RE: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[Turner, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: Remy Maucherat [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Saturday, September 28, 2002 10:12 AM
> > 
> > And if you use JSP with custom tags Jasper2 can really 
> improve performance.
> 
> Hopefully you'll put 4.1.x on your higher volume sites and/or 
> use it in 
> standalone mode so that we see how it behaves.
> 

Yikes, that comment does not instill confidence.  I'll have to read up more
on the Apache-style development process...it was my understanding that that
sort of testing was done by the developers prior to "voting" on a release.
I'm no developer, but I can't imagine getting something to work on my
desktop and then saying "ok, it's ready for release". 

Is there a document somewhere that describes the criteria used to determine
if something is ready for release?  Or something that describes the criteria
used to determine if someone should vote "yay" or "nay" in a release vote?
Or is it all just personal preference?

> Remy
> 

John


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RE: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[Turner, John]

Thanks, but I have to be a little more cautious than that.  While I'm sure
lots of people don't read the release notes, the idea that so many people
would be surprised by behavior changes in the newest version makes me think
there are probably other issues yet to be uncovered.  It also makes me
wonder about the whole "voting" process when determining if something is a
release.  What was the time period between .10 and .12?  Three weeks?  Which
"vote" shouldn't have happened, then?  The .10 or the .12?  What are the
odds we'll see a .13 or .14 next week, also termed "release"?

I'm not arguing or debating, just trying to illustrate how the traffic on
the list in the last couple of weeks might make someone a little wary of
using anything beyond 4.0.5 in a critical situation.  I would say the
majority of those of us in production situations do not have 100% management
buy-in on open source...it takes a huge effort to overcome the momentum that
traditional commercial software has, and any glitch, no matter how small,
can set that effort back quite a ways.

Most administrators don't have the luxury of doing server component upgrades
more than once or twice a month, either.  I know I'd have some questions to
answer if I had used my maintenance window to go with .10 only to have my
boss find out 2 weeks later that I should be running .12 because its the
latest (especially in a security-fix scenario), and the next maintenance
window is weeks away.

John

> -Original Message-
> From: Glenn Nielsen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 9:19 PM
> To: Tomcat Users List
> Subject: Re: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?
> 
> 
> The discussion regarding Tomcat 4.1.12 was not related to its 
> stability.
> I have been using Tomcat 4.1.x in production for over 6 months
> (but still with Jasper1), and recently upgraded to Jasper 2.
> 
> IMHO, Tomcat 4.1.x is a much better container for production 
> than 4.0.x.
> 
> All of the issues raised were about some minor differences in 
> behaviour.
> Not about stability. Tomcat 4.1.x has been rock solid for me 
> in production
> on a site that heavily uses JSP pages and has >500k page 
> views per month.
> 
> Install and test your app in Tomcat 4.1.12. Your app and 
> config may not
> even notice the difference, or at most there may be a couple of issues
> to resolve.
> 
> And if you use JSP with custom tags Jasper2 can really 
> improve performance.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Glenn
> 

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Re: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[Remy Maucherat]

Glenn Nielsen wrote:
> The discussion regarding Tomcat 4.1.12 was not related to its stability.
> I have been using Tomcat 4.1.x in production for over 6 months
> (but still with Jasper1), and recently upgraded to Jasper 2.
> 
> IMHO, Tomcat 4.1.x is a much better container for production than 4.0.x.
> 
> All of the issues raised were about some minor differences in behaviour.

So far I agree. I believe most differences are motivated by the attempt 
at making Tomcat more secure and reliable. There were a few gotchas in 
4.1.10, though (with Jasper bugs, and with Windows compatibility).

> Not about stability. Tomcat 4.1.x has been rock solid for me in production
> on a site that heavily uses JSP pages and has >500k page views per month.
> 
> Install and test your app in Tomcat 4.1.12. Your app and config may not
> even notice the difference, or at most there may be a couple of issues
> to resolve.
> 
> And if you use JSP with custom tags Jasper2 can really improve performance.

Hopefully you'll put 4.1.x on your higher volume sites and/or use it in 
standalone mode so that we see how it behaves.

Remy


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Re: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[Glenn Nielsen]

The discussion regarding Tomcat 4.1.12 was not related to its stability.
I have been using Tomcat 4.1.x in production for over 6 months
(but still with Jasper1), and recently upgraded to Jasper 2.

IMHO, Tomcat 4.1.x is a much better container for production than 4.0.x.

All of the issues raised were about some minor differences in behaviour.
Not about stability. Tomcat 4.1.x has been rock solid for me in production
on a site that heavily uses JSP pages and has >500k page views per month.

Install and test your app in Tomcat 4.1.12. Your app and config may not
even notice the difference, or at most there may be a couple of issues
to resolve.

And if you use JSP with custom tags Jasper2 can really improve performance.

