Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
I noticed that a similar Trimble Thunderbolt is for sale over on Ali Express. Has older firmware (Ver. 2.2) and a much higher price. 73, Dick, W1KSZ Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 6:17 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system Hi That’s an odd one. It is very unclear *where* that OCXO came from. Bob > On Feb 5, 2019, at 7:16 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > Here's a shot of what's inside those T-Bolts I bought. > (thanks to tvb for reducing the size of my original). > > Comments solicited ... > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq > > Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 12:11 PM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Hi > > If the sticker on the OCXO (not the label on the outside of the box) has a > date code > in 2006, that should be fine. I’ve seen cases on … errr … various sites … > errr … > where the stuff inside the box did not match up very well with the labels on > the outside > of the box. No idea why …. > > Bob > >> On Feb 5, 2019, at 12:26 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: >> >> The two I have are Trimbles with Red & Black Labels with White letters. >> It's marked D/C 0635, which if I assume is the Date Code puts them in >> 2006. >> >> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >> >> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >> >> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq >> >> Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 8:32 AM >> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement >> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> >> Hi >> >> The parts we typically call TBolt’s were produced from about 1997 through >> about 2006. >> The date codes on the parts are one way to work out how far along the uint >> you have is >> in that sequence. There are other parts that Trimble produced (produces) >> under the same >> Thunderbolt brand. Those can be quite different beasts depending on which >> one you >> happen to be looking at. >> >> The early parts had OCXO’s labeled “PIEZO” on them. The later parts had a >> generic >> “TRIMBLE” label on them. The PIEZO labels have a date code stamped on them >> sort >> of randomly. The TRIMBLE labels have a field marked “date code”. In all >> cases I have seen >> it’s a two digit year followed by a two digit week. >> >> Anything with a PIEZO label is “early”. Anything from about 2003 on should >> be a pretty good >> OCXO. There are no guarantees, but that’s a pretty good guess. >> >> There are also changes in the temperature sensor IC and mods to the firmware >> along the >> way. The novel approach to a precision DAC and the resulting “noticeable” >> temperature >> coefficient seems to have been a constant through the entire production run. >> They also >> have various little spurs and noise bumps that some people get into cleaning >> up. >> >> The good news is that they all (from the first unit to the very last) run >> very well with LH. >> *That* more than any other factor makes them a really good choice. When >> tuned up, >> set up, and monitored with LH, they do much better than they would just >> running on their own. >> >> Bob >> >>> On Feb 5, 2019, at 9:23 AM, Richard Solomon wrote: >>> >>> How does one tell the difference between "early" and "later" ? >>> >>> S/N, Rev # ?? >>> >>> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >>> >>> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >>> >>> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq >>> >>> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 7:23 PM >>> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement >>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >>> >>> Hi >>> >>> One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo’s used in them got better as the >>> years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a later >>> one. They >>> also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic issue - later is >>> probably >>> better …. >>> >>> Bob >>> >>
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Hi That’s an odd one. It is very unclear *where* that OCXO came from. Bob > On Feb 5, 2019, at 7:16 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > Here's a shot of what's inside those T-Bolts I bought. > (thanks to tvb for reducing the size of my original). > > Comments solicited ... > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq > > Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 12:11 PM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Hi > > If the sticker on the OCXO (not the label on the outside of the box) has a > date code > in 2006, that should be fine. I’ve seen cases on … errr … various sites … > errr … > where the stuff inside the box did not match up very well with the labels on > the outside > of the box. No idea why …. > > Bob > >> On Feb 5, 2019, at 12:26 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: >> >> The two I have are Trimbles with Red & Black Labels with White letters. >> It's marked D/C 0635, which if I assume is the Date Code puts them in >> 2006. >> >> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >> >> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >> >> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq >> >> Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 8:32 AM >> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement >> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> >> Hi >> >> The parts we typically call TBolt’s were produced from about 1997 through >> about 2006. >> The date codes on the parts are one way to work out how far along the uint >> you have is >> in that sequence. There are other parts that Trimble produced (produces) >> under the same >> Thunderbolt brand. Those can be quite different beasts depending on which >> one you >> happen to be looking at. >> >> The early parts had OCXO’s labeled “PIEZO” on them. The later parts had a >> generic >> “TRIMBLE” label on them. The PIEZO labels have a date code stamped on them >> sort >> of randomly. The TRIMBLE labels have a field marked “date code”. In all >> cases I have seen >> it’s a two digit year followed by a two digit week. >> >> Anything with a PIEZO label is “early”. Anything from about 2003 on should >> be a pretty good >> OCXO. There are no guarantees, but that’s a pretty good guess. >> >> There are also changes in the temperature sensor IC and mods to the firmware >> along the >> way. The novel approach to a precision DAC and the resulting “noticeable” >> temperature >> coefficient seems to have been a constant through the entire production run. >> They also >> have various little spurs and noise bumps that some people get into cleaning >> up. >> >> The good news is that they all (from the first unit to the very last) run >> very well with LH. >> *That* more than any other factor makes them a really good choice. When >> tuned up, >> set up, and monitored with LH, they do much better than they would just >> running on their own. >> >> Bob >> >>> On Feb 5, 2019, at 9:23 AM, Richard Solomon wrote: >>> >>> How does one tell the difference between "early" and "later" ? >>> >>> S/N, Rev # ?? >>> >>> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >>> >>> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >>> >>> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq >>> >>> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 7:23 PM >>> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement >>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >>> >>> Hi >>> >>> One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo’s used in them got better as the >>> years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a later >>> one. They >>> also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic issue - later is >>> probably >>> better …. >>> >>> Bob >>> >>>> On Feb 4, 2019, at 8:51 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: >>>> >>>> There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site >>>> that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). >>>> I grabbed two and they work. >>>> >>>> My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window >>
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Hi All I have just pulled out of redundant stock a Trimble 2102 Plus satellite navigation unit for an aircraft can this be used as a frequency standard at such as 1/5/10 Mhz Paul B -Original Message- From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@lists.febo.com] On Behalf Of Bob kb8tq Sent: 05 February 2019 19:12 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system Hi If the sticker on the OCXO (not the label on the outside of the box) has a date code in 2006, that should be fine. I've seen cases on . errr . various sites . errr . where the stuff inside the box did not match up very well with the labels on the outside of the box. No idea why .. Bob > On Feb 5, 2019, at 12:26 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > The two I have are Trimbles with Red & Black Labels with White letters. > It's marked D/C 0635, which if I assume is the Date Code puts them in > 2006. > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq > Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 8:32 AM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Hi > > The parts we typically call TBolt's were produced from about 1997 through about 2006. > The date codes on the parts are one way to work out how far along the uint you have is > in that sequence. There are other parts that Trimble produced (produces) under the same > Thunderbolt brand. Those can be quite different beasts depending on which one you > happen to be looking at. > > The early parts had OCXO's labeled "PIEZO" on them. The later parts had a > generic "TRIMBLE" label on them. The PIEZO labels have a date code stamped > on them sort of randomly. The TRIMBLE labels have a field marked "date > code". In all cases I have seen it's a two digit year followed by a two > > digit week. Anything with a PIEZO label is "early". Anything from about 2003 on should be a pretty good > OCXO. There are no guarantees, but that's a pretty good guess. > > There are also changes in the temperature sensor IC and mods to the > firmware along the way. The novel approach to a precision DAC and the > resulting "noticeable" temperature coefficient seems to have been a > constant through the entire production run. They also have various little. > spurs and noise bumps that some people get into cleaning up > The good news is that they all (from the first unit to the very last) run. > very well with LH *That* more than any other factor makes them a really > good choice. When tuned up,set up, and monitored with LH, they do much better than they would just running on their own. > > Bob > >> On Feb 5, 2019, at 9:23 AM, Richard Solomon wrote: >> >> How does one tell the difference between "early" and "later" ? >> >> S/N, Rev # ?? >> >> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >> >> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >> >> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq >> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 7:23 PM >> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement >> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> >> Hi >> >> One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo's used in them got better as >> the years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a >> later one. They also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic >> issue - later is probably better .. >> >> Bob >> >>> On Feb 4, 2019, at 8:51 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: >>> >>> There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site >>> that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). >>> I grabbed two and they work. >>> >>> My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window >>> sash, facing South. >>> >>> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >>> >>> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >>> >>> From: time-nuts on behalf of Grant Hodgson >>> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 11:15 AM >>> To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com >>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >>> >>> Paul >>> >>> The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of >>> these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as >>> the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is simi
