[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
Thank's for everyone's replies! I don't expect tiddlywiki to radically change. I want to tiddlywiki to modularize its functions, and maybe I can copy them in designing my own wiki. I want to dismantle tiddlywiki, and reconstruct my own wiki with aesthetics in mind from the get go (and interaction on small devices). I'll be happy if jQuery makes this easier by standardizing the feature set of tiddlywiki. maybe there is room for a tiddlywiki 2, where we could demonstrate some radical new changes for modern browsers (without worrying about breaking support/compatibility). but I don't expect this. (just out of curiosity, other than jQuery, what sort of features/goals are in the roadmap for the current tiddlywiki build that is backwards- compatible?) I'm trying to find where html is lacking in designing an interactive application such as tiddlywiki. Is html5 sufficient as it is?--is it is enough to cleanly redefine tiddlywiki? I want to be able design with meaningful markup and progressive css. Markup has become so convoluted with container elements such as div and span that are added only in concern for styling. These are typically used to create complex, fragile layouts and user interactions with css. But I don't think these layouts nor the complicated markup used to create them are necessary to build well-designed websites/applications. Tiddlywiki has a 3-column layout designed with the desktop in mind. Instead of redesigning tiddlywiki for a mobile setting, why not build it so that is usable to everyone and perhaps progressively enhanced for people with more screen real-estate? I don't expect the tiddlywiki crew to answer all these questions. But I do hope you all working on it continue to modularize it. I hope that I can build a tiddlywiki someday (soon) as easily as I build conceptual templates with html and css: by progressively adding modularized javacript functionality to recreate tiddlywiki's functionality transparently with any design. If only these concepts were demo'd somewhere (i.e. an html file demonstrating the javascript for opening and closing tiddlers-- probably trivial). I did notice the save plugin was demo'd at http://jquery.tiddlywiki.org/, and I think this is a step in the right direction. Learning javascript from the bottom is hard when you know when what your trying to recreate is already very evolved and sophisticated. Once I can build designs more rapidly without working _around_ tiddlywiki, I will quickly discover which design is best. Tobias, good luck to what your working on! containing core css definitions to nullify any default browser styles I never go this far when creating stylesheets, but I might try it someday. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
it's nice how tiddlywiki provides several measures of hackability, but when it comes down to it styling it is very difficult We're aware of these issues. Unfortunately, significant changes are often constrained by backwards-compatibility concerns, as a large number of themes, plugins and individual customizations rely on the current DOM structure and styling. I've been trying to design it from the inside-out to be more usable We'd love to hear any suggestions you might have. will I one day be able to rapidly construct a tiddlywiki using a pre-existing, modularized library of rich javascript functions? is tiddlywiki backporting some of its features to jQuery itself, rewriting some of its original features using jQuery, or both? We're definitely aiming to both take advantage of jQuery where sensible and extracting functionality into generic jQuery plugins: http://jquery.tiddlywiki.org Any contributions in that area would be most welcome (best discussed on the developers' list). -- F. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
Hi jk and FND, I agree with jk about certain aspects of design convolutedness. Right now I am working on a flavour for which I stripped all preconfigured design rules. I replaced the shadow-Stylesheets in the file ...well knowing that I need to take care of that when upgrading. Yet, I started completely from scratch (even using css-browser-reset from yui). In terms of finding my own ways, that was a relief, I tell you. I think a good workaround that meets jk's needs (and mine too) were to present at least two standard downloads for TiddlyWiki, the backwards- compat' one and a basic design stripped of every single css declaration from the core that is not essential (even indentation for lists!), containing core css definitions to nullify any default browser styles, presented as a basic TiddlyWiki ...so that those who think they know better how to style it may do so without having to consider any default unnessessary gradients, margins, paddings, fonts, colors and what not... and that is not overriding, but rather starting from (quite a different) scratch, which I would prefer big time (for some use-cases). Consider this: those basic downloads just differ in their pre-applied shadow-StyleSheets... shouldn't that be rather simple to achieve? Or... how about a never upgrade flag for certain shadow tiddlers? Tobias. On 16 Okt., 10:06, FND f...@gmx.net wrote: it's nice how tiddlywiki provides several measures of hackability, but when it comes down to it styling it is very difficult We're aware of these issues. Unfortunately, significant changes are often constrained by backwards-compatibility concerns, as a large number of themes, plugins and individual customizations rely on the current DOM structure and styling. I've been trying to design it from the inside-out to be more usable We'd love to hear any suggestions you might have. will I one day be able to rapidly construct a tiddlywiki using a pre-existing, modularized library of rich javascript functions? is tiddlywiki backporting some of its features to jQuery itself, rewriting some of its original features using jQuery, or both? We're definitely aiming to both take advantage of jQuery where sensible and extracting functionality into generic jQuery plugins: http://jquery.tiddlywiki.org Any contributions in that area would be most welcome (best discussed on the developers' list). -- F. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
You can over ride the PageTemplate gradient with this in the
StyleSheet.
