including photos and a nice profile map of Sistema Los Toros. Photos feature Dr. Minton, Yvonne Droms, Charles Fromen, Bill Steele, Dr. Diana Tomchick, and others along with some interesting speleothems. The next article features a trip to J2 and a photo of Dr. Bill Stone. The 3rd article written by Ellie Watson, featuring Geoff Hoese, Joe
[Texascavers] live rope cam
Did anybody watch the installation this morning of a web cam on the top of the capsule? It is sending live video images up and down from the top of the capsule. It appears to be held on with a magnet and some duct tape. How is this tiny video camera sending live video to the whole world? That was a good idea, but it seems like they should have had it on the 1st paramedic down the hole. David Locklear - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] cavers recycle
Recycling containers will be available at TCR for the collection of aluminum cans and plastic bottles. Look for them near the Bexar Grotto camp and the food area. The aluminum will be contributed to Green Guy Recycling of San Marcos, the providers of the containers. . Sam
Re: [Texascavers] new TCR photography policy
You don't have to leave your camera at home. Just use a little common sense and have a little RESPECT folks. Give it a try, at least! This is a simple policy with a lot of avenues of interpretation for a reason. Nudity, partial nudity, inebriation, all of these things are more fun without a lot of incriminating photos the next week. If you don't like this policy, then I challenge you to spend all day saturday wearing nothing but paint, a thong, and a sign around your neck that says please take my picture. ...Actually, I think that could be a lot of fun ;) ...but I don't think I'd want to see those photos in the Texas Caver... ~Saj On Fri, Oct 8, 2010 at 11:09 AM, mark.al...@l-3com.com wrote: Agreed, Butch, and the same with *The TEXAS CAVER.* ** I always try to make sure that whatever I print, I would be comfortable with if it was one of my family members or on the cover of the local newspaper (remember those?). If it would embarrass someone or is cave/landowner sensitive, i.e., gives directions to a certain cave, it doesn't go in. Luckily, neither has been a problem. BUT, in the age of Facebook and every yahoo in existence having a cellphone with a camera, how you will ever be able control this is beyond me. The genie is out of the bottle and it, along with personal privacy, has gone the way of the chariot and carbide. (See the Rutgers incident). Rest assured that Butch and I will be the epitome of privacy and good taste, relatively speaking in a caver sense. All the other avenues, good luck with all that! Mark P.S. - I'm surprised this hasn't been discussed sooner, this week or in prior years. -- *From:* Butch Fralia [mailto:bfra...@maverickgrotto.org] *Sent:* Fri 10/8/2010 9:01 AM *To:* 'Saj Zappitello'; Texascavers@texascavers.com *Subject:* RE: [Texascavers] new TCR photography policy Is this an official policy or? Wouldn’t it be easier to just say don’t take photos of naked people? TCR is a difficult place to get photo permission for everyone in the photo, there could be hundreds. If we have to ask permission from everyone in the photo there wont be a TCR photo spread ever again. We always try to keep the website decent and not embarrass anyone. If they are embarrassed, they can request a photo be removed. Butch *From:* Saj Zappitello [mailto:sajar...@gmail.com] *Sent:* Wednesday, October 06, 2010 10:51 AM *To:* Texascavers@texascavers.com *Subject:* [Texascavers] new TCR photography policy In the new generation of social networking sites (like facebook) and a global digital footprint, some of us have been brainstorming new ways to keep TCR a fun and free-spirited retreat from our usual social inhibitions. Our solution is to request that everyone participate in a new photography policy that has worked well at other free-spirited gatherings. Please DO NOT take photographs of anyone without their permission, and certainly do not post photographs of anyone online without permission. The way this works is simple--just ask people before you take their photograph, and ask them again if you want to post photos online. We will post a reminder of this new policy at registration. Let's keep this event fun and wild! Feel free to respond to me OFF LIST if you have comments about this. Thanks and happy caving! ~Saj
[Texascavers] AMCS sales at TCR
As usual, the Association for Mexican Cave Studies will be selling publications at TCR. We should have at least a couple copies of everything in our catalog at amcs-pubs.org (not amcs.org), with lots of copies of newer things. I believe the following are all new since the last TCR AMCS Activities Newsletter 33, June 2010 softbound $10, hardbound $20 AMCS Reprint 11: Mexican Field Trip Guidebooks from the 15th ICS $10 AMCS Bulletin 21: Karst Hydrogeology and Speleogenesis of Sistema Zacatón, by Marcus Gary $14 From Forests to Deserts: A Journey in the Caves of Mexico. Hardbound book by the La Venta group in Italy $32 Huautla: The Mexican Cave. 35-minute 1995 film by Jay Arnold converted to DVD-R. $5 And I don't want to hear anybody say that they know they need issues of the AMCS Activities Newsletter but don't know which ones. This is your warning to check and make a list. -- Bill Mixon, AMCS sales A chicken is the egg's way of making another egg. You may reply to the address this message came from, but for long-term use, save: Personal: bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu AMCS: edi...@amcs-pubs.org or sa...@amcs-pubs.org - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] NSS awards nominations sought
