[time-nuts] Fwd: Re: fluke.l monitor for Thunderbolt . . . the saga continues

[Steve]

   Here's where I am with the replacement microcontroller subboard for the
   fluke.l iCruze display.
   I used my bench power supply to slowly bring up the voltage on the
   replacement microcontroller subboard without it being installed on the
   display motherboard. The current limiting was set to about half an amp.
   As the input voltage to the microcontroller subboard got above about
   5VDC, it went into current limiting. This is a board that should take a
   few tens of milliamperes, so something was clearly wrong. And the
   trouble was easy to locate. It didn't take long to find a blob of
   solder on the 3-pin voltage regulator between the output pin and
   ground. I fixed that and the current draw was then about what I
   expected.
   I was reluctant to go further with this board since the solder blob
   surely indicates the board was not tested following assembly. What else
   would be wrong? Was the microcontroller even programmed?
   I forged ahead and installed it on the iCruze board. No joy. VDD on the
   microcontroller was about 3.1VDC. I could see voltage transitions on
   the microcontroller input pin. But nothing on the iCruze. Maybe the
   microcontroller is not programmed, maybe something else is wrong.
   Someone suggested in early June that the original microcontroller
   subboard might be salvageable, could not find the email so I do not
   know who to thank for the advice. I replaced the zero ohm resistors at
   D1, D2 and D2 with 1N914 diodes. The microcontroller VDD went from
   about 5VDC to about 3.2VDC. And it worked. The iCruze is now displaying
   the usual data from the Thunderbolt. It's been running much of the
   afternoon, I hope I'm back in business.
   Wonder if the microcontroller's life has been shortened by having VDD
   at 5VDC for almost a year?
   Thanks all for the insightful advice.
   Steve
    Original Message 

Subject: Re: [time-nuts] fluke.l monitor for Thunderbolt . . . the saga
 continues
   Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2011 18:56:45 -0400
   From: Steve [1]
   Reply-To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
 [2]
 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
 [3]

The replacement board looks like the one pictured on Brooke's web site.
Same processor as the older board. Hope to get it installed this evening
or tomorrow, I'll post the results.

Thanks all for the help.

Steve

On 7/6/2011 5:11 PM, Brooke Clarke wrote:
> Hi Steve:
>
> The last couple of board versions have a 3-terminal voltage regulator
> on board.  See the photos at:
> [4]http://www.prc68.com/I/ThunderBolt.shtml#8051PCB
>
> Have Fun,
>
> Brooke Clarke
> [5]http://www.PRC68.com
>
>
> Steve wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> About a month ago I sought advice from list members regarding a
>> dysfunctional fluke.l monitor for my Thunderbolt GPS receiver.
>> Someone suggested that I contact Bob at fluke.l to see what he would
>> do. I took that advice and thought some of you would be interested
>> where I am now. Plus, I need some more advice :-)
>>
>> Communicating with Bob is a challenge due to my not knowing any
>> Chinese and Bob having quite limited English language skills.
>> Following a number of emails back and forth, Bob sent me a
>> replacement microprocessor board.
>>
>> The layout of the replacement unit differs from the layout of the
>> older microprocessor board. The lengths are about the same, but the
>> replacement board is a bit more narrow than the older board. Further,
>> the microprocessor chip on the replacement board is parallel to the
>> short dimension of the board whereas that IC is parallel to the long
>> dimension of the board on the older unit.
>>
>> Does anyone know if the replacement board with its different layout
>> has the voltage problem I was seeing with the older board? The older
>> board has the microprocessor VDD at about 5V. I understand that VDD
>> should be about 3V and am wondering if the replacement board has
>> corrected that problem?
>>
>> Is it as simple as removing the older, existing board and soldering
>> the replacement unit in its place? Any tips as to how to most easily
>> remove the existing board?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Steve
>>
>
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References

   1. mailto:stev...@suddenlink.net
   2. mailto:time-nuts@febo.com
   3. mailto:time-nuts@febo.com
   4. http://www.prc68.com/I/ThunderBolt.shtml#8051PCB
   5. http://www.PRC68.com/
   6. mailto:time-nuts

Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 84, Issue 25

[David I. Emery]

On Fri, Jul 08, 2011 at 08:12:42PM -0400, brent evers wrote:
> I've actually found the separate mechanical and digital displays quite
> useful.  I spent a lot of time on science vessels and would set one to
> "science time" (GMT) and the other to what ever timezone we happened
> to be adhering to for daily operations, which can vary quite a bit
> when you are working near the poles.

This watch does that, it has dual times of day and a mode where a 
secondary window displays the second time zone with the hands and the
primary display on the other.

Interestingly the two times it keeps can be off in the minutes and
hours, but not in the seconds.   Are those world cities where for religious
purposes mean solar time is observed only on even minute boundaries ?



-- 
  Dave Emery N1PRE/AE, d...@dieconsulting.com  DIE Consulting, Weston, Mass 
02493
"An empty zombie mind with a forlorn barely readable weatherbeaten
'For Rent' sign still vainly flapping outside on the weed encrusted pole - in 
celebration of what could have been, but wasn't and is not to be now either."


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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Bruce Lane]

The only time I wear one is if I'm traveling, and I need to be certain 
places at certain times. Outside of that, I've not worn one for... gad, has it 
really been 25+ years?

My timepiece of choice is an old Casio G-Shock model on a Velcro band. 
Very comfortable.

Happy travels.

*** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***

On 08-Jul-11 at 09:47 ed breya wrote:

>I also hate wearing any kind of jewelry - watchbands and rings seem 
>to cut off circulation, even when sized right. A few years ago I 
>accidentally wrecked the nice Seiko that my wife gave me. Since then 
>I have used cheap no-brand watches attached to my 30 year old Speidel 
>Twistoflex band - the only kind that I can stand to wear.  When I get 
>a new watch, I just toss the band and hook it up to the old 
>Twistoflex, and it's good for a couple of more years. I have found 
>the best deal so far - $5 for battery powered analog ones at Big 
>Lots. I bought a couple of spares for when my $20 one finally craps 
>out. I have spent about a thousand dollars over the years collecting 
>various GPS, Rb, and OCXO items for precision frequency references, 
>but $5 seems about right for an everyday timepiece. It's OK with me 
>as long as my watch isn't off by more than a few minutes, but I want 
>my 10 MHz to be perfect.
>
>
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>signature database 6278 (20110708) __
>
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-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Bruce Lane, Owner & Head Hardware Heavy,
Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com
kyrrin (at) bluefeathertech do/t c=o=m
"Quid Malmborg in Plano..."


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Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 84, Issue 25

[brent evers]

I've actually found the separate mechanical and digital displays quite
useful.  I spent a lot of time on science vessels and would set one to
"science time" (GMT) and the other to what ever timezone we happened
to be adhering to for daily operations, which can vary quite a bit
when you are working near the poles.

Brent

On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 5:58 PM, David I. Emery  wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 08, 2011 at 11:11:34AM -0700, Burt I. Weiner wrote:
>> Being in broadcast I need to know what time it is. I wear a wrist
>> watch with real hands on it so I can tell what time it is.  For a
>> wrist watch, I personally don't care for a digital readout.  I grew
>> up with a wrist watch that had real hands and I learned to tell time
>> and how much time I had simply by looking at the position of the
>> hands, I didn't have to do any math at all in my head.   All that I
>> need to know, for example, is that I need to be somewhere in 3/4 of a
>> turn of the big hand.  In my case I don't always need precision time,
>> I deal with that separately.
>
>        I actually wear an 80s AE-20W Casio watch that has both
> synthetic LCD hands on a clockface and a normal digital time display.
> The LCD hands are sync'd with the digital display - unlike some hybrids
> where a mechanical type movement driven by a step pulse was combined
> with a digital time/stopwatch/alarm display that had no other connection
> to it other than a common timebase.
>
>
>
> --
>  Dave Emery N1PRE/AE, d...@dieconsulting.com  DIE Consulting, Weston, Mass 
> 02493
> "An empty zombie mind with a forlorn barely readable weatherbeaten
> 'For Rent' sign still vainly flapping outside on the weed encrusted pole - in
> celebration of what could have been, but wasn't and is not to be now either."
>
>
> ___
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Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 84, Issue 25

[David I. Emery]

On Fri, Jul 08, 2011 at 11:11:34AM -0700, Burt I. Weiner wrote:
> Being in broadcast I need to know what time it is. I wear a wrist 
> watch with real hands on it so I can tell what time it is.  For a 
> wrist watch, I personally don't care for a digital readout.  I grew 
> up with a wrist watch that had real hands and I learned to tell time 
> and how much time I had simply by looking at the position of the 
> hands, I didn't have to do any math at all in my head.   All that I 
> need to know, for example, is that I need to be somewhere in 3/4 of a 
> turn of the big hand.  In my case I don't always need precision time, 
> I deal with that separately.

I actually wear an 80s AE-20W Casio watch that has both
synthetic LCD hands on a clockface and a normal digital time display.  
The LCD hands are sync'd with the digital display - unlike some hybrids
where a mechanical type movement driven by a step pulse was combined
with a digital time/stopwatch/alarm display that had no other connection
to it other than a common timebase.



-- 
  Dave Emery N1PRE/AE, d...@dieconsulting.com  DIE Consulting, Weston, Mass 
02493
"An empty zombie mind with a forlorn barely readable weatherbeaten
'For Rent' sign still vainly flapping outside on the weed encrusted pole - in 
celebration of what could have been, but wasn't and is not to be now either."


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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Pete Lancashire]

i know you didnt ... it was quite the surprise. But then "Elder Packing"
was not your modern company. Everyone from the janitor up had a full
pension. Mr. Elder sold out to a maga-corp. Rest of the story is text book.

-pete

On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 12:21 PM, Chuck Harris  wrote:
> Hi Pete,
>
> I wasn't implying that it was a cheapie... though most of the more expensive
> watches are at least 21J...   A solid gold case will bring the price up pdq!
> I was just saying that a lot of companies are giving "gold" watches to any
> employee that hangs on long enough to retire.  The cost of that gift isn't
> necessarily high enough to preclude the gesture.
>
> I think the sentiment behind a company giving a treasured employee a gold
> watch on retirement is a very nice one... hopefully there will be some sort
> of pension to go along with it... In my grandfather's day, that wasn't often
> the case.  The watch *was* the pension.
>
> -Chuck
>
> Pete Lancashire wrote:
>>
>> I thouth as well that it was just a cheapie, but when I got it I took
>> it to get it cleaned and to replace the crystal. My watch/clock guy
>> was quite surprised. It was not gold plated but 14ct gold, cheapies
>> where 10ct or plated.
>> I don't have the info with me but he told me it was not your usual
>> gift watch for a 'worker' and in 1968 would have
>> cost around $150.
>>
>> another favorite one i got at a junk store and had fixed was a gift to
>> a Westinghouse Elevator employee, on the
>> face the 1-12 are replaced with W E S T I N G H O U S E and on the
>> back 'for 20 years service, the person name
>> and 'what goes up must come down'.
>>
>> -pete
>
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[d . seiter]

I fall into this category too.  I used to wear an Avocet altimeter watch all 
the time, but once the last of the three I had could no longer be fixed, I just 
kind of gave up.  I don't usually carry a cellphone either.  I keep thinking I 
should get a watch for those occations when I might actually need one, but I 
rarely see any I like. 