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Hi If the sticker on the OCXO (not the label on the outside of the box) has a date code in 2006, that should be fine. I’ve seen cases on … errr … various sites … errr … where the stuff inside the box did not match up very well with the labels on the outside of the box. No idea why …. Bob > On Feb 5, 2019, at 12:26 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > The two I have are Trimbles with Red & Black Labels with White letters. > It's marked D/C 0635, which if I assume is the Date Code puts them in > 2006. > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq > > Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 8:32 AM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Hi > > The parts we typically call TBolt’s were produced from about 1997 through > about 2006. > The date codes on the parts are one way to work out how far along the uint > you have is > in that sequence. There are other parts that Trimble produced (produces) > under the same > Thunderbolt brand. Those can be quite different beasts depending on which one > you > happen to be looking at. > > The early parts had OCXO’s labeled “PIEZO” on them. The later parts had a > generic > “TRIMBLE” label on them. The PIEZO labels have a date code stamped on them > sort > of randomly. The TRIMBLE labels have a field marked “date code”. In all cases > I have seen > it’s a two digit year followed by a two digit week. > > Anything with a PIEZO label is “early”. Anything from about 2003 on should be > a pretty good > OCXO. There are no guarantees, but that’s a pretty good guess. > > There are also changes in the temperature sensor IC and mods to the firmware > along the > way. The novel approach to a precision DAC and the resulting “noticeable” > temperature > coefficient seems to have been a constant through the entire production run. > They also > have various little spurs and noise bumps that some people get into cleaning > up. > > The good news is that they all (from the first unit to the very last) run > very well with LH. > *That* more than any other factor makes them a really good choice. When tuned > up, > set up, and monitored with LH, they do much better than they would just > running on their own. > > Bob > >> On Feb 5, 2019, at 9:23 AM, Richard Solomon wrote: >> >> How does one tell the difference between "early" and "later" ? >> >> S/N, Rev # ?? >> >> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >> >> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >> >> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq >> >> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 7:23 PM >> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement >> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> >> Hi >> >> One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo’s used in them got better as the >> years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a later one. >> They >> also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic issue - later is >> probably >> better …. >> >> Bob >> >>> On Feb 4, 2019, at 8:51 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: >>> >>> There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site >>> that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). >>> I grabbed two and they work. >>> >>> My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window >>> sash, facing South. >>> >>> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >>> >>> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >>> >>> From: time-nuts on behalf of Grant >>> Hodgson >>> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 11:15 AM >>> To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com >>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >>> >>> Paul >>> >>> The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of >>> these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as >>> the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is similar to that of >>> national standards. GPSDOs are more stable than most rubidium standards >>> in the long term, and GPSDOs are extremely common in most laboratories. >>> >>> The Trimble Thunderbolt is very common and available on the surplus >>> market, as is the HP Z3801A. James Miller (G3RUH) used to sell an >
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
The two I have are Trimbles with Red & Black Labels with White letters. It's marked D/C 0635, which if I assume is the Date Code puts them in 2006. 