I am seeking nominations on behalf of the Awards Committee for the National Speleological Society's highest awards. The recipients of these awards are selected by the NSS Board of Governors; the Awards Committee's role is mainly to solicit nominations. Recipients receive life membership in the NSS. One person is awarded Honorary Membership each year for outstanding contributions to the field of speleology. Candidates need not be NSS members; the award has often been given to distinguished foreign speleologists. One NSS member each year receives the William J. Stephenson Outstanding Service Award for outstanding service to speleology and the society. I am appending lists of past recipients for your convenience. You could write a nomination yourself, suggest doing so to someone else familiar with your candidate's qualifications, or both. Nominating letters are compiled and sent to the Board of Governors before their spring meeting. The deadline for nominations for the HM and OS awards for 2011 is November 15, 2010. This early deadline is to allow time for members of the Awards Committee and the Board of Governors to add comments to the file. No one else is told the slate of candidates, and all nominating materials are confidential. Nominations for the Honorary Membership and the Outstanding Service Award should be sent to Bill Mixon bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu 14045 North Green Hills Loop Austin, Texas 78737 HONORARY MEMBERS 1941Vernon O. Bailey 1942Roy J. Holden 1943Ralph W. Stone 1944Allyn Coats Swinnerton 1945Alexander Wetmore 1946Robert DeJoly 1947Don Bloch 1948William J. Stephenson 1949Robert Broom 1950Mark R. Harrington 1951Emil W. Haury 1952René G. Jeannel 1953Charles E. Mohr 1954J Harlen Bretz 1955Henri Breuil 1956Norbert Casteret 1957Carl F. Miller 1958Donald R. Griffin 1959John S. Petrie 1960William E. Davies 1962* Julia L. Staniland Day 1963Thomas C. Barr, Jr. 1964Albert Vandel 1965William R. Halliday 1966E. Aubrey Glennie 1967Russell H. Gurnee 1968G. Nicholas Sullivan 1969Walter B. Jones 1970Donald N. Cournoyer 1971John A. Stellmack 1972Jack Herschend 1973Roger Brucker 1974Don Sawyer 1975Derek C. Ford 1976Marjorie H. Sweeting 1977Herb Jan Conn 1978Rane L. Curl 1979George W. Moore 1980John R. Holsinger 1981Eugenio de Bellard Pietre 1982Art Peggy Palmer 1983Joseph Jennings 1984Stewart Peck 1985Merlin Tuttle 1986Jerry D. Vineyard 1987Gregory Tex Yokum 1988Richard A. Watson 1989Patty Jo Watson 1990Ronal C. Kerbo 1991Alexander B. Klimchouk 1992Donald Davis 1993Antonio Nuñez-Jiménez 1994Nicholas C. Crawford 1995David C. Culver 1996Arrigo A. Cigna 1997Stein-Erik Lauritzen 1998William H. Russell 1999Horton Hobbs III 2000Ronald Greeley 2001Paul Williams 2002Trevor Shaw 2003James R. Goodbar 2004Barry F. Beck 2005Yuan Daoxian 2006John Gunn 2007William Elliott 2008John Mylroie 2009Andy Eavis 2010Jim Martin *The apparent gap just reflects a change in the schedule of announcing the award. OUTSTANDING SERVICE AWARD 1973John Cooper 1974Charles Larson 1975William B. White 1976William F. Cuddington III 1977Roy Davis 1978Eugene Vehslage 1979William S. Hill 1980George F. Jackson 1981Jeanne Gurnee 1982G. Thomas Rea 1983David McClurg 1984Evelyn Bradshaw 1985William W. Torode 1986Robert R. Stitt 1987William Mixon 1988W. Roswell Jones 1989Paul J. Stevens 1990Janet B. Thorne 1991Doug Rhodes 1992Sheck Exley 1993Doug Medville 1994Lee Stevens 1995Albert C. Mueller 1996John P. Scheltens 1997John Wilson 1998Bill Varnedoe 1999Warren C. Lewis 2000Richard Blenz 2001Dave Jagnow 2002Robert B. Hoke 2003Hazel E. Medville 2004Dave Bunnell 2005Joel Stevenson 2006Steve Hudson 2007Scott Fee 2008Keith Wheeland 2009Carol Tiderman 2010Cheryl Jones A chicken is the egg's way of making another egg. You may reply to the address this message came from, but for long-term use, save: Personal: bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu AMCS: edi...@amcs-pubs.org or sa...@amcs-pubs.org - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] NSS Science Award