Dave
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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[Rex]

On 7/8/2011 7:57 AM, Javier Herrero wrote:
As a matter of curiosity... Am I the only time nut that does not wear 
a wrist watch? Or... perhaps I'm not a true time nut... :)


Regards,

Javier



He he. Me too. Back when I used to wear a wrist watch, I found I would 
neurotically keep glancing at it even though I didn't have any reason to 
want to know the time. Other disadvantages: wrist tan lines, bashing a 
good watch against something, snagging safety issues, etc.


My solution -- I bought a cheap Timex quartz wristwatch and cut and 
filed the lugs for the wrist band off of it. So I turned it into a small 
pocket watch. When I really want to know the time I reach into my pocket 
and pull it out.


Now I usually carry a phone too, but I find the "pocket watch" easier to 
read, so I keep that too.



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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Chuck Harris]

Hi Pete,

I wasn't implying that it was a cheapie... though most of the more expensive
watches are at least 21J...   A solid gold case will bring the price up pdq!
I was just saying that a lot of companies are giving "gold" watches to any
employee that hangs on long enough to retire.  The cost of that gift isn't
necessarily high enough to preclude the gesture.

I think the sentiment behind a company giving a treasured employee a gold
watch on retirement is a very nice one... hopefully there will be some sort
of pension to go along with it... In my grandfather's day, that wasn't often
the case.  The watch *was* the pension.

-Chuck

Pete Lancashire wrote:

I thouth as well that it was just a cheapie, but when I got it I took
it to get it cleaned and to replace the crystal. My watch/clock guy
was quite surprised. It was not gold plated but 14ct gold, cheapies
where 10ct or plated.
I don't have the info with me but he told me it was not your usual
gift watch for a 'worker' and in 1968 would have
cost around $150.

another favorite one i got at a junk store and had fixed was a gift to
a Westinghouse Elevator employee, on the
face the 1-12 are replaced with W E S T I N G H O U S E and on the
back 'for 20 years service, the person name
and 'what goes up must come down'.

-pete


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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Chuck Harris]

I too love wearing a wrist watch Since I am always working with machines,
I tend to scar my watches up quite a bit... therefor I tend to wear cheap
watches... my current favorite is a Russian automatic dive watch that I picked
up on ebay for $60.

I only wear automatic winding mechanical watches.  They are more than accurate
enough to help me plot my way through life.

Speidel Twist-O-Flex bands are the only type worth wearing in my opinion.

-Chuck Harris

William H. Fite wrote:

Bravo, Rob.  I thought I was the lone voice crying in the wilderness in
support of watches.

My "beater" is an Omega Seamaster that goes everywhere and does everything
all the time.  My others tend to sit in their rocker boxes and seldom get
worn.


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Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 84, Issue 25

[Burt I. Weiner]

Being in broadcast I need to know what time it is. I wear a wrist 
watch with real hands on it so I can tell what time it is.  For a 
wrist watch, I personally don't care for a digital readout.  I grew 
up with a wrist watch that had real hands and I learned to tell time 
and how much time I had simply by looking at the position of the 
hands, I didn't have to do any math at all in my head.   All that I 
need to know, for example, is that I need to be somewhere in 3/4 of a 
turn of the big hand.  In my case I don't always need precision time, 
I deal with that separately.


Burt, K6OQK



From: John Green 
To: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my cellphone
or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.


Burt I. Weiner Associates
Broadcast Technical Services
Glendale, California  U.S.A.
b...@att.net
www.biwa.cc
K6OQK 



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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[William H. Fite]

Bravo, Rob.  I thought I was the lone voice crying in the wilderness in
support of watches.

My "beater" is an Omega Seamaster that goes everywhere and does everything
all the time.  My others tend to sit in their rocker boxes and seldom get
worn.



On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 12:51 PM, Rob Kimberley 
wrote:

> I'm sitting in the other camp - have many watches, but wear my favourite -
> a Seiko Chrono all the time - never take it off. Hot baths, showers, sea
> etc.  Never let me down (yet). Accurate to I guess not what, but I just love
> it.
> Sorry
>
> Rob K
>
> -Original Message-
> From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On
> Behalf Of Steve
> Sent: 08 July 2011 4:46 PM
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
> Cc: time-nuts@febo.com
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?
>
> Haven't worn a watch in 40+ years as they (and jewelry of any kind) were a
> non-no working in a metrology lab and later around high voltages. I just got
> out of the habit of wearing one and I never had a watch that, no matter how
> well it kept time on the bench or bed stand, would not either noticeably
> gain or lose time or go nuts when I wore it. I had one wind-up I wore for a
> couple of months but kept smashing the crystal at an after school job, so it
> went in the drawer, too. Drives my wife crazy when I complain the clocks in
> the house are off by a minute or so while my clocks in the shop are accurate
> to microseconds...
>
> Steve
>
>
> On Jul 8, 2011, at 10:32 AM, Javier Herrero 
> wrote:
>
> > I see we are twin souls. Exactly the same :)
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Javier
> >
> > El 08/07/2011 17:19, John Green escribi :
>  >> I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my
> >> cellphone or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I
> >> don't wear my wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
> >> ___
> >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to
> >> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> >> and follow the instructions there.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > ___
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>
>
>
>
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Rob Kimberley]