.headerShadow {color:#000;background:#f00}
Using this method, a margin of the macro will still be seen, as the
shadow is offset top left 1px.
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[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
analysed this quite awhile and here are my results.
afaik the macro appends layers of div's with gradiating backgrounds
after .headerForeground and .headerShadow. (try firebug or safari's
web inspector)
so I concocted this to disabled the macro completely:
.header {background:inherit}
.header div+div+div {display:none}
furthermore, to disable the shadow:
.headerShadow {visibility:hidden}
a less elegant but shorter way:
body,.headerForeground {background:#fff;width:100%}
You can over ride the PageTemplate gradient with this in the
StyleSheet.
.headerShadow {color:#000;background:#f00}
Using this method, a margin of the macro will still be seen, as the
shadow is offset top left 1px.
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[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
analysed this quite awhile and here are my results.
afaik the macro appends layers of div's with gradiating backgrounds
after .headerForeground and .headerShadow. (try firebug or safari's
web inspector)
so I concocted this to disabled the macro completely:
.header {background:inherit}
.header div+div+div {display:none}
furthermore, to disable the shadow:
.headerShadow {visibility:hidden}
a less elegant but shorter way:
body,.headerForeground {background:#fff;width:100%}
You can over ride the PageTemplate gradient with this in the
StyleSheet.
.headerShadow {color:#000;background:#f00}
using this method, a margin of the macro will still be seen, as the
shadow is offset top left 1px.
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
TiddlyWiki group.
To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en
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[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
it's nice how tiddlywiki provides several measures of hackability, but when it comes down to it styling it is very difficult. it's hard to measure what is the best way to achieve a look if you didn't write the markup itself or all the default styles. I find tiddlywiki's default look convoluted and distracting (I'm spatially-oriented and dogmatic about aesthetics). I conceptualize a wiki where design disappears, rather than drawing attention to itself. (BTW hacked-up special effects like gradients and text-shadow do not make it any more usable, and barely more attractive. adding complexity to markup for achieving a style effect is a bad idea. CSS3 provides a text-shadow property AND gradients.) I've been trying to design it from the inside-out to be more usable and its a nightmare. if I but more than dabbled in javascript perhaps I would achieve a better understanding of tiddlywiki's guts and it wouldn't be quite such an undertaking. all I know is I spend more time considering how to make tiddlywiki more usable then I do using tiddlywiki. I'm trying to catch up. the use of jQuery in recent versions is exciting, and the idea of modularization of functions. Its important for people to construct their own tools. will I one day be able to rapidly construct a tiddlywiki using a pre-existing, modularized library of rich javascript functions? is tiddlywiki backporting some of its features to jQuery itself, rewriting some of its original features using jQuery, or both? (sorry to get off-topic) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
analysed this quite awhile and here are my results.
afaik the macro appends layers of div's with gradiating backgrounds
after .headerForeground and .headerShadow. (try firebug or safari's
web inspector)
so I concocted this to disabled the macro completely:
.header {background:inherit}
.header div+div+div {display:none}
furthermore, to disable the shadow:
.headerShadow {visibility:hidden}
a less elegant but shorter way:
body,.headerForeground {background:#fff;width:100%}
You can over ride the PageTemplate gradient with this in the
StyleSheet.
.headerShadow {color:#000;background:#f00}
using this method, a margin of the macro will still be seen, as the
shadow is offset top left 1px.