Dear Fellow Cave Scientists/Cavers: In my role as the chair of the Science Award subcommittee of the NSS Awards Committee, I encourage you to submit a nomination for next year’s NSS Science Award. Please think of some good scientists in the various cave and karst disciplines who deserve the recognition. We are looking for people who have made significant contributions to the sciences, but who are also still very active. Close association of the scientist with NSS is not mandatory, but preferable. The nominee must be an NSS member for at least the past two years. Strong preference will be given to nominees who have not received the NSS Honorary Member or Outstanding Service awards (if you’re not sure, check next to the person’s name in the NSS Members Manual or I can let you know). The previous Science Award recipients are: 1994William B. White (geoscience) 1995John Holsinger (biology) 1996Arthur N. Palmer (geoscience) 1997Derek Ford (geoscience) 1998Thomas Poulson (biology) 1999Patty Jo Watson (archeology) 2000John Mylroie (geoscience) 2001James R. Reddell (biology) 2002Carol A. Hill (mineralogy) 2003Paolo Forti (geoscience) 2004E. Calvin Alexander, Jr. (geoscience) 2005Francis G. Howarth (biology) 2006Ira D. Sasowsky (geoscience) 2007 Kathleen H. Lavoie (biology) 2008 Julian Jerry J. Lewis (biology) 2009 Horton H. Hobbs (biology) 2010 Penny Boston (biology) Your nomination letter should include details of the nominee’s contribution to cave science. Please do not assume that “everyone” knows your nominee. Many members of the Awards Committee and the NSS Board of Governors are not scientists and will need this information to make a sound decision. A BRIEF resume attached to your nomination letter can be very useful, especially if trimmed to highlight the most significant achievements. Please keep the process confidential by not letting your nominee know that they have been nominated. Letters from other people supporting your nomination are helpful, especially if they provide additional useful insights into the nominee’s contributions. If you nominated someone that did not get selected last year, please let me know if you'd like me to include that nomination this year. Nominations can be sent to me by mail, e-mail, fax, or as attached e- mail documents. The deadline is November 15th. Mail to: Kathleen Lavoie Arts and Sciences, 101 Ward Hall SUNY Plattsburgh Plattsburgh, NY 1290 lavoi...@plattsburgh.edu 518-564-3152 (fax) 518-564-3150 (any questions) A chicken is the egg's way of making another egg. You may reply to the address this message came from, but for long-term use, save: Personal: bmi...@alumni.uchicago.edu AMCS: edi...@amcs-pubs.org or sa...@amcs-pubs.org - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] TCR Weather Report
Howdy y'all, I wanted to post the weather report for this weekend. The highs Friday, Saturday, and Sunday will be in the mid 80s. The low Friday night will be 47 and Saturday night will be 54. Bring shorts for daytime and a jacket for night. Don't forget something warm to cover with at night. Information about TCR is available at www.oztotl.com/tcr, t...@oztotl.com, or by phone at 210-338-0TCR. See y'all there, Allan - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] Cavers all dressed up, circa 1981
I recently scanned some black and white negatives of a Texas caver wedding back in 1981. You might be surprised at some of the portraits of cavers you know today, all dressed up in their 70s-era best for a church ceremony. Here's a public link of the album on my Facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2093366id=1172443723l=32e1790d48 (You don't have to be a Facebook member to view the images). Frank PS--I'm bummed out that I can't make it back to Texas this weekend to take more embarrassing photos like these at TCR. Frank Binney Frank Binney Associates Interpretive Planning and Media Development P.O. Box 258 Woodacre, CA 94973 415.488.1200 Voice - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] Correct link to caver portraits
I recently scanned some black and white negatives of a Texas caver wedding back in 1981. You might be surprised at some of the portraits of cavers you know today, all dressed up in their 70s-era best for a church ceremony. Here's a public link of the album on my Facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2093366id=1172443723l=32e1790d48 You don't have to be a Facebook member to view the images. Frank PS--I'm bummed out that I can't make it back to Texas this weekend to take more embarrassing photos like these at TCR. Frank Binney Frank Binney Associates Interpretive Planning and Media Development P.O. Box 258 Woodacre, CA 94973 415.488.1200 Voice - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] Frank's photos of 1981 wedding
Thanks Frank. Good examples of the black white world I mentioned in a previous email. The wedding was unusual because it brought together two groups of people who would never have mingled otherwise. Duwain was in the Aggie Cadet Corps, so half of the guests were Aggies, including many cadets. The other half was Barbara's many caver friends from Austin and other places, who showed up with beards, long hair, and wearing blue jeans. Most of the cavers had never met Duwain and were confused, even concerned, about Barbara's decision. Duwain and I had shared a big ol' house in Bryan so I assured them that Barbara had made a good choice. Both groups were on their best behavior and it was a memorable wedding, which as Frank said, has resulted in a lasting relationship. Like a lot of cavers, Barb and Duwain became serious river rafters, and have a successful sideline selling very detailed maps they've made of major rivers in the western U.S. Check out at http:// www.rivermaps.net Logan P.S. Sorry you're not going to be at TCR this year. On 10/13/2010 8:52 PM, Frank Binney wrote: I recently scanned some black and white negatives of a Texas caver wedding back in 1981. You might be surprised at some of the portraits of cavers you know today, all dressed up in their 70s-era best for a church ceremony. Here's a public link of the album on my Facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2093366id=1172443723l=32e1790d48 You don't have to be a Facebook member to view the images. Frank PS--I'm bummed out that I can't make it back to Texas this weekend to take more embarrassing photos like these at TCR. Frank Binney Frank Binney Associates Interpretive Planning and Media Development P.O. Box 258 Woodacre, CA 94973 - Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: texascavers-unsubscr...@texascavers.com For additional commands, e-mail: texascavers-h...@texascavers.com