I'm sitting in the other camp - have many watches, but wear my favourite - a 
Seiko Chrono all the time - never take it off. Hot baths, showers, sea etc.  
Never let me down (yet). Accurate to I guess not what, but I just love it.
Sorry

Rob K

-Original Message-
From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf 
Of Steve
Sent: 08 July 2011 4:46 PM
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
Cc: time-nuts@febo.com
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

Haven't worn a watch in 40+ years as they (and jewelry of any kind) were a 
non-no working in a metrology lab and later around high voltages. I just got 
out of the habit of wearing one and I never had a watch that, no matter how 
well it kept time on the bench or bed stand, would not either noticeably gain 
or lose time or go nuts when I wore it. I had one wind-up I wore for a couple 
of months but kept smashing the crystal at an after school job, so it went in 
the drawer, too. Drives my wife crazy when I complain the clocks in the house 
are off by a minute or so while my clocks in the shop are accurate to 
microseconds...

Steve


On Jul 8, 2011, at 10:32 AM, Javier Herrero  wrote:

> I see we are twin souls. Exactly the same :)
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Javier
> 
> El 08/07/2011 17:19, John Green escribi :
>> I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my 
>> cellphone or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I 
>> don't wear my wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
>> ___
>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to 
>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>> and follow the instructions there.
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> ___
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[ed breya]

I also hate wearing any kind of jewelry - watchbands and rings seem 
to cut off circulation, even when sized right. A few years ago I 
accidentally wrecked the nice Seiko that my wife gave me. Since then 
I have used cheap no-brand watches attached to my 30 year old Speidel 
Twistoflex band - the only kind that I can stand to wear.  When I get 
a new watch, I just toss the band and hook it up to the old 
Twistoflex, and it's good for a couple of more years. I have found 
the best deal so far - $5 for battery powered analog ones at Big 
Lots. I bought a couple of spares for when my $20 one finally craps 
out. I have spent about a thousand dollars over the years collecting 
various GPS, Rb, and OCXO items for precision frequency references, 
but $5 seems about right for an everyday timepiece. It's OK with me 
as long as my watch isn't off by more than a few minutes, but I want 
my 10 MHz to be perfect.



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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Pete Lancashire]

I thouth as well that it was just a cheapie, but when I got it I took
it to get it cleaned and to replace the crystal. My watch/clock guy
was quite surprised. It was not gold plated but 14ct gold, cheapies
where 10ct or plated.
I don't have the info with me but he told me it was not your usual
gift watch for a 'worker' and in 1968 would have
cost around $150.

another favorite one i got at a junk store and had fixed was a gift to
a Westinghouse Elevator employee, on the
face the 1-12 are replaced with W E S T I N G H O U S E and on the
back 'for 20 years service, the person name
and 'what goes up must come down'.

-pete



On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:51 AM, Chuck Harris  wrote:
> Actually, that still happens quite a lot.  A nice looking, but not high
> end gold plated watch can be had very cheaply these days.  I get catalogs
> addressed to my business that have engraved gold retirement watches anywhere
> from $30 to thousands.  It is mostly just symbolic... in *my* grandfather's
> day, it *was* your retirement compensation.  I think you were expected to
> eat
> it, or pawn it...
>
> -Chuck Harris
>
>
> Pete Lancashire wrote:
>>
>> How may factory workers get an engraved 17 jewel watch when they retire
>> now days ?
>>
>> -pete
>
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch

[Charles P. Steinmetz]

Javier wrote:

As a matter of curiosity... Am I the only time nut that does not 
wear a wrist watch?


Nope.  And it's not because I get the time from a cell phone or PDA 
-- I don't carry those, either.


I very occasionally (once or twice a year) wear one of my pocket 
watches.  Almost never a wristwatch.  I can't even imaging having one 
of the 8-10 mm thick, 150 g monster "chronometers" strapped to my wrist.


Charles







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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[William H. Fite]

I bow to your expertise, Chuck.  I thought the tone of year earlier post was
a bit dismissive, given the significant role that the Accutron played in
early aerospace history.

Not everyone agrees with you concerning the Ag2O cells.  I have been
collecting Accutrons since I bought my first one in 1965.  I know, at least
casually, several of the legitimate Accutron
specialists/restorers/rebuilders in the US and one in Australia.  Their
consensus is that ~80% of Accutrons will run on 1.55v cells without
overdriving and "jumping" (as they call it) the index wheel.  Some of them
do the resistor mod as a matter of course (unless the owner is a purist who
wants a completely unmodified movement) but even those folks will tell you
it usually isn't necessary.

I've been told that the danger isn't so much to the coil as to the jewels on
the pawl and index fingers, but you doubtless know a lot more about that
than I do.  Coils go when someone puts a new battery in a watch that hasn't
run in years and has a gummed up gear train.

There certainly used to be a lot of Accutrons that could be picked up in
pawn shops and at yard sales for a song.  I have a beautiful chapter ring
Spaceview that I bought for $25.  Alas, haven't seen one for that money in
many a year.