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
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To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at
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[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
(cont..) ...it's nice how tiddlywiki provides several measures of hackability, but when it comes down to it styling it is very difficult. it's hard to measure what is the best way to achieve a look if you didn't write the markup itself or all the default styles. I find tiddlywiki's default look convoluted and distracting (I'm spatially-oriented and dogmatic about aesthetics). I conceptualize a wiki where design disappears, rather than drawing attention to itself. (BTW hacked-up special effects like gradients and text-shadow do not make it any more usable, and barely more attractive. adding complexity to markup for achieving a style effect is a bad idea. CSS3 provides a text-shadow property AND gradients.) I've been trying to design it from the inside-out to be more usable and its a nightmare. if I but more than dabbled in javascript perhaps I would achieve a better understanding of tiddlywiki's guts and it wouldn't be quite such an undertaking. all I know is I spend more time considering how to make tiddlywiki more usable then I do using tiddlywiki. I'm trying to catch up. the use of jQuery in recent versions is exciting, and the idea of modularization of functions. Its important for people to construct their own tools. will I one day be able to rapidly construct a tiddlywiki using a pre-existing, modularized library of rich javascript functions? is tiddlywiki backporting some of its features to jQuery itself, rewriting some of its original features using jQuery, or both? (sorry to get off-topic) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
(also...) it's nice how tiddlywiki provides several measures of hackability, but when it comes down to it styling it is very difficult. it's hard to measure what is the best way to achieve a look if you didn't write the markup itself or all the default styles. I find tiddlywiki's default look convoluted and distracting (I'm spatially-oriented and dogmatic about aesthetics). I conceptualize a wiki where design disappears, rather than drawing attention to itself. (BTW hacked-up special effects like gradients and text-shadow do not make it any more usable, and barely more attractive. adding complexity to markup for achieving a style effect is a bad idea. CSS3 provides a text-shadow property AND gradients.) I've been trying to design it from the inside-out to be more usable and its a nightmare. if I but more than dabbled in javascript perhaps I would achieve a better understanding of tiddlywiki's guts and it wouldn't be quite such an undertaking. all I know is I spend more time considering how to make tiddlywiki more usable then I do using tiddlywiki. I'm trying to catch up. the use of jQuery in recent versions is exciting, and the idea of modularization of functions. Its important for people to construct their own tools. will I one day be able to rapidly construct a tiddlywiki using a pre-existing, modularized library of rich javascript functions? is tiddlywiki backporting some of its features to jQuery itself, rewriting some of its original features using jQuery, or both? (sorry to get off-topic) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
You might as well edit your PageTemplate and remove the gradient macro calls. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
On Oct 15, 1:46 am, Tobias beertob...@googlemail.com wrote: You might as well edit your PageTemplate and remove the gradient macro calls. The question was; can the header gradient macro be overidden with a style rule? Which it can. However if you just want the header to be a solid color you could edit the PageTemplate and make both gradient colors the same color. Morris On Oct 15, 1:46 am, Tobias beertob...@googlemail.com wrote: You might as well edit your PageTemplate and remove the gradient macro calls. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups TiddlyWiki group. To post to this group, send email to tiddlywiki@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tiddlywiki+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tiddlywiki?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
Hi,
Have you tried this:
http://tiddlywiki.org/wiki/How_To/Header_Macro/Plugin_(for_Custom_Graphic_Header)
//Tobbe
On 13 Okt, 18:57, jk emailo...@gmail.com wrote:
can the header gradient macro be overidden with a style rule?
I tried
.header {background:#f00!important}
but no luck. I know I could modify the PageTemplate, but I'm trying to
implement a theme using only the stylesheet tiddler.
It's easier to maintain and distribute this way.
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[tw] Re: style to override the header gradient?
On Oct 14, 3:57 am, jk emailo...@gmail.com wrote:
can the header gradient macro be overidden with a style rule?
I tried
.header {background:#f00!important}
You can over ride the PageTemplate gradient with this in the
StyleSheet.
.headerShadow {color:#000;background:#f00;}
Morris
On Oct 14, 3:57 am, jk emailo...@gmail.com wrote:
can the header gradient macro be overidden with a style rule?
I tried
.header {background:#f00!important}
but no luck. I know I could modify the PageTemplate, but I'm trying to
implement a theme using only the stylesheet tiddler.
It's easier to maintain and distribute this way.
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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