73, Dick, W1KSZ Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq Sent: Tuesday, February 5, 2019 8:32 AM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system Hi The parts we typically call TBolt’s were produced from about 1997 through about 2006. The date codes on the parts are one way to work out how far along the uint you have is in that sequence. There are other parts that Trimble produced (produces) under the same Thunderbolt brand. Those can be quite different beasts depending on which one you happen to be looking at. The early parts had OCXO’s labeled “PIEZO” on them. The later parts had a generic “TRIMBLE” label on them. The PIEZO labels have a date code stamped on them sort of randomly. The TRIMBLE labels have a field marked “date code”. In all cases I have seen it’s a two digit year followed by a two digit week. Anything with a PIEZO label is “early”. Anything from about 2003 on should be a pretty good OCXO. There are no guarantees, but that’s a pretty good guess. There are also changes in the temperature sensor IC and mods to the firmware along the way. The novel approach to a precision DAC and the resulting “noticeable” temperature coefficient seems to have been a constant through the entire production run. They also have various little spurs and noise bumps that some people get into cleaning up. The good news is that they all (from the first unit to the very last) run very well with LH. *That* more than any other factor makes them a really good choice. When tuned up, set up, and monitored with LH, they do much better than they would just running on their own. Bob > On Feb 5, 2019, at 9:23 AM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > How does one tell the difference between "early" and "later" ? > > S/N, Rev # ?? > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq > > Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 7:23 PM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Hi > > One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo’s used in them got better as the > years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a later one. > They > also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic issue - later is > probably > better …. > > Bob > >> On Feb 4, 2019, at 8:51 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: >> >> There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site >> that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). >> I grabbed two and they work. >> >> My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window >> sash, facing South. >> >> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >> >> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >> ____ >> From: time-nuts on behalf of Grant >> Hodgson >> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 11:15 AM >> To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com >> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> >> Paul >> >> The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of >> these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as >> the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is similar to that of >> national standards. GPSDOs are more stable than most rubidium standards >> in the long term, and GPSDOs are extremely common in most laboratories. >> >> The Trimble Thunderbolt is very common and available on the surplus >> market, as is the HP Z3801A. James Miller (G3RUH) used to sell an >> excellent GPSDO. There are other home-brew designs available if you >> want to build. These have all been extensively characterised if you >> want the details. >> >> If you want to buy new, then there are products such as the Fury and >> Firefly from Jackson Labs; , U-Blox have many offerings (not sure if >> they do a GPSDO though). >> >> Google GPSDO or GPS frequency standard, or check the leapsecond.com >> website for more information - there's loads out there, it's just a case >> of using the right term in the search engine. >> >> regards >> Grant >> >>> Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 23:43:10 - >>> From: "Paul Bicknell" >>> To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'" >>> >>> Sub
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Hi The parts we typically call TBolt’s were produced from about 1997 through about 2006. The date codes on the parts are one way to work out how far along the uint you have is in that sequence. There are other parts that Trimble produced (produces) under the same Thunderbolt brand. Those can be quite different beasts depending on which one you happen to be looking at. The early parts had OCXO’s labeled “PIEZO” on them. The later parts had a generic “TRIMBLE” label on them. The PIEZO labels have a date code stamped on them sort of randomly. The TRIMBLE labels have a field marked “date code”. In all cases I have seen it’s a two digit year followed by a two digit week. Anything with a PIEZO label is “early”. Anything from about 2003 on should be a pretty good OCXO. There are no guarantees, but that’s a pretty good guess. There are also changes in the temperature sensor IC and mods to the firmware along the way. The novel approach to a precision DAC and the resulting “noticeable” temperature coefficient seems to have been a constant through the entire production run. They also have various little spurs and noise bumps that some people get into cleaning up. The good news is that they all (from the first unit to the very last) run very well with LH. *That* more than any other factor makes them a really good choice. When tuned up, set up, and monitored with LH, they do much better than they would just running on their own. Bob > On Feb 5, 2019, at 9:23 AM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > How does one tell the difference between "early" and "later" ? > > S/N, Rev # ?? > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq > > Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 7:23 PM > To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Hi > > One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo’s used in them got better as the > years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a later one. > They > also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic issue - later is > probably > better …. > > Bob > >> On Feb 4, 2019, at 8:51 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: >> >> There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site >> that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). >> I grabbed two and they work. >> >> My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window >> sash, facing South. >> >> 73, Dick, W1KSZ >> >> Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >> ____________ >> From: time-nuts on behalf of Grant >> Hodgson >> Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 