With respect to Accutrons in your dresser drawer, I was just being a
smartass.  [?]

Bill



On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 11:41 AM, Chuck Harris  wrote:

> Hi Bill,
>
> You obviously don't know me!  I've been an amateur watchmaker for a lot
> of years, and I have serviced just about anything that ticks.  My
> collection of clocks and watches, though modest compared to most
> collectors,
> is certainly eclectic.
>
> My observations about Accutrons are accurate.  It isn't all that hard
> to find them, but when you do, they are mostly taking up space in a
> jewelry drawer... even among watch enthusiasts.  They show up all the
> time in yard, and estate sales for giveaway prices like all non
> working watches.
>
> Most Accutrons do *not* run perfectly on 1.55V cells, the tuning fork is
> over-driven, and tends to kick the pawls unevenly.  214's are not at all
> amused by that... just listening to them try makes me cringe.  I recall
> that the later 218's are better about silver oxide cells.  (I can't help
> but think such over-driving will have an effect on the life of the watch.
> Coil failures are already rampant in the species.)
>
> The proper thing to do is change the biasing resistor in the watch.  The
> cells will last longer, and the watch sounds much happier.
>
> I have had the opportunity to own just about any watch I want, and I
> tend towards $50 Russian automatic dive watches, and 1950's Bulova 10BPAC
> (10BOAC) automatics.  I have a certain fondness for the manual wind 10AK
> movements too... But I never much cared for the Accutron.
>
> I may be dumb, but I do know the market rates for Accutrons.  If I had
> any, I would be fixing and selling them, not giving them away.
>
>
> -Chuck Harris
>
> William H. Fite wrote:
>
>> Oh, Chuck!  You have no soul.  [?]  People collect and use Accutrons for
>> the
>> same reason that people collect and use manual Omega Speedmaster
>> Professionals.  And the same reason that some of us keep old shipboard
>> chronometers (mine was built by Thomas Bassnet a little over 250 years
>> ago)
>> and other vintage timepieces.  We pay a mint to have them cleaned and
>> lubricated and we understand that their inaccuracy is not a fault but a
>> measure of where the technology was when they were built.
>>
>> Those cranky, noisy, inaccurate old devices that you scorn took explorers
>> across the oceans and to the moon and back.  They are not to be lightly
>> dismissed.
>>
>> Most Accutrons run perfectly on 1.55v Ag2O cells and those that don't are
>> very easily modified to do so.  There are a number of highly capable
>> watchmakers who can restore and maintain them though some 214 parts are
>> becoming scarce.  A number of hacks, too, of course.
>>
>> I also like automatic movements and am wearing an Omega Seamaster right
>> this
>> minute.
>>
>> The hum when you lay it on the dresser is part of it.
>>
>> You can send me all the Accutrons that are doing drawer duty at your
>> house.
>>
>> Bill
>>
>
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[jmfranke]

I prefer an inexpensive pocket watch, which I carry everyday, everywhere. As 
with John Harrison, I use it to carry time from one good clock to another. I 
depend on its short term stability rather than its long term accuracy.


John  WA4WDL

--
From: "Russell Rezaian" 
Sent: Friday, July 08, 2011 11:48 AM
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" 


Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

While I do sometimes wear a wristwatch, I find I normally don't.  I 
usually use a stand alone clock of some sort, or the time display on my 
phone.


As for Time Nut relevance, it's still true that you can get much better 
accuracy and precision for a given cost in a clock that most people would 
not find comfortable to wear (with all due respect to the Atomic Wrist 
Watch from TvB's web site :) ) as opposed to what most of the rest of us 
would consider wearable.


That said, I think it's quite reasonable for time nuts to prefer to check 
the time with clocks that are not exactly wrist friendly.


I do wish it was simpler to NTP synchronize the clock on my phone though. 
One nice thing about the CDMA phone I had years ago was that I knew the 
clock on the phone was going to be reasonably accurate.  Time sync for GSM 
phones is not as nice.

--
Russell

At 5:32 PM +0200 2011/07/08, Javier Herrero wrote:

I see we are twin souls. Exactly the same :)

Regards,

Javier

El 08/07/2011 17:19, John Green escribió:
I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my 
cellphone

or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.


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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Chuck Harris]

Actually, that still happens quite a lot.  A nice looking, but not high
end gold plated watch can be had very cheaply these days.  I get catalogs
addressed to my business that have engraved gold retirement watches anywhere
from $30 to thousands.  It is mostly just symbolic... in *my* grandfather's
day, it *was* your retirement compensation.  I think you were expected to eat
it, or pawn it...

-Chuck Harris


Pete Lancashire wrote:

How may factory workers get an engraved 17 jewel watch when they retire
now days ?

-pete


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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Russell Rezaian]

While I do sometimes wear a wristwatch, I find I 
normally don't.  I usually use a stand alone 
clock of some sort, or the time display on my 
phone.


As for Time Nut relevance, it's still true that 
you can get much better accuracy and precision 
for a given cost in a clock that most people 
would not find comfortable to wear (with all due 
respect to the Atomic Wrist Watch from TvB's web 
site :) ) as opposed to what most of the rest of 
us would consider wearable.


That said, I think it's quite reasonable for time 
nuts to prefer to check the time with clocks that 
are not exactly wrist friendly.


I do wish it was simpler to NTP synchronize the 
clock on my phone though.  One nice thing about 
the CDMA phone I had years ago was that I knew 
the clock on the phone was going to be reasonably 
accurate.  Time sync for GSM phones is not as 
nice.