[Texascavers] photos at TCR -- recap
Howdy folks, So it seems like the word policy has been taken out of context. No one wants a hard and fast rule at TCR, and we shouldn't need to worry about policing. Think of this as an officially approved request. *Please be considerate with your photography.* That's all. And ask your friends to be considerate too. Asking permission to take photos is often a common courtesy; however, the biggest issue is with *posting* photos in a public forum. Once you post a photo online, it never goes away forever. The same is not true of traditional printed medium, until it is scanned in and digitized. Cavers are a community, and when we hang out together, as at TCR, we might want to be able to leave some of the cares of normal life behind. This is why this request is being put forward. Many people behave in ways at TCR that they would not dare even dream of in their normal lives. considerate, flexible, common sense guidelines are preferable to rigid policies Cavers do form a community, and we need to protect the interests of those who would feel (and be) vulnerable without this protection. the concept that TCR is provided as a safe place to turn kids, dogs, and yourself loose for the weekend and enjoy some freedoms that must be kept penned up during one's daily visits to the real world. This ease of distribution, combined with declining respect for privacy throughout much of society, appears to be the real root of an emerging potential problem. Below are the sorts of attitudes that I am trying to discourage. I want everyone to get wild and let loose with me. I think that they are more likely to if these fears are put to rest by a simple considerate approach. If you do something in public that you don't want publicized - then don't do it. don't do it during the daylight hours at TCR. That way no one can take an embarrassing photo of you. unintended and naive use of those photos can and will happen. I want everyone to be comfortable and *do* do it. Let's get informed, and inform our friends, and protect our carefree community. Thanks, ~Saj
Re: [Texascavers] photos at TCR -- recap
TCR supports this awareness program. Please think before you press that button. There will be no photo police at TCR. Allan - Original Message - From: Saj Zappitello To: Texascavers@texascavers.com Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 8:55 PM Subject: [Texascavers] photos at TCR -- recap Howdy folks, So it seems like the word policy has been taken out of context. No one wants a hard and fast rule at TCR, and we shouldn't need to worry about policing. Think of this as an officially approved request. Please be considerate with your photography. That's all. And ask your friends to be considerate too. Asking permission to take photos is often a common courtesy; however, the biggest issue is with posting photos in a public forum. Once you post a photo online, it never goes away forever. The same is not true of traditional printed medium, until it is scanned in and digitized. Cavers are a community, and when we hang out together, as at TCR, we might want to be able to leave some of the cares of normal life behind. This is why this request is being put forward. Many people behave in ways at TCR that they would not dare even dream of in their normal lives. considerate, flexible, common sense guidelines are preferable to rigid policies Cavers do form a community, and we need to protect the interests of those who would feel (and be) vulnerable without this protection. the concept that TCR is provided as a safe place to turn kids, dogs, and yourself loose for the weekend and enjoy some freedoms that must be kept penned up during one's daily visits to the real world. This ease of distribution, combined with declining respect for privacy throughout much of society, appears to be the real root of an emerging potential problem. Below are the sorts of attitudes that I am trying to discourage. I want everyone to get wild and let loose with me. I think that they are more likely to if these fears are put to rest by a simple considerate approach. If you do something in public that you don't want publicized - then don't do it. don't do it during the daylight hours at TCR. That way no one can take an embarrassing photo of you. unintended and naive use of those photos can and will happen. I want everyone to be comfortable and do do it. Let's get informed, and inform our friends, and protect our carefree community. Thanks, ~Saj