11:15 AM >> To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com >> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> >> Paul >> >> The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of >> these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as >> the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is similar to that of >> national standards. GPSDOs are more stable than most rubidium standards >> in the long term, and GPSDOs are extremely common in most laboratories. >> >> The Trimble Thunderbolt is very common and available on the surplus >> market, as is the HP Z3801A. James Miller (G3RUH) used to sell an >> excellent GPSDO. There are other home-brew designs available if you >> want to build. These have all been extensively characterised if you >> want the details. >> >> If you want to buy new, then there are products such as the Fury and >> Firefly from Jackson Labs; , U-Blox have many offerings (not sure if >> they do a GPSDO though). >> >> Google GPSDO or GPS frequency standard, or check the leapsecond.com >> website for more information - there's loads out there, it's just a case >> of using the right term in the search engine. >> >> regards >> Grant >> >>> Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 23:43:10 - >>> From: "Paul Bicknell" >>> To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'" >>> >>> Subject: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >>> >>> >>> Dear all >>> I currently use a 198 Khz off air standard but I can no longer use 600 khz >>> since it moved from Rugby >>> I have herd a lot about varies frequency references that use satellites >&
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
How does one tell the difference between "early" and "later" ? S/N, Rev # ?? 73, Dick, W1KSZ Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> From: time-nuts on behalf of Bob kb8tq Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 7:23 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system Hi One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo’s used in them got better as the years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a later one. They also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic issue - later is probably better …. Bob > On Feb 4, 2019, at 8:51 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site > that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). > I grabbed two and they work. > > My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window > sash, facing South. > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Grant Hodgson > > Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 11:15 AM > To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Paul > > The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of > these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as > the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is similar to that of > national standards. GPSDOs are more stable than most rubidium standards > in the long term, and GPSDOs are extremely common in most laboratories. > > The Trimble Thunderbolt is very common and available on the surplus > market, as is the HP Z3801A. James Miller (G3RUH) used to sell an > excellent GPSDO. There are other home-brew designs available if you > want to build. These have all been extensively characterised if you > want the details. > > If you want to buy new, then there are products such as the Fury and > Firefly from Jackson Labs; , U-Blox have many offerings (not sure if > they do a GPSDO though). > > Google GPSDO or GPS frequency standard, or check the leapsecond.com > website for more information - there's loads out there, it's just a case > of using the right term in the search engine. > > regards > Grant > >> Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 23:43:10 - >> From: "Paul Bicknell" >> To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'" >> >> Subject: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> Message-ID: >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >> >> >> Dear all >> I currently use a 198 Khz off air standard but I can no longer use 600 khz >> since it moved from Rugby >> I have herd a lot about varies frequency references that use satellites >> This technology has improved immensely & become more affordable over the >> past 5 years >> >> So can a standard locked to a satellite be as good as a Rubidium ? >> >> What accuracy can I achieve for a satellite system below ?800 as I am not >> familiar with the latest that are on offer? >> >> Regards Paul Bicknell South Coast UK >> >> > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Hi One thing to watch on the TBolts - the ocxo’s used in them got better as the years went by. An early one likely will not do quite as well as a later one. They also updated the firmware as time went by, same basic issue - later is probably better …. Bob > On Feb 4, 2019, at 8:51 PM, Richard Solomon wrote: > > There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site > that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). > I grabbed two and they work. > > My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window > sash, facing South. > > 73, Dick, W1KSZ > > Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> > > From: time-nuts on behalf of Grant Hodgson > > Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 11:15 AM > To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > > Paul > > The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of > these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as > the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is similar to that of > national standards. GPSDOs are more stable than most rubidium standards > in the long term, and GPSDOs are extremely common in most laboratories. > > The Trimble Thunderbolt is very common and available on the surplus > market, as is the HP Z3801A. James Miller (G3RUH) used to sell an > excellent