--
Russell

At 5:32 PM +0200 2011/07/08, Javier Herrero wrote:

I see we are twin souls. Exactly the same :)

Regards,

Javier

El 08/07/2011 17:19, John Green escribió:

I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my cellphone
or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.


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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[William H. Fite]

I worked at one time for an employer who give 35-year retirees a Rolex.
That was about 20 years ago but I think they still do it.




On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 11:37 AM, Pete Lancashire wrote:

> I normally don't. Use to but one day it stopped working and never got
> it repaired.
> But then I have 20+ clocks at home and a Nixie(R) clock on my desk at work.
>
> The only one I wear now on special events is a retirement gift to my
> grandfather
> when he retired in the the late 60's.
>
> How may factory workers get an engraved 17 jewel watch when they retire
> now days ?
>
> -pete
>
> On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:19 AM, John Green  wrote:
> > I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my
> cellphone
> > or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
> > wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
> > ___
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> >
>
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Steve]

Haven't worn a watch in 40+ years as they (and jewelry of any kind) were a 
non-no working in a metrology lab and later around high voltages. I just got 
out of the habit of wearing one and I never had a watch that, no matter how 
well it kept time on the bench or bed stand, would not either noticeably gain 
or lose time or go nuts when I wore it. I had one wind-up I wore for a couple 
of months but kept smashing the crystal at an after school job, so it went in 
the drawer, too. Drives my wife crazy when I complain the clocks in the house 
are off by a minute or so while my clocks in the shop are accurate to 
microseconds...

Steve


On Jul 8, 2011, at 10:32 AM, Javier Herrero  wrote:

> I see we are twin souls. Exactly the same :)
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Javier
> 
> El 08/07/2011 17:19, John Green escribió:
>> I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my cellphone
>> or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
>> wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
>> ___
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>> and follow the instructions there.
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[bownes]

Guess I'm an oddball, I have my choice of about a dozen wrist bourn time pieces 
from the dresser. 

Hardly the best, but my favourite is a euro spec tag heurer chrono. 





On Jul 8, 2011, at 11:37, Pete Lancashire  wrote:

> I normally don't. Use to but one day it stopped working and never got
> it repaired.
> But then I have 20+ clocks at home and a Nixie(R) clock on my desk at work.
> 
> The only one I wear now on special events is a retirement gift to my 
> grandfather
> when he retired in the the late 60's.
> 
> How may factory workers get an engraved 17 jewel watch when they retire
> now days ?
> 
> -pete
> 
> On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:19 AM, John Green  wrote:
>> I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my cellphone
>> or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
>> wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
>> ___
>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>> and follow the instructions there.
>> 
> 
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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[Chuck Harris]

Hi Bill,

You obviously don't know me!  I've been an amateur watchmaker for a lot
of years, and I have serviced just about anything that ticks.  My
collection of clocks and watches, though modest compared to most collectors,
is certainly eclectic.

My observations about Accutrons are accurate.  It isn't all that hard
to find them, but when you do, they are mostly taking up space in a
jewelry drawer... even among watch enthusiasts.  They show up all the
time in yard, and estate sales for giveaway prices like all non
working watches.

Most Accutrons do *not* run perfectly on 1.55V cells, the tuning fork is
over-driven, and tends to kick the pawls unevenly.  214's are not at all
amused by that... just listening to them try makes me cringe.  I recall
that the later 218's are better about silver oxide cells.  (I can't help
but think such over-driving will have an effect on the life of the watch.
Coil failures are already rampant in the species.)

The proper thing to do is change the biasing resistor in the watch.  The
cells will last longer, and the watch sounds much happier.

I have had the opportunity to own just about any watch I want, and I
tend towards $50 Russian automatic dive watches, and 1950's Bulova 10BPAC
(10BOAC) automatics.  I have a certain fondness for the manual wind 10AK
movements too... But I never much cared for the Accutron.

I may be dumb, but I do know the market rates for Accutrons.  If I had
any, I would be fixing and selling them, not giving them away.

-Chuck Harris

William H. Fite wrote:

Oh, Chuck!  You have no soul.  [?]  People collect and use Accutrons for the
same reason that people collect and use manual Omega Speedmaster
Professionals.  And the same reason that some of us keep old shipboard
chronometers (mine was built by Thomas Bassnet a little over 250 years ago)
and other vintage timepieces.  We pay a mint to have them cleaned and
lubricated and we understand that their inaccuracy is not a fault but a
measure of where the technology was when they were built.

Those cranky, noisy, inaccurate old devices that you scorn took explorers
across the oceans and to the moon and back.  They are not to be lightly
dismissed.

Most Accutrons run perfectly on 1.55v Ag2O cells and those that don't are
very easily modified to do so.  There are a number of highly capable
watchmakers who can restore and maintain them though some 214 parts are
becoming scarce.  A number of hacks, too, of course.

I also like automatic movements and am wearing an Omega Seamaster right this
minute.

The hum when you lay it on the dresser is part of it.

You can send me all the Accutrons that are doing drawer duty at your house.

Bill


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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Pete Lancashire]

I normally don't. Use to but one day it stopped working and never got
it repaired.
But then I have 20+ clocks at home and a Nixie(R) clock on my desk at work.

The only one I wear now on special events is a retirement gift to my grandfather
when he retired in the the late 60's.

How may factory workers get an engraved 17 jewel watch when they retire
now days ?

