RE: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real

[Fritz Holt]

Louise,
If Methuselah lived 969 years, why can't you?
Fritz


From: Louise Power [mailto:power_lou...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 5:47 PM
To: Don Cooper
Cc: Off Topic
Subject: RE: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real

Do you really believe that any of the happy accidents that make us human are 
exclusive to this little planet? To quote the title of a recent movie: "I want 
to believe."

Looking at the recent news I really don't want to believe that we're at the top 
of the social pyramid; that there's nothing else or nothing better. Or even 
nothing the same. Reminiscent of the old Peggy Lee song, "Is that all there is?"

I refuse to die until I know for sure--one way or another.



List-Post: texascavers@texascavers.com
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 17:24:41 -0500
From: wavyca...@gmail.com
To: power_lou...@hotmail.com
Subject: Re: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real
CC: o...@texascavers.com

Just for the record... and I hope others will chime in as well.
I do NOT believe.
I think that abundant life is out there, and somewhere there are other 
creatures pondering the possible existence of us, as well.  Yet the physical 
obstacle of getting from one island of life to another is so substantial that 
this species will never, ever get to see or experience any other "sentient" 
beings.
Even if we do leave this planet for an interstellar journey before we destroy 
ourselves, I am sure that visiting another solar system will be, for those 
making the trip, a one way experience.
We have, as a species, developed a brain complex and rich enough in abstract 
thought that we are able to convince ourselves that we have seen things which 
we have not - and experienced that which does not and has not ever existed.  
This to me is the realm of of flying saucers, spacemen, rods and gods.
-WaV
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Louise Power 
mailto:power_lou...@hotmail.com>> wrote:
Just thought I'd turn our minds to other subjects:

[http://gfx1.hotmail.com/mail/w3/pr01/emoticons/smile_omg.gif]

Astronaut: Aliens Are Real
By Tom Shoop | Friday, July 25, 2008  |  10:16 AM

Well, the conspiracy had to crack sometime.
Edgar Mitchell, an astronaut on Apollo 14 and the sixth man to walk on the 
moon, told Kerrang! Radio<http://www.kerrangradio.co.uk/Article.asp?id=804160> 
this week that we're not alone in the universe and the government knows all 
about it.
"I happen to have been privileged enough to be in on the fact that we've been 
visited on this planet and the UFO phenomena is real," he said.
Mitchell is more than just a famous astronaut and a scientist. He grew up in 
Roswell, N.M., site of a famous alleged UFO landing. And, he said, "I've been 
in military circles and intelligence circles that know beneath the surface of 
what has been public knowledge that yes, we have been visited. ...I have been 
deeply involved in certain committes and certain research programs with very 
credible scientists and intelligence people that do know the real inside story."
"There's been quite a bit of contact going on," Mitchell added. "The Roswell 
crash was real and [the fact that] a number of other contacts have been real 
and ongoing is pretty well known to those of us who have been briefed and have 
been close to the subject matter."
So who exactly are the visitors? "Some of them are these little people that 
look strange to us," Mitchell said. "As far as I know from my contacts that 
have had contact, that was the reaction."
NASA politely suggests Mitchell doesn't know what he's talking about. "NASA is 
not involved in any sort of cover up about alien life on this planet or 
anywhere in the universe," the agency told the radio station. "Dr. Mitchell is 
a great American, but we do not share his opinion on this issue."
Oh really? If Mitchell's crazy, how do you explain the fact that he got the 
agency's Ambassador of Exploration 
award<http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2006/jan/HQ_M06013_Mitchell_ambassador_award.html>
 just a couple of years ago?

Re: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real

[CaverArch]

In a message dated 07/28/08 17:25:12 Central Daylight Time, wavyca...@gmail.com 
writes:
Just for the record... and I hope others will chime in as well.
I do NOT believe.
Chiming away:  Aliens are probably real, but we aren't going to see them on our 
doorstep (or vice versa)
Interstellar flight is usually conceived as some sort of 'warp drive' that 
makes journeys between stars a matter of weeks or months rather than lifetimes. 
 This sort of technology is clearly, ahem. light years ahead of ours.  But 
interstellar flight is of course possible if a culture is willing to make the 
investment in ships that travel at sub-light speeds, especially if reliable, 
long-term hibernation of some sort is feasible for that species.  That would 
still require a level of technology that is far in advance of our own, but not 
so radically as a [probably impossible] hyperdrive. 

But I doubt that there would be many intelligent species that would want to 
make such an investment, much less persons from those societies that would be 
willing to make such a one-way trip: one in 10,000 species let's say.  Given 
what we now know about the number of stars with planets, number of stars, 
number of galaxies, etc., yes, there may still be thousands of star-faring 
species.  Even so, the chances are infinitely small that one of those should 
happen to show up on earth in the blink of an eye of human existence.  If they 
showed up earlier, then their traces were light and are hidden by our 
geologically active planet.  And if an alien species capable of interstellar 
travel and survival on Earth got here, evolutionary processes have erased any 
trace of their effect on native plants and animals.  