GPSDO. There are other home-brew designs available if you > want to build. These have all been extensively characterised if you > want the details. > > If you want to buy new, then there are products such as the Fury and > Firefly from Jackson Labs; , U-Blox have many offerings (not sure if > they do a GPSDO though). > > Google GPSDO or GPS frequency standard, or check the leapsecond.com > website for more information - there's loads out there, it's just a case > of using the right term in the search engine. > > regards > Grant > >> Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 23:43:10 - >> From: "Paul Bicknell" >> To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'" >> >> Subject: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system >> Message-ID: >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >> >> >> Dear all >> I currently use a 198 Khz off air standard but I can no longer use 600 khz >> since it moved from Rugby >> I have herd a lot about varies frequency references that use satellites >> This technology has improved immensely & become more affordable over the >> past 5 years >> >> So can a standard locked to a satellite be as good as a Rubidium ? >> >> What accuracy can I achieve for a satellite system below ?800 as I am not >> familiar with the latest that are on offer? >> >> Regards Paul Bicknell South Coast UK >> >> > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
There have been some Trimble Thunderbolts over on that auction site that were being sold for $80 each (not surplus Telcom ones). I grabbed two and they work. My antenna was a "hockey puck" style antenna sitting on the window sash, facing South. 73, Dick, W1KSZ Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> From: time-nuts on behalf of Grant Hodgson Sent: Monday, February 4, 2019 11:15 AM To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system Paul The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is similar to that of national standards. GPSDOs are more stable than most rubidium standards in the long term, and GPSDOs are extremely common in most laboratories. The Trimble Thunderbolt is very common and available on the surplus market, as is the HP Z3801A. James Miller (G3RUH) used to sell an excellent GPSDO. There are other home-brew designs available if you want to build. These have all been extensively characterised if you want the details. If you want to buy new, then there are products such as the Fury and Firefly from Jackson Labs; , U-Blox have many offerings (not sure if they do a GPSDO though). Google GPSDO or GPS frequency standard, or check the leapsecond.com website for more information - there's loads out there, it's just a case of using the right term in the search engine. regards Grant > Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 23:43:10 - > From: "Paul Bicknell" > To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'" > > Subject: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > Dear all > I currently use a 198 Khz off air standard but I can no longer use 600 khz > since it moved from Rugby > I have herd a lot about varies frequency references that use satellites > This technology has improved immensely & become more affordable over the > past 5 years > > So can a standard locked to a satellite be as good as a Rubidium ? > > What accuracy can I achieve for a satellite system below ?800 as I am not > familiar with the latest that are on offer? > > Regards Paul Bicknell South Coast UK > > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Paul
The keyword is GPSDO - GPS disciplined oscillator. The vast majority of
these will give a 10MHz output. The long term accuracy is the same as
the GPS navigation system, which for most purposes is similar to that of
national standards. GPSDOs are more stable than most rubidium standards
in the long term, and GPSDOs are extremely common in most laboratories.
The Trimble Thunderbolt is very common and available on the surplus
market, as is the HP Z3801A. James Miller (G3RUH) used to sell an
excellent GPSDO. There are other home-brew designs available if you
want to build. These have all been extensively characterised if you
want the details.
If you want to buy new, then there are products such as the Fury and
Firefly from Jackson Labs; , U-Blox have many offerings (not sure if
they do a GPSDO though).
Google GPSDO or GPS frequency standard, or check the leapsecond.com
website for more information - there's loads out there, it's just a case
of using the right term in the search engine.
regards
Grant
Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2019 23:43:10 -
From: "Paul Bicknell"
To: "'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement'"
Subject: [time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Dear all
I currently use a 198 Khz off air standard but I can no longer use 600 khz
since it moved from Rugby
I have herd a lot about varies frequency references that use satellites
This technology has improved immensely & become more affordable over the
past 5 years
So can a standard locked to a satellite be as good as a Rubidium ?
What accuracy can I achieve for a satellite system below ?800 as I am not
familiar with the latest that are on offer?
Regards Paul Bicknell South Coast UK
___
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com
and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] 10 mhz accuracy for a satellite system
Dear all I currently use a 198 Khz off air standard but I can no longer use 600 khz since it moved from Rugby I have herd a lot about varies frequency references that use satellites This technology has improved immensely & become more affordable over the past 5 years So can a standard locked to a satellite be as good as a Rubidium ? What accuracy can I achieve for a satellite system below £800 as I am not familiar with the latest that are on offer? Regards Paul Bicknell South Coast UK ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