-pete

On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:19 AM, John Green  wrote:
> I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my cellphone
> or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
> wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
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>

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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[Javier Herrero]

I see we are twin souls. Exactly the same :)

Regards,

Javier

El 08/07/2011 17:19, John Green escribió:

I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my cellphone
or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
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Re: [time-nuts] Am I the only Time Nut who doesn't wear a watch?

[John Green]

I haven't worn a wristwatch in maybe 30 years. I generally use my cellphone
or whatever timepiece that's handy. Or, I just guess. I don't wear my
wedding ring either. Jewelry of any kind bothers me.
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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[Javier Herrero]

As a matter of curiosity... Am I the only time nut that does not wear a 
wrist watch? Or... perhaps I'm not a true time nut... :)


Regards,

Javier

El 08/07/2011 16:46, William H. Fite escribió:

Oh, Chuck!  You have no soul.  [?]  People collect and use Accutrons for the
same reason that people collect and use manual Omega Speedmaster
Professionals.  And the same reason that some of us keep old shipboard
chronometers (mine was built by Thomas Bassnet a little over 250 years ago)
and other vintage timepieces.  We pay a mint to have them cleaned and
lubricated and we understand that their inaccuracy is not a fault but a
measure of where the technology was when they were built.

Those cranky, noisy, inaccurate old devices that you scorn took explorers
across the oceans and to the moon and back.  They are not to be lightly
dismissed.

Most Accutrons run perfectly on 1.55v Ag2O cells and those that don't are
very easily modified to do so.  There are a number of highly capable
watchmakers who can restore and maintain them though some 214 parts are
becoming scarce.  A number of hacks, too, of course.

I also like automatic movements and am wearing an Omega Seamaster right this
minute.

The hum when you lay it on the dresser is part of it.

You can send me all the Accutrons that are doing drawer duty at your house.

Bill



On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 9:34 AM, Chuck Harris  wrote:


There are plenty of Accutrons out there, but I think most owners have long
since
relegated theirs to drawer duty.  The short battery life (9 months), loud
hum,
lack of mercury cells, and poor performance on silver oxide cells did them
in.

It isn't that they cannot be adjusted to work with silver oxide cells, they
can, but who will do it for you?  There are no service centers left, and
only
a handful of watchmakers that will work on them.

I much prefer automatic watches.   If I cannot have an automatic, I would
then
prefer a quartz watch... most of the modern quartz watches will go 5 years
on
a cell, and keep way better time than the Accutron ever did, and are silent
when
you place them on your bedstand.

-Chuck Harris


William H. Fite wrote:


BTW, how many of us have running Accutrons?  I surely can't be the only
one.




On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:56 AM, William H. Fite
  wrote:

In fact, that was exactly what Accutron watch technicians were taught to

do.  They deliberately set the watches to run slow (~4 seconds per day, I
think, but someone may correct me on that) because, when worn, slight
bumps
and jars would stimulate the tuning fork to vibrate slightly faster for a
fraction of a second and/or the index wheel to advance two notches per
impulse rather than one.




On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:59 PM, Hal Murray
wrote:




IThis reminds me of the story (from time-nuts) of how to calibrate a
pocket

watch.  The recipe was roughly:

  Take watch to shop.
  Shop puts watch in stable environment.
  Shop adjusts watch to tick corectly.
  Shop gives watch to customer.
  Customer uses watch as "normal" for a week.
  Customer brings watch back to shop.
  Shop mis-adjusts watch to match customers usage patterns.



--
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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[William H. Fite]

Oh, Chuck!  You have no soul.  [?]  People collect and use Accutrons for the
same reason that people collect and use manual Omega Speedmaster
Professionals.  And the same reason that some of us keep old shipboard
chronometers (mine was built by Thomas Bassnet a little over 250 years ago)
and other vintage timepieces.  We pay a mint to have them cleaned and
lubricated and we understand that their inaccuracy is not a fault but a
measure of where the technology was when they were built.

Those cranky, noisy, inaccurate old devices that you scorn took explorers
across the oceans and to the moon and back.  They are not to be lightly
dismissed.

Most Accutrons run perfectly on 1.55v Ag2O cells and those that don't are
very easily modified to do so.  There are a number of highly capable
watchmakers who can restore and maintain them though some 214 parts are
becoming scarce.  A number of hacks, too, of course.

I also like automatic movements and am wearing an Omega Seamaster right this
minute.

The hum when you lay it on the dresser is part of it.

You can send me all the Accutrons that are doing drawer duty at your house.

Bill



On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 9:34 AM, Chuck Harris  wrote:

> There are plenty of Accutrons out there, but I think most owners have long
> since
> relegated theirs to drawer duty.  The short battery life (9 months), loud
> hum,
> lack of mercury cells, and poor performance on silver oxide cells did them
> in.
>
> It isn't that they cannot be adjusted to work with silver oxide cells, they
> can, but who will do it for you?  There are no service centers left, and
> only
> a handful of watchmakers that will work on them.
>
> I much prefer automatic watches.   If I cannot have an automatic, I would
> then
> prefer a quartz watch... most of the modern quartz watches will go 5 years
> on
> a cell, and keep way better time than the Accutron ever did, and are silent
> when
> you place them on your bedstand.
>
> -Chuck Harris
>
>
> William H. Fite wrote:
>
>> BTW, how many of us have running Accutrons?  I surely can't be the only
>> one.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:56 AM, William H. Fite
>>  wrote:
>>
>> In fact, that was exactly what Accutron watch technicians were taught to
>>> do.  They deliberately set the watches to run slow (~4 seconds per day, I
>>> think, but someone may correct me on that) because, when worn, slight
>>> bumps
>>> and jars would stimulate the tuning fork to vibrate slightly faster for a
>>> fraction of a second and/or the index wheel to advance two notches per
>>> impulse rather than one.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:59 PM, Hal Murray>> >wrote:
>>>
>>>
 IThis reminds me of the story (from time-nuts) of how to calibrate a
 pocket

 watch.  The recipe was roughly:

  Take watch to shop.
  Shop puts watch in stable environment.
  Shop adjusts watch to tick corectly.
  Shop gives watch to customer.
  Customer uses watch as "normal" for a week.
  Customer brings watch back to shop.
  Shop mis-adjusts watch to match customers usage patterns.