Regards,

Glenn

Turner, John wrote:
> Hello -
> 
> We're almost ready to deploy a new app.  We have been using 4.0.4 in
> development.
> 
> I need to get an idea of how stable 4.1.12 is...based on the traffic in the
> last week, 4.1.12 looks to be fairly unstable, regardless of its 'release'
> designation.
> 
> Should we stick with 4.0.4, or take the plunge with 4.1.12?  We will be
> using Apache with a connector in addition to Tomcat.
> 
> - John
> 
> 
> John Turner
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Advertising Audit Service
> http://www.aas.com
> 
> 
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RE: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[Turner, John]

I think the first thing is get a working installation, apache 1 + mod_jk +
Tomcat 4.1.12.  By "working" I mean that Apache will serve the Tomcat
examples on port 80.

Then add in your app, and diagnose and resolve any errors that show up.

John


> -Original Message-
> From: David Wynter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 12:34 PM
> To: Tomcat Users List
> Subject: RE: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Well your observation about 4.1.12 worries me. I had a 
> working application
> using a Turbine app on apache 1.3.23 and Tomcat 4.0.4, but it had a >1
> minute time to load the first page because of a 
> IllegalStateException. No
> one had an explanation and suggested a Tomcat upgrade so I 
> went for the
> latest 4.1.12 with 1.3.23 but could not build the connectors 
> because I did
> not have apxs. So I went to 2.0.42 and now cannot get them to 
> work together
> and we have been off line for 2 days.
> 
> So the nightmare continues. 4.0.4 has a security issue and if 
> I go for 4.0.5
> maybe that does not solve my IllegalStateException problem? 
> What to do?
> 
> David
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Turner, John [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: 27 September 2002 16:50
> To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> Subject: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?
> 
> 
> 
> Hello -
> 
> We're almost ready to deploy a new app.  We have been using 4.0.4 in
> development.
> 
> I need to get an idea of how stable 4.1.12 is...based on the 
> traffic in the
> last week, 4.1.12 looks to be fairly unstable, regardless of 
> its 'release'
> designation.
> 
> Should we stick with 4.0.4, or take the plunge with 4.1.12?  
> We will be
> using Apache with a connector in addition to Tomcat.
> 
> - John
> 
> 
> John Turner
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Advertising Audit Service
> http://www.aas.com
> 
> 
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RE: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[Adam Greene]

Well, I've been noticing some "irregularities" in the way Tomcat 4.1.12
works.  First off, I had to change my Resource paths from
"/com/whatever/file.ext" to "com/whatever/file.ext".  I have had it refuse
to recognize jar files placed in the common/lib directory.  and other minor
problems.  So I would suggest caution on deployment.

-Original Message-
From: Turner, John [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 12:50 PM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?



Hello -

We're almost ready to deploy a new app.  We have been using 4.0.4 in
development.

I need to get an idea of how stable 4.1.12 is...based on the traffic in the
last week, 4.1.12 looks to be fairly unstable, regardless of its 'release'
designation.

Should we stick with 4.0.4, or take the plunge with 4.1.12?  We will be
using Apache with a connector in addition to Tomcat.

- John


John Turner
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Advertising Audit Service
http://www.aas.com


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RE: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[David Wynter]

Hi,

Well your observation about 4.1.12 worries me. I had a working application
using a Turbine app on apache 1.3.23 and Tomcat 4.0.4, but it had a >1
minute time to load the first page because of a IllegalStateException. No
one had an explanation and suggested a Tomcat upgrade so I went for the
latest 4.1.12 with 1.3.23 but could not build the connectors because I did
not have apxs. So I went to 2.0.42 and now cannot get them to work together
and we have been off line for 2 days.

So the nightmare continues. 4.0.4 has a security issue and if I go for 4.0.5
maybe that does not solve my IllegalStateException problem? What to do?

David

-Original Message-
From: Turner, John [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: 27 September 2002 16:50
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?



Hello -

We're almost ready to deploy a new app.  We have been using 4.0.4 in
development.

I need to get an idea of how stable 4.1.12 is...based on the traffic in the
last week, 4.1.12 looks to be fairly unstable, regardless of its 'release'
designation.

Should we stick with 4.0.4, or take the plunge with 4.1.12?  We will be
using Apache with a connector in addition to Tomcat.

- John


John Turner
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Advertising Audit Service
http://www.aas.com


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How many people are using 4.1.12 successfully?

[Turner, John]

Hello -

We're almost ready to deploy a new app.  We have been using 4.0.4 in
development.

I need to get an idea of how stable 4.1.12 is...based on the traffic in the
last week, 4.1.12 looks to be fairly unstable, regardless of its 'release'
designation.

Should we stick with 4.0.4, or take the plunge with 4.1.12?  We will be
using Apache with a connector in addition to Tomcat.

- John


John Turner
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Advertising Audit Service
http://www.aas.com


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