I'd love it if some sort of hyperdrive were possible.  But (aside from 
Einstein) I'm afraid that the best evidence that it is not possible is the fact 
that our world was not colonized eons ago.  I think such a technology, once 
invented, would spread like intergalactic wildfire* among intelligent species, 
and would be as difficult to contain as fire-making or nuclear technology.  And 
once it's introduced, it would be equally difficult to extinguish.  Calamities 
on the scale of star systems or star clusters would not extinguish the 
technology once it's had a little time to spread within a galaxy, and why 
shouldn't it hop galaxies if FTL (faster than light) travel works?  

* consider that it took only a few thousand years for people to spread across 
the Americas on foot, just by natural population increase and following game 
and edible plants.

Roger Moore
GHG

RE: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real

[Louise Power]

Do you really believe that any of the happy accidents that make us human are 
exclusive to this little planet? To quote the title of a recent movie: "I want 
to believe." 
 
Looking at the recent news I really don't want to believe that we're at the top 
of the social pyramid; that there's nothing else or nothing better. Or even 
nothing the same. Reminiscent of the old Peggy Lee song, "Is that all there is?"
 
I refuse to die until I know for sure--one way or another.



List-Post: texascavers@texascavers.com
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 17:24:41 -0500From: wavycaver@gmail.comTo: 
power_louise@hotmail.comSubject: Re: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are RealCC: 
o...@texascavers.com
Just for the record... and I hope others will chime in as well.I do NOT 
believe.I think that abundant life is out there, and somewhere there are other 
creatures pondering the possible existence of us, as well.  Yet the physical 
obstacle of getting from one island of life to another is so substantial that 
this species will never, ever get to see or experience any other "sentient" 
beings.Even if we do leave this planet for an interstellar journey before we 
destroy ourselves, I am sure that visiting another solar system will be, for 
those making the trip, a one way experience.We have, as a species, developed a 
brain complex and rich enough in abstract thought that we are able to convince 
ourselves that we have seen things which we have not - and experienced that 
which does not and has not ever existed.  This to me is the realm of of flying 
saucers, spacemen, rods and gods.-WaV
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Louise Power  wrote:

Just thought I'd turn our minds to other subjects:  Astronaut: Aliens Are 
RealBy Tom Shoop | Friday, July 25, 2008  |  10:16 AM Well, the conspiracy had 
to crack sometime. Edgar Mitchell, an astronaut on Apollo 14 and the sixth man 
to walk on the moon, told Kerrang! Radio this week that we're not alone in the 
universe and the government knows all about it."I happen to have been 
privileged enough to be in on the fact that we've been visited on this planet 
and the UFO phenomena is real," he said. Mitchell is more than just a famous 
astronaut and a scientist. He grew up in Roswell, N.M., site of a famous 
alleged UFO landing. And, he said, "I've been in military circles and 
intelligence circles that know beneath the surface of what has been public 
knowledge that yes, we have been visited. ...I have been deeply involved in 
certain committes and certain research programs with very credible scientists 
and intelligence people that do know the real inside story.""There's been quite 
a bit of contact going on," Mitchell added. "The Roswell crash was real and 
[the fact that] a number of other contacts have been real and ongoing is pretty 
well known to those of us who have been briefed and have been close to the 
subject matter." So who exactly are the visitors? "Some of them are these 
little people that look strange to us," Mitchell said. "As far as I know from 
my contacts that have had contact, that was the reaction." NASA politely 
suggests Mitchell doesn't know what he's talking about. "NASA is not involved 
in any sort of cover up about alien life on this planet or anywhere in the 
universe," the agency told the radio station. "Dr. Mitchell is a great 
American, but we do not share his opinion on this issue."Oh really? If 
Mitchell's crazy, how do you explain the fact that he got the agency's 
Ambassador of Exploration award just a couple of years ago?

RE: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real

[Fritz Holt]

I DON'T EITHER.
Fritz


From: Don Cooper [mailto:wavyca...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 5:25 PM
To: Louise Power
Cc: Off Topic
Subject: Re: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real

Just for the record... and I hope others will chime in as well.
I do NOT believe.
I think that abundant life is out there, and somewhere there are other 
creatures pondering the possible existence of us, as well.  Yet the physical 
obstacle of getting from one island of life to another is so substantial that 
this species will never, ever get to see or experience any other "sentient" 
beings.
Even if we do leave this planet for an interstellar journey before we destroy 
ourselves, I am sure that visiting another solar system will be, for those 
making the trip, a one way experience.
We have, as a species, developed a brain complex and rich enough in abstract 
thought that we are able to convince ourselves that we have seen things which 
we have not - and experienced that which does not and has not ever existed.  
This to me is the realm of of flying saucers, spacemen, rods and gods.
-WaV
On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Louise Power 
mailto:power_lou...@hotmail.com>> wrote:
Just thought I'd turn our minds to other subjects:

[http://gfx1.hotmail.com/mail/w3/pr01/emoticons/smile_omg.gif]

Astronaut: Aliens Are Real
By Tom Shoop | Friday, July 25, 2008  |  10:16 AM

Well, the conspiracy had to crack sometime.
Edgar Mitchell, an astronaut on Apollo 14 and the sixth man to walk on the 
moon, told Kerrang! Radio<http://www.kerrangradio.co.uk/Article.asp?id=804160> 
this week that we're not alone in the universe and the government knows all 
about it.
"I happen to have been privileged enough to be in on the fact that we've been 
visited on this planet and the UFO phenomena is real," he said.
Mitchell is more than just a famous astronaut and a scientist. He grew up in 
Roswell, N.M., site of a famous alleged UFO landing. And, he said, "I've been 
in military circles and intelligence circles that know beneath the surface of 
what has been public knowledge that yes, we have been visited. ...I have been 
deeply involved in certain committes and certain research programs with very 
credible scientists and intelligence people that do know the real inside story."
"There's been quite a bit of contact going on," Mitchell added. "The Roswell 
crash was real and [the fact that] a number of other contacts have been real 
and ongoing is pretty well known to those of us who have been briefed and have 
been close to the subject matter."
So who exactly are the visitors? "Some of them are these little people that 
look strange to us," Mitchell said. "As far as I know from my contacts that 
have had contact, that was the reaction."
NASA politely suggests Mitchell doesn't know what he's talking about. "NASA is 
not involved in any sort of cover up about alien life on this planet or 
anywhere in the universe," the agency told the radio station. "Dr. Mitchell is 
a great American, but we do not share his opinion on this issue."
Oh really? If Mitchell's crazy, how do you explain the fact that he got the 
agency's Ambassador of Exploration 
award<http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2006/jan/HQ_M06013_Mitchell_ambassador_award.html>
 just a couple of years ago?

Re: [ot_caving] Astronaut: Aliens Are Real

[Don Cooper]

Just for the record... and I hope others will chime in as well.
I do NOT believe.
I think that abundant life is out there, and somewhere there are other
creatures pondering the possible existence of us, as well.  Yet the physical
obstacle of getting from one island of life to another is so substantial
that this species will never, ever get to see or experience any other
"sentient" beings.
Even if we do leave this planet for an interstellar journey before we
destroy ourselves, I am sure that visiting another solar system will be, for
those making the trip, a one way experience.
We have, as a species, developed a brain complex and rich enough in abstract
thought that we are able to convince ourselves that we have seen things
which we have not - and experienced that which does not and has not ever
existed.  This to me is the realm of of flying saucers, spacemen, rods and
gods.
-WaV

On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 12:31 PM, Louise Power wrote:

>  Just thought I'd turn our minds to other subjects:
>
>
>
> *Astronaut: Aliens Are Real
> *By Tom Shoop | Friday, July 25, 2008  |  10:16 AM
>
> Well, the conspiracy had to crack sometime.
> *Edgar Mitchell*, an astronaut on Apollo 14 and the sixth man to walk on
> the moon, *told Kerrang! 
> Radio*this week that 
> we're not alone in the universe and the government knows all
> about it.
> "I happen to have been privileged enough to be in on the fact that we've
> been visited on this planet and the UFO phenomena is real," he said.
> Mitchell is more than just a famous astronaut and a scientist. He grew up
> in Roswell, N.M., site of a famous alleged UFO landing. And, he said, "I've
> been in military circles and intelligence circles that know beneath the
> surface of what has been public knowledge that yes, we have been visited.
> ...I have been deeply involved in certain committes and certain research
> programs with very credible scientists and intelligence people that do know
> the real inside story."
> "There's been quite a bit of contact going on," Mitchell added. "The
> Roswell crash was real and [the fact that] a number of other contacts have
> been real and ongoing is pretty well known to those of us who have been
> briefed and have been close to the subject matter."
> So who exactly are the visitors? "Some of them are these little people that
> look strange to us," Mitchell said. "As far as I know from my contacts that
> have had contact, that was the reaction."
> NASA politely suggests Mitchell doesn't know what he's talking about. "NASA
> is not involved in any sort of cover up about alien life on this planet or
> anywhere in the universe," the agency told the radio station. "Dr. Mitchell
> is a great American, but we do not share his opinion on this issue."
> Oh really? If Mitchell's crazy, how do you explain the fact that he *got
> the agency's Ambassador of Exploration 
> award*just
>  a couple of years ago?
>