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>>>
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>> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>> and follow the instructions there.
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[time-nuts] FS: Frequency Divider Boards

[David C. Partridge]

I still have a number of these left.  The cost is GBP75 including P&P to 
anywhere in the world (GBP70 for UK customers).

For more details please goto  and follow the links

Please reply OFF LIST 

Regards,
David Partridge


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[time-nuts] and now, for a collection of many clocks..

[Jim Lux]

Seemed like a time-nuts-y sort of thing:
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-et-turan-notebook-clock-20110708,0,4924534.story


This is how "The Clock" works. In every city it plays, the screenings 
are synchronized to local time. At least once in every minute, there is 
a shot of a timepiece of some type showing that precise minute, both 
a.m. and p.m. versions. So one way to look at "The Clock" is as the 
world's most expensive time-telling apparatus, the only movie ever to 
keep real time 24 hours a day.


-- OK. from a time-nuts perspective.. "how closely synchronized"

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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[Chuck Harris]

There are plenty of Accutrons out there, but I think most owners have long since
relegated theirs to drawer duty.  The short battery life (9 months), loud hum,
lack of mercury cells, and poor performance on silver oxide cells did them in.

It isn't that they cannot be adjusted to work with silver oxide cells, they
can, but who will do it for you?  There are no service centers left, and only
a handful of watchmakers that will work on them.

I much prefer automatic watches.   If I cannot have an automatic, I would then
prefer a quartz watch... most of the modern quartz watches will go 5 years on
a cell, and keep way better time than the Accutron ever did, and are silent when
you place them on your bedstand.

-Chuck Harris

William H. Fite wrote:

BTW, how many of us have running Accutrons?  I surely can't be the only one.




On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:56 AM, William H. Fite  wrote:


In fact, that was exactly what Accutron watch technicians were taught to
do.  They deliberately set the watches to run slow (~4 seconds per day, I
think, but someone may correct me on that) because, when worn, slight bumps
and jars would stimulate the tuning fork to vibrate slightly faster for a
fraction of a second and/or the index wheel to advance two notches per
impulse rather than one.




On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:59 PM, Hal Murraywrote:



IThis reminds me of the story (from time-nuts) of how to calibrate a
pocket

watch.  The recipe was roughly:

  Take watch to shop.
  Shop puts watch in stable environment.
  Shop adjusts watch to tick corectly.
  Shop gives watch to customer.
  Customer uses watch as "normal" for a week.
  Customer brings watch back to shop.
  Shop mis-adjusts watch to match customers usage patterns.



--
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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[William H. Fite]

BTW, how many of us have running Accutrons?  I surely can't be the only one.




On Fri, Jul 8, 2011 at 8:56 AM, William H. Fite  wrote:

> In fact, that was exactly what Accutron watch technicians were taught to
> do.  They deliberately set the watches to run slow (~4 seconds per day, I
> think, but someone may correct me on that) because, when worn, slight bumps
> and jars would stimulate the tuning fork to vibrate slightly faster for a
> fraction of a second and/or the index wheel to advance two notches per
> impulse rather than one.
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:59 PM, Hal Murray wrote:
>
>>
>> IThis reminds me of the story (from time-nuts) of how to calibrate a
>> pocket
>>
>> watch.  The recipe was roughly:
>>
>>  Take watch to shop.
>>  Shop puts watch in stable environment.
>>  Shop adjusts watch to tick corectly.
>>  Shop gives watch to customer.
>>  Customer uses watch as "normal" for a week.
>>  Customer brings watch back to shop.
>>  Shop mis-adjusts watch to match customers usage patterns.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's.  I hate spam.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to
>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>> and follow the instructions there.
>>
>
>
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Re: [time-nuts] NERC/TEC test

[William H. Fite]

In fact, that was exactly what Accutron watch technicians were taught to
do.  They deliberately set the watches to run slow (~4 seconds per day, I
think, but someone may correct me on that) because, when worn, slight bumps
and jars would stimulate the tuning fork to vibrate slightly faster for a
fraction of a second and/or the index wheel to advance two notches per
impulse rather than one.




On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 10:59 PM, Hal Murray  wrote:

>
> IThis reminds me of the story (from time-nuts) of how to calibrate a pocket
> watch.  The recipe was roughly:
>
>  Take watch to shop.
>  Shop puts watch in stable environment.
>  Shop adjusts watch to tick corectly.
>  Shop gives watch to customer.
>  Customer uses watch as "normal" for a week.
>  Customer brings watch back to shop.
>  Shop mis-adjusts watch to match customers usage patterns.
>
>
>
> --
> These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's.  I hate spam.
>
>
>
>
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
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> and follow the instructions there.
>
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